Official DLC Speculation Discussion Volume II

[zumaddy]

A Spyro and Crash dual reveal is peak pipedream "never gonna happen" stuff, but if it did I might die on the spot from happiness

 

[Doomguy46]

King K. Rool, Samus, Snake, and Rob are all pretty heavy zoners.

sorry for the super late response but I'm thinking a character that's primary tools are ranged and snake I dunno if id call heavyweight. I'm thinking your superheavies. K. Rool is the closest we have but not really what I'm looking for. And samus isn't heavy iirc.(isn't she lighter than zss?)

A Spyro and Crash dual reveal is peak pipedream "never gonna happen" stuff, but if it did I might die on the spot from happiness

it would be neat but disappointing In this fp IMHO. I think we need really big showstoppers like longtime fan requests or genres not repped to really end ultimate on a high note.

 

[Pillow]

sorry for the super late response but I'm thinking a character that's primary tools are ranged and snake I dunno if id call heavyweight. I'm thinking your superheavies. K. Rool is the closest we have but not really what I'm looking for. And samus isn't heavy iirc.(isn't she lighter than zss?)

Samus is pretty heavy. Iirc she's around 9th or 10th heaviest, being heavier than Ridley. Arguably she falls just short of "super heavyweight" class, but she's the heaviest of the tier below that.

I do think Superheavies could use more variation though. Imagine a superheavy character the size of kirby.

 

[StrangeKitten]

I think that's part of the reason creators/companies trust him with their creations, because he understands them and he does them justice. He's obviously a very talented guy, from game design to character design to writing. His ethos doesn't really match that of the hardcore Smash player, but he's very skilled at setting out to realize the product he envisions.

And you can tell the contrast when someone else handles the trailers. I mean, I think the "story" of the P/M trailer just wasn't very well done, and actual reveal part was... uninspired? It's hard to articulate. It seemed fan-level to me.

"Where's Pyra?"
"Have you seen Pyra? No?"
"Have you seen Pyra? No"
"Where's Pyra?"
"Oh, there's Pyra"
"Hey Rex I'm in Smash"

Leave the trailers to Sakurai, methinks.

Some people call for his departure from Smash, but I'm not sure you'd end up liking the result any more. I think those calls come from people who imagine his replacement would magically have all the same priorities they do. But if someone from EPD took over, I think we'd end up even further away.

I found the trailer unnecessarily long. It felt like the search for Pyra went on too long, and then the showcase of their moves felt really long too. Kinda felt like you could have cut the length by around half. It wasn't bad imo, but felt really drawn-out. I had chalked that up to the Smash devs potentially wanting people to question whether it was Smash or more DLC for XC2, but now we know that Monolithsoft are responsible.

 

[Doomguy46]

Samus is pretty heavy. Iirc she's around 9th or 10th heaviest, being heavier than Ridley. Arguably she falls just short of "super heavyweight" class, but she's the heaviest of the tier below that.

I do think Superheavies could use more variation though. Imagine a superheavy character the size of kirby.

no there is balance and that would be terrifying. this is in large part why i push for heavy so hard because i truly believe he would be a new pick that would spice up the game

 

[Pillow]

no there is balance and that would be terrifying. this is in large part why i push for heavy so hard because i truly believe he would be a new pick that would spice up the game

I mean hurtbox size and weight are just attributes that can be balanced again anything else. Small and heavy is a potent combo, but it's not inherently imbalanced.

 

[Doomguy46]

I found the trailer unnecessarily long. It felt like the search for Pyra went on too long, and then the showcase of their moves felt really long too. Kinda felt like you could have cut the length by around half. It wasn't bad imo, but felt really drawn-out. I had chalked that up to the Smash devs potentially wanting people to question whether it was Smash or more DLC for XC2, but now we know that Monolithsoft are responsible.

Honestly the fact myself and many others believed it was a Xenoblade 2 expansion makes it pretty perfect imo. The perfect bait and switch. Also just throwing out there the next character will likely be revealed at and released close to the digital e3 event. So I'm hyped.

 

[cothero]

I strongly believe that the two characters left are going to be from companies already involved in smash, or maybe only one will be from a new company.

Also, i think Lloyd is more likely than ever now.

 

[Shroob]

it would be neat but disappointing In this fp IMHO. I think we need really big showstoppers like longtime fan requests or genres not repped to really end ultimate on a high note.

