Geno (♥♪!?): Return of the Starsend Savior

[Deleted member]

They could, but I dunno.

If I asked somebody who would know about a character being in Smash and they told me something like "we'll see," I'd take that as a tease/still a bit suspect if they weren't being humorous, as it's not a straight no. And they could still say no regardless, we don't know who they are.

Yes, it doesn't bode well for the characters' chances, but I wouldn't say it's a 100% disconfirm, especially if the person has lied before. I'd assume 100% disconfirm regardless tbh, I'm just sayin' it could end up differently.

Yeah, that's how someone could respond to a question they aren't supposed to reveal the answer to. If they straight up say "no" however, I'm taking that as a disconfirm.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

From what I understand of NDA's you can still say a hard No under it. So while I do believe Sora and Chief are out, it might not be the case.

NDA's are really dumb sometimes, heh.

 

[ShadowTheHedgehogZ]

From what I understand of NDA's you can still say a hard No under it. So while I do believe Sora and Chief are out, it might not be the case.

NDA's are really dumb sometimes, heh.

Don't tell me you feel that way about Sora's chances

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Don't tell me you feel that way about Sora's chances

Honestly, I don't feel good about him. This looks a lot more clear than the Chief one, which took 343 saying something as is for me to consider Chief out. Frank's tweet was really trollish(and he has a large history of troll tweets) that make me take it with a grain of salt. The combination killed him for me. Sora feels out due to this information. I don't know much about the tweeter, so I guess the guy could be trolling? It doesn't sound like it from the translations or context though.

 

[Ze Diglett]

All I’m getting out of this conversation is that speculation is pointless.

I mean, at this point, it basically is, if we're being honest.

Or they could give a neutral response, which is something like "we'll see."

If someone says their character isn't in, again, it probably means they aren't in.

Actually, I don't think they can. I'm not an expert on this sort of thing, but I'd assume NDA's prohibit you from even hinting at the possibility of something.

 

[wynn728]

Imagine if we get no character at E3.

I know I'm the only one who would say this, but I'm good with no character getting revealed at E3. All my favorites are dead and after that November Direct I lost my interest in the series' future. I look forward to everything related to Nintendo at E3 except for Smash Bros.

 

[EricTheGamerman]

Yeah I think that’s a huge assumption on your part given the only thing Sakurai has said about Geno is that he wanted to make him playable but it didn’t work out so we got the mii costume instead. That doesn’t sound like a situation where he was always only intended to be a mii costume.Especially when we have a quote showing certain requests were rejected.

The process has almost always been that Sakurai has approached a company with a specific character in mind, so I don't think it's too huge of an assumption that he only went for Final Fantasy. I've been over it countless times, but that are plenty of reasons Geno wouldn't be the first pick in this situation or may have not made priority in a situation where Final Fantasy was on the table. Wanting to make someone a fighter I still do not inherently view as the same as, "I prioritized trying to make him a character and got rejected by Square." We only know rejections have happened at this point, not which characters have been rejected and when. We know that Sakurai was interested in making Geno a fighter at one point during Brawl, we don't know that he was still actively trying to make Geno happen during Smash 4 and again, Sakurai has talked about approaching Square with the clear goal of Cloud in mind for Final Fantasy. A determination he stuck to even when Square Enix expressed surprise. You're right, I am making an assumption, but it's based upon the confidence he exhibits regarding Final Fantasy in Smash and the lack of any compelling evidence that Geno was considered for playable status during Smash 4.

Again, the article says "he didn't appear as a fighter, but I was able to achieve that of a Mii costume" implying that he did indeed attempt to get Geno for Smash 4. He wouldn't have mentioned the bit about him not appearing as a fighter if his intent was solely to get the Mii costume from the beginning.

Frank O'Conner was responding to a tweet about whether or not Master Chief would be DLC. He didn't do it without anyone asking. He's also replying to "some dude" on the internet, so it's not a different situation from Sora's deconfirmation.

Here's the whole quote:

—What led you to decide to make a Geno costume after all this time?

Sakurai: To tell the truth, it’s because I wanted Geno to be a playable character. He has a gun for a hand, and I think he fits in really well with Smash. During Brawl, I thought it would be great if I could add him, but in the end it didn’t become a reality.

—Because of that, you added him as a Mii Costume this time?

Sakurai: That’s right. He’s very popular. When talking about older characters, Geno always gets a lot of requests. He didn’t appear as a fighter, but I was able to achieve something kind of close to that as a Mii Costume.

He only specifically talks about during Brawl in the quote about it not becoming reality with regards to Smash 4 because that sentence functions to only reference the Brawl period in the first quote.

All that he says in the second part of the quote is, "He didn't appear as a fighter, but I was able to achieve something kind of close to that as a Mii costume." He's really not speaking more beyond the factual state of things. Geno wasn't a fighter in Smash 4 and thus he achieved an approximation for Geno as a character by achieving a Mii costume. There's zero indication of why Geno isn't a character in the entire post. There's nothing to gleam about Square Enix rejecting him, or that he was ever under any more consideration for Smash 4 than as a Mii costume. The only timeline specified is the Brawl period when Geno didn't happen. And even then, we know even less about that particular period than Smash 4 and he could have hit a dead end in multiple places with regards to Geno. There is nothing in that quote that implicates Geno as a failed negotiation of the Smash 4 period.

