FGD~ Time to get SHTL done

[I.S FoxMkloud]

Hmm, strange... All it does will be crouching down even if I perform reflector input correctly. May be I should try this jump cancelled reflector thing for insta-reflection.

 

[fox67890]

At this time, I mained MK, Pika, Ness, Kirby, Sonic, Luigi, Peach, Bowser, Sheik, ZSS, GaW, and a few more.

o.o


Shine comes out 2 frames later than shield does iirc. Which characters do you have trouble against in getting reflector up in time?

 

[Reckless4Christ]

Oh that's your problem...
I've had this happen with Wolf, but not with Fox.
Edit: yeah shine is frame 3 and shield is instant.

 

[I.S FoxMkloud]

Basically any character that does not have slow projectile such as Wolf's blaster. Falco is the hardest and Mario, Luigi, ICs are hard because I cannot seem to get my reflector up in time due to him crouching down. May be I input it in wrong order perhaps? But then I have no problem shine stalling or reflecting in air.

 

[Reckless4Christ]

oh well I don't know what it is
Edit: Scratch that, you're pressing b slightly early.
You don't have a problem in air cuz the game takes fastfall then b as shine in midair.When you press b too early, it makes you fastfall, but it's cancelled by the shine(which you probably already knew).So shine stall works.But crouch then shine has extra lag.
Double Edit: LATE.not early, late. sorry.

 

[I.S FoxMkloud]

So do I... It is a mystery... That's why I said in other thread that I was considering gcc even though I am too used to ccp. May be it is ccp input lag affecting me or something.

 

[Reckless4Christ]

Well you ninja'd this ^ before Iedited my last post...

 

[I.S FoxMkloud]

It's all because Ima ninja Fox main m8 it is in my genetics if you consider my ethnicity but I am not a Japanese or Chinese though.

 

[Reckless4Christ]

OK I just managed to confuse myself...
What's goin on?

 

[I.S FoxMkloud]

Confused about what?

 

[fox67890]

Hmm, strange... All it does will be crouching down even if I perform reflector input correctly. May be I should try this jump cancelled reflector thing for insta-reflection.

I actually don't think the jump canceling makes a difference in timing. I think it was just a misconception when it was discovered. I think it's possible to reflect just as fast regularly compared to a jump canceled one (but you have to hold slightly down on the control stick rather than all the way to perhaps skip the crouch animation, so realistically, maybe the jump canceled reflectors are faster to input I guess).

/\ If that was confusing to understand, it was kinda unimportant anyway. Just do what feels comfortable I guess.

...on that note though, I actually always do jump cancelled reflectors. I don't do it for any benefit though, I actually just do it out of habit. I used to think doing it was faster, so if I jump canceled it, perhaps I could true combo into an upsmash. The obviously generally doesn't work, but I developed the habit from it. Personally, doing the jump cancelled reflectors feels completely comfortable, but the technique took awhile to develop.

Basically any character that does not have slow projectile such as Wolf's blaster. Falco is the hardest and Mario, Luigi, ICs are hard because I cannot seem to get my reflector up in time due to him crouching down. May be I input it in wrong order perhaps? But then I have no problem shine stalling or reflecting in air.

Wolf and Luigi are kinda hard because their projectiles are kinda hard to react to in general (or at least it is to me because I play on wifi). For Falco, the second you see him leave the ground for a SH laser, pull out reflector. Mario you just have to react to, but unlike Luigi, Mario players can use their fireballs from further away, so it isn't too bad. ICs are easy imo, but I guess it depends on distance somewhat.

If you're in a counter camping situation, it's easier to throw out reflector if you are short hop single lasering, rather than short hop triple lasering (since there's more commitment in the latter).

wall of text...

 

[I.S FoxMkloud]

I enjoy your wall of text because of information it contains. Will make me a better Fox. So, I should try not to do it on reaction when their projectiles are launched?

Thanks Fox.

 

[Reckless4Christ]

@I.S-I posted,then you posted,then I realized I messed up and double edited,I don't even know what I'm confused about...
I'm must be going crazy?
I've gotten like 20 alerts today lol there's so much goin on

Edit:make that 21

 

[I.S FoxMkloud]

Too many "watching" of threads I guess lol. Well, I thought you were confused about what I said about my ethnicity and nationality. Oh and your "what's going on" made me think of http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZZ5LpwO-An4

 

[Reckless4Christ]

23...
I don't watch that many threads actually,
All those alerts came from here, the ccp thread, the Ness boards, and likes.And maybe one more.

 

[I.S FoxMkloud]

lol, I guess I should say I "spammed" you with alerts. I don't get that many alerts because I did not subscribe to any other threads other than my region's social thread and this thread.

 

[Reckless4Christ]

Oh and your "what's going on" made me think of http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZZ5LpwO-An4

ummmmmm...

 

[fox67890]

Well, it depends.

If their projectile is really slow...such as Pika, ICs, Lucario... than you can do it on reaction, and you probably should.

If their projectile is fast, it depends on the projectile and somewhat on reading the opponent.
For instance reflecting lasers from Falco and arrows from Toon Link purely on reaction from when they're fired is too hard (well...kinda for TL). For Falco, wait for the short hop, and then reflector. Lasers take commitment, so this works. Toon Links generally rely on arrows cancels to fire arrows (which occurs when they fire their arrows right before touching the ground, reducing lag). They also have to jump to do this. So a common thing to see is a TL doing a retreating SH fair/nair>arrow cancel. You can reflect this not really based on reaction, but from reading your opponent and knowing their character.

