- Apr 8, 2015
Where does everyone think Ness is as far as tiers are concerned?
Also what projectiles can Ness reflect with his bat?
Also what projectiles can Ness reflect with his bat?
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1. Dashing and shielding will get you in on the projectile wall. Link can't really spit his projectiles out fast enough to presure your shield at a range. As for dealing with zair, you might just wanna shield that too and make a read after he lands. Don't tell yourself you've got a guaranteed punish after shielding it, but instead, see it as an opportunity to make a read on the uncomfortable position you're putting him in. Is he going to jab? Space an attack to counter it. Is he going to dodge? Use a meaty attack to punish it. Don't roll into him though, that's how you get punished.Hi. Long time lurker since melee days. I had to recreate an account because I forgot my previous account info. I recently got into Smash 4 and I been practicing a lot with my buddy who plays a super annoying Link. I have two simple questions.
1. Against Link. How do I get past his wall of projectiles (boomerang, bombs, arrows) and his Zair. Every time I would get close, he would SHFF Zair or Nair if I'm standing too close. If I roll into him, he would roll away or jab me out. His Zair comes like so fast and it seems like it has no recovery lag that I just can't punish him for spamming it.
2. For oos Nair, do I let go of the shield button and then shorthop Nair or do I keep the holding down the shield button while doing Nair? Or it doesn't make a difference?
What is the recovery frame for Link's Zair? Is it the same as his landing lag (10 frames)? What would be the optimal punish against a Link that just spams Zair when I'm in range?1. Dashing and shielding will get you in on the projectile wall. Link can't really spit his projectiles out fast enough to presure your shield at a range. As for dealing with zair, you might just wanna shield that too and make a read after he lands. Don't tell yourself you've got a guaranteed punish after shielding it, but instead, see it as an opportunity to make a read on the uncomfortable position you're putting him in. Is he going to jab? Space an attack to counter it. Is he going to dodge? Use a meaty attack to punish it. Don't roll into him though, that's how you get punished.
i had a similar problem some time ago actuallyOk, from all the characters in the entire game...
How do I deal with Luigi? Like, for real, I think it's the one match up I just CAN'T do a damn thing, it's really infuriating </3
Rushdown. I mean, if SANIC is a bad MU for Ness, then you should't worry too much about getting in. PK Fire is really laggy, so just jump over it and attack.ok.. how do I deal with this little ****er?
I have way too much trouble then I want to admit..
whats the best way to deal with PK-fire and thunder spam? that **** is so annyoing..
how do I deal with his arials? best way to shut off his neurtral game?
I use ZSS and Sheik btw
Bair is relatively safe on block. It's certainly the safest to say the least, so if you must use an aerial to land, this is your best bet.So I latched on to this idea when it was first discovered but didn't really hear too much of it afterwards. When Bair was first being said to be our new 'b&b tool in neutral' for safety, I was like "oh sweet, so I'm guessing Bair is totally safe on a non PS?" And then the whole thing died down and I never got an answer.
So what I'm asking is, Bair - is it safe on block on all characters? If not, who can punish it and how? What about as a landing option? And would one get better results delaying the use of Bair on a SH until they're close to the ground or would it be better to use it as soon as you SH and then FF to the ground?
They key to making PKT2 as safe as possible is knowing its limits, and saving your DJ. Your DJ is perfect for recovery, combined with Ness' air dodge and quick aerials, you can get back with this alone about half the time.Tell me about PK Thunder and what I should know to make its use as a recovery move as safe as possible.
Are there any moves that I should be afraid of clanking out PK Thunder before I wrap it around myself?
PKT2's invincibility seems to last as long as the sweetspot (Frames 1-10). Does it have a significant disjoint after that? Should I be afraid of opponents trading or outright beating it after a point?
Does it snap the ledge better horizontally or vertically (if at all)? Is there a point in the PKT2 animation where it won't snap to the ledge?
In general, what's the best angle/distance from the ledge to approach the ledge with PKT2 for maximum safety?
1. Depends on where you go typically, but for my region it's FD, BF, Smashville, T&C, and Lylat.I need anyone with tourney experience here, preferably a Ness main. I'm going to my first tourney at the end of this month and I would like to know the following:
- Which stages are starters?
- Which stages should a Ness main counterpick and ban?
- What should I expect from my first tourney?
I understand that these are kind of just basic Smash related questions rather than Ness ones, but for my first tourney, I would like to know what I'm getting myself into and know which stages I should go to and which ones to avoid, that way I don't waste the time of other tourneygoers while I'm there. If you can give additional advice as to why a certain stage is better than another, that would be beneficial for me. Say I have to go against Sonic and you tell me not to go to a stage with a lower ceiling because I can die early. Stuff like that would be helpful to know, that way I can go off what I've been told here. Thanks.
