Official DLC Speculation Discussion Volume II

Deleted member · Oct 20, 2021

Brb going back in time to tell my past self that half joking about the 6th character being Sora after some unexpected negotiations was actually 100% correct

DarthEnderX · Oct 20, 2021

And finally, with 1512 Spirits collected and max leveled, my collection is complete!

Now if I could just clear a 9.9 Classic mode, my challenges would be complete.

Jerry98 · Oct 20, 2021

So... last day of this thread?
I didn't participate very much, especially in the last months, but it was fun.

Momotsuki · Oct 20, 2021

"Sorry, Reimu didn't make it. But that's okay; we got Steve, and we got Kazuya. No, not Heihachi. It- it's complicated. Just hold on a bit, and don't get your hopes up for FP5. It ain't good."
- Present Momo, talking to late-2019 Momo.

Firox · Oct 20, 2021

Michael the Spikester said:
Imagine the timeline where Kazuya was indeed our last fighter.

Not gonna lie, I know others would have been hyped, but it would have been an all time low for me. Like, as in Wolf, Bayo and Byleth being god-tier in comparison.

Momotsuki · Oct 20, 2021

Firox said:
Not gonna lie, I know others would have been hyped, but it would have been an all time low for me. Like, as in Wolf, Bayo and Byleth being god-tier in comparison.

Could - could you elaborate? And you - you have an issue with Wolf?

DarthEnderX · Oct 20, 2021

WeirdChillFever said:
Might mess around and become a Waluigi supporter to supplement my usual Splatoon shilling (and no, just Octoling won’t be enough)

I will never be free to "mess around" as long as the checklists continue to go unchecked!

The mindgoblins won't allow it...

Firox · Oct 20, 2021

Momotsuki said:
Could - could you elaborate? And you - you have an issue with Wolf?

Oh, hell no. I love Wolf, as evidenced by my maining him in Brawl. I actually voted for him to return in the official ballot (along with my votes for Isaac and Geno on two other computer/IP addresses). I guess he was the wrong example to include (though he would still be god-tier next to Kazuya). What I meant to say is, no matter how underwhelming other people have thought the other "ending" characters to be, I would have thought Kazuya the worst for me because I had literally zero emotional connection to his character. Prior to his reveal, the only Tekken character I knew of was Jin, so when Kazuya dropped, I was like "Who the actual **** is this?" Not exactly the highest note to end an entire game cycle on. I get that Tekken is a big deal and that Kazuya is noteworthy for the FGC as a whole, but as I said, I feel absolutely nothing for him. So glad Sora was the last character instead.

DaybreakHorizon · Oct 20, 2021

Before this thread gets iced, I'd just like to say this one thing:

There was a problem fetching the tweet

From The Second Ultimate Square Enix Character Argument:

Anyways, as well all know, Fighters Pass 2 has 6 fighters instead of 5. This fact was prominently introduced and discussed in Byleth's Sakurai Presents presentation. I believe that this could be due to the fact that negotiations for a character who had previously been rejected (which we know has occurred due to Sakurai's book) suddenly became available, and Nintendo jumped on it...

Sora had immense popularity during the ballot period, with the Kingdom Hearts community rallying together for Sora's inclusion. It's not hard to believe that Nintendo tried for Sora then, but negotiations fell through for one reason or another. They drop the issue until Fighters Pass 2, when Disney has done a 180 on video games following the mass success of Kingdom Hearts 3 and is looking to promote the series in the largest gaming crossover of all time. Nintendo approaches Sakurai like they did for Dragon Quest, and they go for it despite having already decided Fighters Pass 2 in its entirety. Since it's DLC, all they have to do is tack on another fighter to the pass and promote as such...

This explanation accounts for Disney's role in negotiations while also accommodating the timeline of Fighters Pass 2 being decided. In the initial decisions, Nintendo had a very thin window to negotiate with Disney if they decided to do so, probably for the second or third time. By going outside of that timeline, however, and explaining Disney's turnaround on negotiations as being due to a desire to capitalize off the success of the Kingdom Hearts series after KH3, you can justify Sora's inclusion as the special sixth fighter in Fighters Pass 2.

