Geno (♥♪!?): Return of the Starsend Savior

[drag0nscythe]

Oh, I've been ready for dissapointment since I first started rooting for Geno to join, defentally not as long as some of yall in this thread, but I have wanted Geno for a while...Disappointment is not new to me, but it gets worse each time.



Your points are completely valid, and I respect every single point you made. But look at it this way, there's no official way of deconfirming someone unless it comes from a companies. Geno May never have a chance again, does not mean that there is still a logical explanation on how he could get in though. Mii fighters and I do have a love/hate relationship, I hate the 90% likely deconfimrs, but I love the details on the costumes. even if I do not 100% agree with what you said, I 85% agree though.

That is true. There is no official way of de-confirming a character unless outright from rights holder. I do think when it comes to speculation, I think mii costumes do a very solid job of taking chances down to maybe 5% or though.
And costume details are awesome. Love how Goemon looks.

 

[StrangeKitten]

I do think the Mii costume deconfirms Geno for probably the rest of Ultimate DLC. I'm kinda 50/50 on Mii costumes and spirit events: If they happened early on, well, the original plan was just to do FP1, so they don't deconfirm. Hence, Min Min. But if it's more recent, it probably does deconfirm. Ring Fit Adventurer and Paper Mario likely aren't happening, at least for this pass. And the Geno Mii costume is honestly showing up at a pretty bad time. Of course we don't know for certain what the future plans will be, but I would think that if more characters beyond FP2 are in those plans, the ball has likely started rolling. So I'm expecting Geno to be out for good unless they really blindside us by adding way more characters beyond FP2.

But it's worth keeping in mind that Mii costumes do only cost 75¢. That's affordable even to low-income people. So sure, it would be a little scummy to have people buy a Mii costume and then a fully-playable fighter later, but only slightly. The cost for both is only around $7, after all.

 

[Paper_Marzio]

I haven't personally been involved with the Geno fanbase aside from making some memes awhile ago and lurking, but my condolences for the massive amount of hate being received in all corners of the internet right now. Additionally, as someone who appreciates the direction Super Mario RPG took with unique characters I feel saddened to see Geno fall from grace again.

However, a DS game, Mario Hoops 3 on 3, being a combination of Nintendo and Square Enix did feature Geno and Mallow!

This means that Square Enix and Nintendo DO care about Geno! So hopefully this unique puppet can find some ground given that he's not limited in appearance given that he's a playable character in that game!


Hopefully the direction of the Mario RPGs stop being sterile by the time Geno breaks into the spotlight for Super Mario RPG 2 and Smash!

 

[GenoToto]

I haven't personally been involved with the Geno fanbase aside from making some memes awhile ago and lurking, but my condolences for the massive amount of hate being received in all corners of the internet right now. Additionally, as someone who appreciates the direction Super Mario RPG took with unique characters I feel saddened to see Geno fall from grace again.

However, a DS game, Mario Hoops 3 on 3, being a combination of Nintendo and Square Enix did feature Geno and Mallow!
View attachment 296274

This means that Square Enix and Nintendo DO care about Geno! So hopefully this unique puppet can find some ground given that he's not limited in appearance given that he's a playable character in that game!


Hopefully the direction of the Mario RPGs stop being sterile by the time Geno breaks into the spotlight for Super Mario RPG 2 and Smash!

As much as I would love for this to be true, it's just a fan-made creation from someone over on DeviantART: https://www.deviantart.com/ellistandarbros/art/Mario-Hoops-3-on-3-Geno-and-Mallow-846175550

 

[Paper_Marzio]

As much as I would love for this to be true, it's just a fan-made creation from someone over on DeviantART: https://www.deviantart.com/ellistandarbros/art/Mario-Hoops-3-on-3-Geno-and-Mallow-846175550

Oh, well that is disappointing, really confused as to why he wouldn't appear in a game like that.

 

[Urso_Ornitier]

As much as I would love for this to be true, it's just a fan-made creation from someone over on DeviantART: https://www.deviantart.com/ellistandarbros/art/Mario-Hoops-3-on-3-Geno-and-Mallow-846175550

Of course it’s fan made.

Geno with rocket hands and Mallow with stretchy arms would be WAY TOO overpowered for basketball.

