Official DLC Speculation Discussion Volume II

[WeirdChillFever]

Octoling kinda feels like Wild Link in that they’re posed as the solution for a drastic increase of potential that a new game offers, while the original game never displayed them as anything more than a variant of an existing character. Octoling with a fully unique moveset feels more like a hidden stash of “Splatoon Stuff” than a character with a fitting set, much like a Wild Link felt like a vehicle for Breath of the Wild in a character.
Wild Link has more reason to exist though, since the deal with Octolings and these new snazzy weapons is that none of them are particularly associated with Octolings specifically beyond maybe sharing a debut game. It feels more like a way to get an updated Inkling set in before the next game rather than feeling truthful to Octolings. Very much a kitchen sink clutter of gear rather than a playstyle reminiscent of how Octolings play in Splatoon 2, which is...identical to Inklings.

It’s really a shame people cling to Octoling so badly when Splatoon‘s potential can be focalized much better in a different character that is actually associated with the new gear in a cohesive set, but people somehow have the idea that it’s Octo or nothing, and thus it’s this character that has to be saddled with a moveset that is basically Splatoon’s Game and Watch Of Everything New.

 

[Peeton]

Y'know, the Aegis renders kinda reminded me of fan renders at first glance

I think it's the eyes. They're larger than most eyes in the game, and I feel like a lot of fan renders end up doing that too. Granted, the renders themselves are pretty darn cool, though it'd be nice if we could get separate renders too.

It’s the skin for me. Fan renders never get the lighting or skin texture right and they always look real weird

 

[Garteam]

The reality is that, even with Second Chances theory, we still don't have a great idea of who was and was not considered for the base game. Game development is such a complicated process that hundreds of ideas are considered, discussed, and sometimes worked on without being present in the final product. Look at Pokemon Gold and Silver, people are still finding a ton of scrapped or altered concepts even after two beta builds of those games leaked.

While we knew that ARMS and Xenoblade Chronicles 2 characters were considered but cut from the base roster for being introduced too late in development, we had absolutely no idea about the negotiations for Minecraft and additional FFVII content that later became Steve and Sephiroth's fighter packs. While Chun-Li, a Tales character, or Shantae all could have been considered in the base game, we can't say this with certainty. As such, while we can assume and (more productively) argue the case for certain characters, I would hesitate to conclude that an option is on or off the table due to Second Chances theory.

Hell, the only two characters we know for sure were considered for Smash Ultimate were Alucard and Decidueye, but I don't think they're going to get a Fighter's Pass unless Sakurai really had some magic for their movesets.

 

[Cosmic77]

I think Callie and Marie appearing as costumes with Min Min pretty much tells us all we need to know regarding whether or not Splatoon has a character in this pass.

I mean, I guess it's possible that they have four or five other Splatoon costumes, which forced them to put the Squid Sisters in a different bundle. Wouldn't hold my breath though.

 

[ROBnWatch]

My honest opinion on the Octoling's Chances depends entirely on if Splatoon 3 was planned for 2021 or not lol.

This is also something that could be taken into account. Splatoon usually releases in the summer so if it had been planned for this summer and been delayed to...let’s say May 2022 at the latest. I still highly doubt that Octoling will make it this pass, but there’s plenty of content left untouched that Octoling could play around with.

 

[Aerospherology]

I made a hare-brained theory after seeing this meme image:

So, the first column is a random first party. Then, huge hit of the 2010's. Then, Square Enix. Then, a duo character. Is the next character a fighting game character or SNK character from a different genre?

 

[JOJONumber691]

Octoling kinda feels like Wild Link in that they’re posed as the solution for a drastic increase of potential that a new game offers, while the original game never displayed them as anything more than a variant of an existing character. Octoling with a fully unique moveset feels more like a hidden stash of “Splatoon Stuff” than a character with a fitting set, much like a Wild Link felt like a vehicle for Breath of the Wild in a character.
Wild Link has more reason to exist though, since the deal with Octolings and these new snazzy weapons is that none of them are particularly associated with Octolings specifically beyond maybe sharing a debut game. It feels more like a way to get an updated Inkling set in before the next game rather than feeling truthful to Octolings. Very much a kitchen sink clutter of gear rather than a playstyle reminiscent of how Octolings play in Splatoon 2, which is...identical to Inklings.

