How do you start off a match?

[Leafplayer452]

I made this thread for us to discuss the best ways to start off a match with Sheik, I'll even start us off:

Should we use usmash earlier to rank up a decent amount of early damage?

I say that because, if we use that as our first attack on our opponent then chances are we are going to have to use a whole lot of other attack on our opponent, and by when your opponent is in killing percentage, the usmash will be off the decay chart and at full power (Correct me if I'm wrong please)

Anyway from that, post what you do to start off a match, even for a speific character like I do this when facing a Falco: jump ---> charge needle (til I hear the "needle charge sound" once) ----> jump ----> needle charge til I hit the ground. And its actually works for me!

 

[Zankoku]

Against Falco I start off by facing away and crouching to see how he uses his lasers.

Usually I start off by charging needles.

 

[choknater]

charge needles

crouch if u see laser/arrow coming

 

[saviorslegacy]

*crouch to avoid any projectiles

I throw a single Needle and then charge Needle's.

 

[Steel]

i throw one needle

then attack

 

[KRDsonic]

Against characters without projectiles: Charge Needles

Against characters with quick projectiles: Double Jump > Needle Charge, then repeat until I'm done.

 

[<π]

throw one needle then charge.
charge and throw two needles.
full jump and charge.
fall though plat and charge.
fall through plat and throw one needle.

 

[saviorslegacy]

To just sum it up.
Needles= what the cool kids are doing.
Thus every match should be started this way.

 

[choknater]

DACUS at the start

 

[Steel]

then you dacus back to where u started amirite

chok dacus camping ftw

 

[Lore]

you are probably the best Dacus camper ever chok.

what I do:
needles then walk

 

[Leafplayer452]

LOL DACUS start FTW

 

[Crossjeremiah]

lol. what i do. is i throw a needle. and wait till my opponent makes its move then punish it.

 

[<π]

I wanna play you dacusers... I'd down smash you on reaction!

 

[Dr. Hyde]

If I'm on BF I single needle then attack

any other place charge needles or duck and cover

 

[Lythium]

Charge needles. Throw needles. Dash towards my opponent, jump over my opponent and give 'em a good ol' back air.

It sounds weird, but almost every opponent expects a dash attack, and it works every single time for me.

 

[PHiL Gee]

If its Final Destination or Smashville, I usually start with charging my needles, sometimes I dash in against a heavy character like Ganondorf. Other stages, short hop nair(battlefield, lylat cruise, pokemon stadium). If I face a Pit, Falco, Fox, I usually crouch if its on Final Destination or Smashville, or fall under followed by a forward jump nair or fair if its Lylat cruise or pokemon stadium, battlefield.

 

[Steel]

this thread should be renamed

"How do you start off a match if your b button is disabled?"

 

[JackieRabbit5]

if they're within range i'll start w/ chain sometimes heh

 

[Zankoku]

this thread should be renamed

"How do you start off a match if your b button is disabled?"

I'd remap my Y button to "Special" and charge needles.

 

[Steel]

I'd remap my Y button to "Special" and charge needles.

Ankoku.

Always one step ahead of me.

I will return~

 

[Leafplayer452]

:

Should we use usmash earlier to rank up a decent amount of early damage?

I say that because, if we use that as our first attack on our opponent then chances are we are going to have to use a whole lot of other attack on our opponent, and by when your opponent is in killing percentage, the usmash will be off the decay chart and at full power (Correct me if I'm wrong please)

I think some people didn't read my question T_____T

 

[JackieRabbit5]

well the title is misleading and doesn't mention decay =P

sounds like u have a good idea there though...might as well take a few risks earlier in the match then play it safer later

 

[Tristan_win]

More or less the same as everyone else has stated but on mostly flat stages such as FD or smashville I'll sometimes double jump into needle charge since doing so avoid most opening range attacks immediately. If I notice them charging forward after I've used up my jumps I cancel the needles and start di towards the edge. I suppose if they came out running some characters could reach you before you grab the ledge but most of those are without a range attack and this set up isn't meant for them. When it comes to attacking in those ultra low %s (0-10) I wont use
Ftilt (next to completely useless and will be more useful in higher %)
jack chain(it will freeze the game if you use it that soon in the match, first 10 moves remember that)
jump into chain(in pure fear I may get jack)
normal chain(no reason really it's just easier to land something else)
vanish( too high risk, there's always a better option at %)
fsmash( I just don't use the fsmash normally)

Usually once they reach around 10% I'll start attempting dtilt combos unless I can manage to get them into a "AAA" rapid jabs, needle storm, smash attack, grab(which can combo at those %s) that would exceed that then...

