Official DLC Speculation Discussion Volume II

[chocolatejr9]

Something like this?
View attachment 304114

I hate it.

I HATE IT!

I H A T E I T !!!!

 

[KillerCage]

Nope. Just compare them to his taunt appearance in the trailer. They are obviously different. Eyes to be wary of...
View attachment 304115

Good sir, have you played/beaten Xenoblade 2?
I have gotten all of the base game's Rare Blades, beaten all but one of the superbosses, cleared all of the sidequests, and 100% completed the Torna expansion. I can strongly say that Rex had gold eyes long before he got Pyra.​

 

[chocolatejr9]

View attachment 304117

Good sir, have you played/beaten Xenoblade 2?
I have gotten all of the base game's Rare Blades, beaten all but one of the superbosses, cleared all of the sidequests, and 100% completed the Torna expansion. I can strongly say that Rex had gold eyes long before he got Pyra.​

The way you phrased this reminded me of that one meme, where it's another meme but the image is less detailed and the text is more detailed.

 

[Megadoomer]

As a certified Internet boomer, seeing Richter in Smash made me almost die laughing


Only to realize how many people didn't know who he was.


Damn kids, how do you not know one of the most meme'd lines in a video game of all time?!

I knew the line, but not who Dracula was saying it to. (I didn't play Symphony of the Night until long after it was released, and I wasn't aware that Richter was the Belmont in question)

 

[Pillow]

I know you're referring to the two-in-one deal, but my first thought was Hmm yes Steve the anime swordfighter

Still, Pyra and Mythra are at least semiclones of each other, can be freely switched between each other, and they're in the same pack. It'd still be a fair amount of anime swords, but it would only be three content packs of it. At least, I think that's how they would be counted.

I'm not really complaining, I just think it's kind of funny and feel that Sakurai actually does care about diversity enough to not want another JRPG swordy in this pass.

And we really don't know at this point exactly how similar Pyra and Mythra are, so I definitely will still count them separately!

I say bring it on.
The only reason I like playing Smash Bros is so I can play a fighting game with a huge number of anime-style swordies.

Yeah but I want other anime swordies instead! I'll take 2B, Dante, or Monster Hunter!

Actually we have 2 characters left anyway I guess, so the dream of all swordies and Min-Min is still alive.

 

[CureParfait]

Something like this?
View attachment 304114

Oh no that hurts my soul seeing that.

 

[SharkLord]

I'm not really complaining, I just think it's kind of funny and feel that Sakurai actually does care about diversity enough to not want another JRPG swordy in this pass.

And we really don't know at this point exactly how similar Pyra and Mythra are, so I definitely will still count them separately!

Hasn't it been made clear that Nintendo's calling the shots, though? Sakurai said it after Byleth, an ARMS rep was requested by Nintendo, so was Steve... Even if Sakurai thinks there's too many swords, there's only so much he can do about it.

Though, with all the curveballs we've been through, I'm half-expecting Velvet as the Tales rep, so...

 

[Rie Sonomura]

Pyra and Mythra are semi clones of each other

oh...?

this is how not-Echo octolings can win maybe?

 

[I.D.]

View attachment 304117

Good sir, have you played/beaten Xenoblade 2?
I have gotten all of the base game's Rare Blades, beaten all but one of the superbosses, cleared all of the sidequests, and 100% completed the Torna expansion. I can strongly say that Rex had gold eyes long before he got Pyra.​

I can post my hundreds of hours played of Xenoblade 2 if you want a **** measure contest so badly. I merely asked you to go back to the trailer and compare, but nope, you obviously just had to jump at the chance to be an ass.

CLEARLY different

 

[kylexv]

Pyra and Mythra appear to have very similar animations for their normals but with different frame data (Mythra's attacks are faster and weaker, Pyra's attacks are slower and stronger). Where they differ the most is their specials, in which both characters have completely different special moves (minus their Transform) and Final Smashes. Mythra also appears to have a passive that acts similarly to Bat Within, which scares me a bit.

