Q&A Game Play Advice and General Discussion

[Reggie Amiibo]

So I got told I should ask this here.

If my personal best isn't good enough, and I've tried to improve but can't, tried a variety of characters, never found one I was good enough as (with my good enough being consistent wins as them), should I give up?

 

[Thinkaman]

So I got told I should ask this here.

If my personal best isn't good enough, and I've tried to improve but can't, tried a variety of characters, never found one I was good enough as (with my good enough being consistent wins as them), should I give up?

Let's take a step back.

Good enough for what? What is the goal in question?

Win Apex? To be blunt, most of us will never be capable of placing in the top 8 of an international tourney. If this is your singular goal, it might very well be wise to focus instead on other goals.

But if your goal is to beat your friend or cousin at the game, or just improve, then yes--this is within your capability of a human being and no self-defeatism should let you think otherwise. Frankly, improving at Smash Bros will probably end up being one of the less impressive things you do in your lifetime.

I'm not going to go into specifics on how you should go about improving in this post, because specifics shouldn't be tied to this fact. (And there's no silver bullet) But you asked a question, and there is your answer.

 

[Reggie Amiibo]

Let's take a step back.

Good enough for what? What is the goal in question?

Win Apex? To be blunt, most of us will never be capable of placing in the top 8 of an international tourney. If this is your singular goal, it might very well be wise to focus instead on other goals.

But if your goal is to beat your friend or cousin at the game, or just improve, then yes--this is within your capability of a human being and no self-defeatism should let you think otherwise. Frankly, improving at Smash Bros will probably end up being one of the less impressive things you do in your lifetime.

I'm not going to go into specifics on how you should go about improving in this post, because specifics shouldn't be tied to this fact. (And there's no silver bullet) But you asked a question, and there is your answer.

Thanks.

 

[CrazyPerson]

So I got told I should ask this here.

If my personal best isn't good enough, and I've tried to improve but can't, tried a variety of characters, never found one I was good enough as (with my good enough being consistent wins as them), should I give up?

Needless to say I have never seen you play... but I have been wrestling with this a lot. As far as smash goes, I think I was playing tic tac toe and am now trying to learn checkers... unfortunately many of the people here are playing chess.

But... if improvement is the goal I'd ask the chess players what steps to take to learn.

 

[Reggie Amiibo]

Needless to say I have never seen you play... but I have been wrestling with this a lot. As far as smash goes, I think I was playing tic tac toe and am now trying to learn checkers... unfortunately many of the people here are playing chess.

But... if improvement is the goal I'd ask the chess players what steps to take to learn.

Good advice. Thanks.

 

[GhostUrsa]

So I got told I should ask this here.

If my personal best isn't good enough, and I've tried to improve but can't, tried a variety of characters, never found one I was good enough as (with my good enough being consistent wins as them), should I give up?

Quitting is something every sports player, whether eSports or physical, has to figure out sometime. I've heard it's called the Wall, where you seem to have hit a peak and need to decide if you'll walk away and enjoy what you had or try to punch through and keep going.

If you want to keep trying, but still struggle with what you mentioned, I'd recommend first analyzing yourself. Try a few games that aren't competitive in nature but similar in style, like a brawler (Hyrule Warriors is good) and see how you approach your situations. Do you prefer faster characters that dazzle your foes, slow juggernauts that shrug off hits and deal more damage back, that kind of thing. Once you know what kind of player you like, then finding a good character to compliment you becomes easier. Then it's looking at that characters specific forums and learning how the matchups work.

Each time you hit a wall, re-analyze yourself and see what you want out of this. If you don't find it ultimately fun, then don't play the game that way. Since most of us here will never be professional eSports players, we need to approach this just like any other physical sport. Remember that it's ultimately just a game, and to do our best.

 

[Reggie Amiibo]

Quitting is something every sports player, whether eSports or physical, has to figure out sometime. I've heard it's called the Wall, where you seem to have hit a peak and need to decide if you'll walk away and enjoy what you had or try to punch through and keep going.

