"I don't care how strong you are. It's not strong enough!" Roy Match Up Thread

[Smolder]

Im sorry if this has already been discussed, and feel free to tell me to look through the thread if it has, but im curious about the roy sheik mu. i generally have a lot of trouble with sheik and that is definitely due to having poor experience with the mu as well as how sheik plays and what sheik wants to do but itd be cool to get some insight.

So Sheik is a bit of an ugly MU for Roy. There are two big problems that Roys tend to have with Sheik.
A.) Her tech chases.
B.) Her gimp game.
If you want to have any chance against a Sheik, you must learn how to effectively deal with both A. and B.

When fighting a Sheik, you must always mix up your techs. Mixing up your techs for her down throw is essential because if she adapts to your tech pattern, she will easily rack up some good percent before finishing you off with a down throw --> drop down fair on ledge. If you can't seem to figure out a way to get past her tech chasing, begin teching towards the closest ledge. This is very dangerous though, because she can follow you off the ledge with a drop down fair. You must DI her throw up and away so that you are close enough to make it back to the ledge and so that she can't get a fair follow up.

As for dealing with her gimp game, you can utilize two or three different tactics that I know of. The first tactic would be to merely up-B early. If you notice that the Sheik is running towards the ledge at breakneck speed in an attempt to gimp you, just up-B early to catch her off guard. Due to the priority of your up-B, you will almost always beat her before she can throw out a fair. If you find yourself falling parallel to the wall of the stage, you can let her go off for you, fall until you are at max range, and then up-B almost straight upwards. Due to your fall speed as compared to hers and the amount of time it takes her to get to you, you can usually win with this tactic. The third tactic is very niche and rarely used, but if she hits you with a lower knockback move that only sends you slightly away from the ledge, you can let her run off towards you, then do a fade back jump to bait out the fair and then follow up with an up-B to get back to the stage while racking up some percent on her. As you can see, most of your recovery game revolves around beating her fair attempts, because she WILL go out as deep as she needs to secure those early stocks.

When dealing with her in neutral, keep in mind that she can come down on you with a fair, then follow up with either a ftilt or a jab. Let her drop on your shield with her fair, let her ftilt, then punish her with a grab. I'm not sure you can do the same with her jab though, seeing as it turns into a multi-hit move. Also, keep in mind that she can mix up her fair approach with a follow up grab. Watch to see which of these mix ups she uses the most and punish accordingly. Fortunately, CC dtilt is actually pretty useful against her due to its fast IASA frames and the fact that she's at that sweet spot combo weight where you can do some ugly things to her.

Your whole game plan will be to play footsies with her until you can get a confirmed dtilt or grab, then push her towards the edge of the stage. Sheik has a glass jaw when she's the one who's trying to recover. More often than not, you can actually hold the ledge, see where she lands from her up-B and if she ends up on stage, you can ledge dash to grab or ledge dash to fsmash. Either way, she's in for some pain. Most Sheiks, however, will try to up-B into you on the ledge to get you either stage spiked or back on stage so she can have the ledge. This tactic of theirs is actually highly effective and very hard to punish due to the invincibility frames on her up-B. However, if you get lucky and they mess up their spacing on the up-B, you can actually dair from ledge and either get the spike, the knock up, or the semi-spike. (Her up-B doesn't have invincibility on the first few frames of start up) All of these are great options because two of them are a confirmed kill and one of them is a possible kill because you can L-cancel on stage then do a bair follow up to put her even further away from the ledge. Also, keep in mind that that the first explosion of her up-B is the only one with damage and knock back. The second explosion that you see of her coming out of her up-B actually does nothing. This means you can just hold the ledge and watch her lose a stock if she attempts a sweet spot.