As an aside, I don't think I've talked about my reaction to the two yet. Mostly just happy for the Xenoblade fans since I think the series deserved another character, but I'm very excited to learn more about their moveset since a stance change character is something I've wanted for Smash for a while. 7/10 reveal in my book: looks exciting but I didn't really jump out of my seat or anything like that.

 

[Lamperouge]

View attachment 304117

Good sir, have you played/beaten Xenoblade 2?
I have gotten all of the base game's Rare Blades, beaten all but one of the superbosses, cleared all of the sidequests, and 100% completed the Torna expansion. I can strongly say that Rex had gold eyes long before he got Pyra.​

I've sunk hundreds of hours into XC2 and have played through the story three times and even I immediately noticed the difference.

 

[Nekoo]

mfw I just explained that Final Smash assist characters have golden eyes because it's coded in the game that anyone using Eye_Material get shining eyes, just like chrom does in Robin's FS, or like all Pokémon and the trainer does but people ignored it

 

[I.D.]

mfw I just explained that Final Smash assist characters have golden eyes because it's coded in the game that anyone using Eye_Material get shining eyes, just like chrom does in Robin's FS, or like all Pokémon and the trainer does but people ignored it

mfw you have no face

 

[Pillow]

Hasn't it been made clear that Nintendo's calling the shots, though? Sakurai said it after Byleth, an ARMS rep was requested by Nintendo, so was Steve... Even if Sakurai thinks there's too many swords, there's only so much he can do about it.

Though, with all the curveballs we've been through, I'm half-expecting Velvet as the Tales rep, so...

There's no way to know, but I doubt they'd really force Sakurai to do something he didn't really want to do. It's likely some of the characters were Nintendo pushed, but if Nintendo asked for Spiderman I think Sakurai would be able to say no. The game still follows his vision after all. Plus I don't really see Nintendo pushing for a Tales character like they did for Minecraft or their own franchises. If anything, I'd say Monster Hunter or Astral Chain would be the next thing Nintendo would want to push for if they were really calling all the shots.

oh...?

this is how not-Echo octolings can win maybe?

I respect your unyielding optimism for impossible characters

 

[Kokiden]

I wonder when Sakurai will do the presentation? I did find it a bit odd that there is silence, even now.

I'm guessing that the new character will drop sometime in March.

 

[Lamperouge]

I wonder when Sakurai will do the presentation? I did find it a bit odd that there is silence, even now.

I'm guessing that the new character will drop sometime in March.

Solid guess since they confirmed a March release in the Direct.

 

[Nekoo]

I'm guessing that the new character will drop sometime in March.

Yeah, that's the best guess you can make since it has been announced that it was dropping in March already.

 

[SharkLord]

There's no way to know, but I doubt they'd really force Sakurai to do something he didn't really want to do. It's likely some of the characters were Nintendo pushed, but if Nintendo asked for Spiderman I think Sakurai would be able to say no. The game still follows his vision after all. Plus I don't really see Nintendo pushing for a Tales character like they did for Minecraft or their own franchises. If anything, I'd say Monster Hunter or Astral Chain would be the next thing Nintendo would want to push for if they were really calling all the shots.

Granted, they also went after Joker, Terry, Banjo, and Sephiroth despite them not having any obvious advertising power. Tales is pretty darn big in Japan, being regarded as one of the Big Three of JRPGs alongside Final Fantasy and Dragon Quest. Plus, the owners are working alongside them, so the rights should be easy. Just because Nintendo is at the wheel doesn't necessarily mean everything is a Switch-era "shillpick" or whatever.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

There's no way to know, but I doubt they'd really force Sakurai to do something he didn't really want to do. It's likely some of the characters were Nintendo pushed, but if Nintendo asked for Spiderman I think Sakurai would be able to say no. The game still follows his vision after all. Plus I don't really see Nintendo pushing for a Tales character like they did for Minecraft or their own franchises. If anything, I'd say Monster Hunter or Astral Chain would be the next thing Nintendo would want to push for if they were really calling all the shots.