If you want to keep trying, but still struggle with what you mentioned, I'd recommend first analyzing yourself. Try a few games that aren't competitive in nature but similar in style, like a brawler (Hyrule Warriors is good) and see how you approach your situations. Do you prefer faster characters that dazzle your foes, slow juggernauts that shrug off hits and deal more damage back, that kind of thing. Once you know what kind of player you like, then finding a good character to compliment you becomes easier. Then it's looking at that characters specific forums and learning how the matchups work.

Each time you hit a wall, re-analyze yourself and see what you want out of this. If you don't find it ultimately fun, then don't play the game that way. Since most of us here will never be professional eSports players, we need to approach this just like any other physical sport. Remember that it's ultimately just a game, and to do our best.

More great advice! You guys are an awesome community.

 

[Conda]

MOST IMPORTANT THING TO REALISE:

Playing against faceless online opponents who can leave at any time without giving you tips or a chance to figure out a way to defeat them = more frustrating than playing against people irl.

Keep than in mind, and realise that most of your frustrations are because you cannot communicate with the person who is bodying you.

 

[HeroMystic]

MOST IMPORTANT THING TO REALISE:

Playing against faceless online opponents who can leave at any time without giving you tips or a chance to figure out a way to defeat them = more frustrating than playing against people irl.

Keep than in mind, and realise that most of your frustrations are because you cannot communicate with the person who is bodying you.

I can say from experience about how true this is. On For Glory, you're only focused on winning, and if you lose you can't redeem yourself. IRL, you can communicate and build a competitive bond with your practice partner and help each other improve. This part is the best part of being in a FGC, especially one as self-sustaining as Smash.

Needless to say I have never seen you play... but I have been wrestling with this a lot. As far as smash goes, I think I was playing tic tac toe and am now trying to learn checkers... unfortunately many of the people here are playing chess.

But... if improvement is the goal I'd ask the chess players what steps to take to learn.

I'd like to think of myself as a chess player.

Best thing to do to learn how to play chess? Watch other people play chess.

"The Wall" can often be broken by knowing what tools are available to you.

 

[Conda]

I'd like to think of myself as a chess player.

Best thing to do to learn how to play chess? Watch other people play chess.

"The Wall" can often be broken by knowing what tools are available to you.

Agreed. I began making youtube videos for Smash because I want people to have helpful commentary that can help them understand what's going on and what to improve on. Non-tournament footage is super valuable to have commentary on - at least for me - because it shows what the non-top-players are doing wrong and what they can change to get better. Provides some upward mobility. But also, I want people to see the competitive community as friendly and helpful, and also super welcoming.

 

[CrazyPerson]

I'd like to think of myself as a chess player.

Best thing to do to learn how to play chess? Watch other people play chess.

"The Wall" can often be broken by knowing what tools are available to you.

Watching others can help. At the same time... watching chess players when you don't know the rules for how pieces can move, what the heck castling is, isn't as effective as watching after having learned those things.

I am getting some things out of videos (when i have time to watch)... bit more now that I have practiced a few things. At the same time, sometimes things are just at a level I can't easily pick up.

 

[Pazx]

Watching others can help. At the same time... watching chess players when you don't know the rules for how pieces can move, what the heck castling is, isn't as effective as watching after having learned those things.

I am getting some things out of videos (when i have time to watch)... bit more now that I have practiced a few things. At the same time, sometimes things are just at a level I can't easily pick up.

Ask! Ask ask ask! Don't be afraid to ask questions! "How did you move 2 pieces in 1 turn?"

 

[The Winged Cherry Pie]

Throughout my whole 11 or so years of playing Smash, I have always been using the Control Stick to jump. I always find it awkward and difficult to jump with a button, like the default Y or Z, as some people are doing apparently. But I feel like the only person who ever uses the Control Stick to jump. Like, everyone I know, except my brother, always uses the buttons to jump. So I'm wondering, why is using the jump button so common? Is there some kind of strategic advantage to using a button to jump as opposed to the stick?

 

[Pazx]

Throughout my whole 11 or so years of playing Smash, I have always been using the Control Stick to jump. I always find it awkward and difficult to jump with a button, like the default Y or Z, as some people are doing apparently. But I feel like the only person who ever uses the Control Stick to jump. Like, everyone I know, except my brother, always uses the buttons to jump. So I'm wondering, why is using the jump button so common? Is there some kind of strategic advantage to using a button to jump as opposed to the stick?