I hope this helps you out, man. That MU is pretty annoying to play against. =)

 

[Azureflames]

Just to piggyback on what @ Smolder said...i think the majority of your kills will come from surprise DED mix ups when shes popped in the air and cant CC it, occasional Fsmashes, and mostly edgeguard punishing her up-B landing. In this MU you really really need to be comfortable ramen noodle wavedashing onto the ledge, quickly wavedash>fastfall grab the ledge, and ledgedashing consistantly. Also a lot of the time if you see them going for upB hitboxes to knock you off, you can predict the upB> quickly ledgedash> fastfall wavedash back onto the ledge to force Sheiks upB to either miss into the stage, getting you the stock, or force the upB right onto the stage. If you notice the momentum of the upB poof go to the stage you can sometimes quick ledgedash and punish the landing lag with a forward smash. If you really struggle with getting on and off the ledge and mobility in general you're not only gonna have a really tough time fishing for Fsmash kills vs sheik, but you'll struggle against many other matchups that require precise edgeguarding.

smolder had a lot of really great points, definitely stick to this as your game plan. Just be sure to really footsie around with quick wavedash>crouch>wavedash movements mixed in with careful fox-trot dash dancing to get dat crouch cancel/Dtilt game goin. Gotta be careful of dash attack or when sheik turns on the offensive switch. Spacing spacing spacing is key.

 

[thechosenjuan]

What are your guys' favorite matchups?

least favorite matchups?

 

[Smolder]

Favorites: Fox, Falco, Marth
Least favorites: DK, D3, ROB, and Roy

 

[Taytertot]

Thanks for the advice this helps a lot. unfortunately my skills need more practice to accomplish these strats cause I l-cancel correctly about 75% of the time and wavedash correctly about 80% of the time. I'll keep working on it. I just joined up with a local smash club so i should be able to practice with people more often now.

I also had a lot of trouble with fox but that was due to me not knowing anyone who played fox beforehand so the shield pressure and overall quickness of fox's movement caught me very offguard. Id say most of the melee top tiers are unknown mu's to me for roy in PM.

 

[Azureflames]

Tbh im not even sure if i really have any particular favorites, these are just kind of the ones i dont mind as much or ones that i'm used to fighting. There's so much character jank that im bad at adapting to in PM; not even jank really... just character gimmicks i have a tough time with and haven't found a way around yet.

Favorite Matchups:


Least Favorite matchups:


unsure but kind hate these matchups:

 

[thechosenjuan]

Tbh im not even sure if i really have any particular favorites, these are just kind of the ones i dont mind as much or ones that i'm used to fighting. There's so much character jank that im bad at adapting to in PM; not even jank really... just character gimmicks i have a tough time with and haven't found a way around yet.

Favorite Matchups:


Least Favorite matchups:


unsure but kind hate these matchups:

I hate the Bowser matchup, idk if it's just me but I realllllly hate it. Same with Luigi.

 

[Azureflames]

I hate the Bowser matchup, idk if it's just me but I realllllly hate it. Same with Luigi.

No kidding. Bowser can be rough, its all about capitalizing at the right moments and really baiting out as much as you can and grab whenever possible. I hate the luigi matchup. I hate how certain characters like luigi and mario to name two, have combo breaker moves or super super fast cooldown moves that come out really fast AND have decent enough knockback. You can only get maybe two or three hits usually before you have to play a zoning game instead of going for combo strings.

I also hate that the majority of luigi's i see only ever just spam side-b and down-b as actual strategies...I hate it more for how well it can work sometimes. Idk the MU can feel so jank even though i'll still win it the majority of the time.

 

[Taytertot]

hows the mario mu in 3.5? i know it was a bit rough for roy in 3.02 but im wondering if the changes have had a large impact on that.

 

[Azureflames]

hows the mario mu in 3.5? i know it was a bit rough for roy in 3.02 but im wondering if the changes have had a large impact on that.

In my experiences its still as annoying as it was before. He's got pills, fast interrupting aerials, fast smashes and a good crouch cancel game. I think the most noticable thing is that his walljump super recovery is pretty shot down for the most part. He can still be tricky to edgeguard in some cases though. Everything but his recovery i find to still feel the same when i play against him, though he was always beatable even in 3.02, he's just a real big pain to deal with.

