Meta Falco: Approaches and Combos/Strings

[Ffamran]

It looked like he hit Ness after PKT2's hitbox finished or Ness was about to ledge snap ending PKT2 and he hit him. I'm not really sure, though.

 

[Zionaze]

You can hit ness out of PkT2 . Definitely possible. And I did the u-throw > bair on this toon link and fox multiple times so pretty sure the hitstun is long enough

 

[Ffamran]

I was going to ask, but I kept forgetting, but have people been using Falco's Uair backwards? It's a front flip unlike other Uairs like Captain Falcon, Ganondorf, (Dr.) Mario, Luigi, ZSS, and even Marth and Lucina, so the hitbox comes out from the back. RAR Uairs might be a thing for Falco... Geez, everything is backwards for Falco... Can't wait for those reverse Utilt, Ftilt, Up Smash, Down Smash, Nair, Fair, and Dair techs he's going to get. Well, Dair's spike trajectory is angled which means he can sort of stage spike with it which would make it more difficult than just getting spiked for some fighters.

 

[InkPlum]

That's an awesome mix up for the DI, I'll keep working on it. Seems like as long as I'm buffering jump within 10 or so frames of the laser hitting on the up throw, im getting the combo.

 

[Kayzee]

Geez, everything is backwards for Falco... Can't wait for those reverse Utilt, Ftilt, Up Smash, Down Smash, Nair, Fair, and Dair techs he's going to get.

You can jump cancel reverse up smashes. You also get a bit more of a slide from normal jump canceled up smashes as opposed to normal running up smashes.

 

[BlueBirdE]

You can up throw up air above 90% on some characters. Depends their weight and fast fall speed. I can up throw up air falcon in 120s and kill just need to time it differently

 

[AmishTechnology]

Yeah he does get a guaranteed hoo haa but there is a small window and on some characters I don't think there's ever a window where guaranteed up throw up air will kill (e.g. Dedede). If he was able to do it consistently on the entire cast that would buff his viability a ton but we'd probably get complaints about Falco being the next Diddy.

 

[Ffamran]

Actually, Falco would be considered the next Rosalina because his Uair is pretty strong compared to Captain Falcon, ZSS, Meta Knight, Mario, Luigi, and even pre-patch Diddy's. Basically, if Falco's U-throw to Uair was guaranteed at say, 110%, then he's the only character to be able to jump next to the blast zone and boot you in which he can already, but it's not guaranteed like a true combo. His high jump alone makes his Uair strong since even though ZSS has like the third highest jump, her Uair is meant more for juggling than Falco's which kills and juggles. Same with Captain Falcon, Mario, and Luigi. Falco's Uair being frame 10 is what stops it from being as abusable as Diddy's which was powerful and fast instead of being a fast juggle tool like Captain Falcon and ZSS's Uairs. A frame 3 move shouldn't be killing that early. Meta Knight's Uair stops being broken because it's weak in terms of its own power, but chained together as he rises up with his 6 jumps and with Shuttle Loop as a finisher, it's a strong, but not broken tool since you need to be precise to make it work.

Fox, Ganondorf, and Rosalina & Luma's Uair are probably stronger, but Falco covers so much of the air with his jump. If Fox and Rosalina had Falco's jump, they be bordering broken as Fox can shark on the ground before leaping up to kill you while Rosalina's disjointed Uair will be even more terrifying. Ganondorf? If he had Falco's jump, there goes the metagame as you'll have the scariest edgeguarder made scarier and now he can hop up next to you near the blast zone? Screaming for your mother won't be the only thing you're screaming. They are, especially Fox and Ganondorf, are held back by lower jumps which stops their Uair from killing super early. Oh, and since Fox and Ganondorf are fast fallers, they have to be on point with their Uair while Rosalina has more leeway, but being light would make it punishable if she whiffs her Uair.

