Official General Post-DLC Discussion [Closed]

[Runic_SSB]

Johnknight1 The base game had way more than just 3 stages and characters going on at once, and only lasted about 3x longer than that. So, yes, it is possible. Also, the condescension isn't necessary.

 

[Burruni]

Johnknight1 The base game had way more than just 3 stages and characters going on at once, and only lasted about 3x longer than that. So, yes, it is possible. Also, the condescension isn't necessary.

And it had far more than x3 the amount of staff making it. Sakurai's stressed repeatedly how small the team is and how they've been trying to scrape all that they can for the game.

 

[Schnee117]

Johnknight1 The base game had way more than just 3 stages and characters going on at once, and only lasted about 3x longer than that. So, yes, it is possible. Also, the condescension isn't necessary.

The base game also had a far bigger team working on it and had to get to a deadline. The DLC team is considerably smaller and can be more lax in terms of deadlines as evidenced by multiple updates without characters.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Johnknight1 The base game had way more than just 3 stages and characters going on at once, and only lasted about 3x longer than that. So, yes, it is possible. Also, the condescension isn't necessary.

Actually, the base game not only had a larger team and budget, but also the ability to re-use a lot of Brawl's assets

 

[Sceptile4Smash]

Are people really complaining about ? Really? -_-
I don't have much experience with the Final Fantasy franchise but I was hyped. Sure, I would have preferred or Sceptile but we're talking about ANOTHER 3rd party character here. Who cares if we have a lot of swordfighters? That's like saying we have too many Brawlers in Street Fighter.

Swordfighters:
There is like 50 characters in the game, only 10 of them are swordfighters. The Smash community can make some of the most weirdest 'rules'. You're not making the game guys, we're lucky getting DLC at all.

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

Has anyone legitimately considered that maybe...just MAYBE the ballot wasn't meant for this game, but the future of Smash? I don't know. If December is the last of the DLC (I know that isn't what they said, but it very well could be), I would have a hard time believing that they busted out a character in that short of a time frame.
----
I really feel as if the remaining DLC, as Johnknight1 said was planned. I feel like there is little to no chance that they just came up with these ideas.

That said, there is really only a handful of characters I can see getting revealed in December. They are: K.Rool, Isaac, Wolf, Snake, Inklings and...that's pretty much it. That is of course we get TWO more curveballs, which we could.

I know some are thinking Banjo is coming, but I still doubt it. While Cloud wasn't expected in pretty much any capacity, he's owned by Square Enix. SE is a 3rd party, not owned by anybody. Banjo is owned by Rare, which is owned by Microsoft. Not only are you paying for usage of the character, but costs for amiibo, etc...If they're making an amiibo for a Microsoft owned character, then there'd have to be compatibility somewhere. That alone makes negotiations difficult. I don't see it happening myself.

Then again, I could have said the same for Cloud.

 

[PrettyIvyPearls22]

Are people really complaining about ? Really? -_-
I don't have much experience with the Final Fantasy franchise but I was hyped. Sure, I would have preferred or Sceptile but we're talking about ANOTHER 3rd party character here. Who cares if we have a lot of swordfighters? That's like saying we have too many Brawlers in Street Fighter.

Swordfighters:
There is like 50 characters in the game, only 10 of them are swordfighters. The Smash community can make some of the most weirdest 'rules'. You're not making the game guys, we're lucky getting DLC at all.

Yeah, people seem to forget how many characters there are in this game. There's variety for everyone people. Stop complaining about who has what in the roster, at least they are all somewhat different from each other, its like chill out, its not that serious.

 

[Burruni]

How dare nobody talk about the issue of the clear over-representation of Blonde haired people in Smash!

For something filled with so many "anime swordsmen," we have nobody with green hair!

GAWD!

...Wait....

no we good.

Edit: I've been sitting on this for about 10 minutes and I'm upset nobody said "But what about ?"