Crash would generate huge hype to be fair.

I just don't think Spyro between the 2 has a shot, due to his lacking presence in Japan.

 

[Doomguy46]

My predictions are firmly on doomguy and Pheonix wright. I strongly feel that would not only be the best but most likely scenario for smash.

 

[Pillow]

Crash would generate huge hype to be fair.

I just don't think Spyro between the 2 has a shot, due to his lacking presence in Japan.

Spyro's just the smaller of the two characters in general. But yeah, being unknown in Japan definitely doesn't help Spyro.

My predictions are firmly on doomguy and Pheonix wright. I strongly feel that would not only be the best but most likely scenario for smash.

I'd love for this to be true and wish I shared your optimism.

 

[Doomguy46]

Spyro's just the smaller of the two characters in general. But yeah, being unknown in Japan definitely doesn't help Spyro.


I'd love for this to be true and wish I shared your optimism.

I do have somewhat something to back this up, its weak and probably confirmation bias but here it is anyway.

Given PW is a capcom character something has bugged me. Why only 4 mii costumes this time instead of the usual 5? especially when PW would have been an obvious brawler choice that would be fan favorite, profitable, and few would complain. So why not ask when in contact with capcom? It's a theory but I feel pretty strongly about PW.

DG is notably weaker but his situation reminds me a lot of little macs where they were practically begging to be in smash. He was given more super weapons and a grappling hook, as if its practically begging to happen. As well, he's got in game alts.. etc. IIRC id unconfirmed around the time of FP1 but its pretty clear to me FP2 came sorta outta left field for devs so its entirely possible they were being truthful at the time and it ended up being untrue later, or they just lied which is common for this stuff iirc. Also doomguy was given a sword.

IF THAT DOESNT SCREAM PUT ME IN SMASH WHAT DOES

 

[Pillow]

Also doomguy was given a sword.

**** you're right, he's for sure coming.

 

[Knight Dude]

**** you're right, he's for sure coming.

And he has an arm blade, that's like 1 1/2 swords. He's in bros.

 

[cashregister9]

To keep Doomguy 100% accurate, all attacks with the Crucible will be one hit KO's

 

[Doomguy46]

To keep Doomguy 100% accurate, all attacks with the Crucible will be one hit KO's

don't even joke

 

[StrangeKitten]

no there is balance and that would be terrifying. this is in large part why i push for heavy so hard because i truly believe he would be a new pick that would spice up the game

A superheavy the size of Kirby could be balanced just fine. Sure, they'd be a little hard to hit but there's lots of ways to keep them from being overpowered. Would Kirby suddenly become top tier if he weighed as much as DK? Probably not.

 

[SpecterFlower]

edit: my b accidentally posted twice, gonna need to find the remove button

I STHERE ONE?!>!>?!?!?

 

[Doomguy46]

A superheavy the size of Kirby could be balanced just fine. Sure, they'd be a little hard to hit but there's lots of ways to keep them from being overpowered. Would Kirby suddenly become top tier if he weighed as much as DK? Probably not.

metal kirby confirmed SS tier for both FP 10 and 11

 

[Shroob]

I STHERE ONE?!>!>?!?!?

No

Bottom text

 

[Koopaul]

I mean hurtbox size and weight are just attributes that can be balanced again anything else. Small and heavy is a potent combo, but it's not inherently imbalanced.

They could have a bad recovery to balance it.

 

[SpecterFlower]

you know what I'll give my thought on pyra and mythra

i think they are top 30 material, what's holding them back is their recovery if that was better i could see top 5.

Mythra:

Mythra can combo dtilt into anything, however her only kill move is lighting buster. what not a lot of people seem to know is that that there is a nasty multi hit hitbox on her sword while she's charging it which can combo into the full string which can be extremely deadly, despite being able to edge guard better than almost evry other character she can be pretty easily edge guarded herself however if she's close enough to use her side be to recover she will be able to get back using it in almost every interaction unless you kill her. her speed is ridiculous and she can lap circles around most characters, what helps is that foresight is basically bat within but better, it slows the opponent own a little bit so you can counterattack them.

