Q&A Gameplay Q&A and General Discussion Thread

[OceloT42]

Guys could someone list Corrin's weaknesses and shut all these "CORRIN IS OP NERF NERF NERF" threads up.
Plus, it'll be good to know them while he's just out.

So let's say I hit someone with a charged DFS but they're not at kill percent. What's the optimal damage follow up? Is it fair strings? Footstool shinanigans? Dragon Lunge combos?

Normally I go for a dash or Fair or a good hard DL read.
Charge another DFS, surprisingly works sometimes.Don't spam tho.
Enjoy!

 

[LordShade67]

So, couple questions.
1. DThrow vs. UThrow. Which kills more reliably?
2. Is SH Dragon Lunge practical? I mean in terms of using it for kills and the like.

 

[OceloT42]

So, couple questions.
1. DThrow vs. UThrow. Which kills more reliably?
2. Is SH Dragon Lunge practical? I mean in terms of using it for kills and the like.

Uthrow is better for kills IMO, I seem to kill much earlier with it.
And yes, in fact SHDL should be one of your go-to killers, if you can land the tip it's very rewarding.

 

[Eureka]

Up throw kills about 10% earlier and has a more vertical angle so it's less affected by DI, so use that for kills.

 

[KCB: Cloth]

Hey guys, just found out Corrin can do the lagless ledge get-up. Ill be testing on more stages asap!

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Fpj1I6E7MRA

 

[JediLink]

It's a fairly well-known tech called B Reverse. Simply input the opposite direction within a few frames after pressing B.

Here's a vid explaining it pretty well.[/MEDIA]

Yep, that's it. I knew about B reversing but I always assumed you could only do it in the air cause that's how it's usually shown being used. I guess it actually does work on the ground too. Thanks.

 

[Merfect]

So, couple questions.
1. DThrow vs. UThrow. Which kills more reliably?
2. Is SH Dragon Lunge practical? I mean in terms of using it for kills and the like.

Uthrow kills slightly earlier, but after hearing about it somewhere and doing some testing, Dthrow scales more with rage. So if you have rage backing you up, Dthrow kills slightly earlier.
Haven't tested with DI though.

 

[Delzethin]

What are our best options for punishing if an opponent lands behind us? I keep dsmashing out of shield, and it's a bad idea and I know it's a bad idea but I keep doing it as a reflex for some stupid reason because I can't think of an alternative.

 

[fuzzissast]

Final edit: Nevermind, pardon..............

 

[Naragacu]

Man, fsmash looks like it beats Fox Illusion and whatever Falco's is called pretty soundly. I did a few matches with a Falco who liked to go to the ledge, jump and then use it to get back on stage and it got caught in the charge hitbox or interrupted by the actual fsmash every single time.

The up b they tried to hit me with did get through the charge hitbox a few times, though.

 

[OceloT42]

Man, fsmash looks like it beats Fox Illusion and whatever Falco's is called pretty soundly. I did a few matches with a Falco who liked to go to the ledge, jump and then use it to get back on stage and it got caught in the charge hitbox or interrupted by the actual fsmash every single time.

The up b they tried to hit me with did get through the charge hitbox a few times, though.

If I'm not wrong, Corrin is the only character in SSB4 to have a smash charging hitbox, and the second in Smash history to have it.
Who was the first?

 

[Delzethin]

If I'm not wrong, Corrin is the only character in SSB4 to have a smash charging hitbox, and the second in Smash history to have it.
Who was the first?

Ness had one on his dsmash in Melee and Brawl...but it was mainly a defensive tool; it didn't link into the main hit like Corrin's fsmash does.

 

[KCB: Cloth]

I have no choice, but to join the battle for high tier

 

[GemZ]

Okay so like, I'm new to this whole labbing thing but I'm killing earlier with D throw on Dreamland as opposed to Upthrow by like 3 percent or so on the top platform vs Shiek.

Dthrow kills training mode Shiek at 100

Up throw kills at 104 percent.