 

[Bradli Wartooth]

How dare nobody talk about the issue of the clear over-representation of Blonde haired people in Smash!

For something filled with so many "anime swordsmen," we have nobody with green hair!

GAWD!

...Wait....

no we good.

Wait... If Sheik is blonde... And Zelda has brown hair... Are they actually the same?

 

[Burruni]

Wait... If Sheik is blonde... And Zelda has brown hair... Are they actually the same?

is blonde because she's OoT Zelda.

is one of two major incarnations that are brunettes.

 

[NintenZ]

So why is SK higher than Shantae? In fact, why is he higher than WR, at this point his chances has basically boiled into nothing.

 

[Burruni]

So why is SK higher than Shantae? In fact, why is he higher than WR, at this point his chances has basically boiled into nothing.

He isn't higher, in that listing. He's on the same tier.
Which, overall, is fair.

Shantae and Butt-Butt clenching onto that hope of a felt need for an indie character and Blunder Red's game suffered from nichety, terrible advertisement, and being too early in the WiiU's abysmal life cycle to sell well.

 

[Johnknight1]

Johnknight1 The base game had way more than just 3 stages and characters going on at once, and only lasted about 3x longer than that.

The Smash 4 DLC staff is considerably smaller though. Most of the Smash 4 development staff has either gone to work on something Soul Calibur, Tekken x Street Fighter, something something Tales, Tekken 7, or Pokken.

There's a reason 2 years ago Bamco had a job listing for "Smash 5," and it was for post-release DLC.

Also, again, the contract negotiations alone from April on would take up like 4 months. Pre-development would take up a month or 2. That means development would have started in either September or October. Honestly... if the Smash DLC staff worked that fast on a character and stage, the roster would be 100 characters long by now.

Edit: Also, I wasn't trying to come off as rude, but rather show how unreasonable that demand schedule is. Developers work their butts off and are super efficient, but they aren't that crazy efficient. They aren't 20 super computers combined.

I mean, just to make Roy and Mewtwo in PM took well over 10,000 hours of combined work, and that was after ported data from Melee. Considering the WiiU is basically a 2 generation jump and that this game is an actually sold game with higher expectations and graphical and physics-based demands, it would take considerably longer to make.

lol no Cloud's support was very minor everywhere, not to mention adding a character who was popular in the beginning of a poll doesn't mean the character will be popular in the endresults

Cloud support doesn't equal want though. While you're almost definitely right Cloud wasn't winning the ballot (I wouldn't be shocked if he was like 8th at best), he definitely has been a character a lot of Smash fans and non-Smash fans alike would have liked, as evident by the huge reaction.

After all, none of the Nintendo-owned Smash 4 characters got the massive reaction Cloud got; not even the Villager.

 

[NintenZ]

He isn't higher, in that listing. He's on the same tier.
Which, overall, is fair.

Shantae and Butt-Butt clenching onto that hope of a felt need for an indie character and Blunder Red's game suffered from nichety, terrible advertisement, and being too early in the WiiU's abysmal life cycle to sell well.

What about Snake Eater?

 

[Burruni]

What about Snake Eater?

Konami.

At this point, Konami has become that kid in elementary school who's sit in the corner of the room at lunch time eating paste and wiped their mouth with construction paper but had awesome toys that people want to play with but they just keep smashing them into walls and never wanting to share.

 

[Johnknight1]

And okay, my brother who watches the Japanese Direct told me the Japanese Direct actually says that the December Smash Bros broadcast will be the last special presentation for Smash Wii U/3DS, not sure if this means there will be no major updates... so I'm not gonna make a thread about this yet.

Or this could just tells us that there will no more Smash focus presentations when they announce new characters?

It will be the last Smash WiiU/3DS Direct. There were only 2 before: one back in mid-early 2014 with the confirmation of ZSS, Sheik, Charizard, and Greninja (along with a lot of gameplay, item, content, Smash 3DS, and stage stuff), and the 51 Fact Extravaganza one back at the end of 2014 that confirmed Mewtwo as DLC amongst other WiiU-related things.

