Official DLC Speculation Discussion Volume II

[Dukefire]

So, what characters may be cut for Smash 6? Any updated changes to the current characters? New moveset perhaps?

 

[Michael the Spikester]

So, what characters may be cut for Smash 6? Any updated changes to the current characters? New moveset perhaps?

are certainly biting it.

 

[CureParfait]

We begin speculating what Smash 6 newcomers will be!

Guessing Waluigi, Dixie, Spring Man and Rex are certainly shoe-ins?

I think the shoe-ins would be Waluigi, Spring Man, and Rex at the very least.

 

[DaybreakHorizon]

Made a meme about Smash DLC now that it's all concluded:



RIP Capcom fans my heart really goes out to y'all.

 

[N3ON]

Or participate in Japan only events to get a couple trophies:

Mmm, I think I'd draw the line at transcontinental airfare. ;P

I wonder what Sakurai’s last column will be like, where he talks about Sora and maybe even what he’ll do for the future

Probably driving around in his sports car drinking diet coke like a Chad among Chads.

Poor Rex can't catch a break apparently. Has joined Waluigi and Spring Man.

Well those two might actually get in next time. Waluigi at least. We'll have to see what becomes of ARMS.

 

[Momotsuki]

So, what characters may be cut for Smash 6?

Don't care, we have Ultimate.

 

[Ivander]

Well, that's that for Smash Ultimate, and likely Smash as a whole for a solid decade if not more.

Right now I'm just sitting here as the dust settles and am just thinking to myself

View attachment 333365

We begin speculating what Smash 6 newcomers will be!

Guessing Waluigi, Dixie, Spring Man and Rex are certainly shoe-ins?

Geez, slow down, we still got like, what, another possible 3 years before the next Smash game?

That said, I can imagine Waluigi, maybe another ARMS rep, if Nintendo and Microsoft are still good with each other, Master Chief could happen. Ring Fit and Astral Chain are other possibilities. Depending on how Metroid Dread does, we could get another Metroid rep with the Chozo General or another possibile unrevealed character. We could get another Zelda rep depending on Breath of the Wild 2. Pokemon, Fire Emblem and Splatoon feel like easy predictions. If Advance Wars does well, maybe an Advance Wars rep(but that'll also heavily depend on fans working together).

Otherwise, not really much to talk about until the next Smash is actually announced at the time, where we'll have more stuff and new games to talk and speculate about.

 

[Michael the Spikester]

Rex

Not likely tbh. Didn't occur to me but Xenoblade 3 will be out by then and certainly the protagonist of that will get in before Rex does.

 

[Ivander]

Is it…possible to top this? Sure there are other hype reveals but Sora literally won the popularity contest.

I can't exactly imagine. While Master Chief would be a big one for the West and an actual Microsoft character would be pretty big, Sora is huge all-around. Not to mention that if Nintendo and Microsoft keep their good relationship, Master Chief can quite possibly be expected for the next Smash Bros. A Playstation character would be pretty huge too, but that depends on how popular Kratos and Rachet are in other parts, including Japan.

If I had to take one very out-there guess, I think the only one that could possibly match with Sora in the hype meter, it would be the Hunter from Bloodborne.

For the first factor, The Hunter from Bloodborne is a Sony Playstation character, as well as from an M-rated game with alot of visceral and gory action, much like Doom and Mortal Kombat. The second factor: Bloodborne was probably one of the most popular games from the last Gen. Like really popular. Not just America and Europe, but also Japan. Like, they have figmas, they have figures, including Goodsmile, which IIRC is one of the bigger figure making businesses, they have Nendoroid and Funko Pop figures, it's a very popular game to stream, etc. 3rd factor: The Hunter themselves have a very distinct and recognisable design.

And four, Bloodborne was one of the games that really brought back the attention to Lovecraft-styled art and horror, with many games being inspired by both Lovecraft and by Bloodborne, much like it's predecessor Dark Souls.

Like, if we were to get our first Sony Playstation and From Software character and it turned out to be this character, I feel the Hunter could be the character that would be the absolute closest to rivalling Sora's hype. And with the rumors and possibility of Bloodborne 2 coming out for PS5, the Hunter coming out during a time where Bloodborne is getting attention would be big brain on both Nintendo's and Sony's part.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

So, what characters may be cut for Smash 6? Any updated changes to the current characters? New moveset perhaps?

If Richter returns he should at LEAST get a different final smash

 

[GilTheGreat19]

SSBU is slowly becoming SSF2

 

[N3ON]

If you go thinking Rex is going to get in next time and forget how series without static casts phase each other out, you're going to fall down the Elma pit.

 

[Technomage]

If you go thinking Rex is going to get in next time and forget how series without static casts phase each other out, you're going to fall down the Elma pit.

Oooooohhhh, I know someone who's not gonna like hearing that.

 

[CureParfait]

So, what characters may be cut for Smash 6? Any updated changes to the current characters? New moveset perhaps?

I think the majority of the Square characters, Pokemon like Incineroar/Jigglypuff/Pichu, and Wii Fit Trainer would most likely be cut.

 

[Mushroomguy12]

Lmao.

“Mr Sakurai. The representatives from Disney are here to discuss their terms for Sora.”

“Please. Send them in.” pic.twitter.com/HqwAuYWYEn

— Blake ™ (@NeilNevins) October 5, 2021

 

[TheBeastHimself]

So glad Sora is in after all this time. He looks awesome. The Mickey keychain at the end of his keyblade isn't actually in-game, right? It looked like just a chain was hanging there. Probably an extra 500k to have it there lol.

 

[Technomage]

I think the majority of the Square characters, Pokemon like Incineroar/Jigglypuff/Pichu, and Wii Fit Trainer would most likely be cut.

Uhhhh, I highly doubt Sakurai would ever break the Original 12 tradition...

 

[Mushroomguy12]

If you go thinking Rex is going to get in next time and forget how series without static casts phase each other out, you're going to fall down the Elma pit.

Dixie Kong and Chorus Kids after getting cut because of technical limitations couldn't even get in with a static cast in their series.

 

[WeirdChillFever]

So with Ultimate finally having come to an end. What's everyone's overall thoughts and opinions to ever newcomer?







/Sora

Very quick thoughts cause I’m tired and there’s a lot of characters:

-Inkling: Very nice and obvious pick, hate how they play
-Daisy: Showstopping, iconic, perfect, amazing, gold star, queen, the power she has, the implications she has. VERY GLAD she was added
-Ridley: aww man he’s still the dream
-Belmonts: play like ****
-Chrom: I will blame him and Richter for ruining what’s otherwise an amazing selection of alts for the Echo Fighters. Chrom’s neat, if not rushed.
-Dark Samus: She is so iconic. Still stuck with Samus’ set but her float and alternate costumes add all the drama she needs.
-K. Rool: what a lad what a lad what a lad. he must be max’s father cause he’s ****ing goofy
-Isabelle: Is a bell!
-Ken: Iconic, perfect send-off for the Echo Fighter concept
-Incineroar: suffer
-Plant: Yes, he’s a dumb pick but you don’t have all the facts which is that I love him.
-Joker: oh you mean the one with the akechi alts? yeah hes fun. i like the classy alts
-Hero: Random bull**** go! And he does it very well! Iconic obviously yaddayadda grandfather of RPGs, but he’s the reason I have a “Get Thwacked” counter at like 30 and I love him for it
-Banjo: he’s niiiiice. i like how he plays
-Terry: A fighting character? In my fighting game? More likely than you think
-Byleth: I might be biased when I say this, but AYMR!!
-Min Min: min
-Steve: Had to be here, also unplayable and a chore to fight against but hey! Sales!
-SE PI ROTH: i love. pure love. pure lil ******* love like you can only have for a cat and sepiroth. love how he plays, love his content, love his stage
-Aegis: They play very smooth, and so does my brain. Perfect match.
-Kazuya: Oh yeah
-Sora: The ballot winner

 

[N3ON]

Lmao.

“Mr Sakurai. The representatives from Disney are here to discuss their terms for Sora.”

“Please. Send them in.” pic.twitter.com/HqwAuYWYEn

— Blake ™ (@NeilNevins) October 5, 2021

I've heard the Japanese dub of Donald Duck and I understood about the same amount as when he speaks English.

Also, lol.

 

[subterrestrial]

Am I the only one who’s disappointed mario didn’t die in the trailer. I kinda grown into expecting a Mario death per trailer. When he reached into the fire and through it I was expecting whoever it was to just throw it straight back at him.

also NGL I was thinking it was gonna be king boo from the way the trailer was. Mario being left all alone going towards a fire in the floor whilst the rest were turned into trophies. I deffo had king boo vibes NGL

Mario being the focus + smashball fire getting snuffed out immediately made me think it was king boo but I also thought it was tabuu and then a dark souls char, that trailer really was a rollercoaster of emotions.

(smash 6 base roster btw)

 

[Shroob]

I've heard the Japanese dub of Donald Duck and I understood about the same amount as when he speaks English.

Also, lol.

