Event - E3 Invitational 2014 E3 2014 Rumor/Leak Discussion Thread

[Deleted member]

Yes but so were Doctor Mario and Roy, and I don't see them returning.

This goes back to the issue of continuing to develop popular interest in a franchise. Mewtwo was the first mega evolution revealed for Pokemon X and Y, and thus contributed greatly to the development of popular interest in that game because it not only introduced Mega Evolutions, but did so with a character that is widely recognizable within the Pokemon franchise. Certainly characters such as Fox and Captain Falcon exist as characters that have not had a new franchise for years, however, it stands to reason that these characters have stayed simply because of their residency in Smash 64, which has yet to have any of its members cut from a roster of one of the newer smash games. Dr. Mario and Roy were a part of the code for Brawl, yes, but the disparity between those two and Mewtwo is that Mewtwo has been "revived" in a sense thanks to his use to introduce the Mega Evolutions in the newest generation of Pokemon. Also, in Melee, Dr. Mario and Roy existed as clones of Mario and Marth (respectively) with only different move attributes to set them apart from the characters of which they are cloned. Mewtwo on the other hand is his own unique character with his own unique moveset. Knowing that Sakurai quite enjoys the concept of uniqueness in the fighters he adds to the games (as seen with the additions of WFT and the Villager), it would make sense that he would be more prone to bring back a more unique and well known character like Mewtwo as opposed to bringing back two characters that have not been very involved with their franchises for quite some time that would also take a great amount of time in order to prevent them from becoming simple clones of Mario and Marth once again.

What of course is the glaring problem here is the existence of Ganondorf, who existed as a slow Captain Falcon clone in Melee. However, he is a slightly different case in the sense that he came back in Brawl. I believe that Sakurai decided to bring him back (although he was a clone in his first appearance) mostly because Ganondorf had remained relevant in the LoZ franchise as one of the major antagonists in the new LoZ title of that time, Twilight Princess. Thus, Ganondorf's inclusion is somewhat logical in the sense that he still existed as a prominent character in the Zelda games at the current time, and Sakurai actually managed to make him slightly more of his own character by tweaking some of his moves. The fact that Sakurai decided to prepare Ganondorf before Dr. Mario and Roy somewhat supports this claim as it seems to show that Sakurai wanted to finish the wanted characters that were still relevant/easily recognizable first.

Another problem that is had by Roy is the way that the Fire Emblem games are created. With the exception of rare paired-sequel games like PoR and Radiant Dawn, every new Fire Emblem title takes place in a new continent with a new set of characters. Going back to wanting to include most relevant/recognizable characters for the sake of developing popularity, it is thus logical that Sakurai chose to finish/include Ike first since he was the most current Fire Emblem Representative of that time and since Ike didn't have the issue of needing to be "uncloned" in order to be a fresh and enjoyable character.

Moving to Dr. Mario, the major issue that exists with him is the fact that he is literally an alternate costume of Mario with slight variation in his moveset attributes and visual aesthetics to set him apart. Going back to Sakurai wanting to include more unique and fresh characters, it is thus logical from this standpoint that Dr. Mario was a low-priority character to be developed (not to mention that he would've had the same "uncloning" problem (with a lack of relevancy) that Roy had). As such, with future releases it would make sense that Dr. Mario will from here on out be more likely an alternate costume for Mario (if having any presence at all) since as more games are created, Sakurai will continue to desire the addition of more current and unique characters in order to keep the newer additions to the Smash Franchise as enjoyable as the early iterations.

EDIT: Apologies in advance for possible topic irrelevancy and thank you for reading.

 

[hotcrumpets]

There is literally a 0% chance that the disgusting ridley leak is real, do we know if it was posted by the guy who posted the first 2 leaks?

 

[GamerGuy09]

I'm just gonna take a step back for a second and say that, subjectively, this whole leak reeks of fakery. It doesn't make a lot of sense to me why somebody would take photos so close to the screen like this. Why not just take a complete photo?

