Q&A Game Play Advice and General Discussion

[Shaya]

Probably worth giving it a go there then.
If it doesn't really have a response you would like to see I will consider bringing it back here.

 

[Clockzarb]

Hi,

I am new to this forum full of informations. I registered so I could ask about "training program". I have always wanted to become better at fighting games but everytime I launch the game I find myself wandering into training mode with no idea about what to do or what goals I should set to follow my progression.

Any tips? How do pro smash players practice when alone with no sparring budies? (Yes I am aware playing versus humans is important but I have a bad connection and work does not give me enough spare time to meet other players - I understand I will never be a great player, I just want to have fun learning the game and becomming decent at it).

Ps : is there a french community that you know of?

Regards,

Olivier

Hi Olivier,

I'm from Strasbourg (France) and recently joined a nice french smash community. Look for Meltdown. These are gaming bars and it's where you should look for if you're trying to find IRL communities in any video game. In Strasbourg we have a nice little smash community with tournaments every Monday. If you live near a large city, there's probably have a Meltdown not far, and maybe a smash community within.

To get better I would advise you to watch a lot of smash too. I've always been interested in smash that I looked a lot of tournament, guide, tech guide, etc even though I did not play the game. I think that's what makes me able to compete with better and more experienced players even though I have barely no real experience. However to really get better you probably need to find balance between actually playing and looking for data.

Good luck finding a smash community where you live, not easy in France however new smash communities pop every year and they're growing so don't despair if you don't find any!

 

[KirbyFan20]

Does anyone know just how much extra percent staleness adds when you're trying to land a KO move, but fail?

 

[Electrix]

Does anyone know just how much extra percent staleness adds when you're trying to land a KO move, but fail?

You should check out this video for an in-depth explanation.
Short answer: The attack degrades by one or two percent and does less knockback.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wis_25jQeew

 

[Angross]

I keep going to my local tourneys, and I have done decent (5th place) considering I am relatively new to the sm4sh competitive scene. Sometimes I 2-0 some scrubs but other times I get bodied by the top players at my locals, but getting bodied is something I expect. But multiple times in the last 4 tournaments, I have won the first game of a set, a lot of times 2 stocking these players. Then, they come back and win the very next 2 games, off of sometimes stupid sds or dumb choices on my part. How can I focus better so that I don' t choke after winning my first game?

 

[KirbyFan20]

You should check out this video for an in-depth explanation.
Short answer: The attack degrades by one or two percent and does less knockback.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wis_25jQeew

I've already seen that video twice now. I'm just wondering about the exact percents, which they didn't seem to cover.

 

[C0rvus]

Since staleness is a modifier, the exact amount staleness removes depends on the move in question and the level of staleness.

 

[Stryker95]

I've already seen that video twice now. I'm just wondering about the exact percents, which they didn't seem to cover.

That would require an incredible amount of research which is not worth it. You mean you want to know how much more percent you need to kill with every move and at every level of staleness? That is alot and not something people would take the time to record. You can always test things yourself for your character.

 

[epicjelly1]

what should I be thinking about during a match? I wanna start going to locals, but I auto pilot a bit

 

[Stryker95]

what should I be thinking about during a match? I wanna start going to locals, but I auto pilot a bit

EVERYTHING! But really, if you are auto-piloting than you need to focus. Watch how your opponent reacts and learn to read their habits while trying to force them into an uncomfortable situation.

 

[MrSaek]

This is real easy to overcome, What you can do is not take the game seriously. Just take it as for fun and you won't even try so hard. You will play at your Peak like normal, But also not choke since you wont be thinking about winning or losing.

 

[C0rvus]

Consistency really just comes from experience. Maybe focus on specific ways you find yourself losing. Think of matches you lost and consider why you lost. Listening to music can help some people focus on the game, but it's not for everybody.

More or less just keep playing. You can't be that bad if you're getting 5th at locals. Keep at it.

 

[FireBowels]

I've been trying to find a main for a while now(since the game came out), but no one really "clicks" for me. Does anyone have any suggestions on who I should main? If it helps my favorite games are:
Fire Emblem(All of them)
Super Mario 64
Pokemon(Again, all of them)
Luigi's Mansion
Super Mario Maker
Splatoon

So, if you can, please suggest a main to me and I will try it out. Thank you in advance.