I wasn't aware that Frank O' Connor was responding to someone in his Tweet, but it's still undeniably a much more active effort to deconfirm Chief than Sora. You can absolutely ignore millions of people and questions on the internet, that becomes much more difficult to do in person when you're having a conversation with someone. O' Connor still had to actively decide that he was going to respond to a random Tweet instead of staying silent or ignoring it. Shinji was in person and had to give an answer. Those are still quite different situations at the end of the day given the level of autonomy each has when comparing one another. O' Connor has near complete control. Shinji is compelled by societal norms to answer a question posed to him in a direct conversation where pausing and not responding with certainty/quickly enough will then allow to perceive something else from your body language and words. A Tweet is devoid of that urgency and has the benefit of as much composition time and thought as you want. Text conversation and communication is completely different from direct contact and should be treated differently.

That's what I mean when I say I take Sora's "deconfirmation" differently than Chief's "deconfirmation." There's more of an active will to assure people that Chief won't be in the game because Twitter is a wider platform and Frank O' Connor chose to respond when in a situation in which he is significantly less compelled to respond. Shinji was in a regular conversation or in public when this question was posed to him, so he had to reply in some fashion and there's also the fact that this meeting was a much smaller venue with a much smaller potential audience. They are far more different situations than I think you're implying because of all of this.

I don't think we can dismiss Sora from our conversations so quickly because I do think there is enough nuance in the context to give extra pause. I think the end result will likely be the same as for Master Chief, AKA not in the DLC, but there's a reason why I place the comments that have been made on different levels of convinced thought.

 

[Deleted member]

I mean, at this point, it basically is, if we're being honest.

Actually, I don't think they can. I'm not an expert on this sort of thing, but I'd assume NDA's prohibit you from even hinting at the possibility of something.

"We'll see" doesn't hint at anything. It's a neutral response.

The process has almost always been that Sakurai has approached a company with a specific character in mind, so I don't think it's too huge of an assumption that he only went for Final Fantasy. I've been over it countless times, but that are plenty of reasons Geno wouldn't be the first pick in this situation or may have not made priority in a situation where Final Fantasy was on the table. Wanting to make someone a fighter I still do not inherently view as the same as, "I prioritized trying to make him a character and got rejected by Square." We only know rejections have happened at this point, not which characters have been rejected and when. We know that Sakurai was interested in making Geno a fighter at one point during Brawl, we don't know that he was still actively trying to make Geno happen during Smash 4 and again, Sakurai has talked about approaching Square with the clear goal of Cloud in mind for Final Fantasy. A determination he stuck to even when Square Enix expressed surprise. You're right, I am making an assumption, but it's based upon the confidence he exhibits regarding Final Fantasy in Smash and the lack of any compelling evidence that Geno was considered for playable status during Smash 4.



Here's the whole quote:

—What led you to decide to make a Geno costume after all this time?

Sakurai: To tell the truth, it’s because I wanted Geno to be a playable character. He has a gun for a hand, and I think he fits in really well with Smash. During Brawl, I thought it would be great if I could add him, but in the end it didn’t become a reality.

—Because of that, you added him as a Mii Costume this time?

Sakurai: That’s right. He’s very popular. When talking about older characters, Geno always gets a lot of requests. He didn’t appear as a fighter, but I was able to achieve something kind of close to that as a Mii Costume.

He only specifically talks about during Brawl in the quote about it not becoming reality with regards to Smash 4 because that sentence functions to only reference the Brawl period in the first quote.

All that he says in the second part of the quote is, "He didn't appear as a fighter, but I was able to achieve something kind of close to that as a Mii costume." He's really not speaking more beyond the factual state of things. Geno wasn't a fighter in Smash 4 and thus he achieved an approximation for Geno as a character by achieving a Mii costume. There's zero indication of why Geno isn't a character in the entire post. There's nothing to gleam about Square Enix rejecting him, or that he was ever under any more consideration for Smash 4 than as a Mii costume. The only timeline specified is the Brawl period when Geno didn't happen. And even then, we know even less about that particular period than Smash 4 and he could have hit a dead end in multiple places with regards to Geno. There is nothing in that quote that implicates Geno as a failed negotiation of the Smash 4 period.

I wasn't aware that Frank O' Connor was responding to someone in his Tweet, but it's still undeniably a much more active effort to deconfirm Chief than Sora. You can absolutely ignore millions of people and questions on the internet, that becomes much more difficult to do in person when you're having a conversation with someone. O' Connor still had to actively decide that he was going to respond to a random Tweet instead of staying silent or ignoring it. Shinji was in person and had to give an answer. Those are still quite different situations at the end of the day given the level of autonomy each has when comparing one another. O' Connor has near complete control. Shinji is compelled by societal norms to answer a question posed to him in a direct conversation where pausing and not responding with certainty/quickly enough will then allow to perceive something else from your body language and words. A Tweet is devoid of that urgency and has the benefit of as much composition time and thought as you want. Text conversation and communication is completely different from direct contact and should be treated differently.

