Geno (♥♪!?): Return of the Starsend Savior

[Polarthief]

https://mobile.twitter.com/New_WabiSabi/status/1228772877647769600?p=v

Sabi is saying, Emily Rogers a known person who reports on gaming News and the like Is implying we're getting an Animal Crosding direct this week.

Take it at face value I suppose, I don't know if it's anything but we'll see.

Uuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuugggggggggggggh. Really hoping this is BS. I would like an AC Direct, but not before a general Direct.

 

[Deleted member]

Geez this Cornavirus thing is something else.

I know we're all just faceless nameless people to each other on here, but our combined support of Geno and love of Super Smash Bros. brings us together, and you're all cool people so just be careful out there and and stay healthy. All the best I hope this passes in time.

Anyway yeah Emily Rogers isn't always right, so this might not be anything she's a cool person so we'll see what happens. If it's nothing well guess we still got a wait ahead of us.

 

[Professor Pumpkaboo]

I feel very strongly about this last characters and who I think it is but he isnt related to Geno so ill keep my mouth shut

https://mobile.twitter.com/New_WabiSabi/status/1228772877647769600?p=v

Sabi is saying, Emily Rogers a known person who reports on gaming News and the like Is implying we're getting an Animal Crosding direct this week.

Take it at face value I suppose, I don't know if it's anything but we'll see.

Yeah, im just gonna believe everyone is lying about an AC direct until its actualy announced. For all we know, thr coronavirus probably f'ed that up too. that being said Id really love an AC direct

 

[Lord Woomy]

So, this bit of news just came out:

https://gonintendo.com/stories/3549...auses-cancellation-of-pokemon-asia-top-league

Maybe the Coronavirus does have something to do with the missing Direct...

Is China one of the countries competing though? If it is, then it makes more sense to cancel that tournament over just a Direct.

 

[Polarthief]

that being said Id really love an AC direct

I really would too TBH. I really want to hear about the new stuff since I've been a fan all the way back since the Gamecube (rather, the first for us Western plebs). But sadly, that's giving me info on *one* game I care about, not de/confirming rumors and information I want to hear about *many* games I care about.

That said, I will take an AC direct over nothing, but man oh man I am starving for a general direct first. Plus AC:NH is out in just 5 weeks while everything else I care about will take longer than that. I just want some info on them!

PS: If the virus is what's causing all these problems, I hope whatever caused it burns in the deepest pits of hell, regardless if it was nature or some asshole who ****ed around with things he shouldn't be ****ing with.

 

[Professor Pumpkaboo]

I really would too TBH. I really want to hear about the new stuff since I've been a fan all the way back since the Gamecube (rather, the first for us Western plebs). But sadly, that's giving me info on *one* game I care about, not de/confirming rumors and information I want to hear about *many* games I care about.

That said, I will take an AC direct over nothing, but man oh man I am starving for a general direct first. Plus AC:NH is out in just 5 weeks while everything else I care about will take longer than that. I just want some info on them!

man, you dont know how hungry I am for AC news- Did you say 5 weeks?
*starts vibrating* The day is getting so close

 

[Deleted member]

The game has me interested too, I finally have acesss to Nintendo Switch games again thanks to a Switch Lite, and after I'm done with Pokemon Sword, I'd love too see more from it. and play it.

I would love a direct for it. But I too want a general direct as much as everyone too.

 

[Polarthief]

man, you dont know how hungry I am for AC news- Did you say 5 weeks?
*starts vibrating* The day is getting so close

I know I am too, but my stomach for general news is starving to death whereas my AC stomach is "quite hungry". Plus it already has that "5 weeks deadline" which helps take the sting off. Metroid 5, Paper Mario 3, Smash news, etc etc. As much as I love AC, my love of all other Nintendo stuff combined takes a bit of precedent.

Still though, just deliver unto us, Nintendo. Be the champions and announce the general direct for Wednesday and the AC direct for Thursday, or have the AC direct follow the general direct! That'd be an amazing scenario.

 

[Professor Pumpkaboo]

You know, would the fandom be understanding if Nintendo did say the Coronavirus was causing them trouble?

