Hearts Mafia - Game over! Who won?

[Circus]

DOUBLE POST. THIS IS IMPORTANT. SO ITS OK.

what no
You posted this in your first post of two posts which could have just been turned into one post.

Yo Circus, tell me why you said this in the underlined.

To be coy.

Underlined, this implies you suspect Raz. When exactly did you garner a suspicion on Raz and why? (Give a quote too, that would help)

Oh you.

Bold, how could he have known your vote was random?

My vote was not random. And he couldn't have known it. That's why I told him it wasn't.

Well with not much of anything from a few people, Circus, it's hard to give much there. If anything, Ruy is piquing my interest, and JTB's question doesn't sit right.

Yeah, this makes sense if you haven't read anything since post 28. That one question from JTB sure does seem to be dominating your world right now.

 

[#HBC | Gorf]

Gorf, what are you doin' to me? Changing your mind on J is one thing; exploring other avenues is another. Trying to erase the whole stance by saying "I didn't mean it" is something else entirely. No me gusta, Gordito. I thought we were gonna be tight this game.

U srs? I never intended on pursuing J. I smply baited a reaction, nothing more. But while you're at it you should vote bardull for me or at least put your stance on em out there wrt my case.

 

[#HBC | Nabe]

I don't like this post. I don't think Raz could have gotten much content from these questions, and I feel he picked JTB to ask questions to seem town, while fluffing up at the same time. The 'why would you buddy Gorf' question doesn't help him find scum, nor does his question about John's scumtell book. It seems fake. Also don't like the bold coming from him. I don't think he is fine with lynching RR for being possibly scum, just if RR wastes the posts he'll lynch him for it.

Underlined is fluff. Especially about the rvs/uselessness. He keeps going on and on about avoiding the useless posts. (His advice to john is legit, because john could have posted in one post)

Underlined+Bolded is the questions to JTB. I don't think he really could have seen scum intent from those questions, so that's why I don't like them.

Bolded is him being fine with a policy lynch, not a scum lynch. I feel he is trying to poster himself as town by caring about uselessness and waste of space.

Vote: Raziek

What are you doing? While it's been a slow game thus far, I don't see how you can justify a vote on Raz from this single post (of the two or three he's made), when meanwhile there's votes on Bardull, a player you haven't commented on at all.

Nabe I don't see why you keep urging MJ to fix his play if it's something that can be legit suspicious. You said if he kept going down that path you would find it suspicious, so. How is he holding up read wise with you currently? Is he getting better or no?

"keep urging"
I asked them exactly once, right here in the post you've quoted, and that requires them to first acknowledge that I've said it -- which I also asked for. MJ's a null, nothing has changed.

Also, give me an explanation for your suspicion on Bardull, since you are joining the wagon.

Wagon vote implies I think all the evidence by Gord and MJ is good and useful, i.e. that all the evidence against the wagonee is legit. I didn't want to glorify what is literally a no-work vote on my part.

Buddy buddy July buddy buddy.

You suspect MJ? Could you elaborate, 'cause this is the first I've heard of it.

Leaning town because always leaning town. And she actually does seem like she's already starting to think critically.

Uh, fair enough. I guess I didn't expect anything more.

 

[Raziek]

Got a lady friend, which kicked my activity square in the Jimmies.

I'll get to this game late tonight or tomorrow.

 

[Circus]

U srs? I never intended on pursuing J. I smply baited a reaction, nothing more. But while you're at it you should vote bardull for me or at least put your stance on em out there wrt my case.

But you were bringing up totally valid criticisms. Even if it wasn't straight up lynchable material, you did point out, correctly, that J's posts have been hypocritically fluffy and focused too strongly on game mechanics. You even gave reads on other players based on this apparently fake J read (see: Nabe). Then you just wave a magic wand over it and say none of that suspicion was real. If it wasn't real, then what was the point? You say it was to bait a reaction, but what did J's reaction tell you about J? Have you learned anything about Nabe through this (if not, why even mention him in your #45?)? What makes you actively think J is town?

The way you handled this bothers me. Moving away from J because your points are relatively shallow and Bardull seems like greener grass to you is fine. Attempting to wipe yourself of any suspicion of J at all makes me think you might know more about J than you should. The reasoning doesn't justify the actions I'm seeing. There's a link of some sort missing here.

I'm awfully happy with where my vote is right now. Give me more about B-dull if you want my weight on the wagon. Why is he a better wagon than John?

You suspect MJ? Could you elaborate, 'cause this is the first I've heard of it.

I suspect him insofar as he seems like he's more interested in looking good than doing good, though I could also chalk up plenty of what I've seen to general J-ness (which is who has undoubtedly been the one making almost every MJay post we've seen so far). The comment to July stuck out to me specifically because of just how totally unnecessary and pandering it was.

 

[#HBC | marshy]

vote scummingjay
fos scumziek
request votecount

 

[Jdietz43]

With 13 alive it take 7 to lynch!


Bardull [3] – Mockingjay, Gorf, Nabe
Circus [0] -
Gorf [0] -
John2k4 [2] – Circus, Bardull
JTB [2] – Red Ryu, July
July [0] -
Marshy [0] –
Mockingjay [1] – Marshy
Nabe [0] -
Ranmaru [0] -
Raziek [1] – Ranmaru
Red Ryu [2] - JTB, John
Sokr [0] –

Not Voting [2] – Raziek, Sokr


Last Allowed Post of the Day: Post #686

 

[July]

Dividing Gorf's attention between myself and you is counter-productive MJ since it alleviates pressure from you as well as the seriousness of the situation. I also wanted to get a read on you. To be blunt, there is still one thing that is making me extremely uncomfortable about your slot: why would you talk about filler or bad posting being a scum tell? That's not something scum would immediately understand or recognize, so I'm completely at odds as to why you outed that information early on.

I don't agree with this, if Gorf had made a case on both you and MJ then he has already divided his attention, and addressing his case on you wouldn't alleviate the pressure on MJ, it would just increase or decrease the amount of pressure on yourself.