That's what I mean when I say I take Sora's "deconfirmation" differently than Chief's "deconfirmation." There's more of an active will to assure people that Chief won't be in the game because Twitter is a wider platform and Frank O' Connor chose to respond when in a situation in which he is significantly less compelled to respond. Shinji was in a regular conversation or in public when this question was posed to him, so he had to reply in some fashion and there's also the fact that this meeting was a much smaller venue with a much smaller potential audience. They are far more different situations than I think you're implying because of all of this.

I don't think we can dismiss Sora from our conversations so quickly because I do think there is enough nuance in the context to give extra pause. I think the end result will likely be the same as for Master Chief, AKA not in the DLC, but there's a reason why I place the comments that have been made on different levels of convinced thought.

If his plan from the beginning was solely to get the Mii costume, he wouldn't have said "but I was able to achieve that of a Mii costume" or commented specifically on him not being a fighter. "But" and "able" implies he was able to achieve something that wasn't the original goal, but was still good regardless.

For Shinji, he could've said "we'll see." It's a neutral response that doesn't imply yes or no. Heck, even when you look at the response from Roxas' voice actor, he have a neutral response of "I don't know."

Considering this, Shinji explicitly saying "we have no plans for Sora in SSBU" probably means exactly what it's saying.

 

[Datboigeno]

The process has almost always been that Sakurai has approached a company with a specific character in mind, so I don't think it's too huge of an assumption that he only went for Final Fantasy. I've been over it countless times, but that are plenty of reasons Geno wouldn't be the first pick in this situation or may have not made priority in a situation where Final Fantasy was on the table. Wanting to make someone a fighter I still do not inherently view as the same as, "I prioritized trying to make him a character and got rejected by Square." We only know rejections have happened at this point, not which characters have been rejected and when. We know that Sakurai was interested in making Geno a fighter at one point during Brawl, we don't know that he was still actively trying to make Geno happen during Smash 4 and again, Sakurai has talked about approaching Square with the clear goal of Cloud in mind for Final Fantasy. A determination he stuck to even when Square Enix expressed surprise. You're right, I am making an assumption, but it's based upon the confidence he exhibits regarding Final Fantasy in Smash and the lack of any compelling evidence that Geno was considered for playable status during Smash 4.

Where has it been stated that Sakurai approaches companies with a specific character in mind? Like I said before He could've gone for both Geno and Cloud. Whatever reasons you've brought up before are kind of unimportant considering he can do whatever he wants and we have a quote stating he has tried to get certain characters but their rights have been too hard to obtain. The evidence is that he got the Mii costume and has had issues getting in before due to a rights situation which sakurai even said was a reason why characters weren't picked over Bayo. It lines up pretty well for Geno to have been at least one of the characters he tried to get.

Also this does invalidate Reggie's claim from an interview that Sakurai has never been turned down for a character he tried to get. Figured I should highlight that since no one else has yet.

 

[EricTheGamerman]

"We'll see" doesn't hint at anything. It's a neutral response.



If his plan from the beginning was solely to get the Mii costume, he wouldn't have said "but I was able to achieve that of a Mii costume" or commented specifically on him not being a fighter. "But" and "able" implies he was able to achieve something that wasn't the original goal, but was still good regardless.

For Shinji, he could've said "we'll see." It's a neutral response that doesn't imply yes or no. Heck, even when you look at the response from Roxas' voice actor, he have a neutral response of "I don't know."

Considering this, Shinji explicitly saying "we have no plans for Sora in SSBU" probably means exactly what it's saying.

He has wanted to make Geno a fighter in the past, so being able to achieve something close to a fighter can still absolutely just apply to him wanting to have made Geno a fighter in Brawl. The "but" functions in reference to he didn't appear as a fighter and "able" refers to the actual existence of the Mii costume as a way to make something similar to Geno. They can only imply his original goal insofar as wanting Geno to be a playable character. There's nothing beyond that to make the Smash 4 situation more specific. He's saying he got something similar to a playable Geno by developing the Mii costume. That doesn't inform us beyond that straight fact. What I'm saying is we have no way to tell that Geno was ever considered for Smash 4, and this quote absolutely does not supply us with any of that information.

Yes, Shinji could have. Maybe he panicked and shot it down in the moment to get an answer out. It's also possible that maybe he was informed to shoot down all Sora talk if Sora was actually in so as to make it a bigger surprise when Nintendo unveils him. I think the same thing could happen with Master Chief to be honest. Yes, there's no way to actually know if we're being told the truth or not. I do suspect that this means that we aren't getting either of them and take them mostly at face value when they make these deconfirmations. But again, I consider the Frank O' Connor and Chief situation to be quite different from this one with Sora for the reasons I've listed earlier. They both have the same end point, characters not in Smash that I mostly believe, but again, I have more hesitancy given the circumstances of Sora than I do with Chief. There's degrees of certainty here that I'm referring to.

And while I think Kingdom Hearts in Smash would be a really cool moment for the gaming community and basically Cloud 2.0, I don't have any real investment or vested interest in Sora getting in. I'm just calling the situations as I see them.