If you like using tap jump there is no reason to change. People often turn it off to make it easier to do up-airs and up-tilts. Most people also find it's easier to short hop with a button rather than the control stick.

Some of the better aspects about using the control stick to jump is that it makes Out of Shield options far easier to execute. Simply tap up and B or A when shielding to perform an up special or up smash OoS respectively (jumping cancels the shield and the special/smash cancels the jump). Another benefit to jumping with the control stick (or a shoulder button) is that it allows you to have your right thumb resting on the c stick so you don't have to move your hand to perform aerials.

Rumour has it that Hungrybox (one of the best Melee players, been top 5 in the world for a long time) uses the control stick almost exclusively to jump.

 

[TotallyNotMikey]

Throughout my whole 11 or so years of playing Smash, I have always been using the Control Stick to jump. I always find it awkward and difficult to jump with a button, like the default Y or Z, as some people are doing apparently. But I feel like the only person who ever uses the Control Stick to jump. Like, everyone I know, except my brother, always uses the buttons to jump. So I'm wondering, why is using the jump button so common? Is there some kind of strategic advantage to using a button to jump as opposed to the stick?

I only just recently made the switch to the jump button from using the tap jump option. It's difficult to get used to, but often leads to more comfortable tilts and up aerials without the risk of accidentally jumping, like with the tap jump.

Don't let anyone force you to change, though. If that's what you're used to, stick with it, make it work and don't let anyone tell you you're wrong for doing so. As I said, I only made the switch around a month ago, as this is the game I really want to be competitive at, and Shulk's up-tilt reach is godly.

 

[HeroMystic]

Throughout my whole 11 or so years of playing Smash, I have always been using the Control Stick to jump. I always find it awkward and difficult to jump with a button, like the default Y or Z, as some people are doing apparently. But I feel like the only person who ever uses the Control Stick to jump. Like, everyone I know, except my brother, always uses the buttons to jump. So I'm wondering, why is using the jump button so common? Is there some kind of strategic advantage to using a button to jump as opposed to the stick?

It is far, far easier to do short hops with buttons instead of the control stick. It's a similar reasoning as to why people prefer the C-stick over manually inputting aerial attacks.

 

[Iron Kraken]

I've only been playing Smash seriously since the 3DS version, but for some reason I decided to compete at Apex. I've never even been to a tournament before. Now that the hour of destiny is almost here, I realize there's still knowledge gaps I have that I need to fill in.

Non-Game Related
1) Besides bringing my own gamecube controller and a valid ID, is there anything else I need to bring / should bring? Anything at all?
2) My doubles pool runs from 9AM-11AM and my singles pool runs from 11AM-1PM on Friday. If I can't check-in the night before, how early should I arrive on Friday?
3) How's the parking situation? I live in NYC and I will have a car available, but I have yet to determine whether I should drive in or take public transit (yes I'm a poor / last minute planner)
4) If I'm completely eliminated from singles and doubles by 1PM, will there be anything else for me to do there? I have no actual friends in the Smash community who I know personally, and I'm not bringing any of my friends with me, so I'm a bit worried about feeling out of place once I'm eliminated and I'm in the middle of such a large venue.

Game Related
(I play Rosalina & Luma for what that's worth)
5) How do I properly DI Diddy's down-throw at low %s? Should I jump or spot dodge to escape? How do I properly DI Diddy's down-throw at high %s to avoid death? Should I jump or spot dodge to escape?
6) Any advice on how to gimp Diddy? (I know his recovery is supposed to be easy to gimp but I haven't found it to be.)
7) What's the best way to deal with Sheik's Bouncing Fish? Is there any way to punish Bouncing Fish on shield?
8) What's the best thing to do when you find yourself in a string of Sheik Fairs? Or rather, any advice on how to avoid getting trapped in a string of Sheik Fairs?
9) What's the best way to deal with ZSS' Flip Jump? Is there any way to punish Flip Jump on shield?
10) Is there any way to escape Luigi's down-throw to Cyclone combo? Especially at death %?