 

[Binary Clone]

Adding onto all that about Sheik:

I think the dthrow techchases are even more dangerous than you think. At many, many percents, proper DI and tech mixups are not going to save you. The only time I've been 4-stocked in tournament was by Faceroll's sheik, and I've played against ORLY and Kels (granted I played a lot later against Kels, when I was better, and he was using Falcon). I talked to him afterward, and he told me that Roy's tech roll is bad enough that a good, fast Sheik player like Faceroll does not need to read you. For Sheik, Roy's tech roll is reactable - he just waits, sees, and regrabs or attacks. The only real way is to hope he messes up (helped by tech mixups, of course), or to not tech, then DI the jab combo up and away to hope he doesn't follow up.

Basically, step 1: don't get grabbed.




Also, since everyone hates the Luigi MU it seems like, can we talk about that? I don't really like it, either.

I get the feeling that it isn't actually unfavorable (though correct me if you think I'm wrong, it may well be), but I think Roy struggles with a lot of different aspects of how Luigi functions.

Luigi has a frame-2 jab, a frame-3 sex kick, a frame-5 dsmash, and his slowest aerial is frame 7. And it's a killmove. With the angle of Roy's killmoves, plus decent DI, Luigi doesn't die until incredibly late compared to Roy because of Green Missile plus Tornado plus his DJ and upB. And personally, I struggle to edgeguard Luigi as Roy. Most characters have a much easier time of it, but because Roy's offstage presence is nearly nonexistent, and Luigi being very floaty and able to go very low as well makes him difficult to guard offstage. Then his tornado and ability to save his DJ for so long with green missile taking care of the horizontal means that edgehogs can be difficult to make effective.

Thoughts?

 

[Taytertot]

Also, since everyone hates the Luigi MU it seems like, can we talk about that? I don't really like it, either.

I get the feeling that it isn't actually unfavorable (though correct me if you think I'm wrong, it may well be), but I think Roy struggles with a lot of different aspects of how Luigi functions.

Luigi has a frame-2 jab, a frame-3 sex kick, a frame-5 dsmash, and his slowest aerial is frame 7. And it's a killmove. With the angle of Roy's killmoves, plus decent DI, Luigi doesn't die until incredibly late compared to Roy because of Green Missile plus Tornado plus his DJ and upB. And personally, I struggle to edgeguard Luigi as Roy. Most characters have a much easier time of it, but because Roy's offstage presence is nearly nonexistent, and Luigi being very floaty and able to go very low as well makes him difficult to guard offstage. Then his tornado and ability to save his DJ for so long with green missile taking care of the horizontal means that edgehogs can be difficult to make effective.

Thoughts?

Well i think that this is an annoying mu for roy. my only guess as to how it should be played would be to, unfortunately, camp it out as if youre a marth that plays too safe and not go for many combos because of luigi's weight and nair. So probably a lot of waiting and dtilt or ftilt to just add up small percent because from what ive seen, one of luigi's weaknesses is that he has short range attacks meaning that as long as roy plays the space game, he should be able to keep luigi at bay. I actually feel that edgeguarding should get roy some extra percent each time if roy plays it careful and doesnt really try to follow up. The reason I think that we should get some free percent during edgeguarding is because trying to sweetspot the ledge for luigi seems pretty difficult. If im wrong on that then nevermind, but if the luigi cant sweetspot the ledge every time then that should give roy a chance to dtilt or down angled ftilt at max range without fear of being interrupted by luigi's recovery, which would possibly put luigi in a situation where roy might be able to catch him again as luigi tries to grab the ledge. But, this leads to a very boring, very long game of poking and if luigi gets in then he definitely gets better punishes and better combos, so roy has to play very safe and be prepared for those long wavedash and waveland approaches.

 

[Taytertot]

Alright so I was watching sethlon vs azer IaB22 again and it made curious how bad/good the roy vs falco and roy vs snake mu's are. Obviously, sethlon made it look easy but unfortunately we cant all be sethlon, so I wanted to know what those mu's are like in reality?

 

[Deleted member]

Falco Roy is like even ish

I think roy beats snake due to snakes less than amazing neutral game and lack of ability to get back on the ground vs roy. They both punish eachother kind of hard though.

 

[Taytertot]

Cool. I had a feeling that roy had the advantage vs snake cause snake doesnt deal with juggles and is pretty easy to edgeguard though I wanted to make sure.