 

[MamaLuigi123456]

Personally, I wasn't too surprised with the result of Sephiroth's presentation. However, I am with the camp that believes Geno is still possible, either as FP9 with the Mario 35th anniversary or as a bonus. I do not believe in a third fighter's pass.

Regardless, I want to say I am glad I made some people laugh here in the Geno thread with the posts I made yesterday. Until Geno eventually becomes a fighter, expect me to periodically post drawings and other fun things. You guys are doing a great job with dealing with and outside negativity, keep it up!
P.S. Thank you QQS for your never-ending attitude of positivity and helping me out in my early days here!
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Take these as a token of appreciation!

THERE I AM GARY THERE I AM

 

[Firox]

You know, looking back at the Sephiroth presentation, I think it's really interesting to dissect the psychology behind what happened. Think about it: Historically, the mii costumes have always come at the end of the presentation, never at the beginning if memory serves. Now, why would Sakurai choose to do that? Some reasons could include:

-He wanted to rip off the band-aid for Geno, knowing how many of us were biting our nails over it? Considering the fact that he knew how much of a fan base Geno had, I think this is certainly a factor. But also consider this—the last time he presented the costume, Geno got a special mention, a splash screen, and basically a mock reveal. This time? No splash screen. No special entrance. Sakurai didn't even mention Geno by name. All we saw was "Smash bros X SMRPG" with the "Beware the forest mushrooms" in the background. Geno's name was only referenced in the Mii pack graphic for purchase. So why give the puppet a special nod in Sm4sh, then virtually toss him over your shoulder in the next game? Because he no longer gives a ****? Because if he did he'd go into a rant about his puritanic Mario overlords? Maybe. OR....

-Notice how his segway into Sephiroth's presentation now draws our attention completely away from the Mii's to focus on the character at hand. The general viewership has now move on, casting the apparent death of Geno into the back of their minds. What if this was by design? By having the Mii reveal first, it ensures that the last taste in our mouths will be Sephiroth and not the Mii's. Again, this could be to soften the blow of Geno's death, but what if it's because he purposely wanted to sweep Geno under the rug? What if he purposely wants us to dismiss the chances of Geno ever coming...because it was the most effective way to shake leaker expectations? Sakurai lives for the shock factor. He always strives for the unexpected. Let's be honest, what could be more unexpected at this point than a Geno fakeout? Could there ever be a more ridiculously epic underdog reveal?! Granted, Geno's chances are still incredibly low and I'm fully aware that this line of thinking is a long shot, but if Sakurai really thinks that an unceremonious execution is the way to end a long time known fan favorite, that's pretty poor taste if you ask me.

 

[Trevenant]

We only believe Geno doesn't have a chance because of some dumb fan rule that says "No DLC Mii costumes can't get promoted". What we say doesn't matter as Sakurai is the one that decides the rules aside from Nintendo. And if a character can become a Mii, than I don't see it being impossible for them to become playable in the same game.

I can completely understand things being called dumb if they make zilch sense in speculation but, like, the mii costume one is far from dumb tbh. Pretty much every person here cant deny thinking that Geno mii-ssing was suspicious and a point in his general likelhood. There are also similar circumstances, which, while they were nowhere near as much a common belief as the missing Geno outfit being a notch in favour, still were held opinions which have not much reason to change aside from the Geno costume being revealed and they are all ones I mentioned earlier. The fortnite content and Travis and Heihachi. I remember people here saying those characters were unfortunately deconfirmed and offering condolences etc. Nothing has happened because of the Geno mii being revealed to imply that Nintendo are going to upgrade a costume which they made you pay for in order to get a consolation prize especially when all this has been finalised way in advance from the point when Travis and Heihachi were unfortunately disconfirmed so that means we just have to look at the facts we can imply from the costume which i just provided and i think its suffice to say it honestly shoves the nail in the coffin. Even in Ultimate in general, if we miraculously get more stuff after the deadline the mii costume is still a large obstacle.