Pyra:

she can dthrow into up b i believe which kills way too early, in order too play her effectively you need to be good at reading the opponent, otherwise she kind of suck's, the moment she goes offstage while her opponent is on it her chances of getting back are slim, it's always better to swap to mythra to recover. prominence revolt has way too large of a hitbox and is probably her second best kill move behind fsmash. neutral b is surprisingly multipurposed, it can basically do everything, it's kind of like a close up fully charged hero netural b. her side b is great for reposition however aside from gaining time it's not the most helpful, for recovery purpose it's only useful if you can airdodge to the platform otherwise you lost your way to transform to mythra and you're already dead. dsmash is probably her best get off me move and upsmash goes off really quickly for how much it can kill, i think. fmsash takes commitment but if you can successfully read your opponent it's straight murder.

overall both have a very good kit but they have pretty big weaknesses to projectiles and with their recovery. they will be able to secure kills really early and mythra will probably have insane combos soon.

 

[Ben Holt]

Why would Crash come with Spyro? They aren't part of the same series and Crash has enough characters to easily fill a Spirit Banner itself.
I mean, yeah, Spyro sometimes does crossovers with Crash, like with their GBA games, Skylanders, and Crash Team Racing, but Spyro is otherwise its own separate series.

Like, yeah, we saw non-Fatal Fury Spirits with Terry, but lets be honest, his thing was more 'Smash Bros. x SNK' than it was strictly 'Smash Bros. x Fatal Fury' regardless fo what it said, I doubt they'd do a 'Smash Bros x Activision' thing with 'Smash Bros x Crash Bandicoot'.

Pardon the late reply, but you just answered your own question.
While yes, they are two different franchises, Crash and Spyro have always been sister series. Even during development of the original Trilogies. Spyro 1 had a demo in Crash 3 and vice versa. During the sixth console generation (GameCube, GBA, PS2, XB) Crash and Spyro basically lived together, having McDonald's toys together, Spyro making a cameo in a mandatory cutscene in Crash Twinsanity. Twinsanity and Hero's Tail were marketed together and had trailers of the other respective game built in.
Though Crash Purple and Spyro Orange were sub-par minigame collections, they were still official crossovers. Spyro was a playable character in the GBA version of Nitro Kart and reprised that role recently in CTR: Nitro Fueled. Whenever the N. Sane Trilogy was announced, everyone IMMEDIATELY assumed Spyro was next, which was correct. Now with Crash 4, everyone is predicting a Spyro 4 in the near future.
I daresay that Spyro is more of a Crash Bandicoot character than Ralf and Clark from Ikari Warriors are Fatal Fury characters.
Unless we get Fighter's Pass 3 with a playable Spyro (assuming Crash is one of the remaining two), then Spyro works best with Crash as a Legend Spirit and a Mii costume.

Plus, I already know the perfect ability for a Spyro Support Spirit.
Mouthful of Curry + Impact Run.
Mouthful of Curry represents Spyro's flame, and Impact Run represents his charge attack.

 

[DynoStretch]

Given PW is a capcom character something has bugged me. Why only 4 mii costumes this time instead of the usual 5?

My guess is because Monster Hunter's male and female costumes are pretty different in design. Even the Rathalos armor is slightly different.

Also doomguy was given a sword.

Oh god you're right, Doomguy is a lock for Smash now. We're doomed!

Edit: THAT WASN'T AN INTENTIONAL PUN I SWEAR.

 

[ChunkySlugger72]

it would be neat but disappointing In this fp IMHO. I think we need really big showstoppers like longtime fan requests or genres not repped to really end ultimate on a high note.

Whether you think he's hype or not, Crash Bandicoot is a video game icon and the "Majority" believe he's Showstopper material and has the status and legacy to carry the weight of an E3 reveal/announcement.

While Crash Bandicoot's demand has been more recent the last couple of years because of the franchise's resurgence, He constantly tops and ranks high in polls.

He's one of the most well rounded candidates for Smash which is why Smash fans, Game journalists and Youtubers constantly bring him up as a potential pick.

 

[N3ON]

I think Crash would only be superseded in making the most people lose their minds by Sora and Master Chief.

Unless you're Japanese.

 

[Pillow]

Whether you think he's hype or not, Crash Bandicoot is a video game icon and the "Majority" believe he's Showstopper material and has the status and legacy to carry the weight of an E3 reveal/announcement.

While Crash Bandicoot's demand has been more recent the last couple of years because of the franchise's resurgence, He constantly tops and ranks high in polls.

He's one of the most well rounded candidates for Smash which is why Smash fans, Game journalists and Youtubers constantly bring him up as a potential pick.

