Holy Crap, IGN <3's P:M!

[Steelia]

People need time but don't worry, eventually everyone will love Project M.

It's not that I don't like the project, or what everyone working on it is doing... It's awesome to see SSBM-esque things being implemented for a modern audience to enjoy, and actually being recognized for it. I wasn't a backer of the project until I saw some random Project M Sonic footage, among other things. Also, Wario's new side-b is amazing.

Sarcasm or not, the problem is that... it's Brawl. Personally, just looking at that game, or hearing anything about it, pisses me off to unheard fanboyrage levels.

I WANT to like Project M as much as SSBM. But when it's associated with THAT game, a game that's become the bane of my SSB-fanboy's existence . . . Liking Project M means for me to play Brawl, and to enjoy it under a different skin. It's all psychological. If more elements of SSBB can be replaced (sound effects mostly; the menu revamp was a great one), then... maybe. Just maybe. Project M looks so promising, exciting, and actually looks like fun. I find no enjoyment out of SSBB due to its completely overindulgence in the media, its ****ing on nostalgia, and its brainwashing of the masses . . . yet Project M promises to offer the exact opposite of this.

wth.


tl;dr SSBB scarred me for life hard to like Project M because of it.

 

[♡ⓛⓞⓥⓔ♡]

It's not that I don't like the project, or what everyone working on it is doing... It's awesome to see SSBM-esque things being implemented for a modern audience to enjoy, and actually being recognized for it. I wasn't a backer of the project until I saw some random Project M Sonic footage, among other things. Also, Wario's new side-b is amazing.

Sarcasm or not, the problem is that... it's Brawl. Personally, just looking at that game, or hearing anything about it, pisses me off to unheard fanboyrage levels.

I WANT to like Project M as much as SSBM. But when it's associated with THAT game, a game that's become the bane of my SSB-fanboy's existence . . . Liking Project M means for me to play Brawl, and to enjoy it under a different skin. It's all psychological. If more elements of SSBB can be replaced (sound effects mostly; the menu revamp was a great one), then... maybe. Just maybe. Project M looks so promising, exciting, and actually looks like fun. I find no enjoyment out of SSBB due to its completely overindulgence in the media, its ****ing on nostalgia, and its brainwashing of the masses . . . yet Project M promises to offer the exact opposite of this.

wth.


tl;dr SSBB scarred me for life hard to like Project M because of it.

You pretty much summed up why most of my friends (being hardcore Melee fans) dislike Project M. Coincidently, for some strange reason, they also happen dislike Brawl. What a ****ing surprise.

This dislike started when, after the release, they realized that Brawl would NEVER be Melee. Ever.

"Brawl made me realize how good Melee is"

Yet EVERYONE expected and hoped for something as "awesome" (relative Melee-bias). I'm not ashamed to admit that I did. Anyone remember:

-Checking the Brawl Dojo every day, multiple times, before the release?
-Screaming in agony when Brawl was delayed (several times)?
-Playing imported Brawl because you were too anxious to wait to release in your region?

I've seen quite a bit of first-impressions on the Project M since the release and they always seem to follow the same pattern, even the PHRASES people say are sometimes exactly the same:

1. Start the game
2. Pick a Melee character. Remember, Brawl = bad, Melee = good. Keep it safe
3. Play silently for few minutes & make observations
4. Take ANY-****ing-THING that is different from Melee (graphics, sound effects, character voices, announcer voice etc.)
5. Start complaining, let it out and do it fast:

"Isn't this supposed to be Melee 2.0?"

"Why haven't they changed 'x'?

"OMG 'x' IS DIFFERENT FROM MELEE AND I DON'T LIKE IT"

"Melee is so much better than this ****"

"WHY CAN'T I DO 'x'? I can do it in Melee every single time!"

"This game sucks!"

7. Repeat step 5. for any duration of matches
8. Curse Brawl
9. Ignore EVERYTHING that is totally ****ing AWESOME about Project M
10. Pop in a Melee disc
11. Curse Sakurai
12. Never, ever play Project M again. I mean come on, the game sucks.
You know this for a fact because you have played Melee since 2002.
That makes you a ****ing Project M expert.

Things people fail to realize:

- Project M is a completely new game.
Playing Melee doesn't make you an expert at it.
Learn to play the game, you scrub.

- For ****s sake, the PMBR is doing this without any pay. And they have done it for over 2 years now spending countless hours on the project.

- PMBR =/= HAL or Nintendo.