It’s really a shame people cling to Octoling so badly when Splatoon‘s potential can be focalized much better in a different character that is actually associated with the new gear in a cohesive set, but people somehow have the idea that it’s Octo or nothing, and thus it’s this character that has to be saddled with a moveset that is basically Splatoon’s Game and Watch Of Everything New.

A Zoner to Compliment the Inkling's Rushdown would be perfect for the Octolings regardless of a Bow or not, thus still fitting the Octoling's Identity.

 

[Commander_Alph]

I have to say, the Second Chances theme of the pass makes me feel a bit more confident in an Undertale rep. I don't think one was ever actively planned, but the massive reaction to the Sans costume probably made them consider it.

Min Min and Pyra have me doubting Frisk, though. It would either be Papyrus or Toriel.

I mean good reception is one thing but that doesn't mean a lot to change their mind, I mean Sans is a mii costume is because Toby Fox just so happened to visit Sakurai and win at a Smash game, that doesn't really scratching deep below the surface.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

The reality is that, even with Second Chances theory, we still don't have a great idea of who was and was not considered for the base game. Game development is such a complicated process that hundreds of ideas are considered, discussed, and sometimes worked on without being present in the final product. Look at Pokemon Gold and Silver, people are still finding a ton of scrapped or altered concepts even after two beta builds of those games leaked.

While we knew that ARMS and Xenoblade Chronicles 2 characters were considered but cut from the base roster for being introduced too late in development, we had absolutely no idea about the negotiations for Minecraft and additional FFVII content that later became Steve and Sephiroth's fighter packs. While Chun-Li, a Tales character, or Shantae all could have been considered in the base game, we can't say this with certainty. As such, while we can assume and (more productively) argue the case for certain characters, I would hesitate to conclude that an option is on or off the table due to Second Chances theory.

Hell, the only two characters we know for sure were considered for Smash Ultimate were Alucard and Decidueye, but I don't think they're going to get a Fighter's Pass unless Sakurai really had some magic for their movesets.

Actually we do have people who used to be at Majong say that Steve negotiations started in 2015. I'd say that should count as a confirmation

 

[Garteam]

Actually we do have people who used to be at Majong say that Steve negotiations started in 2015. I'd say that should count as a confirmation

This is true, but the general public only found out about this after Steve was revealed in October. It wasn't like with ARMS or Xenoblade where we knew the characters were considered prior to the reveal.

 

[Diddy Kong]

So given where the Pass is sitting now. Where do you guys think it goes from here? Seems so far it seems to be based on content that was left out of Base game.

Min Min - ARMS rep, was considered too late for Base game.
Steve - Negiogations for five years, said to have been planned for Base game and Pass 1.
Sephiroth - Possible Cloud being included was under the condition Sephiroth would appear.
Pyra & Mythra - Xenoblade 2 rep, same with ARMS rep.

This pattern could of course break but so far my only prediction now is Chun-Li will be announced for E3.

Chun-Li is probable, but we already have Ken. I much rather see them give us a new addition of a franchise neglected much more as... Well, gotta keep saying it, Donkey Kong and Zelda.

That I feel we almost have to beg for a new character from veteran series that are the biggest after Pokemon and have been included since Smash 64 is beyond me.

deep sigh

 

[zferolie]

The reality is that, even with Second Chances theory, we still don't have a great idea of who was and was not considered for the base game. Game development is such a complicated process that hundreds of ideas are considered, discussed, and sometimes worked on without being present in the final product. Look at Pokemon Gold and Silver, people are still finding a ton of scrapped or altered concepts even after two beta builds of those games leaked.