I WAS 100% CORRECT ~~(besides the turnaround being due to a chance meeting but that's besides the point)~~

KNEEL BEFORE ME, THE GOD OF SMASH ULTIMATE SPECULATION

Firox · Oct 20, 2021

DaybreakHorizon said:
Before this thread gets iced, I'd just like to say this one thing:

There was a problem fetching the tweet

From The Second Ultimate Square Enix Character Argument:

I WAS 100% CORRECT ~~(besides the turnaround being due to a chance meeting but that's besides the point)~~

KNEEL BEFORE ME, THE GOD OF SMASH ULTIMATE SPECULATION

Long live Britannia! Long live Lelouch!

Colololin · Oct 20, 2021

Just to clarify, is there anything about Steve having been planned for the first pass? Sakurai said during the Smash 4 days that the process of creating a character can take 1 year so in theory Byleth started development after the game came out meaning it is very possible Steve was planned for the first pass but withheld because of Vergeben's leaks.

HYRULESHERO42 · Oct 20, 2021

Last day of the thread - To all the retro characters not yet remembered in the Smash Bros series, we do not forget you and when the time comes, we will campaign for you once again.

Let’s hope this site (and all of us) are still around when the next cycle of speculation begins somewhere down the road.

Wunderwaft · Oct 20, 2021

Colololin said:
Just to clarify, is there anything about Steve having been planned for the first pass? Sakurai said during the Smash 4 days that the process of creating a character can take 1 year so in theory Byleth started development after the game came out meaning it is very possible Steve was planned for the first pass but withheld because of Vergeben's leaks.

The only thing we officially know about Steve is that he took around five years of discussion, we don't know if he was actually planned for FP1 as well. I think he probably was one of the few characters that were planned to be sold after FP1 before an entire FP2 was greenlit.

Nekoo · Oct 20, 2021

DaybreakHorizon said:
Before this thread gets iced, I'd just like to say this one thing:

There was a problem fetching the tweet

From The Second Ultimate Square Enix Character Argument:

I WAS 100% CORRECT ~~(besides the turnaround being due to a chance meeting but that's besides the point)~~

KNEEL BEFORE ME, THE GOD OF SMASH ULTIMATE SPECULATION

Do I have the right to flex too when I said the same thing since the moment FP2 was announced? :bobomb:

Speed Weed · Oct 20, 2021

Heyyyyyyy yeah, I guess today's the day this thread goes kaput, isn't it?

It's been a fun ride with you people. I don't have much to say because I'm Not Good at these posts, but I do hope Smashboards stays alive. I joined this site relatively late in the game's speculation cycle, so it'll be interesting to now live on this unknown territory where everything has basically reset. Very excited to see where speculation goes with this in mind. ~~sukapon resurgence lets ****ing GOOOOOOOOOOO~~

Anyway, yeah, I'm not planning on going anywhere. I have a creation thread to run, and I haven't been here for that long so I've still got plenty of energy left in me as far as speculation goes. And I mean, this place needs someone to spread the good word of Opa-Opa.

DaybreakHorizon · Oct 20, 2021

Nekoo said:
Do I have the right to flex too when I said the same thing since the moment FP2 was announced?

Hell yeah brother

RoboFist · Oct 20, 2021

Just gonna drop this here for all the conspiracy theorists/revisionists who think B&K only got into Smash because Minecraft content wasn't finished in time for FP1 and B&K was a consolation prize...

It honestly makes me wonder just how many votes the duo got if Sakurai is mentioning that fact in his column. That's really satisfying to know.

DaybreakHorizon · Oct 20, 2021

ChronoBound said:
This is my first time ever posting in the second iteration of the Ultimate Newcomer/DLC discussion thread. I have basically been in the background for speculation in regards to Pass 2. Of my predictions, they were mostly wrong, with the only two possibilities I had ended up happening being Steve and Sora.

Regardless, I am here to say I have a very important message to which I want to share with this community. I have been a part of this site for over 15 years. I have seen many things unfold during that time. I want to say I think I am basically done with speculation and character support. Do not get me wrong, there are still some additions that I would like to see happen, but I would say Ultimate has very much satisfied me.