I 'unno


Donald sounds pretty clear to me ngl

 

[Schnee117]

I 'unno


Donald sounds pretty clear to me ngl

Don Cheadle word of the day

Sora

 

[WeirdChillFever]

I 'unno


Donald sounds pretty clear to me ngl

Oh hey I guess this is canon to Smash now since that episode has a reference to Kingdom Hearts as well

 

[DaybreakHorizon]

So with Ultimate finally having come to an end. What's everyone's overall thoughts and opinions to ever newcomer?







/Sora

Amazing.

Probably the strongest lineup of newcomers imo, and a great way to build on the foundation of Everyone is Here!

 

[GilTheGreat19]

There's Definitely Planning on the Next Smash game

Unless Nintendo and/or Sakurai want to shelve Smash as a series, which I doubt they would after seeing it become the Best Selling Fighting game of all time, They would always have to be planning something for the future.

With anything successful, there's always the starting of production on the Continuation. As example, While Mortal Kombat X (Base game) was Finishing up, Development on Injustice 2 likely started, and when that was finishing up, they got started on MK11, and continue and continue. Same thing with Namco likely working on Tekken 8 while Tekken 7 was finishing up, and then during it's DLC

It's not just with games either, It's also with Consoles. The PS6 and Next Xbox are probably in the Conception phase even though the PS5 and Xbox Series X just came out. Same thing with whatever is next for Nintendo after the Switch

In any case, I do bet that Nintendo and/or Sakurai are planning the Next game. New game is a better Idea than just a Fighter Pass 3 since Nintendo benefits more from Profit from New game purchases. I would say at least Half, or even more of Players only buy the Base game and that's it, no Attention paid to any of the DLC

So why not just continue Development into whatever the Next Smash game is? why not stop here?

I think the thing to remember is that besides Sakurai and his Wife, the Employees at Sora LTD. are contracted workers, and in this Case, they are Bandai Namco Employees

While I do think Planning is going on, I think the difference between the Hypothetical Next Smash and the Transition to Smash Ultimate is that the Project Plan was already finished for Ultimate by the time Smash 4 DLC was wrapping up, as Iwata had tasked Sakurai with making the Ultimate Smash game for the Nintendo NX. Since the Project Plan was complete, Development can go on Continuously RIGHT after the DLC was over

I Imagine that whatever is being planned, it's not a Complete Draft or Plan, and as such, Development won't be able to start right away after Ultmate's DLC. I'm sure Sakurai is loaded with Money to take a break for awhile, but I bet the Bandai Namco employees need some source of Continuous revenue, and I'm sure Bandai could use some hands on deck for projects in development, So the Employees will go back to Namco, until they are needed again for whatever the Next Smash is. That's why I think the Continuous Development ends here. You can't continue Something that's not ready to be continued

We've heard of No Comment situations and weird Answers be given from Companies like Epic Games and Koei in terms of their characters getting into Smash, and while they have no presence in the Actual Smash Ultimate game, I'm sure there's more going on than just nothing. I'm sure Nintendo and/or Sakurai have talked to More Companies about potential characters getting into Smash, just not at this exact moment

This would especially need to be done because if Smash is going to go even further into Crossing over all these game series, than it's best to start early on Negotiations so any complications can be dealt with earlier without Compromising potential Development

I think Judging not only from the Sales of Ultimate and what the game has accomplished, but also the addition of Fighter files in the game, in spite of Smash 4 making sure to use all the Files and slots in the data, even taking away Slots I believe, I'm gonna suspect that Nintendo and Sakurai are gonna try for a continuation on Ultimate. It seems impossible now with all the Licensing they got to do, especially since they just Added Sora to the game with that Disney Licensing. Here's some of my Reasoning

-While it is gonna be tough being able to handle all of these Licenses, the thing Smash Ultimate has achieved is a Pedigree of being the Crossover Fighter. Max talked about how Getting characters like Cloud and Sephiroth is a very Tough, and Expensive Task for anyone to do, but because Sakurai has established a level of Quality and Consistency in his Development of Smash, it was likely much Easier than usual to achieve these characters

Smash Ultimate is the Best Selling Fighting game of all time. If Smash was big before, Than Smash Ultimate as established the series as Legend other Legends strive to be with.

It's likely gonna be easier than ever to get Characters from 3rd party Companies, and the More Crossover you add, the More and More other Series and Franchises and Companies are gonna want to join in. It's a Successful Loop that Smash is now in a Prime position to take advantage of

-I Imagine the Switch is gonna have a Long, Long lifecycle. I don't think Nintendo is ever gonna make a Pure Console or Pure Handheld ever again, and I think for the time being, we might start just getting Improved models on the Nintendo Switch

I think Long enough that it might be too long for a Smash game to wait for a Completely new console, and I'm sure Nintendo wants to continue Smash as a Series sooner rather than Later

However I think many people might stick with the OG Switch for perhaps the entire time until Nintendo do come out with Something completely New, and if there are to be 2 Smash games on a Similiar console, I don't think Nintendo and/or Sakurai would want to break up Audience like that

That's why I think whatever New Smash game comes out after Ultimate, is gonna continue Ultimate, so that people that have stuck with the Base game can still feel included with perhaps New content. If the Slots data are anything, it does support the idea of content from the New Smash game being transferable to Ultimate

-Sakurai knows how Close he is to having 100 Characters in a Smash game, and I think he does want to achieve that Achievement as well

-If BOTW2 is any Indication, they are willing to continue the Success of a Particular game without having to Re-invent the entire thing and also release it on the Same console that game came on. Granted there is alot of variable to Consider, like how BOT2 is a combination of Planned DLC that is saved for BOTW2 as of now, and that BOTW2 doesn't have any of the Licensing Cost Smash Ultimate does, but it's still something to Consider

Same thing with Splatoon 2 and Splatoon 3. Splatoon 3 doesn't seem to be changing the Formula that much, but I bet many People are gonna buy Splatoon 3 despite Splatoon 2 being Switch Exclusive also

So that's what is making me think the Next Smash is an Ultimate continuation, now what do I expect in an Ultimate Continuation

The thing with Ultimate is that the Base game was focused on Bringing stuff back. DLC is the Main Carrier of New, never before seen content in this game, otherwise the amount of Actual New content is kind of Lacking than usual

Since the Base of Ultimate is already made, with everyone already being Developed and Balanced, This time the Dev team can focus on Adding New content even in the Base game, So I would expect the following things

-A Big, Platforming like Story mode. The Reasons World of Light is the way it is is because there was not enough time to Develop a Story mode Similiar to Subspace and such, but since the Base of the game is Already made, Now there can be more time and focus allocated to the Story Mode.

While Smash does sell itself on Multiplayer and the Roster, the Single Player also matters too, it adds to the Production Values. That's what puts Mortal Kombat over other Fighting Games as an example

-More Characters. Since Sakurai is officially counting 89 Fighters, he would need to add in at least 11 More to get to 100. Balancing the Newcomers with the ever increasing Amount of Fighters is gonna be a Task, but I do imagine we could get a Regular amount of Newcomers with this Continuation of Ultimate Base game

I also imagine DLC will be a thing with whatever the New Smash game is

I think the Characters would be the only thing Transferable to Base Ultimate, besides maybe some Gameplay Tweaks and Online Improvements. I think the Story Mode will be an exclusive

-New Gameplay Features. This would also need to be changed with Base Ultimate. Perhaps adding things like Wavedashing, Air Dashing, EX Moves, or just More Specials at once can go a long way in helping to make things feel more fresh despite the ever increasing amount of Re-used Assets

-More Cosmetics. I heard a Reason every character only has 8 Costumes is because of the Lack of Memory to hold everything. I bet exclusive to the Next Smash game, perhaps Cosmetics will be a big part and go over the 8 Costume mark. Perhaps DLC Costumes can be sold

-Graphical tweaks and Improvements. Obviously, to showcase the Power of whatever the Next Switch Model is

-Improved Online. Whether it's Rollback, or some other Method that Nintendo Feels is best, I think the ability to Sell a New Smash game is gonna give Nintendo and/or Sakurai to go back and re-invent the Online and Netcode, which could perhaps be applicable to Base Smash Ultimate and the New Smash. However perhaps Base Ultimate might have limited form of Improvement, if NASB is any indication only providing Rollback for 2 Players

As for what type of Fighters we are gonna get in this Next Smash

-With Sora being added as the True Ballot Winner, I think the Ballot is not gonna factor into the Character Choices anymore. Whether there's a New Ballot that's made, or Nintendo and/or Sakurai is gonna keep take Social Media requests as law, I think characters being added for being Requested is not gonna depend on the Ballot anymore

-The Switch Library is gonna be Explored some more. Ring Fit, Gen 8 Pokemon, Astral Chain, and perhaps Future Titles are gonna express the Nintendo Library. In the Case of Gen 8 Pokemon, since by this point the Popular Pokemon has been determined, we might not get a Starter as a representation, which would be Nice Change of Pace

-Requested Fighters that had their Biggest Break in Ultimate is gonna have some Consideration. Waluigi, Geno, Skull Kid, Isaac, Shadow, Ashley, Bandana Dee, Porky, Eggman, are examples, At least among 1st party or Franchises already with Playable characters

-I think the Biggest thing is gonna be the Increased focus on Crossovers in the Roster. I doubt they would take a Majority of the Base Roster Spots, especially due to the Licensing, but we are gonna get some Big characters to sell on the Big Roster.