While we knew that ARMS and Xenoblade Chronicles 2 characters were considered but cut from the base roster for being introduced too late in development, we had absolutely no idea about the negotiations for Minecraft and additional FFVII content that later became Steve and Sephiroth's fighter packs. While Chun-Li, a Tales character, or Shantae all could have been considered in the base game, we can't say this with certainty. As such, while we can assume and (more productively) argue the case for certain characters, I would hesitate to conclude that an option is on or off the table due to Second Chances theory.

Hell, the only two characters we know for sure were considered for Smash Ultimate were Alucard and Decidueye, but I don't think they're going to get a Fighter's Pass unless Sakurai really had some magic for their movesets.

Oh, i agree none of these are no sure things, but i think we can look at characters as having slightly better chances and possibly rate them differently.

 

[WeirdChillFever]

A Zoner to Compliment the Inkling's Rushdown would be perfect for the Octolings regardless of a Bow or not, thus still fitting the Octoling's Identity.

If you stick to a specific range for Octolings, then that‘s much better already. It’s just that I always see people treat Octoling as a bargain bin for new Splatoon content with no regards for playstyle. Sticking to Snipers would definitely alleviate a lot of that, while also representing content of Splatoon that‘s missing in Smash right now. Give them E-Liter and go from there, that could definitely work.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Octoling kinda feels like Wild Link in that they’re posed as the solution for a drastic increase of potential that a new game offers, while the original game never displayed them as anything more than a variant of an existing character. Octoling with a fully unique moveset feels more like a hidden stash of “Splatoon Stuff” than a character with a fitting set, much like a Wild Link felt like a vehicle for Breath of the Wild in a character.
Wild Link has more reason to exist though, since the deal with Octolings and these new snazzy weapons is that none of them are particularly associated with Octolings specifically beyond maybe sharing a debut game. It feels more like a way to get an updated Inkling set in before the next game rather than feeling truthful to Octolings. Very much a kitchen sink clutter of gear rather than a playstyle reminiscent of how Octolings play in Splatoon 2, which is...identical to Inklings.

It’s really a shame people cling to Octoling so badly when Splatoon‘s potential can be focalized much better in a different character that is actually associated with the new gear in a cohesive set, but people somehow have the idea that it’s Octo or nothing, and thus it’s this character that has to be saddled with a moveset that is basically Splatoon’s Game and Watch Of Everything New.

Slight counterpoint: Octolings could be used to portray how ink actually works in Splatoon rather than as a defense debuff like the Inklings have without changing the Inklings. I believe it would also fit in with their more territorial nature, though I'm not sure it applies to the playable ones.

Also, a different take on an existing moveset never hurt anyone. As long as it's more like Wolf was handled and not like how Isabelle was handled it should be fine.

 

[Firox]

Me about a month ago: "Ok, so we just got Sephiroth, the supreme overlord of all swordies. No way we're getting another swordie, at least not unless it's the last DLC character."

Sakurai has entered the chat: "lul Here's another swordie, kids."

Me: "....................."

In all seriousness though, I never thought I'd be so stoked to see another swordie so soon. Pyra/Mythra looks freaking awesome and I can't wait to play them. POWER AND EYE CANDY IN THE SAME PACKAGE. As a big fan XC2, I'm also drooling over all the potential music we'll get. Good times are ahead.

 

[RoboFist]

Hell, the only two characters we know for sure were considered for Smash Ultimate were Alucard and Decidueye, but I don't think they're going to get a Fighter's Pass unless Sakurai really had some magic for their movesets.

I think we can put Alucard and Decidueye (and honestly Ninjara, as well) over with Chun-Li in the "Characters That Were Straight Up Replaced" category. Their exclusions don't feel like a matter of "There wasn't enough time", but rather "They were considered, but ultimately another character took their place."

 

[Cutie Gwen]

I think we can put Alucard and Decidueye (and honestly Ninjara, as well) over with Chun-Li in the "Characters That Were Straight Up Replaced" category. Their exclusions don't feel like a matter of "There wasn't enough time", but rather "They were considered, but ultimately another character took their place."