However, I still want to write about Smash and its content, just not about speculation. I prepared a sort of farewell essay that gives me thoughts about the conclusion to Ultimate and my hopes for the future. My hope is that despite the length, that many of you will read it in its entirety. I absolutely encourage anyone who reads it to please send their thoughts and ideas about what I wrote as a personal message to me. I really want to hear the many stories that Ultimate has behind it.

Without further ado, here is my "farewell" essay:

Introduction

Ultimate speculation has finally drawn to an end. This title in particular has been very poignant to me. It fulfilled many different things to which I thought unlikely to ever happen for a Smash title and also were personal dreams and hopes I had. The inclusion of Ridley (my single most wanted character for nearly 20 years) and bringing back the entire past roster were absolutely incredible to me personally, as were the inclusions of the Belmonts and Banjo & Kazooie. Heck, even non-roster inclusions such as most prior stages being brought back and Pico (my favorite F-Zero character) having a role beyond trophy/spirit, meant a lot to me.

In a recent column Sakurai made in Famitsu, he said, "Everything must come to an end at some point."( https://www.nintendolife.com/news/2...ai_says_he_likes_the_idea_of_early_retirement Sakurai ) used this column to announce that he would retire his Famitsu column that he had been writing since 2003. Ultimate will not be the end for Smash, but I think Sakurai will likely to take a break from the franchise for a few years, especially after having worked nonstop on Smash for nearly a decade (development on Smash 4 began in early 2012).

At this point much of my interest in Smash speculation and character support is gone. There are a multitude of reasons for this. One is that I have far less free time than I did during prior Smash speculation epochs. Another is that I am getting older and gradually losing interest in many gaming things in general. Another reason is that the general dynamics for speculation have changed with the in-depth dives only really only being appreciated if you are a known Youtube personality. Platforms like Reddit and Twitter seem counter-intuitive for speculation to me, and the old mainstays like GameFAQs and SmashBoards have bled much of their userbase.

Another important thing about my depreciated interest is that Ultimate has basically given me most of what I had been hoping for in regards to Smash. Ultimate implemented many things I had wanted to see, but had always thought of as being very unlikely to ever happen. I am someone that had been following Smash even before the first installment was internationally released, and I have been involved in online roster speculation for 20 years now. To me, Ultimate feels like a culmination or rather a personal conclusion.

In general Ultimate was basically a "too good to be true" title that somehow ended up being real. There are some things that I wish ended up happening with Ultimate, but the thing is that as far as a Smash title goes in terms of being in line with my own personal desires and tastes, this is the best it will get (assuming Ultimate is not ported and built upon). At some point the journey has to end for myself.

By comparison, there are many others that are still waiting for their most wanted characters to debut in Smash or for it to take a direction that they want the series to go down (such as a single player mode that is similar to Subspace Emissary or a high focus on competitive gameplay). For many others here, their dream Smash has yet to be realized and it is what will be driving them going forward aside from particular characters that they want to see make it onto the roster.

Ultimate is likely the pinnacle in terms of character and stage count, but there are other directions Smash can taken that can take that can make them stand as tall as Ultimate has. For myself, though, Ultimate is what I was hoping for.

There are still a few things left that I would like to see, most notably Dixie Kong being a part of the roster (it is still peculiar how we are at nearly 90 characters, yet she is not part of them), however, overall I would say 95% of my personal desires for Smash Bros. have now been fulfilled.

For myself, the overwhelming bulk of my involvement during this speculation period was during the base game period. I made over 500 posts in 2018 alone. By comparison, I only made around 110 posts in 2019, and only 30 in 2020. I would say for Pass 2 most of my interest in speculating had been very depreciated. I would also say none of the Pass 2 characters in general I was personally hyped for, although of all the DLC characters in general, the only one that I was personally glad to see was Banjo & Kazooie. That being said I am still very happy about the additions that were made with the base roster. I would have satisfied even if there had been no DLC at all for Ultimate.