 

[kenniky]

Hi there! I've been playing a bit of Falco, decided to post stuff I've found. Let me know if anything is a duplicate because most of it probably is

dtilt -> ftilt (low %s) (may have to angle up)
dthrow --> Blaster, Phantasm, Fast Fire Bird (low %s) (basically useless)
dthrow --> dash attack, RAR bair (bread and butter stuff)
dthrow --> Reflector (low to mid%s if DI is read correctly) (this is pretty useless too)
FF nair --> utilt (not sure if true combo but it works a lot) (this can be followed up by stuff like more nairs)
dtilt --> air dodge bait --> fsmash (low %s, obviously isn't true)
fthrow --> something (low %s, I don't remember what this goes to, might have been Phantasm)

yeah

Have a nice day!

 

[ShineFantasm]

I was going to ask, but I kept forgetting, but have people been using Falco's Uair backwards? It's a front flip unlike other Uairs like Captain Falcon, Ganondorf, (Dr.) Mario, Luigi, ZSS, and even Marth and Lucina, so the hitbox comes out from the back. RAR Uairs might be a thing for Falco... Geez, everything is backwards for Falco... Can't wait for those reverse Utilt, Ftilt, Up Smash, Down Smash, Nair, Fair, and Dair techs he's going to get. Well, Dair's spike trajectory is angled which means he can sort of stage spike with it which would make it more difficult than just getting spiked for some fighters.

Rar upair can be risky, I prefer to fast fall a non rar upair as an approche, since it is the end of the hitbox you'll have more time to act if blocked, I often find myself killing ppl at high percent by fast falling uair and then quickly doing dsmash, they dont expect it most of the time, ffuair is an awesome approche tool, and even a great kill move on grounded oponent, I already killed grounded oponent by fast falling upair at high percent, something like 120-130% with myself having 80-90%

 

[SaintNick49]

I like to dash then short hop Fair. You can do it twice if fast enough at the beggining if the fightbi also like to edge gaurd with Fair becsuse Bair it tricky to maintain backwards whils Fair you can move and do it to cover more area

 

[Ffamran]

Patch 1.0.8 has given Falco the ability to become an Airbender! Thanks, for the sick combos @I Am Normal (IAN).

 

[ShineFantasm]

He now prefers the air even more :D

 

[Baskerville]

Some more 1.0.8 Falco combos from terminalkai!

 

[Snipnigth]

Some ppl been saying that upair reduced knockbacka and remuval of the sourspot is a nerf, but really, upair coming out so much faster makes it a more reliable move and enables him to do more combos as seen in these two videos.

 

[Ffamran]

More DPS (damage per second) than DPH (damage per hit), I guess. Having a faster Uair means Falco can do 20% quicker with the new frame 7, low knockback Uair than he can do 22% with a frame 10, high knockback Uair. In general, Falco's DPS is much higher now while not being insane like Captain Falcon who could do 13% with the early hit of his frame 6, low knockback Uair. Now, it does 2% or 3% less overall meaning Captain Falcon does 10% at the very least with a frame 6 Uair. I really want to know exactly how fast Falco's Uair and Fair are now since if Falco's Uair might be frame 6 and Fair being frame 6 would be killer. Now, if only Dair was frame 5 or 8 while being a weak spike, but allowing us to launch and lock people quicker. Sure, he'd lose a powerful spike, but as of now, Dair's still a situational move even more so than Captain Falcon's and sort of has less reward and a higher risk than Ganondorf whose Dair is a much stronger spike and who's a heavyweight and can take a beating unlike Falco. Want this too for Wii Fit Trainer whose Dair is weak for a frame 20 hit - yes, it's that slow.

 

[CommanderVimes]

Patch 1.0.8 has given Falco the ability to become an Airbender! Thanks, for the sick combos @I Am Normal (IAN).

Maybe I'm so far removed from the metagame lately, but those are actual counters on the counter. I forget if that means they are guaranteed on that character or if DI and such is still a thing. I still have some problems moving around with Falco compared to my other characters, but if I can convert more damage like this when I do get in and the combos aren't super absurd to pull off, I want to give him another go

 

[BlueBirdE]

Some ppl been saying that upair reduced knockbacka and remuval of the sourspot is a nerf, but really, upair coming out so much faster makes it a more reliable move and enables him to do more combos as seen in these two videos.

