Geno (♥♪!?): Return of the Starsend Savior

Firox

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"Sure, Geno did come out, just remember he's bottom tier despite what the pros are saying and is 100% going to be cut in the next game."
LOL The irrational hate is real. I could just see it now....

"Geno is trash tier. Nobody wanted him in the first place. After about a week, you won't see anybody playing him!"

(3 months later Geno wins several major tournaments, MKLeo decides to main him and he is considered in top 5 characters in the game)

"We always knew he was a broken, brain-dead character. Just Geno-whirl for the win, herp derp. You know he's gonna get banned, right? Either that or Sakurai will straight nerf him out of the game. That's what you get for breaking the game with that stupidly OP possessed doll!"
 
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(3 months later Geno wins several major tournaments, MKLeo decides to main him and he is considered in top 5 characters in the game)

"We always knew he was a broken, brain-dead character. Just Geno-whirl for the win, herp derp. You know he's gonna get banned, right? Either that or Sakurai will straight nerf him out of the game. That's what you get for breaking the game with that stupidly OP possessed doll!"
I really hope not, I enjoy playing underappreciated characters.

I agree. I just think we (royal we as in also these sites covering it) are so starved for legit information that we are seeing what we want to see. I'm not saying the Flipnote stuff isn't for new games or couldn't be the vehicle through which they do transitions and reveals in a presentation (which would be really cool) but I feel like everyone is just kind of jumping on the train of thought that that is what it means and there's just not enough evidence that that is the case. My mantra always seems to be "wait and see".

Taking that mantra into other discussions taking place, why are we even arguing about how characters are getting chosen and what factors are significant for a character to get chosen? If anything, reveals in general have proven that many factors can impact character choices. But there's no way you can look at the base roster at least and not point out that fan demand is overwhelmingly a major factor to consider and Geno fits that bill. But because of how DLC has used many factors across the board both realizing and ignoring fan preferences to select each character, it's simply impossible to say what the important factors really are because they shift each character so far. Basically...wait and see. There's no point in gatekeeping, because there are no gates left. Just because a character seems unlikely or likely doesn't mean they will go that route.
Maybe I'm just overlooking something obvious, but exactly what's wrong with the idea that they're just upscaling and porting the classic 3D Mario games as a collection rather than remaking them from the ground up? I mean, how many times has Nintendo proven to us that remaking their much loved games is a mistake? Mario and Luigi Superstar Saga, Majora's Mask 3D, Mario 64 DS... Honestly it feels like the only remake they've nailed is Link's Awakening (but that's because the original game was terrible, in my honest opinion). A collection of straight ports doesn't appeal to someone like me, who has all of their consoles connected to one TV in a mess of cords and dust - I can play the original whenever I damn well please, as it was meant to be played and I don't have to buy the games again, but at this point, Mario 64 is like 25 years old, Sunshine is 18, and Galaxy is 13 - none of them have been re-released aside from 64 on Virtual Console, and it's getting harder to find them. A new generation deserves to be able to play them approximately as they were intended, as well.

It's not like it means anything bad for Geno's chances if the games aren't remakes. I'm more interested in the Paper Mario and feel like it means more for Geno.

Also, to theorize a bit further about the characters and how they're getting chosen, I do think it's very convenient that one of the more concrete things Fatman has said some folks in his network have talked about is how aware Nintendo is of the disappointment the November 1 Smash Direct was. Nintendo being out of touch with the fans has been talked to death, so I don't think I need to ramble on about it, but it sure is interesting that they're opening up the second pass with a fighter from a franchise whose front man was revealed that day as a soulless assist trophy - one that a ton of people didn't understand happening, since the franchise is so new and he seemed like not just a great fit, but an obvious fighter choice. Even guys like me who never wanted him thought that ARMS and its fans were robbed with that dumb move.

And really, aside from eternal joke Waluigi, all of the first party fan favorites were shown off as assist trophies that day, and I am including Black Knight in that, as he was a popular request after Ike was revealed in Brawl and continued to be, even in Smash 4. Maybe he deserves to stay just an assist trophy, though... SURELY by now they realize even a fan favorite Fire Emblem character won't be welcomed. Anyway, to lead off with arguably the least interesting "apology" character... Spring Man or not, if this is supposed to be the hype play, we're in for a bad time, but if it's just the tip of the iceberg, I don't think we have anything to worry about.
 

zferolie

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Honestly i am just assuming this Mario all star game is just upscaling the games, touching up a few things, wide screen support, and the what not. I do hope Mario 64 DS is included somehow but i feel that may need more work to remove the touch screen stuff
 
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I don't want him, but I'm tired of seeing "can't jump" be used as an argument when we have a roster packed with characters that never once jump in their home game and we just naturally assume they can.
Even MALLOW can jump... not high, but can, and yes, it should absolutely be assumed that everyone can naturally jump because it's pretty much as natural as breathing. But, when they make it a point to point out that a character can't jump (like Captain Toad) as opposed to it just not being a thing (Link in most Zeldas), that's way different. Also, why in the **** would they even go with Captain Toad? What is he to promote? Who is he to cater to? An ARMS rep means they'll likely be pushing ARMS this year, and there actually are ARMS fans. Yeah I'm sure there's Captain Toad fans too, but I don't see any of them clamoring for him to be playable. I don't even see that many people asking for TOAD to be playable (have seen a few, but it's nothing like other picks). Honestly, as much as I still think Sora has no chance because of Disney, I'd put money on Sora having a higher chance than him.

Also regarding King Boo, is there DLC coming to LM3 or not? I don't have it, I don't follow it, so I don't really care, but if there is, there could be a chance he'd get in, but again, not hedging bets on King Boo getting in over Geno, Waluigi, or even Birdo.

Finally, don't forget that we've had this Paper Mario 3 rumor for quite awhile now, and I'd wager that if it's being shown off at "E3", well... besides Paper Mario, who would represent the series? Could it be the predecessor character that is very known by Nintendo to be fan-requested? Hmmm...