Ultimate Ending Is A Massive Milestone

I am not sure how many of you are aware of this, but Ultimate concluding is not just the end of Ultimate but also the end of the long cycle that began all the way back when Smash 4 was first announced in June 2011. In general, it seems as though Sakurai seems to view Smash 4 and Ultimate as a single development cycle. Sakurai quite explicitly stated this in one of this columns, and it was alluded to again during the Kazuya presentation to which he showed a short clip of every newcomer in Smash 4 to Ultimate beginning with Villager.

The development between Smash 4 to Ultimate was continuous. The project plan for Ultimate was completed in December 2015, the same month to which Corrin and Bayonetta were unveiled. Sakurai said he began development for Smash 4 soon after Kid Icarus Uprising was finished (which was early 2012), so he has been working on Smash for nearly a decade now.

Making Ultimate was also a “last request” from Iwata to Sakurai (Source: https://www.nintendolife.com/news/2..._sakurai_and_he_doesnt_know_what_hell_do_next ) . Sakurai went over and beyond for Ultimate as a way to honor the deceased Iwata. I think without the particular gravity of Iwata passing soon after he made this request to Sakurai, it might have been possible Ultimate would not be as “ultimate” as it turned out to be.

Ultimate is also the culmination of what began starting with Smash 64 in 1999. It not only has the entire roster up until this current point, and almost all of the stages, but also almost the entire soundtrack for 64, Melee, Brawl, and Smash 4 as well.

Thoughts On Sora

I have barely played the Kingdom Hearts series, so I cannot say I have a personal affinity for the series and its main protagonist, Sora. With that being said, Sora was a fitting conclusion for Ultimate. The main motif of Ultimate going back to its formal unveil at E3 2018 was the “making the impossible possible”. Sora was a character long thought to be impossible due to the unique copyright situation for the character, and in particular being owned by Disney.

There was also the matter that a very important part of Kingdom Hearts is the crossover with Disney’s traditional animation properties. With Sakurai still being very hesitant to add non-game characters to Smash, many believed that adding Kingdom Hearts to Smash Bros. was very unfeasible, and if it was, that it would open the floodgates for non-gaming characters to be added to the roster for future Smash titles.

The revelation that Sora was the true winner to the Smash Ballot makes him the most fitting end to Ultimate in general with the consideration that the Smash Ballot was the basis to which Ultimate’s foundation was derived. Everyone Is Here, Ridley, King K. Rool, the Belmonts, Chrom, Dark Samus, and Banjo & Kazooie all could probably owe their inclusion in Ultimate due to their ballot performance.

There was something very poignant about Sakurai saying that he talked about the results to Iwata (which was probably only months or weeks before he died). Ultimate in general was made as a sort of last request from Iwata to Sakurai. I think with the addition of Sora to Ultimate in a way made Iwata’s last request finally fulfilled. Ultimate is a legendary title that is truly worthy of its moniker.

It is difficult to think of a character that could have beat out Sora in terms of being a bigger finish than he was. Master Chief might have been able to rival him in the West, but he is a pretty niche character outside of Western game markets. I think Sora is the one character that ties best with Ultimate’s unveil motif of making the impossible possible.

A Shout Out To The Dixie Kong Support Thread

I said this to the Dixie Kong support thread in the past, but I was amazed how a cozy and supportive online community that is actually on topic about it (or relatively on topic since it often talked about the DK franchise in general) could exist on today’s internet. You had artists, all sorts of different and unique takes on how Dixie Kong could be approached as a fighter, and many just bringing up their own personal stories about how or why they were fans of the character. It was not a replacement for a social circle like many other online spaces either, most people usually posted when they actually had something to contribute.

Also, there was a tolerance for differing viewpoints and ideas. The most contentious of these for the Dixie Kong thread was whether she should or could work as an echo fighter. Even then, users generally had respect for one another even if they were in different camps in regards to this. The proprietor to the Dixie Kong thread, @BirthNote, would also constantly highlight the contributions that various Dixie Kong supporters put out by changing the topic title. This actually helped foster a sense of community without it being a “social club”. It made everyone feel like their contributions were meaningful and that they put forth something worthwhile.

This sort of environment proved to me that a non-toxic environment in relation to Smash or Nintendo is still possible on today’s internet. This was how an internet community should be. People with unique talents and perspectives coming together and sharing their passion together, and still having a respect for one another even if they have a different opinion on an aspect to that shared interest. Even though Dixie Kong was ultimately never added to Ultimate’s roster I am still thankful for the positive experience I had within that thread during my last few years with the Smash community.