-From Companies already with Playable characters, we got Franchises like Resident Evil, Devil May Cry, Tomb Raider, Tales of, Nier, Ace Attorney, Dark Souls, Soul Calibur, Bomberman, Puyo Puyo, Yakuza, Silent Hill, and Halo and now Technically Doom, Fallout, and Skyrim as examples of Some Well Known, Popular, and/or Iconic Franchies

-From Companies that are Represented, but not with Characters, we Got Rayman, Assassins Creed, Guilty Gear, Blazblue, Ninja Gaiden, and All the Indie Franchises like Undertale, Cuphead, Shantae, Shovel Knight

and From Companies not Represented, We got Fortnite, League of Legends, Crash Bandicoot, Overwatch, GTA, Mortal Kombat, Any Falcom Franchise like Trails of and Y's, Danganronpa, Professor Layton, And Other Indies franchises or Series like Hollow Knight, Hades, Touhou, Goose Game, Among Us,


I think a Majority of the Base Roster is gonna be about Expanding the Crossover of the Series. I think for once the Amount of 3rd Party Newcomers on the Base Roster is actually gonna outnumber the Amount of 1st Party

FPS is the Biggest Genre missing, So I Imagine that would be placed in the Base roster. I actually think all the FPS (and/or Shooter) characters are gonna share the Same potential FPS type gameplay Gimmick, with their own Abilities to showcase their Home Series separate from one another

I Imagine most of the Characters added from the Japanese Side are gonna be from Companies already in, since Franchises owned by Japanese Companies without a Character tend to be on average more Niche than franchises from Comapnies like Capcom, Sega, Namco, Square, etc.

Since Sakurai and the Team now have experience working with Western Characters as Playable characters, I definitely expect to see more.


This has been a very Long post. Now that Ultimate is Over in terms of Speculation, I'm already looking towards the Future when it comes to the Next Smash, and these are my Thoughts. Sora is a Really good finale (Gripes about his Representation aside), and is gonna help tide Smash fans over until the Next Game. I think the fact they were able to Negotiate with Disney is a good sign of the Future, it showcases the Power that Smash has emerged with Thanks to Smash Ultimate success

I think the ideas I have provided forward are very Optimistic in Nature, but with that being said, I do think it is likely, and I do think there are signs that point toward at least the Next Smash taking the Crossover Aspect to the Next Level.

Please just open up your own library, I love how much you like to type and it’s fun to read lol

 

[kylexv]

Welp. It’s over. This almost decade-long wild ride (counting Smash 4 as well) is finally over, and I’m glad that Sakurai can finally rest and watch the sun rise upon a grateful universe. Now, I suppose it’s time for a retrospective of Mr. Sakurai's wild ride: time for me to look back on my general impressions of Ultimate’s newcomers. I’ve already gone into detail about my impressions on Ultimate’s DLC characters, but I decided to include them in this post to have everything in one place.

Spoiler: Inkling joins the Battle!

Imagine my surprise coming home from work late in the evening of March 8, 2018, looking to see what I missed from that day’s Nintendo Direct, and seeing the announcement of a new Smash Bros. game (and Undertale on Switch, but that’s beside the point). With this teaser trailer came the most obvious newcomer inclusion in the entirety of Smash 4 and Ultimate: the Inkling. Splatoon proved to be a breakout new IP on the failing Wii U, and Splatoon 2 managed to break the 10 million unit barrier on Switch. Any new Smash Bros. roster would have felt incomplete without them, and I was glad to see them in this new Smash game we knew almost nothing about yet.

We wouldn’t see any gameplay for Inkling until Smash Ultimate formal reveal at E3 2018, and it’s there we found out that Inkling’s kit involved covering the opponent in ink to deal more damage. Of course, like the games, the amount of ink Inkling had was limited, and they had to refill their ink tank every once in a while. Not only that, Inkling was one of the 30 playable characters in Smash Ultimate’s E3 2018 demo, meaning that there was plenty of footage going around that showed off their entire kit.

After Ultimate arrived in player’s hands on December 7th, 2018, Inkling ended up being the character everybody considered top tier that every now considers only high/mid tier. I guess people saw how much damage Inkling did when the opponent was inked and how long Roller kept people buried for and thought they were better than they actually were.

As for what I think of the character overall, I put plenty of playtime into Splatoon 1, so I was quite excited to see how they would turn out in the new game. However, because of the way this reveal happened, I felt that the overall game reveal overshadowed this inclusion a bit. After all, I wasn’t expecting a new Smash game so soon after Smash 4.

• Initial Hype: 7/10
• Gameplay: 7/10
• Overall: 7/10

Spoiler: Everyone is Here!

I will remember June 12th of 2018 for a very long time, and it is because of the sheer hype riding behind this trailer. The slow and mind-bending revelation that every single veteran in the Smash Bros. series was coming back in Super Smash Bros. Ultimate. And yes, that meant Pichu too. Every character that I loved, liked, disliked, and felt neutral about throughout the history of the Smash Bros. franchise would be returning to the fray once again. We were now looking at the biggest Smash Bros. game of all time, and it would manage to somehow get even bigger. It’s something I still can’t quite comprehend even as I am writing this, but I am very happy that Sakurai and the Smash dev team managed to pull this off.

• Initial Hype: 10/10
• Overall: 10/10

Spoiler: Daisy joins the Battle!

During the bombardment of new Smash information that was E3 2018, we learned of a new type of character: the Echo Fighters. Echo Fighters borrowed moves, animations, and general properties from another character in the roster, so much so that a lot of them ended up being nearly identical to the character they copied. Lucina and Dark Pit, the two new clones characters in Smash 4, were denoted as the first two echo fighters, showing the playerbase what to expect from future Echo Fighters. That ended up raising a question, however: who will be the first new Echo Fighter? Luckily, we didn’t need to wait long, since not even a minute later, the first new Echo Fighter was revealed to be...Daisy?

I have to admit, Daisy was an underwhelming first echo fighter reveal, and it didn’t help that I found Daisy kind of annoying in the Mario spin offs (Daisy fans, please don’t kill me). Nowadays, I’m no longer underwhelmed by her inclusion itself, but instead by how she was implemented. All Daisy proved to be was a glorified costume of Peach that took up a separate character slot on the character select screen, and that was quite disappointing. On top of that, Sakurai had mentioned that Peach and Daisy would have a few differences in their movesets, which ended up being completely untrue. I really wish they did more to differentiate the two. Is it that hard to give her one difference from Peach? At least she feels like she fits in the game.

• Initial Hype: 6/10
• Gameplay: 2/10 (A very disappointing Echo fighter in terms of implementation)
• Overall: 5/10

Spoiler: Ridley Hits the Big Time!

After everything that was revealed during E3 2018 about Smash Ultimate, how could the presentation get even better? We had just learned in the last 20-25 minutes that every veteran in the series was returning, Echo Fighters were a thing, and Ganondorf finally had a sword. How could this presentation even get better? The answer was in revealing one of the most highly requested Smash characters of all time…

As soon as we all saw the setting of the newcomer trailer that had just started playing, the thought was “it’s Ridley, isn’t it?”. And, by some miracle, it was actually him. Sakurai was willing to go back on his word to cater to the desires of fans, and that, my friends, is why I respect the hell out of Sakurai and the development team. For years after Smash 4, I and many others began to think that Ridley was truly too big to ever be playable in Smash. If you would have asked me prior to 2018, I would have scoffed at the very idea of Ridley being playable in a Smash game, as I was almost convinced it would never happen. Even though I had no personal attachment to Metroid at the time, seeing Ridley’s journey finally end made me very, very happy.

Smash Ultimate’s first proper newcomer trailer also narrowly proved to be the biggest in the base roster for me (quite literally). Even though I’m pretty terrible with him, Ridley ended up being one of the most fun newcomers in the base roster, as I enjoyed edgeguarding and using Side-B with him. Many of the DLC characters have overshadowed him in fun factor, but I still pick him up from time to time. After all, Ridley in Ultimate feels like a dream made reality...

• Initial Hype: 10/10
• Gameplay: 9/10
• Overall: 10/10

Spoiler: Simon Lashes Out!

Before I begin here, I must talk about Vergeben and the effect he had on speculation for the base roster. Prior to E3 2018, word had gotten out from Vergeben that the entirety of Smash 4’s roster would return along with Ice Climbers and Snake. He also stated that Ridley and Simon Belmont would be newcomers in the new Smash game’s roster. Due to Vergeben’s iffy track record with other fighting games, not too many people believed this leak, but, after E3, all signs pointed to this leak being real. Because of this, many who participated in speculation at the time, including myself, saw Simon as an inevitability.