Honestly i am just assuming this Mario all star game is just upscaling the games, touching up a few things, wide screen support, and the what not. I do hope Mario 64 DS is included somehow but i feel that may need more work to remove the touch screen stuff
If they do go with the DS version, I just hope it doesn't look like the DS. I know I sound insane but I'd much rather take the blocky N64 polygons over DS ones. I absolutely hated the DS-age visuals; they look like redoing N64 but worse because it's not the "old days" of gaming anymore.

That said, I do hope it's a collection instead of each game being its own $50-60 title because I could see them trying to do that after doing it with everything else they've been porting.
 
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Honestly i am just assuming this Mario all star game is just upscaling the games, touching up a few things, wide screen support, and the what not. I do hope Mario 64 DS is included somehow but i feel that may need more work to remove the touch screen stuff
If they only do up scales, I’ll like it if it’s the original version, but I do hope they work in Luigi, Wario and Yoshi - and maybe Waluigi. I’m not sure they’d have to worry about the touchscreen to bring anything over save for the minigames.
 
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LOL The irrational hate is real. I could just see it now....

"Geno is trash tier. Nobody wanted him in the first place. After about a week, you won't see anybody playing him!"

(3 months later Geno wins several major tournaments, MKLeo decides to main him and he is considered in top 5 characters in the game)

"We always knew he was a broken, brain-dead character. Just Geno-whirl for the win, herp derp. You know he's gonna get banned, right? Either that or Sakurai will straight nerf him out of the game. That's what you get for breaking the game with that stupidly OP possessed doll!"
...

Funny thing is , I'm a pretty active member of the french :ultbanjokazooie: discord. And I'll tell you one thing , I see people almost daily complaining about how he play in Smash (too campy/wonderwing/too heavy for his archetype/I can't approach easily a zoner who throw projectiles , it's unfair). Even yesterday , i saw some screenshot of someone who lost against one of our Banjos , going on a rant on how dumb the character in a public discord , and it's kind of sad to see such collective hate for the character. Granted , all characters get hate , because since everyone has different mains , we see the game in a different perspective.

It's just that the hate for the character seem so collective , it's a bit depressing.

So , if we ever get Geno in Smash... I god hope that the hate will be less strong , even if honestly , it's going to be there. Let's be honest , we're asking for a small , speedy glass canon type character with ton of explosive projectiles type moves. So yeah , we're bound to see some people complain , just...

As a general advice : Play who you want despise what others say. Ultimate don't have any Brawl Meta Knight or Sm4sh Bayonetta , nobody is broken even if they are stronger characters than others. And even then , if people try to put you down for who you main in a fighting game , they're pathetic. It's okay to complain about a character , but they are some limits in doing so , and I see so many cases of people going out limit.
So yeah , if Geno get in , play him if you like him , regardless of his viability. Yes , fighting games get big tournaments , and are at a pretty serious level , but gaming should remain something we enjoy and have fun with before anything else.
 

Phoenix Douchebag

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OOOOOH BABY IT'S TRIPLE!!!


So, ya'll pretty much know or have read by now (if you've been following on the upcoming Mario remasters/Paper Mario, etc.) that the rumored Paper Mario game seems to be a return to form a-la Paper Mario for the N64? What if (and I think it's been mentioned here some time ago) going back to the REAL roots of the franchise (before it got the re-branding of Paper Mario, it was going to be Super Mario RPG 2), they brought back characters from the original Super Mario RPG game, in Paper Mario form (Geno, Mallow, Croco, Axem Rangers, etc.)? :eek:

But boy o boy, the first bit; if legit game news outlets are indicating that Nintendo's possibly going after a Super Mario All-Stars 2 with Super Mario 64, Super Mario Sunshine, and Super Mario Galaxy 1 & 2?!?!?! :eek: :2gud:
You know something is up when Jonneh reports on it. Im actually interesed to see how this plays out, assuming they entire Insider circle isn't having an AF ****fest, but the more people report on it, the less likely this possibility becomes.

Well, unless this is a telephone kind of game where the first guy was actually just jesting for April's sake and then people started to believe in it.
 

Firox

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I really hope not, I enjoy playing underappreciated characters.
Funny thing is , I'm a pretty active member of the french :ultbanjokazooie: discord. And I'll tell you one thing , I see people almost daily complaining about how he play in Smash (too campy/wonderwing/too heavy for his archetype/I can't approach easily a zoner who throw projectiles , it's unfair). Even yesterday , i saw some screenshot of someone who lost against one of our Banjos , going on a rant on how dumb the character in a public discord , and it's kind of sad to see such collective hate for the character. Granted , all characters get hate , because since everyone has different mains , we see the game in a different perspective.

It's just that the hate for the character seem so collective , it's a bit depressing.

So , if we ever get Geno in Smash... I god hope that the hate will be less strong , even if honestly , it's going to be there. Let's be honest , we're asking for a small , speedy glass canon type character with ton of explosive projectiles type moves. So yeah , we're bound to see some people complain , just...

As a general advice : Play who you want despise what others say. Ultimate don't have any Brawl Meta Knight or Sm4sh Bayonetta , nobody is broken even if they are stronger characters than others. And even then , if people try to put you down for who you main in a fighting game , they're pathetic. It's okay to complain about a character , but they are some limits in doing so , and I see so many cases of people going out limit.
So yeah , if Geno get in , play him if you like him , regardless of his viability. Yes , fighting games get big tournaments , and are at a pretty serious level , but gaming should remain something we enjoy and have fun with before anything else.

Don't worry, I was just exaggerating the fact that people are going to complain no matter how Geno turns out. It is worth noting that if he ends up a zoner, which kind of seems inevitable for the most part, we're definitely going to see some salt, but frankly, people just need to suck it up and deal with it. Pretty much every character in the game has their own hate club, but they have their own fan club too. At the end of the day, just play the characters you love that resonate with your playstyle. You think MKLeo gives a rat's balls what people say about Joker or Lucina? Winning is winning and fun is fun regardless of the whiny losers out there. Just play the game and have fun.
 
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...

