Golden Sun: The Lost Age (of) Mafia -Game Over! Indy Alex wins!

[Kantrip]

Oh have there only been two lighthouses lit?

Maybe scum dying isn't the trigger.

 

[rid****ulous]

It hasn't been every other night or anything like that though. It's been on nights when Red scum have just died, which was N2 and N3. But not N1, when Blue scum died.

There could be something else triggering it, but hell if I know what it is. No use worrying about it, really.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

After n2 it starts, my guess is Jupiter lighthouse happens tonight and mars will be the night after.

Mars being lot is the most dangerous because scum, except for Alex, are all mars adapts.

 

[#HBC | Ryker]

Okay, someone post the list of claims for me, because I feel like there are waaaaaaaaaaaaaay too many roles that can be used protectively, both active and passive.

 

[Furio Tigre]

Okay, someone post the list of claims for me, because I feel like there are waaaaaaaaaaaaaay too many roles that can be used protectively, both active and passive.

I share similar sentiments.

Traveling Cat can not be night killed. There are other quirks to her role, but she initially kept these quirks to herself. Babi. Mercury Adept?

Red Ryu - presumed Mercury Adept Jailer. Mia.

Kantrip - self watcher, Jupiter Adept. Hama.

Riddick - Busdriver. Bunzo.

Ryker - BP and...Move, which essentially forces a bodyguard. Felix.

Don Tigre - A type of commuter. Mercury Adept. Piers.

Rake - Neighborer, Ivan.

 

[Furio Tigre]

Putting aside flavor and claims though, I really want to hear your input on who you feel blue scum is, Ryker. Whom do you believe makes sense to be WL/BSL's mate?

 

[Kantrip]

I thought tcat claimed a type of commuter too?

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Babi is not an adapt.

I'll get to this in the morning.

 

[#HBC | Ryker]

Putting aside flavor and claims though, I really want to hear your input on who you feel blue scum is, Ryker. Whom do you believe makes sense to be WL/BSL's mate?

Putting it aside, what do you have? Kantrip tripping all over himself at the beginning of the game including in his interactions with WL. If you want to lynch someone based solely on play, he's the only candidate. TCat who hasn't been here much. Ruy, who is probably town. Rake, who is probably town. Riddick who I haven't read. Furio who I have as town after those two big ones.

I'll give you a Riddick read when I have time to read again (soon). I've only really read Day 1 and toDay, but I have at least skimmed everything else.

 

[Kantrip]

There's more to play than looking at one player in a vacuum, Ryker.

You mention my interactions to WL. You can look at everyone's reactions to WL/BSL for scumminess if you can't find it in individual play, and you can also get townreads and use PoE. PoE is a way to work through without having scumreads but not using mechanics.

 

[#HBC | Ryker]

Are you seriously lecturing me? I was pointing out how absurd it was to not take into account roles in what looks like an obnoxiously overprotective set-up. As for your play, I seriously doubt anything that comes up in a reread will make me feel less like the early game where I had you as linked to WL is going to make you anything near cleared on a PoE.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Ryker do you think teh two factions and the info you got plays a part, fro my role I do't think it plays a role with it since that means Saturos, aka the game where Mia is a mainstale more so than The Lost Age, would make sense.

Otherwise I think one or both scum teams had a strongman.

 

[Furio Tigre]

I thought tcat claimed a type of commuter too?

False. TCat can not be killed during any night phase. A commuter is someone who is invulnerable to all actions only when they use their active ability.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Damn it Breyu can't spell.

Still I agree not a fan of Kantrip but if you could spell out what in particular makes him and WL bad I will listen, I want Tcat atm.

 

[#HBC | Ryker]

Ryker do you think teh two factions and the info you got plays a part, fro my role I do't think it plays a role with it since that means Saturos, aka the game where Mia is a mainstale more so than The Lost Age, would make sense.

Otherwise I think one or both scum teams had a strongman.

Okay, if I misinterpreted your post, tell me. You want to know about your information that there is someone who can bypass your protect and the one that I have that says that my BP isn't infallible are because of the same thing? I think that mine is based on different factions. It could be because of a strong man, but I doubt it.

My comments about Swiss's role are all conjecture based on the fact that Issac and Felix mirror each other as characters and my abilities, seeing as Move is powerful but only a one-shot, could easily be made with a duplicate who is BP to the opposite side in a double mafia game.

 

[#HBC | Ryker]

Damn it Breyu can't spell.