 

[CHAMPIONX9]

I mean, I don't think people want to get sick. Don't think people will be too butt hurt

 

[Polarthief]

You know, would the fandom be understanding if Nintendo did say the Coronavirus was causing them trouble?

I mean, the assholes won't care. They wouldn't care if the entire HQ was lost in a freak accident like a horrible fire, earthquake, or whatever. I do think the majority of people, myself included, would totally understand, if that was/is the case. But if they don't say anything, then I'm just left assuming it was deliberate.

Either way, if the direct is amazing and confirms stuff like PM3 and gives me Geno, the wait will be more than justified in my eyes, even if it was deliberate. I wouldn't care; I'd be over the moon.

 

[MattX20]

We don't know if the Coronavirus is specifically responsible for the delay of the general direct just yet, only a Pokemon TCG tournament. If they did announce on Twitter it was the cause like how they delayed the September Direct of 2018 due to an earthquake hitting Japan, at least that would be better than leaving viewers waiting with no discernible explanation.

 

[Professor Pumpkaboo]

I know an anime has been delayed indifinatly unill next month because of the virus from what I read so looks likes effecting more then we think.
That being said im one of those people that just say "the direct will happen when it happens" I got Taiko and DQB2 to play in the mean time, so I can wait

 

[CannonStreak]

You know, would the fandom be understanding if Nintendo did say the Coronavirus was causing them trouble?

To me, yes. I would be understanding.

It would be nice if they could just say it if that were the case, though.

 

[MarioRaccoon]

An AC Direct for 20th and a General Direct for March 5th is really pausible, and it benefits because the longer the direct takes place, the more chances increases that they will reveal a smash character. Between juanuary 28th (FP2 releases for purchase) and march 5th there are around 40 days, and I considered a long wait for the reveal of FP6.

 

[Professor Pumpkaboo]

To me, yes. I would be understanding.

It would be nice if they could just say it if that were the case, though.

I feel if they havent ssid anything by now, they either a) dont think they need too or b) dont think they should but we will see

 

[Sigran101]

I'm pretty sure it was said that "December 2021" was just a placeholder date, not an actual end date. I highly doubt it'll be that long until we get all the characters. Personally I feel like we'll get the last one around E3 2021.

This. I thought this was proven already. Something on the Japanese page for the pass confirmed it if I recall.

 

[CannonStreak]

I feel if they havent ssid anything by now, they either a) dont think they need too or b) dont think they should but we will see

Well, even if they shouldn’t, I think it would still be nice if they said so.

 

[Polarthief]

An AC Direct for 20th and a General Direct for March 5th is really pausible, and it benefits because the longer the direct takes place, the more chances increases that they will reveal a smash character. Between juanuary 28th (FP2 releases for purchase) and march 5th there are around 40 days, and I considered a long wait for the reveal of FP6.

If they actually waited this long, they should just do March 9th for the 24th anniversary *if* Geno is #6 and/or if NSO gets SMRPG.

 

[YsDisciple]

So, this bit of news just came out:

https://gonintendo.com/stories/3549...auses-cancellation-of-pokemon-asia-top-league

Maybe the Coronavirus does have something to do with the missing Direct...

Heh, imagine we actually get an Animal Crossing: New Horizons-focused Direct this week, and at the end we get a surprise reveal of Challenger Pack #6 being Tom Nook to kick things off?

 

[LiveStudioAudience]

If a general Direct does happen in March, I hope the content is worthwhile. After six months of no real significant news outside Pokemon announcements & Byleth's reveal; getting to a presentation with a few Wii U ports, underwelming Nintendo online news, & some scant DLC updates for a few titles would be just a letdown after such a long drought. And in all honesty, I'm already somewhat expecting that.

 

[BluYoshi828]

Reminder that the Byleth reveal video as recorded in November.

I'd say chances of getting a teaser for FP6 in the next General Direct are decent. The longer it takes to come out, the higher the chances. Though as comrade Fatman has said previously, E3 is THE place to do a blowout. We got Hero+Banjo last E3, which really helped make that direct feel utterly insane.

Seriously though. We got BANJO. Compared to the circus of rights and ethical hoops of that, getting Geno should be a cakewalk.