Well, that's a lot. I don't expect all of these questions to be answered, and I am certainly am not asking one person to answer them all. But any help whatsoever would be greatly appreciated!

 

[Jrzfine]

4) Try to be social and make some friends and watch the other matches and I guarantee you'll learn a few things. That's my advice. Plus I'm sure there will be some friendly matches happening that you can take part in once the majority of participants have been eliminated.
5) I don't have much experience with Diddy, especially as a light character, so I'm going to go with DI upwards from Diddy.If you break free in time do a combination of jumps and shields so they wont read the airdodge and punish.
6) Diddy's UpB is terrible and should only be used as last resort. So, you can expect a side b. Dair spikes or just constant Fair interruptions work well. If they have to pull out the jetpack, they're sitting ducks. Alternatively wait until they launch, and you can Bair them into the wall as they scramble for ledge.
7) Perfect shielding aside, not really, unless you use a fast character like Fox or Falcon. Good Shieks will ensure the gap between you and them is too large to punish as she flips back, so bait a shield or dodge.
8) DI high, might save you from an additional Fair. Kind of difficult to avoid at low %, just be very wary of the grab and try to DI the Dthrow straight up.
9) Pretty sure its safe on shield. If you know the flip jumps going to happen, intercept it about halfway through the arc with a disjointed aerial.
10)DI the Dthrow Up and/or mash control stick down after each hit of the Cyclone. Its called Smash DI, and helps you out of multihit moves.

 

[Firehyphen]

4) Try to be social and make some friends and watch the other matches and I guarantee you'll learn a few things. That's my advice. Plus I'm sure there will be some friendly matches happening that you can take part in once the majority of participants have been eliminated.
5) I don't have much experience with Diddy, especially as a light character, so I'm going to go with DI away from Diddy. He will probably still get a Fair in but its better than a triple Uair.If you break free in time do a combination of jumps and shields so they wont read the airdodge and punish.
6) Diddy's UpB is terrible and should only be used as last resort. So, you can expect a side b. Dair spikes or just constant Fair interruptions work well. If they have to pull out the jetpack, they're sitting ducks. Alternatively wait until they launch, and you can Bair them into the wall as they scramble for ledge.
7) Perfect shielding aside, not really, unless you use a fast character like Fox or Falcon. Good Shieks will ensure the gap between you and them is too large to punish as she flips back, so bait a shield or dodge.
8) DI high, might save you from an additional Fair. Kind of difficult to avoid at low %, just be very wary of the grab and try to DI the Dthrow straight up.
9) Pretty sure its safe on shield. If you know the flip jumps going to happen, intercept it about halfway through the arc with a disjointed aerial.
10)DI the Dthrow Up and/or mash control stick down after each hit of the Cyclone. Its called Smash DI, and helps you out of multihit moves.

DI Upwards is the best to do with Diddy

 

[HeroMystic]

4) If I'm completely eliminated from singles and doubles by 1PM, will there be anything else for me to do there? I have no actual friends in the Smash community who I know personally, and I'm not bringing any of my friends with me, so I'm a bit worried about feeling out of place once I'm eliminated and I'm in the middle of such a large venue.

Be social and make friends. It sounds obvious but I say this with absolute sincerity. Despite being in the heart of one of the biggest scenes in Smash, I've been unknown and quiet for 5+ years until I got out to a tournament and started being a social butterfly. You're in THE biggest place with people who share the same interests as you, don't waste that time being scared!

 

[MezzoMe]

Game Related
(I play Rosalina & Luma for what that's worth)
6) Any advice on how to gimp Diddy? (I know his recovery is supposed to be easy to gimp but I haven't found it to be.)

The Monkey Flip has absolutely no hitboxes/grabboxes if not forward Diddy, and if you expect your opponent to do it, you can react in many ways when you see te flash, including her USmash, and even then, the grabbox only covers diddy himself(think at Falcon's Raptor Boost), being vulnerable to each of her disjointed hitboxes, the kick has low range by himself, so a timed attack should take him out however, you'll always want to attack him at his blind spot.
The Up B is what makes me think that Diddy has the worst recovery in the game.
First off, know that uncharged, it'll travel less than the aerial version of Tornado Uppercut's distance, so if a Diddy is less distant than this anticipate them, otherwise it'll be easier to intercept his recovery. During his Up B, if hit either during the charging or during the fly, no matter if by Sonic's Spring or Warlock Punch, his Barrels will fly off for half an hour and, until they explode, Diddy cannot use them again, and usually Diddy Kong can't charge enough to come back if he gets hit under the main platform of Final Destination, but be prepared for another hit nonetheless. Remember to be decisive and unpredictable.