A Brief Background for Who I Am

There are likely many of you that are reading this piece that have little idea as to who I am. In particular, I stopped being very active in speculation after 2018, and I made hardly any posts from the second half of 2015 to June 2018.

My history with Smash speculation and character support is a very long one, but I will only talk about the most important details.

I began my involvement with online Smash speculation and character support all the way back in 2001 a few months after the Melee unveil at E3 2001. I initially joined because I had a hope for Ridley making the roster for that title due to his appearance in the Melee unveil trailer. The basic foundation of what to expect with speculation, with fan expectations not being aligned with what ultimately ended up happening, manias pertaining to peculiar characters at certain points, and legit roster leaks being met with denial and vitriol. It was simply a preview of what was going to expand much more when Brawl was unveiled.

For the next epoch, Brawl speculation, I was at the forefront of speculation. It was in 2007 where I began regularly putting out long write ups in regards to speculation. I was even the first one to piece together the entirety of Brawl’s roster, as all of the legit leakers gave out an incomplete picture, and it was only through looking at how all the ones that were proven to be legit overlapped, that I was able to figure out Brawl’s 35 (or 39) character roster. I also was the first one to call the scrapped characters that still had folders within Brawl’s coding, “the Forbidden 7”.

I apologize if the previous paragraph came across as “boastful”, that was not my intention, but rather to provide context to my impact on the speculation community and just how far back this influence was. There are many who are now here that have little idea as to who I am, so I wanted to provide some anecdotes as to my work in the far past.

After Brawl’s release, I did five things: do extensive history lessons on the history of character support and speculation (I was one of the few speculators from the pre-Melee and first half of pre-Brawl that was still around), provide extensive analyses, do extensive character support for Ridley, extensive character support for Roy’s return, and do research into the desires of the Japanese side to the Smash fanbase.

With Sakurai seeming to give a definitive statement on Ridley as a playable fighter (it almost seemed like he would never become playable) in November 2014 and Roy confirmed to return for Smash 4 in June 2015, I basically left speculation in June 2015. I only made two posts after June 2015 and prior to April 2018.

I only returned in April 2018 a month after the Inkling teaser. I only made a few posts before the Ultimate unveil in June 2018. Ultimate’s unveil ended up fulfilling two of my dreams that I thought unlikely to ever happen, namely bringing back every single veteran and bringing in my single most wanted character for almost two decades, Ridley. At that point, I ended up back to being fully involved in Smash speculation and character support.

The August 2018 direct brought my hype to even further heights through the confirmation of the Belmonts (and the extensive Castlevania content in general), Dark Samus, and K. Rool being confirmed, as well as the confirmation nearly all of the prior stages to the series would be returning. It was shortly after this direct that I began to devote myself to doing character support for Dixie Kong. She was the one character I felt was most conspicuously absent from a roster as legendary as Ultimate’s, as well as the game character that meant a lot to me during my childhood that still was not on the roster (aside from Banjo & Kazooie, whom seemed impossible at the time).

When Ultimate released, I felt largely satisfied with the game and that it had fulfilled most of the desires that I had pertaining to Smash Bros. My activity during the DLC period was much less than it was during the second half of 2018. I was very happy to see Banjo & Kazooie happen. After 2019, I most relegated myself to making infrequent posts in the Dixie support thread as well as my own Pass 2 predictions topic (which ended up being mostly incorrect).

Overall, I am someone known for their very long legacy within the Smash Bros. speculation and character support community, and for making extensive essays on a myriad of different topics. The two primary characters I was known for supporting were Ridley and Roy. I also started extensively supporting Dixie Kong since 2018, although most of that was limited to her support thread.

At this point, I feel like I have lost most of my interest in doing character support and roster speculation. However, I still feel like I have ideas and essays to share with others….