Funny thing is , I'm a pretty active member of the french :ultbanjokazooie: discord. And I'll tell you one thing , I see people almost daily complaining about how he play in Smash (too campy/wonderwing/too heavy for his archetype/I can't approach easily a zoner who throw projectiles , it's unfair). Even yesterday , i saw some screenshot of someone who lost against one of our Banjos , going on a rant on how dumb the character in a public discord , and it's kind of sad to see such collective hate for the character. Granted , all characters get hate , because since everyone has different mains , we see the game in a different perspective.

It's just that the hate for the character seem so collective , it's a bit depressing.

So , if we ever get Geno in Smash... I god hope that the hate will be less strong , even if honestly , it's going to be there. Let's be honest , we're asking for a small , speedy glass canon type character with ton of explosive projectiles type moves. So yeah , we're bound to see some people complain , just...

As a general advice : Play who you want despise what others say. Ultimate don't have any Brawl Meta Knight or Sm4sh Bayonetta , nobody is broken even if they are stronger characters than others. And even then , if people try to put you down for who you main in a fighting game , they're pathetic. It's okay to complain about a character , but they are some limits in doing so , and I see so many cases of people going out limit.
So yeah , if Geno get in , play him if you like him , regardless of his viability. Yes , fighting games get big tournaments , and are at a pretty serious level , but gaming should remain something we enjoy and have fun with before anything else.
With how well Banjo is generally received in the community, I pray that Geno will be liked even half as much. Sure you have people saying Banjo’s moveset sucks or that he’s boring and a pain to fight against, but those people clearly don’t make up the majority and are probably just salty over something. Geno will undoubtedly have his haters if he gets in no matter how fair/unfair or balanced/unbalanced he is, so I’d recommend not putting too much thought into what other people think.
 
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Well, unless this is a telephone kind of game where the first guy was actually just jesting for April's sake and then people started to believe in it.
Inb4 this is an elaborate, 2 days early, April Fool's. That said, the PM3 rumor has been around for like 2 months(?) now and that's by far the one I care about the most. Also the one that benefits the most from Geno's inclusion ;) (unless they start pushing Square NSO games, SMRPG especially).

With how well Banjo is generally received in the community, I pray that Geno will be liked even half as much. Sure you have people saying Banjo’s moveset sucks or that he’s boring and a pain to fight against, but those people clearly don’t make up the majority and are probably just salty over something. Geno will undoubtedly have his haters if he gets in no matter how fair/unfair or balanced/unbalanced he is, so I’d recommend not putting too much thought into what other people think.
Funny enough, Banjo & Kazooie were by far my favorite pick of FP1 (I mean they were my #2 top wanted, just behind Geno), and yet I like all the other DLC playstyles/movesets better. I still play them from time to time though. Even though I don't fully enjoy playing them, I still love that they're in and that's what most important to me at least.
 
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Phoenix Douchebag

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With how well Banjo is generally received in the community, I pray that Geno will be liked even half as much. Sure you have people saying Banjo’s moveset sucks or that he’s boring and a pain to fight against, but those people clearly don’t make up the majority and are probably just salty over something. Geno will undoubtedly have his haters if he gets in no matter how fair/unfair or balanced/unbalanced he is, so I’d recommend not putting too much thought into what other people think.
Amen to that. I main Simon and i can tell you the hatred Dracula has over the Belmonts is sexual passion and desire compared to what i have seen online. Living well is the best revenge as i say.


.....well, Simon's recovery does suck ass though (should have gone with my Castlevania 2 Tornado idea). and i suppose most of the hate goes to Richter and not Simon since he's ignored, but when i supported Simon in Smash, nobody cared outside of a few people (those same few that flocked to Richter the second he showed up because of his bishonen look) so i guess it has gone full circle in a way. Im the Simon main, flaws and all.So if you ever see someone maining the masculine barbarian blonde whip user that uses less projectiles than usual, that's me. Simon for life, i have waited 7 years for this, and during my 660 hours of playing Ultimate, you bet your ass Simon is my number one, no one even comes close, not even ****ing Mewtwo.

I root for the underdog. You can keep your mainstream top stars, i cheer for the mistreated and ignored out of love and passion. The US Sports Team from KOF, Grant Danasty from Castlevania (**** you Warren Ellis, your name is also stupid), Bandanna Dee, Waluigi if you can even call it an underdog nowadays, Mighty the Armadillo.................and Kairi. (& Knuckles)

When i played DB FIghterZ, a game with blue Haired God Saiyans up the wazoo, i already decided my choice before even buying it, and guess who i main based on my preferences:

Never let those who don't care to put your passion down.
 
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Don't worry, I was just exaggerating the fact that people are going to complain no matter how Geno turns out. It is worth noting that if he ends up a zoner, which kind of seems inevitable for the most part, we're definitely going to see some salt, but frankly, people just need to suck it up and deal with it. Pretty much every character in the game has their own hate club, but they have their own fan club too. At the end of the day, just play the characters you love that resonate with your playstyle. You think MKLeo gives a rat's balls what people say about Joker or Lucina? Winning is winning and fun is fun regardless of the whiny losers out there. Just play the game and have fun.
With how well Banjo is generally received in the community, I pray that Geno will be liked even half as much. Sure you have people saying Banjo’s moveset sucks or that he’s boring and a pain to fight against, but those people clearly don’t make up the majority and are probably just salty over something. Geno will undoubtedly have his haters if he gets in no matter how fair/unfair or balanced/unbalanced he is, so I’d recommend not putting too much thought into what other people think.
Yeah , myself , i'm well aware that in any fighting game , you should play who you like the most before anything else.

It's just that , when I transitionned to ultimate , I saw those hate clubs way more often than in Sm4sh , and it's not like I joined a ton of discord servers in between. I saw several peoples changing characters just to avoid hate from the community , and affect pretty heavily some players. Especially the younger ones , so I think those kind of reminders are necessary.

It might seem obvious to us , but I know that they are a lot of younger folks who really want Geno in Smash , so it would be a shame to see them not play the character because of that.
 
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Uh... guys, Nintendo just uploaded this. What the actual...? :eek:
Cute little community thing. I like how they blurred out Jirard (the Completionist)'s shirt when I could have sworn it was just his "That One Video Gamer" brand.

They're prepping for an exciting announcement.
...In June. That or some competitive thing that I don't follow. They just announced the ARMS rep, so idk what they could possibly unveil that's exciting that isn't a competitive thing, if what you say is correct.
 