7) What's the best way to deal with Sheik's Bouncing Fish? Is there any way to punish Bouncing Fish on shield?

I think that you can close distance after the hit to gain stage control and take a chance of applying a reaction to the Sheik, but there isn't a true punish on shield. However, it suffers high landing lag. Finally, if used for recovery, you'll want to shield since recoverying with the Bouncing Fish usually has as first aim to take you away from the ledge.

10) Is there any way to escape Luigi's down-throw to Cyclone combo? Especially at death %?

I'm not entirely sure, but I think that that combo works only if you DI, while he can Nair/Shoryuken when you don't, but he do both relying on a read, so don't get read. Also Luigi hasin general shorter range than Rosalina (aside for her grab) so don't let that happen in the first place.
On a side note, the Cyclone has an autolink angle, being techable if he drsgs you from the air to the ground, akin to Rosalina's Fair, but Luigi's down B has much more ending lag compared to Rosalina's Fair landing lag so be prepared.
Hope that it helps.

 

[Pazx]

I've only been playing Smash seriously since the 3DS version, but for some reason I decided to compete at Apex. I've never even been to a tournament before. Now that the hour of destiny is almost here, I realize there's still knowledge gaps I have that I need to fill in.

Non-Game Related
1) Besides bringing my own gamecube controller and a valid ID, is there anything else I need to bring / should bring? Anything at all?
2) My doubles pool runs from 9AM-11AM and my singles pool runs from 11AM-1PM on Friday. If I can't check-in the night before, how early should I arrive on Friday?
3) How's the parking situation? I live in NYC and I will have a car available, but I have yet to determine whether I should drive in or take public transit (yes I'm a poor / last minute planner)
4) If I'm completely eliminated from singles and doubles by 1PM, will there be anything else for me to do there? I have no actual friends in the Smash community who I know personally, and I'm not bringing any of my friends with me, so I'm a bit worried about feeling out of place once I'm eliminated and I'm in the middle of such a large venue.

1. Money for food. I'm not sure if you can bring your own food into the venue. Also, warm clothing.
2. Check-in is available from 8am. Sorry if this is late (I have no idea what time it is for you) but the schedule can be found here.

Can't help with number 3 but everything else has been answered, good luck!

 

[STiCKYBULL3TZ]

Am I allowed to post matches of myself to get advice from?

 

[HeroMystic]

It'd be better if you do that in the Character forum. So if you want to post videos for Luigi, you'd want to go to the Luigi boards for that.

 

[STiCKYBULL3TZ]

I do that but I don't usually get much advice. MAYBE one person will comment on it. I'll give it some time tho. I might get a few more ppl this time. Thanks.

 

[Mrawesome48]

How do you punish rolls? I have been using Down smash but all my opponents are now shielding dirrectly after rolling making my smashes useless and my opponents are just rolling all over the stage till they win

 

[PixelPerfect]

How do you punish rolls? I have been using Down smash but all my opponents are now shielding dirrectly after rolling making my smashes useless and my opponents are just rolling all over the stage till they win

Well , Dsmash is useful in puishing rolls but my suggestions is to try and read your opponent. If they constantly roll behind you, try and read that roll and attack behind you in order to punish the roll. People don't just roll, they roll into a situation where they are usually able to counter you, like behind, so you need to see that pattern and read that action. If they shield right after the roll, go for the grab at them since you are able to grab through a shield. Also, since I assume you main Prach, try using your dash attack at them, since it has a lingering hitbox so they won't be able to shield right after their roll. I'd suggest getting someone, a friend or family member, to just practice it offline until you are able to punish rolls well. Practice and experience in those situation will definitely help.