Everyone Is Here: Everyone’s Stories

At the forefront of Roy support, I would constantly hear how Roy was a worthless addition for Smash Bros., and that they could not understand why anyone, much less an avid Fire Emblem fan, be a fan of him. Over the course of supporting Roy’s return for Smash, I also ended up becoming sympathetic to the supporters of other cut veterans, and hoped that somehow that they would get to enjoy their favorite Smash veteran returning one day as well.

There are many deep personal stories that people have in regards to the 89 playable characters on Ultimate’s legendary roster. I really want people to share their own personal stories and be able share just why any character on Ultimate’s roster, whether one of gaming’s biggest icons or ones that are largely forgotten are ones are dear to their heart.

There are many, many personal stories out there regarding each character on Ultimate’s legendary roster. One of my goals going forward is to find a personal story for every single character, from the likes of Link to the likes of Corrin. I would also like to extend this to people who were happy about a particular Mii costume, Assist Trophy appearance, and stage appearance or role. For myself for example, I was extremely pleasantly surprised about Pico’s World of Light role, and I would provide a personal story on why I like Pico so much, and why even though it was not a roster role, it still meant a lot to me.

Here are some of the people I already have in mind to explain their stories:

@Arcadenik: Duck Hunt
Opossum : Chrom
N3ON : Banjo & Kazooie
@BKupa666: King K. Rool
@Fuzzy Pickles!: Mega Man
@Diem: Dark Samus
@Diddy Kong: (What do you think)
DaybreakHorizon : Sora ; Joker
Phoenix Douchebag : Simon

These are just a few of people that come to mind in regards to a certain character inclusion meaning a lot to someone in particular, I apologize if there are others out there that are strongly associated with a character already on the roster and you are not part of this “example list”. As to the examples given on this list, I am not sure whether they would be interested in sharing their stories about these characters, but I hope they do. To anyone else out there that wants to write their own particular personal story pertaining to a particular character on Ultimate’s roster, you are more than welcome. Just send me a private message about the character that means something personally to you.

I would also like to write about the speculation history pertaining to each character on Ultimate’s roster as well, but I cannot make a certain promise I can do it. I will chime in on a particular character’s speculation and character support backstory if I feel I have anything worthwhile to add.

In regards to when the stories have to be written, the truth is that you have plenty of time to write out your stories. I want to turn this into a regular series of sorts, so it would take years to build up a sizable amount of content.

The other reason why you do not have to get your own stories ready immediately (you can write them gradually over the course of months) ties in with my future plans that I want to do after speculation and character support. Back in the summer of 2018, after the August 2018 Ultimate direct, I started thinking about all of the characters on Ultimate’s roster to which meant something me to personally. Initially thinking about it, it was 25 characters. However, over the course of three years, it expanded to 30 and then 40.

For all of these characters, they would each have a series of essays about them. The character in question would be the common “glue” between all of the essays.

Here is an example of what a series of essays would look like for a particular character as part of this project would look like, and how the character in question would serve as the “umbrella” to which all of the essays fall under.

Bowser Jr. will be a part of this 40 character series. Here are the series of essays that I would compose as part of the Bowser Jr. “set”:

A review and analysis of Bowser’s Fury (Bowser Jr. is the co-protagonist of this title)

A review and analysis Bowser Jr.’s Journey (Bowser Jr. is the main protagonist of this title)

History and analysis of Bowser Jr.

History and analysis of the Koopalings

A look at the history of the animosity between the fanbases of Bowser Jr. and the Koopalings and how it was eventually healed

An essay on multiple characters existing within the same slot as “palette swaps” (like it does for characters like Bowser Jr., Olimar, Hero, and Steve).

An analysis, history, and breakdown of the ESRB leak in regards to Smash 4 (Bowser Jr. was among the final characters leaked for Smash 4’s base roster)

A history of the very high competition that always existed between various fanbases for potential Mario newcomers going back to pre-Melee to the very present.

As can be seen, each character might very well have a novella about them.

As mentioned earlier, these are 40 characters on Ultimate’s legendary roster that have some sort of personal meaning to me. It will take a very, very long time for me to get through every single one of these characters, and it will likely take at least one decade.

All of the major roster leaks would be covered as part of this series, as well as many different parts of speculation history in general. This is a personal passion project of mine, and it will take a very, very long time to complete. I am uncertain even what sort of format these essays will take, or where I will even host them.