Like, I'm all for calling BS on fanrules which really don't stick, but if we are being honest, we are only trying to call BS on DLC costumes just because it's Geno. For months we have been saying stuff like gen 8 pokemon, astral chain and ring fit etc were deconfirmed via spirit events and saying Heihachi and Travis were via costumes, and assuming Fortnite was getting a costume just to deconfirm it and as Geno hasn't changed anything in regards to costumes, we can only make exceptions if it was believed originally (and it was by tonnes of people) because it's Geno. With the mii costume in tow, the most we can do to say Geno is likely is just make a super general assumption and say 'You never know' but if we are at the point where we can only use a point which can not only be reasonably applied to absolutely anything involving Smash and absolutely anything not involving smash, then that should speak volumes for how likely we really think he is. You can but it just goes to show. Im not trying to make anyone give up hope btw but sugar coating the mii costume like i've seen people do to try and make him still seem like a reasonable expectation is why i wanted to point it out. Not everyone of course. I am bummed too. I have really gotten to know the character in the past couple years, which while barely comparing to people do hoping for him way back when 64 was, which shows how great a character he is inside and outside of smash and have been thinking he was very likely for over a year since a second wave was confirmed. I genuinely do hope he gets in someday as the prescence of the mii should surely attest to how well he could work, even if its not going to be in Ultimate

 

[Sovereign Trinity]

Hey, everyone. I've been on here for quite a while, and I wanted to say it's been fun and an honor being on here with you all. Even if Geno is a Mii costume, I will never forget the fun times we all had together during this speculation. I would like to thank PsychoIncarnate for making the ultimate supporing thread for Geno! I mean, look at it, we're ALMOST at 4000 PAGES! We had Geno veterans from the Melee and Brawl days return to us, and Geno's support has been the biggest it's ever been! Since it's always not a good thing to look at the negative side of things, I'm looking at the bright side of things. To me, it was the big journey that made this speculation incredibly fun, not the destination. Whether we get a 3rd fighters pass or a new Smash game in 2028, I will still support and hope for Geno and Mallow in anyway to come back to ANY game; whether it's Super Smash Brothers, a SMRPG sequel, remake, or a completely new Mario game. I think it would be best for Geno and Mallow to completely return in a Mario game first.

Personally, I love how they put Geno with the FF crew in this picture... judging from how it looks, it feels like Geno could surprisingly fit in with the Final Fantasy cast. In a way, it looks like Geno's a proud member of AVALANCHE in this picture... how cool!

I've been supporting Geno in Smash since the Brawl days (2007-08), and hoping for Geno and Mallow to return in a Mario game for almost 20 years now... it's been a rough ride for me as well. I will still be around, but it's time for me to move on. Stay safe, everyone. Once again, it's been fun and an honor. Love you all! <3

 

[S1itchey]

So I just binge watched some reactions to the geno mii costume and man. People really have it out for us. Some were DEFINETLY sad like papa and Rogers base but some were just mean. Even from people I wouldnt expect like Marss or coney. Jeez man.

 

[TheCJBrine]

Sad Truth: Humans are selfish, narcissistic, bigoted* assholes by nature. It really says something when you considers studies that have been done about what influences human "happiness".

For example: -If you have someone who makes $200,000/yr living in a neighborhood of millionaires, they are typically less happy than someone who makes $70,000/yr living in a neighborhood of people who make sub $40,000. Interestingly, humans don't find happiness in success unless they're MORE successful than those around them. We are sadistic creatures that subconsciously take pride and solace in watching the suffering and misfortune of others. The German's even invented the term "Schadenfreude" to describe the joy people get from the pain of others. It's pretty jacked up and there are always pleasant exceptions, but for the most part, humans are inherently evil and it's a personal struggle for all of us to fight the urge to kick others when they're down.

(*Definition of bigoted: obstinately or unreasonably attached to a belief, opinion, or faction, in particular prejudiced against or antagonistic toward a person or people on the basis of their membership of a particular group.)

I don’t believe in inherent evilness, but I can believe in inherent selfish feelings that are different for everyone. A lot of people are saddened by others doing worse off than them, and like helping others, despite the existence of selfishness.

Also despite the selfishness, we have naturally good and cooperative feelings that are done genuinely and not out of selfish wants or caring only about one’s own needs; studies have been done on those too. Like infants in the first year of life showing empathy towards others in distress, and people in their later years of life doing the same genuinely even if who they’re reacting to and trying to help is a stranger. Also people who still live like prehistoric humans, and feel obligated to share everything.

There are also personality disorders that cause some people to be unable to have certain feelings like empathy, like narcissistic disorders, psychopathy, sociopathy...people who may likely need mental help so they can stay good socially and even personally since some tend to not care about their own well-being either.