It helps give me an idea of what to expect from you as far as your personality and your approach to the game. I also like getting familiar with each player now, sort of like a hello, before I get invested in the game. It's a social thing, I don't know. From what I've gathered though, you're cautious and a bit of skeptic when dealing with players you're unfamiliar with. You're also humble in that you recognize when you make mistakes, but I don't get the feeling that they happen often in accordance with your last post. You're serious and punctual. The question itself wasn't meant to get an alignment read on you. Curiously, do you think what I did was scummy?

That's actually a pretty accurate assessment, except for the punctual part. I didn't find it scummy, I thought it was a rather useless question that didn't relate to mafia, but you did manage to get information about me based off that question so it wasn't so worthless after all.

No, that wasn't a legit read. Basically everything said that added to my "MJ scum read" was weight to pile on. I don't have a read on em yet.

Kk, but then what do you think of the suspicions or concerns that people such as Nabe, Circus, and Bardull have expressed about MJ? Do you see their suspicions, a lot of which resonate with your own reasons for your "case" on MJ, as legit?

I don't like this post. I don't think Raz could have gotten much content from these questions, and I feel he picked JTB to ask questions to seem town, while fluffing up at the same time. The 'why would you buddy Gorf' question doesn't help him find scum, nor does his question about John's scumtell book. It seems fake. Also don't like the bold coming from him. I don't think he is fine with lynching RR for being possibly scum, just if RR wastes the posts he'll lynch him for it.

Underlined is fluff. Especially about the rvs/uselessness. He keeps going on and on about avoiding the useless posts. (His advice to john is legit, because john could have posted in one post)

Underlined+Bolded is the questions to JTB. I don't think he really could have seen scum intent from those questions, so that's why I don't like them.

Bolded is him being fine with a policy lynch, not a scum lynch. I feel he is trying to poster himself as town by caring about uselessness and waste of space.

Vote: Raziek

I also feel John is slightly scum for his "Yes I'm scumhunting, why do you ask this?" It seemed like a knee jerk reaction from him. It wasn't a scumhunting question, just a question to throw back at the ... person asking questions. I would expect John to be laid back and not do much yet I wouldn't expect him to ask a question like that unless he was scum. Like what was his intention in asking that? That is what I am looking at here.

Gord/JTb thoughts on this?



John, how did that question help you find scum? Is this not a question one should ask you?



Obviously null. Why would you ask me this so early in the game, rather, when you haven't even posted yet?



Nabe I don't see why you keep urging MJ to fix his play if it's something that can be legit suspicious. You said if he kept going down that path you would find it suspicious, so. How is he holding up read wise with you currently? Is he getting better or no?

Also, give me an explanation for your suspicion on Bardull, since you are joining the wagon.



Where have you played with them before? (Most recent please)



Thank you for explaining. I do agree everyone should have the chance to speak.

No I was talking about someone else posting more than me. I was just wondering if it would be odd if someone posted much more than me. I realize it won't be because I have restrained myself a bit too much, and have dropped.

Ran, I want to respond to this post after Raziek does.

Also, can you explain what you mean by the bolded?

 

[#HBC | Gorf]

Kk, but then what do you think of the suspicions or concerns that people such as Nabe, Circus, and Bardull have expressed about MJ? Do you see their suspicions, a lot of which resonate with your own reasons for your "case" on MJ, as legit?

I guess I can see why they think it's scummy, but I don't agree. Take it like this: I didn't like the earlier posts from MockingJay because they were dwelling on stupid things. I don't agree with the notion that it was scummy, however. I couldn't get a definitive read leaning either way from it, so I went with trying to gauge their reaction.

But you were bringing up totally valid criticisms. Even if it wasn't straight up lynchable material, you did point out, correctly, that J's posts have been hypocritically fluffy and focused too strongly on game mechanics. You even gave reads on other players based on this apparently fake J read (see: Nabe). Then you just wave a magic wand over it and say none of that suspicion was real. If it wasn't real, then what was the point? You say it was to bait a reaction, but what did J's reaction tell you about J? Have you learned anything about Nabe through this (if not, why even mention him in your #45?)? What makes you actively think J is town?

What J's reaction told me is that he was town. Read above to see my thoughts on the slot. What he said could've honestly gone either way, so I wanted to see how he'd react to me calling him out. I mentioned em, like I said, to add weight to the "J suspicion." Mostly, because I liked his response to my calling out of him, and I liked and agreed with what he had to say about Bardull before I even said it in thread.

The way you handled this bothers me. Moving away from J because your points are relatively shallow and Bardull seems like greener grass to you is fine. Attempting to wipe yourself of any suspicion of J at all makes me think you might know more about J than you should. The reasoning doesn't justify the actions I'm seeing. There's a link of some sort missing here.

You're thinking too hard here. Nothing J did was inherently scummy. He wasn't TRYING to look good by talking about it (unlike Bardull). He had his concerns, and he's gotten to a point where the subject matter is still not subtly, or explicitly, there (unlike Bardull). And plus, knowing J's meta, I wouldn't put it past 'em to honestly have concerns with this, but that's aside the point. I have no, and never had a, scum read on J.

I'm awfully happy with where my vote is right now. Give me more about B-dull if you want my weight on the wagon. Why is he a better wagon than John?

John's not trying. That's the extent. Bardull's playing a scum game. See: my 59.

 

[Sokr]

@Circus I'm not sure about John but I don't like Mockingjay.

I gotta apologize for this one. That was just extremely poor wording because I said exactly opposite what I meant. I did not mean to say getting quiet people to remain quiet but I wanted to say I wanted to get people who are quiet to talk more by pressuring them. It wasn't a backdoor to the previous statement, I just messed up my previous statement.

This post leaves a poor taste in my mouth. Pretty sure he's backpeddling. Anybody that claims to have meant the opposite of what they said automatically raises red flags.

This is pretty much a reiteration of your first point so I'm not going to repeat myself haha. I do have a question though. If my main point was to stop RVS and also just stop the flow of conversation, why did I contribute to RVS and random vote?

Didn't see anywhere Gorf accusing you of trying to stop RVS. In fact he seems to be accusing you of unnessecarily drawing it out, which I agree with.

