Fact 54 - Mewtwo Is On The Way [Social/General Discussion]

[Gavitro]

I kind of think that was the idea...

Well, now I just realized the irony of what I said. I wanted unlockable characters to be a more difficult challenge, and I start to complain about the sheer difficulty of unlocking Mewtwo in Melee.

Anyways, having realized that, I guess Mewtwo is going to be even harder to unlock than before.

I'm going to go on a limb here and say that Mewtwo's unlock requirements might be a set amount of hours playing "For Glory". After all, fighting and showing no mercy to enemies is what Mewtwo does best.

 

[Shroob]

Well, now I just realized the irony of what I said. I wanted unlockable characters to be a more difficult challenge, and I start to complain about the sheer difficulty of unlocking Mewtwo in Melee.

Anyways, having realized that, I guess Mewtwo is going to be even harder to unlock than before.

I'm going to go on a limb here and say that Mewtwo's unlock requirements might be a set amount of hours playing "For Glory". After all, fighting and showing no mercy to enemies is what Mewtwo does best.

I really doubt they'd lock a character to be unlockable via wi-fi matches only. Not everyone plays online.

 

[SethTheMage]

I'm still hopeful for Mewtwo's return. There are a ton of people who say that Greninja lowers Mewtwo's chances, but I don't think so. He was nowhere to be found in Greninja's trailer or even the Direct in general. Not to mention Sakurai's comments on Mewtwo at the X/Y roundtable at last year's E3 or the fact that he's arguably the most requested character for this game.

I'm of the opinion that the only Pokemon veterans that are affected by the Greninja/Charizard trailer are Ivysaur and Squirtle. Since Charizard and all transformation characters are now solo, this means that Pokemon Trainer is not returning. I don't think that Squirtle and Ivysaur have enough going for them on their own to justify three separate Kanto starters as playable fighters. Plus, we now already have a water starter in Greninja.

I think that Mewtwo will be just as he was in Melee: an unlockable character that you have to work for. That suits him just fine. Just as long as he's a LITTLE easier to unlock this time...

I just want my Mewtwo back. Even though he wasn't the greatest, I still used him a bunch in Melee.

 

[Smashoperatingbuddy123]

Ok I'm sick of people getting scared of mewtwo failing again because of greninja

Time to end this

http://www.nowgamer.com/news/1970393/pokemon_in_super_smash_bros_how_theyre_selected.html

That's how he picks pokemon I'm sure mewtwo fits everything as of today and squirtle and ivysaur kicked for jigglypuff and mewtwo

 

[Shroob]

Ok I'm sick of people getting scared of mewtwo failing again because of greninja

Time to end this

http://www.nowgamer.com/news/1970393/pokemon_in_super_smash_bros_how_theyre_selected.html

That's how he picks pokemon I'm sure mewtwo fits everything as of today and squirtle and ivysaur kicked for jigglypuff and mewtwo

Not to nag but, your paranoia is showing.

 

[samsparta21]

He's relevant because of his Mega Evolutions. He's also iconic, and obviously good enough to be a fighter since he was not only in Melee but also in scrapped fighter files from 64 and Brawl. Along with Jiggs, adding Mewtwo would bring the Pokemon total up to 6, equal to the amount in Brawl. Mewtwo literally fills every criteria for a character to be added. If there's a 6th Pokemon rep, it's definitely Mewtwo.

 

[Gavitro]

He's relevant because of his Mega Evolutions. He's also iconic, and obviously good enough to be a fighter since he was not only in Melee but also in scrapped fighter files from 64 and Brawl. Along with Jiggs, adding Mewtwo would bring the Pokemon total up to 6, equal to the amount in Brawl. Mewtwo literally fills every criteria for a character to be added. If there's a 6th Pokemon rep, it's definitely Mewtwo.

Very much agreed. Mewtwo has been more relevant than possibly his own debut as of today. The fact that he was already in Smash before only solidifies his relevance.

Can't wait to see Mewtwo finally stand upright. Surely, being upright is the best feature Smash has introduced.

 

[MewtwoMaster2002]

In regards to if Mewtwo gets in with a Mega Evolution, I would think X would be the one. From the transforming final smashes we've seen, the characters still kept their general movesets. Turning into Y would mean having to change the tail moves because his tail is now on his head...

 

[IsmaR]

X would make him have a bigger hurtbox, to be fair. And his tail sticks upwards rather than down.

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

Mega Mewtwo Y is also much shorter in height. It should also be noted that Mega Mewtwo Y has had a bigger anime involvement than Mega Mewtwo X, much like how Mega Charizard X is used more than Mega Charizard Y.

