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- Thread starter Commander_Beef
- Start date
bubbaking
Smash Hero
That would probably be Coney.......or me. 
D
Deleted member 189823
Guest
Love for Coney.
Talking about Coney, have any more recent matches of him? I can't find many recent match, but those sets against Olimar are beautiful. You've inspired me to love that MU I have yet to try. ;~;
Talking about Coney, have any more recent matches of him? I can't find many recent match, but those sets against Olimar are beautiful. You've inspired me to love that MU I have yet to try. ;~;
allshort17
Smash Ace
9B for best Dedede ever.
Player-1
Smash Legend
yes he is indeedBy that you mean 4god if the most amazing ddd ever!
| Big D |
Smash Master
bubbaking
Smash Hero
Holy cow, the background on that first match was distracting. 
D
Deleted member 189823
Guest
Why.
What do you mean? He looks pretty fine to me. Skinutski is amazing.
Nah, it's fine.Holy cow, the background on that first match was distracting.
I never really saw how textures like those are distracting. You're supposed to look at the characters, not the backround.
| Big D |
Smash Master
I didn't mean he was the one getting exposed...
allshort17
Smash Ace
I personally really enjoy his insane patience. How he approached some MU's through patience and defense just blew my mind. I can't really say any of his results, so technically speaking, I know that Atomsk is better (and also tied for first in my option). But, from what I've seen from him, I really respect his sense of spacing and slow approach. Also, he was very technically solid. He's the only Dedede I've ever seen do the banana lock infinite on Diddy in tournament. He's the pinnacle of patient play. I just wish he still played Dedede.
Gadiel_VaStar
Smash Champion
Too bad thats not the case. He moved onto better things, but at least he gave you plenty of vids to study from.
D
Deleted member 189823
Guest
I see...well, I'm really not a fan of slow and defensive play :E, so I'm not too big on that.
His ICs are pretty cool, though.
A question:
Why do some people end the CG with a simple D-Throw? Isn't F-Throw a better option because of the way better damage? Or why not just Pummel Release for a possible edgehog?
bubbaking
Smash Hero
Dthrow combos into ftilt. If you delay the ftilt, you can possibly eat up a DJ. Also, it still sets the position in a great position to be edgeguarded while tacking on some extra damage. It's like a compromise between GR and fthrow.
Edit: But admittedly, sometimes DDDs aren't thinking or are lazy.
Edit: But admittedly, sometimes DDDs aren't thinking or are lazy.
allshort17
Smash Ace
Not all the time. D-throw to dtilt/ftilt can lead to more damage than just fthrow. Also, at higher percents, fthrow sends some character very high, eliminating our pressure and gimping abilities. Characters like Snake favor being higher for recoveries. With Dthrow, it sends the opponent at a constant distance right in front of you. If they jump and you ftilt, you take away there jump and that can usually lead to a gimp or panic recovery. Also, you can just hog the ledge and force them to wait it out or go over you. Other follow-ups include footstools (rare), run off bair/fair, and dtilt. Plus, if you don't hog the ledge, the opponent usually goes for the ledge, putting you at a very advantageous situation. I think fthrow can be better at lower percents. but you need to mix-up your cg ending in order to get different reactions and follow-up. You can also try to grab-release, which can drop some characters lower than just a dthrow, making it easier to gimp them, or up-throw. I know people believe up-throw is 2008, but I like it for people with solid ledge options and sub-par options when above us, such as Pit.
bubbaking
Smash Hero
I would have thought that Snake would have been a better example for that uthrow example.
D
Deleted member 189823
Guest
The DDD's I've seen end it with the D-Throw really had no follow-ups after that. 8P
allshort17
Smash Ace
How do you deal with IC's blizzard and Uair?
bubbaking
Smash Hero
Just off the top of my head, doesn't DDD's ftilt go through blizzard, and his dair through ICs' uair?
Coney
Smash Master
against blizzard approach from the top; invariably, they will send one IC to uair you away, and you can bait and punish.
alternatively, throw waddles and hope for a gordo. they go through blizzard.
for uair, bait and punish, or just dair
alternatively, throw waddles and hope for a gordo. they go through blizzard.
for uair, bait and punish, or just dair
D
Deleted member 189823
Guest
DDD boards. I am very interested in building an aggresive, preferably fast paced, DDD.
Like, what approaches should I look forward to, what kind of things should I be doing, dealing with camping that might pose a threat to this playstyle.
Anything, anything at all.
Like, what approaches should I look forward to, what kind of things should I be doing, dealing with camping that might pose a threat to this playstyle.
Anything, anything at all.
allshort17
Smash Ace
Shield grab. Dedede's terrible at approaching. But, if you powershield a move you can usually shield grab for your best approaching option. Don't be too predicable or committal though because they can just grab you back or spotdodge. Bair's also pretty good if you know what you can beat with it and what you can't.
Dedede's just really not an aggressive character. He's a grappler. When have you ever seen an aggressive Zangief, T. Hawk, Potemkin, Tager, ect. do well consistently? They're just not built for that. And if you are thinking about Coney then he even admits he plays Dedede too aggressive to bee effective.
D
Deleted member 189823
Guest
Ah, the good ol' shieldgrab.
Anything on how to punish 'dem spotdodges, though? I wouldn't like to rely on Dash Attack to punish all of them, and thereby staling one of my KO moves.
And does RAR B-Air work well as an approach?
Anything on how to punish 'dem spotdodges, though? I wouldn't like to rely on Dash Attack to punish all of them, and thereby staling one of my KO moves.