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Firox

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Funny enough, Banjo & Kazooie were by far my favorite pick of FP1 (I mean they were my #2 top wanted, just behind Geno), and yet I like all the other DLC playstyles/movesets better. I still play them from time to time though. Even though I don't fully enjoy playing them, I still love that they're in and that's what most important to me at least.
It's kinda sad and ironic but I feel the exact same way. B-K was definitely my most favorite CHARACTER pick of FP1, but as a FIGHTER, I honestly enjoy playing Joker, Hero and Terry more. I'm still pretty good with B-K though and I definitely gel better with them than I do Byleth. I get how to play Byleth and I'm decent with him/her, but they're just too slow and clunky for my taste.
 
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It's kinda sad and ironic but I feel the exact same way. B-K was definitely my most favorite CHARACTER pick of FP1, but I honestly enjoy playing Joker, Hero and Terry more. I'm still pretty good with B-K though and I definitely gel better with them than I do Byleth.
Yup to all of this. It's funny that my "main" I guess you could say is Joker and KKR, but I do enjoy Hero, Terry, and Byleth, with BK behind them. TBH I just have a bunch of characters I like playing, but it's mostly the DLC.

but they're just too slow and clunky for my taste.
It's all worth it for that one time you get an Aymr (DownB) kill. I wish they had Super Armor through the entire move due to how slow it is, not just the latter half.
 
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Firox

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It's all worth it for that one time you get an Amyr (DownB) kill.
True dat. My big issue with the Down B though is that they should have given it super armor in the air too. I think it kind of negates the purpose and effectiveness of the move when just STARTING it in the air cancels out the armor. As for B-K, my only real gripe is the clunkiness of the eggs and the jankiness of the Nair and Bair hitboxes. Otherwise, I love the bury down throw and every time a zoner gets killed by wonderwing, an angel gets its wings. :chuckle:
 
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When i played DB FIghterZ, a game with blue Haired God Saiyans up the wazoo, i already decided my choice before even buying it, and guess who i main based on my preferences:

Never let those who don't care to put your passion down.
Good taste my man , nice to see some love for Yamcha. I had the luck to read Dragon Ball since it's beginning , and not start with DBZ , so Goku's human friends became my favorite DB characters , and are my main team in FighterZ.
234971523_small.jpg


Actually , talking about FighterZ , I would love to see Nintendo do a game like that with Mario characters , as unlikely as it sound. Like , imagine a Geno , Fawful and Dimentio tag team , it would be awesome.
 
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True dat. My big issue with the Down B though is that they should have given it super armor in the air too. I think it kind of negates the purpose and effectiveness of the move when just STARTING it in the air cancels out the armor.
Give it SA all throughout the ability! It should be meant to be dodged, not blocked or attacked (though I'm fine with it being counter-able; risk/reward).

I'd really like Geno to have a solid kit that isn't janky, but either way, if he's in, I'm ecstatic. If I enjoy his playstyle, that's just gravy.

PS: Reee, you sniped me fixing the typo on Aymr.
 
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Fatmanonice

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So, pretty exciting past two days. So, going into E3 and counting stuff that's backed up by multiple people, we're potentially looking at Nintendo representing Nintendo franchises in double digits this year:

-Mario
-Paper Mario
-Luigi's Mansion
-Zelda
-Metroid
-Animal Crossing
-Pikmin
-ARMS
-Donkey Kong
-Smash
-Fire Emblem
-Miitopia/Tomodachi Life
-Pokemon

Going off my own sources, there's potentially 3 MORE that will be part of this mix. Some of my confidants already know but it's well worth the surprise if E3 really does wind up being the place Nintendo spills its guts. Also, something to keep in mind... This is only first/second party and Nintendo more or less admitted that a ton of announcements were held back because of Corona. Needless to say, there's going to be a lot to look forward to even if we only get a percentage of the Nintendo list.
 

zferolie

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So, pretty exciting past two days. So, going into E3 and counting stuff that's backed up by multiple people, we're potentially looking at Nintendo representing Nintendo franchises in double digits this year:

-Mario
-Paper Mario
-Luigi's Mansion
-Zelda
-Metroid
-Animal Crossing
-Pikmin
-ARMS
-Donkey Kong
-Smash
-Fire Emblem
-Miitopia/Tomodachi Life
-Pokemon

Going off my own sources, there's potentially 3 MORE that will be part of this mix. Some of my confidants already know but it's well worth the surprise if E3 really does wind up being the place Nintendo spills its guts. Also, something to keep in mind... This is only first/second party and Nintendo more or less admitted that a ton of announcements were held back because of Corona. Needless to say, there's going to be a lot to look forward to even if we only get a percentage of the Nintendo list.
Not more fire emblem /kappa

But seriously, i think just the pokemon dlc is enough... but if we are also gettimg diamond and pearl remakes ill scream.
 

Fatmanonice

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As others have said, we have nothing to worry about. If Nintendo really is going hot and heavy on Mario remasters this year, my theory about 2020 being a crazy year is pretty heavily supported and I don't think Smash will be any different. I'm still in the boat that Season 2 is overwhelmingly going to be stuff that people are super enthusiastic about. On the topic of Nintendo hardcore celebrating Mario's 35th anniversary... Guess which game was the first major Mario crossover with a third party? That's right.... HOTEL MARIO, BAY-BEE; LET'S GO!
 

zferolie

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As others have said, we have nothing to worry about. If Nintendo really is going hot and heavy on Mario remasters this year, my theory about 2020 being a crazy year is pretty heavily supported and I don't think Smash will be any different. I'm still in the boat that Season 2 is overwhelmingly going to be stuff that people are super enthusiastic about. On the topic of Nintendo hardcore celebrating Mario's 35th anniversary... Guess which game was the first major Mario crossover with a third party? That's right.... HOTEL MARIO, BAY-BEE; LET'S GO!
Gee mario sure was nice of the princess to invite us!
 

Springwood Slasher

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All of this Mario remaster news has me greatly excited! I’ve played Mario 64 countless times. I could only stomach Mario Sunshine once, but have been itching to replay it recently.