It is literally this case. Sakurai made it clear he can deny any character he wants. And that Fighter's Pass 1 had no denials related to moveset(that doesn't mean some would have been said no to, mind you). He also noted no one was his personal picks among all 11 packs. Maybe Rex was his personal pick in this case, but the character wasn't suggested, so... he can't use him. For an example. My guess is in the case of Hero, he could mean that Erdrick's his personal pick, but Luminary is treated as the frontrunner. That would be a little awkward with his phrasing, but not necessarily wrong. Min Min is the only one that's questionable, but while he liked her and Ninjara a lot, it's possible he wanted Spring Man as the main representation as a fighter in the first place. So like 3 personal picks, but two aren't as important. It's an awkward statement in the end. I can see another case with Sephiroth as well. He's not the SE character he wanted at that point(maybe it was Geno?), but to deny him is ludicrous. We'll never know who all his actual personal picks are, but every single character is unique, so it's not like we've had a single one that makes no sense. I'd love to find out who he would've personally chosen, though. It'd be a fun trivia thing~

The only things he's said that wasn't hard applied to FP2, but honestly might as well be, is no Echoes. He's made it reasonably clear this is the final 6 packs(though vague enough that we could still get a FP3, admittedly, but it's about as likely as an Echo character in the Pass. Though to be fair, an Echo wouldn't lack anything else but a unique moveset. The pack would be full. He didn't really need to say it cause everybody's expecting unique characters in the pack).

 

[Pillow]

Granted, they also went after Joker, Terry, Banjo, and Sephiroth despite them not having any obvious advertising power. Tales is pretty darn big in Japan, being regarded as one of the Big Three of JRPGs alongside Final Fantasy and Dragon Quest. Plus, the owners are working alongside them, so the rights should be easy. Just because Nintendo is at the wheel doesn't necessarily mean everything is a Switch-era "shillpick" or whatever.

I agree with this, and I'm not trying to downplay Tales. I'm mostly saying I think the conversations go more like "Mr. Sakurai are you down to put ____ in Smash?" more than "We pay your salary so get it done" and they're probably more forceful with their suggestions the more of a "shillpick" it is.

Which goes back to my original point - Tales is a big franchise, especially in Japan, but I think Sakurai might have reservations about including a character that hits so many of the same buttons as Pyra does.

 

[Louie G.]

Even if Tales is part of the "big three", I think the fact that Persona got in before Tales (and Dragon Quest, technically) speaks volumes, let alone an additional character from two other JRPG series already in Smash as DLC before seeing even one from Tales.

Not to say Tales isn't important - just that it may not exactly be a huge priority, and that status may not mean that much on its own. I really do think it's the end of the line for Lloyd and Yuri and I'm fully expecting their costumes come Pyra's presentation.

(Er well, Lloyd's at least, but I think a Yuri costume would be warranted).

 

[Sysreq]

Which goes back to my original point - Tales is a big franchise, especially in Japan, but I think Sakurai might have reservations about including a character that hits so many of the same buttons as Pyra does.

This. I don't know anything about Yuri, but the only thing I remember about Lloyd is two swords and "Demon Fang!" (jk it was sword rain) But yeah, I can't think of anything truly unique at least that Lloyd could bring to the table that Pyra AND Mythra won't already in their specials.

 

[CapitaineCrash]

I wonder when Sakurai will do the presentation? I did find it a bit odd that there is silence, even now.

I'm guessing that the new character will drop sometime in March.

My guess is that it will be at the end of March near the release of the new amiibo wave on the 26th.

 

[SharkLord]

I agree with this, and I'm not trying to downplay Tales. I'm mostly saying I think the conversations go more like "Mr. Sakurai are you down to put ____ in Smash?" more than "We pay your salary so get it done" and they're probably more forceful with their suggestions the more of a "shillpick" it is.