Chunners only has a rumour, there's no proof she was actually considered at all

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

I think we can put Alucard and Decidueye (and honestly Ninjara, as well) over with Chun-Li in the "Characters That Were Straight Up Replaced" category. Their exclusions don't feel like a matter of "There wasn't enough time", but rather "They were considered, but ultimately another character took their place."

Though in Chun-Li's case it could be both.


Also, what Gwen said.

 

[ROBnWatch]

Octoling kinda feels like Wild Link in that they’re posed as the solution for a drastic increase of potential that a new game offers, while the original game never displayed them as anything more than a variant of an existing character. Octoling with a fully unique moveset feels more like a hidden stash of “Splatoon Stuff” than a character with a fitting set, much like a Wild Link felt like a vehicle for Breath of the Wild in a character.
Wild Link has more reason to exist though, since the deal with Octolings and these new snazzy weapons is that none of them are particularly associated with Octolings specifically beyond maybe sharing a debut game. It feels more like a way to get an updated Inkling set in before the next game rather than feeling truthful to Octolings. Very much a kitchen sink clutter of gear rather than a playstyle reminiscent of how Octolings play in Splatoon 2, which is...identical to Inklings.

It’s really a shame people cling to Octoling so badly when Splatoon‘s potential can be focalized much better in a different character that is actually associated with the new gear in a cohesive set, but people somehow have the idea that it’s Octo or nothing, and thus it’s this character that has to be saddled with a moveset that is basically Splatoon’s Game and Watch Of Everything New.

When Splatoon is literally about going into battle to shoot ink at the ground and customizing a character to go into said battle with a washing machine and/or mini bathtub that shoots ink at an opponent for a weapon, yet you complain about “kitchen sink” argument.

Part of Splatoon is legit customization. And there is also a plethora of stuff that is non-existent in Smash right now. Salmon Run, literally anything from Splatoon 3, various weapon types.

I swear I’m going to have to create this moveset for Octoling just to spite some of you guys lol.

 

[Diddy Kong]

I made a hare-brained theory after seeing this meme image:
View attachment 303844
So, the first column is a random first party. Then, huge hit of the 2010's. Then, Square Enix. Then, a duo character. Is the next character a fighting game character or SNK character from a different genre?

And the very last character has to be from Fire Emblem again right ?

I'd die of laughter if this happens.

Please Lord, owe me this one thing. You know I need some humor in my life

 

[zferolie]

I think we can put Alucard and Decidueye (and honestly Ninjara, as well) over with Chun-Li in the "Characters That Were Straight Up Replaced" category. Their exclusions don't feel like a matter of "There wasn't enough time", but rather "They were considered, but ultimately another character took their place."

Its just a rumor too, but i think monster hunter eventually morphimg into just rathalos and byleth coild make sense too

 

[RoboFist]

Chunners only has a rumour, there's no proof she was actually considered at all

Which is all the more reason for us to not jump on the "Chun-Li's definitely the E3 reveal!" bandwagon.

Its just a rumor too, but i think monster hunter eventually morphimg into just rathalos and byleth coild make sense too

EVERYTHING is just a rumor, so it's a matter of which ones we like best haha. Like this one. I like this one. It fits in with what Capcom has said about Hunters is crossovers, Rathalos as a boss, and Byleth's moveset.

We have no clue if it's TRUE, but NOBODY knows what's true. That's the definition of speculation haha.

 

[Aerospherology]

And the very last character has to be from Fire Emblem again right ?

I'd die of laughter if this happens.

Please Lord, owe me this one thing. You know I need some humor in my life

or it'll be either intelligent systems or koei tecmo, meaning either paper mario or ryu hayabusa

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Which is all the more reason for us to not jump on the "Chun-Li's definitely the E3 reveal!" bandwagon.

Wait first you counted her alongside characters who had at least some consideration and now you're saying otherwise?