Thanks, this is all good advice. Hearing more from others would be good. But I understand what you're saying. I don't have a Wii U, so I'm not all that familiar with the stages or their selections. I think I'm more likely to see a Luigi somewhere along the way. I would have not thought about getting caught with Luigi's combos on Battlefield's platforms, so knowing this early on is good. I'm not too worried about the d-throw > fair set up. I use it, but I feel like my opponents expect it, so I kind of do other things after the d-throw. I've been nervous previously when going up against other players online alone, but over the months it has dwindled down. I'll need to keep my composure, though, that's for sure. I tend to get nervous when my opponent is really doing good against me. And thanks for the good luck.1. Depends on where you go typically, but for my region it's FD, BF, Smashville, T&C, and Lylat.
2. It's character dependent mostly, but I almost always ban Lylat. That stage ruins your use of PKF, gimps you hard, and the platforms don't help Ness much as they ruin dthrow > fair combos and he doesn't shark all that well.
Your mentality for striking stages should be "What stage does this character do better on than me?" For example, when I play against ROB players, I'm more likely ban Halberd because of its low ceiling. Against Luigi, I might ban BF because I don't wanna get locked on a platform, sharked with uairs, and give him a confined space to work with. It's all about knowing the characters, the stages they like, and taking that away from them.
3. Expect to have your fundamentals tested. If it's your first tourney, your matchup experience will be more limited, so you won't be able to rely on as much matchup specific stuff unless you've been REALLY reading up on things and can implement them that quickly. As a result, you'll have to just depend on the basics that you know work. Also, people go into a much more focused state when their tourney placing is on the line as opposed to friendlies, so try your best to stay focused and not get nervous.
Good luck friend.
Anyone? I've been having a really frustrating time with stall players that are good at sudden death and could really use some advice.This might be deserving of its own thread, but what is the optimal approach to sudden death?
My sudden death success rate in For Glory is an abysmal 40% and credit most of my successes to shielding attacks and punishing, rather than actually attacking and winning. In the rare cases where it is an option, PKT is a 1HKO in sudden death, but against players that know what they're doing, it won't be an option. (Except in team FG, where it works near-perfectly)
I have an 88% winrate in For Glory, but lose most games that go to sudden death.
I could push that winrate higher if only I didn't lose so frequently to players that stall and get their 1HKO.
I don't know that much since i don't do FG that much these days, and in tournament sudden death isn't a thing.Anyone? I've been having a really frustrating time with stall players that are good at sudden death and could really use some advice.
Anyone? I've been having a really frustrating time with stall players that are good at sudden death and could really use some advice.
Fireball spam is easy to deal with using Ness. Magnet absorb those babies, and roll backwards or SH to magnet cancel them. Magnet cancelling is a HUGE help in this matchup and I highly suggest you learn how to do it.I recently started playing with this Luigi player that I met through another friend. Now I know he doesn't follow the competitive scene or read up on frame data. But the way he plays is super lame and I have no idea how to counter it.
He plays super defensive and just spot dodge 24/7. He would spam fireballs and wait for me to approach him then he would spot dodge and jab/grab or upsmash/dsmash. When he's not spot dodging he would spam fireballs and SH fair to create a wall and slowly push me to the edge, if he sees me trying to magnet or shield he would dash up behind the fireball and grab me. And because Luigi's frame data are so good, I feel like there is nothing I can do to punish his spot dodge, jabs, grabs, or smash attacks. 1 grab = 50%. Around 100% is when he looks for opportunity to upsmash. If I block the upsmash, it pushes me away (not sure if I can dash up and grab). Dsmash comes out so quick and recovers fast (7 frames), no way I can punish that.
Should I try faking him out and wait for him to spot dodge? Isn't that too risky. It just seems so easy for him to punish everything I do, like I have no safe options.
Also, should I be using Fair or Nair more in a neutral game? I find Fair great for pressuring shield and disrupting their aerial attacks. But the recovery is longer and is more easily punishable if they dash under me and grab. Nair just feels so short that it seems like every time I throw it out, I get hit by their air attacks. Please advise.
First you have to analyze your opponent's reaction to an oncoming PKT (but I'll admit, 80% of my opponents react the same way).Thanks for the response.
Next question; how do you effectively aim PK Thunder to hit with the tail? I try to edgeguard with it but more often than not I'll hit with the head or not hit at all. Also, is there an effective way to set up PKT2 traps from an edgeguard?