This inevitability would eventually lead to an accidental early confirmation, as, the night before the August 2018 Smash Direct, one of the music tracks was accidentally renamed to Bloody Tears from Castlevania, confirming Simon with 99% certainty around 12 hours before he was officially revealed in the opening of the August 2018 Smash Direct. As a gaming icon of the NES, Simon felt like one of the last third party characters that had an association with Nintendo that deserved to be in Smash (later ones would include Hero, Banjo-Kazooie, and Steve), and I was glad to see him join in on what has practically become the pantheon of gaming.

As for how I feel about him from a playstyle standpoint, he’s definitely not my type of character. I typically don’t like playing zoners/campy characters, since I prefer to be up in the opponent’s face, but he’s fun to play as a turn-your-brain-off type of character. However, this means that Simon is one of the more annoying characters to fight online, as you’re constantly bombarded with projectiles. Simon also planted himself near the middle of Smash Ultimate’s viability ranking, making him overlooked in the competitive scene for the most part. Ultimate seems to favor more aggressive play after all.

• Initial Hype: 8/10
• Gameplay: 6/10
• Overall: 7/10

Spoiler: Richter Crosses Over!

Despite Simon being an obvious inclusion due to leaks, the Castlevania series would still prove to have a surprise character in store. After being on Smashboards for almost five years, I thought that I would recognize every potential newcomer for the game. Turns out, I was wrong. I did not know who Richter was prior to his reveal, but I did ironically recognize the music that was playing with his reveal. I just didn’t put two and two together at the time. Overall, Richter became a very surprising and cool Echo Fighter addition to the roster, and I was glad to see him as a nice bonus addition to the roster. Obviously, my gameplay impressions of Simon apply to Richter as well, as they are nearly identical in every aspect gameplay-wise.

• Initial Hype: 8/10
• Gameplay: 6/10
• Overall: 7/10

Spoiler: Chrom Joins the Battle!

After Ike’s Chrom costume was suspiciously missing from the E3 demo of Ultimate, many surmised that Chrom may have been added as an Echo Fighter to the game. As it turned out, this suspicion was correct, as Chrom was the second of the three Echo Fighters revealed in the August 2018 Smash Direct. What surprised people was that he ended up being an Echo Fighter of Roy, not Ike, despite having Ike’s Up-Special. Despite being yet another Fire Emblem character in a roster where Fire Emblem is overrepresented, Chrom still felt like he deserved to be there, since he got shafted hard in Smash 4. He also proved to be a great example of what I was looking for in the game’s Echo Fighters, which is a nice bonus.

• Initial Hype: 6/10
• Gameplay: 10/10 (One of my mains and the textbook definition of what an Echo should be)
• Overall: 7/10

Spoiler: Dark Samus Joins the Battle!

In the span of two months, Metroid went from being underrepresented in Smash to being perfectly represented, and this was with the addition of Ridley along with a new Echo Fighter in Dark Samus. Dark Samus felt like a natural choice for an Echo Fighter, and many, including myself, were glad to see her added to the game. Despite being mechanically almost identical to Samus, Dark Samus added her own unique flair in really cool animations, making Dark Samus my preferred version of Samus to use.

• Initial Hype: 8/10
• Gameplay: 7/10
• Overall: 7/10

Spoiler: King K. Rool Comes Aboard!

With four character reveals already during the August 2018 Smash Direct, I wasn’t expecting to get another character reveal at the end. And, as the screen started shaking as Sakurai bid farewell to the audience, I ended up being proven wrong…

In my opinion, King K. Rool had the second best character reveal in Ultimate’s history (with one of the DLC characters having an even better trailer in my opinion). The fake out with Dedede is one of the funniest things a Smash trailer has ever done, and seeing K. Rool duke it out with DK and Diddy for the first time in many years was quite the excitement.

If it weren’t for Ridley, this would have definitely been the most hype newcomer reveal for me by far (at least for the base roster). Like Ridley, King K. Rool was a heavily requested reptilian villain that had felt excluded from the roster for a little bit too long. Because of their similarities, Ridley and K. Rool felt like two best buds, and it would have been weird to have one and not the other. Finally, the two most requested characters could lay down and rest, and it was all thanks to the Smash Ballot. As it turns out, Sakurai referred to the Smash Ballot when developing Ultimate as well, and the ballot is what inspired him to add Ridley, Simon, and K. Rool to the game. It seemed that Smash Bros. fans had a voice in the roster decisions, and a certain Mario character would surge in popularity because of it…

In terms of gameplay, K. Rool ended up being a pretty unique heavyweight all things considered. His recovery wasn’t terrible, he had two projectiles, and he had a unique form of super armor. With these tools, players thought K. Rool was a good character at first, but, as it turned out, these tools could not save him from the detriments that his low mobility and laggy frame data brought him, placing him in Ultimate’s Bottom 10 characters. K. Rool also seems to be the noob killer of this game, much like Bastion in Overwatch 1, offering tools that seem overpowered in the hands of a novice but weak in the hands of a competent player.

• Initial Hype: 10/10
• Gameplay: 7/10
• Overall: 10/10

Spoiler: Isabelle Turns Over a New Leaf!

In September of 2018, Isabelle was revealed at the end of a Nintendo Direct along with the announcement of an Animal Crossing title coming to Switch in 2019. For me, this ended up being the most underwhelming reveal in the base roster. To me, Isabelle seemed like a very likely candidate for Ultimate’s roster based on the fact that she had been increasingly associated with the Nintendo and Animal Crossing brands as well as getting into Mario Kart 8 as DLC, so this was no surprise. Along with this, Isabelle ended up being a semi-clone, not an echo fighter like many thought. Sakurai later clarified that this was done because Villager and Isabelle have different body types, but it still felt disappointing at the time. This isn’t even mentioning the fact that I hadn’t played New Leaf and thus had little attachment to the character unlike many Animal Crossing fans, so this reveal ended up being quite underwhelming for me. Nowadays, Isabelle just feels like a worse version of Villager to play, who already isn’t that good to begin with, so that doesn’t help her cause either.

• Initial Hype: 4/10
• Gameplay: 4/10
• Overall: 4/10

Spoiler: How the Grinch Stole Smash Speculation…

We interrupt your regularly scheduled programming to talk about the most prolific fake leak in Smash Bros. History: The Grinch Leak. Named because of a picture of the Grinch in the background, the leak provided a version of the Fighter Banner that we had never seen before. There were seven “unrevealed” characters on this new banner: five of these characters were completely new (Banjo-Kazooie, Geno, Isaac, Mach Rider, and Chorus Men) while two were supposed echo fighters (Ken and Shadow). This leak was posted just eight days before the final base roster was revealed (we didn’t know that at the time), and I look back to those eight days with disgust. Unlike the ESRB leak, which I have fond memories of despite it being kind of a disappointment, the Grinch Leak brought nothing but darkness and chaos to the internet, especially after it was proven fake. The Grinch Leak split the internet into two factions: those who believed the Grinch and those who believed the box and Vergeben. The latter suggested that Ken and Incineroar were the last newcomers to be added, which would eventually be proven to be correct. Because of this leak, the final roster reveal proved to be more disappointing to the masses than it should have. At least two of these characters (Ken and Banjo-Kazooie) would survive the slaughter.
Sayonara...Shadow the Hedgehog...

Spoiler: Ken Turns Up the Heat!

Ken was in a unique situation going into his reveal because literally everyone was expecting him to show up. Not only was he in both the Grinch Leak and the Box Theory (which suggested one more unique newcomer and one more echo fighter), but he managed to be in the only real image leak Ultimate ever had. So, when he showed up in that boxing ring in the trailer, no one was very surprised. As the original Echo Fighter, Ken seemed like a natural choice for an echo fighter, especially after Richter’s reveal proved that third-party characters could get Echo Fighters. He also ended up being the most different of the Echo Fighters from their base counterparts, calling into question if he should have even been called an Echo Fighter in the first place. What I’ve always said is that Ken is an Echo Fighter in name only, and I still stand by that.

• Initial Hype: 7/10
• Gameplay: 7/10
• Overall: 7/10

Spoiler: Incineroar Enters the Ring!

Incineroar was another heavily expected newcomer due to leaks. However, there was one key distinction compared to Ken: Incineroar was not in the Grinch Leak. The fate of the Grinch and the Box both rested on Incineroar. Of course, after we saw those gleaming eyes in the darkness waiting for an opportunity to enter the ring, we all knew that the Grinch was done for….

I initially did not like the thought of Incineroar making it into Ultimate over a few other Gen 7 Pokemon such as Decidueye, Mimikyu, and Lycanroc: the three Pokemon Vergeben deconfirmed by name. However, because of how likely he seemed, I prepared myself mentally for his inclusion for two full months. Because of this, Incineroar managed to pleasantly surprise me. He was one of Ultimate’s most expressive characters, and he also proved to be fun to play. Stuff like this turns inclusions I wouldn’t be a fan of to ones I enjoy, despite Incineroar sticking out like a sore thumb next to the other Pokemon characters.

• Initial Hype: 6/10
• Gameplay: 9/10
• Overall: 7.5/10

Spoiler: Piranha Plant Pipes Up!