 

[Diddy Kong]

Wait first you counted her alongside characters who had at least some consideration and now you're saying otherwise?

Doesn't have to be. Byleth was picked by Nintendo themselves, I bet they're the ones who picked the last character of this pass themselves as well.

 

[ShrimpScampi]

Since Pyra & Mythra are a modern Nintendo rep (well, Monolith Soft, but that’s under the Nintendo umbrella), maybe this is the chance to get an Astral Chain Mii costume or two to go along with them

I want to punch people as Lappy

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Doesn't have to be. Byleth was picked by Nintendo themselves, I bet they're the ones who picked the last character of this pass themselves as well.

What does this have to do with Chun Li and characters who at some point might have been considered but didn't make the cut?

 

[RoboFist]

Wait first you counted her alongside characters who had at least some consideration and now you're saying otherwise?

I think there's some miscommunication, my bad. I do not consider Chun-Li, Decidueye, Alucard, etc as viable characters at this point specifically because I'm subscribing to the theory that they were replaced by other characters during base game (Ken, Incineroar, Belmonts, etc).

 

[Cutie Gwen]

I think there's some miscommunication, my bad. I do not consider Chun-Li, Decidueye, Alucard, etc as viable characters at this point specifically because I'm subscribing to the theory that they were replaced by other characters during base game (Ken, Incineroar, Belmonts, etc).

Ah, Chunners still shouldn't be mentioned in that until we have actual hard evidence she was considered instead of a random 4chan post anyone can make.

 

[WeirdChillFever]

Slight counterpoint: Octolings could be used to portray how ink actually works in Splatoon rather than as a defense debuff like the Inklings have without changing the Inklings. I believe it would also fit in with their more territorial nature, though I'm not sure it applies to the playable ones.

Also, a different take on an existing moveset never hurt anyone. As long as it's more like Wolf was handled and not like how Isabelle was handled it should be fine.

Absolutely, Octolings would be a great as a semiclone where they take Inkling‘s moveset and change every weapon to the version that’s a tad heavier and slower. That’s honestly the perfect way to implement them, since neither Splatoon nor Inkling’s moveset are hurt by such a set.

The thing then becomes that the viability of these semi-cloned sets as DLC is disputed, so people aim to make a moveset for them from scratch, a thing I think is antithetical to their portrayal in Splatoon.

When Splatoon is literally about going into battle to shoot ink at the ground and customizing a character to go into said battle with a washing machine and/or mini bathtub that shoots ink at an opponent for a weapon, yet you complain about “kitchen sink” argument.

Part of Splatoon is legit customization. And there is also a plethora of stuff that is non-existent in Smash right now. Salmon Run, literally anything from Splatoon 3, various weapon types.

I swear I’m going to have to create this moveset for Octoling just to spite some of you guys lol.

I just think it’d be weird for Inklings to have a pretty basic set, only for Octoling to have a set that‘s just how Inklings should‘ve been, like a Daniel-The Cooler Daniel situation. Much of Octoling’s desire so far stems from wanting to have a redo at the Inkling moveset, with Octoling then having actual ink mechanics and all the weapons Inklings couldn’t have for having the burden of being the introductory set.

It feels like asking for Young Link, except Young Link would use all the obscure items from Zelda rather than the more iconic Bow-Boomerang-Bomb, and would also have a Z-targetting mechanic. For a character that is always presented as an equal to Link, it’d feel off to not make him play like Link.

Also I definitely await your set! I’ve already created a Cap’n Cuttlefish set out of spite so that’d make us even. Might even make an Octoling set of my own to reflect on what I’m babbling about here.

 

[TCT~Phantom]

Since Pyra & Mythra are a modern Nintendo rep (well, Monolith Soft, but that’s under the Nintendo umbrella), maybe this is the chance to get an Astral Chain Mii costume or two to go along with them

I want to punch people as Lappy

I would bet on Astral Chain if we get any DLC beyond this pass. Nintendo clearly sees value in the IP , it was a good success and they bought full ownership from Platinum. TBH, if we don't get any more DLC, Officer Howard and Ring Fit Trainee are some of the most likely first parties imo.