The first part of the paragraph are fair points against John, however, what I dislike is the continuing of Bardull. He seems to be trying to make his case seem stronger than it actually is with facts that are less than true.

I don't like the bolded because he is trying to compare John to being another RR which isn't even the case at all. You make an arbitrary statement saying that "its odd and peculiar at best" which doesn't give us any reasoning as to why its "odd and peculiar" nor does it give us anything to tell us why it is scummy persay. It feels you are more saying that he is anti-town and should die for that fact alone over scummy behaviour.

Yellow part, he does not explain what is scummy about John's actions and nor do I agree with his opinion on the situation because I didn't get that impression from John and I didn't think his reaction was that bad.

I like this case up to the yellow part. But that's just cause what I see isn't lining up with what he apparently sees.

I don't like this because it looks like backdoor. Well..let me correct that it doesn't look like a backdoor, it is one and a pretty obvious one too. He is saying that is is willing to listen to those who may have a reasoning for TownJohn or case but in the end he just says "not seeing it at the moment." I don't get/like the qualifier he put here in case someone does in fact see John as leaning town.

He's reaching for a case. That wasn't a backdoor, that was an invitation to get people talking and to get other's opinions. There is no need for a back door in a claim like that.

Hee doesn't explain what he likes about where Gorf is going and the last sentence sets off alarm bells because it somewhat alludes to Gorf being town in his eyes without really showing why and saying "don't mind him running amuck whatever he does." off of one post.

Again, he's reaching. People do that kind of thing all the time. It's day one. Letting one player roam loose when there are plenty of other suspects isn't a scumtell.

Bardull doesn't even really question Gorf's scum-read on him but moreso just says its "interesting and that they should talk about it later." if he was really concerned, Gorf can multi-task even though he is pushing me. It looks more like a way to hide behind the fact that Gorf is pushing me so he doesn't get involved too much right now. I don't like the somewhat buddying nature he has had towards Gorf in the last two quotes because they seem too...I really can't find the right word but it's somewhere between being too friendly/complacent/non-chalant.

Why would he question it? It's early in Day 1. There's plenty of time to discuss it. He's leaving an invitation to do just that. This whole thing seemed to be a pretty weak case.


I dunno, maybe MJ's just scummy to me because our views don't line up, but I don't like his slot ATM. I'm not gonna vote him yet, but he's definitely got my FOS.

 

[JTB]

prod dodge, been busy + tera just launched, ill try something tomorrow

 

[Mockingjay]

Adressing a few small things for the time being and later when I get home I'll respond to Bardull in full. ;P

Buddy buddy July buddy buddy.

Don't get the point of pointing this out. Me and July usually always have a buddy-buddy attitude with one another. I even recall you saying that doing this in Liar Game was scummy when we were both town and still did it. Soooo what's your point Circus because this:

I suspect him insofar as he seems like he's more interested in looking good than doing good, though I could also chalk up plenty of what I've seen to general J-ness (which is who has undoubtedly been the one making almost every MJay post we've seen so far). The comment to July stuck out to me specifically because of just how totally unnecessary and pandering it was.

*the bolded*

Is a stretch to try and make it look like my obvious buddying of July is inherently scummy. If you felt that way towards my buddying, what makes you of JTB's obv-buddying of Gorf earlier on in the game?

Let me also adresse this as well. Moreso looking good than doing good? What sort of point is that? You can't really back that statement up because what I have been doing does show my interest in doing good. I really don't know how to combat a point so can you explain more into detail how we are "looking good" > "doing good" because I don't get it haha.

It wasn't backpeddling though....? I literally just messed up my wording and not take things back/doing the opposite I said.

Question: Opinion on Gorf?

Didn't see anywhere Gorf accusing you of trying to stop RVS. In fact he seems to be accusing you of unnessecarily drawing it out, which I agree with.

He said it in the quote above which I did quote in that post. Unneccessarily draing out RVS? Can you point out exactly what you mean?

I like this case up to the yellow part. But that's just cause what I see isn't lining up with what he apparently sees.

Well thanks for liking it haha. I was surprised to see this quote especially if it was expressing why you disliked me. ;P

He's reaching for a case. That wasn't a backdoor, that was an invitation to get people talking and to get other's opinions. There is no need for a back door in a claim like that.

However, let me bring this point up again because later on in the thread he said "it wasn't going to happen because no one could have a town case for John." it shows that he did not really care about the opinion of having someone have John as town for his sake of mind and seems locked in on it. If someone were to, shall we say, have a case on John for him being town (which is plausible because John's actions this game have sat at a pretty null position) and it ends up looking better than his scum-case/ends up changing the crowd's opinion on the slot then Bardull could join in because he asked the question of "Is there anyone who had a town-case on John."

Again, he's reaching. People do that kind of thing all the time. It's day one. Letting one player roam loose when there are plenty of other suspects isn't a scumtell.

I don't get where you are coming from with how it is not a scum-tell by generalizing it to "Everyone else does it." where I have never seen this case before unless its specic people (i.e. Mainly just Ryker/Cello). However, what makes you of the other people who have found what I have said suspicious as well?

Why would he question it? It's early in Day 1. There's plenty of time to discuss it. He's leaving an invitation to do just that. This whole thing seemed to be a pretty weak case.

This kind of goes along with the point above where I don't get how you find that as a towny-tell>scummy-tell. People have called him out on this too and it is scummy to just wave off the agressor as "too busy to be dealing with someone else" or his complacent attitude of not really caring.

I dunno, maybe MJ's just scummy to me because our views don't line up, but I don't like his slot ATM. I'm not gonna vote him yet, but he's definitely got my FOS.

So let me ask you this, you have a town read on Bardull it seems if you are saying our views do not line up correct? Can you explain your town read more?

I'd also like to ask you why you aren't voting me if you do find me suspicious AND your vote is not located on anyone else.

I also do not get why you are defending Bardull as well, however, to be fair I have defended my own town reads in the past as well but it seems somewhat out of place that the major reason you are pushing me is due to my starting of the Bardull wagon.

