Fact 54 - Mewtwo Is On The Way [Social/General Discussion]

[The Suit-less Ace]

Shadow pulse for gen 7 so we have,water,dark,dragon and shadow or ghost pulse(which would be the same thing since it's ghost type) for Gen 7!

Sounds cool. I would personally like more steel type moves. Steel is used more defensively but some more attacking moves would be cool. Maybe something with rockets or steel traps? That would be cool too.

By the way, what exactly is Mewtwo's up smash? It's really cool and I never knew what it was, I'd say it's one of his best attacks. (And dat forward grab too, that **** is awesome), think they'll keep these too?

 

[Deleted member]

I was saying you're missing the point (and apparently the defintion of irony)

I don't think anyone actually cares what the move is called nor whether it is the official/canon move. The original suggestion was simply that the move look more like Shadow Claw, regardless of whether or not it actually is the move and whether or not Mewewo can use said move.[/quote]

He had Shadow Claw in Melee, but the legit Shadow Claw did not exist as a Pokémon move yet, I'd like them to keep it, but make the animation look more like the legit Shadow Claw.

Preeeety sure that's a statement that claims they are one in the same.
Oh, and:

I know that irony is the expression of something other than its literal intention (Futurama ftw) among other cases of its literal definition, which are explained in the source this image comes from.
However, I used the word in a way it is commonly misused (which, by definition, is irony in itself); to express when someone is guilty of the action they accuse another for.
You knew what I was saying; just because it isn't a LITERAL case of irony doesn't mean I'm some dumbass that doesn't know what irony is.

't even about Mewtwo so much as it is a petty argument regarding who is right or wrong (and whether or not a credible yet erroneous source matters to a bunch of guys on the Internet).

Why is it credible when the guides they make more often than not contain fabricated information just to make something trivial sound interesting?
Hell, I'm seeing other sources (that I also doubt on credibility) that list the attack as something else: Shadow Slash.
http://wikicheats.gametrailers.com/Super_Smash_Bros._Melee_-_GC/Walkthrough#Move_List_16
http://www.ign.com/wikis/super-smash-bros-melee/Mewtwo
Even the SmashWiki uses both names as a label.

Let's face it; unless the information comes from Nintendo or Sakurai himself, it's subject to questionability.

 

[Chiroz]

Golden, Ismar is right, it does go double for you.

From what I understand your argument is this: Mewtwo's foward air is not Shadow Claw because

1. The move did not exist yet in the handheld RPGs and
2. Mewtwo can't learn it in the handheld RPGS.

I replied to both of your points explaining how those points do not disqualify the move as being Shadow Claw.

I first refuted your first argument, I gave you example of moves that do not exist in the handheld RPGs and yet are referenced by name in Smash itself, allowing the move to have been called Shadow Claw before the actual Shadow Claw was made.

I then gave you example of official Pokemon games where some Pokemon can learn moves they cannot learn in the original handheld RPG, which refutes your second point, allowing Mewtwo to use a move he can't learn in the handheld RPGs.

(Note: There is also examples such as Shadow Ball stated in this thread, which first debuted in the movies and then was created in the games and Mewtwo did use them in the movies. And there are plenty of example of Pokemons in the anime who use moves they cannot learn in the games.)




I then told you, that even if the "Shadow Claw" used by Mewtwo has no connection to the "Shadow Claw" used in the handheld RPGs (which it probably doesn't, but not because of any of the reasons stated above), the move Mewtwo uses is still called "Shadow Claw", so saying: "Mewtwo does not use Shadow Claw" is an incorrect statement. You might want to mean that he does not use the move "Shadow Claw" from the RPGs, but he does use something called Shadow Claw.


I then gave you an example pretty much akin to exactly what you are claiming and instead of refuting my example you just called it "ridiculous" because the "Aura" pokemon would have all moves with the name "Aura" in it, apparently, which had nothing to do with the point I was trying to make.



You also believe a guide who had information on things that were never actually revealed or in the game, yet were conceptualized and were in the game's code, to "invent" information, when in fact it just shows that they have information coming from the dev team itself, as there is no other way to "guess" all of the pokeball pokemons + also guess "Ditto" and for them to all be coincidentially in the game and Ditto having been coincidentally planned and scrapped at the last moments of development. IDK about the other claims of Waluigi or Princess Peach or w/e, but at least in what Ditto is referred, that just gives them more validity into knowing what the development team was doing, and naming an attack is part of the development team's job.