Which goes back to my original point - Tales is a big franchise, especially in Japan, but I think Sakurai might have reservations about including a character that hits so many of the same buttons as Pyra does.

I dunno about that. Two swords versus one, no stance-swapping, a faster, combo-based style rather than a really big sword, and move cancelling (Granted, that's also in XC2, but it doesn't seem like they have it in Smash), and the Over Limit mechanic giving them a power-up. They wear red clothes, have swordfighting, and from action RPGs, but the similarities end there. Lloyd and Pyra aren't that close.

 

[PeridotGX]

I don't know if they would double dip on Sun & Moon rather than adding in a new Sword & Shield Pokemon.

What if they don't go for Decidueye the Alola starter, but Decidueye the Pokken fighter? Synergy bursts, Partner Pokemon, everything from that game.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

I dunno about that. Two swords versus one, no stance-swapping, a faster, combo-based style rather than a really big sword, and move cancelling (Granted, that's also in XC2, but it doesn't seem like they have it in Smash), and the Over Limit mechanic giving them a power-up. They wear red clothes, have swordfighting, and from action RPGs, but the similarities end there. Lloyd and Pyra aren't that close.

Tellin ya, it’s gonna be the monhuns that’ll return

you CANNOT tell me Xenoblade wasn’t influenced in some way by MonHun

 

[CapitaineCrash]

Even if Tales is part of the "big three", I think the fact that Persona got in before Tales (and Dragon Quest, technically) speaks volumes, let alone an additional character from two other JRPG series already in Smash as DLC before seeing even one from Tales.

Not to say Tales isn't important - just that it may not exactly be a huge priority, and that status may not mean that much on its own. I really do think it's the end of the line for Lloyd and Yuri and I'm fully expecting their costumes come Pyra's presentation.

(Er well, Lloyd's at least, but I think a Yuri costume would be warranted).

I'm starting to think that Nintendo just hate Namco. We got Fatal fury before Tekken or Soul calibur, and Persona before Tales of.
Next fighter: Bloodborne hunter instead of Chosen undead

 

[SharkLord]

What if they don't go for Decidueye the Alola starter, but Decidueye the Pokken fighter? Synergy bursts, Partner Pokemon, everything from that game.

If we were getting a Pokken fighter, I feel like they'd go for someone like Lucario or Pikachu, seeing as they're the ones on the box art, or Shadow Mewtwo, which is the main villain.

Oh wait.

 

[Louie G.]

I dunno about that. Two swords versus one, no stance-swapping, a faster, combo-based style rather than a really big sword, and move cancelling (Granted, that's also in XC2, but it doesn't seem like they have it in Smash), and the Over Limit mechanic giving them a power-up. They wear red clothes, have swordfighting, and from action RPGs, but the similarities end there. Lloyd and Pyra aren't that close.

I think what Pillow means, and which I agree with, is that Lloyd also comes from a flashy anime-style action RPG and would be the third character from the JRPG genre in this pass (third in a row if he was to be next), let alone the third swordfighter. I also believe that Mythra probably has a "fast combo-based style" in contrast to Pyra's stronger and slower attacks.

Obviously Tales and Xenoblade are two different series, but it feels like he may overlap a bit too much in general audience appeal and arguably gameplay niche to what we already have. I wouldn't say it's like, an outright disconfirmation mind you but I do think it's important to take notice that this pass has been extremely diverse in the audiences it caters to. Even Sephiroth and Pyra, both hailing from JRPGs, cater to an older and more modern audience respectively.

I'm starting to think that Nintendo just hate Namco. We got Fatal fury before Tekken or Soul calibur, and Persona before Tales of.

On the bright side, I don't think there's anything even comparable to Katamari, so that's DEFINITELY the first pick of its genre... whatever that genre is.

 

[PeridotGX]

If we were getting a Pokken fighter, I feel like they'd go for someone like Lucario or Pikachu, seeing as they're the ones on the box art, or Shadow Mewtwo, which is the main villain.