And as far as the design of the screen is concerned, there are a lot of design decisions that don't feel right to me, but again, that's hard to objectify. The use of the smash logo stripes on the locks feels very amateur, as it's bad practice to overuse a brand element like that. The fact that the images are essentially identical to images found on the website also smells funny. And the fact that any implication of a new character that hasn't been revealed has been shown in some cryptic way where they're cleverly cropped. To me, that communicates that the person posting the photos is trying to make us dance, which is exactly what we're doing.

The first 2 original pics don't show us anything that we should be skeptical about, but all the subsequent images haven't been rock solid like the first 2 images (Ridley, Pacman, etc.)

If this is indeed the character select screen, it's still a reasonable assumption to make that only the first 2 pictures are legitimate.

But again, the idea of fragmenting the starter characters by scattering them among a field of lock icons doesn't feel like something the design team would do based on all the precedents we have seen in past games.

Agree fully. This just hurts my brain now...

There is literally a 0% chance that the disgusting ridley leak is real, do we know if it was posted by the guy who posted the first 2 leaks?

Only Bird Jesus knows now.

 

[Con0rrrr]

I'm just gonna take a step back for a second and say that, subjectively, this whole leak reeks of fakery. It doesn't make a lot of sense to me why somebody would take photos so close to the screen like this. Why not just take a complete photo?

And as far as the design of the screen is concerned, there are a lot of design decisions that don't feel right to me, but again, that's hard to objectify. The use of the smash logo stripes on the locks feels very amateur, as it's bad practice to overuse a brand element like that. The fact that the images are essentially identical to images found on the website also smells funny. And the fact that any implication of a new character that hasn't been revealed has been shown in some cryptic way where they're cleverly cropped. To me, that communicates that the person posting the photos is trying to make us dance, which is exactly what we're doing.

The first 2 original pics don't show us anything that we should be skeptical about, but all the subsequent images haven't been rock solid like the first 2 images (Ridley, Pacman, etc.)

If this is indeed the character select screen, it's still a reasonable assumption to make that only the first 2 pictures are legitimate.

But again, the idea of fragmenting the starter characters by scattering them among a field of lock icons doesn't feel like something the design team would do based on all the precedents we have seen in past games.

They wouldn't take a pic of anything but the screen to avoid being found out on where the pic is. Even Pic 7 explained that but we theorized that a lot earlier. The odder the CSS is the more credit it gets in my book. Because CSS fakers play it safe, and have no reason to take risks like that.

 

[The Light Music Club]

This goes back to the issue of continuing to develop popular interest in a franchise. Mewtwo was the first mega evolution revealed for Pokemon X and Y, and thus contributed greatly to the development of popular interest in that game because it not only introduced Mega Evolutions, but did so with a character that is widely recognizable within the Pokemon franchise. Certainly characters such as Fox and Captain Falcon exist as characters that have not had a new franchise for years, however, it stands to reason that these characters have stayed simply because of their residency in Smash 64, which has yet to have any of its members cut from a roster of one of the newer smash games. Dr. Mario and Roy were a part of the code for Brawl, yes, but the disparity between those two and Mewtwo is that Mewtwo has been "revived" in a sense thanks to his use to introduce the Mega Evolutions in the newest generation of Pokemon. Also, in Melee, Dr. Mario and Roy existed as clones of Mario and Marth (respectively) with only different move attributes to set them apart from the characters of which they are cloned. Mewtwo on the other hand is his own unique character with his own unique moveset. Knowing that Sakurai quite enjoys the concept of uniqueness in the fighters he adds to the games (as seen with the additions of WFT and the Villager), it would make sense that he would be more prone to bring back a more unique and well known character like Mewtwo as opposed to bringing back two characters that have not been very involved with their franchises for quite some time that would also take a great amount of time in order to prevent them from becoming simple clones of Mario and Marth once again.