So...yeah, it depends. You're not going to be reflecting, say, Pit's arrows on reaction. You just have to watch what they do and read from there. If your playing offline, maybe you could react to Pit's animation right before he fires an arrow. So camp when you can and when you think they might fire a projectile watch, and if you see the animation, reflect. That assumes you can react to the animation though (which I think you can), so you'll have to be doing SHSLs rather than SHTLs.

If that was confusing, I could try to explain it better.
edit:

Too many "watching" of threads I guess lol. Well, I thought you were confused about what I said about my ethnicity and nationality. Oh and your "what's going on" made me think of http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZZ5LpwO-An4

"Ahhhhhhhhh!!"

 

[I.S FoxMkloud]

I see, your post was informative fox67890. Believe it or not, I should try to nail down shine so that I won't crouch in the first place. Hmm, by the way, about Lucario, would you say I should be on guard almost all the time like when I am facing TL?
@R4C, lol yeah I hope you enjoyed that viral vid!

 

[Reckless4Christ]

You're not going to be reflecting, say, Pit's arrows on reaction.

I actually do this.lol I feel all special!

 

[fox67890]

I see, your post was informative fox67890. Believe it or not, I should try to nail down shine so that I won't crouch in the first place. Hmm, by the way, about Lucario, would you say I should be on guard almost all the time like when I am facing TL?

The MUs are actually somewhat similar, so I guess so. You can really hard camp Lucario though if you want, but you have to be ready to reflect aura spheres at all times.

I actually do this.lol I feel all special!

So you can react to his animation? Tis' is good~

 

[I.S FoxMkloud]

I actually do this.lol I feel all special!

lol, I don't know why but that's funny (no offense intended, it's just me being weird)

"Ahhhhhhhhh!!"

"Is everything ok?"
Oh by the way, are you still active on wifi? Do you do basic brawl at all or just friend code thing? Add me and show me your moves!

 

[fox67890]

I usually do only friend codes, as my internet trolls me and I almost never find anyone on basic brawl :\
Usually when I do, it taunts parties. lol

Sure, we could play. Just let me know sometime your ready~
I'm going to add my fc to my profile now.

 

[Reckless4Christ]

It was meant to be funny...
I would play you guys but my wifis so indescribably bad

 

[fox67890]

I know that feeling
I recently got better internet though, but it's still somewhat questionable :\

 

[I.S FoxMkloud]

@fox67890, "Thanks Fox!" I will watch as you "show me your moves!" I actually played team battle online with other people once as MK. Thankfully it wasn't a taunt party. Glad I won without losing a stock to them (I lost mine once because Bom-omb detonated on me when I was trying to pick it up) Oh by the way, would a barrel roll help me reflect projectiles?
@R4C, so will be mine, but we can always try. I guess it will be more fun and better than playing CPUs all day...

Man, this is so addictive http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZaCzGqTXa70
If I could, I will make this as my ringtone!

 

[Reckless4Christ]

^ lol that's literally what I do.
You really are"lurking,stalking"

 

[fox67890]

"Affirmative, General"

You can legit do a barrel roll after reflecting a projectile though lol. Not even trolling with an April fools joke.

 

[I.S FoxMkloud]

Yeah, as I said on my profile page, in reply to Xiivi, I am following the advice from an old wise fox named James McCloud. "Follow your instincts." Because I am a Fox which means I am a predator to some degree
@fox67890,"Huh? What?" You can? Do you have a vid of that?

 

[Reckless4Christ]

Yeah after you reflect something you have like five frames to roll, jump, or spotdodge.
It's cuz the reflector acts like a shield.

 

[I.S FoxMkloud]

Hmm... I see. Well, I watched plenty of videos about hop thingy but I guess I didn't know about rolling. I guess I should be thankful.

 

[fox67890]

You can roll and spotdodge, but 99.9% of the time, your honestly just better off short hopping tbh

 

[Reckless4Christ]

Oh wow...
I have PROOF you are spammingme with alerts
I got 32 so far today and 18 came from you.
OK now I'm serious. Rolling's not really all that important, or at least if it is, I don't know how todo it without getting punished or putting myself in a bad position.
Jumping's really important, cuz you can SHTL out of shine.So not only do you reflect your opponent's projectiles but also 3 lasers.
One reason why Fox is a good camper.

 

[I.S FoxMkloud]

@R4C, I don't know what you are talking about
@fox67890, that's what I thought... I guess rolls could be used once or twice as a mix up or something.

Anyways, I feel like I am the newest Fox of us all. Well that must be the case because I've been only using Fox seriously for like 2 months. I wonder how long y'all have been using Fox.

EDIT: I got 29 alerts so far and most comes from this thread! If that's the case for me, I kinda feel sorry for those who are inactive on this thread, but then they most likely never set "watch the thread" option on this thread anyways.

 

[Reckless4Christ]

April just now started so about 11 months.
But I'm probably like the youngest though.

 

[fox67890]

I've been using him since brawl came out, but I didn't play competitively then. When I started to, though, I went back to Fox. I've been loyal to Fox for all three smash games (I've only played brawl competitively though)...so yeah.

 

[I.S FoxMkloud]

Oh... so I am the youngest of yall (in terms of Fox age) because I only started main him seriously 2 months. By the way, you all students? Because I am May be I have too much free time at hands.

 

[fox67890]

Yep, student here. Real life should always come first

 

[I.S FoxMkloud]

Yep, real life comes first as always. Like it or not Sometimes it interferes with my Fox development. Wish I was in Summer break without upcoming finals.

 

[Reckless4Christ]

I'm back!
Had some stuff to do, but yeah yall are right.Life(unfortunately) has to come first.