I'll try other scenarios but I was playing an actual match and I killed Bowser at 116 percent on the ground with D Throw. I was 150 + rage but that's very early, considering how heavy Bowser is.

EDIT

Okay so, on Final Destination D throw kills at 142 and U throw kills at 138.

So... the higher up you are the better d throw is? I'm confused.

 

[Nah]

Does anyone know if you can (S)DI out of the Fsmash charge hitbox? I've gotten a few kills by holding people in place with the chainsaw and striking with a fully charged Fsmash (since the sourspot kills at reasonable percents at max charge), but I don't know if that's a legit kill method or if people just haven't figured out how to escape it.

What are our best options for punishing if an opponent lands behind us? I keep dsmashing out of shield, and it's a bad idea and I know it's a bad idea but I keep doing it as a reflex for some stupid reason because I can't think of an alternative.

Nair OoS maybe?

 

[Mr. Potatobadger]

Does anyone know if you can (S)DI out of the Fsmash charge hitbox? I've gotten a few kills by holding people in place with the chainsaw and striking with a fully charged Fsmash (since the sourspot kills at reasonable percents at max charge), but I don't know if that's a legit kill method or if people just haven't figured out how to escape it.

Yea, I've practiced with a buddy of mine. SDIing out is actually pretty easy to do. If you're trying to get out of the charge, you have 2 options.

One, do everything you can to get out by SDing. Mash jump, if you can jump out you will.

Two, airdodge or jump right before actual attack connects. For this reason, you want to mix up your timings for when you actually release the attack.

If you can time it perfectly, they won't be able to escape and you'll still get the kill since you're so close to fully charged.

Oh, and if you want to get out you want to SDI up and away.

 

[StarForce]

I had secured to be a Corrin main since reveal. Glad She can backup the talk. (She actually Bites and does not bark ^_^) Indeed she has some great gameplay. Any advice to linking upsmash from anything? I tend to use that as reflex when someone is around my head. So yeah it's also a bummer Dragon Lunge can't actually be cancelled. Haven't tried yet but is the short lunge hop usefull for added recovery? Again I haven't tried my offstage recovery options yet.

 

[Mr. Potatobadger]

I had secured to be a Corrin main since reveal. Glad She can backup the talk. (She actually Bites and does not bark ^_^) Indeed she has some great gameplay. Any advice to linking upsmash from anything? I tend to use that as reflex when someone is around my head. So yeah it's also a bummer Dragon Lunge can't actually be cancelled. Haven't tried yet but is the short lunge hop usefull for added recovery? Again I haven't tried my offstage recovery options yet.

I don't think you can actually link upsmash from anything, (maybe dtilt to upsmash at low percents?...) however, you can use it a lot like Marth's. From what I've tried, it can beat out Cloud's Dair, among other things like Bowser Bomb and such. It can't beat out Toon Link's dair, which makes me sad. I personally don't think the hop is useful for recovery. Plus, I'm P. sure you can only use it when grounded.

Speaking of canceling the dragon lunge.

This morning I was messing around with corrin and I am 100% sure I cancelled the pin. I pinned someone and somehow landed on my feet after it connected. I have no clue how it happened or how to make it happen again, but I'm pretty convinced that there's a way to cancel the move without actually waiting a while.

 

[StarForce]

Is it possible to cancel the Lunge only when pinning an opponent then? By any chance it was not auto cancel by the opponent mashing buttons to free right? I'll keep into this. There has to be a way to cancel it. You just can't wait it out. The trailer can't be that wrong or ambiguous to when it specifically can.

 

[Mr. Potatobadger]

Is it possible to cancel the Lunge only when pinning an opponent then? By any chance it was not auto cancel by the opponent mashing buttons to free right? I'll keep into this. There has to be a way to cancel it. You just can't wait it out. The trailer can't be that wrong or ambiguous to when it specifically can.

I agree. There literally has to be some way.