Still I agree not a fan of Kantrip but if you could spell out what in particular makes him and WL bad I will listen, I want Tcat atm.

I want TCat too because she's claiming to be unkillable when we have multiple protectives. Furio said to ignore roles, which is not reflective of what I actually want done.

Kantrip I never liked mostly because of the early game defense that WL put up for him when he was acting scummy at the start before it became obvious that he would get heat for it.

 

[#HBC | Ryker]

Wait a sec, wait a sec, wait a sec. I may not have to continue to guess at whether or not Swiss is my double or if there's a strongman.

Rake, did Swiss claim to you? If he did and he isn't BP of some sort, then there probably is a strongman and I'm not factionally bulletproof.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

It's possible your info might relate to mine, I'm damn sure there is a strongman over a roleblocker.

I know for a fact one or the other is here in the game, that much I am sure of.

I want TCat because she claimed unkillable without any restiction on it, plus her reads are very jarring on a reread, more so what she said on D1. Her reaction to the Inferno claim where she puts doubt on me is even more confusing, she votes Inferno but then puts doubt on my fake guilty.

I'm not seeing the thought behind those actions.

When you catch up, btw will bribe with League skins RP if you get this up tomorrow I'm dead serious, tell me what you think of her actions.

 

[Kantrip]

False. TCat can not be killed during any night phase. A commuter is someone who is invulnerable to all actions only when they use their active ability.

False. A commuter is a role that leaves the NAR. It can either be automatic or activated. In LoL UPick, for example, I was Singed, Town Commuter and I passively commuted every Night, being always immune to Night actions. Some commuters are even/odd Night, and some are activated with a 1-shot, 2-shot, or what have you restriction.

 

[Kantrip]

Wait a sec, wait a sec, wait a sec. I may not have to continue to guess at whether or not Swiss is my double or if there's a strongman.

Rake, did Swiss claim to you? If he did and he isn't BP of some sort, then there probably is a strongman and I'm not factionally bulletproof.

He did claim and Rake already outed what Swiss said.

You and Swiss are not doubles. Swiss apparently had 4 abilites that were 1-shot each, and he could only use 2 of them in the game. One was a vote block, one a double voter, one made someone take 1 more to lynch, and one did I forget.

 

[rid****ulous]

False. A commuter is a role that leaves the NAR. It can either be automatic or activated. In LoL UPick, for example, I was Singed, Town Commuter and I passively commuted every Night, being always immune to Night actions. Some commuters are even/odd Night, and some are activated with a 1-shot, 2-shot, or what have you restriction.

you're missing the point. TCat is immune to kills, not other actions like investigations. A commuter is immune to everything, because they become freaking gone for the night. They typically do have to activate their power, otherwise they wouldn't be a commuter, they'd just be "immune". There's a reason commuters have to choose to use their power. They may think an investigator is targeting them, and they want to get cleared.

 

[Kantrip]

Yeah tcat isn't a commuter because she doesn't leave the NAR. It was my mistake initially because I read her claim of "I travel to this cave every Night" and took that as leaving the NAR without looking at the mechanical implications.

So tcat is bulletproof, Ruy is jailer, Furio is commuter, and Ryker has a one-shot bulletproof as well as some sort of NA manipulating action?

So we have a bunch of protective claims, yeah?
And we have a town bus driver that saved Rake, yeah?

Ryker's claim looks really fishy under that microscope. One-shot BP, first off. Just want to go on record saying whenever I see one-shot BP in a game it is not town. Usually indy, with multiple mafia factions in this setup could easily be mafia too. Then Ryker's second ability is REALLY close to a bus driver, yet we already have one of those.

Ryker on claim alone looks really bad. Then you see his general inactivity which means he has nothing to REDEEM him from this claim. Then you look at that one post he made with regards to WashedLaundry's slot. Then you look at how he's trying to focus on mechanics right now rather than play. He's also been holding on to a scumread on my slot that reads as disingenuous to me. I am more than fine with Ryker going.

Vote: Ryker

 

[rid****ulous]

He's not the only one who thinks you were scummy as **** on D1 man.

I wanna discuss with my partner before voting.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

unvote Ryker someone, jesus Kantrip.

I don't want him ended til we get a plan for nightphase. Also I do not think Ryker is better over Tcat right now.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Knatrip if your not scum jesus.

Like if we do have even half these PRs we need to plan this crap.

 

[Kantrip]

Why we're lynching Ryker right now

[collapse=Ryker's early posts]

I hate Kantrip. I hate KevMo more. **** that guy.