 

[Circus]

What J's reaction told me is that he was town. Read above to see my thoughts on the slot. What he said could've honestly gone either way, so I wanted to see how he'd react to me calling him out. I mentioned em, like I said, to add weight to the "J suspicion." Mostly, because I liked his response to my calling out of him, and I liked and agreed with what he had to say about Bardull before I even said it in thread.

You're still not answering my question. What about J's reaction tells you he's town? The fact that he brought up Bardull before you did? Is that really it?

John's not trying. That's the extent. Bardull's playing a scum game. See: my 59.

I've read your 59. It seems about as compelling as your 51 regarding J. Maybe I'm missing something since I haven't read DK mafia; that seems to be informing your read on Bardull quite a bit.

Also, I think Bardull did a decent job responding to your 59 with his 66. You know, the one you made a point of not reading or responding to yourself and are stubbornly pressing for a wagon anyway. You see, when you let your opponent have the last word, you concede your points. Unless your opponents points/responses are so stupid or false that they can be readily seen as such, you have to actually continue arguing against them if you expect other people (or at least me) to take your case seriously. Because right now it looks like you just want Bardull dead for the sake of wanting Bardull dead.

Don't get the point of pointing this out. Me and July usually always have a buddy-buddy attitude with one another. I even recall you saying that doing this in Liar Game was scummy when we were both town and still did it.

Being nice and even friendly with other players is not a big deal. It's when you post things that basically scream "like me too much to lynch me" that gets under my skin.

Soooo what's your point Circus because this:



*the bolded*

Is a stretch to try and make it look like my obvious buddying of July is inherently scummy. If you felt that way towards my buddying, what makes you of JTB's obv-buddying of Gorf earlier on in the game?

I already said that the example I highlighted from you was particularly pandering and pointless. What July said could hardly even be considered a joke, and you reacted to it like a blind date desperate for a bedroom invitation.

July: "I'll probably procrastinate on my homework."
J: "Oh my gosh that's SO FUNNY I'M DYING HAHAHA."

It's fake. That's why it's notable.

Let me also adresse this as well. Moreso looking good than doing good? What sort of point is that? You can't really back that statement up because what I have been doing does show my interest in doing good. I really don't know how to combat a point so can you explain more into detail how we are "looking good" > "doing good" because I don't get it haha.

Many of your posts have just looked like you're reaching for words to fill posts. You've said that you and Sang planned on being more conservative with your posting for the sake of the post limit (which is not only a needless thing to say, but also seems to not be true), you went off on some tangent comparing the post limit to the moon in Majora's Mask, you've been going out of your way to respond to every little criticism anyone makes about you (like now. I'm not even pursuing you right now and you're already getting defensive with me). I see a lot of posturing and self-defense, but not a whole lot of scumhunting.

And it's worth saying that I still don't think you're that scummy right now. Like I said, I can attribute plenty of what I'm seeing from you to normal J-ness and I've agreed with some of your stances. Even the thing with July, I can see TownJ doing. But it still bothers me, so I said something. I can express distaste for some of the things people do without thinking they're automatically scum for it.

John, I want to see you do something. Please don't pull another Majora's Mask. If you are town, then getting you to scumhunt and actively participate in discussion should not be this similar to pulling teeth. Are you still suspicious of Red Ryu? If so, are you planning on, like, doing something about that? Have you read any of the last 60 posts?

RAZIEK, STOP MACKIN' ON YOUR IMAGINARY GIRLFRIEND.

RED RYU, HAVE YOU DIED OF ALCOHOL POISONING?

 

[#HBC | Gorf]

You're still not answering my question. What about J's reaction tells you he's town? The fact that he brought up Bardull before you did? Is that really it?

In a nutshell, he was NOT doing what you're accusing him of. No, I don't have the time to point out what specifically it is that he did that I liked, but there were instances where I was being intentionally snide in things like saying "Yep he so scum" and he put himself out there, not being cautious with what he was saying, and called me out on it. And plus, I felt like he was giving good responses to the things I was calling em out on, like when I went on for a while about him talking about the early game shiz. He wasn't cautious in the way he responded to that, much like I (and, yes, you) would expect scumJ to respond. He defended his points well, and like I said ultimately I was able to see either town or scum intent in what he did early game. I chose to see what the eff avenue he'd take by my calling him out, and I just don't see scum in the way he reacted.

I've read your 59. It seems about as compelling as your 51 regarding J. Maybe I'm missing something since I haven't read DK mafia; that seems to be informing your read on Bardull quite a bit.

And you know what's funny? You comment on how precise my J callouts were, and commend me on finding the shiz. The fact is Bardull's playing a really scummy game. John is simply playing a really really JOHN game. John actively does nothing (see: Gigabots mafia) (see: DK mafia) as town. He's at least scummy and tries to mask that as scum (see: Adventure Time mafia).

Also, I think Bardull did a decent job responding to your 59 with his 66. You know, the one you made a point of not reading or responding to yourself and are stubbornly pressing for a wagon anyway. You see, when you let your opponent have the last word, you concede your points. Unless your opponents points/responses are so stupid or false that they can be readily seen as such, you have to actually continue arguing against them if you expect other people (or at least me) to take your case seriously. Because right now it looks like you just want Bardull dead for the sake of wanting Bardull dead.

If you reeeeally want me to respond to that, I will. The reason I didn't is because it's long winded, probably stupid, and tbh I have a hard time concentrating and sitting through big posts like that and have a bad tendency to skim em up. I'm just bad with big a** posts.

 

[BarDulL]

Is it just me, or does Gorf seem like he's full of **** right now?

FOS: Gorf

You don't have time to point out specifically what you like? Are you that arrogant that you believe we'll just bite into whatever spouts of your mouth?

Your sudden dismissal of MJ was terrible. You're not going in depth with your actions and it's hella scummy. Heck, you're not even going in depth or trying to respond to my post which debunks your argument against me on the premise that "you don't need to." Why? I think it's because you know your case is **** and you don't have squat on me. No, I'm pretty sure that's exactly what it is.

Things Gorf needs to do:

Explain what exactly about MJ's response did he find to be townie enough to the point where he would dismiss his would-be scum read on him?

An in-depth response to my post detailing why he still feels I'm scum.