What of course is the glaring problem here is the existence of Ganondorf, who existed as a slow Captain Falcon clone in Melee. However, he is a slightly different case in the sense that he came back in Brawl. I believe that Sakurai decided to bring him back (although he was a clone in his first appearance) mostly because Ganondorf had remained relevant in the LoZ franchise as one of the major antagonists in the new LoZ title of that time, Twilight Princess. Thus, Ganondorf's inclusion is somewhat logical in the sense that he still existed as a prominent character in the Zelda games at the current time, and Sakurai actually managed to make him slightly more of his own character by tweaking some of his moves. The fact that Sakurai decided to prepare Ganondorf before Dr. Mario and Roy somewhat supports this claim as it seems to show that Sakurai wanted to finish the wanted characters that were still relevant/easily recognizable first.

Another problem that is had by Roy is the way that the Fire Emblem games are created. With the exception of rare paired-sequel games like PoR and Radiant Dawn, every new Fire Emblem title takes place in a new continent with a new set of characters. Going back to wanting to include most relevant/recognizable characters for the sake of developing popularity, it is thus logical that Sakurai chose to finish/include Ike first since he was the most current Fire Emblem Representative of that time and since Ike didn't have the issue of needing to be "uncloned" in order to be a fresh and enjoyable character.

Moving to Dr. Mario, the major issue that exists with him is the fact that he is literally an alternate costume of Mario with slight variation in his moveset attributes and visual aesthetics to set him apart. Going back to Sakurai wanting to include more unique and fresh characters, it is thus logical from this standpoint that Dr. Mario was a low-priority character to be developed (not to mention that he would've had the same "uncloning" problem (with a lack of relevancy) that Roy had). As such, with future releases it would make sense that Dr. Mario will from here on out be more likely an alternate costume for Mario (if having any presence at all) since as more games are created, Sakurai will continue to desire the addition of more current and unique characters in order to keep the newer additions to the Smash Franchise as enjoyable as the early iterations.

In my eyes I agree full on with the Roy thing. Fire Emblem is in a way like Pokemon, with a new cast almost every game. And look at Mewtwo, he was behind Lucario in the development line.

 

[Shroob]

This goes back to the issue of continuing to develop popular interest in a franchise. Mewtwo was the first mega evolution revealed for Pokemon X and Y, and thus contributed greatly to the development of popular interest in that game because it not only introduced Mega Evolutions, but did so with a character that is widely recognizable within the Pokemon franchise. Certainly characters such as Fox and Captain Falcon exist as characters that have not had a new franchise for years, however, it stands to reason that these characters have stayed simply because of their residency in Smash 64, which has yet to have any of its members cut from a roster of one of the newer smash games. Dr. Mario and Roy were a part of the code for Brawl, yes, but the disparity between those two and Mewtwo is that Mewtwo has been "revived" in a sense thanks to his use to introduce the Mega Evolutions in the newest generation of Pokemon. Also, in Melee, Dr. Mario and Roy existed as clones of Mario and Marth (respectively) with only different move attributes to set them apart from the characters of which they are cloned. Mewtwo on the other hand is his own unique character with his own unique moveset. Knowing that Sakurai quite enjoys the concept of uniqueness in the fighters he adds to the games (as seen with the additions of WFT and the Villager), it would make sense that he would be more prone to bring back a more unique and well known character like Mewtwo as opposed to bringing back two characters that have not been very involved with their franchises for quite some time that would also take a great amount of time in order to prevent them from becoming simple clones of Mario and Marth once again.

What of course is the glaring problem here is the existence of Ganondorf, who existed as a slow Captain Falcon clone in Melee. However, he is a slightly different case in the sense that he came back in Brawl. I believe that Sakurai decided to bring him back (although he was a clone in his first appearance) mostly because Ganondorf had remained relevant in the LoZ franchise as one of the major antagonists in the new LoZ title of that time, Twilight Princess. Thus, Ganondorf's inclusion is somewhat logical in the sense that he still existed as a prominent character in the Zelda games at the current time, and Sakurai actually managed to make him slightly more of his own character by tweaking some of his moves. The fact that Sakurai decided to prepare Ganondorf before Dr. Mario and Roy somewhat supports this claim as it seems to show that Sakurai wanted to finish the wanted characters that were still relevant/easily recognizable first.