 

[Xzsmmc]

I'm probably in the minority here, but I don't really want Mewtwo's Mega Evos to factor into his moveset at all. With Lucario and Charizard already doing it, I don't want it to feel overused. Or to put it another way, like another Landmaster situation (ignoring the fact that I'm not a fan of it in XY either). More than anything else, I'd like to see him use Psystrike as a Final Smash.

 

[Smashoperatingbuddy123]

Not to nag but, your paranoia is showing.

Not intirely I still see a couple of prediction rosters without him after the greninja trailer

But I do believe mewtwo is coming back

But yea I feel I'm getting a little upset at people who believe mewtwo is dead because of greninja

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

To be fair, 6 playable Pokemon does reference the maximum Pokemon party amount that you can have in the RPGs. Therefore, Mewtwo and Jigglypuff are still very possible.

 

[godogod]

Well, now I just realized the irony of what I said. I wanted unlockable characters to be a more difficult challenge, and I start to complain about the sheer difficulty of unlocking Mewtwo in Melee.

Anyways, having realized that, I guess Mewtwo is going to be even harder to unlock than before.

I'm going to go on a limb here and say that Mewtwo's unlock requirements might be a set amount of hours playing "For Glory". After all, fighting and showing no mercy to enemies is what Mewtwo does best.

IIRC, Sakurai said he is gonna make unlocking stuff much less tedious than previous games at least a year ago..

You like wolf and falco having the same moves as fox in brawl with the same type of attacks

Wolf's b moves were a little similar but had different enough properties to differentiate it from Falco and Wolf. Everything else outside the special moves of Wolf's is completely different from Fox and Falco.

 

[IsmaR]

IIRC, Sakurai said he is gonna make unlocking stuff much less tedious than previous games at least a year ago..

To be fair, that could mean anything from the SSE not returning (thus everyone being easily unlocked) to only being able to unlock them through VS mode.

Wolf's b moves were a little similar but had different enough properties to differentiate it from Falco and Wolf. Everything else outside the special moves of Wolf's is completely different from Fox and Falco.

Also, try not to post consecutively (double post).

 

[Smash G]

As someone who hates similar characters and clones I'm kind of iffy about Mewtwo returning. If he had his old moveset he would be so similar to Lucario. Give him some new moves and I'd be fine with it.

 

[godogod]

Alright....^^^


So..I'm sure sure this has been discussed before, as there are +60 pages that I can't cycle through, but:

How do people want Mewtwo buffed in this game from the Melee version? Added weight, speed, altered movesets?

For me:

1. Faster movement speed. Doesn't have to be as fast as Greninja, Charizard, and Mewtwo, but he definitely needs a faster movement speed(walk and dashing). I hope his dash speed is above average, and maybe Yoshi to Donkey Kong speed.
http://supersmashbros.wikia.com/wiki/Dashing

2. Heavier weight/less knockback. I get the floatiness, and I'm not expecting him to be as heavy as Ganondorf, but less than Mario in Melee was ridiculous.
I think he should be above average in weight. Doesn't have to be as heavy as Charizard, but Wario to Samus or above is good (107-108).. High middle weight at the very least.
http://supersmashbros.wikia.com/wiki/Weight

Everything else: I haven't played project M or any other mod, but I think the guys at project M did a fantastic job buffing Mewtwo, and if sakurai followed that model verbatim, I wouldn't mind at all.

As someone who hates similar characters and clones I'm kind of iffy about Mewtwo returning. If he had his old moveset he would be so similar to Lucario. Give him some new moves and I'd be fine with it.

In what way besides the special B button and similar side smash?

 

[MewtwoMaster2002]

X would make him have a bigger hurtbox, to be fair. And his tail sticks upwards rather than down.

Giga Bowser has a much bigger hurtbox, but he just didn't flinch. I'd assume the same could work with Mewtwo X. Best thing to do now is wait and see if he gets revealed or not.

 

[False Sense]

As someone who hates similar characters and clones I'm kind of iffy about Mewtwo returning. If he had his old moveset he would be so similar to Lucario. Give him some new moves and I'd be fine with it.

...Mewtwo is not a clone of Lucario... They have one special move that's similar in concept.

By that definition, Samus is a clone of Mewtwo/Lucario.

 

[Smash G]

...Mewtwo is not a clone of Lucario... They have one special move that's similar in concept.

By that definition, Samus is a clone of Mewtwo/Lucario.