The nerf to knockback messes up the up throw up air kill grab. Works at higher percents now and a smaller range. Some characters who had a short range of percents in the first place probably doesnt work at kill percent anymore. That being said his neutral all around has been buffed. Fair is vastly improved and nair has new properties im gonna have to relab on. Utilt seems to have more hit stun too. Idk all the changes yet but once a datadump hits a link would be appreciated.

 

[SoundChow]

They really buffed Falco's combo game with a low knock back u-air and combo starter nair. I first looked at the patch changes and thought Falco got nerfed slightly, but these combo videos make him look incredible. D-throw nair seems like the optimum throw combo, unless they di down/away in which case bair or dash attack is better.

 

[Ffamran]

U-throw to Uair is more of a combo thing now instead of DI read kill. The main thing is that Falco does more damage in a combo now. Back, you could get U-throw to 2 Uairs, but it wasn't guaranteed past low percents since Uair was slower and the knockback was much stronger. Now, getting 2 Uairs might be easier and that translates to 20% quicker than 22%. Nair's better connection means Falco can U-throw to Nair at low percents without risking much, D-throw to Nair, and maybe F-throw to Nair.

 

[Snipnigth]

The nerf to knockback messes up the up throw up air kill grab. Works at higher percents now and a smaller range. Some characters who had a short range of percents in the first place probably doesnt work at kill percent anymore. That being said his neutral all around has been buffed. Fair is vastly improved and nair has new properties im gonna have to relab on. Utilt seems to have more hit stun too. Idk all the changes yet but once a datadump hits a link would be appreciated.

That kill combo wasent 100% guaranteed to kill or hit at high % ppl could DI from it and some character can even jump or dodge the upair before it hit for example mario, its much more reliable now that its faster allowing more combos and better reactions...also this gives falco even a more reliable hit confim kill combo, im trying sh upair then jump bair, and thx to the low knockback it actually combos, im trying it on C. Falcon and it combos even on 100% great hit confirm to kill combo if you ask me....it also seems that depending on where you hit the upair they will be send flying up or to the sides.

sh up air into bair even combos on kirby on 90~100%, this new upair is awsome.

 

[Ffamran]

Stop, Falco... Stop. We get it; your Nair's good now... Just stop hurting Marth.

 

[EndlessRain]

Stop, Falco... Stop. We get it; your Nair's good now... Just stop hurting Marth.

That last one...

...ain't Falco

 

[Ffamran]

That last one...

...ain't Falco

I know. It's like he came out of nowhere.

 

[Snipnigth]

Stop, Falco... Stop. We get it; your Nair's good now... Just stop hurting Marth.

Now thats a hit confirm to kill combo holy ****!

 

[Zionaze]

Hmmn i guess they just changed a lot of properties that falco used to have and im just not used to it yet :V gotta hit the lab for these new nair combos

 

[Superbat]

Is Falco feasible mid tier now? @ Ffamran smashboards is glitchy on phone. Lol. Nvm saw ur post in the competitive impression boards.

 

[Ffamran]

Really not sure where Falco is now since compared to other characters affected by the patch, Falco pretty much became a new character. Ike is straight up stronger, so is Lucina except her and Marth's jabs work differently now, Captain Falco's Uair was toned down, and Zelda was straight up buffed too. Falco? Falco's aerials minus Bair function differently now. That's like a quarter of his moveset changed. Only time will tell and by that time, he might even be a different character again - Wolf patch, everyone.

 

[Snipnigth]

UMM not sure where to post this but, aparently you can now fast fall lagcancel the last hit of NAIR just like dair cancel but you must hit the last hit of Nair at the same time you hit the ground with fastfall....its actually easier than dair cancel i belive, this is the way im doing it, i sh nair and start spaming fastfall lol, can anyone confirm this?

 

[Zionaze]

UMM not sure where to post this but, aparently you can now fast fall lagcancel the last hit of NAIR just like dair cancel but you must hit the last hit of Nair at the same time you hit the ground with fastfall....its actually easier than dair cancel i belive, this is the way im doing it, i sh nair and start spaming fastfall lol, can anyone confirm this?

thats been my approach option since the patch started lol

 

[CommanderVimes]

And that's just doing a shff nair at the right time? I can add that. I don't really know when to be jumping in and such even with safish attempts, but that comes with time.
What about shff uair?