Another problem that is had by Roy is the way that the Fire Emblem games are created. With the exception of rare paired-sequel games like PoR and Radiant Dawn, every new Fire Emblem title takes place in a new continent with a new set of characters. Going back to wanting to include most relevant/recognizable characters for the sake of developing popularity, it is thus logical that Sakurai chose to finish/include Ike first since he was the most current Fire Emblem Representative of that time and since Ike didn't have the issue of needing to be "uncloned" in order to be a fresh and enjoyable character.

Moving to Dr. Mario, the major issue that exists with him is the fact that he is literally an alternate costume of Mario with slight variation in his moveset attributes and visual aesthetics to set him apart. Going back to Sakurai wanting to include more unique and fresh characters, it is thus logical from this standpoint that Dr. Mario was a low-priority character to be developed (not to mention that he would've had the same "uncloning" problem (with a lack of relevancy) that Roy had). As such, with future releases it would make sense that Dr. Mario will from here on out be more likely an alternate costume for Mario (if having any presence at all) since as more games are created, Sakurai will continue to desire the addition of more current and unique characters in order to keep the newer additions to the Smash Franchise as enjoyable as the early iterations.

EDIT: Apologies in advance for possible topic irrelevancy and thank you for reading.

I agree with this, but I'm not going to count my chickens before they hatch, honestly. I still believe that Lucas will be in.

 

[Gameboi834]

But again, the idea of fragmenting the starter characters by scattering them among a field of lock icons doesn't feel like something the design team would do based on all the precedents we have seen in past games.

Sigh.

Again, if you read the thread you'd know that the design is very similar to other Bamco games, such as Soul Calibur, merged with typical Smash CSS's.

 

[Bladeviper]

I'm just gonna take a step back for a second and say that, subjectively, this whole leak reeks of fakery. It doesn't make a lot of sense to me why somebody would take photos so close to the screen like this. Why not just take a complete photo?

And as far as the design of the screen is concerned, there are a lot of design decisions that don't feel right to me, but again, that's hard to objectify. The use of the smash logo stripes on the locks feels very amateur, as it's bad practice to overuse a brand element like that. The fact that the images are essentially identical to images found on the website also smells funny. And the fact that any implication of a new character that hasn't been revealed has been shown in some cryptic way where they're cleverly cropped. To me, that communicates that the person posting the photos is trying to make us dance, which is exactly what we're doing.

The first 2 original pics don't show us anything that we should be skeptical about, but all the subsequent images haven't been rock solid like the first 2 images (Ridley, Pacman, etc.)

If this is indeed the character select screen, it's still a reasonable assumption to make that only the first 2 pictures are legitimate.

But again, the idea of fragmenting the starter characters by scattering them among a field of lock icons doesn't feel like something the design team would do based on all the precedents we have seen in past games.

to be fair though namco is working on the game and this is how they have set up fighting game screens in the past that have locked characters, also the first two pic never showed or even hinted at a new character and there is no way to prove that the same person posted all 7 pics and even the guy that posted the 7th pic said he didnt post the first ones.

edit: ninja'd

 

[RIDLEY is too SMALL]

There is literally a 0% chance that the disgusting ridley leak is real, do we know if it was posted by the guy who posted the first 2 leaks?

He himself confirmed that he is a different person.

 

[Shroob]

He himself confirmed that he is a different person.

That means very little. If I were to create a thread on 4chan and then make another thread to make fun of my previous thread, I could just easily say "That's not me" and you wouldn't be able to prove it.

 

[The Light Music Club]

From my stand point, it would have to be that images 3, 4, and 7 would have to be the same guy because the Ridley pixel that is off in image 3 is present in image 7, and we get a whole look at the css box with the off pixel in image 7, which wouldn't be possible unless they are the same person.

And who ever said the fragmenting the characters thing, I agree with, because in Melee, Pikachu was in between Mario and Peach, and not down with the question mark icons.

 

[Bladeviper]

That means very little. If I were to create a thread on 4chan and then make another thread to make fun of my previous thread, I could just easily say "That's not me" and you wouldn't be able to prove it.

but it does go both ways so its just more speculation on the pile lol

 

[hotcrumpets]

He himself confirmed that he is a different person.

good point lol should of looked closer, but ya That ridley leak is almost definitely fake, ridley just feels off from the rest off the cast.

