Ok, first off. That's not slippery slope fallacy.
Second, you misunderstood what I said, that wasn't my point. The point I was making was how "less relevant" characters made it into Smash to prove how weak an argument "relevance" is.
I'm not changing definitions, I'm addressing the fallacy in misusing the meaning of a term to make it purely subjective.
And in the second part of this, you're proving my point, relevancy is a purely subjective experience.
There is no way to qualify "relevance" in purely objective terms. You state Kratos and Master Chief as irrelevant based on my statements, but miss the entire point, that identifying them as relevant or irrelevant is a futile endeavor. What criteria are we using to qualify this category? Kratos in fact has NOT had any games this gen, so by the criteria of some people around here, that would qualify as less relevant than other characters.
Likewise, where is the merit for impact within the industry in regard to this?
Is relevance referring to how recently a character has had a major release? Or to the impact within the industry? Mega Man for example qualifies in the latter and not the former, yet, you believe Master Chief to be relevant, thus, which is more relevant?
What about characters who'll have NO lasting appeal? Like Shulk. If you've played the XB games, you'll know he's only getting one game, and that's it. Thus, can we say he's relevat? And if so, how so?
This is absurd.
Why would it apply to one and not the other? Why must there be a distinction?
Again, this is just proving that "relevance" is just a purely subjective term. There are no objective grounds to define it. People merely make things up as they go, and they often times conflict with Sakurai's perception of things, leading people to say "oh, Sakurai just does what he wants" when in hindsight, a lot of Sakurai's decisions on the roster make a lot of sense.
But on what grounds do you claim to know what developers find popular, and how are you so certain that it aligns with what the fans find popular? We've already discussed a difference in taste due to generational differences. For a 90s kid like me, the likes of Rareware, SEGA and Capcom are far more important to the industry than Activision and Ubisoft, despite the fact the latter two dominate the current industry whole the former three mostly dwindled.
Many kiddies today genuinely believe Shovel Knight genuinely has a chance on the roster due to his current popularity, which to a younger mind, that doesn't have the perception of the full picture, that seems like a sensible conclusion. But to someone older, like me, I say, "not a chance in hell" because Shovel Knight is irrelevant in the grand scheme of things.
Sure, he's relevant now, but in the big picture, actually not at all.
Do you understand now how "relevance" is entirely subjective?
Except this is entirely false.
Banjo and Kazooie have still remained incredibly popular and beloved among the fans who grew up with them.
How quickly Yooka-Laylee got funded, the wildfire caused by Phil's tweet, and the amount of support they got in polls for the ballot all stand testament to this, and disprove your statement. In fact, DESPITE not having a game in years, the fact that they still have this much support and admiration, and this strong a fanbase, simply stands testament to how big they were in their peak. And if a true Banjo revival were to happen, a quality one I should clarify, I guarantee it would very quickly launch the two back on the radar. Hell, when Banjo-Threeie was first teased for 360, people went crazy, and it was one of the most hyped reveals of that E3, alongside Snake in Brawl. So there's evidence for this already.
See, you're mistaken, Banjo's fanbase hasn't dwindled, it has no reason to. The only thing that happened is that the industry has grown much bigger in the 15+ years they've been absent. But even still, this has happened to other characters as well:
And their importance in the industry hasn't been any lower.
You say "lasting popularity" but again, I bring up Shulk, where us his lasting popularity?
And as I've shown above, Banjo has demonstrated a considerable amount of lasting popularity for a character who's been out of the scene for over a decade?
So, again, what criteria are you gonna use to measure thus?
Number of appearances =/= popularity either. It simply = exposure.
Likewise, I don't see how that's dragging anyone down, since the perception one has of an icon is purely subjective. And one could argue the bear and bird are on over all equal standing as the blue bomber, especially since the rise and fall of 3D collectathons mirrors that of the rise and fall if 2D action platformers.
If anything, I've yet to see a convincing argument for why they wouldn't be on the same foothold as Snake.
Regardless of details however, as a former Nintendo mascot, the face of one of the most reputable and critically acclaimed devs in the history of gaming, and the kickstarter for the massive wave of mascots-based 3D collectathons (which Rayman, Crash, Spyro, Jak, and so many others, all tried to copy), I think their spot on the roster is well-earned.
See above.
And don't put words in my mouth, the only one arguing that relevacy can be a measurable trait here, is you. I'm arguing the opposite, tgat it's a meaningless, purely subjective trait that has no merit.
Well, there is no 3rd party out there as relevant to Nintendo (see now THIS is more objective due to being qualifyable, and well, actually using the word correctly as per its definition, rather than as a vague trait.) than Banjo, considering he was a former Nintendo mascot. Being owned by Microsoft means squat if he's had more games on Nintendo platforns, stood side by side with Mario, and is still remembered for his Nintendo games.
As for "how popular a character will be with the Smash community..."
Ha!!! Clearly Sakurai doesn't care about that all, considering Cloud, WFT, Ryu, Ridley, etc...
He only cares about this in regard to keeping vets, but he doesn't always listen to fan demands, hence Ridley.
And even still, the Smash community as far as Sakurai is concerned wants to see K.Rool, Isaac, and Banjo... So...