Plant was and will continue to be the strangest, most mind-bending reveal of the entire Smash Bros series. Sakurai reveals that we're getting a bonus character for adopting the game early. We all had ideas racing through our heads about what it could be, but not a soul thought "It's going to be a Piranha Plant". Yes, a potted plant beat out Mario characters such as Toad and Waluigi. A character that was not even playable in the Mario spin offs before the point. And I was all for it. Seeing a Piranha Plant feverishly rush toward its opponents and beat them up for the first time gave me a special type of joy.

Plant was also strange because he was the first and only DLC character that was shadowdropped. We had no idea when he was coming until the moment he was added to the game. No showcase, no warning, no nothing. All of us got to experience this character's moveset coming in almost completely blind, which is another aspect of this character I enjoyed.

It's too bad, then, that I tend to forget nowadays that Plant is even in the game. It's like Sakurai had said: the initial shock value had worn off. Now, we have the worst of the DLC character tier-wise who is pretty much defined by a single move: Ptooie. All in all, Plant followed the exact trend these absurd reveals tend to follow: the internet collectively loses their minds only to move on years later. Sorry to be melodramatic, but it's the truth. Nobody really talks about Plant anymore, making him the black sheep of the DLC characters: A DLC character without any DLC sauce.

• Initial Hype: 9/10
• Gameplay: 7/10
• Overall: 8/10

Spoiler: Joker Steals the Show!

On the eve of Smash Ultimate’s launch day, merely 30 minutes before the official North American release, the first Fighters Pass character of many to come was revealed: Joker from Persona 5. I remember my reaction quite well. As the trailer went on, I thought to myself “This is a Smash reveal, isn’t it?”. Lo and behold, that is what happened. I sat there in stunned silence knowing full well that Alpharad once again got the character he wanted. And, as it turned out, just like Bayonetta in Smash 4, it was an omen for things to come...

The wait for his release felt like a long one, as all we got between his reveal and April was his character model in a February Nintendo Direct, with a hint of further additions coming with him in the Spring. When April finally rolled around, Joker's showcase trailer was dropped unexpectedly, showing off his moveset, the new Stage Builder mode, and dropping the release date: one day after the showcase was dropped. Joker was the only Fighter's Pass character to not receive a Sakurai Presents, which is also interesting to note. On the day he was released, however, I remember that Nintendo's servers were riddled with troubles and it took me nearly two hours of trying to download the update to finally get my hands on him.

Once he was finally in players' hands, though, he slowly proved to be one of, if not the best characters in the game. Although MKLeo has moved on to other characters as of recent, he pushed Joker to his absolute limit, showing the power of Arsene. Arsene also became a divisive mechanic in itself, with many arguing that it made Joker too powerful. As for me, I, too, have grown to detest whenever the scary top hat man comes out to play, as I know I will soon be on the receiving end of powerful normals and projectiles or the best counter in the game.

• Initial Hype: 8/10
• Gameplay: 9/10
• Overall: 8.5/10

Spoiler: The Hero Draws Near!

This reveal was very disappointing for me at first. An insider had hinted at Banjo coming as DLC, and here Hero was to rain on his parade. Or so we thought. It didn’t help that Hero had been heavily hinted at by insiders and even the game’s files, making his inclusion very unsurprising. Don’t get me wrong, I knew the importance that Dragon Quest had on gaming, but I had zero attachment to this character.

When he was revealed, he was the most predictable, milk-toast inclusion. Everybody expected Hero, specifically Erdrick, because of the codename leak from that January, and, since I had no personal connection to the series, I had zero excitement for his inclusion. But then, something changed…

The first Sakurai presents had aired a day before Hero's released and was revealed on a Sunday night of all times. During this Presents, Hero was then revealed to have the most insane RNG-based kit in the entire cast, which made him look absolutely busted at first. I was split on the idea at first. That is until I got my hands on him. Hero did a complete 180 when he proved to be the most fun character in this game. Down-B and Crits are the funniest things ever, and I have a blast every time I play this character. Now, I’m not terribly good at Hero, which is why he’s not my main, but I would be lying if I said I don’t play him a lot.

However, Hero presented a bigger problem with his inclusion in two different ways. Firstly, there was a hot debate shortly after Hero was released on whether or not Hero should be banned from tournaments due to his overturned skills. This looks stupid now because what people failed to realize is that Hero rarely is able to get access to the broken stuff and his normals are pretty bad all things considered. The second debate, however, has a lot more merit to it. Hero's Down-B spells are listed by name next to his icon on the HUD, but, due to the language barrier, a local player who does not speak that language won't be able to tell what spell Hero is using, giving them an unfair disadvantage. This could easily be solved by having icons next to the spells denoting what it is, and the fact that this has gone over two years without being patched kind of surprises me. I sincerely hope this issue is addressed at some point, but I am starting to doubt it ever will.

• Initial Hype: 4/10
• Gameplay: 9/10
• Overall: 7/10

Spoiler: Banjo-Kazooie are Raring to Go!

For a solid twenty minutes during the E3 2019 direct, I felt utterly defeated. Hero was the DLC reveal of the conference, and it appeared that the bear and bird’s glimmer of hope had vanished. But then, by some miracle, another Smash trailer started playing. When I saw that Jiggy fly by DK and crew, I popped off hard. Finally, Banjo and Kazooie are appearing in a Smash Bros. game. The dream somehow became real. E3 2019 was perfect for Smash reveals because we got a character that was massive in the East and a character that was massive in the West, so very few left unhappy.

Only 5 weeks after getting Hero, another Nintendo Direct rolled around with Banjo releasing that evening. From the Sakurai Presents, we gathered that Banjo was built in a way where he didn't feel like a DLC character, instead of feeling like he's already been there for a while. This is fitting, as Banjo is a character that would have been added to Smash much earlier if Microsoft hadn't bought him out. The only thing that looked somewhat crazy was Wonderwing: an invincible burst option with limited uses per stock. Regardless, due to the sheer demand for Banjo, many were excited to finally try him out.

However, what happened after Banjo's release was an interesting conundrum: he was a character that a lot of people didn't really have fun playing as. A decent amount of people that had clamored for Banjo's inclusion for years felt disappointed by the way he played, focusing on his two projectiles and zoning the opponent out. His slow air speed might be a factor as well: because of it, he's forced to use Wonderwing more as a recovery tool than an offensive option. Although, in my opinion, Banjo is the least fun character to play as in FP1, I am still incredibly glad he's in the game. The character once thought as impossible was finally included where he belonged: alongside the rest of Nintendo's all-stars.

• Initial Hype: 10/10
• Gameplay: 6/10
• Overall: 10/10 (I’m just glad he’s here, OK? Who cares if I don’t really like playing him?)

Spoiler: Terry Faces the Fury!

Now this was kind of unexpected. Three days before the September 2019 Nintendo Direct, someone noticed an SNK copyright on a webpage for Challenger Pack #4. An SNK rep managed to fly under the radar for most, so this was certainly a surprise to see. As many surmised after this accidental leak, the SNK rep would end up being Terry Bogard from Fatal Fury, killing any of the suspense on which SNK character would grab the letter in his reveal trailer.

I was aware of Terry’s existence prior to this, but I didn’t really have any attachment to him. I pretty much only saw him in Capcom vs. SNK 2 and understood him as one of the faces of Capcom's fighting game rival SNK. One thing I remember stating to myself after his reveal was “He will be cool if he gets access to a super meter”. This is something that I would have liked on Ryu and Ken (specifically a Super Turbo style super meter), and I felt that having access to a super meter outside of the Final Smash would make him much more interesting.

As fate would have it, Terry got his own form of a super meter that let him unleash super attacks at above 100% damage. It turns out I was right about the super meter as well: it made him much more interesting to watch and play as than his fellow input characters Ryu and Ken. When Terry first launched, I had a blast playing as him and learning his specials and super moves, and I can thank him for helping me understanding other special move inputs in traditional fighting games as well.

• Initial Hype: 6/10
• Gameplay: 9/10
• Overall: 7.5/10

Spoiler: Byleth Joins Smash House!

There is a whole lot to unpack with this character for me.

I woke up early on the morning of January 16th, 2020 anticipating the final reveal for the first Fighter's Pass. I had a lot of ideas on who it could be, but I was fairly certain that it would be a third-party character. After all, the other four characters were third-party, and they wouldn't suddenly end the Fighter's Pass with a first party. Right?

Wrong. The character that greeted me that fateful morning was none other than the Ashen Demon themself: Byleth. To say I was disappointed would be an understatement. The exact moment I thought we wouldn't get a Fire Emblem character as DLC (face it, everybody expected either Byleth or Edelgard before Joker was revealed), there was one staring me right in the face. His moveset turned out to be one of the most unique of the now more bloated Fire Emblem cast, using not only the Sword of the Creator but the three relics of the House Leaders: Amyr, Areadbhar, and Failnaught. It was nice that Fire Emblem's weapons triangle was finally fully represented in Smash, even if it doesn't make much sense canonically for Byleth.

Byleth was set to release 12 days after the Sakurai Presents that revealed them. I didn't have much to say when playing as Byleth for the first time either, although trying to beat Byleth's 9.9 Classic Mode gave me a very hard time. It was a playstyle I didn't really jive with at the time so shortly after launch I wasn't touching Byleth much anymore.

