EXTENNNDUURRRRRR (samus gen. disc.)

[Geist]

I don't ever use the grappling function anywhere else besides the ledge o.o

I hope they at least speed her grab up. Samus really doesn't need much else besides a competent grab game. 18 frames is a bit much of a wait. That's almost 1/3 of a second... -_-

 

[abcool]

I think her grapple was sped up, so that won't be a problem. An a little more priorty on charge shot, so needles don't make a plasma beam fade into nothing..

 

[THE RED SPARROW]

Not even Project M can take away the gay that is in brawl. The game still looks wack and boring as all hell.

In other news I think I will never use Samus for the Peach matchup ever again. It makes me feel like a masochist. Float cancels when perfectly spaced and pressured are impossible to contend with in any way and no trade with Peach is in your benefit, esp. if they ***** CCin'.

 

[Pi]

you don't challenge her landing, you challenge her rising and floating

 

[DarrellD]

Someday I'm going to record chain throwing Foxes with Uthrow... it happens sometimes in friendlies, but I never get it recorded...

So apparently according to Noobking I might be the best Samus in BC... kinda sad about that. Get your *** over here, Blowtoes, I need someone to learn from.

****, now I miss Darrell and his random advice.

"SPACE IT, for ****'s sake, Eric... how are you not spacing every attack!?"

<3

Send me an aim if you ever get stuck =]

 

[abcool]

I beg to differ connor brought sexy back in this vid.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tiDWOyK3X2M

When sonic can moonwalk a long distance while surfing to reverse grab tech chase it officially became legit.

 

[Geist]

lmao
I agree it still looks pretty janky. I hate how zair changes your momentum, and little things like that.
But I wouldn't say it looks boring, per se.

 

[THE RED SPARROW]

you don't challenge her landing, you challenge her rising and floating

I know that you can contend her during her those times, but playing someone who knows the matchup limits that possibility. Basically, you can't contend with her ground-to-ground, air-to-ground, and air-to-air. You just have to hope your ground-to-air can disrupt her. So all you can hope is to catch her on the very few intervals where she's not throwing turnips from a safe distance, float canceling into w/e, or whoring her disgustingly high priority normals.

Peach is the one character you can read perfectly and you still can't do nothing about it 90% of the time.

The fact that you can't kill her vertically just makes it more annoying as DI can make her last. So if you're a stock behind you have to risk adding more unnecessary damage (i.e. Down Smash and Nair trades) just to get ahead.

 

[abcool]

I think tether characters are gonna have a new style and i welcome it in a way. If samus has the same defensive style and everyone else has a crazy offense or other good characteristics, then who would wanna play samus, ya know?! I think an easier window to swd and more kb on certain moves, plus zairs are alot more offensive aswell,(So we got something to make up for the nerf) can lead to alot of players wanting to see what she is about. I want her to have some of melee's old strategies, but you have to really be perfect to get far with her as is.

Plus when u play melee again it'll feel refreshing to go back to the old style, but marth and sheik will be there in that tourney waiting to needle your bombs and poke your shield.

 

[Violence]

Wait, why can't you contend with her ground to ground or air to air? What can Peach do against Ftilt? What can Peach do against nair/bair/uair?

 

[resTy]

Ground-to-ground you just have to watch out for that gay dash attack. It beats all Samus' ground moves, I swear to god.
Air-to-air you can probably win if you're below but if you're above, you lose.
Correct me if I'm wrong dudes.

 

[Pi]

her dair is pretty spammy
best approach is probably to just missile in her path and make her do something then follow that
or space a fair since it's disjointed
or nair kind of diagonally

 

[THE RED SPARROW]

Wait, why can't you contend with her ground to ground or air to air? What can Peach do against Ftilt? What can Peach do against nair/bair/uair?

Dash Attack/ FC Nair/ A-A combo >>>> You

What makes Dash Attack a ridiculous move (other than the godly priority) is that even the retraction of the arm has a weak hitbox which can pierce through your shield or act as a psuedo-anti-air preventing you from jump away. It also eats through missiles with ease.

Her slaps negate WD back or jump attempts and offers quick pressure follow ups in the form of grabs or FC Nair.

Peach's Nair, Fair, Bair all beat you entire repertoire of aerials clean 90% of the time. Most Peach players don't realize this so you won't face those kinds of problems generally.


HOWEVER, Samus's Bair is a useful move to trade with when Peach is at a higher %, for obvious reasons.

 

[Pluplue]

her dair is pretty spammy
best approach is probably to just missile in her path and make her do something then follow that
or space a fair since it's disjointed
or nair kind of diagonally

This is all you can really safely do against peach, except fair. I'd say up air or nair instead of that crappy priority fair.

 

[TheLifeRuiner]

i don't agree that you can't contend ground to ground

i don't wanna say more cuz i'm tired~~~~~

 

[Geist]

Red sparrow, you make it seem like it's Samus's worst matchup lol

 

[THE RED SPARROW]

Red sparrow, you make it seem like it's Samus's worst matchup lol

It's certainly my most hated matchup, I hate it even when I've won.

 

[Geist]

Yeah, can't argue with you there.
Matchup's preeee ghey (it's not actually that bad though)

I like Samus v Marth better, there's considerably less ***gotry going around.
Which is weird, if you think about it.

 

[THE RED SPARROW]

Yeah, can't argue with you there.
Matchup's preeee ghey

I like Samus v Marth better, there's considerably less ***gotry going around.
Which is weird, if you think about it.

lol Yeah.


The main reason is that Marth can be combo'd and edgeguarded, and there's no Peach Down Smash.


The main problem is getting Marth into those positions where he's that vulnerable.


But on a technical front, the Marth matchup is worse, but Peach's gayness defies description. All it takes is Down Smash, bomb, or stitchface to completely gain momentum and take a stock. Other than Jiggz no other character has that luxury.