He’s pretty much the successor to Banjo Kazooie in terms of Smash speculation, though he feels more inevitable than Banjo ever did. After Crash, the western platformer fans will flock to idk, Rayman or Ratchet&Clank.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

I think Crash would only be superseded in making the most people lose their minds by Sora and Master Chief.

Unless you're Japanese.

I like the implication that Sora isn't popular in Japan

 

[N3ON]

I like the implication that Sora isn't popular in Japan

I think you knew what I meant

 

[SharkLord]

I do wonder just how popular Crash is in the Japanese fanbase. I know that he's one of the few Western games to really get a strong foothold in Japan, but I'm not sure if he's held in such high regard of inevitability and popularity like over here. I feel like he'd appeal more to the West than to Japan, even if he'd be decently well-received over there.

 

[Pillow]

I think Crash would only be superseded in making the most people lose their minds by Sora and Master Chief.

Unless you're Japanese.

Out of video game characters, those are probably the top 3. But people would definitely lose their **** in both directions if we got Spider-Man or Goku or Mickey Mouse.

and yeah, Japan likes weird **** though, there aren’t many characters left that align with the tastes of both audiences. It’s just Sora and far below him is stuff like Dante, 2B, Monster Hunter and Dark Souls.

 

[Ben Holt]

I think Crash would only be superseded in making the most people lose their minds by Sora and Master Chief.

Unless you're Japanese.

I'd be salty as **** if Sora got in over Crash.
Keep the Disney Universe out of Smash.

 

[DevaAshera]

Pardon the late reply, but you just answered your own question.
While yes, they are two different franchises, Crash and Spyro have always been sister series. Even during development of the original Trilogies. Spyro 1 had a demo in Crash 3 and vice versa. During the sixth console generation (GameCube, GBA, PS2, XB) Crash and Spyro basically lived together, having McDonald's toys together, Spyro making a cameo in a mandatory cutscene in Crash Twinsanity. Twinsanity and Hero's Tail were marketed together and had trailers of the other respective game built in.
Though Crash Purple and Spyro Orange were sub-par minigame collections, they were still official crossovers. Spyro was a playable character in the GBA version of Nitro Kart and reprised that role recently in CTR: Nitro Fueled. Whenever the N. Sane Trilogy was announced, everyone IMMEDIATELY assumed Spyro was next, which was correct. Now with Crash 4, everyone is predicting a Spyro 4 in the near future.
I daresay that Spyro is more of a Crash Bandicoot character than Ralf and Clark from Ikari Warriors are Fatal Fury characters.
Unless we get Fighter's Pass 3 with a playable Spyro (assuming Crash is one of the remaining two), then Spyro works best with Crash as a Legend Spirit and a Mii costume.

Plus, I already know the perfect ability for a Spyro Support Spirit.
Mouthful of Curry + Impact Run.
Mouthful of Curry represents Spyro's flame, and Impact Run represents his charge attack.

It doesn't matter how closely link they are, I still feel its unlikely for Spyro to guest star in Crash's Spirit Board as Spyro is not a Crash Bandicoot character. While he is the Donkey Kong to Crash's Mario (though a little less-so considering that Mario debuted in Donkey Kong), Spyro is more likely as a Stand-Alone Spirit released around the same time as Crash Bandicoot rather than part of Crash's Spirit Board (which I do feel is likely enough).

Ralf & Clark, like I said, is a somewhat different case as Terry's Spirit Board was more SNK Characters than strictly Fatal Fury Characters, while Crash Bandicoot's wouldn't be like that as I doubt it'd just become an Activision Board and having a Crash Bandicoot themed Spirit Board with a random Spyro the Dragon Spirit mixed in would be a little odd, regardless of how closely the series are linked.

Another difference is that SNK practically gave away content it seems while having both Crash characters & Spyro would likely require there to be two separate licensing agreements akin to how the X-Men Animated Series needed separate permission to use the likes of Captain America, it just doesn't seem worth the hassle to just include a singular Spyro the Dragon Spirit in Crash Bandicoot's Board. Like I said, it seems more likely, at that point, that they'd instead license Spyro the Dragon as a series for a Spirit Event, which would likely mean more Spyro content than just a singular Spirit and is honestly a much preferred method if you were to ask me.