 

[Deleted member]

He has wanted to make Geno a fighter in the past, so being able to achieve something close to a fighter can still absolutely just apply to him wanting to have made Geno a fighter in Brawl. The "but" functions in reference to he didn't appear as a fighter and "able" refers to the actual existence of the Mii costume as a way to make something similar to Geno. They can only imply his original goal insofar as wanting Geno to be a playable character. There's nothing beyond that to make the Smash 4 situation more specific. He's saying he got something similar to a playable Geno by developing the Mii costume. That doesn't inform us beyond that straight fact. What I'm saying is we have no way to tell that Geno was ever considered for Smash 4, and this quote absolutely does not supply us with any of that information.

Yes, Shinji could have. Maybe he panicked and shot it down in the moment to get an answer out. It's also possible that maybe he was informed to shoot down all Sora talk if Sora was actually in so as to make it a bigger surprise when Nintendo unveils him. I think the same thing could happen with Master Chief to be honest. Yes, there's no way to actually know if we're being told the truth or not. I do suspect that this means that we aren't getting either of them and take them mostly at face value when they make these deconfirmations. But again, I consider the Frank O' Connor and Chief situation to be quite different from this one with Sora for the reasons I've listed earlier. They both have the same end point, characters not in Smash that I mostly believe, but again, I have more hesitancy given the circumstances of Sora than I do with Chief. There's degrees of certainty here that I'm referring to.

And while I think Kingdom Hearts in Smash would be a really cool moment for the gaming community and basically Cloud 2.0, I don't have any real investment or vested interest in Sora getting in. I'm just calling the situations as I see them.

"He didn't appear as a fighter, but I was able to achieve something kind of close to that as a Mii costume." If he only wanted to get the Mii costume, he would've said something along the lines of "I added the Geno Mii costume to please his fans." He explains what didn't happen, and then said "but, I was able to make this happen." He showed that he wasn't able to make one happen, but was able to make something else happen.

Or the infinitely more likely outcome that he meant exactly what he said.

 

[EricTheGamerman]

"He didn't appear as a fighter, but I was able to achieve something kind of close to that as a Mii costume." If he only wanted to get the Mii costume, he would've said something along the lines of "I added the Geno Mii costume to please his fans." He explains what didn't happen, and then said "but, I was able to make this happen." He showed that he wasn't able to make one happen, but was able to make something else happen.

Or the infinitely more likely outcome that he meant exactly what he said.

Where does that imply that he considered Geno for Smash 4? That's where the disconnect is and I genuinely do not see how to get that from his statement about Geno. He explains that Geno didn't happen for Brawl, but we're absolutely in the dark when it comes to Smash 4 and Geno. There's no value judgment in "He didn't appear as a fighter," it's just a neutral fact that Geno was not in Smash 4. Even in context, we only know that Sakurai likes the idea of Geno in Smash and had some higher interest in adding him during the Brawl period, which again, gets us nowhere to reading into a consideration for Smash 4. Achieving something "kind of close to that as a Mii costume" does not itself imply that Geno was ever considered more than that. We don't know if he wasn't able to make one happen for Smash 4. I think that's the real issue here, whether or not the, "He didn't appear as a fighter" is neutral or not. I take it you're reading into it as so to interpret that Geno was rejected based upon that line?

And that's my contention of Geno could have not happened for many reasons during Smash 4. Square Enix turning down Geno is just one of those. Final Fantasy taking complete priority is another. Geno not being appealing enough during a more modern focused Smash 4 and being a hassle through Square is another.

To be as clear as I possibly can; I'm not saying it's impossible for Geno to have been rejected by Square Enix during the Smash 4 DLC days, but I am saying that there's zero indication that's the case or that any potential explanation is the actual case. We genuinely don't know, and this quote absolutely does not provide us with anything beyond: He's not in the game, here's my alternative because of that fact. I'm really trying to read this multiple ways, but I really cannot seem to see what you seem to be seeing in this specific quote.

And if it's my earlier comment about the Mii costume being the only thing Geno was ever planned for, then that was entirely supposed to be my suspicion and what is easiest for me to believe when I look at the information I see surrounding Geno and Smash 4. There's just nothing to connect the dots between the Geno Mii costume and the comment about being rejected characters. It's more than fine for you to believe it means Geno, but there's no connective tissue there from the objective information we know.

 

[Deleted member]

Where does that imply that he considered Geno for Smash 4? That's where the disconnect is and I genuinely do not see how to get that from his statement about Geno. He explains that Geno didn't happen for Brawl, but we're absolutely in the dark when it comes to Smash 4 and Geno. There's no value judgment in "He didn't appear as a fighter," it's just a neutral fact that Geno was not in Smash 4. Even in context, we only know that Sakurai likes the idea of Geno in Smash and had some higher interest in adding him during the Brawl period, which again, gets us nowhere to reading into a consideration for Smash 4. Achieving something "kind of close to that as a Mii costume" does not itself imply that Geno was ever considered more than that. We don't know if he wasn't able to make one happen for Smash 4. I think that's the real issue here, whether or not the, "He didn't appear as a fighter" is neutral or not. I take it you're reading into it as so to interpret that Geno was rejected based upon that line?