 

[BlueBirdE]

That kill combo wasent 100% guaranteed to kill or hit at high % ppl could DI from it and some character can even jump or dodge the upair before it hit for example mario, its much more reliable now that its faster allowing more combos and better reactions...also this gives falco even a more reliable hit confim kill combo, im trying sh upair then jump bair, and thx to the low knockback it actually combos, im trying it on C. Falcon and it combos even on 100% great hit confirm to kill combo if you ask me....it also seems that depending on where you hit the upair they will be send flying up or to the sides.

sh up air into bair even combos on kirby on 90~100%, this new upair is awsome.

You arr absolutely right. The changes benefit falco vastly and like other comments say hes almost a new character. I was playing matches earlier and he feels 2-3x faster to me in all honesty. Before i was playing a passive aggressive style and while i stll do i was waay more aggressive at the same time. My lab notes may not apply anymore but im fine to start over again.

 

[CommanderVimes]

What makes him feel faster? The faster startup of Nair and its increase in safety allowing Falco to put himself in situations he could not have been in previously?

 

[Ffamran]

If Nair was any faster, it would be a broken move. The fastest aerial is Little Mac's Nair which isn't good because of its short range, low damage, low knockback, and end lag. The fastes move is frame 1 which includes Little Mac and ZSS's jabs and Pac-Man's Trampoline - maybe some others that I don't know. Falco's Nair is frame 3 which is where the other quick Nairs are: Mario, Dr. Mario, Luigi, Sheik, and Yoshi all have frame 3 Nairs, but only Falco's is a multi-hit.

What's faster is Uair and Fair. Uair is 3 frames faster; startup went from 10 to 7. The lowered knockback also gives that feel where Falco can combo quicker. Fair is faster, but nobody has checked by how fast. It was frame 6 in Brawl, but that might be too quick, but it seems to be in the range of Up Smash's startup of 8 frames. Before the patch, Fair was frame 12 which was slightly faster than his Dair.

 

[Snipnigth]

Shff up air combos into Dair :D

 

[BlueBirdE]

I really feel his aerial speed is improved as well. Wont know for sure until datadump but im really feeling these changes. Utilt combos much easier now i believe it has more hitstun or its just falcos faster to followup. Also is it me or does dair feel safer? Dair changes are appreciated i feel its much morr rewarding to hit now. Im sure this can net earlier kills if properly comboed. Need to lab asap

 

[CommanderVimes]

A nice little kill setup found by Cyro, I'll leave it up to you better players to decide whether or not it is feasible in a real match (have to be really close to the edge).

Either way it is easy to perform, even for me (against standing dummy at least). You don't have to do any additional movement to go from jab to nAir (at least on Falcon), just time the gap between the two moves correctly and both characters follow each other down and it works.

 

[Snipnigth]

I really feel his aerial speed is improved as well. Wont know for sure until datadump but im really feeling these changes. Utilt combos much easier now i believe it has more hitstun or its just falcos faster to followup. Also is it me or does dair feel safer? Dair changes are appreciated i feel its much morr rewarding to hit now. Im sure this can net earlier kills if properly comboed. Need to lab asap

About his aerial speed it might be placebo, but i do feel his jumps are faster, i mean he reaches max altitud faster....hope we get the data soon xD

 

[Ffamran]

@McDareth, your video just got uploaded. Moral of the story: Never trade with Falco's Fair 'cause he ain't a fair player.

Edit: 3 days and we've gotten 5 videos on Falco's Nair. I don't know what's up with the intro or the music, but there's some wicked combos like fast fall Nair to Up Smash: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dhLiHG_Npi0.

 

[ILOVESMASH]

Down tilt is an even better combo starter now. Falco can follow-up / combo from down tilt better than he could previously with up air, nair, and to the lesser extent, fair (I'm assuming this is because of slightly greater hitstun, but I'm not sure). He might have a few kill setups with this, but they are a bit specific in terms of percent ranges. Hitting the D-tilt isn't too difficult either, as you can use it as an OOS option or after jab 1,2.

F-Smash is a bit more useful as well. Falco still can't combo into it, but due to the larger sweetspot, it can catch rolls and ledge getups better than it could before.