Circus, I agree with most of your points on MJ except the part about him and July. J does that to every girl in Dgames LOL. He did it to Sangfroid in AT mafia, as you should be aware. I DISLIKE that he used a post specifically for that though when he himself claimed that useless posting is pretty scummy.

 

[#HBC | Gorf]

Oh, hello Circus, I didn't know you hacked Bardull's account.

 

[BarDulL]

Nice deflection.

BTW, you're really, really bad.

Now answer up. Or do we have to get a wagon on you going for you to start talking?

 

[Circus]

If you reeeeally want me to respond to that, I will. The reason I didn't is because it's long winded, probably stupid, and tbh I have a hard time concentrating and sitting through big posts like that and have a bad tendency to skim em up. I'm just bad with big a** posts.

I mean, I'm not gonna make you do anything you don't wanna do. I'm just saying that rebutting Bardull's comments would probably be a good place to start if you're actively interested in building a wagon on him.

You're still giving me half-***** responses, but that's actually not such a bad thing. I like that you're at least being honest and not trying to reach for specific points to back up your reads that you don't already have just to appease me. All-in-all, I actually like where this conversation has gone so far.

Circus, I agree with most of your points on MJ except the part about him and July. J does that to every girl in Dgames LOL. He did it to Sangfroid in AT mafia, as you should be aware. I DISLIKE that he used a post specifically for that though when he himself claimed that useless posting is pretty scummy.

Like I said, I too can see TownJ saying what he said. My "buddy July" comment wasn't supposed to be some kind of silver bullet or anything. In fact, it is often the case that the more bothered by J's style I am, the less likely it is that he's scum, so I'm really not hung up on it.

Bardull, is Gorf scum?

 

[Sokr]

It wasn't backpeddling though....? I literally just messed up my wording and not take things back/doing the opposite I said.

Question: Opinion on Gorf?

I hope you understand if I'll take that response as not much because obviously scum would say that, and so would town who's telling the truth. I'm not gonna push this point as it's mainly based on WIFOM.

Honestly, I haven't really looked at him. I'll go over his posts and get back to you on that.

He said it in the quote above which I did quote in that post. Unneccessarily draing out RVS? Can you point out exactly what you mean?

Most of your talk earlier revolved around questioning if we should have an RVS, whether a posting restriction should be placed on individuals and how many posts determine scuminess. While I understand doing the first thing, the next two reek of procrastinating and trying to get empty discussions going to eat up our post limit.

However, let me bring this point up again because later on in the thread he said "it wasn't going to happen because no one could have a town case for John." it shows that he did not really care about the opinion of having someone have John as town for his sake of mind and seems locked in on it. If someone were to, shall we say, have a case on John for him being town (which is plausible because John's actions this game have sat at a pretty null position) and it ends up looking better than his scum-case/ends up changing the crowd's opinion on the slot then Bardull could join in because he asked the question of "Is there anyone who had a town-case on John."

Fair enough. I can't argue that.

I don't get where you are coming from with how it is not a scum-tell by generalizing it to "Everyone else does it." where I have never seen this case before unless its specic people (i.e. Mainly just Ryker/Cello). However, what makes you of the other people who have found what I have said suspicious as well?

I don't really understand what you're saying here. I'll try and clarify on what I said. If we have a number of strong suspects, letting one roam free is harmless. Just as long as they continue to post. If you have an issue with letting... was it Gorf?... roam free, then you can pressure him yourself.

This kind of goes along with the point above where I don't get how you find that as a towny-tell>scummy-tell. People have called him out on this too and it is scummy to just wave off the agressor as "too busy to be dealing with someone else" or his complacent attitude of not really caring.

Yes, not really caring is scummy. But if someone is focusing on a couple other people and not all the suspects, that isn't a scumtell.

So let me ask you this, you have a town read on Bardull it seems if you are saying our views do not line up correct? Can you explain your town read more?

I have a null read ATM. Like with Gorf, I'll have to do some rereading.

I'd also like to ask you why you aren't voting me if you do find me suspicious AND your vote is not located on anyone else.

Because you are not scummy enough for me to vote. I just saw a few questionable things in your post. I'll vote someone when I deem it necessary (pressure, relatively strong scum read, etc.)

I also do not get why you are defending Bardull as well, however, to be fair I have defended my own town reads in the past as well but it seems somewhat out of place that the major reason you are pushing me is due to my starting of the Bardull wagon.

I am not defending Bardull. I am merely questioning some things that caught my attention in your argument.

 

[BarDulL]

Honestly I liked his read on John because it actually seems pretty legit. The "John is being John" thing was pretty townie to me. But Gorf's play differs here from DKmafia where he was more thorough in his analysis and to the point with his read on me. Like, there was a degree of understanding and trying to relate to me. His read here is SIMILAR to the DKmafia read on me where I overreacted but didn't follow up on my overreaction.

Firstly, he's wrong to think that I'd make the same mistake twice as scum. Secondly, I didn't overreact to RR, what RR was doing earlier was massively different from what Super Vegito did in DKmafia.

Basically what happened in DKmafia was, Super Vegito asked Town how they felt about mass claiming in his first post of the game. It was a pretty obvious reaction test to phish out fakeness and the like. I overreacted in my response, it was kind of like a "WTF WHY WOULD YOU ASK THAT" kind of response which came off as pretty fake. I also didn't follow it up with an FoS or a vote which made me seem more suspicious. Then Gorf/Kuz pushed on that as well as the fact that I seemed to be asking a question earlier in the game that seemed to be irrelevant. It was similar to the vig question that I asked John. They concluded that what I did was "the Dgames #1 scum tell" or something and pushed on it. They were right that I was scum.

HOWEVER. RR's drunk posting and general stupidity earlier in the thread was completely detrimental to Town. I reacted to it the way I normally would've. I also dislike RR in general so that probably added to my reaction, but my reaction was in fact legitimate. My questions to July, you, Sokr, and John were also legitimate questions.