Oh wait.

I feel like Decidueye has something of an advantage, because it's THE new character in DX, pushed above the other four (who are also technically not newcomers, because they were in the japan only arcade version).

Granted, Pokken isn't getting represented so the point is moot.

 

[Nekoo]

If we're getting a Pokemon, it wont be from last gen, but this one.
Remember, Pokemon are another deal than Sakurai saying "I want". Pokemon Company hold the cards here gives him options and then he chooses from them.

If Nintendo's list had "Another Pokemon rep" instead of a certain pokemon, I'm sure Game Freak/Pokemon Company will go for Gen 8 My friends.

 

[Mamboo07]

This is just sad.

(No wonder first party reps are sometimes disliked.)

 

[SharkLord]

I think what Pillow means, and which I agree with, is that Lloyd also comes from a flashy anime-style action RPG and would be the third character from the JRPG genre in this pass (third in a row if he was to be next), let alone the third swordfighter. I also believe that Mythra probably has a "fast combo-based style" in contrast to Pyra's stronger and slower attacks.

Obviously Tales and Xenoblade are two different series, but it feels like he may overlap a bit too much in general audience appeal and arguably gameplay niche to what we already have. I wouldn't say it's like, an outright disconfirmation mind you but I do think it's important to take notice that this pass has been extremely diverse in the audiences it caters to. Even Sephiroth and Pyra, both hailing from JRPGs, cater to an older and more modern audience respectively.

To be fair, we did get three RPG characters last pass too. There's also the fact that Lloyd is entirely about combos and chaining together attacks, while Mythra's kit is made to contrast with Pyra's. Even then, we got two largely range-based characters with Min Min and Sephiroth, and right after Byleth was touted as a "distance demon."
I'd also like to point out that Tales of Symphonia is an early 2000's title, and Lloyd would cater to a different demographic than the Blades, who hail from a late 2010's title, if demographics are the issue here. Even then, we already got three 2010's characters, two of which are from 2017 first-party Switch games. I don't see Pyra being that much of an issue for Lloyd.

 

[chocolatejr9]

This is just sad.
View attachment 304128
(No wonder first party reps are sometimes disliked.)

If only we could break out of these mentalities. Like, I like third parties as much as the next guy, but we can't just pretend first parties are just there to pad out the roster.

If only we could be the change we want to see...

 

[Shroob]

"I have done nothing but listen to the Xenoblade 2 OST for three hours."


My wallet is in danger send help

 

[I.D.]

View attachment 304130


"I have done nothing but listen to the Xenoblade 2 OST for three hours."


My wallet is in danger send help

Just buy the damn game

 

[Nekoo]

This is just sad.
View attachment 304128
(No wonder first party reps are sometimes disliked.)

Welcome to the world of DLC. Sad reality, but reality nontheless.
We live in a world where DLC in fighting games are all impressive, or loved favorites.

In smash that translates to big Names or Big Third Parties and first parties feels like "should have just been base game"
Which is true in a sense. But wrong in another as those characters didnt exists at the time or just missed the mark by a bit.
And I say that as someone who loved Byleth and love Pyra/Mythra but despise Min-min

 

[Lamperouge]

View attachment 304130


"I have done nothing but listen to the Xenoblade 2 OST for three hours."


My wallet is in danger send help

Good, good...

What are your favorite songs so far?

 

[KillerCage]

I can post my hundreds of hours played of Xenoblade 2 if you want a **** measure contest so badly. I merely asked you to go back to the trailer and compare, but nope, you obviously just had to jump at the chance to be an ass.

View attachment 304120

CLEARLY different

Quoting Chuggaaconroy: I! AM! AN! IDIOT! BOX!

 

[Kokiden]

Solid guess since they confirmed a March release in the Direct.

Yeah, that's the best guess you can make since it has been announced that it was dropping in March already.

I missed the beginning of the direct and the smash reveal.