And does RAR B-Air work well as an approach?
| Big D |
Smash Master
If you're approaching and you feel the will spotdodge then running past them and pivot grabbing works well. If they are approaching you and you feel they will spotdodge but not sure when, inhale works really well.
D
Deleted member 189823
Guest
Thank you.
Where can I find more recent videos (2011 and above) of Coney and/or Vex? I see very few matches of them. Is there some kind of playlist? I'd also like to see how they did at APEX during that time.
EDIT: Singles only, please.
Where can I find more recent videos (2011 and above) of Coney and/or Vex? I see very few matches of them. Is there some kind of playlist? I'd also like to see how they did at APEX during that time.
EDIT: Singles only, please.
i wonder...during a perfectly framed skid cancelled shield grab CG, is the time between the dthrow and the grab longer than during a regular CG ? i have played against marth lately and it seems like he can make his way out with a Bup easier than with a regular CG.
Altough i don't think my scsg cg is perfectly framed :|
Altough i don't think my scsg cg is perfectly framed :|
FredFuchs
Smash Apprentice
i've read somewhere (i think on a comment by tech chase) that ddd does have options to punish mk's whorenado. what are such options besides praying that it doesn't shield stab?
FredFuchs
Smash Apprentice
bubbaking
Smash Hero
Well, if you time and space yourself properly, you can utilt MK out of his tornado but you can't allow your shield to be hit for that. I don't know what DDD is supposed to do against a competent MK that 'nados your shield.
Bobwithlobsters
Smash Journeyman
I believe the generally most accepted option is just shield through it and attempt to punish the ending. If he runs the whole tornado on your shield you can try to spot dodge the ending of it to conserve shield. Sadly even ddd's spot dodge can be punished by tornado. Kinda stupid considering I believe that buffered spot dodges by ddd can't be punished by grabs or fox's lasers...
bubbaking
Smash Hero
They can be, but the grabs/lasers/applicable attacks have to be basically frame-perfect. 
CourageHound
Smash Ace
Hey guys, so I was wondering if I could get a MU tip. So I was fighting an MK as DDD and he took me to Frigate Orpheon. I dunno the details of the Frigate vs MK but I was getting wrecked. Barely any room to work, the lack of ledges was pretty glaring, and I was pretty much a combo target till I could regain momentary stage control. Any tips vs MK in general, not just Frigate?
bubbaking
Smash Hero
Every stage that's not SV or FD is a pretty heavy MK CP in this MU, I feel. I'm really pessimistic about that MU, though...
D
Deleted member 189823
Guest
Personally I think people fighting MK should learn to space well, aka, not letting him do anything he wants with you. I wouldn't turtle it, either.
You also would like to kill him rather early. I just hate seeing MK live over 120% when DDD can kill him quite before that with an U-Tilt or a Dash-Attack/D-Smash setup out of D-Throw.
Question:
Is DDD's N-Air hurtbox present when the hitbox is out? Say I want to punish Fox/Falco's phantasm, will it work to get him out of it?
You also would like to kill him rather early. I just hate seeing MK live over 120% when DDD can kill him quite before that with an U-Tilt or a Dash-Attack/D-Smash setup out of D-Throw.
Question:
Is DDD's N-Air hurtbox present when the hitbox is out? Say I want to punish Fox/Falco's phantasm, will it work to get him out of it?
CourageHound
Smash Ace
I'm quite certain nair will do the trick. However due to you having to time n-air to hit before you plop onto the ground I would much rather throw a waddle(which could mayyybe net a kill with a gordo), throw out an u-tilt(can also kill), Full hop down air, or f-tilt(not sure if this out prioritizes illusion though..). I say this cuz usually fox/falco use illusion close to the ground level. If you miss with n-air, which is a great possibility, then you have the split second belly flop lag and get hit by the illusion. Even if you did hit with n-air, I couldn't imagine you being able to follow up smoothly.
D
Deleted member 189823
Guest
Hm, I was referring more to a situation where I get him offstage and then attempt to gimp him. In Training Mode, I could do some cool things combining aerials like N-Airs, F-Airs and B-Airs. Obviously the CPU doesn't do a very good job with it's reactions, but- It could just work against a player.
bubbaking
Smash Hero
I honestly don't think you know what you're talking about. You can't 'space' against a character who is faster than you, craps on your shield, and beats out most of your attacks with his OWN spacing. Tornado beats out every tilt other than a perfectly timed utilt, and it beats every aerial, other than a perfectly positioned u/dair. You can't "turtle" him, but it's really hard to be aggro against him as well. MK just wins heavily in every scenario, even after a successful hit from DDD. You say you "hate seeing MK live over 120%," but if MK is playing properly, he can live LONG past that. Good MKs won't be utilted. Many of your punishments will be throws with some bairs and tilts mixed in. I doubt that DDD will be killing with staled bairs or dtilts until 150%. Dthrow does not always set-up for DA or dsmash. The move sets up a tech-chase, not a true combo situation, and MK also has a choice (through his DI) over whether he wants to be run through that TC scenario.
Yes, the hurtbox is still present. I've never tried to intercept Illusion/Phantasm with nair. It might work, but my bet is that the move will trade if it actually hits Fox/Falco. It's better to just go for a tilt or b/dair, IMO.
CourageHound
Smash Ace
Have you ever gotten a dash attack out of a tech chase? Does that work or can someone PS it?
bubbaking
Smash Hero
I've gotten a DA out of a tech-chase, but I'm not sure if it's actually guaranteed out of any tech options.