Ryker, I'm going to be honest with you in pregame, I'm generally going to ignore literally everything you say this game until you either flip, and or I have no other choice but to sift through your posts.

Nothing personal though bay lets play league later <3

You know I'm not going to take anything like that personal. However, if you don't tell me why you had to do what you did, I'm gonna be forced to make you start sifting already. I really don't like it and if you don't want me to straight up call you out on it, then I'll need to know why.

His push on you is null, his attemps to wiggle his way through accusations is not.

Give this man a prize.

Hoping confirmation phase is long because I can't post until my hydra is straightened out when the game starts.

Kantrip is town, this is the exact same idiotic bull**** that he pulled in the last 2 games I played with him and I called him on it. He apparently still hasn't learned.

Oh, Happy b-day RR!

Where's your scum comparison that means he's town instead of null, if that's the case?

Don't need one, he's not good enough to force a farce of his town behavior without making it glaringly obvious. He's town.

Weak sauce.

Definitely looks like you did.

Don't like Laundry already.
Vote Kevin

Well, since he neglected to answer me, I'll elaborate.

I really, REALLY don't like this Miller crumb.

Crumbing it lets you waste a cop investigation still and stands to benefit only yourself. You only ever point it out in the event of a cop claim against you while keeping the option of never claiming it on the board.

Hi Kev. Sift please.

Aight, I'm here for the moment.

Kantrip is really bad. Like, really, really bad. But his play is still scummy. I just am not completely convinced of his scumminess yet. I'm not playing the "let's find scummies before the game even starts" game, that's chibo-level horse****, but his actions in pregame are peculiar to say the least and fairly scummy.

That said, despite his weird inconsistencies in his actions, I do remember Kantplay being ****ty gambit guy from like a year ago so pulling a ****ty gambit and then panicking when it fails doesn't seem too out-of-character for him. It's not a pass for his play but it's definitely something to stop me from jumping straight on the lynch wagon.

Adumb's defense of it was horse****. "I've seen him do this as town all the time radarada he's badtown, ignore him" is bad and he should feel bad. Even if this is a dumb vs. scum case, he needs to flesh it out a lot more than he did and a few posts in pregame (I'mma keep stressing this guys, pregame means jack **** to me) are definitely not enough to make that call, not in a case like this. DumbA strikes again, I suppose.

I have no read on IR for it though. Typical Gheb is typical. Salt levels too strong with a strong dose of tunnel and he even cut the explanations for it. If that's not cookie cutter, I-haven't-changed-how-I-play-in-3-years Gheb, I don't know what is.

First, paragraph is legit.

Second paragraph is terrible and ruins the first paragraph because it removes all commitment to the read.

Third paragraph is hella legit. Adum probably has the single worst post in the game sans that miller crumb. However, I don't like the stress that pregame means nothing.

Fourth paragraph is dumb as ****. Shots at Gheb for no better reason than to empty chambers in his revolver.



I haven't had an issue with any of his other posts that I remember. This is the one that comes to mind when I think of WL. Overall, I don't like him, but at the moment, I would much rather kill Kev or kill Kantrip. If Kantrip flips scum, look at Laundry. If Kantrip flips town, look at Adum.

All day long, Swiss.

[/collapse]
After this collection of posts, Ryker disappeared for a while so I'll stop here for the purpose of this case as I'm sure it'll be enough.

Point 1: Ryker has a disturbingly low amount of contribution to the game

As you can see from the quotes compiled above, Ryker really didn't do much of anything this game. He started with a scumread on me and KevinM. He failed to adequately back up his read on me, and his read on KevinM was summed up by Kev's miller crumb. When the game starts, he votes KevinM and adds Laundry to his list of hated players. He shows everyone the miller crumb, He does an analysis on a WashedLaundry post but maintains that he wants me and Kev dead before Laundry, and that's basically it.

Ryker has unfortunately plagued the game with inactivity a lot more than with content. I hate to have to bring this up in a case but I want to be thorough and start with the easy stuff. The good news is that the inactivity is not the important part of this case.

Point 2: Ryker has an incriminating connection to WashedLaundry

This is a pretty strong point at this phase in the game, as we are all quite certain that we're looking for Laundry's partner on the blue mafia team. Ryker starts the game with very half-***ed distancing from Washed by calling him scum with a one-liner and leaving it. For a time. However, he revisits Laundry and dedicates his only post of analysis on him. This is significant.

Aight, I'm here for the moment.