 

[PixelPerfect]

Sorry, I know this is a stupid question but does anyone have any suggestions for trying to maintain a focused mindset. Whenever I'm in a match that is important like the Anther's Ladder or something, as soon as I lose that first stock, my play just goes downhill from there. Anyone have any strategies on how to maintain that focused and positive mindset?

 

[CrazyPerson]

Sorry, I know this is a stupid question but does anyone have any suggestions for trying to maintain a focused mindset. Whenever I'm in a match that is important like the Anther's Ladder or something, as soon as I lose that first stock, my play just goes downhill from there. Anyone have any strategies on how to maintain that focused and positive mindset?

I struggle with this... but the rule I am trying to make about life and games is mumble a bad word then refocus. I hate making mistakes... hate losing... hate failing but all will happen when learning something. Granted this tactic only works when not around people who would mind the tactic.

Other thing is quickly mentally recite what just happened... play by play facts only no color cometary type judgements.

My old tendency would be something like "I screwed up, fired a move which I knew could be punished, got smashed for my efforts than royally messed up my recovery. dang shoot rats." (well... that is the version that won't get me in trouble with smashboards.."

After using the 1st tactic I mentioned... II try now to say "I used ____________, which was punishable. This gave him the chance ot smash attack me, then I used my second jump a slight bit early." Take the emotion out of it, and think about what was wrong in hopes of not making that same mistake again.

I am still struggling not to play this game with my old basic strategy instincts... it is tough to change.

 

[Keyo~Zakuya]

Are you sure this happens offline and with the regular A button (not c-stick)?

This happens to me all the time but only online and only with the C-Stick. I figured it was due to lag and the way the c-stick works. The C-Stick is now a macro for direction + A which means that if you lag in the middle of the c-stick input you will get direction and then A which ends up in neutral air, jab or dash attack instead of smashes.

I've tested this thoroughly and my theories seemed to be correct. It even goes as far as rendering the c-stick completely useless in high-lag matches and me having to switch to the A button. Everytime a match receives a huge lag spike it also rendere the c-stick useless during the lag spike.

I've never had it happen offline though, so my theory might be wrong.

When it comes to offline, it's only happened once or twice so it's most likely that I suck and just simply missed my inputs. If it's lag then that explains why I can't replicated it in training mode. Thanks for the info, it sucks that there's no way around it other than having a better connection. At least now I know, and knowing if half the struggle.

 

[sparkyb]

So I'm just getting used to this game now. I'm all right, but I feel that I always fall short when it comes to dodging, and punishing rolls.

I'm okay at putting up my shield, and then grabbing. When it comes to rolling I can kind of space myself away from my opponent, but I'm finding that people can easily read my rolls.

What I want to bring up is spot dodging. It seems like I never do this. When I see someone approaching I never think to spot dodge. I always shield or roll. Should I primarily be using a spot dodge when I'm near my opponent, or should I just stick to what I'm doing now and improve on it?

 

[PixelPerfect]

Well, spot dodge's usefulness depends on the situation. I'd recommend spot dodging whenever someone throws out a quick attack like Pit's dash attack. However, any move that has a lingering hitbox, like Jigglypuff's pound move, shield or roll as you will get hit with the end of that hitbox, which your opponent can use to attack and possibly combo you.

Spot dodging is a skill that I recommend practicing but you should also know situations where you don't want to use it, like what I stated above. If you have knowledge on all 3 then you can change the way that you avoid attacks that keep your opponents from reading your style, like constant rolling.

Learn how to spot dodge and try and use it in situations where your opponent doesn't have a lingering hitbox out so you can punish them easier, which is the reason for the spot dodge. Shield and dodge roll are still useful though and shouldn't be completely ignored either.

TL;DR Yes, learn how to spot dodge but don't always use it when an opponent approaches.

 

[Shin Chie]

Sorry, I know this is a stupid question but does anyone have any suggestions for trying to maintain a focused mindset. Whenever I'm in a match that is important like the Anther's Ladder or something, as soon as I lose that first stock, my play just goes downhill from there. Anyone have any strategies on how to maintain that focused and positive mindset?

This is something I really struggle at too lol. It gets annoying though. Like I'll be really focused in a match but like half way through I zone out.