I never said he was a clone. I just put him in the same generalized group. He's got several normal attacks and a special attack that are very similar. He feels similar. The style is similar. I want complete and utter uniqueness. Instead Lucario feels like he's a bit too much Mewtwo inspired. So if Mewtwo gets put back I'd hope he'd have some more uniqueness to further separate himself.

Nothing feels cheaper than characters that are too similar to comfort (looking at you Wolf! Get unique specials!). Mewtwo and Lucario are probably the most distant of the bunch and certainly aren't clones but still, too similar in some regards for my tastes.

 

[godogod]

As someone who hates similar characters and clones I'm kind of iffy about Mewtwo returning. If he had his old moveset he would be so similar to Lucario. Give him some new moves and I'd be fine with it.

In what way besides the special B button and similar

I never said he was a clone. I just put him in the same generalized group. He's got several normal attacks and a special attack that are very similar. He feels similar. The style is similar. I want complete and utter uniqueness. Instead Lucario feels like he's a bit too much Mewtwo inspired. So if Mewtwo gets put back I'd hope he'd have some more uniqueness to further separate himself.

Nothing feels cheaper than characters that are too similar to comfort (looking at you Wolf! Get unique specials!). Mewtwo and Lucario are probably the most distant of the bunch and certainly aren't clones but still, too similar in some regards for my tastes.

They feel very different to me. Perhaps besides the special b and side smash similarity, they have the slow fall feel, but that's pretty much it. Their fighting styles are vastly different. Lucario is a close combat fighter and combo well. With Mewtwo, its harder to approach characters from close up.

 

[PLATINUM7]

I never said he was a clone. I just put him in the same generalized group. He's got several normal attacks and a special attack that are very similar. He feels similar. The style is similar. I want complete and utter uniqueness. Instead Lucario feels like he's a bit too much Mewtwo inspired. So if Mewtwo gets put back I'd hope he'd have some more uniqueness to further separate himself.

Nothing feels cheaper than characters that are too similar to comfort (looking at you Wolf! Get unique specials!). Mewtwo and Lucario are probably the most distant of the bunch and certainly aren't clones but still, too similar in some regards for my tastes.

The only similarities I see are their neutral special and even then they are different.
Seriously, what other similarities are there? (Don't say their both Pokemon or something like that)

 

[MewtwoX825]

People that think Mewtwo playing similar to Lucario outside of two moves is a reason for not bringing him back yet get pissed when someone says that Lucas should be cut because his moveset is 100% similar to Ness. By thier logic they must also think a tomato is a vegitable.

 

[samsparta21]

One small thing I noticed: Mew in the PokeBall got replaced by Victini. Not sure if it helps Mewtwo's chances, maybe Mew would be involved in his Final Smash?

 

[Smash G]

People that think Mewtwo playing similar to Lucario outside of two moves is a reason for not bringing him back yet get pissed when someone says that Lucas should be cut because his moveset is 100% similar to Ness. By thier logic they must also think a tomato is a vegitable.

Really? If only that were true. I think Lucas is a cheap half-clone and should be cut too. I don't remember getting pissed. Therefore your whole theory fails.

 

[I_hate_usernames]

One small thing I noticed: Mew in the PokeBall got replaced by Victini. Not sure if it helps Mewtwo's chances, maybe Mew would be involved in his Final Smash?

Mew is in the Pokemon lineup, but he's right in the back.

 

[godogod]

Really? If only that were true. I think Lucas is a cheap half-clone and should be cut too. I don't remember getting pissed. Therefore your whole theory fails.

I got a news flash for you buddy. LOTS of characters in this game have similar specials or even standard attacks, and they aren't necessarily from the same franchise.

Greninja's movesets aren't exactly original themselves. Water Shuriken is your standard charge up projectile B special(samus), Up B is your luigified quick attack(pikachu), and down B is your luigified counter(marth).

 

[Staarih]

One small thing I noticed: Mew in the PokeBall got replaced by Victini. Not sure if it helps Mewtwo's chances, maybe Mew would be involved in his Final Smash?

Mew is still a Pokéball Pokémon, it was featured in one of the press kit 3DS-pictures, here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vqRNuDK-oL0

around the 4:23 mark.

 

[samsparta21]

Mew is still a Pokéball Pokémon, it was featured in one of the press kit 3DS-pictures, here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vqRNuDK-oL0

around the 4:23 mark.

Ah, sorry I didn't see those. What would Mewtwo's Final Smash be though?

 

[Gavitro]

Ah, sorry I didn't see those. What would Mewtwo's Final Smash be though?

Undoubtedly, it's probably going to be one of his Mega Evolutions. Both Lucario and Charizard seem to use their Megas in battle, and it darn well looks like a Final Smash.