And that's my contention of Geno could have not happened for many reasons during Smash 4. Square Enix turning down Geno is just one of those. Final Fantasy taking complete priority is another. Geno not being appealing enough during a more modern focused Smash 4 and being a hassle through Square is another.

To be as clear as I possibly can; I'm not saying it's impossible for Geno to have been rejected by Square Enix during the Smash 4 DLC days, but I am saying that there's zero indication that's the case or that any potential explanation is the actual case. We genuinely don't know, and this quote absolutely does not provide us with anything beyond: He's not in the game, here's my alternative because of that fact. I'm really trying to read this multiple ways, but I really cannot seem to see what you seem to be seeing in this specific quote.

And if it's my earlier comment about the Mii costume being the only thing Geno was ever planned for, then that was entirely supposed to be my suspicion and what is easiest for me to believe when I look at the information I see surrounding Geno and Smash 4. There's just nothing to connect the dots between the Geno Mii costume and the comment about being rejected characters. It's more than fine for you to believe it means Geno, but there's no connective tissue there from the objective information we know.

So, when he says "he didn't appear as a fighter," it shows that he had the possibility of Geno being a fighter in mind. When he says "but, I was able to," it's him saying that he wasn't able to achieve one thing, but he wasn't able to achieve the other. It's like, say, if a boy's mom didn't make him lasagna that day, but was able to make him spaghetti. "I didn't make lasagna that day, but I was able to make spaghetti." It shows that since making lasagna wasn't something she was able to do (meaning that she did try to), she made spaghetti. It's the same case here. Making Geno a fighter wasn't something Sakurai was able to do (and, actually, not being able to do something means you did attempt to do it), but he was able to give Geno fans a Mii costume.

 

[TheCJBrine]

It's possible Sakurai attempted to get Geno in Smash 4, but I just assumed he was trying to please the fans with a mii costume and just focused on getting Cloud, though I guess he could've tried to get both and Square said no.

 

[Deleted member]

It's possible Sakurai attempted to get Geno in Smash 4, but I just assumed he was trying to please the fans with a mii costume and just focused on getting Cloud, though I guess he could've tried to get both and Square said no.

Yeah, I think he attempted to get both, but was turned down for Geno (but still able to get the Mii costume of course).

 

[Firox]

That's impossible, it's one of the biggest gaming conventions where a lot of people could see the new character and make Nintendo the most money

Not impossible, but Nintendo would be beyond brain dead if they didn't. Fortunately, their past performance is a pretty safe bet that they'll make a move. My prediction for E3 is that they will have a heavy focus on Pokemon Sword and Shield with a side of Daemon X Machina and Fire Emblem Three Houses. Then they will re-stoke the Smash hype train with a double reveal, one of which being a gen 8 pokemon. Not saying that I necessarily want a gen 8 pokemon, but it seems like the easiest first-party promotion and at very least I would prefer a pokemon over another FE character any day.

 

[Deleted member]

What are everyone's thoughts on Paper Mario Ttyd?

It's my second favorite Mario game, just behind a certain one.

 

[Ovaltine]

What are everyone's thoughts on Paper Mario Ttyd?

It's my second favorite Mario game, just behind a certain one.

For the most part, it's great, but the amount of backtracking you have to do in certain segments has NOT aged well. I generally feel that Paper Mario 64 has a better balance of backtracking tedium and genuine difficulty than TTYD does. On top of that, it has a charm that feels a little more SMRPG-ish than TTYD does, so... I guess I'm extra biased there, haha.

 

[Deleted member]

For the most part, it's great, but the amount of backtracking you have to do in certain segments has NOT aged well. I generally feel that Paper Mario 64 has a better balance of backtracking tedium and genuine difficulty than TTYD does. On top of that, it has a charm that feels a little more SMRPG-ish than TTYD does, so... I guess I'm extra biased there, haha.

Ah okay. For me though, it can be kinda annoying (but sometimes the idea of constantly going back and forth between places is just hilarious lol), but the rest of the game definitely weighs it out for me.

 

[Firox]

Has anyone else here played Mario and Luigi Dream Team? I thought the Luigi clone formations were pretty fun, but overall, it didn't quite have the spark of the paper mario games. Any thoughts?

 

[Deleted member]

Has anyone else here played Mario and Luigi Dream Team? I thought the Luigi clone formations were pretty fun, but overall, it didn't quite have the spark of the paper mario games. Any thoughts?

I haven't yet, but I think I may sometime after playing BIS. It does look fun lol.

 

[Deleted member]

I'm just gonna wait for Luigi's Mansion 3 at E3

Wait

Luigi's Mansion E3

Perfect

 

[GoodGrief741]

Not impossible, but Nintendo would be beyond brain dead if they didn't. Fortunately, their past performance is a pretty safe bet that they'll make a move. My prediction for E3 is that they will have a heavy focus on Pokemon Sword and Shield with a side of Daemon X Machina and Fire Emblem Three Houses. Then they will re-stoke the Smash hype train with a double reveal, one of which being a gen 8 pokemon. Not saying that I necessarily want a gen 8 pokemon, but it seems like the easiest first-party promotion and at very least I would prefer a pokemon over another FE character any day.