Falco I was less sure about because I could see it being somewhat even, but I could also see it being rough for roy due to lasers and falco's pressure game. Roy can combo falco but it seemed like falco could more easily get in and out vs roy and the roy player would generally have to play a more perfect game then the falco player to avoid falco's shenanigans and not quite so much vice versa.

 

[Deleted member]

I find it fairly easy to power shield falcos lasers by setting whichever jump button (y or x) that you don't use to shield. It makes neutral easier, because if you PS a few of falcos lasers then the falco player gets impatient and just runs at you lmao

 

[Taytertot]

Oh ok i'll have to try that. I do need to work on my power shielding but ive never tried setting x to shield. Thanks for then info.

 

[NTG]

I'm having serious issues against Ivysaur. Like, borderline unbeatable for me. I just feel like all her attacks interrupt mine and she can zone me out so easily. Have issues with Sheik and DK too, though not as bad...any advice on a secondary? Been using Zard mostly, but he has trouble with those matchups too.

 

[Ghetto Blush]

If you're getting zoned by a projectile like Razor Leaf then you probably just need to work on your movement. It's super easy to avoid that move and it's pretty punishable. One really easy thing you can do is to punish her tether since she doesn't have any other way to get on stage. You could probably go for a ledge hop uair when she jumps up followed by an immediate bair.

 

[Taytertot]

How do i fight squirtle? i feel like this is a very odd mu. Im not entirely sure how i should be approaching it because squirtle has a few armor moves as well as a kinda hit and runesque strat and can kinda just dash back and forth waiting for something to punish. What should i be doing?

 

[thechosenjuan]

Well my training partner mains Squirtle, and I'd like to think he's pretty good in the big picture of Squirtle players. First off, Roy is a great counter to Squirtle. You can crouch cancel his withdraw, dtilt, and his weight is nice for any combos you can get off. Roy has some good grab mixups with fthrow and dthrow. You should really take advantage of the neutral, because unfortunately, you are still Roy and will lose the offstage game hard. He has really easy dropzone gimps, his nair can armor thru your recover. His back air stays out for quite some time, and it lingers there, and his tail is intangible during his bair. Of course like most characters while squirtle is a good character to combo, Roy is still gonna be comboed hard by squirtle. Edgeguarding is a tricky one as Roy, or anyone really, Squirtle's recover is very safe. Good range and good hitboxes to make him difficult to hit. Be careful with his hydroplaning and what not. His fsmash and dsmash have armor, so usually hydroplane dsmash is a good approach tool. His bubble works really well in the neutral. He can come over and mess you up out of a dash dance or something with bubble.
Just do your best to bait him out, if he's on you, try your best not to spot dodge, I've learned how scary Squirtle's dsmash is, how long it stays out and how good it is for followups. Dash Dancing is really effective, you should do your best to let him engage, and punish him.

If you have any specific questions, I can do the best of my ability to answer them.

 

[Taytertot]

Well my training partner mains Squirtle, and I'd like to think he's pretty good in the big picture of Squirtle players. First off, Roy is a great counter to Squirtle. You can crouch cancel his withdraw, dtilt, and his weight is nice for any combos you can get off. Roy has some good grab mixups with fthrow and dthrow. You should really take advantage of the neutral, because unfortunately, you are still Roy and will lose the offstage game hard. He has really easy dropzone gimps, his nair can armor thru your recover. His back air stays out for quite some time, and it lingers there, and his tail is intangible during his bair. Of course like most characters while squirtle is a good character to combo, Roy is still gonna be comboed hard by squirtle. Edgeguarding is a tricky one as Roy, or anyone really, Squirtle's recover is very safe. Good range and good hitboxes to make him difficult to hit. Be careful with his hydroplaning and what not. His fsmash and dsmash have armor, so usually hydroplane dsmash is a good approach tool. His bubble works really well in the neutral. He can come over and mess you up out of a dash dance or something with bubble.
Just do your best to bait him out, if he's on you, try your best not to spot dodge, I've learned how scary Squirtle's dsmash is, how long it stays out and how good it is for followups. Dash Dancing is really effective, you should do your best to let him engage, and punish him.

If you have any specific questions, I can do the best of my ability to answer them.

Wow thanks!