Oh, and there was a Smash "special presentation" Direct at E3 this year, where we got Ryu and Roy confirmed, amongst other things.

So yeah... it's not a huge deal, other than to indicate 2016 is almost definitely the last year of Smash 3DS/WiiU DLC.

 

[Wolfie557]

Since December is when we will get our last Smash presentation, which likely means DLC to go out with a bang, I decided to make my FINAL DLC Wishlist.

I don't expect there to be that many, but if just 1 character from here will become DLC, I will be satisfied with all of the DLC in general. : ))

Don't judge ma choices.

How dare nobody talk about the issue of the clear over-representation of Blonde haired people in Smash!

For something filled with so many "anime swordsmen," we have nobody with green hair!

GAWD!

...Wait....

no we good.

Can't believe you did not think of: ... :/

 

[Ura]

Konami.

At this point, Konami has become that kid in elementary school who's sit in the corner of the room at lunch time eating paste and wiped their mouth with construction paper but had awesome toys that people want to play with but they just keep smashing them into walls and never wanting to share.

Not gonna lie, I was sorta like that in elementary school.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Cloud support doesn't equal want though. While you're almost definitely right Cloud wasn't winning the ballot (I wouldn't be shocked if he was like 8th at best), he definitely has been a character a lot of Smash fans and non-Smash fans alike would have liked, as evident by the huge reaction.

I'm aware Cloud's popular, though I'm certain he's like Ryu. Not because of fan demand, but because of their overall popularity. Both would have been wild cards too if it wasn't for Ryu being leaked

 

[Burruni]

Since December is when we will get our last Smash presentation, which likely means DLC to go out with a bang, I decided to make my FINAL DLC Wishlist.
View attachment 82766
I don't expect there to be that many, but if just 1 character from here will become DLC, I will be satisfied with all of the DLC in general. : ))

Don't judge ma choices.

Can't believe you did not think of: ... :/

Between me posing it and you posting the resonse I made an edit about nobody citing me intentionally ignoring Paletuna, the Fish of Light.

Sorry, dear.

 

[Wolfie557]

Between me posing it and you posting the resonse I made an edit about nobody citing me intentionally ignoring Paletuna, the Fish of Light.

Sorry, dear.

That's, Goddess of Light, to you sir. Notice how I put so many Palutena's so that you can remember.

 

[Johnknight1]

I'm aware Cloud's popular, though I'm certain he's like Ryu. Not because of fan demand, but because of their overall popularity. Both would have been wild cards too if it wasn't for Ryu being leaked

True. Cloud doesn't really transcend gaming as a multimedia icon like Ryu, Sonic, Snake, or Pac-Man do. He also isn't a constant figure in his series as his series "reboots" almost every time, much like Fire Emblem (although usually they're totally different canons).

Still, he is the franchise's most prominent character.

Cloud is also the most popular traditional RPG character and 3rd party character of the 5th generation of gaming, similar to Ryu with traditional fighting games and modern arcade games.

 

[NintenZ]

Guys, I found how Cloud got in Smash!

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Still, he is the franchise's most prominent character.

Making him pretty much THE JRPG character in gaming tbh

 

[Johnknight1]

Making him pretty much THE JRPG character in gaming tbh

You can take out the "pretty much part," because it is obvious you are right.

I 100% agree though. It isn't even close really. Who's even the second most popular JRPG character? Crono from Chrono Trigger? Viivi from FFIX? Tidus from FF X?

Heck, who from Western RPG's is even remotely as popular? Maybe Commander Shepard if you really stretch things.

 

[NintenZ]

Does anybody think Steve Burton will come back to voice again, or will he just be voiced by his Japanese voice?

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Does anybody think Steve Burton will come back to voice again, or will he just be voiced by his Japanese voice?

Steve Burton wasn't in trailer sooooo...