If I continue I would be giving away too much of my style and would have to start talking about different characters lunch resistances as well

 

[saviorslegacy]

More or less the same as everyone else has stated but on mostly flat stages such as FD or smashville I'll sometimes double jump into needle charge since doing so avoid most opening range attacks immediately. If I notice them charging forward after I've used up my jumps I cancel the needles and start di towards the edge. I suppose if they came out running some characters could reach you before you grab the ledge but most of those are without a range attack and this set up isn't meant for them. When it comes to attacking in those ultra low %s (0-10) I wont use
Ftilt (next to completely useless and will be more useful in higher %)
jack chain(it will freeze the game if you use it that soon in the match, first 10 moves remember that)
jump into chain(in pure fear I may get jack)
normal chain(no reason really it's just easier to land something else)
vanish( too high risk, there's always a better option at %)
fsmash( I just don't use the fsmash normally)

Usually once they reach around 10% I'll start attempting dtilt combos unless I can manage to get them into a "AAA" rapid jabs, needle storm, smash attack, grab(which can combo at those %s) that would exceed that then...

If I continue I would be giving away too much of my style and would have to start talking about different characters lunch resistances as well

Woooow... Tristan doesn't jack at the beginning!?!?!?!? That is like the best thing to do.

 

[Canvasofgrey]

Needles. Lol

 

[Zankoku]

I think some people didn't read my question T_____T

It's a bad idea not because of decay, but because a random usmash from across the stage is something that gets shielded and punished.

 

[<π]

but ankoku I thought DACUS was unpunishable!

 

[rathy Aro]

I'm training myself not to start with ftilt since a decayed ftilt is useless at lower percents and ftilt is always useless under ~15. So I start of with jabs-> grab or dtilt for ground game and bairs and fairs for air game. I wouldn't use usmash, not for decay reasons, but because its sorta easily punished, but if you can get it off at that percent safely, go ahead.

 

[<π]

ftilt grab *****. it's a little charcater dependant but it beats most people out in terms of reaction time and junk.

also needles. puts people above 15 fast. Love needles and they'll love you.

 

[rathy Aro]

ftilt grab *****. it's a little charcater dependant but it beats most people out in terms of reaction time and junk.

also needles. puts people above 15 fast. Love needles and they'll love you.

At low percents, no. Ftilt just doesn't give you that kind of frame advantage, and once people notice they'll just hit you with something faster, possibly a grab if you ftilt at 0.

 

[legion598]

charge needles>DACUS/approach use the needles later

 

[Zankoku]

At low percents, no. Ftilt just doesn't give you that kind of frame advantage, and once people notice they'll just hit you with something faster, possibly a grab if you ftilt at 0.

Actually, from 0-30%, the frame advantage ranges anywhere from -1 to +4. This doesn't give you enough advantage to combo into another ftilt (+5 or more), but it's also not enough for the opponent to outright grab you (-4 or less). Very often the common response to a low % ftilt is to try to shield the second one, which is why ftilt grab does indeed tend to work.

 

[saviorslegacy]

k.....

I prefer the Fair/Bair> u-tilt> grab> ???
combo at low percents.

 

[KRDsonic]

At lower percents, if I Ftilt too early without realizing, I'll just do Ftilt > Jab > Grab. My opponents never seem to react on time when they can.


(I also just realized that I don't just start off charging matches with needles, I'll dash and do a short up needle charge, and on Smashville, I'll start out hopping towards the platform to where I know I'll land on it and start charging needles before I even land, just for safety)

 

[rathy Aro]

Actually, from 0-30%, the frame advantage ranges anywhere from -1 to +4. This doesn't give you enough advantage to combo into another ftilt (+5 or more), but it's also not enough for the opponent to outright grab you (-4 or less). Very often the common response to a low % ftilt is to try to shield the second one, which is why ftilt grab does indeed tend to work.

I meant they could grab if you first if you try to grab. People have gotten used to my ftilt to grab (which used to be all I do at that percent) and no one falls for it anymore not even lvl 9 cpus. I've pretty much been scared out of ftilting at those percents.

 

[goodkid]

I needle camp as much as possible @ low %. Then you can figure how well your opponent will respond to the needles, some get aggravated, some are relaxed. Sometimes, I'll just run right behind my opponent to see what they do. This is rarely punished because of Sheik's speed. Pivot grab could work, and maybe turn-around needles...is that possible?

 

[DarkThundah]

How I start? up taunt. nuff said

 

[Crossjeremiah]

How I start? up taunt. nuff said

2nd


and good you shouldn't needle camp you have way more options than that... i like ending my matches asap. but thats just me and it maybe an weakness of mine but my matches tend to be like 3:30 min or less. you can needle camp a lil. to have your opponent distracted with you dodging needles then you can punish like so xD