- Project M =/= Melee 1.1

-It's DEMO 2. NOT the final release.

 

[Strong Badam]

whoa bro calm down
i love PM as much as the next guy but that's not the way to sell it lol

 

[♡ⓛⓞⓥⓔ♡]

whoa bro calm down
i love PM as much as the next guy but that's not the way to sell it lol

I'm not part of PMBR and I'm not a P:M salesman.
I'm a mentally disturbed Melee addict who thinks P:M is the future of Smash.

I also find Melee to be the better game of the two, for now.

But seriously, if Brawl would have been Project M I wouldn't have to deal with this ****.

 

[Mr.Jackpot]

You pretty much summed up why most of my friends (being hardcore Melee fans) dislike Project M. Coincidently, for some strange reason, they also happen dislike Brawl. What a ****ing surprise.

This dislike started when, after the release, they realized that Brawl would NEVER be Melee. Ever.

"Brawl made me realize how good Melee is"

Yet EVERYONE expected and hoped for something as "awesome" (relative Melee-bias). I'm not ashamed to admit that I did. Anyone remember:

-Checking the Brawl Dojo every day, multiple times, before the release?
-Screaming in agony when Brawl was delayed (several times)?
-Playing imported Brawl because you were too anxious to wait to release in your region?

I've seen quite a bit of first-impressions on the Project M since the release and they always seem to follow the same pattern, even the PHRASES people say are sometimes exactly the same:

1. Start the game
2. Pick a Melee character. Remember, Brawl = bad, Melee = good. Keep it safe
3. Play silently for few minutes & make observations
4. Take ANY-****ing-THING that is different from Melee (graphics, sound effects, character voices, announcer voice etc.)
5. Start complaining, let it out and do it fast:

"Isn't this supposed to be Melee 2.0?"

"Why haven't they changed 'x'?

"OMG 'x' IS DIFFERENT FROM MELEE AND I DON'T LIKE IT"

"Melee is so much better than this ****"

"WHY CAN'T I DO 'x'? I can do it in Melee every single time!"

"This game sucks!"

7. Repeat step 5. for any duration of matches
8. Curse Brawl
9. Ignore EVERYTHING that is totally ****ing AWESOME about Project M
10. Pop in a Melee disc
11. Curse Sakurai
12. Never, ever play Project M again. I mean come on, the game sucks.
You know this for a fact because you have played Melee since 2002.
That makes you a ****ing Project M expert.

Things people fail to realize:

- Project M is a completely new game.
Playing Melee doesn't make you an expert at it.
Learn to play the game, you scrub.

- For ****s sake, the PMBR is doing this without any pay. And they have done it for over 2 years now spending countless hours on the project.

- PMBR =/= HAL or Nintendo.

- Project M =/= Melee 1.1

-It's DEMO 2. NOT the final release.

 

[Wobbles]

Project M is bunches of fun IMO. Weirdly enough I execute better in that game than I do in Melee even though I don't enable any buffering >__>

I got to play it for the first time yesterday and had a pretty great time.

Anybody who judges it based on what they think of Brawl is acting dumb for no reason. Especially since so much of Brawl is good and fun and cool (except, IMO, for the gameplay. You know. The thing P:M changes substantially).

 

[Vigilante]

It's great to hear wobbles. I'm keeping close cotnacts with Rich since the day I contacted them and we'll get more coverage from them. Also, I'm working on a little side Project with IGN... I'll call it Project W. Those who know about it, please don't spoil it yet. I just need to get somemone to work on final touchups. Maybe in a week or two?

 

[Deleted member]

- Project M is a completely new game.
Playing Melee doesn't make you an expert at it.
Learn to play the game, you scrub.

I have some issues with PM that get portrayed this way even though it's not the case. The hyperbole is definitely played out on both sides. Particularly when I only picked the melee characters. Again, having nothing to do with brawl, but simply that i like the melee character choices better sans Ike, and I don't like PM Ike at all.

 

[Rubyiris]

I have an easier time with pm also. Zero buffer.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

It's not that I don't like the project, or what everyone working on it is doing... It's awesome to see SSBM-esque things being implemented for a modern audience to enjoy, and actually being recognized for it. I wasn't a backer of the project until I saw some random Project M Sonic footage, among other things. Also, Wario's new side-b is amazing.

Sarcasm or not, the problem is that... it's Brawl. Personally, just looking at that game, or hearing anything about it, pisses me off to unheard fanboyrage levels.