Out of video game characters, those are probably the top 3. But people would definitely lose their **** in both directions if we got Spider-Man or Goku or Mickey Mouse.

and yeah, Japan likes weird **** though, there aren’t many characters left that align with the tastes of both audiences. It’s just Sora and far below him is stuff like Dante, 2B, Monster Hunter and Dark Souls.

Well..yeah..but that'd be more-so due to how unexpected it was due to Sakurai distinctly saying 'no non-game characters' multiple times..and I really hope it stay that way, otherwise kiss most 3rd Party characters bye bye in favor of random other media characters that are more popular/well-known..

I'd be salty as **** if Sora got in over Crash.
Keep the Disney Universe out of Smash.

Why do you phrase it like that?
Oh, and what if BOTH got in?

 

[SpecterFlower]

I think Crash would only be superseded in making the most people lose their minds by Sora and Master Chief.

Unless you're Japanese.

Eh crash is a middling character, and by that I mean it would be the only character out of every single character in smash history to disappoint me.

however the amount of character in the game -1/ the amount of characters in the game is still a really good ratio.

also don't care about master cheif or sora, i only like basically JRPG characters exclusively.

if i was in charge of smash everyone would be anime swordspeople.

 

[DarthEnderX]

So I just unlocked the new XB Spirits and I got my Arthur Spirit and there's a blank spot between the two. What am I missing?

 

[Shroob]

So I just unlocked the new XB Spirits and I got my Arthur Spirit and there's a blank spot between the two. What am I missing?

Persona 5 Strikers spirit.

 

[DevaAshera]

I do wonder just how popular Crash is in the Japanese fanbase. I know that he's one of the few Western games to really get a strong foothold in Japan, but I'm not sure if he's held in such high regard of inevitability and popularity like over here. I feel like he'd appeal more to the West than to Japan, even if he'd be decently well-received over there.

Crash Bandicoot was a lot more than just decently well-recieved in Japan, I would say Japanese reception was equal to, or in some ways even greater than, Western reception.

So I just unlocked the new XB Spirits and I got my Arthur Spirit and there's a blank spot between the two. What am I missing?

A Spirit of Sophia from Persona 5 Strikers was released along with Arthur if you had data on your Switch from that game, but she'll release later as well.

 

[DarthEnderX]

Persona 5 Strikers spirit.

Ah, boo. Guess it'll take awhile for me to get that.

 

[Pillow]

It doesn't matter how closely link they are, I still feel its unlikely for Spyro to guest star in Crash's Spirit Board as Spyro is not a Crash Bandicoot character. While he is the Donkey Kong to Crash's Mario (though a little less-so considering that Mario debuted in Donkey Kong), Spyro is more likely as a Stand-Alone Spirit released around the same time as Crash Bandicoot rather than part of Crash's Spirit Board (which I do feel is likely enough).

Ralf & Clark, like I said, is a somewhat different case as Terry's Spirit Board was more SNK Characters than strictly Fatal Fury Characters, while Crash Bandicoot's wouldn't be like that as I doubt it'd just become an Activision Board and having a Crash Bandicoot themed Spirit Board with a random Spyro the Dragon Spirit mixed in would be a little odd, regardless of how closely the series are linked.

Another difference is that SNK practically gave away content it seems while having both Crash characters & Spyro would likely require there to be two separate licensing agreements akin to how the X-Men Animated Series needed separate permission to use the likes of Captain America, it just doesn't seem worth the hassle to just include a singular Spyro the Dragon Spirit in Crash Bandicoot's Board. Like I said, it seems more likely, at that point, that they'd instead license Spyro the Dragon as a series for a Spirit Event, which would likely mean more Spyro content than just a singular Spirit and is honestly a much preferred method if you were to ask me.

Well..yeah..but that'd be more-so due to how unexpected it was due to Sakurai distinctly saying 'no non-game characters' multiple times..and I really hope it stay that way, otherwise kiss most 3rd Party characters bye bye in favor of random other media characters that are more popular/well-known..

Why do you phrase it like that?
Oh, and what if BOTH got in?

Oh I agree with that sentiment 100% Smash should stay gaming focused.

So I just unlocked the new XB Spirits and I got my Arthur Spirit and there's a blank spot between the two. What am I missing?

Persona spirit

edit:

 

[Cutie Gwen]

So I just unlocked the new XB Spirits and I got my Arthur Spirit and there's a blank spot between the two. What am I missing?

What the hell they gave Arthur a Spirit? Is the first time a Mii costume brought a Spirit with them cause I don't remember this happening before