Then, I played Fire Emblem: Three Houses on the Nintendo Switch...

It’s crazy how much playing a character’s game can make you change your opinion of them. After playing Three Houses for the first time in the Winter of 2020 (and playing another route this past Summer), I now appreciate their inclusion way more than I ever did. Three Houses ended up being one of my favorite experiences on the Switch, and I managed to clock in over 100 hours between the two routes I completed. I also started playing as Byleth a lot more in Smash as well, eventually even adding them to my list of secondaries (I main Bowser; my other secondaries are Mewtwo, Roy, Chrom, and Sephiroth).

However, despite my newfound love for the series, I still can’t deny that Byleth’s reveal was very lackluster in retrospect. His reveal trailer was one of the worst we ever got since it was immediately obvious who the character was and the trailer was four minutes long. I also feel that Byleth should have been switched with Terry in placement, and I can’t deny that Fire Emblem is overrepresented in Smash Bros. at this current moment, and Byleth adds to that problem. Byleth has caused so much animosity in the greater Smash community because of this, but I personally think that all started with Corrin. Overall, I feel this was a good character inclusion that got ruined by circumstances that were not the character’s fault (stares angrily at Corrin).

No seriously, play Fire Emblem: Three Houses. You won't regret it.

• Initial Hype: 3/10
• Gameplay: 9/10
• Overall: 8/10 (If I had played Three Houses before this reveal, the Initial Hype would reflect this score more)

Spoiler: Min Min Arms Herself!

Every single character revealed in the second Fighters Pass so far managed to be a surprise to me, and an ARMS rep was no exception. We all thought that ARMS’s chances were dead after Spring Man was in the base game as an Assist Trophy. After all, it was also three years since ARMS came out. It was dead, right? But, in March of 2020, we were all proven wrong. One of ARMS’s fifteen characters was set to appear as the first fighter of the second Fighters Pass.

Many names were thrown around, but Min Min was ultimately the one chosen by the development team. Having not played ARMS, Min Min was the ARMS character I wanted simply because I liked her design the most, so I was happy to see Nintendo choose her as the character. Her moveset ended up being fun, albeit annoying for others to fight against, as well, which is nice. Overall, another solid character inclusion but nothing to get overly excited about.

Min Min also set an interesting precedent for speculation to come: she had a spirit in Ultimate’s base game. This meant that some characters that had spirits in Ultimate’s base game now had a solid chance to be in this Fighter’s Pass, opening the door to a lot more potential characters. Min Min would prove not to be the only newcomer to fit under this bill either...

(Wow, I really don't have too much to say about this character)

• Initial Hype: 6/10
• Gameplay: 8/10
• Overall: 7/10

Spoiler: Steve Rocks the Block!

On September 30th, 2020, we got the announcement of the next Smash character announcement. Many speculated over who it could be (with myself thinking it would be the "inevitable" Gen 8 Pokemon), but I feel that few arrived at the conclusion that this character would be the one revealed. The moment I saw those Enderman eyes in the background, I had a strange mix of shock, feelings of absurdity, and hype knowing which character was going to appear fifteen seconds later...

To say that Steve is a big addition is an understatement. This was one of the biggest, most well-known characters you could add, as Steve comes from the highest-selling game of all time (excluding mobile games). I often call Minecraft the most versatile game in existence, so of course, it would attract the attention of the huge audience it did over the years. As one of the many millions of human beings on this planet who have played Minecraft, this character was probably the most deserving third-party rep out there. With Banjo being in the first Fighter’s Pass, I didn’t think Steve would happen, seeing as that meant we would get two Microsoft characters. Of course, it did, and it made the Banjo vs. Steve wars seem silly in retrospect.

I also love how faithful Steve is to his home game. During the Sakurai presents, Steve would be shown having a wacky moveset that involved building blocks, upgrading tools, and making use of some of the other items in Minecraft. In a way, his moveset offers the same kind of creativity that his home game offers, allowing for very clever use of building and managing resources. Now, because of the complexity of Steve's moveset, I can't really play him that well, but damn am I glad he got added to the game.

• Initial Hype: 9/10
• Gameplay: 8/10
• Overall: 8.5/10

Spoiler: Sephiroth Descends into Battle!

With the 2020 Game Awards fast approaching, the internet discussed whether or not we would have a Smash reveal show up there or not. After all, we all expected a reveal at the 2019 Game Awards but instead got Byleth revealed in a solo presentation a month later. Luckily Nintendo would clear up the discourse by outright announcing that a new fighter would be revealed at the 2020 Game Awards. Many characters were brought up, but, as is the trend of FP2, the one that would show up was one not many talked about prior...

What opened the 2020 Game Awards was perhaps the best Smash reveal trailer we've ever gotten. The Smash cast is on their desperate last stand against Galeem when it starts charging a powerful attack. All of the sudden, the godlike being was cleaved in two by a mysterious entity. I thought "who is powerful enough to be able to do this?" Then I heard the first notes of a certain well-known final boss music. It was clear at that moment that this mysterious entity was none other than Sephiroth from Final Fantasy VII, one of the most iconic video game villains of all time.

As the rest of his reveal trailer took place, my mind would be blown over and over. Sephiroth tears through the Smash cast with his Masamune and giant explosions, rushing forward to seemingly stab Mario right through his neck. Of course, this is an E10+ game, so Sephiroth merely caught Mario on his overalls, giving me a good laugh. Cloud and Sephiroth then duke it out, directly referencing Advent Children. This was a character I didn't know I wanted. Not only was this another villain, a character archetype that I've supported for a very long time (Look at Bowser Jr, Ridley, and K. Rool), but this was a character I thought would be cool but dismissed because I thought it wouldn't happen. Then, at the 2020 Game Awards, he appeared in probably the single most cool character reveal trailer in all of Smash 4 and Ultimate.

His Sakurai Presents would air a week later, showing off a repertoire of powerful attacks and huge, sweeping hitboxes. Of course, with such a powerful kit, Sephiroth had to have drawbacks, those being his low weight and trouble with close range. However, Sephiroth was not dropped like a normal DLC character. Instead, Sakurai and the developers allowed the player who purchased FP2 to unlock him early. That is if you could be him in a fight. The Sephiroth Challenge was dropped right after the presentation, allowing access to the character, stage, and music five days early. However, his spirit board would not be added until his actual official release date.

Sephiroth gave off a great first impression when I got my hands on him as well. In the first few hours of playing him, I was having a lot of fun, and, eventually, I was playing him so much that he became one of the two characters I play the most regularly (the other being Bowser). Sephiroth ties and maybe even surpasses Banjo as my favorite DLC character inclusion and was an excellent inclusion for me in all aspects.

• Initial Hype: 10/10
• Gameplay: 10/10
• Overall: 10/10 (I think this is my favorite Ultimate newcomer overall…)

Spoiler: Pyra Blazes into Battle/Mythra Awakens!

I remember waking up the morning the February 2021 Nintendo Direct was announced, doubting the announcement I was seeing on my phone. After all, it had been since September 2019 that we got a standard Nintendo direct, so I thought standard Nintendo Directs as we knew them were a thing of the past. Boy, was I glad to be wrong. Not only that, but the announcement promised the reveal of the next Smash Ultimate DLC character, making me even more excited about it. Of course, when that direct finally aired, the character that was revealed ended up being the Aegis (Pyra/Mythra).

Pyra and Mythra were characters I didn't particularly want in the game, but they looked very cool. I’ve mentioned outside of these forums that a stance change character would be a great addition to the game, and a character like Pyra/Mythra was exactly what I was looking for. I felt that Xenoblade 2 deserved a rep as well, so the reveal went better for me than I expected. Not only that, Pyra and Mythra were the second and third DLC newcomers that had spirits in Ultimate’s base game, further reinforcing that spirits did not eliminate a character’s chances for DLC. It managed to get even better after they came out, as they felt really good to play when I picked them up for the first time (mostly because they’re easy to play, but I digress). Pyra and Mythra ended up becoming powerful characters in their own right as well, with players nowadays placing them somewhere in Top 3 and them even being a candidate for the best character in the game.

• Initial Hype: 7/10
• Gameplay: 9/10
• Overall: 8/10

Spoiler: Kazuya Gets Ready for the Next Battle!

E3 was about to roll into town again, and everyone and their mother expected a Smash reveal to happen there, myself included. Because of how many pairs of eyes E3 attracts, most people expected some sort of big reveal, but what we got wasn’t really that. Instead, we finally got our second Bandai Namco rep: Kazuya Mishima from Tekken

To me, Kazuya was the definition of an average reveal: I had no strong feelings one way or the other toward him and his inclusion. Although I was happy for Tekken fans, this character just didn’t do anything for me. I haven’t played a Tekken game, and his moveset is a little too complicated for my tastes (more so than Ryu and Terry, who I can actually play somewhat decently with). Overall, very average inclusion with a pretty funny reveal trailer, but I will admit he’s fun to watch in tournaments.

• Initial Hype: 5/10
• Gameplay: 6/10
• Overall: 6/10

Spoiler: Sora is Finally Here!