In reality, the human brain is very complex, and everyone is different. Most of our behavior is also dependent on environmental factors, and is not entirely genetic. That doesn’t make the bad stuff okay, and most if not everybody has a mix of feelings even if mostly good with little if any evil in a lot of people, and some unfortunately being unreasonable jerks or full-on evil, but y’know what I mean.

 

[QQS]

How is it the familiar QQS QQS saying goes... ah, yes.

No, it's

GENO AWAKENS

It’s actually:

GENO AWAKENS!

Personally, I wasn't too surprised with the result of Sephiroth's presentation. However, I am with the camp that believes Geno is still possible, either as FP9 with the Mario 35th anniversary or as a bonus. I do not believe in a third fighter's pass.

Regardless, I want to say I am glad I made some people laugh here in the Geno thread with the posts I made yesterday. Until Geno eventually becomes a fighter, expect me to periodically post drawings and other fun things. You guys are doing a great job with dealing with and outside negativity, keep it up!
P.S. Thank you QQS for your never-ending attitude of positivity and helping me out in my early days here!
View attachment 296266
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Take these as a token of appreciation!

Thanks for the drawings and the mention! Everyone is welcome on the QQS’s ride.

Why can't we have more people with the mindset of Mii costumes don't deconfirm. I mean I understand all points about them deconfirming people, but there are always counterpoints ya know?

I understand people think because we pay 75 cents for a mii costume, they are deconfirmed as fighters, My counter-point is that's a fan-rule

I understand that people are upset that the Geno costume is in the game instead of him being an actual fighter, my counter is Nintendo wanted to reuse most of the DLC costumes from Smash 4, as DLC for ultimate...

I understand a lot of the points, but each one can be easily countered. That's why even though getting Mii costumed hurts, It does not affect me as much as others, since I'm in the boat that Mii costumes do not deconfirm, only lower chances.

except if you are a deluxe, then your never getting in this game. So I'm actually happy Geno ain't a deluxe, or he would be a hard deconfirm.

This is so true. Maybe we didn’t have a deluxe costume cause, INDEED, Geno is going to f****** AWAKEN!

(This is my first Multi Quote post, it seems I have new skills and better English hahaha).

This is just the beggining. Geno isn’t gone, not even forgotten!

GENO SHOOTS FOR SMASH!

 

[Slender]

You know, looking back at the Sephiroth presentation, I think it's really interesting to dissect the psychology behind what happened. Think about it: Historically, the mii costumes have always come at the end of the presentation, never at the beginning if memory serves. Now, why would Sakurai choose to do that? Some reasons could include:

-He wanted to rip off the band-aid for Geno, knowing how many of us were biting our nails over it? Considering the fact that he knew how much of a fan base Geno had, I think this is certainly a factor. But also consider this—the last time he presented the costume, Geno got a special mention, a splash screen, and basically a mock reveal. This time? No splash screen. No special entrance. Sakurai didn't even mention Geno by name. All we saw was "Smash bros X SMRPG" with the "Beware the forest mushrooms" in the background. Geno's name was only referenced in the Mii pack graphic for purchase. So why give the puppet a special nod in Sm4sh, then virtually toss him over your shoulder in the next game? Because he no longer gives a ****? Because if he did he'd go into a rant about his puritanic Mario overlords? Maybe. OR....

-Notice how his segway into Sephiroth's presentation now draws our attention completely away from the Mii's to focus on the character at hand. The general viewership has now move on, casting the apparent death of Geno into the back of their minds. What if this was by design? By having the Mii reveal first, it ensures that the last taste in our mouths will be Sephiroth and not the Mii's. Again, this could be to soften the blow of Geno's death, but what if it's because he purposely wanted to sweep Geno under the rug? What if he purposely wants us to dismiss the chances of Geno ever coming...because it was the most effective way to shake leaker expectations? Sakurai lives for the shock factor. He always strives for the unexpected. Let's be honest, what could be more unexpected at this point than a Geno fakeout? Could there ever be a more ridiculously epic underdog reveal?! Granted, Geno's chances are still incredibly low and I'm fully aware that this line of thinking is a long shot, but if Sakurai really thinks that an unceremonious execution is the way to end a long time known fan favorite, that's pretty poor taste if you ask me.

Ooooorrrr they revealed the Mii Costumes first to allow the Tifa, Barret and Aerith Mii Costumes to be used during Sephiroth's presentation. I don't think the fact that the costumes being revealed first had any relation to Geno, and while I do wish that he said something about Geno, he did not speak about any of the other returning Mii Costumes in previous presentations.