 

[abx]

I don't get it. You named some video game series which are present in Smash Bros. 4, you should have no trouble picking them up. As for recommendations for who fits your playstyle the most, more infos are needed about - well - your playstyle. Do you prefer wuick, agile characters or slow heavy-hitters? Do you you like close-combat or would you like experimenting with projectiles? Did you have a favourite from previous installments (given that you have played one of them)?

Seriously, I have no idea how you want this to work out.

 

[FireBowels]

I don't really have a preference, that's why I can't find a main. But Snake and Pokemon Trainer were my all-time favorites from Brawl.

 

[FireBowels]

Also, I put my favorite games on there because how you play in those game might adjust how I play is Smash.

 

[DaDavid]

Also, I put my favorite games on there because how you play in those game might adjust how I play is Smash.

This does clarify your intent a bit but it's still pretty difficult to give any main advise based on that particular list haha. There's a decent amount of platformers on there so maybe a character with good ups and a strong edgeguard game? Who all have you already tried that isn't "clicking?"

 

[FireBowels]

The people who I'm bad with are definitely Wario, Palutena, Olimar, Sonic, and Bayonetta. Good ups and strong edgeguarding does sound good for me, so who in the roster is good at that?

 

[DaDavid]

Yeah just don't get carried away by the fact that you won an "important" match. We're all here because we love Smash and obviously enjoy playing it competitively, but at the end of the day it's still a game. Have fun, don't think about what losing or winning would mean, just play your best and focus on the match at hand. Like Cracklin_Oats said, you could try music if ambient noise is causing issues but it could affect your play like it does for some people who like to feel I guess "connected" to the game via sound as well.

 

[DaDavid]

Well, in my opinion...
Mario, Luigi, Yoshi, Rosalina is kinda weird and floaty but sort of its the criteria. Kirby, Pit and Dark Pit might be decent fits too given their multi-jumps. Any particular play-style that you think may appeal to you? Combo focused, juggles, early kills, maybe something more ranged/campy?

 

[FireBowels]

Juggles and combos both appeal to me a lot.

 

[krosswerks]

Main a Fire Emblem character! I suggest Lucina to get a hang of the playstyle, then go for one of the more specialized characters. As a Fire Emblem fan, I think you will love playing the FE characters when you start to think of the Smash stage as the "battle" phase of a Fire Emblem map (even easier to visualize if you're playing on an omega stage and you're thinking of the GBA Fire Emblems: http://vignette3.wikia.nocookie.net...reen011.jpg/revision/latest?cb=20090319001346 ). Stay on your side of the stage... wait to see what attack your opponent chose... and counterattack. You're a FE fan, you've got a FE avatar... you should be in the Emblem crew B)

 

[FireBowels]

Thanks for the info! I'll start practicing with her right now.

 

[DaDavid]

Personally I'll suggest Marth over Lucina for that tipper power but your choice.

 

[Megamang]

And combo ability. The weaker sourspots marth has actually work as combo setups. Best of both worlds. Plus marth is cool yo.

 

[Electrix]

Am I the only one that does mediocre/good online or against CPUs but plays very consistently against real players? I've wondered this since Brawl, as I would often add lots of advanced techniques against CPUs and such, but then just ledge camp with projectiles at the ledge when it came to facing a player. I'm not sure if it's from facing friends that underestimate the shield-then-punish mindset or just exploiting weakNesses in the opponent's playstyle, but I am very different online vs offline, and not just from lag.

 

[dhif24]

Hi here is a video of me (luigi) playing a buddy (falco). Would really like some feedback on what I can do better. Thanks and please be brutally honest.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1DexHkIIWY8

Video quality is poor so play on full screen to make viewing easier.

 

[Joflyer]

Heya. Went to my first tournament and got to losers brackets round 2. Kinda disappointed, but it was fun and a learning experience!


The two biggest flaws than I've learned are that I don't spot dodge and I lack match up knowledge. The first one I know how to deal with, though it'll take time to get into that habit, the other one I'm not sure what to do.