This was it. The final DLC character of Super Smash Bros. Ultimate and the bookend to the Smash Bros. series as we currently know it. We all had varying ideas of who this final character would be. Could it be a big name like Crash, Master Chief, or Waluigi? Could it be a standard first party character like a Generation 8 Pokemon or even an Advance Wars rep? Could it be someone very few expected? One thing was for certain though: none of us had any clue who this character would end up being, and we were all eagerly anticipating the morning of October 5th, 2021. And, when the clock hit 10AM EST that morning, that character was revealed to be none other than…
...Sora from Kingdom Hearts! Nintendo actually managed to make the deal with Disney work out, and it’s a little bit of a cursed image seeing Disney’s name in the game’s copyright list. Despite not being a fan of Kingdom Hearts myself, this was one of the biggest, if not the biggest finale to the Smash Bros. series you could have gone for. We also learned that Sora was the true winner of the ballot all along, making his inclusion even more legendary than it already is! Now, Sora isn’t out yet at the time of writing, but he appears to be a floaty, combo-based character similar to that of his Super Smash Flash 2 incarnation (if you haven’t played it, go check it out while you wait for Sora to release). However, his moves do seem Smash 4 Bayonetta-esque, which worries me a bit. Hopefully, Sora doesn’t end up being super oppressive as tournaments live on. All in all, despite this inclusion being divisive for some people, I think this was the best way you could end support for this game.

• Initial Hype: 8/10
• Gameplay: ?/10
• Overall: 8/10

Spoiler: Overall Opinions + Closing Thoughts

Smash Ultimate will undoubtedly go down as having one of the greatest, if not the greatest, fighting games rosters of all time. Nearly 90 video game all stars of new and old don’t get to crossover in this capacity very often. Ultimate’s decision to bring back every veteran is something I will respect forever, and I feel that its newcomer choices were considerably better than Smash 4’s overall. While many of Smash 4’s newcomers did not resonate with me very well, I loved many of Ultimate’s inclusions either because of their gameplay or because I’ve wanted the character in Smash for a long time. After all, I thoroughly enjoy playing as most of the DLC characters, and the only Fighter’s Pass character that didn’t fit either of the two criteria I just mentioned is Kazuya, and even he has his merits. While Smash 4’s newcomers had the occasional hit, Ultimate’s newcomers were consistently hitting for me, and that is what pushes its newcomers over the edge of Smash 4’s newcomers for me.

This also marks the end of the Smash Bros. series for what is most likely a very long time, and what an ending it was. Sakurai and the development team poured their hearts and souls into this game, and it shows in the roster alone. After nearly a decade straight of development on Smash, it is now time for Sakurai to take the rest he absolutely deserves. As for me, Melee and Brawl were the two games that made me a Nintendo fan, and to see the Smash Bros series evolve from its humble beginnings to the goliath it is now is nothing short of fascinating. The way Smash celebrates its various game series and their roots are what makes it special to me, and Ultimate is, well, the ultimate realization of that idea. Besides, where else can Minecraft Steve, Sora, Ryu, Mario, Pac-Man, Cloud Strife, Link, and a Mii in a Sans Undertale costume throw PokeBalls at each other on Green Hill Zone? And with that, as the curtain to the Smash Bros we know closes, I bid farewell.

Sorry about the giant ass post, but I wanted to get my opinions out before this thread inevitably closes.

 

[N3ON]

I 'unno


Donald sounds pretty clear to me ngl

Sneak peak of the upcoming Mario cast performing their characters

 

[Michael the Spikester]

Akira Howard, Dixie Kong, Octoling, Ring Fit Trainer, Spring Man, Waluigi, Xenoblade 3 protagonist.

All the ones I'm certain has a shot for the next game. Waluigi most certainly getting in given the outcry.

 

[WeirdChillFever]

Sneak peak of the upcoming Mario cast performing their characters

Jim Rash as Fawful, make it happen Nintendo

 

[Rie Sonomura]

There's Definitely Planning on the Next Smash game

Unless Nintendo and/or Sakurai want to shelve Smash as a series, which I doubt they would after seeing it become the Best Selling Fighting game of all time, They would always have to be planning something for the future.

With anything successful, there's always the starting of production on the Continuation. As example, While Mortal Kombat X (Base game) was Finishing up, Development on Injustice 2 likely started, and when that was finishing up, they got started on MK11, and continue and continue. Same thing with Namco likely working on Tekken 8 while Tekken 7 was finishing up, and then during it's DLC

It's not just with games either, It's also with Consoles. The PS6 and Next Xbox are probably in the Conception phase even though the PS5 and Xbox Series X just came out. Same thing with whatever is next for Nintendo after the Switch

In any case, I do bet that Nintendo and/or Sakurai are planning the Next game. New game is a better Idea than just a Fighter Pass 3 since Nintendo benefits more from Profit from New game purchases. I would say at least Half, or even more of Players only buy the Base game and that's it, no Attention paid to any of the DLC

So why not just continue Development into whatever the Next Smash game is? why not stop here?

I think the thing to remember is that besides Sakurai and his Wife, the Employees at Sora LTD. are contracted workers, and in this Case, they are Bandai Namco Employees

While I do think Planning is going on, I think the difference between the Hypothetical Next Smash and the Transition to Smash Ultimate is that the Project Plan was already finished for Ultimate by the time Smash 4 DLC was wrapping up, as Iwata had tasked Sakurai with making the Ultimate Smash game for the Nintendo NX. Since the Project Plan was complete, Development can go on Continuously RIGHT after the DLC was over

I Imagine that whatever is being planned, it's not a Complete Draft or Plan, and as such, Development won't be able to start right away after Ultmate's DLC. I'm sure Sakurai is loaded with Money to take a break for awhile, but I bet the Bandai Namco employees need some source of Continuous revenue, and I'm sure Bandai could use some hands on deck for projects in development, So the Employees will go back to Namco, until they are needed again for whatever the Next Smash is. That's why I think the Continuous Development ends here. You can't continue Something that's not ready to be continued

We've heard of No Comment situations and weird Answers be given from Companies like Epic Games and Koei in terms of their characters getting into Smash, and while they have no presence in the Actual Smash Ultimate game, I'm sure there's more going on than just nothing. I'm sure Nintendo and/or Sakurai have talked to More Companies about potential characters getting into Smash, just not at this exact moment

This would especially need to be done because if Smash is going to go even further into Crossing over all these game series, than it's best to start early on Negotiations so any complications can be dealt with earlier without Compromising potential Development

I think Judging not only from the Sales of Ultimate and what the game has accomplished, but also the addition of Fighter files in the game, in spite of Smash 4 making sure to use all the Files and slots in the data, even taking away Slots I believe, I'm gonna suspect that Nintendo and Sakurai are gonna try for a continuation on Ultimate. It seems impossible now with all the Licensing they got to do, especially since they just Added Sora to the game with that Disney Licensing. Here's some of my Reasoning

-While it is gonna be tough being able to handle all of these Licenses, the thing Smash Ultimate has achieved is a Pedigree of being the Crossover Fighter. Max talked about how Getting characters like Cloud and Sephiroth is a very Tough, and Expensive Task for anyone to do, but because Sakurai has established a level of Quality and Consistency in his Development of Smash, it was likely much Easier than usual to achieve these characters

Smash Ultimate is the Best Selling Fighting game of all time. If Smash was big before, Than Smash Ultimate as established the series as Legend other Legends strive to be with.

It's likely gonna be easier than ever to get Characters from 3rd party Companies, and the More Crossover you add, the More and More other Series and Franchises and Companies are gonna want to join in. It's a Successful Loop that Smash is now in a Prime position to take advantage of

-I Imagine the Switch is gonna have a Long, Long lifecycle. I don't think Nintendo is ever gonna make a Pure Console or Pure Handheld ever again, and I think for the time being, we might start just getting Improved models on the Nintendo Switch

I think Long enough that it might be too long for a Smash game to wait for a Completely new console, and I'm sure Nintendo wants to continue Smash as a Series sooner rather than Later

However I think many people might stick with the OG Switch for perhaps the entire time until Nintendo do come out with Something completely New, and if there are to be 2 Smash games on a Similiar console, I don't think Nintendo and/or Sakurai would want to break up Audience like that

That's why I think whatever New Smash game comes out after Ultimate, is gonna continue Ultimate, so that people that have stuck with the Base game can still feel included with perhaps New content. If the Slots data are anything, it does support the idea of content from the New Smash game being transferable to Ultimate

-Sakurai knows how Close he is to having 100 Characters in a Smash game, and I think he does want to achieve that Achievement as well

-If BOTW2 is any Indication, they are willing to continue the Success of a Particular game without having to Re-invent the entire thing and also release it on the Same console that game came on. Granted there is alot of variable to Consider, like how BOT2 is a combination of Planned DLC that is saved for BOTW2 as of now, and that BOTW2 doesn't have any of the Licensing Cost Smash Ultimate does, but it's still something to Consider

Same thing with Splatoon 2 and Splatoon 3. Splatoon 3 doesn't seem to be changing the Formula that much, but I bet many People are gonna buy Splatoon 3 despite Splatoon 2 being Switch Exclusive also

So that's what is making me think the Next Smash is an Ultimate continuation, now what do I expect in an Ultimate Continuation

The thing with Ultimate is that the Base game was focused on Bringing stuff back. DLC is the Main Carrier of New, never before seen content in this game, otherwise the amount of Actual New content is kind of Lacking than usual

Since the Base of Ultimate is already made, with everyone already being Developed and Balanced, This time the Dev team can focus on Adding New content even in the Base game, So I would expect the following things

-A Big, Platforming like Story mode. The Reasons World of Light is the way it is is because there was not enough time to Develop a Story mode Similiar to Subspace and such, but since the Base of the game is Already made, Now there can be more time and focus allocated to the Story Mode.