I WANT to like Project M as much as SSBM. But when it's associated with THAT game, a game that's become the bane of my SSB-fanboy's existence . . . Liking Project M means for me to play Brawl, and to enjoy it under a different skin. It's all psychological. If more elements of SSBB can be replaced (sound effects mostly; the menu revamp was a great one), then... maybe. Just maybe. Project M looks so promising, exciting, and actually looks like fun. I find no enjoyment out of SSBB due to its completely overindulgence in the media, its ****ing on nostalgia, and its brainwashing of the masses . . . yet Project M promises to offer the exact opposite of this.

wth.


tl;dr SSBB scarred me for life hard to like Project M because of it.

That is incredibly petty of you to hate PM for.

 

[MysteryRevengerson]

Project M is fun.
Being someone who's played Brawl for years, Project M is easily better.
Glad to see it getting some fame.

Also, not digging the ****ty "I hate Brawl so I'll hate this" reasoning.

 

[Steelia]

That is incredibly petty of you to hate PM for.

It's petty of me to be holding a grudge against a game to begin with.

I don't hate PM. But I do . . . not like . . . the game it's modifying, is what I was getting at.

It's not that I don't like the project

Missed the first line of the post?

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Funny for a project you seemingly don't hate, you seem to still harbor a large grudge against it for trying to getting away from the game you deeply detest.

Just because it was it's origin.

Your first post seems to send conflicting messages in that regard.

tl;dr SSBB scarred me for life hard to like Project M because of it.

And you said this while not hating it?

 

[Steelia]

you seem to still harbor a large grudge against it for trying to getting away from the game you deeply detest.

[...] Your first post seems to send conflicting messages in that regard.

It's... complicated to explain. But I have a feeling I'm not the only one who feels this way.

I hold nothing ill against the project. I want to see where it goes; I even introduced some people to it and some detest SSBB more than me, but were really hyped to see it in action. It's the source we still do not like. And the further away Project M gets away from the source (which they've been successful in doing so far), I think the more it will begin to rub off on all of us.

 

[Deleted member]

true fact, some people are actually just petty.

people don't have to justify themselves when they like/dislike something.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

They don't have to, but I can still point out it makes no sense.

 

[Wobbles]

It certainly helps to understand why you like/dislike something, so you don't come off as a major tool when people point out that it's actually exactly what you said you wanted.

Also, interesting occurrence here, watch Falco carefully: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r7wKgvGdtFA#t=6m21s

 

[♡ⓛⓞⓥⓔ♡]

They don't have to, but I can still point out it makes no sense.

Actually, it does make a lot of sense, for reasons already mentioned in this thread.
I think Steelia was very honest to recognize and admit the cause of his dislike, and also to express in a ironic (himself being the object of it) manner that this "automatic" dislike is exorbitant and partially out of his control.

"tl;dr SSBB scarred me for life hard to like Project M because of it."

Hence I believe you misinterpreted his post when you said:

"That is incredibly petty of you to hate PM for."

I think there's some kind of confirmation bias going on when people are focusing heavily on small things that different between Melee and P:M, and using these trivial differences as evidence to reinforce their opinion, for themselves, of Brawl (and anything associated with it) of being simply bad and certainly inferior to Melee.

This is also the reason why long-term Melee players sometimes fail to see clear shortcomings of Melee as a game.

 

[Revven]

Also, interesting occurrence here, watch Falco carefully: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r7wKgvGdtFA#t=6m21s

Yeah, that's a Brawl cape glitch, nothing that we can probably fix... maybe in the future but it's soooo rare.

 

[♡ⓛⓞⓥⓔ♡]

Also, interesting occurrence here, watch Falco carefully: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r7wKgvGdtFA#t=6m21s

Universal reverse ledge grabbing out of up-b freefall makes Mario's cape utterly useless in edgeguarding.
I don't understand how the PMBR doesn't realize that this shouldn't be universal, this has been brought up in the P:M topic few times. It also causes other problems:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hi27zKeHfMA

 

[Revven]

Universal reverse ledge grabbing out of up-b freefall makes Mario's cape utterly useless in edgeguarding.
I don't understand how the PMBR doesn't realize that this shouldn't be universal, this has been brought up in the P:M topic few times.

He would have grabbed it even without reverse ledgegrabbing, it's a Brawl cape glitch, if you watch it carefully enough the cape hit Falco right as he was still in the Side B action but was also grabbing the ledge at the same time.

Removing universal ledgegrabs wouldn't fix that bug lol. And we already told you that the current way it's done isn't our "ideal" mechanic.