I don't think they'll lean into Sword and Shield that much, they're having a mini Direct for that next week.

What are everyone's thoughts on Paper Mario Ttyd?

It's my second favorite Mario game, just behind a certain one.

It's great.

Has anyone else here played Mario and Luigi Dream Team? I thought the Luigi clone formations were pretty fun, but overall, it didn't quite have the spark of the paper mario games. Any thoughts?

I really liked it. Kinda easy though.

 

[SSGuy]

I'd be nice if they held a separate Smash direct for their content but I am also unsure of how much content they will hold.

 

[The Anigriffin]

Well, Animal Crossing, Luigi's Mansion 3 and even Smash can't completely hold over E3. There's gotta be something like a brand new 1st party game they plan on announcing. And if Polar's source is correct, it'd be a big one that Brave is tied too.

 

[Firox]

Well, Animal Crossing, Luigi's Mansion 3 and even Smash can't completely hold over E3. There's gotta be something like a brand new 1st party game they plan on announcing. And if Polar's source is correct, it'd be a big one that Brave is tied too.

Interesting. I wonder what it could be. It better not be Three Houses. I could just imagine: "We know how much you LOVE your FE characters so....HUZZAH! Two more Marth clones in Smash! Your prayers have been answered!"

 

[osby]

Interesting. I wonder what it could be. It better not be Three Houses. I could just imagine: "We know how much you LOVE your FE characters so....HUZZAH! Two more Marth clones in Smash! Your prayers have been answered!"

I'd like getting Edelgard or Byleth in Smash, but there's no point in making them a clone. They aren't requested and we're not pressed for extra characters. Plus, they already confirmed we won't get echoes with the pass.

 

[The Anigriffin]

Interesting. I wonder what it could be. It better not be Three Houses. I could just imagine: "We know how much you LOVE your FE characters so....HUZZAH! Two more Marth clones in Smash! Your prayers have been answered!"

BYLETH STEALS THE HYPE!!!

 

[Firox]

I'd like getting Edelgard or Byleth in Smash, but there's no point in making them a clone. They aren't requested and we're not pressed for extra characters. Plus, they already confirmed we won't get echoes with the pass.

I was just messing around with the clone thing. I have to say I'm actually really glad that Sakurai confirmed that there wouldn't be any more echoes. As for FE characters, I guess I wouldn't mind as long as the character is vastly different from the rest of the swordies. Maybe someone with an axe or spear?

 

[Ovaltine]

After cuts, FE characters in future Smash titles aren't a problem for me, but as it stands right now, it's really got enough representation. I'd be perfectly fine with no more FE characters, thank you very much.

 

[domriver]

After cuts, FE characters in future Smash titles aren't a problem for me, but as it stands right now, it's really got enough representation. I'd be perfectly fine with no more FE characters, thank you very much.

watch a brand new echo FE character will revealed at E3. LOL

 

[EricTheGamerman]

Well, Animal Crossing, Luigi's Mansion 3 and even Smash can't completely hold over E3. There's gotta be something like a brand new 1st party game they plan on announcing. And if Polar's source is correct, it'd be a big one that Brave is tied too.

I think all the people talking about how E3 can't just be Animal Crossing and the other games are missing two big points. The first of which being, Animal Crossing is absolutely one of Nintendo's heavy hitters going by the 3DS sales and people have been clamoring for a proper HD release of the series for years. On an anecdotal note, I know several people holding off on buying a Switch just for Animal Crossing to be officially shown off. Ever since the February Direct it has been clear to me that Animal Crossing is meant to be the heavy hitter of E3 (Assuming that the 2019 release date of the game is accurate that is) and it's probably the biggest franchise Nintendo has without any presence on the Switch right now.

The second part being that Nintendo just simply doesn't play by conventional rules anymore and there's plenty of content coming later in the year to make up for the fact that maybe an E3 presentation isn't as bombastic as people expect. Post E3 we're supposed to see the releases of Animal Crossing, Luigi's Mansion 3, Super Mario Maker 2, Fire Emblem Three Houses, Astral Chain, the Link's Awakening remake, and the first HD mainline entry of Pokemon with Sword and Shield. That reads like a ****ing wishlist for Nintendo fans of the past decade all around, not to mention smaller titles like Daemon X Machina, third party games like Dragon Quest 11 Definitive Edition, and so on. Hell, despite how much I love Smash and want new characters for it, it's honestly one of the least important things related to Nintendo going into E3 and should have an appropriately smaller presence no matter the character. Smash honestly took up way too much of Nintendo's focus last year...

So, I definitely think them not pulling out any major new announcements could hold over E3 perfectly well given their release schedule as is. I just expect we'll see something else from them and some hints for 2020. The supposed Banjo Threeie on Switch or whatever people have been trying to link with "Brave" I really don't see happening though. I think we'll get a notable character announcement at E3 given they've waited this long to announce #2 though.

After cuts, FE characters in future Smash titles aren't a problem for me, but as it stands right now, it's really got enough representation. I'd be perfectly fine with no more FE characters, thank you very much.