My original plan is to just read up/watch a guide on each character, go play For Glory for a while with that character and then move. I assume that'll help me learn what option that character has and what not. I'm coming hear to ask you guys what your opinion is on learning match-ups. I kinda don't want to play For Glory, because I just don't find it fun. Iunno why, but as soon as I go onto for Glory I become a billion times worse then I usually am when playing locally. But I don't see any other options.

I don't really have any friendlies to play with to learn match up. If I did, I'd love to just do dittos with every character in the roster, that sounds like fun and a learning experience, but alas, I only have my brother who plays Little Mac as if it were an orthodox religion.


My other problems I have is that I also lack knowledge of some of the options I have with my character, (Didn't realize I could instant pin the stage after running of the ledge to edge guard) I lack the mechanical skill to pull of some of the things I try to do (Corrin spike on Omega stages and then recovering, somehow I keep doing up-B instead of side B. :/) or I just plain screw up the timing of moves and wiff them. All these things here, though, I know what the problem is how to fix them (Study/Practice).

Oh, another issue I have is reads, but I assume that'll get better with time and me learning match-ups, since I'll know what they can do and thusly, what they'll want to do.



Also, sorry if this is the wrong thread for this, I just assume this would go here. ;___;

 

[WackySpinachAgate]

Pretty much in the title, I don't win any regionals when I go to them but more often than not I place high enough to be happy but whenever I play online or if i get eliminate early in a tournament online/offline I find myself getting super mad at myself for losing and wanting to just quit entirely. I always get very self-destructive and have broken a few controllers and given myself some bruises from punching stuff. I never get mad at my opponent but I always beat the crap out of myself regardless of how close the match is I always get this super feeling of hatred towards myself for losing and its this feeling that sometimes prevents me from wanting to improve in fear of setting my expectations for myself to high. TL:DR How can I not get salty

 

[Stryker95]

This may help. Really it is just self-control and the realization that being angry is not fun and can even cause you to become hated in a community, see Leffen a few years back.

 

[epicnights]

What's the best thing to do with your time once you've been knocked into Losers bracket? From what I've seen, there's generally a lot of time between when bracket starts and when Losers bracket begins, so I'm generally not sure what to do with that time.

 

[Megamang]

That depends. Do you feel you aren't warmed up enough? Find some friendlies. Want to know your competition, or have some entertainment? Go find the highest level matches being played, usually on the stream if your event has one. Do you feel tired from your pools matches, or need to calm down from some close matches? Then don't play any, this can be combined with the watching matches of course... Hungry? Eat something. Seriously, being hungry or thirsty can effect your performance negatively. Get what you want from the experience.

But for gods sake, dont disappear when you should be playing. Make sure you know when you will be playing, and preferably who you're playing so you can find them. Maybe meet up with them quickly and suggest a meeting time a few minutes before your scheduled match time.

 

[realmwars]

I main and and there's this one guy I normally face who uses and sometimes on occasions and it seems majority of the time whenever I go to approach him he spot dodges everything I throw at him. A dash attack, a grab, tilts, specials

I just want to know if I'm doing anything wrong in terms of punishing spot dodges and if there's a more effective method of punishing them.

 

[Stryker95]

I main and and there's this one guy I normally face who uses and sometimes on occasions and it seems majority of the time whenever I go to approach him he spot dodges everything I throw at him. A dash attack, a grab, tilts, specials

I just want to know if I'm doing anything wrong in terms of punishing spot dodges and if there's a more effective method of punishing them.

Force the spotdodge. Run up at him, wait for the spotdodge, and then hit him.

 

[epicnights]

I main and and there's this one guy I normally face who uses and sometimes on occasions and it seems majority of the time whenever I go to approach him he spot dodges everything I throw at him. A dash attack, a grab, tilts, specials

I just want to know if I'm doing anything wrong in terms of punishing spot dodges and if there's a more effective method of punishing them.

As someone with a spot dodge problem... Just run up to him. It's likely a predictive/reactive spotdodge, so if you run up and do something, they will be committed to spotdodging, giving you 9 to 10 frames to punish. It's part of mind games.