 

[Icedmana]

This morning I was messing around with corrin and I am 100% sure I cancelled the pin.

You remember if you were falling and landed the pin, doing an instant, or doing it from a side+b hop?

 

[Mr. Potatobadger]

You remember if you were falling and landed the pin, doing an instant, or doing it from a side+b hop?

Instant

 

[FMHappy]

Whats better for approaching, nair or fair? Also how do you auto cancel them, I was never really good at autocaneling, so I never got into the habit of doing so.

 

[False Sense]

What are our best options for punishing if an opponent lands behind us? I keep dsmashing out of shield, and it's a bad idea and I know it's a bad idea but I keep doing it as a reflex for some stupid reason because I can't think of an alternative.

Theoretically, if you can pull it off, you could try instant Dragon Lunge.

 

[Mr. Potatobadger]

Whats better for approaching, nair or fair? Also how do you auto cancel them, I was never really good at autocaneling, so I never got into the habit of doing so.

What to approach with is situational. Nair is usually better over all, but fair is a good option in the same way it is with Roy.

I wouldn't worry about autocancelling, it isn't too important with Corrin and you won't be using it often, if at all.

 

[OceloT42]

I'd like to point out that it may be possible for charging Fsmash to beat attempted Ganoncide.
Also, hello Delzethin and False Sense nice to see you peeps here from the speculation thread.
Fellow Corrin mains, any advice on how to break shield with bite?
And, how much does Fsmash eat up shield, with charging and hit?

 

[Simperheve]

I've noticed that if you use Side-B to hop on the ground, you can only fire the Lance in the same direction, whereas if you SH you can Side-B to fire the Lance in either direction. Can someone else try this as well to confirm it?

 

[OceloT42]

I've noticed that if you use Side-B to hop on the ground, you can only fire the Lance in the same direction, whereas if you SH you can Side-B to fire the Lance in either direction. Can someone else try this as well to confirm it?

Yes it is. Confirmed, and pretty obvious.

 

[Icedmana]

Instant

I tried a bunch of inputs on 1/4 time at various parts of the move but didn't find anything. http://pastebin.com/RTdTMMa6
Wouldn't consider it definitive, I'm still bad at the game

Damage knocks corrin out of it of course so maybe there was there a hit box out? Any other details you remember about the situation (positioning?) and what character you were against?

 

[Zionaze]

Sometimes my DFS doesnt stun on hit. What makes this happen?

 

[sunfallSeraph]

Sometimes my DFS doesnt stun on hit. What makes this happen?

I've noticed this as well. I suspect there's a brief period after stunning someone in which they cannot be re-stunned, similar to the regrab window where you cannot grab someone again immediately after having grabbed them. I'm sure this is in place to prevent stun-lock infinites such as the one ZSS had on Robin back in the 3DS days.

 

[Zionaze]

They must have increased the period because i hit them with a DFS after i fthrew them

 

[sunfallSeraph]

They must have increased the period because i hit them with a DFS after i fthrew them

Really? That's interesting. Perhaps stun is also taken into consideration with the regrab window? This is the first I've heard of it, but until now ZSS was the only other character with a non-custom stun move, so I suppose that's not surprising. It's possible they just implemented this mechanic in the latest patch to avoid some stun-locks Corrin might've been able to do in testing.

 

[LevinViolin]

They must have increased the period because i hit them with a DFS after i fthrew them

You can't get stunned twice in the air, you must've stunned them, grabbed them, threw them, then tried to stun them again or something along those lines.
People have to touch the ground before they can be stunned again.

What are our best options for punishing if an opponent lands behind us? I keep dsmashing out of shield, and it's a bad idea and I know it's a bad idea but I keep doing it as a reflex for some stupid reason because I can't think of an alternative.