 

[Pazx]

Short answer: if you are getting grabbed, spotdodge.

 

[VKatana]

What are the competitive usages/advantages to foxtrotting? I find it far easier than perfect pivoting since my opponent usually puts out a hitbox on me before I get behind them to pivot f-tilt or grab.

 

[Indigo Jeans]

On the topic of projectile spam:

The best way to deal with projectile spam imo is walking and powershielding. Also be aware of who can crouch what. Mega Man, Lucina, Marth, Wii Fit Trainer, and quite a few other characters can just duck beneath a lot of stuff, like Super Missiles and Link's fully charged Arrows. Of course, a good player will catch on quickly and release the arrows earlier so they arc down and hit you, so bear that in mind.

What are the competitive usages/advantages to foxtrotting? I find it far easier than perfect pivoting since my opponent usually puts out a hitbox on me before I get behind them to pivot f-tilt or grab.

Foxtrotting's main benefit is being able to cover ground more quickly, since initial dashes are almost universally faster than runs. It was a lot more useful in melee though, since dashes had a larger window where you could dash in the opposite direction without skidding (dash dance), perfect pivot, shield, or even crouch cancel the dash.

Anyway, are you sure you're not confusing perfect pivoting with skidding? Perfect pivoting is dashing, then tapping the opposite direction in the early frames to turn around into your idle animation. It's usually really hard to perfect pivot behind someone because you need to "hold" your dash longer in order to get past their model and get behind them, at which point the window for perfect pivoting is probably gone.

 

[sparkyb]

Well, spot dodge's usefulness depends on the situation. I'd recommend spot dodging whenever someone throws out a quick attack like Pit's dash attack. However, any move that has a lingering hitbox, like Jigglypuff's pound move, shield or roll as you will get hit with the end of that hitbox, which your opponent can use to attack and possibly combo you.

Spot dodging is a skill that I recommend practicing but you should also know situations where you don't want to use it, like what I stated above. If you have knowledge on all 3 then you can change the way that you avoid attacks that keep your opponents from reading your style, like constant rolling.

Learn how to spot dodge and try and use it in situations where your opponent doesn't have a lingering hitbox out so you can punish them easier, which is the reason for the spot dodge. Shield and dodge roll are still useful though and shouldn't be completely ignored either.

TL;DR Yes, learn how to spot dodge but don't always use it when an opponent approaches.

Thanks for the info

 

[PixelPerfect]

I don't know if this is off topic but I guess it falls into general discussion but should I think about dropping Smash 4? I was just watching the Apex stream and all I could see was Smash 4 getting flack for not being Melee, though some of the matches weren't the best. Should I just go with Melee since it's the most popular choice and I won't have to face ridicule for playing Smash 4 or should I just stick with playing both games?

Or is this a stupid question for this thread but I really couldn't think of anywhere else to post this and I wanted to get it off my chest.

 

[Pink'd]

I don't know if this is off topic but I guess it falls into general discussion but should I think about dropping Smash 4? I was just watching the Apex stream and all I could see was Smash 4 getting flack for not being Melee, though some of the matches weren't the best. Should I just go with Melee since it's the most popular choice and I won't have to face ridicule for playing Smash 4 or should I just stick with playing both games?

Or is this a stupid question for this thread but I really couldn't think of anywhere else to post this and I wanted to get it off my chest.

Keep playing Smash 4. Don't you dare drop it, especially if you enjoy it. Because Sm4sh was expected to be like Melee in some way, it constantly gets flack for not being like the big M.

 

[HeroMystic]

I don't know if this is off topic but I guess it falls into general discussion but should I think about dropping Smash 4? I was just watching the Apex stream and all I could see was Smash 4 getting flack for not being Melee, though some of the matches weren't the best. Should I just go with Melee since it's the most popular choice and I won't have to face ridicule for playing Smash 4 or should I just stick with playing both games?

Or is this a stupid question for this thread but I really couldn't think of anywhere else to post this and I wanted to get it off my chest.

I can't believe the VGBC audience are making people think this. This is just so... deplorable.

Answer: You should only drop Smash 4 if you don't like it yourself. Do not be influenced by the bad eggs of our community.