I'm holding out hope for the next Famitsu article/interview for anything on Geno's fate.

 

[Cahalan]

Imagine if the Famitsu article has something along the lines of "Stay Tuned" coming from Sakurai in regards to Geno.

This thread would probably implode from hype alone.

 

[G0nard]

While I don't constantly post I just wanna say that you guys are something special. I believe in Geno and I believe in us. Regardless as to what happens I'll try my absolute best to support you guys as much as possible!!

 

[Deleted member]

I'd consider it better news for Sakurai to say nothing about Geno, though as I mentioned earlier, I doubt he'd say a word about it unprovoked.

 

[OptimisticStrifer]

Imagine if the Famitsu article has something along the lines of "Stay Tuned" coming from Sakurai in regards to Geno.

This thread would probably implode from hype alone.

Stay Tuned..... for the Mallow Costume

 

[MrGameguycolor]

So I just binge watched some reactions to the geno mii costume and man. People really have it out for us. Some were DEFINETLY sad like papa and Rogers base but some were just mean. Even from people I wouldnt expect like Marss or coney. Jeez man.

Eh...
After watching some of Marss's content, he totally has that belittling personality... (At least on the internet)

So I'm not surprised he would dip that low...

 

[Firox]

Ooooorrrr they revealed the Mii Costumes first to allow the Tifa, Barret and Aerith Mii Costumes to be used during Sephiroth's presentation. I don't think the fact that the costumes being revealed first had any relation to Geno, and while I do wish that he said something about Geno, he did not speak about any of the other returning Mii Costumes in previous presentations.

I'm holding out hope for the next Famitsu article/interview for anything on Geno's fate.

While that's a good point about the Tifa and Barret costumes, I'm not sure if that's true about him talking about the mii costumes. He talked a little about the Bomberman costume and could have sworn he said something about Travis.

 

[Dan]

So I just binge watched some reactions to the geno mii costume and man. People really have it out for us. Some were DEFINETLY sad like papa and Rogers base but some were just mean. Even from people I wouldnt expect like Marss or coney. Jeez man.

I don't understand it at all: we've never done **** to anyone and are like the most innocent sect of the internet; all we want is a puppet from a 24-year old Mario game...

 

[Malo Mart]

I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but I might as well rip off the bandaid... here's a DM screenshot of Jeff Grubb a friend of mine from Star Road sent me:

 

[Forthestarcapelad]

Stay Tuned..... for the Mallow Costume

AXEM RANGERS ARE ON THE WAY!
...for extra mii costumes.

 

[RetrogamerMax]

So have you guys seen this?

POTENTIAL SPOILER ALERT: This 4chan post is either an extremely lucky guess or a legitimate leak!

This would be a hype Fighters Pass ngl. Still hoping for 2B in FP3 😏 pic.twitter.com/JEda9qANvs

— YoRHa 2B  (@YoRHaAlerts) December 18, 2020

While I'm not the type to put stock or cent on any 4chan leak, I think it's interesting someone predicted Min Min, Steve, and Sephiroth all the way back in May.

 

[smash puffle]

Uh, well... I, um... on the bright side we got some neat concept art for Geno! There's at least this:

盛り上がってきている様なので
ボツ案をいくつかご覧ください。#ジーノ参戦　#マリオRPG pic.twitter.com/iFhwp7yExX

— 倉島一幸 (@kurashimakaz) December 18, 2020

I'm still sad though. I don't like this support thread getting derailed this way.

 

[MidoriBlade]

Look what the algorithm showed me.

A message to Geno Fans - YouTube

 

[MonkeyDLenny]

I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but I might as well rip off the bandaid... here's a DM screenshot of Jeff Grubb a friend of mine from Star Road sent me:

View attachment 296282

Saved me the trouble of having to be the bearer of bad news.

So there you have it.

 

[Grumbo]

Not sure if this has been brought up yet but there are 6 slots left on the stage select screen. 3 for the pass and 3 extra. And if I remember correctly there’s 3 extra character slots in the code. I’m almost certain we’re getting some bonuses or a small pass. Plenty of fighting games have done it

 

[MaddaD]

While I'm not the type to put stock or cent on any 4chan leak, I think it's interesting someone predicted Min Min, Steve, and Sephiroth all the way back in May.