Kantrip is really bad. Like, really, really bad. But his play is still scummy. I just am not completely convinced of his scumminess yet. I'm not playing the "let's find scummies before the game even starts" game, that's chibo-level horse****, but his actions in pregame are peculiar to say the least and fairly scummy.

That said, despite his weird inconsistencies in his actions, I do remember Kantplay being ****ty gambit guy from like a year ago so pulling a ****ty gambit and then panicking when it fails doesn't seem too out-of-character for him. It's not a pass for his play but it's definitely something to stop me from jumping straight on the lynch wagon.

Adumb's defense of it was horse****. "I've seen him do this as town all the time radarada he's badtown, ignore him" is bad and he should feel bad. Even if this is a dumb vs. scum case, he needs to flesh it out a lot more than he did and a few posts in pregame (I'mma keep stressing this guys, pregame means jack **** to me) are definitely not enough to make that call, not in a case like this. DumbA strikes again, I suppose.

I have no read on IR for it though. Typical Gheb is typical. Salt levels too strong with a strong dose of tunnel and he even cut the explanations for it. If that's not cookie cutter, I-haven't-changed-how-I-play-in-3-years Gheb, I don't know what is.

First, paragraph is legit.

Second paragraph is terrible and ruins the first paragraph because it removes all commitment to the read.

Third paragraph is hella legit. Adum probably has the single worst post in the game sans that miller crumb. However, I don't like the stress that pregame means nothing.

Fourth paragraph is dumb as ****. Shots at Gheb for no better reason than to empty chambers in his revolver.

We see here Ryker taking a post by Washed a really breaking it down. This is actually a very GOOD post by Ryker. The analysis is good and it even looks like it's coming from a townie perspective. It's his ONLY post of this sort, however, in a game where Ryker has put very little effort into everything else. So why did he put so much effort into this one post? Simple. Because the intention behind it was NOT analysis. The only reason Ryker put so much effort into this ONE post and NO others is because he needed to look townie and he needed to distance, as his goals as scum. He accomplished both by doing this, so it was worthwhile. That's why this post got made and no other good Ryker posts. It was top priority.

I haven't had an issue with any of his other posts that I remember. This is the one that comes to mind when I think of WL. Overall, I don't like him, but at the moment, I would much rather kill Kev or kill Kantrip. If Kantrip flips scum, look at Laundry. If Kantrip flips town, look at Adum.

You can see how he floats his WL read at the bottom of all his scumreads, behind me and Kev. He wants to distance, but he doesn't want to put his scummate in danger because they're only a team of two. Well, more because it's not necessary to bus so early or put Laundry in danger, but it does benefit him to distance. So he calls him scum and makes sure he has GOOD reasoning. The problem is that he DOESN'T have good reasoning for a KevinM or a Kantrip scumread, so having them above Laundry is purely irrational. Why would you spend time analyzing your THIRD scumpick? It is pretty apparent that outlining what he doesn't like about Laundry wasn't the point of this post.

Point 3: Ryker started posting again when his slot was in trouble and no earlier

Pretty self-explanatory of a point. It was awfully convenient when Ryker suddenly "jumped back" into the game. When he was in danger he began to have time for this again. He cared about saving his ***.

Point 4: Ryker is failing to come up with any reasoning for his reads which have remained almost constant throughout the game

Ryker has posted reads a great deal of times, but WashedLaundry (his 3rd scumpick in D1) was the only one he ever explained. All game, from Day 1 until now, he has called me scum. NEVER has there been a good reason for it besides that I was "playing badly". He hasn't made the distinction between bad and scum because there isn't one. He picked his scumreads D1 (me and Kev) because they were convenient. Kev had that miller crumb, and I was being typical Kantplay.

Hoping confirmation phase is long because I can't post until my hydra is straightened out when the game starts.

Kantrip is town, this is the exact same idiotic bull**** that he pulled in the last 2 games I played with him and I called him on it. He apparently still hasn't learned.

Oh, Happy b-day RR!

Where's your scum comparison that means he's town instead of null, if that's the case?

Don't need one, he's not good enough to force a farce of his town behavior without making it glaringly obvious. He's town.

Weak sauce.

In this exchange we see adum calling me town because of parallels to other games where I pulled the same stuff. Ryker tries to argue that that should make me null, not town. However, Ryker doesn't have any leverage to argue that it is SCUMMY, so why does he CONTINUE to scumread me?