To end it, that point that Ismar stated is true, it goes double for you. You are so fixated on the fact that Mewtwo can't learn Shadow Claw that you miss the fact that most of the points you are using against Melee's Shadow Claw attack are already disregarded by some other Smash attack and as such hold no ground.


Edit: Note: I am not claiming the attack is the RPGs "Shadow Claw" either, I was merely pointing that the "reasons" you exposed as to why is it not that move are not really of importance to Smash.

 

[Steelia]

Mewtwo's fsmash is called Shadow Blast - which is the same name as Shadow Lugia's signature move in Pokemon XD. Time to debate about that :d

jk of course, but this is the first time I've ever heard of Mewtwo's fair being referred to as Shadow Slash. That's still a pretty great name, doesn't quite roll off the tongue as easily though. I could've sworn the old official English SSBM website called Mewtwo's fair Shadow Claw, too? They had move lists for all the characters... Maybe I'm mistaken.

 

[Deleted member]

@ Chiroz : Not even going to bother with a full response, just this:
Not once did I use the fact Mewtwo cannot learn the technique as reasoning as to why they aren't the same. This is why I cannot take your argument seriously. You make a pitiful attempt to make a hypothetical comparison between that and Aura Storm, and heavily fixate on that statement (and still do) when it wasn't even a huge point to my argument.

Hell, I never argued against Smash being able to break canon and give Mewtwo the legit Shadow Claw technique, meaning the whole time, you've been arguing a strawman point.
Even when I've singled out my point in red, you continue to argue something else based on a statement meant as an "to add insult to injury" rather than an actual arguing point.
If you still don't get that and want to continue arguing about the damn "Mewtwo can't learn Shadow Claw" statement, don't bother responding; I'll just ignore it.

 

[Chiroz]

@ Chiroz : Not even going to bother with a full response, just this:
Not once did I use the fact Mewtwo cannot learn the technique as reasoning as to why they aren't the same. This is why I cannot take your argument seriously. You make a pitiful attempt to make a hypothetical comparison between that and Aura Storm, and heavily fixate on that statement (and still do) when it wasn't even a huge point to my argument.

Hell, I never argued against Smash being able to break canon and give Mewtwo the legit Shadow Claw technique, meaning the whole time, you've been arguing a strawman point.
Even when I've singled out my point in red, you continue to argue something else based on a statement meant as an "to add insult to injury" rather than an actual arguing point.
If you still don't get that and want to continue arguing about the damn "Mewtwo can't learn Shadow Claw" statement, don't bother responding; I'll just ignore it.

I will repeat myself yet again.
Mewtwo did not have Shadow Claw.

It doesn't matter what the move was listed as in a strategy guide, it's not the Pokémon move known as Shadow Claw.
Shadow Claw debuted in Generation 4, five years after Melee was released. And guess what? Mewtwo can't even learn it!

And don't bother trying to use Shadow Ball as an example.
That debuted in Generation 2, released two years before Melee. And Mewtwo can learn that.

This is literally the only argument you gave me before you saying I wasn't understanding your "point" (to which I replied with this post).

You were saying?

Apparently I missed some other point because you didn't actually write it down. At least not to me. (Or in the past 5 days, because this argument started 4 days ago and I when I come into a thread I check 1 or 2 pages previous to the thread in order to "catch up". I don't, however, read the whole thread every time I go into a new thread, and I imagine you don't either).

 

[Deleted member]

It's not my fault you didn't bother to read what I said to IsmaR considering you've read what he/she (forgot which, sorry IsmaR) said to me.
And forgetting that for a moment, even if that was the only thing I said on the issue, I WAS NOT using the "Mewtwo can't learn Shadow Claw" as a major point, which I will say yet again.

So on that note, seeing as you still can't grasp that, I'm pretty much through with trying to get you to understand. I'd say it was a pleasure discussing this with you, but it really hasn't. Good day.

 

[Chiroz]

It's not my fault you didn't bother to read what I said to IsmaR considering you've read what he/she (forgot which, sorry IsmaR) said to me.

Ismar came into the argument after you claimed I did not understand your point, so that post holds no value to the discussion of whether I understood your previous point or not. (because at that time Ismar hadn't even posted, unless, again, you are talking about a 6+ days old post, which I will admit to not having read, but neither did I read Ismar's 6+ days old post).

And forgetting that for a moment, even if that was the only thing I said on the issue, I WAS NOT using the "Mewtwo can't learn Shadow Claw" as a major point, which I will say yet again.

So on that note, seeing as you still can't grasp that, I'm pretty much through with trying to get you to understand. I'd say it was a pleasure discussing this with you, but it really hasn't. Good day.