I’m surprised nobody has asked this question though - do we think they are remastering Super Mario 64 or Super Mario 64 DS? Anybody have any insight there?

as for Geno - E3 is certainly seeming more likely for him. The rumoured Paper Mario game is a great Segway into a smash character reveal for Geno!
 

SmashChu

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I'm fully aware that characters that don't have fan support can get in, but fan requested characters have happened. Especially in Ultimate's case. Also when looking at the character choices so far in Ultimate, there's not much to suggest Nintendo is heavily prioritizing characters that boost what's relevant to them and their first party games anyways

You mentioned Terry earlier, and while he does have a legacy in gaming, it should be noted that outside of Smash, he wasn't used to push anything for Nintendo and isn't at all widely recognized among casual groups. Banjo too, even with his strong Nintendo roots, didn't end up benefitting Nintendo outside of Smash. Sakurai literally said to play Banjo Kazooie on Xbox. Then we have Joker, who's main game is a Sony exclusive currently

Yes, we've had picks like Byleth and now ARMS that are indeed used to promote their modern Switch line up, but that hasn't been a consistent thing

So to get to your main argument, I don't think it matters at all that Geno is less relevant than characters like Captain Toad when it comes to the Mario brand. Nintendo has shown they'll pick characters that don't have a promotional value to them outside of Smash for whatever reason

Also, it's not like the Mario brand is lacking characters that are publicly recognized in Smash. Suddenly putting in a niche popular Mario character doesn't make people forget that other Mario characters are in Smash as well. In fact just the fact that this character is related to Mario will grab public attention anyways
You're point on promotion is all over the place. We can at least admit that with some characters, yes, Nintendo is trying to promote something of their own. It should also be noted these are the last two characters added.

I'll go back to what I mentioned in the outset that Nintendo would include a Mario character to promote the 35th Anniversary. If the rumors are to be believed, Nintendo was gearing up for a celebration of Mario in 2020. This included things like the movie and theme park. Also, Nintendo has done this before with Smash. The Mario Maker stage was added in the month of Mario's 30th Anniversary. It was the only new stage not tied to a new series. So, if Nintendo was planning a big push for 2020, why wouldn't that also include their crossover game.

You are right in that the Mario brand isn't lacking for recognizable characters. But this begs the question. Why wouldn't Nintendo just go with one of their more prominent and recognizable characters . Why specifically pick a lesser known character. Sure, you can argue there are a lot of fans of Geno in the Smash community. But someone like Waluigi is far bigger and would elicit a far bigger reaction than Geno. Keep in mind there was an article in a mainstream publication about Waluigi's exclusion. When you compare the two it's a no brainer. Do you do go with a mainstay character that has appeared in numerous games that is highly requested or do you go with a lesser known character who appeared in a single title and is owned by another company that is highly requested. Obviously the former.

And I think this is sometimes what Geno fans forget. Sure, Nintendo has added obscure characters to Smash. But Ridley was a main villain in his series as was K Rool. Banjo was the star of numerous games as was Terry. Geno is a character that has appeared in a single title and he wasn't even the star of that game. Moreover, Nintendo doesn't even own him. Yes, Geno has very strong fan support. But your average person isn't going to know who Geno is. They'll know Waluigi. They'll know Captain Toad. They won't know Geno. And if this character is going to be part of a big Mario push, why are you going to go with Geno over a character that will appear in future titles (this is true of Waluigi, Captain Toad and King Boo).

A Waluigi reveal at E3 would not only serve fan interest but would promote the main series. And that's why I don't see Nintendo adding Geno as part of a big Mario push.
 
Joined
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Messages
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But seriously, i think just the pokemon dlc is enough... but if we are also gettimg diamond and pearl remakes ill scream.
gOtTa YeArLy EnStAlLmEnT 'eM aLl! PoKeRmUnZ

I'd personally want to see Gen 9 first before asking for any more remakes; given how controversial Gen 8 is, I wouldn't want the same mindset of Gen 8 for the remakes/9 (given that I absolutely loathe SwSh) and perhaps they took the criticism to heart. That's just me though, as I know there's tons of people who absolutely love SwSh (and I'll never understand why).

As others have said, we have nothing to worry about. If Nintendo really is going hot and heavy on Mario remasters this year, my theory about 2020 being a crazy year is pretty heavily supported and I don't think Smash will be any different. I'm still in the boat that Season 2 is overwhelmingly going to be stuff that people are super enthusiastic about. On the topic of Nintendo hardcore celebrating Mario's 35th anniversary... Guess which game was the first major Mario crossover with a third party? That's right.... HOTEL MARIO, BAY-BEE; LET'S GO!
2020 2nd half*. 2020 1st half has been loathsome. ACNH is great, yeah, but Byleth and ARMS Smash DLC are not a good way to end FP1/start FP2 (respectively), and... that's... pretty much it for the first half outside of 3H and SwSh DLC. Definitely lookiing forward to that June direct, though until then, there's pretty much nothing to look forward to Nintendo-wise since they haven't officially revealed anything yet.

PS: Inb4 Hotel Mario is the next Mario rep. At least Vinny (Vinesauce) might lose his **** and he'd probably pull that voice out more, so there's that, haha.

Gee mario sure was nice of the princess to invite us!
SPAGHET
 
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Phoenix Douchebag

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Mar 19, 2020
Messages
177
Good taste my man , nice to see some love for Yamcha. I had the luck to read Dragon Ball since it's beginning , and not start with DBZ , so Goku's human friends became my favorite DB characters , and are my main team in FighterZ.
View attachment 267806

Actually , talking about FighterZ , I would love to see Nintendo do a game like that with Mario characters , as unlikely as it sound. Like , imagine a Geno , Fawful and Dimentio tag team , it would be awesome.
I was born in Chile. While the US got DBZ first and saw DB as a prequel, we got to see it in order. I distinctly remember the episode in which Yamcha sees Bulma's "beauty" and his reaction to it. So even though in Latin America (especially Mexico) DBZ is the more popular one, i could appreciate OG DB and prefer it. Which is why the DLC of that game ended up beign really dissapointing outside of Kid Goku (i would have preferred the original Kid Goku but i guess it's close enough) Bardock and Broly. I hope Master Roshi shows up soon.

and yes, i also use the Human Team in DBFZ with 16 ocassionally showing up because he is my favorite of the Android trio. I guess it was only fitting.