Sort of a late reply, but I've been having a similar problem, and I've been thinking about Corrin's general "strategy flow." It seem like at a distance, he has a lot of moves to keep you at a distance, up close he has a lot of moves that send the opponent upwards. this usually results in people being launched above him (duh), so naturally they try to get behind you. I think this is where bair comes into play because it "auto-spaces." It seems like the optimal way to play as Corrin is to keep people at a distance around mid stage until you can get in close for combos, then sort of "retreat" to the other end of the stage with bair.

 

[FullmetalPain]

Seems like up-throw AND down-throw are kill throws. down-throw does 9% and up-throw does 10%. Use up throw for damage since it does the most and use down-throw for the kill since up throw will be stale by the time their percent is high enough for the KO.

down-throw is basically your fresh kill throw.

Edit: Seems like they both do 9%, but i noticed both will do 10% after a second throw. So use one for damage and keep one throw fresh so it kills in the later percents

 

[Nu~]

I'm pretty sure many of you already know that tipper jab pulls opponents in slightly. Jab 1 > grab OR Jab 1 > Dtilt > grab seem like good mixups when opponents get into your jab range.

 

[JesterJaded]

Can anyone here explain this?

 

[OceloT42]

Seems like up-throw AND down-throw are kill throws. down-throw does 9% and up-throw does 10%. Use up throw for damage since it does the most and use down-throw for the kill since up throw will be stale by the time their percent is high enough for the KO.

down-throw is basically your fresh kill throw.

Edit: Seems like they both do 9%, but i noticed both will do 10% after a second throw. So use one for damage and keep one throw fresh so it kills in the later percents

There's also the added benefit of a dragon stomping down on their sorry ass.
Honestly, I never get tired of whipping out her dragon form.It's so...majestic.
Many of my friends say Corrin is OP.I disagree, of course, the only thing is her counter kills much earlier than others due to vertical trajectory, not to mention it's 1.3x multiplier.(Eat your hearts out, Mac and Shulk).
A shoutout to Nu~ who was there on the original thread.He was(and is) one of my favourite posters, and certainly knows his stuff.

 

[Reizilla]

Edit: Okay multiquote doesn't work on mobile?

Delzethin if someone lands behind you at a distance, Instant Pin is a great followup. Does good damage, sends them off stage and can kill at higher percents. If they're too close for you to pin, you can try nair OoS for potential followups, or charge Fsmash for damage/kill if they don't know how to get out.

LordShade67 GemZ and pretty much everyone else... Dthrow has a higher base knockback than Uthrow, meaning it will send them farther at lower percents. Uthrow has a higher Knockback growth, so eventually it will catch up and send farther than Dthrow. That's why Dthrow kills earlier on a really high platform, because Uthrow hasn't caught up yet. From the floor, Uthrow will kill first. But rage messes that up, since it increases base knockback, meaning if you have high rage (100%+) Dthrow will be a better kill option.

Nah Mr. Potatobadger You can also get out of charge Fsmash by SDIing down and powershielding. What I'm curious to know is if a partial charge connects better than full charge. Unfortunately I can't test this atm.

Zionaze if an opponent is falling or moving away quickly there are times where stun will activate but weird hurtboxes cause it to just barely whiff. This happens with ZSS too. You just have ti make sure that you're really on target when trying to stun an opponent in the air.

 

[Deleted member]

Seems like up-throw AND down-throw are kill throws. down-throw does 9% and up-throw does 10%. Use up throw for damage since it does the most and use down-throw for the kill since up throw will be stale by the time their percent is high enough for the KO.

down-throw is basically your fresh kill throw.

Edit: Seems like they both do 9%, but i noticed both will do 10% after a second throw. So use one for damage and keep one throw fresh so it kills in the later percents

Don't stale either imo.
Reason being is that Down Throw deals more knockback with rage than Up Throw.
Making it good when you have rage on a platform, etc...
BUT
Up Throw is your main Kill Throw.
If you do use either of them early in a match...ALWAYS pummel!
Mainly use Forward/Back Throw for spacing and resetting the neutral. You can use Down Throw to add pressure since they go in the air, but make sure to pummel to refresh...