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Geno (♥♪!?): Return of the Starsend Savior

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PatPrime

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Enigma735 said:
Alright, let's get my thoughts out on this real quick.
I'm not mad at this nor am I even surprised Minecraft is getting represented in Smash, let alone a fighter, but I swear that trailer really felt like it was playing with my emotions. The trailer starts out with all these 90's gaming icons clashing together, so obviously my initial guess as who it may be is Crash, who is one of my most wanted characters, so obviously I get hyped. But then, I suddenly realize that this isn't for Crash since Mario is knocked in to this black room. I was really thinking he was in Bowser's Keep from Mario RPG, so then I start to get hyped for Geno, because again, he is another one of my most wanteds, and then we're greeted to a door, and its Steve. Just Steve. After that, I just didn't even know how to react.

Even though I am a bit salty over the trailer really messing with me, I do have to admit that Steve looks fun to play as and I will definitely tune in to see what Steve has to offer on Saturday. Let's just hope Geno's outfit doesn't come back with him because then I would really feel like that would rub salt on the wound. I am happy for the Steve fans who did get their character since I do realize he was a heavily requested character, and Minecraft is such a cultural phenomenon, but I can't help but feel underwhelmed after that reveal.

Don't forget what I said yesterday, we still have four more spots left on the Fighters Pass, and its very likely Geno is in it. It just means today isn't his day like many of us thought. However, let's all not be debbie downers here, and let's congratulate a Steve fan who regularly comes to this thread almost everyday. Congrats TheCJBrine TheCJBrine !
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I was thinking Crash and others too, with all the icons but Steve and Minecraft as a whole is a huge icon as well. So it makes sense. I like Minecraft and Steve looks very interesting and fun. I'm glad it's not boring human Johnson and we got a square man instead. I'm happy with this reveal overall. I still think Geno is coming.
 
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Rohanx17

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Man that was a trip. Congrats to all the steve fans I'll be loving the new stage and music but frankly steve was one of the characters I hoped wouldn't make it for a number of reasons several of which were on full display in the trailer.

And can I say that if steve, a zombie, and an enderman can share THE EXACT SAME MOVESET then there is ZERO reason for anyone to get angry over people speculating on or wanting a composite ARMS fighter. We now know it could have absolutely been a thing and I'm glad this is case is finally closed.
 
Fatmanonice

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Polarthief said:
So basically nothing changed except MC died for Steve.
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Exactly. If anything, this just made Power of Six theory even more reliable of a predictor. There's still another Square Enix character coming more than likely and, weird silver lining, they basically chose Steve over Chief due to popularity so that's a whole buffet of food for thought there.
 
CannonStreak

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Fatmanonice said:
Exactly. If anything, this just made Power of Six theory even more reliable of a predictor. There's still another Square Enix character coming more than likely and, weird silver lining, they basically chose Steve over Chief due to popularity so that's a whole buffet of food for thought there.
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So, what was the Power of Six again?

And what do you think about chances for a reveal at The Game Awards?
 
WeirdAlFan101

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I'm cool with Steve, got nothing against him, and he definitely looks super faithful and fun to play as.

Now if only I could get my own Switch...or since I'm hella poor, if only college could reopen officially, so that I can visit the gameroom there, and be able to see some of the guys I used to be able to play with
 
MattX20

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Skull Leader said:
Devil's advocate, because I need a little uplifting right now.

What if 7, 8, and 9 are scrambled up a bit from their original intended order? COVID may not have hampered production or development, but with the extended delay since Byleth it allowed Sakurai's team, Nintendo, and whoever they coordinate with for 3rd parties to rearrange the release schedule for the middle of this pass to give it a non-shill reason to sell the pass (Minecraft) and make it look better to general consumers and their parents before dropping the characters of a decidedly smaller market but more able to spend their money freely (Geno, Crash, Dante, Whomever).

The Microsoft purchase of ZeniMax was just announced, with a potential Cacodemon Mii costume sale left in the balance. This delay now means that all the rights would have been sorted out and clear in time for the costume to be on sale. Moving up Steve to now better sales of the pass overall.

I am really wondering if Sakurai was being Sakurai, or truly digging at Nintendo for voluntolding him to make Minecraft work.
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There might be some truth to it, but we'll have to wait and see what the presentation for Steve on Saturday ultimately brings
 
RichieGonzo

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Just saying now that Doom is owned by Microsoft, we could get a Cacodemon mii costume with Steve.

I'm still banking on Geno as the closer for E3. Good chance he's next.
 
pinshadow

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protoblues said:
Oof. Is anyone worried that the mii costume reveal is on Saturday instead of after the actual presentation?
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No? Why would Square costumes come with Steve? I swear just because it's not Geno now people are throwing in the towel for literally no reason.

I'd argue he works well as a character to come alongside Geno at a hypothetical E3 2020 similar to how Hero came alongside Banjo. It's literally the best selling game in the entire world, certainly a western character but one that also has a huge Japanese fanbase, compared to Geno who's a hard fan-pick. I think this will work out in the end people.
 