So, pretty exciting past two days. So, going into E3 and counting stuff that's backed up by multiple people, we're potentially looking at Nintendo representing Nintendo franchises in double digits this year:

-Mario
-Paper Mario
-Luigi's Mansion
-Zelda
-Metroid
-Animal Crossing
-Pikmin
-ARMS
-Donkey Kong
-Smash
-Fire Emblem
-Miitopia/Tomodachi Life
-Pokemon

Going off my own sources, there's potentially 3 MORE that will be part of this mix. Some of my confidants already know but it's well worth the surprise if E3 really does wind up being the place Nintendo spills its guts. Also, something to keep in mind... This is only first/second party and Nintendo more or less admitted that a ton of announcements were held back because of Corona. Needless to say, there's going to be a lot to look forward to even if we only get a percentage of the Nintendo list.
Do you think any of the announcements could be pushed back to 2021 due to the current ****storm, Fatman?
 
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TheShiningAbsol

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Jan 9, 2020
Messages
120
2020 1st half has been loathsome. Byleth and ARMS Smash DLC are not a good way to end FP1/start FP2 (respectively), and... that's... pretty much it for the first half outside of 3H and SwSh DLC.
Well putting aside Byleth and ARMS, which is entirely based on your opinion, apart from Animal Crossing, we’ve also gotten TMS#FE, Pokémon Mystery Dungeon DX, and Xenoblade coming soon. And that’s just first/second party stuff—far from loathsome.
 

zferolie

Smash Master
Joined
Jul 2, 2013
Messages
3,895
You're point on promotion is all over the place. We can at least admit that with some characters, yes, Nintendo is trying to promote something of their own. It should also be noted these are the last two characters added.

I'll go back to what I mentioned in the outset that Nintendo would include a Mario character to promote the 35th Anniversary. If the rumors are to be believed, Nintendo was gearing up for a celebration of Mario in 2020. This included things like the movie and theme park. Also, Nintendo has done this before with Smash. The Mario Maker stage was added in the month of Mario's 30th Anniversary. It was the only new stage not tied to a new series. So, if Nintendo was planning a big push for 2020, why wouldn't that also include their crossover game.

You are right in that the Mario brand isn't lacking for recognizable characters. But this begs the question. Why wouldn't Nintendo just go with one of their more prominent and recognizable characters . Why specifically pick a lesser known character. Sure, you can argue there are a lot of fans of Geno in the Smash community. But someone like Waluigi is far bigger and would elicit a far bigger reaction than Geno. Keep in mind there was an article in a mainstream publication about Waluigi's exclusion. When you compare the two it's a no brainer. Do you do go with a mainstay character that has appeared in numerous games that is highly requested or do you go with a lesser known character who appeared in a single title and is owned by another company that is highly requested. Obviously the former.

And I think this is sometimes what Geno fans forget. Sure, Nintendo has added obscure characters to Smash. But Ridley was a main villain in his series as was K Rool. Banjo was the star of numerous games as was Terry. Geno is a character that has appeared in a single title and he wasn't even the star of that game. Moreover, Nintendo doesn't even own him. Yes, Geno has very strong fan support. But your average person isn't going to know who Geno is. They'll know Waluigi. They'll know Captain Toad. They won't know Geno. And if this character is going to be part of a big Mario push, why are you going to go with Geno over a character that will appear in future titles (this is true of Waluigi, Captain Toad and King Boo).

A Waluigi reveal at E3 would not only serve fan interest but would promote the main series. And that's why I don't see Nintendo adding Geno as part of a big Mario push.
To be fair i can see Waluigi getting in over Geno if this was a pure Mario rep choice, but i think there may be some fan and Sakurai want in that choice too, which would be better for Geno.

gOtTa YeArLy EnStAlLmEnT 'eM aLl! PoKeRmUnZ

I'd personally want to see Gen 9 first before asking for any more remakes; given how controversial Gen 8 is, I wouldn't want the same mindset of Gen 8 for the remakes/9 (given that I absolutely loathe SwSh) and perhaps they took the criticism to heart. That's just me though, as I know there's tons of people who absolutely love SwSh (and I'll never understand why).



2020 2nd half*. 2020 1st half has been loathsome. ACNH is great, yeah, but Byleth and ARMS Smash DLC are not a good way to end FP1/start FP2 (respectively), and... that's... pretty much it for the first half outside of 3H and SwSh DLC. Definitely lookiing forward to that June direct, though until then, there's pretty much nothing to look forward to Nintendo-wise since they haven't officially revealed anything yet.

PS: Inb4 Hotel Mario is the next Mario rep. At least Vinny (Vinesauce) might lose his **** and he'd probably pull that voice out more, so there's that, haha.



SPAGHET
I enjoyed the gameplay a ton in the new pokemon games but the story and graphics were lacking. This DLC seems to be upping both it seems, and i wish the main game was like this dlc. Especially the story man it felt the most lack luster in the series, and thats a shame coming from the great original sun and moon with the best villain by far Lusamine.

However i ADORE gen 4 so would love to see a great remake...
 
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Messages
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we’ve also gotten TMS#FE
Sorry I have no idea what that is. Something Fire Emblem I assume?

Pokémon Mystery Dungeon DX, and Xenoblade coming soon
I totally forgot about PMD:DX and that Xenoblade was coming this half, my bad. It's still been pretty mediocre overall though.

However i ADORE gen 4 so would love to see a great remake...
I always rag on Gen 4 but I keep forgetting how much I actually played them. I also had this huge book (I think it was a player's guide?), that I'd constantly flip through on the game and dex. I mostly used it with Action Replay to mess around with stuff, but looking back I would like a Gen 4 remake, just not in the Gen 8 style and mindset. That said, I won't be surprised if it happens, along with Gen 5 eventually as well.
 