I am curious how i should be handling the hit and run tactics of squirtle. the Squirtle player i know from a smash club here generally just dashes back and forth in neutral waiting for me to do something punishable and ive yet to get any impatience from the squirtle player on that front. So, ive been trying to use dtilt to catch the dashes as squirtle is coming towards me but if i whiff it i seem to be getting punished with nair or fair, maybe thats me having a poor reaction after whiffing? What things should i be doing vs squirtles different moves (i.e. fair, nair, bair etc.)?

I'm having serious issues against Ivysaur. Like, borderline unbeatable for me. I just feel like all her attacks interrupt mine and she can zone me out so easily. Have issues with Sheik and DK too, though not as bad...any advice on a secondary? Been using Zard mostly, but he has trouble with those matchups too.

I actually think that this is supposed to be a somewhat difficult mu for roy. If the ivysaur player is really smart then ivysaur can starve roy of good interactions and out range roy with her own dtilt. Once you get in past ivysaurs farthest range you should have a good opportunity to catch ivysaur with something and put her into a bad position. From there ivysaur becomes much easier to deal with because ivysaur kinda relies on having that spacing and roy can combo her pretty well with dtilt, uair, and fair after youve broken down that spacing defense. Remeber when playing against ivysaur that she has very poor choices in the air vs roy so if you can get ivysaur above you, you should be getting really hard combos and punishes (just space yourself so that ivysaur cant get out of your combo with nair).

 

[thechosenjuan]

Wow thanks!

I am curious how i should be handling the hit and run tactics of squirtle. the Squirtle player i know from a smash club here generally just dashes back and forth in neutral waiting for me to do something punishable and ive yet to get any impatience from the squirtle player on that front. So, ive been trying to use dtilt to catch the dashes as squirtle is coming towards me but if i whiff it i seem to be getting punished with nair or fair, maybe thats me having a poor reaction after whiffing? What things should i be doing vs squirtles different moves (i.e. fair, nair, bair etc.)?




I actually think that this is supposed to be a somewhat difficult mu for roy. If the ivysaur player is really smart then ivysaur can starve roy of good interactions and out range roy with her own dtilt. Once you get in past ivysaurs farthest range you should have a good opportunity to catch ivysaur with something and put her into a bad position. From there ivysaur becomes much easier to deal with because ivysaur kinda relies on having that spacing and roy can combo her pretty well with dtilt, uair, and fair after youve broken down that spacing defense. Remeber when playing against ivysaur that she has very poor choices in the air vs roy so if you can get ivysaur above you, you should be getting really hard combos and punishes (just space yourself so that ivysaur cant get out of your combo with nair).

So with whiffing a dtilt, like hitting it with the tip of your sword? You should wavedash back or start dash dancing to reset the neutral. What things do you mean for squirtles aerials, like DI and stuff?

 

[Taytertot]

So with whiffing a dtilt, like hitting it with the tip of your sword? You should wavedash back or start dash dancing to reset the neutral. What things do you mean for squirtles aerials, like DI and stuff?

Missing dtilt completely because of the weird things squirtle can do with shellshifting. And for the aerials DI as well as what moves roy's got to counter squirtles moveset (i.e. fair stuffing squirtle's fair). It just feels like an odd mu to play since squirtle has so many movement options. Though, I think roy has a chain grab on squirtle for a fair amount of percent, but i could be wrong.

 

[thechosenjuan]

Missing dtilt completely because of the weird things squirtle can do with shellshifting. And for the aerials DI as well as what moves roy's got to counter squirtles moveset (i.e. fair stuffing squirtle's fair). It just feels like an odd mu to play since squirtle has so many movement options. Though, I think roy has a chain grab on squirtle for a fair amount of percent, but i could be wrong.

Use that sword! Roy has great spacing and is able to keep a lot of characters out with shffl'ed fairs and nairs.
Roy's fthrow and dthrow have DI mixups and can chain really well on Squirtle, fthrow->grab->dthrow, follow up with more grabs or fair to start a combo, etc.

 

[Smolder]

Missing dtilt completely because of the weird things squirtle can do with shellshifting. And for the aerials DI as well as what moves roy's got to counter squirtles moveset (i.e. fair stuffing squirtle's fair). It just feels like an odd mu to play since squirtle has so many movement options. Though, I think roy has a chain grab on squirtle for a fair amount of percent, but i could be wrong.