 

[Deleted member]

This is how we will assert dominance on the detractors once Geno gets in. It’ll save your life one day!

 

[pinshadow]

The idea of Coronavirus cancelling a direct is really weird and super unlikely in my eyes. Directs are planned months in advance and I don't see how the virus would be affecting production of promotional material enough to cancel an entire direct, seriously, I get that it's a big deal but nothing that's going to greatly affect internal development of stuff. (It seems like is it causing problems with physical production of stuff but again is that really something to cancel an entire direct over? Especially when Nintendo already tends to be vauge on release dates and has never had any problem delaying stuff?)

Even if the direct was delayed then when is it going to be? It's not like the virus seems to be going away anytime soon. What, are they just going to not announce anything until E3?

 

[Professor Pumpkaboo]

I don't see how the virus would be affecting production of promotional material enough to cancel an entire direct,

one thing i can think of is the main guy that does the direct gets sick

 

[LiveStudioAudience]

Nintendo announced work was being restarted on Metroid Prime 4 and openly stated it was rescheduled a Direct after an earthquake. If the Corona virus was significant enough to be affecting presentations, I would think they'd be transparent enough to say so to the public.

 

[Professor Pumpkaboo]

maybe they just dont want to tell us anything *shrugs* I mean, they arent obligated to so eh

 

[Vector Victor]

Nintendo announced work was being restarted on Metroid Prime 4 and openly stated it was rescheduled a Direct after an earthquake. If the Corona virus was significant enough to be affecting presentations, I would think they'd be transparent enough to say so to the public.

This is true that they could make a public announcement regarding a delay. However, it's not a 1 to 1 comparison situation.

The direct impacted by the earthquake was announced prior to it and they updated that the direct would be pushed. But right now? Regardless of all the insider murmurs, hints, implications, wink-wink nudge-nudge comments and Nintendo insider memos, at no point in the last month has Nintendo actually officially announced a direct was coming, so they don't need to indicate a delay concerning an unscheduled event.

 

[Dorayaki]

- Not in M&L remake because they would have had to pay for the rights for a tiny cameo that means nothing.
- They have some rights for Smash already considering the spirit exists (Mallow too).
- ^ proves that Square's at least okay with him existing in Smash in some form, and it doesn't make sense to sit on a dead character that's heavily requested when they could make *FREE* money with him.

If SE was actually doing something with Geno, I'd understand, but it's virtually free money at this point to let him in.

The contradiction is that if Geno is a profitable property, making use of him in more video games (either modern Mario games or debut in new SE series as you said) shouldn't be a problem, so that I don't think the companies should restrict his uses. The major issue around Geno at this point should be that whether the companies want to give him spotlights.

On the other hand, it would be smarter to accumulate Genos public attention with more appearances either main roles or cameos. So just giving up making Geno in M&L just seems stupid, and also dissapoiting to Mario RPG fans.

tfw someone says Geno did poorly in the ballot despite the ballot results not being public, they’re basing it solely on Smash 4 Geno supporters on SmashBoards being relatively absent, and Sakurai himself saying Geno gets lots of requests.

I think the use of statistical result is that we can see how much support Geno exactly had. Maybe he ranked six and Nintendo only wanted to scout the top five, or other top rankings don't have difficult right issues etc.

While I believe in Geno' s popularity, I would tend to see a new ballot hold within the Smash 5 era. Since not like all SmAsh games from now on would keep using Smash 4 ballot as the reference. A new ballot would better help Nintendo to examine Geno's popularity fading or not.

 

[ForsakenM]

Hey all so I'm a lurker of this thread. I've never played Mario RPG nor do I have any childhood connection with wanting Geno in Smash, but you guys' passion and drive for this character is so inspiring that I really want him in, too. I also think the unique possibilities for his gameplay mechanics (the star charging system) would be very cool to be implemented into Smash.

To all the people who say this guy is impossible, King K. Rool, whose last semi-canonical appearance was in a game called MARIO SUPER SLUGGERS from over 10 years ago was unveiled to hype reactions and millions of people watching his character trailer. The character is an obese, humanoid crocodile who appeared in like 4 mainline games in the 1990s and was created by a studio no longer affiliated with Nintendo. And guess what. He made it in.