What Gorf is proposing is that I scum telled exactly like how I scum telled in DKmafia. What's odd is that he doesn't recognize the differentiation between the two reactions. Firstly, what RR and Super Vegito did are very different. Super Vegito asked a question that wasn't anti-town at all while RR was being very blatantly anti-town. We are operating on different rules, specifically referring to the posting rule, which means RR's anti-towniness was REALLY anti-town considering he burned up posts. I also haven't let go of my FoS on RR (yes, I've been waiting to see his response ever since he was being ******** with his drunk posting), so it's not as if I haven't followed up/completely discarded my distaste for RR's play. It's the opposite.

So here's the thing. Gorf is pushing for me really hard, like Rykerscum status hard, from when I played with Ryker in Gigabots. Actually, Gorf is posting exactly like how Ryker would post funnily enough. LOL. But what he doesn't recognize is the level of differentiation between my play in this game and my play in DKmafia. Which is odd. The way he's going about it is as if he's trying to squeeze me into the DKmafia scumdull equation and forcing a scum read on me here instead of actually analyzing the scenario and the context of it.

So right now yes, Gorf is leaning scum to me for pushing me on the premise that I "scum telled similar to DKMafia" when this game and DKmafia are completely different scenarios, for one thing. Two, his complete dismissal of MJ and moving onto me AND NOT RESPONDING TO MY CASE is also scummy because it gives me the impression that he is full of **** and doesn't know what he's taking about.

 

[BarDulL]

That was @Circus btw.

Also I haven't put my vote on Gorf yet because I dislike John atm. I also want Gorf to RESPOND to my case first though and see where his head is at. If he doesn't respond then I want everyone to jump along with me and push him until he gets out of ****** mode and starts talking sense. If he refuses to explain himself and his rationale then I say we go ahead and bump him off and call it a day.

 

[Jdietz43]

Red "Ruy" has been prodded

 

[ranmaru]

UGH I HATE WALLS. I WANT TO HAVE SEPARATE POSTS. *RAISES FIST TOWARDS JD *

@Nayb:

What are you doing? While it's been a slow game thus far, I don't see how you can justify a vote on Raz from this single post (of the two or three he's made), when meanwhile there's votes on Bardull, a player you haven't commented on at all.

I'm voting scum. What are you doing?

I like how Bardull responded to Gord's case. Unlike DK Mafia, he hasn't freaked out and has been composed. His latest post convinced me Gord is possibly scum as well trying to fake commitment. I don't see why I should vote Bardull instead of Raziek, and why do you want me to? (Since you are only hopping on the wagon, not really contributing to it)

"keep urging"
I asked them exactly once, right here in the post you've quoted, and that requires them to first acknowledge that I've said it -- which I also asked for. MJ's a null, nothing has changed.

No, it's the second time. Here check this out:

I'm asking for a correction of playstyle from MJ; they've made like 4 posts. It will be sus if play continues down that track.

That was the first time iirc. See the underlined? That is what raises flags about you. You said this again, yet MJ is still null. I don't believe you.

FOS: Nabe

Wagon vote implies I think all the evidence by Gord and MJ is good and useful, i.e. that all the evidence against the wagonee is legit. I didn't want to glorify what is literally a no-work vote on my part.

Yeah but do you have any reads of your own? Also, it seems Gord's case on Bardull is crumbling. Do you still agree to it?

Uh, fair enough. I guess I didn't expect anything more.

Why did you ask Circus about July, and what did you expect? (I mean your line of questioning went no where there nayby baby)

Well with not much of anything from a few people, Circus, it's hard to give much there. If anything, Ruy is piquing my interest, and JTB's question doesn't sit right.


Ran. If I asked you "Plan on ScumHunting this game?", wouldn't you think it odd? It's pretty much a trap question for me, since it can be pulled around whatever I answer to make me look bad, and I didn't like that.

Alright John, got ya. What is your opinion on Gord and Nabe?

what no
You posted this in your first post of two posts which could have just been turned into one post.

My vote was not random. And he couldn't have known it. That's why I told him it wasn't.

I dropped the joke because I saw something I missed (John's quote) and didn't want to state it again.

Ok, what was your reason for voting john in the first place then, now that we know it wasn't random?

And you know what's funny? You comment on how precise my J callouts were, and commend me on finding the shiz. The fact is Bardull's playing a really scummy game. John is simply playing a really really JOHN game. John actively does nothing (see: Gigabots mafia) (see: DK mafia) as town. He's at least scummy and tries to mask that as scum (see: Adventure Time mafia).

If you reeeeally want me to respond to that, I will. The reason I didn't is because it's long winded, probably stupid, and tbh I have a hard time concentrating and sitting through big posts like that and have a bad tendency to skim em up. I'm just bad with big a** posts.

Underlined, John was scummy in both games. You even lynched him in DK Mafia. How has this changed your perspective on his play?

Underlined + Bolded, so you avoid it because it was probably stupid and long? I mean, your reason for avoiding commenting on his defense seems a little iffy. (I mean it seems like you stretched it to justify you not commenting on it)

Honestly I liked his read on John because it actually seems pretty legit. The "John is being John" thing was pretty townie to me. But Gorf's play differs here from DKmafia where he was more thorough in his analysis and to the point with his read on me. Like, there was a degree of understanding and trying to relate to me. His read here is SIMILAR to the DKmafia read on me where I overreacted but didn't follow up on my overreaction.

Firstly, he's wrong to think that I'd make the same mistake twice as scum. Secondly, I didn't overreact to RR, what RR was doing earlier was massively different from what Super Vegito did in DKmafia.

Basically what happened in DKmafia was, Super Vegito asked Town how they felt about mass claiming in his first post of the game. It was a pretty obvious reaction test to phish out fakeness and the like. I overreacted in my response, it was kind of like a "WTF WHY WOULD YOU ASK THAT" kind of response which came off as pretty fake. I also didn't follow it up with an FoS or a vote which made me seem more suspicious. Then Gorf/Kuz pushed on that as well as the fact that I seemed to be asking a question earlier in the game that seemed to be irrelevant. It was similar to the vig question that I asked John. They concluded that what I did was "the Dgames #1 scum tell" or something and pushed on it. They were right that I was scum.