Well, you literally gave NO other arguments, so you can't expect me to guess what your argument was. I can only debate what you actually post for me to read.

 

[Deleted member]

Check the edit. Last thing I'm going to ****ing say.

 

[Chiroz]

Check the edit. Last thing I'm going to ****ing say.

I did, and I also edited.

Just so you know, you are saying I can't grasp that your main point is not that "Mewtwo cannot learn Shadow Claw" even though that was the only point you made.

I don't understand how you expect me to "grasp" a point that was not even written down and also how you expect me to argue against an opinion that apparently has "no point" since the only written one is not its major point and because of that, should not be argued against in your opinion.



Also, you should try to calm down. We aren't discussing for a prize, its a simple discussion about the specifics of a move in a video game, and vague ones at that. I am even agreeing with you on the fact that I do not believe "Shadow Claw" from the RPG references in any way Mewtwo's F-Air, but not because of the reasons you expressed, which is what I was discussing (and the fact that the move is still called Shadow Claw, independently of whatever the RPG move wants to reference or be).

There is no need for anger or profanities.

 

[Deleted member]

On an unrelated note, there is to be a special episode in the anime on April 3rd regarding a battle of Mega Evolutions.

One of those Mega Evolutions? Mewtwo X.

Spoiler

Think we'll finally find out if the old Mewtwo is coming back?

 

[Steelia]

HYPE

Can't wait to see that bad boy in action. Apparently the special consists of more than one part as well. "Pokemon XY Special: Strongest Mega Evolution (Act 1)".

Strongest MegaEvo? Well, we already know the answer to that one. gg other megaevos

 

[woopyfrood]

inb4 they create a third canon Mewtwo who uses the Mega Mewtwo X form instead of just bringing back old Mewtwo.

Spoiler

What about a potential Mega Mewtwo Z? Fourth Mewtwo.

 

[Chiroz]

inb4 they create a third canon Mewtwo who uses the Mega Mewtwo X form instead of just bringing back old Mewtwo.

Spoiler

What about a potential Mega Mewtwo Z? Fourth Mewtwo.

Probably going to happen when Pokemon Z gets released.

I actually hope that Kanto Mewtwo is the one to turn into the other Mewtwo MegaEvo, just to have him back, but somehow I doubt it.

 

[asia_catdog_blue]

Mewtwo's fsmash is called Shadow Blast - which is the same name as Shadow Lugia's signature move in Pokemon XD. Time to debate about that :d

jk of course, but this is the first time I've ever heard of Mewtwo's fair being referred to as Shadow Slash. That's still a pretty great name, doesn't quite roll off the tongue as easily though. I could've sworn the old official English SSBM website called Mewtwo's fair Shadow Claw, too? They had move lists for all the characters... Maybe I'm mistaken.

The Nintendo power Player's Guide listed it as "Shadow Scratch."

 

[DustyPumpkin]

If Mewtwo comes back for Smash I hope it's voiced by Miriam Pultro again

 

[LightningVance]

If Mewtwo comes back for Smash I hope it's voiced by Miriam Pultro again

No. All the no. Mewtwo is not supposed to sound like a chick.

 

[DustyPumpkin]

No. All the no. Mewtwo is not supposed to sound like a chick.

Why?

 

[Diddy Kong]

Forward Air is unofficially Shadow Claw. And that's all. I liked the combo videos though.

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

Some additional Mewtwo size comparisons that I've done up...

 

[Rocket Raccoon]

This just occurred to me, why don't we use X? The Fighting type would be better.

No, just me?

 

[The Suit-less Ace]

This just occurred to me, why don't we use X? The Fighting type would be better.

No, just me?

I was thinking about that. About them using X because it's a fighting type, and SSB is a fighting game. Personally I think they'll use Y, but hey, I could be wrong.

 

[woopyfrood]

Why?

People are too nostalgic for the masculine, anti-heroic rendition of old Mewtwo.

Not only is that a stand-out personality for the Pokemon anime, it also seems to simply match the form better.

 

[Gune]

HYPE

Can't wait to see that bad boy in action. Apparently the special consists of more than one part as well. "Pokemon XY Special: Strongest Mega Evolution (Act 1)".

Strongest MegaEvo? Well, we already know the answer to that one. gg other megaevos

Well seeing that all the mega evos are there its probably all going to make a appearance.

Also Femtwo is cool we need more females in pokemon.

 

[Diddy Kong]

Jigglypuff and Ivysaur not enough for you?