Whatever happens, even though I think Nintendo takes this game seriously, I don't think they care enough about super concrete patterns or relevancy when they make their decisions. Geno has a cool gameplay concept and a legacy with the Smash fanbase and I think that should be enough. So honestly until they say there's no more DLC and Geno isn't in the game, don't give up hope y'all.

See, it's good **** like this that keeps me from going completely insane.

Not only are you supportive without really knowing the character personally, but you understand his situation and you bridge the gap with us on getting a character that we love. On top of that, you recognize how some of these characters in the game already are insane picks that anyone with a greedy mind like EA or Activision/Blizzard or GameFreak wouldn't ever bother with such a thing because it's what fans want in spite of what they tend to say with their wallets. It's what the fans say with their hearts and minds. K. Rool honestly is a huge deal and there were so many naysayers for many reasons, and a lot of them were solid because, as much as I hate to say it since I love K. Rool and grew up with old DK, he had become forgotten by the industry.

Thank you very much for this.

Certainly agree to disagree and there's nothing wrong with that. But again I mean no offense. Evidence clearly means different things to different people. I do want to make one clarification since it's clear you consider SMRPG presence in base game a good thing where I'm saying it's not. Characters who have gotten in in DLC (except PP who was clearly supposed to be base) have had no representation in base game previously meaning that's a bad thing for Geno (Three Houses is for some reason considered separate from other FE content which is a odd but was absent from the base game).

I understand the argument is that FP2 is the wild west and may not follow but we have no way of knowing that. Should DLC continue to follow this then characters you mentioned who have no prior representation in Ultimate are in a "better" spot in that one aspect that we do have a precedent for. This equally could mean nothing much like many points for or against Geno could mean nothing. The problem is we just don't know and it's especially frustrating how convoluted the character selection process is.

It's fine if you think I'm merely waiving all your "evidence" off but I've put a lot of thought into these arguments and simply don't see it the same way. Hopefully for our sake you're correct tho. I just hope everyone knows I'm saying all this as a Geno bro with the only intention of providing a differing lens through which to view things which is merely my opinion and could and has been wrong before. If I am wrong I'll gladly take the L. Although I'm not saying by any means that Geno won't get in just that his chances are roughly the same as other characters. Nintendo makes no sense to me and boy do they like it that way.

Hold on, did you just say evidence means different things to different people? No, evidence is solid facts that prove whether something is true or false. What you are referring to is more circumstantial evidence, in which it COULD be evidence or it could not be, since it's not air-tight solid.

See guys, people like this exist who will find holes (or poke holes when there aren't ones to be found, whether the holes mean anything or not) in arguments that are not air-tight. THIS is why I mention that if speculation gets nutty or drives you crazy, remember the base facts that are 100% true that are in Geno's favor. Remember that we have so much going for us without all the questionable stuff.

As for you SpiritOfRuin and others like Dorayaki I will hit you with the stuff that you cannot debate with.

~Ultimate has been catering to the Smash fanbase more than any other in the series. From longstanding requests () to newer requests () to not cutting a single character to returning all the previously cut characters to all the stages and all the music to all the modes to including a story mode again. Ever since the base game, this game has been giving to it's fans, and mostly to fans who have been around since the beginning too. DLC hasn't changed this either, as both and are longstanding requests while was a newer one. In fact, the fact that we are getting DLC is more proof of fan catering as fans of Smash would never want the new content to end. Thus, we have undeniable proof of fan catering and favoring older fans...and where does Geno fall in line here? That's right: longstanding fan request, and the final really big one to be honest. This is in Geno's favor, no debates.

~Sakurai has gone on record to state that ever since Brawl, he's tried to get Geno in, but it hasn't worked out. Brawl days was likely due to Square and Nintendo still not being on the best terms. Smash 4 days was likely due to time constraints and Square wanting to push FF and knowing that was overall the better choice. Ultimate's base I wouldn't be surprised if there was an attempt but that is speculation...what isn't speculation is that we still have more character coming to the game as we speak and Sakurai spoke to us in a breakdown that he wants to add more worlds into Smash to celebrate gaming as well as fufill more fan requests. This is clearly all in Geno's favor as now both Final Fantasy and Dragon Quest are no longer in his way, which makes him the next big picks since Sora is a Disney character and every other Square character that is requested is much less requested than him and has been requested for a much shorter time then him.