His reads have always just been there because they are convenient. "KevinM has a bad crumb, kill him. Kantrip is playing bad. Lynch him. If Swiss is alive D4, lynch him." WashedLaundry is the exception but I've already covered why that is the case.

Point 5: Ryker's claim is incredibly suspect

Okay, claims.

I'm Felix. I'm a Venus adept. I have two abilities.

The second one is a passive called Hero. I can live through one night kill, but it warns me that it can't stop everything. I assume this means I'm bulletproof to one mafia and I'll bet you $20 that Swiss had the same ability for the other. I don't know which it would be. The mafia from Felix's game is dead so maybe it was them or maybe he can only be killed by them. That, or there is a strongman.

The initial one is called Move. It has one use that I have expended. It moves a target player behind another target player, causing all actions that would target them to target the other and it moves first in NAR short of a theoretical roleblocker. I know because I *****ed at Raz until he told me. I used it to move Swiss behind Frozenflame on N2. I wouldn't be surprised if Swiss had its twin.



Now, back to reading.

So we have a claim of:

1-shot bulletproof
1-shot redirect

Regardless of how he tried to fancy up the description of his abilities, this is what they really are. He tries to say Swiss had the same abilities as him to give him more credibility (I guess he chose Swiss because Isaac is a Venus adept?). Unfortunately for Ryker, Rake knew Swiss's abilities and claimed them already and they do not match this. Moving on though:

We have a Town Bus Driver already claimed. Having both a Town Bus Driver and a one-shot Redirector is weird.

We have a Doctor/Jailer, a permanent bulletproof (with some other facets unclaimed), and a commuter of some sort already claimed. Having all of those and ANOTHER one-shot bulletproof is weird.

In multiple ways, Ryker's claim doesn't fit with how many roles town already has. Town has too many protectives and too many redirect roles, and Ryker's is the ONLY one that fits both of these. Ryker being scum would solve both of these surplusses.

I can get into the fact that redirect is typically scum and 1-shot BP is typically indy, too. And with 2 mafia factions having a 1-shot BP as a mafioso would make sense too.

In Conclusion

Ryker is scum. He has done almost nothing this game except distance from WashedLaundry, he has been unable to describe rational thought behind any of his reads, he has jumped on easy players to hate for easy reasons, he came back into the game when he was in trouble, and his claim is super scummy.

Go go go?

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

If Kantrip derps and doesn't unvote.

I need to announce my jail, abosulutely, it will be Kantrip if Ryker dies.

Ridic needs to switch me with someone and will not tell period.

Furio will commute no questions asked.

TCat will die tomorrow.

Rake will do whatever if Jupiter lighthouse is lit.

Kantrip sits tight and makes me facepalm.

 

[Kantrip]

Plan for the Night phase is there shouldn't be a Night phase. If there is, feel free to jail either me or tcat, whichever you feel is best. Does anyone else even have an active ability?

 

[Kantrip]

Like honestly Night phase is so self explanatory why the hell are you directing people?

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Jesus Kantrip stop forcing s QL and shut the hell up.

Let poeple respond and get info I do not want him at L-1.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

I will ****ing force you dead D5 if you don;t unvote, dead serious idgaf if your town either.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Vote: Kantrip

 

[Kantrip]

Unvote

****ing hell you are bloody annoying. Read the case and tell me I'm right and let's get on with this

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Kantrip is ****ing scum if he doesn't unvote, **** him over if he doesn't do such.

 

[Kantrip]

I will ****ing force you dead D5 if you don;t unvote, dead serious idgaf if your town either.

This is so stupid. You'd rather mislynch me and wouldn't care if I'm town than have Ryker at L-1 right now?

What even the ****? Read why Ryker is scum ffs

 

[Kantrip]

You know what? **** you.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

**** no.

I''ll reread when sober, but I want Ryker's reponse + other. I'm not letting your force a ****ing Gigabots like EE/Glyph did on me.

 

[Kantrip]

You're not sober? No wonder you're being so ****ing ********. Get out of this thread when you're not in the right mind to use your brain

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

This is so stupid. You'd rather mislynch me and wouldn't care if I'm town than have Ryker at L-1 right now?

What even the ****? Read why Ryker is scum ffs

Be quiet.

Later when I can competently.

Your not putting him in a QL situation with almost a week left and us to discuss a plan.

We are not rushing this.

 

[Kantrip]

You mean like the Inferno lynch? Oh man I'm glad you strongmanned us out of that one. So glad you made us wait and not quicklynch him.

oh wait