 

[samsparta21]

Undoubtedly, it's probably going to be one of his Mega Evolutions. Both Lucario and Charizard seem to use their Megas in battle, and it darn well looks like a Final Smash.

If it's mega Y he'd probably use some AoE psychic move, if it's mega X he would get powered up in melee attacks

 

[woopyfrood]

Also, since work had already been completed on Mewtwo before the release of Brawl that would give the development team a head start on his character as well. We don't know how far along Mewtwo got into production, but if that "leaked" image from Subspace Emissary of him is real, then he must of been really close to being viable. At least I really hope so!

Models in SSB4 are not imported and polished versions of the Brawl ones. Every SSB4 model is made from scratch, even if they use the same design. Also, that image was fake.

I'm probably in the minority here, but I don't really want Mewtwo's Mega Evos to factor into his moveset at all.

You're not alone. Mega Evos are, for the most part, kind of dumb looking. I wouldn't actually mind if it was part of his final Smash, however, because I usually don't play with Smash balls. Besides, when it comes to items, any silliness goes.

How do people want Mewtwo buffed in this game from the Melee version? Added weight, speed, altered movesets?

Faster, heavier, new Side B. As you said, Project M did a bang-up job and I wouldn't mind if Mewtwo was kind of like that in SSB4.

I never said he was a clone. I just put him in the same generalized group.

Several characters in Smash share a kind of fighter archetype. This doesn't mean they're too similar, or that their inclusion is redundant. Sheik, Wii Fit Trainer, and Greninja all fit that lithe ninja athlete feel, but they're clearly very different in practice. I want you to play Mewtwo in Melee (or Project M), then play Lucario in Brawl, and see how they are both a very different experience. If you haven't changed your mind, I just don't know where you're coming from.

Besides, if Lucario really was so derivative, this "Mewtwo is too similar" phenomenon would be the first time I've seen people fail to defend the original. That's like saying Falco should be cut because "Wolf is his spiritual successor."

Ah, sorry I didn't see those. What would Mewtwo's Final Smash be though?

Just a guess: Mewtwo transforms (either randomly or depending on version) into one of his Mega Evolutions as a purely cosmetic feature, flies slightly into the background, then performs Psystrike. Psystrike looks kind of like its in-game animation, in which Mewtwo shoots out a saturation of small Shadow balls that hang in mid-air, then once he is done they zoom inwards towards a reticle, a la Snake's final Smash, to hit enemies. Think Dragon Ball Z's "Hellzone Grenade."

Lastly, I believe that if Pokemon hitting 6 reps is a given, Jigglypuff is absolutely not getting cut. Because really, who else would they add to fill that last slot if Mewtwo was in but Jigglypuff was cut? Genesect?

 

[Staarih]

Ah, sorry I didn't see those. What would Mewtwo's Final Smash be though?

I think Mega evolution is a safe bet, seeing as we have Mega Lucario and Mega Charizard X. I'm not sure if they're confirmed to be Final Smashes, but I assume that they are, because at the end of the Charizard/Greninja trailer, we see Mega Lucario and Mega Charizard X right before Greninja performs his supposed Final Smash, so I think they all hint towards being FS's.

If it's going to be only one mega evolution, it'll definitely be Mega Mewtwo Y, as it is the more popular one (just like Mega Charizard X).

 

[Smash G]

Well you go around the internet and I'm not alone. Tons of people feel this way. Lucario feels too much like Mewtwo to us. I don't care about archetypes. I don't care about anything besides feeling. When comparing Lucario and Mewtwo they feel a heck of a lot more similar than other non-cloney characters. Too much for many people's tastes. Mario and Luigi feel more different .

I much prefer when each character has a certain level of uniqueness. Lucario and Mewtwo don't reach that level for me (and again, many others as this is an issue often brought up). When comparing the amazingness and uniqueness of some characters and then I look at Lucario and Mewtwo I just don't see that same level of uniqueness.

Now, give Mewtwo something more to make him feel a bit different and I'd be all for it. I get the feeling though this debate will just degrade into the same thing it always does when it pops up... "they feel the sameish!", "n0 u! They different and not feel sameish!", "but they DO feel sameish!", "no u!".

 

[woopyfrood]

Well you go around the internet and I'm not alone. Tons of people feel this way. Lucario feels too much like Mewtwo to us. I don't care about archetypes. I don't care about anything besides feeling.