~We have all pretty much come to accept that if a costume of your character shows up without that character already being announced, they are likely not coming into the game. This is once of the few "fan rules" or an actual pattern that has yet to be broken since the introduction of Mii Costumes, much like Assist Trophies. It can be broken, but it has yet to be broken. However, in a strange twist of fate, Geno's costume has yet to return. Many people are arguing over why and the circumstances around it, but the simple facts are that A. It hasn't returned, B. They had three perfect opportunities to have it return, what with a Square-focused character and two 'dumps' in which big franchises got both new and returning costumes, yet it didn't happen and C. Negotiations for the costume would have been done already with Geno's likeness due to his Spirit and icon, and his costume is just free money for Square, so there is no reason for it to have not returned yet if they planned on it returning. All of these things are facts that cannot be debated about and they all support Geno's chances, and even some of the speculation like each costume line-up having two returning costumes but Wave 2 didn't or how Wave 2 oddly has fewer costumes than any other wave, tings that are facts but don't directly support Geno are strong as well. His costume not returning thus far is clearly in his favor.

These three solid bits of evidence are all you need in Geno's court. You cannot debate that these things may or may not exist, and you cannot argue that these things may or may not be in Geno's favor.

LET'S GO GENOBROS~!

 

[YsDisciple]

PushDustIn retweeted a very (and I mean VERY) insightful video of someone predicting the Fighters Pass Vol. 2 characters using math.

 

[Polarthief]

The contradiction is that if Geno is a profitable property, making use of him in more video games (either modern Mario games or debut in new SE series as you said) shouldn't be a problem, so that I don't think the companies should restrict his uses. The major issue around Geno at this point should be that whether the companies want to give him spotlights.

*looks around* Hi Belmont Bros. King K. Rool and Banjo-Kazooie. None of you guys have gotten a game in forever (Nuts & Bolts barely counts)? None of you *will* get a new game anytime soon and if you do it's likely because of your inclusion? How did you guys get into Smash Ultimate?

The thing is though is that SE is sitting on a ton of just dead characters. Practically every character from FF not in 7, let alone Geno (and Mallow?). What's a few more?

On the other hand, it would be smarter to accumulate Genos public attention with more appearances either main roles or cameos. So just giving up making Geno in M&L just seems stupid, and also dissapoiting to Mario RPG fans.

Exactly. There's no point to pay out the ass for the tiny cameo.

I think the use of statistical result is that we can see how much support Geno exactly had. Maybe he ranked six and Nintendo only wanted to scout the top five, or other top rankings don't have difficult right issues etc.

While I believe in Geno' s popularity, I would tend to see a new ballot hold within the Smash 5 era. Since not like all SmAsh games from now on would keep using Smash 4 ballot as the reference. A new ballot would better help Nintendo to examine Geno's popularity fading or not.

Definitely true, but I can't help but feel his popularity has only increased. I mean hell, he has a whole discord dedicated to him, a handful of YouTubers who advocate for him, PapaGenos getting his own namesake from the guy, this thread getting up to 2.4k (and counting) pages; does any other wanted character have anywhere close to that many?

Idk, maybe I'm just biased, dumb, and out of touch, but I can't help but feel like I see Geno or SMRPG everywhere I look. Granted, I'm not taking the silent majority into account and that's always something to consider, especially given that many Smash fans are younger and probably didn't even exist when Geno came to be. Many are Europeans who didn't have much time to get to know Geno and get nostalgic for him, etc etc.

 

[MattX20]

PushDustIn retweeted a very (and I mean VERY) insightful video of someone predicting the Fighters Pass Vol. 2 characters using math.

Even math is in Geno's favor.

 

[Lord Woomy]

Even math is in Geno's favor.

I never thought my arch nemesis would help me so much in my darkest hour

 

[Luis27]

This one goes for my Latinoamerican bros xD

Its the first i make xD

 

[Hot_N_Tasty]

PushDustIn retweeted a very (and I mean VERY) insightful video of someone predicting the Fighters Pass Vol. 2 characters using math.

