His World* Sonic Moveset Analysis/Speculation Thread *UPDATED 9/14/14*

[infomon]

Wait, is the spincharge (down-B) SDJ always a small little one? Is it different than the side-B SDJ? They were the same in the E3 demo but maybe that's changed.

 

[Phoenix_Dark]

Do any of the SC's allow for ASC? That's all I want to know lol. Also, any confirmation on the third up b yet?

 

[Sonic Orochi]

Okay, since all these alternate SC/SD seem to have a low SDJ but the standard version seems to work normally (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TPp_k_ykybY @8:12:17), I'm inclined to think that you can actually do a low SDJ by pressing B and a normal SDJ by using A/jump.

I sure hope this is the case.

 

[infomon]

Wow that would be crazytown

Can't wait to try this stuff out!!! aaaaaa

 

[Masonomace]

Just unlocked some new ones! Here's the second Spring Jump. It's a double spring jump. Nothing too complicated but I like it.

I'm bummed out that my custom specials were a figment, but this is cool! Doing two Spring jumps despite the cut in height, basically makes the 2 tiny spring jumps equal the height of a regular Spring jump. I dig it. Have you tested if you can do aerials after the first spring jump?
Examples: You're combo-stringing & you want to keep juggling:

• 1st Spring jump + U-air + 2nd Spring jump + D-air or U-air or N-air

This varies from their current % ofc.

The second spin charge. Maybe somebody else can figure this one out because I'm really not sure what the difference is. I feel like this one has more momentum? It also applies a burning effect when landing a hit from the air and it feels like it's easier to do an aerial after. Maybe a good way to get a bair in?

@ kid craft 24/sonic master Nope. No specials besides the second spring.

Nice! So this special, definitely looks like not only the spin jump is smaller, but it kind of appears that aerials OoJ look quicker to input. Fast-paced combo's to string into each other looks real. Also burning effect! Flame Ring / Crest of Fire references Idk, but damn! Have you tested if the uncharged VSCJ deals a burning attack at close-range?

Here's the 3rd spin charge. It pulls people in and....I'm not sure what else. It looks kinda cool.

Sonic Wind!
But no, the spinning wind surrounding the spin charge looks sick! Rather a Wind-box blowing them away, instead the wind-box draws them in, interesting! Crest of Wind baby! And it's multi-hitting! It has a burning hit too!? Double Crest OP, 3rd Spin Charge da bess Spin Charge. Just to clarify, does Sonic's regular Spin Charge jump now do a burning attack excluding custom specials? If not, then the 3rd spin charge is clearly the best one in my subjective opinion, that wind seriously! You can use that wind-box property in several mix-ups! If you can't hedge-hog the ledge, then just Spin Charge your wind-box & make people **** up their recovery to grab the ledge! Way better than Spring hazarding imo.

Okay, since all these alternate SC/SD seem to have a low SDJ but the standard version seems to work normally (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TPp_k_ykybY @8:12:17), I'm inclined to think that you can actually do a low SDJ by pressing B and a normal SDJ by using A/jump.

I sure hope this is the case.

I second this. That would make Sonic so technical, Yes!

 

[Skyfox2000]

Massive Update Coming Soon! Sorry I haven't updated mourning over the loss of Snake/Lucas.

 

[PsychoSy]

Can sonic still do his Spin dash Shield cancel?(Correct me if got the name wrong, i've been lurking around in the sonic boards for awhile now...)

 

[Masonomace]

Can sonic still do his Spin dash Shield cancel?(Correct me if got the name wrong, i've been lurking around in the sonic boards for awhile now...)

Indeed he can. SDSC is still a thing for Sm4sh Sonic. And yes you got it right, but you didn't capitalize the D in dash. (kidding)

Also, @Sonicrida have you tested to see if Sonic still has his SpinShot AT from Brawl?

 

[shinhed-echi]

I'm so happy that I'll be able to pick Sonic and play right off the bat, cause it seems he has retained pretty much his whole Brawl moveset.
I'll just have to get used to the new Dsmash and improved spinattack.

Question: Is Nair better or worse this time?

 

[PsychoSy]

I'm watching ZeRo fighting a sonic main atm on http://www.twitch.tv/zero maybe you can get something out of this.

Edit: well he was...

 

[Masonomace]

Question: Is Nair better or worse this time?

Unknown of the exact frame data & hit-bubbles, & only going off by performance & appearance, I don't know I've barely seen it used in any videos / streams. Let's fix that:

At 0:19 he does it as a landing option to hit Ness. It's landing lag looks based off real-time faster than Brawl Sonic's N-air landing. I say it's either the same or slightly better since this game's meta is improved past Brawl

 

[Skyfox2000]

Well Guys. I broke my foot pretty badly so there will a MASSIVE UPDATE Coming Soon.