 

[Artsy Omni]

Sigh.

Again, if you read the thread you'd know that the design is very similar to other Bamco games, such as Soul Calibur, merged with typical Smash CSS's.

Dude, cool your jets. =P No need to play strawman with one portion of a larger post just for the sake of being more "up on the thread" than somebody else. There's no harm in somebody retreading some familiar ground in a thread that's moving this fast. You can't possibly expect every person who contributes to the thread to read every single past post before being allowed to say something.

 

[Shroob]

Honestly, we're running around in circles with nothing new being discovered. I'm half tempted to call for a thread closing until all of this dies down, or bar mention of this, because we've gotten nowhere.

 

[Opelucid]

Remember when Binacle was too ugly to be real?

 

[Con0rrrr]

From my stand point, it would have to be that images 3, 4, and 7 would have to be the same guy because the Ridley pixel that is off in image 3 is present in image 7, and we get a whole look at the css box with the off pixel in image 7, which wouldn't be possible unless they are the same person.

Which, even though there's some good evidence against it, Pics 3 and 4 could still be real. Considering we had to look that much into a picture that would have to be entirely photoshopped because the artist would have no starting canvas means something. It took that much work to find a minute detail that could lead toward it being fake.

 

[The Light Music Club]

Which, even though there's some good evidence against it, Pics 3 and 4 could still be real. Considering we had to look that much into a picture that would have to be entirely photoshopped because the artist would have no starting canvas means something. It took that much work to find a minute detail that could lead toward it being fake.

I understand that. I'm just trying to link up some more of the pieces.

 

[GamerGuy09]

Honestly, we're running around in circles with nothing new being discovered. I'm half tempted to call for a thread closing until all of this dies down, or bar mention of this, because we've gotten nowhere.

Please no, I either want this to keep going until E3 or until we get a conclusion. It passes the time for me.

 

[Con0rrrr]

Honestly, we're running around in circles with nothing new being discovered. I'm half tempted to call for a thread closing until all of this dies down, or bar mention of this, because we've gotten nowhere.

We're in the middle of analyzing a new pic, why close it?

 

[Gameboi834]

You can't possibly expect every person who contributes to the thread to read every single past post before being allowed to say something.

I mean, it would make life a lot easier on me, sooo...

 

[RIDLEY is too SMALL]

good point lol should of looked closer, but ya That ridley leak is almost definitely fake, ridley just feels off from the rest off the cast.

hotcrumpets, I believe you were the one who said a while back that the IP address for the guy who posted Pic #6 was the same IP address as the guy who posted the first 2 pics, and that this was discussed on 4chan. Is this correct, or did I misunderstand something? Because I can't find any such discussion of his IP address in the archived 4chan thread of Pic #6.

 

[Sebagomez]

He [maybe] do a photoshop of this image

And anything that image have, you can find on the internet very easy

EDIT: In the image say "Smash / Free For All" in this image say "Online > With Anyone"

 

[Bladeviper]

so at this point the only pic 100% debunked is what 5, cause the ridley box moves a bunch lol

 

[Shroob]

We're in the middle of analyzing a new pic, why close it?

Because it always ends the same. We 'killed' this last night but people still kept debating it. This leak keeps dying and coming back to life more than Kenny McCormick.

 

[GamerGuy09]

He [maybe] do a photoshop of this image

And anything that image have, you can find on the internet very easy

It would actually be very easy to do. Let me try for a second.

 

[Aninymouse]

Remember when Binacle was too ugly to be real?

I do remember, mostly because I thought Binacle was soooooooo ugly. I've grown to accept it, but at the time? I know where you're going with this.

Personally, I always thought Ridley was hideously ugly. One ugly Ridley isn't any worse than another, in my book.

 

[Opelucid]

I'm really divided about Ridley I want him in so I'm hoping that this is real.