Fire Emblem doesn't have good enough representation is really the problem. There's tons of unique movesets to take from other classes and types of characters that we shouldn't discount just because they're from Fire Emblem. Having a Pegasus Knight with a lance in Smash would be ****ing awesome for example. There's also still several beloved characters like Lyn or Hector from Fire Emblem that could function differently and bring something to the series. I mean, I appreciate what we have in Smash, but the fact we don't even touch Lances, Axes, Thieves, Pegasus Knights, Archers, or anything else is a little bit disappointing and definitely something Smash could stand to add as well in an ideal world.

 

[Ovaltine]

Fire Emblem doesn't have good enough representation is really the problem. There's tons of unique movesets to take from other classes and types of characters that we shouldn't discount just because they're from Fire Emblem. Having a Pegasus Knight with a lance in Smash would be ****ing awesome for example. There's also still several beloved characters like Lyn or Hector from Fire Emblem that could function differently and bring something to the series. I mean, I appreciate what we have in Smash, but the fact we don't even touch Lances, Axes, Thieves, Pegasus Knights, Archers, or anything else is a little bit disappointing and definitely something Smash could stand to add as well in an ideal world.

Oh, I agree 100%. That's why I feel FE reps in future titles would be a better idea after cutting some of the fluff. Take it easy on the Marth clones and get some axe users, lance users, thieves, and all sorts of other reps that FE just doesn't have in Smash. It'd make things far more interesting. As it stands right now, though, I'd rather see that later down the line after shaving off some of the excess.

 

[Loliko YnT]

What are everyone's favorite Mario RPGs beside SMRPG?

I think Paper Mario 64 was really solid.



I'm so sick of coding lol

Well, they're depicted as

Cowardly (runs away from a large enemy when they have tools to handle it)
Weak (takes 8 Yoshis to push a Chomp Rock when one is enough from other games)
Stupid (believes Baby Bowser saved them even though they saw the Mario Bros. save them right in front of their faces)

Not to mention that there was no callback to the events of Yoshi's Island despite taking place pretty much just after that.

I have extremely important news for the Geno thread. It's very important. It's huge.

So, you know how Geno calls Mallow 'my fluffy little friend' in the English version? Well, there's an alternative term he uses in the Japanese version: fuka fuka-kun (ふかふか-くん). -kun as a suffix is a way to refer to someone your junior, so it makes sense. What does fuka fuka mean, though? It literally means fluffy fluffy. So, if we're being very literal, Geno is calling Mallow 'Fluffy Fluffy' or even 'Fluffy Fluff', but you may take liberties with the translation to mean, 'Little Fluffy Fluffy' or 'Little Fluffy Fluff'.

This is extremely cute and extremely important. You all need this information. You're welcome.

Oh Zack , please don't make me choose between my childrens lol. More seriously , I fully played the M&L franchise(with the remakes) , and I played TTYD , SPM (not finished) and CS.
I honestly had a good time with all of them. Yes , even Color Splash. Flawed gameplay , but at least this game knew what it wanted to be. (And before someone say "the tombstone of Paper Mario?" , no. It simply wanted to push the use of the Wii U gamepad , having a light-hearted story with lot of jokes , and the classic mario world with paper aesthetics.)
If I have to pick a favorite... I dunno. PiT and BiS have a pretty strong nostalgia power over me , but replaying them... They are still a blast , but I noticed their weaknesses. Like , while playing the BiS remake , I could easily find the broken combinations of equipments and badges. I could , technically , do the final challenge of the Battle arena at lvl around lvl 30. When the recommended level is LEVEL 45.

Spoiler: BiS remake spoilers (battle arena)

All I have to do now is remembering how to consistently dodge Bowser X best attacks. My strategy allow me to remove him 4000 HPs when he goes in Fury mode , but it's not enough. The giant attack is fine , I just have trouble with estimating the distance between the first fireball and Mario (if he aim at him first). However , the attack where he curve into a spiky ball while in fire... These falling fireball increase in speed when they arrive to the bottom screen I swear to god.

TTYD was that "one game I really wanted as a young innocent child" , and when I bought it (50 euros , it was damn worth it.)... I... I played the game a bit too much lol. I was extremely happy to play it , and it was like... 4 or 5 years ago ?
Same for Superstar Saga , but I got it earlier and it wasn't as extreme.
Dream Team and Paper Jam helped me during my first year of high school , I was really depressed , and these games really helped me.
And for Super Paper Mario , it was the first Paper Mario I got. I remember being kinda disapointed , when I was young , I was expecting turn based combat... And I got New Super Paper Mario Bros. That's what I first thought , now I need to find time to play that game lol.

So uh... Am I allowed to say that every Mario RPG I played was such a good experience to me , that I can't choose a favorite xD?

---

For being on the OP Starfall discord... Yeah , SSGuy and Xigger worked hard on the website. Like seriously , wow. Good work.

---

Well , while I agree with you...
It's PiT. The "Return to the Future" of the M&L franchise. It's a complete mess , canon wise.
But I think there would be a point where the Yoshi couldn't find the shroobified Yoshi abomination anymore , he would have been way too big. Guess these Yoshis were addicted to cookies and forgot to exercise egg throwing...
Also , I know that the cookies are most likely a reference to Yoshi's Cookies , but... I want it to be a SMRPG reference so bad lol.