Squirtle players do tend to follow a strictly reactionary playstyle. If they find that you aren't throwing moves for punishment, though, they will attempt to slowly push you to the ledge to cut off your options. If you just play patient, you'll find that they will eventually go in on you. Once they do, outspace them with your disjoint and see if you can set up a tech chase situation. Squirtle's tech roll has got to be one of the worst in the game. Not only does it not go far, but it is also vulnerable mid-roll! A well-spaced fsmash actually covers most of his tech options. It's actually kind of stupid. Oh, and if the Squirtle player doesn't know how to deal with CC, make sure to utilize it a lot. There are some small tricks a Squirtle can use to get around CC, but most Squirtles don't know about them. If you can ever stuff a Squirtle with a jab on one of their approaches, try to follow up with a grab. Roy's grab follow ups on Squirtle can be a little bit ludicrous seeing as Squirtle doesn't live for very long and Roy's fsmash kills floatier characters pretty early. If you can catch a Squirtle DI'ing incorrectly for one of your throws, and he's near the ledge, just fsmash him.

A good stage to take Squirtle to, in my opinion, would have to be a stage with a small ceiling or walls (But the player will probably ban those stages) or take him to Smashville. The reason why I say Smashville is because if you can bait him onto the platform and get a grab, you can throw him in the direction that platform is moving and almost always get a nasty followup such as fsmash, usmash, or even dsmash. This, combined with Squirtle's lightness, will kill him pretty early.

So, just play patiently, and wait for his/her approaches. If a Squirtle player pushes you towards the edge of the stage, you can almost always guarantee that they are about to go for something. Once they go for something, stuff them and look for grab opportunities (Although sometimes they can duck under your grab, so keep that in mind).

 

[Taytertot]

Awesome! thanks for the advice! Next friday i will use this (assuming the squirtle player makes it to the smash club that day) and see how successful i am with it.

 

[Brim]

What are your guys' favorite matchups?

least favorite matchups?

Least favorite Matchups vs
Favorite - (All include vs Roy)
I just found out my least favorite is apparently Jiggs vs Roy. She's a pain to deal with, especially when your opponent is hitting ALL their rests. Or enough to the point where if I can avoid it, I need to have my shield up almost literally by the time it's going to hit. Provided I'm on the ground.

 

[Taytertot]

I tried those strategies vs squirtle yesterday and it worked very well. i won maybe a bit more then half the games i played with the squirtle player, which is a considerable improvement. thanks for all the help.

 

[thechosenjuan]

I tried those strategies vs squirtle yesterday and it worked very well. i won maybe a bit more then half the games i played with the squirtle player, which is a considerable improvement. thanks for all the help.

Good job!

 

[Smolder]

I tried those strategies vs squirtle yesterday and it worked very well. i won maybe a bit more then half the games i played with the squirtle player, which is a considerable improvement. thanks for all the help.

That's great to hear, man! Keep up the good work.

 

[TeeJay308]

I don't know how viable it is against good Squirtle players, but I was at a smashfest this weekend, and there was a relatively new player who played Squirtle. I could DownB counter his UpB recovery pretty much all the time. That was the only way I could edgeguard Squirtle, the UpB beat everything else.

 

[Smolder]

I don't know how viable it is against good Squirtle players, but I was at a smashfest this weekend, and there was a relatively new player who played Squirtle. I could DownB counter his UpB recovery pretty much all the time. That was the only way I could edgeguard Squirtle, the UpB beat everything else.

Sadly, this isn't very effective against decent Squirtles. Squirtle's disjoint at the end of his up-B should be enough to eat a counter while he sweet spots. I know this because I play Dad (The US's best Squirtle) all the time and every time I go for the counter gimp, his up-B will eat it, he'll sweet spot, and then ledgehop bubble punish me.

 

[Aesir]

I have issues with a few match ups for 3.5 if these were covered already could you just point me to the page number? Anyway I have issues with:

Charizard: It feels like he wins the neutral because his spacing tool (ftilt) always catches me off guard. It feels like he can do almost anything he wants and I'm very limited in what I can do. So any input would be nice.

