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Hi, New Sheik!

ll Mafia ll

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Mar 12, 2008
Messages
144
Location
AL
Hey Sheik Board.
I have decided to try out Sheik for a while and main her in addition to Samus.

In the Samus boards, I saw the matches between Gimpy and Rohins, and that caused me to look a lot more at Sheik.

So far, I like her. She is really really fast.... a lot faster than Samus.

Oh, and there is more knockback than Samus.

So, I just wanted to ask the Sheik board if there is anything I should take note of.


Thank you
 

choknater

Smash Obsessed
Joined
Dec 25, 2002
Messages
27,296
Location
Modesto, CA
NNID
choknater
besides what the others said....




awesome points to take note of:

- nair and jab both have 2 frame start up. ftilt, bair, fair, dtilt, utilt also have great startup times. and low landing lag. also easy to autocancel. these moves basically dictate why people call sheik "fast"

- champ strategy: dash attack is too good

- choknater strategy: needle and bair so u dont get hit

- DACUS: not as good as tristan makes it out to be, but not as bad as gimpy makes it out to be.
#1. the bottom line about DACUS: don't dwell on it too much, use sparingly if you actually do learn it
#2. DACUS is dumb LOL
always capitalize DACUS

- chain on the other hand, is gay

- needles do 18%

- grabs kinda suck but use them anyway cuz sheik is good at grabbing
 

SinkingHigher

Smash Lord
Joined
May 4, 2008
Messages
1,886
Location
Canada
If you know how to chain, it's not gay.

If you hit someone above you with the chain, it pulls them into perfect chainlock position in one hit.

DACUS is GAY if you can't get it to work. :p

Sorry to confuse you OP.
 

Charoo

Smash Champion
Joined
Aug 16, 2004
Messages
2,981
besides what the others said....




awesome points to take note of:

- nair and jab both have 2 frame start up. ftilt, bair, fair, dtilt, utilt also have great startup times. and low landing lag. also easy to autocancel. these moves basically dictate why people call sheik "fast"

- champ strategy: dash attack is too good

- choknater strategy: needle and bair so u dont get hit

- DACUS: not as good as tristan makes it out to be, but not as bad as gimpy makes it out to be.
#1. the bottom line about DACUS: don't dwell on it too much, use sparingly if you actually do learn it
#2. DACUS is dumb LOL
always capitalize DACUS

- chain on the other hand, is gay

- needles do 18%

- grabs kinda suck but use them anyway cuz sheik is good at grabbing
dash attack is too good. It have about 1.5x ( or more) the range of grab and if you space it right, they can't punish you cause you go pass them really far. Too bad it only does 7% though =(

I been doing dash attack a lot cause I always spam running attack for any char. haha (aka champ combo from melee). I would never know how fast and how much range dash attack is if I didn't fail so much at DACUS haha.
 

-Mars-

Smash Hero
Joined
Jul 26, 2007
Messages
6,515
Location
UTAH
I honestly can say I have never needed to tether.

I suppose it would be better for edge-guarding.
You never tether? wow that's the first time i've ever heard a Sheik player say that. Tether is better than vanish, especially if your playing characters that are great at gimping(Mario,MK). It gets you back to the edge a lot faster than vanish, harder to edgegaurd, great for edgeguarding, and the range is massive.
 

ADHD

Smash Hero
Joined
Feb 18, 2008
Messages
7,194
Location
New Jersey
learn to "DaCUS" after you have everything down pat and it can help kill some shorter characters from a grab release at 90

Sheik's alot better than samus so enjoy the luxury of a higher tier
 

SinkingHigher

Smash Lord
Joined
May 4, 2008
Messages
1,886
Location
Canada
You never tether? wow that's the first time i've ever heard a Sheik player say that. Tether is better than vanish, especially if your playing characters that are great at gimping(Mario,MK). It gets you back to the edge a lot faster than vanish, harder to edgegaurd, great for edgeguarding, and the range is massive.
Have you ever noticed that sometimes the tether JUST misses? THAT is the point where a Vanish would make it but a chain won't.