 

[ItsASquid]

I can't beat rolls or spot dodging. I know they're coming but the timing is so specific I can't get it, even when I'm 3 moves ahead of what the opponent is doing. It feels like my rolls/dodges are totally ineffective, but the enemy is invincible when they do theirs. Opponents who roll and roll constantly fluster and infuriate me, because all my attacks miss, and I have no idea if they'll roll again, grab or attack. People say to read patterns, but there aren't any to read!

Also I can't find a way to beat roll behind and grab/attack/smash spam.

- If I try to turn around and attack them myself, they roll again or their attack lands first.
- If I try and mimic them, they read me every time.
- If I downsmash, it misses. Every single time. No exceptions.
- If I short-hop back-air or similar, their attack takes priority or the grab sucks me to the ground.
- If I shield, I get grabbed, or pressured so much by attacks I eventually get grabbed anyway.
- If I spotdodge, the next attack/grab gets me instead.
- If I try to jab, it whiffs/misses, my character may not turn around, or the opponent's attack comes first.

Also what do you do when logic doesn't work? If I see someone, say jump towards me, my plan is usually to block or dodge what they do, and hit them when they're open, because it's a logcial thing to do. This rarely works though - Smash is not a logical game often! How do I toss logic out the window and learn the mechanics and workings of the game itself. After almost a year, I still can't memorise physics etc.

 

[Megamang]

Well, Ryu doesn't have spectacular dodges so if you try aggressive rolls like ESAM or Zero you'll probably not have results as good. My problem with rolls and spotdodges was when I was too intent on pressing buttons in the neutral. Doing nothing beats rolling towards and spotdodges, while if they roll away they are only worsening the situation for themselves, unless their back is to the middle of the stage, and even then they are giving up pressure. Try doing nothing in a safe spacing if you think they are using a lot of dodges, then react to the dodge. Ryu's multi speed hadoukens can punish rolls, and he is dangerous to roll into if his punish game is on point.

Worth considering is if someone is dodging your moves, you may not be 3 moves ahead of them. If you really are and you are just missing because you don't understand when they are vulnerable, spend some time in training mode or with yourself/a lab partner finding out which moves can punish dodges in what situation, and when you need to use those moves.

 

[HoSmash4]

I can't beat rolls or spot dodging. I know they're coming but the timing is so specific I can't get it, even when I'm 3 moves ahead of what the opponent is doing. It feels like my rolls/dodges are totally ineffective, but the enemy is invincible when they do theirs. Opponents who roll and roll constantly fluster and infuriate me, because all my attacks miss, and I have no idea if they'll roll again, grab or attack. People say to read patterns, but there aren't any to read!

Also I can't find a way to beat roll behind and grab/attack/smash spam.

- If I try to turn around and attack them myself, they roll again or their attack lands first.
- If I try and mimic them, they read me every time.
- If I downsmash, it misses. Every single time. No exceptions.
- If I short-hop back-air or similar, their attack takes priority or the grab sucks me to the ground.
- If I shield, I get grabbed, or pressured so much by attacks I eventually get grabbed anyway.
- If I spotdodge, the next attack/grab gets me instead.
- If I try to jab, it whiffs/misses, my character may not turn around, or the opponent's attack comes first.

Also what do you do when logic doesn't work? If I see someone, say jump towards me, my plan is usually to block or dodge what they do, and hit them when they're open, because it's a logcial thing to do. This rarely works though - Smash is not a logical game often! How do I toss logic out the window and learn the mechanics and workings of the game itself. After almost a year, I still can't memorise physics etc.

walk more.

 

[Niche]

Hey guys, I main cloud and was wondering what a good character to pocket would be fore the yoshi/cloud MU. Cloud MU isn't as important as the Yoshi MU.

Thank you,
Niche

 

[Stryker95]

Hey guys, I main cloud and was wondering what a good character to pocket would be fore the yoshi/cloud MU. Cloud MU isn't as important as the Yoshi MU.

Thank you,
Niche

I don't know, but if no one answers you should take your question to the Cloud boards.