PsychoIncarnate

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I was like "Hey are they going to add skeleton" because it's the same size. When they didn't I realized it's because of China.
 
MattX20

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Will said:
Is the character from the best-selling game series in the entire ****ing world by a landslide in popularity and recognizability a pass seller?

You answer me that.
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The game is popular, I don't deny that, but in the context of Smash, I'm not sure if the same results would apply
 
AceAttorney9000

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pinshadow said:
OH BOY, 3 MORE MONTHS FOR ANOTHER CHANCE
DON'T YOU GUYS LOOOOOOOOVE DRIP FEEDING? (not mad at Steve, mad at Nintendo.)
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... to be honest, I didn't expect differently, considering we've yet to have another reveal within these presentations.

Assuming Geno is Fighter 8 and supposed to be out before the Mario tournament, we still have the rest of October... but man, that wait's gonna feel real long.

pinshadow said:
No? Why would Square costumes come with Steve? I swear just because it's not Geno now people are throwing in the towel for literally no reason.

I'd argue he works well as a character to come alongside Geno at a hypothetical E3 2020 similar to how Hero came alongside Banjo. It's literally the best selling game in the entire world, certainly a western character but one that also has a huge Japanese fanbase, compared to Geno who's a hard fan-pick. I think this will work out in the end people.
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Yeah. Again, I wouldn't be surprised if Steve and Geno were supposed to be at E3 2020 as a "repeat" of Hero and Banjo from the previous year.
 
pinshadow

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MattX20 said:
The game is popular, I don't deny that, but in the context of Smash, I'm not sure if the same results would apply
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TRUST ME, yes it does.

Also everyone who tried to argue that sales don't matter to Nintendo picking characters at all a few days ago, how do you feel now that Sakurai literally introduced it as the best selling game in the world?
 
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RichieGonzo said:
Just saying now that Doom is owned by Microsoft, we could get a Cacodemon mii costume with Steve.

I'm still banking on Geno as the closer for E3. Good chance he's next.
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Vault Boy would make sense coming with Steve. Microsoft technically doesn’t own Bethesda right now since acquisition is still in progress.
 
ColtonS25

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If this was the E3 presentation, we would have had Microsoft and Square (hopefully) for the second year in a row just swapped on their order. Funny how things work out, huh?

Anyways Steve looks fun. Some jank, but it all seems intentional. And yes, I am counting on Geno still, so I’m doing just fine. I’m not worried.

Also, Cacomallow is still real. Even if it isn’t.
 
Firox

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So if we see the Cacodemon costume come out with Minecraft WITHOUT the mallow costume, I'm gonna be SUPER stoked. However, if the Mallow costume comes as well with or without the Geno costume, I'm going to have to call GG on this pass.
 
Fatmanonice

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SonicSmasher1 said:
So, what was the Power of Six again?

And what do you think about chances for a reveal at The Game Awards?
Click to expand...
Just to summarize Power of Six:

-The theory that every pack in the Fighter's Pass was originally meant to have 6 Mii costumes.

-"Missing" Mii costumes can be used as predictors for future characters and companies involved in Season 2.

-No true Nintendo or Microsoft costumes in the Fighter's Pass suggested packs dedicated to those companies in Season 2 (proven right as of today)

-Monster Hunter costumes potentially saved for another Capcom rep

-Geno and Chocobo saved for another Square rep

-Heihachi, Gil, and Lloyd potentially saved for a Namco rep
 
CopperKoopa

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Some further thoughts I want to toss out there. Feel free to discuss or not:

-This was the E3 opener reveal. It fits. Not much needs to be said here to elaborate on that.

-Min Min was never meant to be the E3 reveal, this was. She was always meant to be an April reveal per Amiibo theory and just general theorycrafting.

-Sakurai doing the showcase during Minecon may have always been the plan. Hero was promptly revealed and then released a month later, but Banjo was not. They may have always planned to release Steve in October and do a joint Minecon bit as part of the reveal.

-The second E3 reveal (FP8) would logically be our next fighter and may be pretty far along in development or even done. This is based on previous release schedules for the 1st Pass and also Sakurai's statement they are "on schedule despite Covid."

-Nintendo tweeted that the Minecon presentation won't reveal another character. We will be waiting a while for the next fighter, no matter how far along or finished they are.

-Nintendo holding off the reveal for Steve this long was a way to help make the connection to Minecon and also save 1 last big reveal for later in the year. We know Nintendo was hit hard by Covid now and is somewhere around 3-4 months behind schedule. They also control the Smash reveals, per Sakurai.

-At a fan panel for the TGAs, Geoff Keighley said he wanted another big reveal from Nintendo similar to Joker. This doesn't line up with a character like Geno, IMO, but definitely for another character like Dante, Chief, etc. if they are in fact still in the running. It also doesn't confirm anything at all, really. Nintendo could unveil zip.