We're still working on the game for a reason. :V

 

[♡ⓛⓞⓥⓔ♡]

He would have grabbed it even without reverse ledgegrabbing, it's a Brawl cape glitch, if you watch it carefully enough the cape hit Falco right as he was still in the Side B action but was also grabbing the ledge at the same time.

Removing universal ledgegrabs wouldn't fix that bug lol. And we already told you that the current way it's done isn't our "ideal" mechanic.

We're still working on the game for a reason. :V

I apologize. I brought up this issue on the P:M thread a while ago and from the response I received I understood that this was purposefully left in the game and would not be changed.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Actually, it does make a lot of sense, for reasons already mentioned in this thread.
I think Steelia was very honest to recognize and admit the cause of his dislike, and also to express in a ironic (himself being the object of it) manner that this "automatic" dislike is exorbitant and partially out of his control.

"tl;dr SSBB scarred me for life hard to like Project M because of it."

Hence I believe you misinterpreted his post when you said:

"That is incredibly petty of you to hate PM for."

I think there's some kind of confirmation bias going on when people are focusing heavily on small things that different between Melee and P:M, and using these trivial differences as evidence to reinforce their opinion, for themselves, of Brawl (and anything associated with it) of being simply bad and certainly inferior to Melee.

This is also the reason why long-term Melee players sometimes fail to see clear shortcomings of Melee as a game.

He hates it because it's a hack of Brawl and as a result must make it bad despite he fact the game's goal was to go back to the Melee roots. Just because it came from it he can't enjoy something that was remade to be what a lot of people in Melee wanted Brawl to be.

He has a reason, but I still think it's bad and or makes no sense.

 

[♡ⓛⓞⓥⓔ♡]

He hates it because it's a hack of Brawl and as a result must make it bad despite he fact the game's goal was to go back to the Melee roots. Just because it came from it he can't enjoy something that was remade to be what a lot of people in Melee wanted Brawl to be.

He has a reason, but I still think it's bad and or makes no sense.

I understand what you mean. From the logical perspective, it doesn't make sense to focus extensively on a trivial details/differences to enforce your opinion about something being "bad" while heavily ignoring the positive aspects/changes.

But from the psychological perspective, it does make sense and it's completely understandable. Actually, it might be even a kind of an natural reaction.

 

[Vigilante]

To be fair, I also modded my Wii just so I don't have to look at the Brawl screen, so I guess I can kind of understand it. But yeah, you eventually can move on and enjoy the game for what it is. He pretty much made a negative association with Brawl. He is conditioned to hate everything that reminds him of Brawl.It takes some effort, but you can get over it. Not playing Project M for that reason will rob you of hours of fun.

I personally don't have much of a reason to play Melee anymore and now find it "bland" since I got Project M. (Melee used to be my favourite game of all time).

 

[KrIsP!]

I want to play PM but I like...unmodded my wii and traded in my twilight princess. Can this be done more easily than it was in the past/does it need to be hacked completely or just need a PM loader?

I feel like Pm could be a lot of fun and whil eI'll agree I'd want melee sfx and models, this could be awesome as a side event.

 

[Kal]

You don't need anything other than a copy of Brawl and an SD card, if I remember correctly. The hack utilizes the stage creator to install unsigned code or something. Don't take my word for any of this with regards to the technical jargon, since I'm... stupid. But basically, there is a "hackless" version, for those who don't want to soft mod their Wiis.

Why did you get rid of the soft mod anyway? The only use I get out of my Wii is through Homebrew.

 

[standardtoaster]

We didn't get rid of it. We still have that method available for download.

 

[Strong Badam]

I'm pretty sure he was specifically talking to KrisP, not the PMBR. <_<

 

[Wobbles]

I didn't find the cape to be useless at all (for the few hours I played, anyhow). Failing an actual KO it would give me a free hit from the cape lift, and it also pushes people back a bit anyhow so sometimes they fell out of ledge range regardless.

 

[KrIsP!]

Why did you get rid of the soft mod anyway? The only use I get out of my Wii is through Homebrew.

TBH, i don't even know. I stopped using my wii 100% for about a year and when i came back it wanted to update and I forgot it was even modded, that got rid of it(but thankfully didn't brick it)

Now I'm too lazy to get homebrew **** back, but PM seems worth it. Can anyone link me to the place i get the program or something since i'm incredibly lazy?

 

[Strong Badam]

http://projectm.dantarion.com/downloads/