While Smash does sell itself on Multiplayer and the Roster, the Single Player also matters too, it adds to the Production Values. That's what puts Mortal Kombat over other Fighting Games as an example

-More Characters. Since Sakurai is officially counting 89 Fighters, he would need to add in at least 11 More to get to 100. Balancing the Newcomers with the ever increasing Amount of Fighters is gonna be a Task, but I do imagine we could get a Regular amount of Newcomers with this Continuation of Ultimate Base game

I also imagine DLC will be a thing with whatever the New Smash game is

I think the Characters would be the only thing Transferable to Base Ultimate, besides maybe some Gameplay Tweaks and Online Improvements. I think the Story Mode will be an exclusive

-New Gameplay Features. This would also need to be changed with Base Ultimate. Perhaps adding things like Wavedashing, Air Dashing, EX Moves, or just More Specials at once can go a long way in helping to make things feel more fresh despite the ever increasing amount of Re-used Assets

-More Cosmetics. I heard a Reason every character only has 8 Costumes is because of the Lack of Memory to hold everything. I bet exclusive to the Next Smash game, perhaps Cosmetics will be a big part and go over the 8 Costume mark. Perhaps DLC Costumes can be sold

-Graphical tweaks and Improvements. Obviously, to showcase the Power of whatever the Next Switch Model is

-Improved Online. Whether it's Rollback, or some other Method that Nintendo Feels is best, I think the ability to Sell a New Smash game is gonna give Nintendo and/or Sakurai to go back and re-invent the Online and Netcode, which could perhaps be applicable to Base Smash Ultimate and the New Smash. However perhaps Base Ultimate might have limited form of Improvement, if NASB is any indication only providing Rollback for 2 Players

As for what type of Fighters we are gonna get in this Next Smash

-With Sora being added as the True Ballot Winner, I think the Ballot is not gonna factor into the Character Choices anymore. Whether there's a New Ballot that's made, or Nintendo and/or Sakurai is gonna keep take Social Media requests as law, I think characters being added for being Requested is not gonna depend on the Ballot anymore

-The Switch Library is gonna be Explored some more. Ring Fit, Gen 8 Pokemon, Astral Chain, and perhaps Future Titles are gonna express the Nintendo Library. In the Case of Gen 8 Pokemon, since by this point the Popular Pokemon has been determined, we might not get a Starter as a representation, which would be Nice Change of Pace

-Requested Fighters that had their Biggest Break in Ultimate is gonna have some Consideration. Waluigi, Geno, Skull Kid, Isaac, Shadow, Ashley, Bandana Dee, Porky, Eggman, are examples, At least among 1st party or Franchises already with Playable characters

-I think the Biggest thing is gonna be the Increased focus on Crossovers in the Roster. I doubt they would take a Majority of the Base Roster Spots, especially due to the Licensing, but we are gonna get some Big characters to sell on the Big Roster.

-From Companies already with Playable characters, we got Franchises like Resident Evil, Devil May Cry, Tomb Raider, Tales of, Nier, Ace Attorney, Dark Souls, Soul Calibur, Bomberman, Puyo Puyo, Yakuza, Silent Hill, and Halo and now Technically Doom, Fallout, and Skyrim as examples of Some Well Known, Popular, and/or Iconic Franchies

-From Companies that are Represented, but not with Characters, we Got Rayman, Assassins Creed, Guilty Gear, Blazblue, Ninja Gaiden, and All the Indie Franchises like Undertale, Cuphead, Shantae, Shovel Knight

and From Companies not Represented, We got Fortnite, League of Legends, Crash Bandicoot, Overwatch, GTA, Mortal Kombat, Any Falcom Franchise like Trails of and Y's, Danganronpa, Professor Layton, And Other Indies franchises or Series like Hollow Knight, Hades, Touhou, Goose Game, Among Us,


I think a Majority of the Base Roster is gonna be about Expanding the Crossover of the Series. I think for once the Amount of 3rd Party Newcomers on the Base Roster is actually gonna outnumber the Amount of 1st Party

FPS is the Biggest Genre missing, So I Imagine that would be placed in the Base roster. I actually think all the FPS (and/or Shooter) characters are gonna share the Same potential FPS type gameplay Gimmick, with their own Abilities to showcase their Home Series separate from one another

I Imagine most of the Characters added from the Japanese Side are gonna be from Companies already in, since Franchises owned by Japanese Companies without a Character tend to be on average more Niche than franchises from Comapnies like Capcom, Sega, Namco, Square, etc.

Since Sakurai and the Team now have experience working with Western Characters as Playable characters, I definitely expect to see more.


This has been a very Long post. Now that Ultimate is Over in terms of Speculation, I'm already looking towards the Future when it comes to the Next Smash, and these are my Thoughts. Sora is a Really good finale (Gripes about his Representation aside), and is gonna help tide Smash fans over until the Next Game. I think the fact they were able to Negotiate with Disney is a good sign of the Future, it showcases the Power that Smash has emerged with Thanks to Smash Ultimate success

I think the ideas I have provided forward are very Optimistic in Nature, but with that being said, I do think it is likely, and I do think there are signs that point toward at least the Next Smash taking the Crossover Aspect to the Next Level.

Interesting read. Kinda long, as is your style I guess,but I can see some super early negotiations being made.

i definitely think the bad online did Ultimate dirty. It could have been perfect if it had better online

you’ve got a solid vision for the future though and I hope it comes to pass

screw VR mode though. Most useless addition ever, I hope that mode goes

 

[subterrestrial]

Akira Howard, Dixie Kong, Octoling, Ring Fit Trainer, Spring Man, Waluigi, Xenoblade 3 protagonist.

All the ones I'm certain has a shot for the next game. Waluigi most certainly getting in given the outcry.

bandana dee, marx, king boo, birdo and or kamek, ashley or any other warioware char, definitely a new zelda char, obligatory gen 26 starter pokemon, latest fire emblem char, master chief, lara croft, crash bandicoot, and bomberman (ik theyre not 1st party but still)

I also genuinely think we will get a smashOC masterhand tabuu or sandbag most likely but maybe primid

 

[N3ON]

Akira Howard, Dixie Kong, Octoling, Ring Fit Trainer, Spring Man, Waluigi, Xenoblade 3 protagonist.

All the ones I'm certain has a shot for the next game. Waluigi most certainly getting in given the outcry.

We're wasting no time here, are we

Jim Rash as Fawful, make it happen Nintendo

Don't worry, by Mario 6: This-A Time It's-A Personal, they'll introduce Fawful.

 

[Geno Boost]

if Sora returns in the next smash game then i will have a lot more confidence on supporting a Club Penguin rep
having Disney barrier broken in smash opens the door for it to happen

 

[GilTheGreat19]

Bruh
Did you guys forget about the Fighters Pass 3 announcement?

 

[Rie Sonomura]

Also I wouldn’t call it the “Elma pit” cuz X’s ending seems to be setting up to a direct sequel where Elma will return

just throwing that out there

also 7NATOR I don’t think Smash 4 removed slots?Just filled what it already came with.

 

[3BitSaurus]

Just realized that Sora's trailer omits every other third party except for Cloud and Sephiroth. Something I don't think was a requirement for anyone else (for example, Hero and BK appearing on Sephiroth's cinematic, and Joker appearing on BK's gameplay trailer).

The only other DLC characters that show up (besides Sephiroth) are Min Min and Byleth. Both Nintendo characters, of course.

 

[SlickWylde]

TBH I've always been one of those "no more anime sword fighters", but I don't see Sora in that category at all. I thought most people were referring to the "realistic" style of humans like (most) of the Fire Emblem characters, who have just normal swords for most of their attacks. Sora is very different from the other sword fighters and looks pretty fun.
I've never played the Kingdom Hearts games but I've seen Sora requested on here since before Smash 4, even during the post Brawl days. So I'm extremely happy for all the Sora fans out there Also, his trailer was fun!

Last thing- I'm really glad they toned down the "gimmicks" for the last DLC fighter. Overall, great pick!!

 

[N3ON]

Also I wouldn’t call it the “Elma pit” cuz X’s ending seems to be setting up to a direct sequel where Elma will return

just throwing that out there

And Dark Dawn ended on a cliffhanger... eleven years ago.

Gotta play with the cards with which we are currently dealt, not those which might come down the line. Otherwise we're basically the Sylux fanbase.

 

[Michael the Spikester]

I hereby consider these four to be "The Sacred Tetralogy"


Sora