HOWEVER. RR's drunk posting and general stupidity earlier in the thread was completely detrimental to Town. I reacted to it the way I normally would've. I also dislike RR in general so that probably added to my reaction, but my reaction was in fact legitimate. My questions to July, you, Sokr, and John were also legitimate questions.

What Gorf is proposing is that I scum telled exactly like how I scum telled in DKmafia. What's odd is that he doesn't recognize the differentiation between the two reactions. Firstly, what RR and Super Vegito did are very different. Super Vegito asked a question that wasn't anti-town at all while RR was being very blatantly anti-town. We are operating on different rules, specifically referring to the posting rule, which means RR's anti-towniness was REALLY anti-town considering he burned up posts. I also haven't let go of my FoS on RR (yes, I've been waiting to see his response ever since he was being ******** with his drunk posting), so it's not as if I haven't followed up/completely discarded my distaste for RR's play. It's the opposite.

So here's the thing. Gorf is pushing for me really hard, like Rykerscum status hard, from when I played with Ryker in Gigabots. Actually, Gorf is posting exactly like how Ryker would post funnily enough. LOL. But what he doesn't recognize is the level of differentiation between my play in this game and my play in DKmafia. Which is odd. The way he's going about it is as if he's trying to squeeze me into the DKmafia scumdull equation and forcing a scum read on me here instead of actually analyzing the scenario and the context of it.

So right now yes, Gorf is leaning scum to me for pushing me on the premise that I "scum telled similar to DKMafia" when this game and DKmafia are completely different scenarios, for one thing. Two, his complete dismissal of MJ and moving onto me AND NOT RESPONDING TO MY CASE is also scummy because it gives me the impression that he is full of **** and doesn't know what he's taking about.

WHEW ALMOST LEFT THE QUOTE TAG BROKEN.

Hmmm, Bardull. Give me an opinion on Raz and Nabe if you can.

@July: I meant that it wouldn't really apply because I had posted less then I would usually post. So one could post more than me without trying.

And yes I await your thoughts on Raz and my post after he replies.

I will ask your opinion on Nabe when you can.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Vote: Bardull

Liker July and Circus.

Hateddddd Bardull, MJ, JTB.

 

[ranmaru]

Back up your stances, Red Ryu.

 

[ranmaru]

I also want you to explain your actions in the beginning in D1. Was it a gambit, or not?

If it was, what did you get from it? Etc etc

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Back up your stances, Red Ryu.

Circus tois lookuing at teh big picture and tasckling reads. I do not agrie wth Bardull on hum but I wouldn't llie that I do tink Gorf jist wanteds him gone to be fone at some leivel. But, I see stuffs thats legit scum tells.

July tes teh same, munus Gorf parter.

Bardull, Mechanoical approachists on meh, putter upp a front to shopve out hus super townie sekf and only that.

MJ I get less outter of stanfces and morter of mechanics dand littlers poiunts.

JTB putter dumb stuffers at beginning and I want him goner NOW!!! *drinks Vodka*

I also want you to explain your actions in the beginning in D1. Was it a gambit, or not?

If it was, what did you get from it? Etc etc

???

[yt]yqyixwqiCag[/yt]

Make one posters nexter time!!!1111

~

And yesh, I dieder of alcohols poisoninf and rave dddancings at ACEN.

 

[#HBC | Gorf]

Nice deflection.

BTW, you're really, really bad.

Now answer up. Or do we have to get a wagon on you going for you to start talking?

I already responded to literally everything you said when I responded to Circus, Circus. You regurgitated every fiber of his scum read on me and attached a vote to it. That's it.

 

[#HBC | Gorf]

Bardull, Mechanoical approachists on meh, putter upp a front to shopve out hus super townie sekf and only that.

Very well put.

 

[#HBC | Gorf]

Underlined, John was scummy in both games. You even lynched him in DK Mafia. How has this changed your perspective on his play?

He was scummy in the same context that scummy is here. Do you disagree?

Underlined + Bolded, so you avoid it because it was probably stupid and long? I mean, your reason for avoiding commenting on his defense seems a little iffy. (I mean it seems like you stretched it to justify you not commenting on it)

Go ask July how much fun I have reading her posts and get back to me.

 

[BarDulL]

I already responded to literally everything you said when I responded to Circus, Circus. You regurgitated every fiber of his scum read on me and attached a vote to it. That's it.

I don't see a vote on you from me anywhere. Why don't you read the thread carefully and get back to me before you make yourself look stupid again?

 

[BarDulL]

Circus tois lookuing at teh big picture and tasckling reads. I do not agrie wth Bardull on hum but I wouldn't llie that I do tink Gorf jist wanteds him gone to be fone at some leivel. But, I see stuffs thats legit scum tells.

July tes teh same, munus Gorf parter.

Bardull, Mechanoical approachists on meh, putter upp a front to shopve out hus super townie sekf and only that.

MJ I get less outter of stanfces and morter of mechanics dand littlers poiunts.

JTB putter dumb stuffers at beginning and I want him goner NOW!!! *drinks Vodka*



???

[yt]yqyixwqiCag[/yt]

Make one posters nexter time!!!1111

~

And yesh, I dieder of alcohols poisoninf and rave dddancings at ACEN.

My mechanical approach? The hell are you talking about? You posting worthless **** at the beginning of D1 was completely anti-town and I have EVERY reason to hate your slot for it. Also, it's VERY obvious that you're faking this restriction considering NO ONE IS DRUNK AT 10:00 AM IN THE MORNING YOU TARD. If you're going to fake a drunk restriction, you may as well do it at night. Don't be a complete blistering idiot while you're at it.

So much scum. So much scum everywhere.

 

[#HBC | Gorf]

@Circus the previous two posts (#111 and #112) are my new case on Bardull. Thoughts?

 

[BarDulL]

Very well put.

Really?

Vote: Gorf

This should be pretty self-explanatory.

 

[BarDulL]

@MOD: Requesting vote count.

 

[Jdietz43]

(Current as of Post #114)
With 13 alive it take 7 to lynch!