When you pull out statements like "I don't care, that's just how I feel" and the assertion that lots of people agree, you can't really blame us for rebuking you. That isn't a debate, that isn't an argument, that isn't even grounds for discussion. It's a petulant opinion, and you yourself have degraded the conversation into nothing more than a solid brick wall.

 

[Smash G]

Pulling the opinion card is not good. Watch this:
That's your opinion.

Everyone knows everyone else has opinions. It's irrelevant. The problem comes when you base those things solely on opinions. And I'm not seeing that this discussion of Lucario being similar to Mewtwo comes up all the time. I'm basing it on a common trail of thought. Every time someone says "that just, like your opinion man" it's about as helpful as whatever the least helpful thing in the world is. I'd call in Captain Obvious since everyone in this thread is sharing opinions but then I'd just be Captain Obvious myself just the same as you. Stating that things are opinions has no real affect on anything since everything is an opinion.

 

[Gavitro]

When you pull out statements like "I don't care, that's just how I feel" and the assertion that lots of people agree, you can't really blame us for rebuking you. That isn't a debate, that isn't an argument, that isn't even grounds for discussion. It's a petulant opinion, and you yourself have degraded the conversation into nothing more than a solid brick wall.

Pulling the opinion card is not good. Watch this:
That's your opinion.

Everyone knows everyone else has opinions. It's irrelevant. The problem comes when you base those things solely on opinions. And I'm not seeing that this discussion of Lucario being similar to Mewtwo comes up all the time. I'm basing it on a common trail of thought. Every time someone says "that just, like your opinion man" it's about as helpful as whatever the least helpful thing in the world is. I'd call in Captain Obvious since everyone in this thread is sharing opinions but then I'd just be Captain Obvious myself just the same as you. Stating that things are opinions has no real affect on anything since everything is an opinion.

An argument about opinions. Classic.

But anyways, what about Mewtwo's palette swaps, or even alternate costumes? Surprised those haven't been discussed yet.

I'd like Mewtwo to have his armor equipped for an alternate costume, like Project M did. But it saddens me that this will never officially happen.

 

[woopyfrood]

Pulling the opinion card is not good. Watch this:
That's your opinion.

You are the one hampering your own case by prioritizing your feelings over evidence. Thrashing back with a "no u" does nothing. Imagine if I had said "I just feel like Mewtwo and Lucario are different." That certainly would be an opinion, and though people could try to sway me absolutely no one could argue with me because that was how I felt and that would be that. However, we have given our reasonings, it is you who is refusing to give more of yours.

I'm not saying "Oh, that's just your opinion," I'm saying "That is only an opinion." You're not debating in any good sense of the word.

Unless you bring something to the table that I can actually argue against, this topic is going to go nowhere!

But anyways, what about Mewtwo's palette swaps, or even alternate costumes?

Mewtwo will invariably have his shiny palette for Green Team. I cannot think of any alternate costumes, as the anime would never be so directly referenced, and his Mega Evolutions would clearly not work.

 

[Smashoperatingbuddy123]

I think Mega evolution is a safe bet, seeing as we have Mega Lucario and Mega Charizard X. I'm not sure if they're confirmed to be Final Smashes, but I assume that they are, because at the end of the Charizard/Greninja trailer, we see Mega Lucario and Mega Charizard X right before Greninja performs his supposed Final Smash, so I think they all hint towards being FS's.

If it's going to be only one mega evolution, it'll definitely be Mega Mewtwo Y, as it is the more popular one (just like Mega Charizard X).

Well if sakurai does not want to overdose to many common final smash mewtwo could get his signiture move for his final smash psystrike

 

[godogod]

Pulling the opinion card is not good. Watch this:
That's your opinion.

Everyone knows everyone else has opinions. It's irrelevant. The problem comes when you base those things solely on opinions. And I'm not seeing that this discussion of Lucario being similar to Mewtwo comes up all the time. I'm basing it on a common trail of thought. Every time someone says "that just, like your opinion man" it's about as helpful as whatever the least helpful thing in the world is. I'd call in Captain Obvious since everyone in this thread is sharing opinions but then I'd just be Captain Obvious myself just the same as you. Stating that things are opinions has no real affect on anything since everything is an opinion.

An opinion is an opinion. But not all opinions are facts, especially when we're talking about objective matters. This shouldn't even be up for debate. It's a known fact that Mewtwo and Lucario playvery differently. Outside the standard special, speed and distance while rolling, and similar floatiness while jumping, they really don't have anyting else in common. They're as similar as Mario and Luigi from Brawl.

Every character seems to share one move(luigified or not) with another. Little Mac isn't 100% original either. His side B is an awful lot like Ike's..