---

"PRINCE FLUFFY FLUFFY-KUN , GET READY FOR OUR DUO ATTACK !"
"YES STAR-DOLL SAMA , I'M READY !"

God I love Japan when they do wholesome stuff like that lol. Now I want Mallow's name to be the one Frogfucius gave him , and Prince Fluffy-Fluffy to be his name as the prince of Nimbus land.

"Prince Fluffy-Fluffy will save us from the evil Smithy Gang !"

God I can't stop xD

 

[The Anigriffin]

I think all the people talking about how E3 can't just be Animal Crossing and the other games are missing two big points. The first of which being, Animal Crossing is absolutely one of Nintendo's heavy hitters going by the 3DS sales and people have been clamoring for a proper HD release of the series for years. On an anecdotal note, I know several people holding off on buying a Switch just for Animal Crossing to be officially shown off. Ever since the February Direct it has been clear to me that Animal Crossing is meant to be the heavy hitter of E3 (Assuming that the 2019 release date of the game is accurate that is) and it's probably the biggest franchise Nintendo has without any presence on the Switch right now.

The second part being that Nintendo just simply doesn't play by conventional rules anymore and there's plenty of content coming later in the year to make up for the fact that maybe an E3 presentation isn't as bombastic as people expect. Post E3 we're supposed to see the releases of Animal Crossing, Luigi's Mansion 3, Super Mario Maker 2, Fire Emblem Three Houses, Astral Chain, the Link's Awakening remake, and the first HD mainline entry of Pokemon with Sword and Shield. That reads like a ****ing wishlist for Nintendo fans of the past decade all around, not to mention smaller titles like Daemon X Machina, third party games like Dragon Quest 11 Definitive Edition, and so on. Hell, despite how much I love Smash and want new characters for it, it's honestly one of the least important things related to Nintendo going into E3 and should have an appropriately smaller presence no matter the character. Smash honestly took up way too much of Nintendo's focus last year...

So, I definitely think them not pulling out any major new announcements could hold over E3 perfectly well given their release schedule as is. I just expect we'll see something else from them and some hints for 2020. The supposed Banjo Threeie on Switch or whatever people have been trying to link with "Brave" I really don't see happening though. I think we'll get a notable character announcement at E3 given they've waited this long to announce #2 though.

They announced Super Mario Party last E3 with Pokemon Let's Go and Smash being announced prior. Them not announcing at least one new first party game is very unlikely.

I agree on the Banjo Threeie thing though. No way in hell would Banjo Threeie be announced in Nintendo's E3 or be exclusive. Microsoft needs all the IP they can use, so if there's a new Banjo game announcement, it'd be at their conference. While I think Banjo is likely and would be completely shocked if he wasn't in the pass at this point, I'm 95% sure he's not Brave.

 

[Deleted member]

Well, Animal Crossing, Luigi's Mansion 3 and even Smash can't completely hold over E3. There's gotta be something like a brand new 1st party game they plan on announcing. And if Polar's source is correct, it'd be a big one that Brave is tied too.

W a r i o L a n d

Nah, jk I know it won't happen lmao

 

[alemerltoucanet]

Well, Animal Crossing, Luigi's Mansion 3 and even Smash can't completely hold over E3. There's gotta be something like a brand new 1st party game they plan on announcing. And if Polar's source is correct, it'd be a big one that Brave is tied too.

Wait, Polar said something about Brave possibly being tied to a new game? :0

BYLETH STEALS THE HYPE!!!

Oh, and awww, I actually unironically been wanting Byleth, I think she/he would be really cool.

 

[EricTheGamerman]

They announced Super Mario Party last E3 with Pokemon Let's Go and Smash being announced prior. Them not announcing at least one new first party game is very unlikely.

I agree on the Banjo Threeie thing though. No way in hell would Banjo Threeie be announced in Nintendo's E3 or be exclusive. Microsoft needs all the IP they can use, so if there's a new Banjo game announcement, it'd be at their conference. While I think Banjo is likely and would be completely shocked if he wasn't in the pass at this point, I'm 95% sure he's not Brave.

Oh I'm agreeing with you. Nintendo will announce something/show something big off not well known like Bayonetta 3. I'm just saying with their current lineup of 2019 games they don't really even need to do so to be hype.

 

[TheCJBrine]

There's gotta be something like a brand new 1st party game they plan on announcing. And if Polar's source is correct, it'd be a big one that Brave is tied too.

Where's this info from?

 

[Datboigeno]

They announced Super Mario Party last E3 with Pokemon Let's Go and Smash being announced prior. Them not announcing at least one new first party game is very unlikely.

I agree on the Banjo Threeie thing though. No way in hell would Banjo Threeie be announced in Nintendo's E3 or be exclusive. Microsoft needs all the IP they can use, so if there's a new Banjo game announcement, it'd be at their conference. While I think Banjo is likely and would be completely shocked if he wasn't in the pass at this point, I'm 95% sure he's not Brave.

Wait, did you already say who you thought Brave might be referring to? Is it Ninten?