 

[shinhed-echi]

Well Guys. I broke my foot pretty badly so there will a MASSIVE UPDATE Coming Soon.

Damn, sounds really bad! Hope you get well soon.

 

[Masonomace]

Well Guys. I broke my foot pretty badly so there will a MASSIVE UPDATE Coming Soon.

Get well soon, or get decent soon. Which ever one you like.

Guys, what if, we do a SD/SC attack, then jump+Footstool, ending with a SD since it would plummet straight down to scoop up the footstool falling & guarantee that hit whether it multi-hits or not.

Thoughts?

 

[Skyfox2000]

So it looks like Sonic has a new victory screen in the 3DS game. check out the Intro/Victory Section.

 

[Anthinus]

I'm thinking that SD*2 could be useful when you are grabbing the edge. I'd love to know if Sonic snaps the edge if you "down to sideB" or if Sonic lands on stage if you "back to sideB". Maybe @Sonicrida or @Zipzo could test that

Unknown of the exact frame data & hit-bubbles, & only going off by performance & appearance, I don't know I've barely seen it used in any videos / streams. Let's fix that:

At 0:19 he does it as a landing option to hit Ness. It's landing lag looks based off real-time faster than Brawl Sonic's N-air landing. I say it's either the same or slightly better since this game's meta is improved past Brawl

I spammed UpB in my mind everytime Sonic was trapped in Ness' PK Fire

 

[Skyfox2000]

Added another possible (DLC) Alt. guys.

Should we try to get this sticked Sonic Mains?

 

[Kinzer]

Also, @Sonicrida have you tested to see if Sonic still has his SpinShot AT from Brawl?

It's impossible to test ATM given that the 3DS doesn't have a button or directional pad that functions similar to the C-Stick on the GCC. That was, AFAIK, the only way to perform Spinshots in Brawl.

 

[Masonomace]

It's impossible to test ATM given that the 3DS doesn't have a button or directional pad that functions similar to the C-Stick on the GCC. That was, AFAIK, the only way to perform Spinshots in Brawl.

. .Huh? The way I inputted a Spinshot, was SD > release , then pressed right after, doing the long-distance spinshot. There was no need to use the GCC's at all. The way I think everyone does it is SD > release , then immediately press or . The words underlined in your quote are what baffles me.

EDIT: No problem though, the new 3DSLL getting those C-sticks soon.

 

[Kinzer]

*Snip.*

EDIT: No problem though, the new 3DSLL getting those C-sticks soon.

Uhm~...! *Ahem.* Well, I suppose that's only half the truth. In order to do a SCSS (Spin Charge Spinshot), you had to be in the air and then smack the C-Stick to the left or right. This version of Spinshot was faster to perform than having to wait for SD to go through its pullback. If you tried the other way, I believe you'd just double-jump in place.

However... I would be lying if I said I recall 100% accurately.

 

[Phoenix_Dark]

I'm ashamed to say that if I put in Brawl right now, I would not remember how to spinshot

 

[Masonomace]

Uhm~...! *Ahem.* Well, I suppose that's only half the truth. In order to do a SCSS (Spin Charge Spinshot), you had to be in the air and then smack the C-Stick to the left or right. This version of Spinshot was faster to perform than having to wait for SD to go through its pullback. If you tried the other way, I believe you'd just double-jump in place.

However... I would be lying if I said I recall 100% accurately.

Just re-did it for the memory of popping in Brawl.
And apologies for I was only mentioning SDSS alone & not both SDSS & SCSS. I forgot we could do it grounded & airborne for both SD & SC.

Thankfully there's more than one way to do SCSS other than SC'ing, then flicking C-stick left or right. The SCSS input with C-stick was a 100% guarantee effort, while SC'ing on the ground pressing B then releasing to immediately press A or X or Y. Depending on timing, you got the same exact result, if done slower the SFX of Sonic's spin charge going into a roll is heard then the sound of the jump upon leaving the ground. In the air it's a lot harder to do a SCSS without the C-stick because you had to use some control stick inputs to DI in the same direction you're facing, had to involve something like this:
SH or FH >SC > + or or = SCSS

So we can still SS with or without the C-stick. I say we ask 'em to test it.

 

[Sonic Orochi]

I used to Spinshot by doing SC->up on C-stick.

Worked great on FD's edge (grab ledge->SS->wall jump->SD into stage) and for this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E-PPoBw2umQ

 

[Camalange]

I use c-stick down for both SideB and DownB spinshot. I think it's funny how so many people do it differently. Just another one of the great things about Smash and Sonic.

I have no idea how I'll spinshot on 3DS.

 

[Skyfox2000]

So @ Masonomace is those the official names of the custom moves or the names were going to dub them?

 

[Masonomace]

So @ Masonomace is those the official names of the custom moves or the names were going to dub them?