I've been learning to KO with Vanish Catches and Wind. It works more often than you would think it would if you practice.

Winding an attack with lots of momentum sometimes can get a KO right there if it's early enough. If not, you can follow it up with f-airs. (Like the ones in that gimpy vid). Vanish Catch is less likely to work and requires a ledge-drop > footstool to KO.

Again, gets much easier with practice. I've been obsessing over the 0%-death Zelda combo. That thing is AWESOME. I really want to see someone else do it.
 

colored blind

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Mar 7, 2008
Messages
398
Location
Purdue/West Lafayette
Tether is essential where speed is concerned (prevent someone from gimping/ledgehogging you). Meaning that unless you need the vertical or horizontal distance, go for the tether--anything to make Sheik faster. If you practice it, you won't have to worry about the 'OMG, the chain didn't reach' because you'll know the chain's range. Just saying--If you're complaining about Vanish range vs. Tether range, practice it. I daresay it could be more useful than Vanish Catches and Wind, considering it's part of Sheik's basic gameplay.
 

Wildfire393

Smash Journeyman
Joined
May 12, 2007
Messages
335
Basically, learn Sheik's best moves, and learn them well. Here are her best moves, in order of usefulness

1) Ftilt - Locks many characters for multiple hits. Long ranged, sets up basically anything, easy to set up, very fast. Only downside is it has pathetic damage (5% undiminished, decays down to as low as 2-3%) and will never kill
2) Bair - Comes out incredibly quickly, very hard to NOT autocancel (basically the only way to do that is use it as you start to hit the ground). 11% in the initial frames, something like 5-6% for the "weak" hit. Weak hit sets up into tilt-lock if it hits low to the ground. Long enough to hit someone out of an airdodge. Incredibly long range makes this Sheik's best aerial. Strong hit can kill around 150% (center of FD on mario).
3) Needles - Single neeldes are great for keeping opponents on their toes. Hard to see so often hard to dodge/shield. Single needle does 3%. Multiple needles can be charged, up to 6. Great for harassing, spam-countering, approach-stopping, and general defensive goodness. Fully charged needles are a great backroll punisher, and the hitlag usually leads to a grab.
4) Dsmash - Comes out very quickly, good range, multiple hits. If shielded, it will either poke their shield on a later hit or push them out of range to grab/counterattack. If spotdodged or rolled through, they'll eat a later hit. First hit kills around 150%. Second hit has longer range than then first, which can often trick people. (Oh, the first hit missed me, I can drop my shie- ow!)
5) Utilt - Comes out very quickly, great range and duration, two hits. Like a downsmash except above you. At low percents, sets up into Ftilt combos. Great ender for an Ftilt combo, as the knockback generally puts them into followup range. One of my favorite moves with Sheik, great for racking up damage and protecting from above. Interesting trivia: this is also Sheik's only Spike. The first hit has downward vertical knockback. This can only really be seen if Sheik is standing at an edge and someone jumps into the first hit from below. They will suffer a (very weak) spike downwards.
6) Nair - Sheik's fastest aerial. Basically identical to the Bair except a frame faster and like 2% more damage, but shorter ranged. Everything else (duration long enough to hit out of airdodge, weak hit sets up ftilt combo, strong hit kills) holds.
7) Jab (Hit 1 and 2) - Sheik's fastest ground move. The third hit repeating jab is pretty much useless (it can rack up OK damage at the edge of a stage, if the opponent DI's towards you rather than just dropping to the ledge), so always cancel this after the first or second hit with Shield into a grab or with Down into an Ftilt/Dtilt.
8) Fair - Sheik's fastest-completing aerial. Very quick swipe, about the same range as the Nair. The window in which it hits is longer than the strong hit window for the nair or bair, making it a good edgeguard, since it's stronger than the weak hit of either, as well as faster completing. Also nearly impossible not to autocancel.
9) Upsmash - Gets points for being Sheik's best kill move by a wide margin (almost 40%). If you can hit the tipper that is. Learn how to get under people with a hyphen smash at least, even if you can't DACUS. Good damage to boot. Too slow to use against an opponent who is not falling.
10) Vanish - Sheik's second best killer. Again, difficult to land. Learn Glide Vanishing to impress your friends and occasionally score kills. Good as a punishment for Dedede's up B and things like Tlink's or Game and Watch's Dairs.
11) Fthrow/Bthrow - If DI'd towards Sheik, they go straight up, making it easy to chase and hit. Should be used over other throws. Also deal the best damage of throws. At low (like 0) % against the people you can Ftilt Lock, it puts them in perfect position to do so