Diddy: This match up I feel was a lot easier in 3.02 which is odd since roy stayed mostly the same and diddy got nerfed. Just feels like Roys weight and fall speed make it perfect for diddy to run train on you.

Other not worthy match ups I'm occasionally having issues with: g&w, DK, ness, lucas.

any input on any of these match ups would be helpful.

 

[Taytertot]

I have issues with a few match ups for 3.5 if these were covered already could you just point me to the page number? Anyway I have issues with:

Charizard: It feels like he wins the neutral because his spacing tool (ftilt) always catches me off guard. It feels like he can do almost anything he wants and I'm very limited in what I can do. So any input would be nice.

Diddy: This match up I feel was a lot easier in 3.02 which is odd since roy stayed mostly the same and diddy got nerfed. Just feels like Roys weight and fall speed make it perfect for diddy to run train on you.

Other not worthy match ups I'm occasionally having issues with: g&w, DK, ness, lucas.

any input on any of these match ups would be helpful.

For charizard Id recommend that you try to bait something out because charizard's moves generally have a lot of end lag and I believe you should be able to punish ftilt if you can bait it by going in and then pulling back to space just outside it and then hit him with your own ftilt or wavedash in and dtilt. As with all heavy characters charizard hits hard but has slow attacks over all (even his jab comes out on something like frame 7 i believe; still quick but slower then most jabs). His attacks, like most heavies, cover large areas, but again if you can bait it out and then punish the miss you should be all good cause roy combos charizard quite well. The thing to watch out for is that charizard has a very quick dash for a heavy character so be prepared (a good ftilt or dtilt should stuff any attempted grab as long as you space yourself so that he cant get in as your landing. In essence, dont be the first one to commit while your in neutral and you'll be golden.

The other mu's i dont know about so i'll leave that to a more knowledgeable player.

 

[Aesir]

You're probably right on the zard match up. For some reason I never bait on Roy it's probably the weakest part of my game with him.

 

[Taytertot]

Id recommend analyzing some of sethlon's sets and looking at each movement choice he makes because he is awesome at it. He has a few gif examples of choices he makes in his roy guide here on the smashboards and if you slow it down to half speed and read the paragraph he wrote describing his thought processes it may help you with baiting. Otherwise its kinda something that develops as you continue to use it on different players.

 

[thechosenjuan]

How do we all feel about the Ivy matchup? What are some options on getting in on her? She's really good at zoning out with a mixture of Razor Leafs and seed bombs. Any advice you guys and gals would have would be awesome!

 

[Smolder]

How do we all feel about the Ivy matchup? What are some options on getting in on her? She's really good at zoning out with a mixture of Razor Leafs and seed bombs. Any advice you guys and gals would have would be awesome!

I don't have much advice to give on this MU, because I don't get to play many Ivy's, but can't you just jab the razor leaf?

 

[Taytertot]

How do we all feel about the Ivy matchup? What are some options on getting in on her? She's really good at zoning out with a mixture of Razor Leafs and seed bombs. Any advice you guys and gals would have would be awesome!

If the ivysaur is good at zoning then i imagine this mu being pretty rough for roy. ivysaur has pretty much the same range as roy and a much better defense game then roy does (though not the greatest offensive game unlike roy). I think you can jab or sideB (now that it can clank) the razor leaves but if you do while close to ivysaur then I believe ivysaur can punish you or at least put more pressure on you because of the hitlag. If you're really good at perfect or power shielding then thats certainly an option. The one thing that is really good in this MU is that ivysaur doesnt have a whole lot of good aerial options. Not to say her aerials are crap but they are more for combos and catching the opponents laggy approach options but her aerials dont cover everywhere very well. Ivy's fair takes a long time to get diagonally below her and her bair takes a bit of time to do the same in the opposite direction (though not quite as bad). Her uair and dair dont have a very far vertical range so roys uair should outrange her dair. Her movement is also very crappy in the air. Not sure if any of that helps much but that's what i know.

There are also a few matches between sethlon and denti on youtube that might help with understanding how to play the MU.