The design is kind of rough looking; but Ridley isn't supposed to be pretty or cute either he's a space dragon for gods sake

 

[Con0rrrr]

hotcrumpets, I believe you were the one who said a while back that the IP address for the guy who posted Pic #6 was the same IP address as the guy who posted the first 2 pics, and that this was discussed on 4chan. Is this correct, or did I misunderstand something? Because I can't find any such discussion of his IP address in the archived 4chan thread of Pic #6.

You cannot track an IP on 4chan. People don't seem to get that. Everyone is anonymous so there is nothing to track. Which explains why most legitimate (and fake) leaks are posted there, there is no way to retrace.

 

[The Light Music Club]

I do remember, mostly because I thought Binacle was soooooooo ugly. I've grown to accept it, but at the time? I know where you're going with this.

Personally, I always thought Ridley was hideously ugly. One ugly Ridley isn't any worse than another, in my book.

The only Ridley that looks good in my book is the boss one.

-Who is to big to smash.

 

[Con0rrrr]

Because it always ends the same. We 'killed' this last night but people still kept debating it. This leak keeps dying and coming back to life more than Kenny McCormick.

Well, you're not wrong XD

 

[Bladeviper]

You cannot track an IP on 4chan. People don't seem to get that. Everyone is anonymous so there is nothing to track. Which explains why most legitimate (and fake) leaks are posted there, there is no way to retrace.

you can get ip address through hacking the 4chan server but then again people on 4chan use proxy address all the time so its super hard to prove/disprove anything on 4chan

 

[RIDLEY is too SMALL]

He [maybe] do a photoshop of this image

And anything that image have, you can find on the internet very easy

EDIT: In the image say "Smash / Free For All" in this image say "Online > With Anyone"

Um, yeah, because that's the official way that the menu screens look. Whether or not the leak is true, the menus are going to look this way because that's the official style.

 

[Con0rrrr]

you can get ip address through hacking the 4chan server but then again people on 4chan use proxy address all the time so its super hard to prove/disprove anything on 4chan

People that claim to hack 4chan's servers are just trying to scare you. Very hard to do, and no recorded instances of it happening and working

 

[Aninymouse]

The only Ridley that looks good in my book is the boss one.

-Who is to big to smash.

On second thought, wasn't it meta ridley in brawl's boss mode? If so, meta ridley does look pretty legit. It's the purple, skeletal version I think is hideous.

 

[Artsy Omni]

I mean, it would make life a lot easier on me, sooo...

Lol, nope, sorry. I'm not that nice.

He [maybe] do a photoshop of this image

And anything that image have, you can find on the internet very easy

EDIT: In the image say "Smash / Free For All" in this image say "Online > With Anyone"

Interesting to note that the "e" in "Anyone" doesn't match the "e" in "Free for all" in the leaks. The counterspace in the "e" is smaller in the real picture, and the drop shadow is also perfectly round behind it in the real pic, whereas in "Free," the drop shadow corresponds to the gap between the bowl of the "e" and the terminal stroke below it.

 

[Sebagomez]

Um, yeah, because that's the official way that the menu screens look. Whether or not the leak is true, the menus are going to look this way because that's the official style.

I know. But I say, that one can use this as a base for another.

 

[Bladeviper]

People that claim to hack 4chan's servers are just trying to scare you. Very hard to do, and no recorded instances of it happening and working

you do have to remember how many hackers hang out on that site though it is possible, i dont think anyone did for this thing as most people dont care on 4chan but they do have the people that could do it lurking around

 

[Gabeking54]

Holy **** why did this thread jump like 50 pages in a day? Lol

 

[RIDLEY is too SMALL]

Lol, nope, sorry. I'm not that nice.


Interesting to note that the "e" in "Anyone" doesn't match the "e" in "Free for all" in the leaks. The counterspace in the "e" is smaller in the real picture, and the drop shadow is also perfectly round behind it in the real pic, whereas in "Free," the drop shadow corresponds to the gap between the bowl of the "e" and the terminal stroke below it.

I think the "e" in the leaks was actually determined to be the smash icon.

EDIT: totally misread your post. sorry. I thought you meant the e that was slightly cut off