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Joined
Oct 25, 2019
Messages
986
My thoughts on what we may or may not see for Super Mario's Birthday Blowout...
  • I do think that the previous 3D Mario games will get ported over in some way...
    • Sunshine and the two Galaxy games, I think will just get the basics "upscale to HD" treatment. Graphically, I think they hold up well enough that they don't need any adjustments. Also, Sunshine is one of the few GameCube games to use the analog shoulder triggers, so they'll have to adjust the controls for that.
    • For Super Mario 64, I think they'll go all out and give it the N. Sane Trilogy treatment: overhaul the graphics to look closer to Odyssey (it's the one game I think would "need" a remaster like this), bring in all the added content from the DS port (the extra stars and playable Luigi, Wario, and Yoshi), and add in a little bit more (like some more stars and a playable Waluigi).
  • In regards to that bit about a new Paper Mario, I think it could go two ways...
    • Possibility #1 - We are indeed getting a brand new Paper Mario game, one that returns to the series' RPG roots like everyone wants.
    • Possibility #2 - We're not getting a new game... but we are getting one of the earlier games remastered and ported to the Switch, most likely either the original Paper Mario on N64 or the GameCube sequel The Thousand-Year Door (cue Arlo screaming happily to the heavens that his wish has been fulfilled). This would be a "safer" option than a brand new game, and it could also serve as a real test to see if fans would be willing to support an old school Mario RPG (as opposed to that tiny Nintendo Club poll that lead to us getting Sticker Star with no story)... and in the case of The Thousand-Year Door, it would be a much needed re-release of a game that hasn't been re-released beyond its original console.
  • In regards to getting a potential character in Smash, I've seen some arguing as to whether or not it would be Geno or Waluigi, but as that one meme says... "Why not both?" We've got six characters for Fighters Pass 2, and I think there's at least some likelihood to us getting a double-dip in some fashion, in this case two Mario characters. Plus, as Fatman pointed out, there's the chance of one of them getting the "bonus character separate from the pass" treatment, even if I don't know how likely that is.
Sorry I have no idea what that is. Something Fire Emblem I assume?
A game that was initially revealed as a Fire Emblem X Shin Megami Tensei crossover game... then it turned out to not be a crossover at all, and instead was something completely different, with only some marginal relation to Fire Emblem and nothing to do with Shin Megami Tensei.
 
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It's kinda sad and ironic but I feel the exact same way. B-K was definitely my most favorite CHARACTER pick of FP1, but as a FIGHTER, I honestly enjoy playing Joker, Hero and Terry more. I'm still pretty good with B-K though and I definitely gel better with them than I do Byleth. I get how to play Byleth and I'm decent with him/her, but they're just too slow and clunky for my taste.
I never wanted Banjo, but for what he means to the Smash fandom at large, I accept the pick as the "best" of the pack, but I too absolutely hate his moveset. Since I play pretty much nothing but zoners, he's a ***** to fight against since my punish options on wonderwing are weak and the eggs are great at stuffing the approaches I need to get something started in earnest. Playing as him isn't fun because he just feels like a discount Mario with a lot of discount Snake moves, which isn't a bad thing and more speaks to the fact that Mario's kit is a little too good for what he is.

I'm in a boat where Mega Man was my favorite character added in Smash 4, and I played him for the lifetime of the game, but I never really liked the way he played. Heckling people with lemons and getting cheesy gimp kills only works for so long before people figure out that you'll never manage to kill them without fishing for some obvious **** - a problem that wasn't fixed in Ultimate and ultimately made me decide to just drop the character for my old main. I really want a character that can cover the matchups that figure out how to deal with my zoning. Geno's such a fast guy in canon that he could a rushdown oriented projectile user - something that would be very unique - maybe having physical combos that are expected to be finished with strong projectiles, or strong projectiles that are set aside for reads.

But hey, I didn't ask for Mega Man (and had actually told friends I didn't see how he would work as far back as 2005), and still put up with his underwhelming moveset because I like the character - you had best believe that I'll play Geno regardless because I actually asked for him.
 

Firox

Smash Champion
Joined
Jan 7, 2019
Messages
2,145
But hey, I didn't ask for Mega Man (and had actually told friends I didn't see how he would work as far back as 2005), and still put up with his underwhelming moveset because I like the character - you had best believe that I'll play Geno regardless because I actually asked for him.
Same. If they give Geno an even halfway fun rushdown game, I'll be all over that (in case Greninja didn't give it away, I love rushdown characters). To be honest, I feel that every competitively good character should have a least one good projectile anyway. If Geno has more than one PLUS rushdown capability, he'll be a dream come true. As a side note, I still think that a notable lack of "gunner" type character in the DLC improve his chances as well. FP1 didn't have any and I doubt the ARMS character will count towards that archetype.
 
Joined
Nov 1, 2018
Messages
1,652
I do think that the previous 3D Mario games will get ported over in some way...
  • Sunshine and the two Galaxy games, I think will just get the basics "upscale to HD" treatment. Graphically, I think they hold up well enough that they don't need any adjustments. Also, Sunshine is one of the few GameCube games to use the analog shoulder triggers, so they'll have to adjust the controls for that.
  • For Super Mario 64, I think they'll go all out and give it the N. Sane Trilogy treatment: overhaul the graphics to look closer to Odyssey (it's the one game I think would "need" a remaster like this), bring in all the added content from the DS port (the extra stars and playable Luigi, Wario, and Yoshi), and add in a little bit more (like some more stars and a playable Waluigi).
I could see them potentially adding SM3DW on there as a bonus since it's also only been on the Wii U. Possibly also SM3DL.
As for SM64, I'd prefer if they did an upscale of the original personally. Idk, I kinda disliked the multiple characters thing; it'd be cooler if it was a "pick a character because you want to play them" kind of thing, not "because you have to".