 

[PeridotGX]

Awhile back, I had an idea for a Pokken themed Decidueye. I don't think that's on the table (I don't even think Decidueye as a whole is), but it would be cool.

 

[JOJONumber691]

If you stick to a specific range for Octolings, then that‘s much better already. It’s just that I always see people treat Octoling as a bargain bin for new Splatoon content with no regards for playstyle. Sticking to Snipers would definitely alleviate a lot of that, while also representing content of Splatoon that‘s missing in Smash right now. Give them E-Liter and go from there, that could definitely work.

That's the first thing I thought of when the Bow was shown lol.

 

[Cosmic77]

I don't think "missed their chance" is a legitimate theme that every single character in this pass will fit in, especially if one of these last two characters is a first-party added for the sole purpose of representing a game that just recently came out.

More than likely, it's just a coincidence. It'll probably end the same way the first pass did when Byleth broke the "all third-parties" theme.

 

[ROBnWatch]

Also I definitely await your set! I’ve already created a Cap’n Cuttlefish set out of spite so that’d make us even. Might even make an Octoling set of my own to reflect on what I’m babbling about here.

Can’t tell if being serious or not but given the I’ll say it’s not.

 

[zferolie]

I don't think "missed their chance" is a legitimate theme that every single character in this pass will fit in, especially if one of these last two characters is a first-party added for the sole purpose of representing a game that just recently came out.

More than likely, it's just a coincidence. It'll probably end the same way the first pass did when Byleth broke the "all third-parties" theme.

I think its more a missed chance or long time considerations. Min Min and Pyra/Mythra barely missed out, and we have confirmed that Steve was in talks for over 5 years it seems. Sephiroth we dont know for sure but if what verg was hearing it seems he was in talks for awhile too.

Sure this pattern can change with FP10, but its a solid theory we can discuss and speculate on

 

[RoboFist]

I would bet on Astral Chain if we get any DLC beyond this pass. Nintendo clearly sees value in the IP , it was a good success and they bought full ownership from Platinum. TBH, if we don't get any more DLC, Officer Howard and Ring Fit Trainee are some of the most likely first parties imo.

I don't even have a realistic "most wanted" character anymore, so I have zero stakes in this, but I would be extremely happy with either of these if we do get another first-party. Especially Ring Fit Trainee. I know a lot of people kind of dismiss her as a joke character, but after playing the game a bit, the potential for a super fun moveset is enormous.

Ironically, considering the big speculative conversation we've all been having since Pythra's reveal, Ring Fit Adventure literally did miss the boat for FP2 haha. Unless Nintendo had the impossible foresight to see how well the game was going to perform in the middle of a once-in-a-lifetime global pandemic...

 

[Aerospherology]

can't wait until the next two characters are another snk rep (with 50 more music tracks) and ryu hayabusa

 

[zferolie]

I don't even have a realistic "most wanted" character anymore, so I have zero stakes in this, but I would be extremely happy with either of these if we do get another first-party. Especially Ring Fit Trainee. I know a lot of people kind of dismiss her as a joke character, but after playing the game a bit, the potential for a super fun moveset is enormous.

Ironically, considering the big speculative conversation we've all been having since Pythra's reveal, Ring Fit Adventure literally did miss the boat for FP2 haha. Unless Nintendo had the impossible foresight to see how well the game was going to perform in the middle of a once-in-a-lifetime global pandemic...

I would love a wii fit adventure girl in the game. Love her design

 

[WeirdChillFever]

Can’t tell if being serious or not but given the I’ll say it’s not.

I have seriously made a Cuttlefish set and I do genuinely await your Octoling set, and I might make a set for Octoling as well. The pac was more to show that ”babbling about“ was lighthearted and the overall tone of the discussion wouldn’t be as serious and more supportive of your efforts!