-With some of the Mario 35th stuff now confirmed to have been pushed back from March or April and likely also E3, a Mario character still makes a ton of sense because they could have been the 2nd character reveal for E3.

-And now my most controversial thought: The 2nd Pass was swapped around to accommodate the new Covid schedule. Not entirely, but there is circumstantial evidence in support of this. I'll admit most of these are mutually exclusive, meaning if one is true than others may not be:
  1. Sakurai said they had difficulty communicating with other developers for a few of the characters in the pass due to Covid
  2. Sakurai's comment that Nintendo asked him to include Minecraft + him stating it was "wizardry" to make it work implies Steve was probably in development for a very long time. It wouldn't be crazy to say he maybe was meant to be one of our earlier fighters but complications in how to make him work got in the way.
  3. The opposite may also be true. Sakurai stated that Steve had simple animations, no voice clips, etc. so developing him sped up. Maybe Steve was moved forward in the pass since he was easier to work with during Covid? Not that insane a thought, really. It would mean he wasn't originally our E3 reveal and may have been intended to be revealed around Minecon all along (which would make him the Terry analog).
  4. Before Covid and circa E3 2019, Sakurai had begun development on the 2nd Pass. We know this for a fact. And there had been rumors for a while starting around then about several things. Ryu Hayabusa was everywhere. We also had the Cacomallow leak, which is up in the air on its legitimacy. Then you toss in speculation/rumors heard by folks like Fatmanonice Fatmanonice and papagenos papagenos about remakes or the Legacy XP takedown and you can build a case for other characters who are clearly not present. My point is that while we receive false information often, some of these things are not totally baseless. Were all of these leaks legitimate and meant to be shown to us earlier? Was Ryu just leakbait for Byleth, as Chief may have been for Steve? We don't know. But it's fishy and I don't like it.
  5. There was a rumor flying around 2ch immediately after Byleth's reveal saying that Byleth was actually intended for the 2nd Pass and swapped places with a 1st Pass fighter who was having difficulties in development. This is getting tinfoil hatty because who knows if that's at all legitimate, but could that have been Steve? Or anybody else, for that matter? We missed a big TGS reveal, and we know Byleth was delayed a little per Sakurai himself. Makes you wonder
 
EntropyAtrophy

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MattX20 said:
The game is popular, I don't deny that, but in the context of Smash, I'm not sure if the same results would apply
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Geno speculation is kind of an echo chamber, my guy. Steve is a popular choice and surely people will be buying the pass based off Minecraft’s inclusion.
 
Mr. Peepee

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Steve is the first character in a while that has genuinely made me excited
Min Min made me soulless
Byleth made me pissed
Terry was leaked beforehand
 
protoblues

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pinshadow said:
No? Why would Square costumes come with Steve? I swear just because it's not Geno now people are throwing in the towel for literally no reason.

I'd argue he works well as a character to come alongside Geno at a hypothetical E3 2020 similar to how Hero came alongside Banjo. It's literally the best selling game in the entire world, certainly a western character but one that also has a huge Japanese fanbase, compared to Geno who's a hard fan-pick. I think this will work out in the end people.
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Not throwing in the towel my dude. I'm just wondering if this has ever happened before. The concern is that they decided to put the costume reveal on a separate day so some people's disappointment wouldn't overshadow the actual trailer.
 
pinshadow

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protoblues said:
Not throwing in the towel my dude. I'm just wondering if this has ever happened before. The concern is that they decided to put the costume reveal on a separate day so some people's disappointment wouldn't overshadow the actual trailer.
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They put it on a seperate day because it's being held as part of Minecon Live...
 
CannonStreak

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Fatmanonice said:
Just to summarize Power of Six:

-The theory that every pack in the Fighter's Pass was originally meant to have 6 Mii costumes.

-"Missing" Mii costumes can be used as predictors for future characters and companies involved in Season 2.

-No true Nintendo or Microsoft costumes in the Fighter's Pass suggested packs dedicated to those companies in Season 2 (proven right as of today)

-Monster Hunter costumes potentially saved for another Capcom rep

-Geno and Chocobo saved for another Square rep

-Heihachi, Gil, and Lloyd potentially saved for a Namco rep
Click to expand...
Okay then. What about The Game Awards?
 
Aaron1997

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Cacomalllow is not dead. If not its chances have increased after this. Remember that the fighter pass was already decided long before the Microsoft/Bethesda buyout so this would have no affect on Doom guy's chances. With Master Chief most likely out now that removes Doom Guy's main rival. If M theory is legit then its changed from Doom guy vs Master Chief to Doom guy vs other Mature characters which is much better for him. Also Correct me if I'm wrong but Sakuari mentioned how hard it was to get Steve in the game due to lack of move set option. It makes me think if Steve had been considered as far back as base game. (Which is where Vergeben got his rumors). This helps Cacomalllow as it tells us they can very well withhelding the Mii costumes like how they've been trying to get Steve in the game.
 
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