 

[NintenZ]

Steve Burton wasn't in trailer sooooo...

Do you think his voice could be added later on?

 

[Johnknight1]

Barring contractual issues, at this point I think it's a mistake to keep Snake out. Adding Snake and Wolf would round out the veterans aside from the Pokemon vets and the Icies (which is fairly understandable) and would add to the all-star cast. That much is undeniable.

One thing to note as well is the fact that we have 2 character slots in the data, along with one stage. There were 3 and 2 respectively prior to Cloud.

Something tells me that one of the remaining characters is getting a stage. The character getting a stage COULD be from a veteran series, but no veteran as DLC has gotten a stage so I doubt Wolf is getting a stage. K.Rool, despite being a newcomer, might not get a stage because he's from a veteran series. To me, that leaves either Snake returning with Shadow Moses Island, or a character like the Inklings coming with a stage of their own.

If both slots are veterans, the only 2 that would come with a stage are Ice Climbers or Snake.

Considering that the only veteran that wouldn't come with a stage is Wolf and the 3 cut Pokémon (and Young Link), I think we can lock in Wolf's roster spot almost definitively in this forthcoming DLC pack.

Well, 17 place is somewhat remarkable, but still not that high. Certainly not enough to convince an initially neutral or even reluctant Sakurai. So considering that, and that Cloud seems to be almost complete, I think it's safe to say that it was a Sakurai idea, and that the deal beetween Square Enix and Nintendo was sealed at least shortly before Ryu was released, if not even before.

Cloud wasn't high on lists because few thought he was even a real candidate. After Snake was announced in Brawl, Cloud was clearly the #2 most wanted 3rd party character after Sonic, ahead of even Mega Man. It wasn't until "reality" set in that demand for Cloud support died down (and it died down FAST). Cloud has always been the #1 "pipe dream" a lot of people have wanted (after Sonic) in Smash, and now, he's in. It goes to show that the developers are listening.

Has anyone legitimately considered that maybe...just MAYBE the ballot wasn't meant for this game, but the future of Smash? I don't know. If December is the last of the DLC (I know that isn't what they said, but it very well could be), I would have a hard time believing that they busted out a character in that short of a time frame.

There is not a snowball's chance in hell the staff working on Smash 4 DLC would approve of this. They want to know who people want so they can make money off that.

Considering we've heard of zero staffer revolts or complaints like with Brawl (where everyone lost their crap), and that the development seems to be "laid back" and "deliberate," this seems to be clearly a designed end to the journey that is Smash WiiU and 3DS. Sakurai's wild ride has no end, but Smash 3DS and WiiU's post-development DLC sure do.

I really feel as if the remaining DLC, as Johnknight1 said was planned. I feel like there is little to no chance that they just came up with these ideas.

That said, there is really only a handful of characters I can see getting revealed in December. They are: K.Rool, Isaac, Wolf, Snake, Inklings and...that's pretty much it. That is of course we get TWO more curveballs, which we could.

I could actually see Rayman in there as well, but again, everything just keeps circling back to Wolf.

I do think the most likely scenario is we get Wolf with Snake and/or the Ice Climbers, but given how crazy the last 2 newcomers reveals have been, I don't even freaking known. I have a hard time seeing Snake absent when Smash 4 is done, but there's still a chance he could be held back for a later date.

I know some are thinking Banjo is coming, but I still doubt it. While Cloud wasn't expected in pretty much any capacity, he's owned by Square Enix. SE is a 3rd party, not owned by anybody. Banjo is owned by Rare, which is owned by Microsoft. Not only are you paying for usage of the character, but costs for amiibo, etc...If they're making an amiibo for a Microsoft owned character, then there'd have to be compatibility somewhere. That alone makes negotiations difficult. I don't see it happening myself.

Then again, I could have said the same for Cloud.