It's interesting for sure, but Doom Guy and Ninjara are the red flags here. Likely just a coincidence.

 

[Dan]

So have you guys seen this?

POTENTIAL SPOILER ALERT: This 4chan post is either an extremely lucky guess or a legitimate leak!

This would be a hype Fighters Pass ngl. Still hoping for 2B in FP3 😏 pic.twitter.com/JEda9qANvs

— YoRHa 2B  (@YoRHaAlerts) December 18, 2020

While I'm not the type to put stock or cent on any 4chan leak, I think it's interesting someone predicted Min Min, Steve, and Sephiroth all the way back in May.

It's like impossible to predict those three so this is definitely worth looking at.

 

[Grumbo]

So have you guys seen this?

POTENTIAL SPOILER ALERT: This 4chan post is either an extremely lucky guess or a legitimate leak!

This would be a hype Fighters Pass ngl. Still hoping for 2B in FP3 😏 pic.twitter.com/JEda9qANvs

— YoRHa 2B  (@YoRHaAlerts) December 18, 2020

While I'm not the type to put stock or cent on any 4chan leak, I think it's interesting someone predicted Min Min, Steve, and Sephiroth all the way back in May.

That’s pretty decent if true. Rayman and Doomguy would be cool. Huge missed opportunity if we don’t get Crash though.

 

[Forthestarcapelad]

I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but I might as well rip off the bandaid... here's a DM screenshot of Jeff Grubb a friend of mine from Star Road sent me:

View attachment 296282

Not really surprised given they did seem to make it pretty clear that they weren't hinting at anything. I mean there was always that chance that they were being coy and were deflecting, but I never bought in to the idea that they were leading up to something bigger. Just never seemed like the right time.

 

[MamaLuigi123456]

In my opinion the chances of Geno being in Ultimate are next to none but I have to admit, everyone coming out of the woodwork to **** on us and we STILL get Geno in the end would feel extremely cathartic...

 

[RetrogamerMax]

It's interesting for sure, but Doom Guy and Ninjara are the red flags here. Likely just a coincidence.

Well, Fighter's Pass 2 was greenlited before Microsoft bought Bethesda so Doom Slayer wouldn't count as a Microsoft rep in that respect. Ninjara was considered aside from Min Min so that's believable.

 

[Dan]

So if it's true then Ninjara was originally an alt?

 

[MrGameguycolor]

I don't understand it at all: we've never done **** to anyone and are like the most innocent sect of the internet; all we want is a puppet from a 24-year old Mario game...

The truth is those people don't care, they just want a reason to talk ****...

(I don't envy them)

 

[NapoleonBeezwax]

wow that sucks that it seems like jeff grubb and irman wernt serious Fatmanonice any thoughts on this

 

[Heoj]

I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but I might as well rip off the bandaid... here's a DM screenshot of Jeff Grubb a friend of mine from Star Road sent me:

View attachment 296282

Well thats one thing dealt with...

I hope papagenos can tell us what he was told about the legacy xp thing...

 

[Forthestarcapelad]

In my opinion the chances of Geno being in Ultimate are next to none but I have to admit, everyone coming out of the woodwork to **** on us and we STILL get Geno in the end would feel extremely cathartic...

Honestly, this is a big part of why I'm not giving up (beyond legitimately loving him and wanting to see him in smash obviously). The absolute cataclysmic meltdown that would ensue from the community at large is far too tantalizing to pass up on.
Are Geno's chances low now? Sure. Is he never making it to smash ultimate? Maybe so, but I've got nothing to lose by continuing to cheer in his corner as a character I legitimately like. I still have hope or some other characters like Rex and Pyra too (not based on specific evidence, just characters I'd like to see that I could see getting in), so I'm used to low odds.

I totally get why other people are just finished and fed up with hoping for Geno, and I respect their decision to throw in the towel. That's their business, and I get that it's emotionally draining. I'm in this till the dust settles though.

 

[MaddaD]

Well, Fighter's Pass 2 was greenlited before Microsoft bought Bethesda so Doom Slayer wouldn't count as a Microsoft rep in that respect. Ninjara was considered aside from Min Min so that's believable.

Bethesda has already come forward to say that Nintendo hasn't come to them to ask about including a character in Smash though.
So it's still up in the air if it's credible.