I can get behind that math but those predictions were pretty off the wall. But Geno/ Sirfetch'd isnt a bad draw.

 

[Izanagi97]

I can get behind that math but those predictions were pretty off the wall. But Geno/ Sirfetch'd isnt a bad draw.

Though I should mention that no prediction method will be 100% perfect.

 

[Polarthief]

PushDustIn retweeted a very (and I mean VERY) insightful video of someone predicting the Fighters Pass Vol. 2 characters using math.

(not spoiling)
That's quite a spread. I was like "Oh this might be actually legit" after DLC 6 is shown, but at 7, I was like "... oh, we're going nonsense then, are we?". Great ending though, but I hope it doesn't take *that* long. I'd also be pretty stoked if #9 got in, but I highly doubt they would.

Edit: Guys, only 2600 posts til we hit 2500 pages/10000 posts. What if the second the 10,000th post is up, Geno is instantly revealed because Sakurai's actually a secret watcher of this thread?

 

[Dorayaki]

*looks around* Hi Belmont Bros. King K. Rool and Banjo-Kazooie. None of you guys have gotten a game in forever (Nuts & Bolts barely counts)? None of you *will* get a new game anytime soon and if you do it's likely because of your inclusion? How did you guys get into Smash Ultimate?.

You seen to misunderstand, the controversies around the current Smash fighters still exist. Like I said long time ago, such as the fact Nintendo don't try to add KRool to newer Mario games after his Smash entry is still much criticized. It is same if same thing happens to Geno.

And we're talking about the character's whose franchise is still running so Banjo, Duck or Simon is hardly part of the topic.

Exactly. There's no point to pay out the ass for the tiny cameo..

Wait, do you agree with this or not?

*looks around* Hi Belmont Bros. King K. Rool and Banjo-Kazooie. None of you guys have gotten a game in forever (Nuts & Bolts barely counts)? None of you *will* get a new game anytime soon and if you do it's likely because of your inclusion? How did you guys get into Smash Ultimate?

The thing is though is that SE is sitting on a ton of just dead characters. Practically every character from FF not in 7, let alone Geno (and Mallow?). What's a few more?



Exactly. There's no point to pay out the ass for the tiny cameo.



Definitely true, but I can't help but feel his popularity has only increased. I mean hell, he has a whole discord dedicated to him, a handful of YouTubers who advocate for him, PapaGenos getting his own namesake from the guy, this thread getting up to 2.4k (and counting) pages; does any other wanted character have anywhere close to that many?.

The problem is social media has run for years, not like it's the only viable marketing research source if the Smash 4 ballot also wasn't necessary already.

And like said, what disappoint fans is that Geno still doesn't get much progress in returning to new games, the whole argument has always been whether the games really reflect on fans demand and wishes.

 

[TriggerX]

See, it's good **** like this that keeps me from going completely insane.

Not only are you supportive without really knowing the character personally, but you understand his situation and you bridge the gap with us on getting a character that we love. On top of that, you recognize how some of these characters in the game already are insane picks that anyone with a greedy mind like EA or Activision/Blizzard or GameFreak wouldn't ever bother with such a thing because it's what fans want in spite of what they tend to say with their wallets. It's what the fans say with their hearts and minds. K. Rool honestly is a huge deal and there were so many naysayers for many reasons, and a lot of them were solid because, as much as I hate to say it since I love K. Rool and grew up with old DK, he had become forgotten by the industry.

Thank you very much for this.


Hold on, did you just say evidence means different things to different people? No, evidence is solid facts that prove whether something is true or false. What you are referring to is more circumstantial evidence, in which it COULD be evidence or it could not be, since it's not air-tight solid.

See guys, people like this exist who will find holes (or poke holes when there aren't ones to be found, whether the holes mean anything or not) in arguments that are not air-tight. THIS is why I mention that if speculation gets nutty or drives you crazy, remember the base facts that are 100% true that are in Geno's favor. Remember that we have so much going for us without all the questionable stuff.

As for you SpiritOfRuin and others like Dorayaki I will hit you with the stuff that you cannot debate with.