  • Possibility #1 - We are indeed getting a brand new Paper Mario game, one that returns to the series' RPG roots like everyone wants.
  • Possibility #2 - We're not getting a new game... but we are getting one of the earlier games remastered and ported to the Switch, most likely either the original Paper Mario on N64 or the GameCube sequel The Thousand-Year Door (cue Arlo screaming happily to the heavens that his wish has been fulfilled). This would be a "safer" option than a brand new game, and it could also serve as a real test to see if fans would be willing to support an old school Mario RPG (as opposed to that tiny Nintendo Club poll that lead to us getting Sticker Star with no story)... and in the case of The Thousand-Year Door, it would be a much needed re-release of a game that hasn't been re-released beyond its original console.
"Why not both?". They have to be aware that people have been saying PM64 and TTYD are great games and SS/CS have been nowhere near as good. Need to refind the source on this, but even Miyamoto himself said Sticker Star was boring (after *HE* told the team responsible to redo it because it's too much like TTYD, *grumble grumble*), so there's no way they can be that thick-headed. As for the originals, could you imagine if they threw them on the 3rd (yes I said 3rd) game as a bonus? Kinda like a "we hear people want these games back, so we're porting them onto this game as a bonus". Not a remake or anything, just a re-release bonus in case you never played the first two. I'd go absolutely mental over that, having not just the original 2 but now also a brand new 3rd game, all on my Switch that I can take anywhere... Now if we could just get an official SMRPG port on the NSO library.

In regards to getting a potential character in Smash, I've seen some arguing as to whether or not it would be Geno or Waluigi, but as that one meme says... "Why not both?" We've got six characters for Fighters Pass 2, and I think there's at least some likelihood to us getting a double-dip in some fashion, in this case two Mario characters. Plus, as Fatman pointed out, there's the chance of one of them getting the "bonus character separate from the pass" treatment, even if I don't know how likely that is.
I'm less sure about Waluigi but I could still see him happening, especially if this year is intended to be Mario-heavy. If we get a Geno & Waluigi double-reveal this June, alongside all these games, I think everyone's gonna lose their **** so hard. Like, this is how you not only outdo the Banjo reveal, but go above and beyond.

All that said though, I'm definitely getting ahead of myself so to curve expectations, by no means am I expecting to see all of this. This would just be *the perfect* "E3" to me personally, seeing all these old games get remasters/ports/whatever brought to the Switch, alongside a new PM that isn't garbage and Geno put in. Waluigi and PM64/TTYD would just be awesome bonuses that I'm still not expecting.
 

waterhasataste

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Oct 31, 2018
Messages
322
You're point on promotion is all over the place. We can at least admit that with some characters, yes, Nintendo is trying to promote something of their own. It should also be noted these are the last two characters added.

I'll go back to what I mentioned in the outset that Nintendo would include a Mario character to promote the 35th Anniversary. If the rumors are to be believed, Nintendo was gearing up for a celebration of Mario in 2020. This included things like the movie and theme park. Also, Nintendo has done this before with Smash. The Mario Maker stage was added in the month of Mario's 30th Anniversary. It was the only new stage not tied to a new series. So, if Nintendo was planning a big push for 2020, why wouldn't that also include their crossover game.

You are right in that the Mario brand isn't lacking for recognizable characters. But this begs the question. Why wouldn't Nintendo just go with one of their more prominent and recognizable characters . Why specifically pick a lesser known character. Sure, you can argue there are a lot of fans of Geno in the Smash community. But someone like Waluigi is far bigger and would elicit a far bigger reaction than Geno. Keep in mind there was an article in a mainstream publication about Waluigi's exclusion. When you compare the two it's a no brainer. Do you do go with a mainstay character that has appeared in numerous games that is highly requested or do you go with a lesser known character who appeared in a single title and is owned by another company that is highly requested. Obviously the former.

And I think this is sometimes what Geno fans forget. Sure, Nintendo has added obscure characters to Smash. But Ridley was a main villain in his series as was K Rool. Banjo was the star of numerous games as was Terry. Geno is a character that has appeared in a single title and he wasn't even the star of that game. Moreover, Nintendo doesn't even own him. Yes, Geno has very strong fan support. But your average person isn't going to know who Geno is. They'll know Waluigi. They'll know Captain Toad. They won't know Geno. And if this character is going to be part of a big Mario push, why are you going to go with Geno over a character that will appear in future titles (this is true of Waluigi, Captain Toad and King Boo).

A Waluigi reveal at E3 would not only serve fan interest but would promote the main series. And that's why I don't see Nintendo adding Geno as part of a big Mario push.
I'm not sure how my point of promotional characters is all over the place. The jist is that Nintendo has selected characters that are completely out of the Nintendo brand and aren't used to promote anything from them. Meaning that yes they are willing to add in characters that don't hold a promotional value. If your main argument is that Nintendo would want a more general Mario character to promote the Mario brand, then it's an argument that doesn't match up with the DLC picks so far because a healthy amount of the picks go against the idea of Nintendo specifically promoting their own games

Also, I'm not sure why Nintendo needs to include a more general character. Mario is a not a sinking franchise. Slap anything with the Mario brand it is guaranteed to sell. Nintendo doesn't need to promote Mario, the name promotes itself. Geno would sell just fine even if he isn't a well known character amoung the general public.

And yeah, he's a side character, he's not the face of many games. But does that really matter when there's already like 10+ Mario characters most of whom are well known? Like we aren't arguing for Geno to get in before Mario, or Luigi, or Peach or Bowser. Literally most of the main Mario cast is already in. If any franchise can add a more niche character, it's easily Mario by a long shot

I'm also not sure why all of a sudden Nintendo cares about specifically satisfying the general audience. Was Joker known by the general public? Was Terry? How about Banjo? When Nintendo negotiated a Microsoft rep, they didn't go for Steve, who comes from a game that literally everyone knows. They instead approved of a dead character just because fans wanted it. They went through the effort of negotiating a western character from a direct competitor and they got a heavily fan requested one over a character that would've been more recognizable with the general public. Nintendo doesn't care about specifically catering to the general public and if they did, the roster would look wildly different
 
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Messages
1,652
Nintendo doesn't care about specifically catering to the general public and if they did, the roster would look wildly different
Now introducing DLC 7: Fortnite.
(I literally know 0 characters from Fortnite except the wolf guy, because obviously)

DLC 8: Steve

DLC 9: League of Legends rep

DLC 10: Call of Duty, Shoot-a-Man rep

DLC 11: Waluigi
 
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