1. Xbox CEO Phil Spencer said he would be open to Banjo appearing in Smash.
2. I'm with you on this. I can believe it COULD happen and that Banjo has a chance, but I would have to see it to believe it. Like, even if the data for Banjo was leaked, it would take a trailer for me to fully believe.
3. Even then my mind still wouldn't really believe it until I played as Banjo in an 8-player Smash match with Mario, Donkey Kong, Ryu, Mega Man, Pac-Man, Sonic, and Cloud freaking Strife.

 

[jamesster445]

Does anybody think Steve Burton will come back to voice again, or will he just be voiced by his Japanese voice?

Probably, Xander Mobus has gone on record to say he hasn't recorded his line for Cloud yet. So they probably will get Burton to come in since they didn't even reveal a release date.


Ok can I get some clarity on something about the state of the "Mario" placeholders? After Mewtwo came out, 5 slots were found. The first three eventually becoming Lucas, Roy and Ryu, with the remaining 2 on hold.

1. Lucas
2. Roy
3. Ryu
4. (Cloud confirmed)
5. "Mario" Placeholder

Then about a month ago 3 more slots were "found". But when I looked at it it didn't take into account of the previous placeholder remainders. So I was always confused did we get 3 more placeholders or just one. Regardless it's fair to say that Cloud is taking the place of the fourth placeholder, but my question is do we have 4 remaining slots or 2?

 

[Johnknight1]

Odd how on the SWF smile list for Smash 4 is listed alphabetically while the ret of the 4 DLC characters are after teh alt characters.

Do you think his voice could be added later on?

Yes, just like how David Hayter's voice was added to Snake after his Brawl reveal.

 

[Burruni]

Probably, Xander Mobus has gone on record to say he hasn't recorded his line for Cloud yet. So they probably will get Burton to come in since they didn't even reveal a release date.


Ok can I get some clarity on something about the state of the "Mario" placeholders? After Mewtwo came out, 5 slots were found. The first three eventually becoming Lucas, Roy and Ryu, with the remaining 2 on hold.

1. Lucas
2. Roy
3. Ryu
4. (Cloud confirmed)
5. "Mario" Placeholder

Then about a month ago 3 more slots were "found". But when I looked at it it didn't take into account of the previous placeholder remainders. So I was always confused did we get 3 more placeholders or just one. Regardless it's fair to say that Cloud is taking the place of the fourth placeholder, but my question is do we have 4 remaining slots or 2?

April:

Mario -
Mario -
Mario -
Mario
Mario

October:




Mario -
Mario
Mario

 

[A Distant Demon]

Has anyone legitimately considered that maybe...just MAYBE the ballot wasn't meant for this game, but the future of Smash? =

I've entertained this idea quite a few times. The distinction of saying it could be used for future games was definitely made me believe it was a possibility.

It's why I voted for RIdley >_> But in the end I don't think it makes a lot of sense to make a ballot for this game and not at least use some of it for this game.

 

[Johnknight1]

I still strongly disagree with the sentiment that the Ballot wasn't meant for Smash 4. No way the Smash 4 devs at Bamco let Sakurai and Nintendo do that without making a lot of money to make said DLC.

However, having said that, I do think it will be used to inspire future playable character choices in future Smash entries. So this ballot will likely have quite a lot of long-term impact.

 

[NintenZ]

Time to make a BS conspiracy...

Does anybody think the ballot was made so Nintendo could produce more Amiibo?

 

[Burruni]

Time to make a BS conspiracy...

Does anybody think the ballot was made so Nintendo could produce more Amiibo?

Any DLC fighter would get an amiibo, the ballot has no causation.

 

[NintenZ]

Any DLC fighter would get an amiibo, the ballot has no causation.

Yeah, it was a joke...

 

[Burruni]

Yeah, it was a joke...

Sorry.
I... I can't tell with people sometimes.
Sorry.

 

[NintenZ]

Sorry.
I... I can't tell with people sometimes.
Sorry.

No it's okay, I understand.

 

[XalchemistX]

Never thought I'd see the day!!!
Next up is Goku!