 

[Geist]

Peach can still be combo'd to the extent Marth can (not really that much tbh). The problem is that Nair... You need to be soooo much more specific with your timing and spacing to get more hits, and know specifically when you can't go for a follow-up.

If Samus didn't have charge beam I would abhor the matchup.

 

[THE RED SPARROW]

Peach can still be combo'd to the extent Marth can (not really that much tbh). The problem is that Nair... You need to be soooo much more specific with your timing and spacing to get more hits, and know specifically when you can't go for a follow-up.

If Samus didn't have charge beam I would abhor the matchup.

Peach is floaty, and combined with that cursed Nair it makes following up a combo* a guessing game. The Nair comes out so fast it can put a damper on your combo dreams.


Marth can do a quick Fair but since it's weak and he's generally DIing away nothing can come of it. It's also easier to fake him out into something else.


(*more like an unfavorable position for Peach)

 

[Pi]

it doesn't take much for marth to gain momentum either...
all he has to do is put you in the air and safely cover all your options

the only thing i would say peach has over marth in the matchup is her gimps

aside from that she has nothing that stands out

if she approaches from the ground you know it's going to be 1 of two things
either DA or grab
DA can be shield grabbed
and grab can be spot dodge downsmashed

every attack she hits your shield with (bar projectiles) can be UB'd, her reach is terribad
she can't out-camp you and can't juggle you half as good as marth can
her approaches are **** tbh, doesn't matter if she's FC things into jab, you can just UB w/e she hits your shield with
not like she's going to come down with a grab, and even if she does an empty jump/float, just UB when she's in your vicinity and you'll get her grab too
her punishes are garbage as well
dsmash is a non issue, and her shield pressure is too if you light shield or UB

peaches kind of give me a hard time though because all the hard counters to her **** i don't like to do; ub OoS, camp, not approach.
now if you try to approach the peach through her turnip bull**** and fair float camping you might run into some problems

 

[Geist]

peaches kind of give me a hard time though because all the hard counters to her **** i don't like to do; ub OoS, camp, not approach.
now if you try to approach the peach through her turnip bull**** and fair float camping you might run into some problems

thisthisthis
Mostly my dislike of Peach comes from having to play gay, and it's totally opposite my usual playstyle.



Nice sig Jason lol

 

[AIDS]

Kniht's Sig should have a background of Michael Jackson.

 

[Pi]

i made another one but it's equally uncreative so i don't know when to switch out

 

[DarrellD]

What are we arguing this time samus mains?

 

[Violence]

About Peach Samus, apparently. I don't think it's all that bad for Samus, but I mean, I've only played Pink Shinobi once, and the other three Peaches in Norcal aren't ranked(but they're all close)

 

[resTy]

Let's argue about why Falco is the easiest character in the game. Or is that already known?

 

[Geist]

Jiggs .

 

[Pi]

falco is easier high level play
jiggs is easier TOP level play

imo

 

[AntoPark]

Does anyone ever run off the stage while the other guy's following you and just come back with a spaced bair?

 

[Andymosity]

yeah. that's an old school mind game. i feel that it doesn't work too well in higher level play though.

 

[Geist]

It works better on platforms, mostly there's more situations open where it works, and also because screwing up doesn't cost you a stock. Usually.

 

[abcool]

How many of you guys can pull off swd at will? I was doing it today and did an instant edgehog with it. If it wasn't so strict on timing samus would be soo much better.

 

[Geist]

Sometimes I can do it at 8/10 times at best, but that's spontaneous and rare, usually only for a few minutes.
Some days I can't do it at all.

 

[abcool]

That is why i think samus is underrated. She has alot of techniques, we just suck at executing them. If we could have incorperated swd into our gameplay she would be higher on the tier list. Instant egdehogging, fsmash to swd bair offstage, I even saw phanna use the grapple mixed with it to grab sheik from behind into a utilt. I am gonna try and get the timing on it down. If not idk, i hope Wes samus can be more consistent with it and develop a new style for her.

 

[AntoPark]

I used to really love SWD(it was partly why I began to use samus in the first place), but I realized even at the peak of my consistency(about 80%), it wasn't very useful. Admittedly, it may have just been me not being able to combo with SWD. Also, people that play with me often know that I can SWD so they usually try to predict it with some smash attack whenever I use a bomb. :[ Nowadays I can only get it to come out half of the times, maybe even less. I only use it to get out of situations where people respawn right above me or faraway edgehogs.

 

[Geist]

Imo it's overrated. Sure, it gives you fastest ground mobility, and you can do crazy stuff, but it never surpasses the reliability of a novelty. I mean, it shouldn't exactly come as a surprise when you SWD, people have more than enough time to prepare. The times when it's most effective is situational.

I'm not saying it woudn't make her at least a little better, it just isn't gamebreaking.

 

[abcool]

If they were expecting it, that could have been your chance to mindgame the hell out of them. Samus have projectiles for a reason. If they throwing out random attacks(Which are usually laggy) You could have faked the first bomb or just simply wavedash forward. I think that is where mixups comes into play. Either way it's fast enough for u to have an advantage.

I wouldn't say a huge advantage, but look at it like this.... you pop across the stage at a high speed in neutral position and can cancel the animation at any point. That would be less lag than normal wavedash. The start up for it could be used when your opponent is trying to use aerials. It could also help with mindgamed charge shots. I also know if would help against campy jiggs players.

 

[Geist]

But from a distance close enough that you could capitalize on a whiffed move, SWD loses much of what makes it good.
Not to mention a spaced aerial is all it would take to beat out most of your options at that distance. Assuming you had perfect control over it of course. The chance of error from that proximity makes it super risky.