~Ultimate has been catering to the Smash fanbase more than any other in the series. From longstanding requests () to newer requests () to not cutting a single character to returning all the previously cut characters to all the stages and all the music to all the modes to including a story mode again. Ever since the base game, this game has been giving to it's fans, and mostly to fans who have been around since the beginning too. DLC hasn't changed this either, as both and are longstanding requests while was a newer one. In fact, the fact that we are getting DLC is more proof of fan catering as fans of Smash would never want the new content to end. Thus, we have undeniable proof of fan catering and favoring older fans...and where does Geno fall in line here? That's right: longstanding fan request, and the final really big one to be honest. This is in Geno's favor, no debates.

~Sakurai has gone on record to state that ever since Brawl, he's tried to get Geno in, but it hasn't worked out. Brawl days was likely due to Square and Nintendo still not being on the best terms. Smash 4 days was likely due to time constraints and Square wanting to push FF and knowing that was overall the better choice. Ultimate's base I wouldn't be surprised if there was an attempt but that is speculation...what isn't speculation is that we still have more character coming to the game as we speak and Sakurai spoke to us in a breakdown that he wants to add more worlds into Smash to celebrate gaming as well as fufill more fan requests. This is clearly all in Geno's favor as now both Final Fantasy and Dragon Quest are no longer in his way, which makes him the next big picks since Sora is a Disney character and every other Square character that is requested is much less requested than him and has been requested for a much shorter time then him.

~We have all pretty much come to accept that if a costume of your character shows up without that character already being announced, they are likely not coming into the game. This is once of the few "fan rules" or an actual pattern that has yet to be broken since the introduction of Mii Costumes, much like Assist Trophies. It can be broken, but it has yet to be broken. However, in a strange twist of fate, Geno's costume has yet to return. Many people are arguing over why and the circumstances around it, but the simple facts are that A. It hasn't returned, B. They had three perfect opportunities to have it return, what with a Square-focused character and two 'dumps' in which big franchises got both new and returning costumes, yet it didn't happen and C. Negotiations for the costume would have been done already with Geno's likeness due to his Spirit and icon, and his costume is just free money for Square, so there is no reason for it to have not returned yet if they planned on it returning. All of these things are facts that cannot be debated about and they all support Geno's chances, and even some of the speculation like each costume line-up having two returning costumes but Wave 2 didn't or how Wave 2 oddly has fewer costumes than any other wave, tings that are facts but don't directly support Geno are strong as well. His costume not returning thus far is clearly in his favor.

These three solid bits of evidence are all you need in Geno's court. You cannot debate that these things may or may not exist, and you cannot argue that these things may or may not be in Geno's favor.

LET'S GO GENOBROS~!

So im going to play devils advocate, because most people on this board will see some of those points as debatable.

So I think your first point is probably the most sound, but it ignores other patterns as well. They are all fan requests, but each of those characters play major reoccurring roles in the series they were introduced in. They are also part of series that continue to grow. At this point they are basically a different caliber of character than Geno is. While I do think the demand for Geno is there, he is basically equivalent to a character like some of the allies you pick up in paper Mario.


Despite Cloud and Hero already being in the game Geno still has a few competitors within Square. Nier and Tomb Raider with the latter being one of Squares biggest money makers. Although I wouldn’t say the character Lara Croft is recognizable as much as Mario, the series itself is and is pretty much a cultural icon. Hopefully it’s 100% up to Nintendo, because honestly I can’t see square pushing for anything SMRPG or Kingdom Hearts.

As far as the costume thing goes, I could be wrong but I was under the assumption the chocobo costume is missing as well? That’s the biggest flaw in that logic. While A,B,C, could be outcomes, the chocobo costume being missing in addition to opens up another option to take. Another Square character, and those 2 costumes returning.

While I’m all for believing maybe his lore might play a role in a spirit upgrade, his situation isn’t really different from a character like Tails and Knuckles who received costumes later despite already having spirits in the game.

Basically at this point the whole argument is based off the notion that Nintendo won’t disappoint its fans. Which in their defense, no matter which characters they chose there will be disappointment and joy.

Either way i do have to agree with Spiritofruin, “evidence” if you even want to call it that , is twisted to fit a lot of biased views on this board.