As for bad moves that should only be used situationally and sparingly:
1) Dair - Laggy, predictable, and not very powerful. Avoid, unless you're above an olimar, since it outprioritizes his usmash
2) Chain - Chain lock can potentially be good, and there's talk of the chain jacket maybe kinda being good. But I'd avoid it.
3) Dash Attack - Laggy, not a great amount of damage or knockback. Only really good if your opponent has enough lag to ensure the hit, but not enough to get with a grab.
4) Uair - Second laggiest of Sheik's aerials, with few autocancel frames and more startup frames than the Nair, Fair, and Bair. Similar to the Nair and Bair, it has a strong hit that kills around 150% with few frames it hits for. Good for killing light characters off the top, but easily airdodged if you attempt to juggle with it.
5) Dtilt - Little slower than the Ftilt, and sets up into it. Good for poking shields and for using while crawling (i.e. avoiding blaster spam). Situational however, as an Ftilt is usually better.
6) Transform - Only useful if you know how to play Zelda as well. That said, you should probably learn how to play Zelda as well. This makes transform significantly better
7) Fsmash - Has about the same KO power as a side-hit Usmash or a Dsmash, but only with the second hit. If not properly spaced, they'll just get knocked out of the first hit and retaliate. Also laggy. Not useful, use a Dsmash or Usmash instead.
 

bluewind

Smash Rookie
Joined
Sep 3, 2008
Messages
3
Location
earth
Have you ever noticed that sometimes the tether JUST misses? THAT is the point where a Vanish would make it but a chain won't.

I've been learning to KO with Vanish Catches and Wind. It works more often than you would think it would if you practice.

Winding an attack with lots of momentum sometimes can get a KO right there if it's early enough. If not, you can follow it up with f-airs. (Like the ones in that gimpy vid). Vanish Catch is less likely to work and requires a ledge-drop > footstool to KO.

Again, gets much easier with practice. I've been obsessing over the 0%-death Zelda combo. That thing is AWESOME. I really want to see someone else do it.
I've heard that if you hold b as your trying to tether, then the chain just "ignores" the ledge all together...Maybe this is the problem...but then again I don't know...maybe you were just too far away from the ledge like you said...

Is there a video for the zelda 0%to death combo? If so, can you direct me to it? Thanks!
 

ll Mafia ll

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Mar 12, 2008
Messages
144
Location
AL
Hmm, so far, I am liking Sheik a lot due to her speed.

Everything is so fast.... it's fun.
Edgeguarding is particularly fun.

I use grabs a lot. Grabs are too good.... Shield grabbing, all of it. As Samus, grabs are.... rare.

And okay, everything sounds pretty good.
I'm liking the sliding upsmash.
The tippper is also great.


And DACUS can go kill itself for now.
I can do it at 1/4 speed! lol
 

SinkingHigher

Smash Lord
Joined
May 4, 2008
Messages
1,886
Location
Canada
I've heard that if you hold b as your trying to tether, then the chain just "ignores" the ledge all together...Maybe this is the problem...but then again I don't know...maybe you were just too far away from the ledge like you said...

Is there a video for the zelda 0%to death combo? If so, can you direct me to it? Thanks!
Hahaha. I'm the one that said the tether all together thing.

I know it's not that.

Anyway, check the Sheik Guide in the Sheik forums. The bottom half is a Zelda guide.

The vids can be found here:

http://www.youtube.com/user/SinkingHigher

But just to be safe check the guide. Other people have added vids to it.

Oh, search "Edge-Reversed NL to Spike." and you'll go to the post with the vid.
 
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