Bardull [4] – Mockingjay, Gorf, Nabe, Red Ryu
Circus [0] -
Gorf [1] - Bardull
John2k4 [1] – Circus
JTB [1] – July
July [0] -
Marshy [0] –
Mockingjay [1] – Marshy
Nabe [0] -
Ranmaru [0] -
Raziek [1] – Ranmaru
Red Ryu [2] - JTB, John
Sokr [0] –

Not Voting [2] – Raziek, Sokr


Last Allowed Post of the Day: Post #686

 

[BarDulL]

@MOD: Do mod posts count towards the total cumulative posts Town is allowed?

Anyway, here's my reasoning for voting for Gorf:

Gorf starts off the game with a scum read on MJ and myself.

Take in mind that the scum read on me stems from my first post in the game.

After MJ responds to Gorf's case, Gorf gives MJ a town pass for it and moves on to me. The town pass is unsubstantiated as of this moment because Gorf has yet to thoroughly explain what he likes about MJ. He has also been avoiding explaining himself on an unclear premise. Gorf then moves onto me.

Gorf's case on me is primarily composed of two things: my reaction to RR seeming fake, and my questions to John/July/Circus seeming fake.

According to Gorf, I "scum telled" exactly like how I did in DKmafia. However, as I've explained, DKmafia and this game are different, as I cited in my #100. Gorf doesn't respond to this. He also has a knack for not reading my posts, as seen in his #108 where he says I voted for him. I had not voted for him yet.

This is evidence that Gorf isn't trying to understand my play or my defense. He is simply pushing for my lynch "for the sake of wanting me dead," as Circus put it. He is not trying to rationalize or understand whether or not I'm Town.

Because of this, it's of my opinion that Gorf is faking commitment and scum goggling me. His hard headedness is too over the top and ridiculous for it to be real.

My biggest piece of evidence against him though is his most recent approval of RR's stance against me. He says RR's stance on me was "very well put."

Firstly, RR said he didn't like my "mechanical approach." Do any of us actually know what RR means by this? "Mechanical approach" is the most vague description of scuminess I've ever seen.

Which begs the question: "How is what RR said very well put at all?"

Gorf's sentiment is completely fake. This was an extremely scumbagish attempt at trying to push my lynch forward and it pretty much seals the deal for me.

@Ran - I need to read Nabe and Raziek. I remember not liking Nabe because he hopped on my wagon without explaining himself and his play reminds me of his AT scum play. Not sure about Raziek yet but I'll look over his posts and let you know.

 

[#HBC | Gorf]

Gorf starts off the game with a scum read on MJ and myself.

Take in mind that the scum read on me stems from my first post in the game.

I don't see why this last piece of information matters. I mean it's obvious being that it's right after your first post, it's been proven that I can find scum from one post (you in DK mafia), and you seemed totally cool with it when it happened, considering that I had verbalized MJ hate over you.

After MJ responds to Gorf's case, Gorf gives MJ a town pass for it and moves on to me. The town pass is unsubstantiated as of this moment because Gorf has yet to thoroughly explain what he likes about MJ. He has also been avoiding explaining himself on an unclear premise. Gorf then moves onto me.

Funny how this wasn't a problem until Circus said it.

Gorf's case on me is primarily composed of two things: my reaction to RR seeming fake, and my questions to John/July/Circus seeming fake.

Except... this isn't true. We should also consider the way that you've tackled the post limit malarkey this game, and also your fake little scenario with JTB where you ask if he already has a town read on you. Oh and also your desire to treat me nice and cozily on the get-go, letting me "run loose for now" and the wording when you were curious about my read on you but not wanting to discuss it while I have my hands tied. But yea. JUST those two things.

According to Gorf, I "scum telled" exactly like how I did in DKmafia. However, as I've explained, DKmafia and this game are different, as I cited in my #100. Gorf doesn't respond to this. He also has a knack for not reading my posts, as seen in his #108 where he says I voted for him. I had not voted for him yet.

And this is scummy cuz?

This is evidence that Gorf isn't trying to understand my play or my defense. He is simply pushing for my lynch "for the sake of wanting me dead," as Circus put it. He is not trying to rationalize or understand whether or not I'm Town.

You actually do a good job outing yourself as scum. I took the initial steps, and it's not like I don't have support.

Because of this, it's of my opinion that Gorf is faking commitment and scum goggling me. His hard headedness is too over the top and ridiculous for it to be real.

Do you even know what you're saying here?

My biggest piece of evidence against him though is his most recent approval of RR's stance against me. He says RR's stance on me was "very well put."

Actually, the fact that I said very well put is allusion to him having to post in a drunken manner, but hey since I like what he said I'll go with it!

Firstly, RR said he didn't like my "mechanical approach." Do any of us actually know what RR means by this? "Mechanical approach" is the most vague description of scuminess I've ever seen.

Actually, it's your mechanical approach on him that he didn't dig, which it was.

Which begs the question: "How is what RR said very well put at all?"

Gorf's sentiment is completely fake. This was an extremely scumbagish attempt at trying to push my lynch forward and it pretty much seals the deal for me.

Again, still not scummy.

A jaded summary of my play =/= a case mang.

 

[Circus]

My mechanical approach? The hell are you talking about? You posting worthless **** at the beginning of D1 was completely anti-town and I have EVERY reason to hate your slot for it. Also, it's VERY obvious that you're faking this restriction considering NO ONE IS DRUNK AT 10:00 AM IN THE MORNING YOU TARD. If you're going to fake a drunk restriction, you may as well do it at night. Don't be a complete blistering idiot while you're at it.

So much scum. So much scum everywhere.

I don't think Red Ryu's restriction is actually that he has to be drunk when he posts.

You regurgitated every fiber of his scum read on me and attached a vote to it. That's it.

I don't see a vote on you from me anywhere. Why don't you read the thread carefully and get back to me before you make yourself look stupid again?

This was legit, but then...

Really?

Vote: Gorf

This should be pretty self-explanatory.

...I wut'd.

Bardull, what about that post pushed Gorf into votable status for you? It's actually not explaining itself to me.

SOKR, YOU'RE VIEWING? Do you have some thoughts on a player other than MockingJay?

 

[John2k4]

Shameless prod dodge - should be more "into" things here in a couple days. Anything that is requiring urgent pressing attention? =P