Mainly just variations with *2 or *3 for now. Unless it's called something specific & we make a term out of it, I'm sticking with *2 and *3

 

[Skyfox2000]

Mainly just variations with *2 or *3 for now. Unless it's called something specific & we make a term out of it, I'm sticking with *2 and *3

So Sonic Wind, Flame Ring and Double Spring it is then.

 

[Zx2963]

I saw in a video that Sonic can cancel his down aerial with shield

 

[Camalange]

Sonic probably daired from the appropriate height to have it autocancel.

 

[Sonic Orochi]

SC2 is, literally, "Auto Spin Charge". Maybe you don't have to hit B to charge it? Sounds pretty useless to me.

HA3 is, also literally, "Quick Homing Attack". I can't exactly read what's written because the vid quality is pretty terrible, but it looks like its range is cut down by a lot.

Spring3 is "Spring Head Attack". This one might be good, if you can combo an Uair after it.

Also, it's official: SCR and SDR have their own distinct characteristics now.

 

[Zx2963]

Sonic probably daired from the appropriate height to have it autocancel.

It was pretty high in the air though .-.

 

[Camalange]

It was pretty high in the air though .-.

That's my point.

Dair doesn't last forever... Once you get past a certain height, the move will end. So if you Dair towards the stage from really high up, by the time you land the move will already be over and you can, for example, shield on landing.

It's the same as Brawl.

 

[Skyfox2000]

So which one of you guys had the idea of a awesome combo with sonic it was.
UpB Spring then Dair them back into the spring and juggle them like that? who had that idea?

EDIT: It was @ kid craft 24/sonic master who had the idea it was called "Spring Trap" Care to explain this to me again?

 

[kid craft 24/sonic master]

I can't remember... although i know i'll definitely be trying SDJ >> Dair Meteor into footstool Spring.

 

[Sonic Orochi]

So which one of you guys had the idea of a awesome combo with sonic it was.
UpB Spring then Dair them back into the spring and juggle them like that? who had that idea?

EDIT: It was @ kid craft 24/sonic master who had the idea it was called "Spring Trap" Care to explain this to me again?

Maybe not exactly what you're looking for but it reminded me of this:

 

[kid craft 24/sonic master]

Basically the gist of spring traps are right as your opponents going to land you spring where they will land forcing them to bounce on the spring from which in brawl most of the time you could possible get a free Bair or Uair off of it. I've also used it against characters with poor aerial mobility to trap their landing options or against players who try to jump back on stage from a ledge on to land on the spring into a Dair. Due to the fact Dair didn't meteor smash it wasn't quite as rewarding but given that it does now it's application as viable setup has increased.

 

[cg0rz152]

SC2 is, literally, "Auto Spin Charge". Maybe you don't have to hit B to charge it? Sounds pretty useless to me.

HA3 is, also literally, "Quick Homing Attack". I can't exactly read what's written because the vid quality is pretty terrible, but it looks like its range is cut down by a lot.

Spring3 is "Spring Head Attack". This one might be good, if you can combo an Uair after it.

Also, it's official: SCR and SDR have their own distinct characteristics now.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but going off of the Custom Moves vid at around 1:40-1:45, it looks like HA3 causes you to rise upwards whenever you whiff the attack. By comparison, HA1 causes you to go at a downward angle when there is no target to lock onto.

To me, using HA1 or even HA2 offstage can be potentially dangerous as it sends you at a downward angle.

Could HA3 be used more effectively as a potential recovery move than HA1? For instance, if you have an opponent trying to edge-guard you, could you not use occasionally use HA3 out of targeting range to briefly stall your approach and make your recovery less predictable?

Another scenario would be if you have an opponent who tries to chase you off the edge, or if you're the one doing the chasing. You could potentially use it as a surprise attack and it'll help your recovery if you're in trouble.

My question is how soon can you act out of a whiffed HA3? I'm curious if it can give you a slightly higher vertical recovery. Say, Jump>Double Jump>HA3>Spring.

Also, if the hop is missing from SideB3 does it snap to the ground when used in the air the way the other 2 Side B moves do? If not, could it provide a better horizontal recovery?

Of course, it's all just theory right now, but I've not seen many vids showing off his custom moves.

 

[Sonic Orochi]

Yep, HA3 does seem viable to use for recovery (at least it seems better than HA1, which has a long delay before you can act again and HA2, which sends you straight downward). We don't know, however, how its lock-on feature works. It may be like HA1's, which is great, or HA2's, which sucks, or even work in a brand new way.

Aerial SD3 is showcased in a video already posted here. It seems to work just like an ASC.

 

[Skyfox2000]

@Hong can we get this Sticked?

 

[Kinzer]

It... already is... question mark.

And since I'm here, can anyone tell me if Sonic still gets cypher-gimped if he's grabbed out of his up-b which doesn't really matter anymore because it auto-snaps; but, it would still be good to know anyway~?