 

[Chandeelure]

Jigglypuff and Ivysaur not enough for you?

Ivysaur is not female ._.

 

[IsmaR]

The only logical solution to please everyone is have masculine Mewtwo be the default voice, with it genderbending into Femtwo upon Mega Evolving.

Alternatively, I'd be down for different alts having different voices, in lieu of He/She Fit Trainer.

 

[Deleted member]

Or just....no voice at all ala Origins.

 

[DustyPumpkin]

Ivysaur is not female ._.

Yes she is

 

[Chandeelure]

Yes she is

http://smashboards.com/threads/ivysaurs-a-girl.171671/page-2
The only argument that I found about that is that Ivysaur has a "female" voice in Japan.
And that's a pretty bad reason to think Ivysaur is female.
But, nobody cares and this is the Mewtwo thread so...meh.

 

[woopyfrood]

Alright, here's how we do this:

Mewtwo Mega Evolves as an aesthetic part of its Final Smash. Mega Mewtwo Y for Wii U, and Mega Mewtwo X for 3DS.

Mewtwo's voiceover takes inspiration from either its Kanto or Kalos anime counterpart, using a masculine personality for Wii U and a feminine one for 3DS, respectively.

 

[Rocket Raccoon]

Techincally Mewtwo is genderless and speaks through telepathy. Meaning it can speak however it feels like.

There's also ProtoMario's theory saying that Mewtwo is an expirement and it can be done more than once and is why Mewtwo has 2 Mega Evolutions.

 

[Gune]

Alright, here's how we do this:

Mewtwo Mega Evolves as an aesthetic part of its Final Smash. Mega Mewtwo Y for Wii U, and Mega Mewtwo X for 3DS.

Mewtwo's voiceover takes inspiration from either its Kanto or Kalos anime counterpart, using a masculine personality for Wii U and a feminine one for 3DS, respectively.

Aww cmon can't we have both?

 

[Toxicroaker]

Alright, here's how we do this:

Mewtwo Mega Evolves as an aesthetic part of its Final Smash. Mega Mewtwo Y for Wii U, and Mega Mewtwo X for 3DS.

Mewtwo's voiceover takes inspiration from either its Kanto or Kalos anime counterpart, using a masculine personality for Wii U and a feminine one for 3DS, respectively.

Why would you make mmx feminine? The feminine mewtwo has the y form. I say put feminine on the Wii U so that I can use the masculine one with mmx.

 

[Rocket Raccoon]

Did my post have no effect on this? You might wanna read it.

Technically Mewtwo is genderless and speaks through telepathy. Meaning it can speak however it feels like.

There's also ProtoMario's theory saying that Mewtwo is an experiment and it can be done more than once and is why Mewtwo has 2 Mega Evolutions.

Might help out a bit

 

[DustyPumpkin]

Why would you make mmx feminine? The feminine mewtwo has the y form. I say put feminine on the Wii U so that I can use the masculine one with mmx.

That sounds awesome, I'm all for Mewtwo X being the feminine and Y being the Masculine.

 

[The Suit-less Ace]

Why would you make mmx feminine? The feminine mewtwo has the y form. I say put feminine on the Wii U so that I can use the masculine one with mmx.

Yes, wouldn't X be male and Y be female if the "Two Mewtwo Theory" is correct? X looks much more masculine and Y looks more feminine.

Did my post have no effect on this? You might wanna read it.


Might help out a bit

I don't really support either side of this theory anymore, but where would they get the data for the experiment to be done again? I really wonder about that sometimes. Like a 100% answer.

Edit: I actually just thought of a few examples myself. But I wonder if anyone has more examples.

 

[Rocket Raccoon]

I don't really support either side of this theory anymore, but where would they get the data for the experiment to be done again? I really wonder about that sometimes. Like a 100% answer.

Just... just watch the video

Think this might be it

 

[TeamFlareZakk]

Because silly, we need Mewbuu.

After all you're the guy proclaiming Lucario is Son Goku, well then we need Mewbuu.

Unless Mewtwo X can be like Celltwo or something?

Now we need Machoke to be King Cold.

 

[Rocket Raccoon]

Because silly, we need Mewbuu.

After all you're the guy proclaiming Lucario is Son Goku, well then we need Mewbuu.

Unless Mewtwo X can be like Celltwo or something?

Now we need Machoke to be King Cold.

Actually this is how I see it.

Spoiler: Mewtwo

is

Spoiler: Mega Mewtwo X

is

or

Spoiler: Mega Mewtwo Y

is