I know it is difficult for many to read a large piece, so I am contemplating perhaps the video format (it has been suggested by a few others as well to me). However, if it were to be a video format, it would take probably at least two years before my first videos would be published. In the case of a video format, I would also narrate the personal stories of others and try to something special for each of them (like put particular music tracks from that character’s title at particular points in the story as well as put up nice artwork of that particular character at various points in the video).

The Decline of The Smash Community

The other reason for “Everyone’s Stories” is to carve out a nice little niche for the Smash fanbase in general free from much of the toxicity that exists today for most online entertainment medium fanbases.

It is no secret that the old mainstays for roster speculation and character support like SmashBoards and GameFAQs have heavily declined in users and activity since the Smash 4 epoch. Much of the activity these days are now on “mega platforms” such as Reddit, Twitter, Discord, and Youtube. For most of these platforms, character support and speculation is mostly done through memes and ****posts. Your own voice and ideas are drowned out in the massive void.

The only one of these platforms where an individual can make a difference and have their own unique ideas and speculation heard is YouTube, but even there it only really matters if your own channel has a large following (at least 5,000 subscribers) and good luck getting to that number with today’s algorithms.

GameFAQs’s Smash circle has basically degenerated into a sort of 4chan-lite except with usernames in terms of aggressiveness and general nonsense. Aside from that there is only ResetEra and SmashBoards in terms of traditional Smash speculation left. For the former, the site is notorious for how authoritarian it is and how just overbearing and petty the mod team there is.

For SmashBoards though, the decline has been a result of a few different factors. One is that traffic has generally flowed out of dedicated forums onto the “mega cities”. Another is that different aspects to the fanbase now have there needs met elsewhere. For example, SmashBoards used to have lots of active discussion for each of the characters on a particular title’s roster, now these subforums are basically ghost towns. Competitive discussion in general used to be extremely active on the site, now it is simply relegated to a single thread.

Most of SmashBoards activity these days actually pertaining to Smash (or at least during the past two years) has only been the DLC/newcomer discussion thread and the old Geno thread (which was extremely active due to devious reasons). Other character support threads remained slow even for third party characters were deemed likely at particular points during the DLC epoch.

Another reason is due to the aggressiveness and meanness of some of the most prominent users on this site. More deflating for those have complained about this to me is that nothing has been done about this and is usually dismissed as being “oh that is just how XXXXX is.” This sort of “cool kids can say and do whatever they want” mentality chased away many people. The demoralization that many feel when their opinion was mocked by by a "clique" or "cool kids" was a sizeable factor for why many gradually left this site. Regardless of their level of prominence, users should not be allowed to be nasty and condescending towards others and their opinions.

In general, this is a problem seen on many smaller sized forums, not just SmashBoards, where there is an “in-group” and everyone else, which is part of the reason why many have retreated to Discord servers and or go into the “mega cities”.

In general, I hate to say this but I think much of internet discourse has been homogenized in a bad way. The megacities have become horrific echo chambers where people aggressively compete for the best way to accrue the most praise possible (this is especially evident on Reddit). On both Twitter and Reddit (and anonymous spaces like 4chan), there is horrific dehumanization of individuals whom do not share the same views as the rest of the “crowd”. Heterodox thinking is increasingly shunned and marginalized on most of the megacities.

In general, almost every space on the internet is incredibly toxic in one way or another. Many people who are in their 30’s now could have been natural leaders and been shepherds in online circles towards the younger cohorts and making positive environments. Instead, I have mostly been seeing stunted people in most entertainment fanbases regardless of their age or time spent in these spaces. ResetEra has most of its user base over 30, yet are notorious for being one of the most backbiting, authoritarian, close-minded spaces for game discussion on the internet.

I have no idea what went wrong and why things have just deteriorated as opposed to getting better. My thinking was that people would mature as they got older and just guide the younger cohorts. Instead many of the older cohorts got nastier, while the younger ones got largely absorbed into the maelstroms that are the megacities.

Also, another thing I am critical of is the “like” system. I am not sure anyone else has noticed, but I have never “liked” a post on SmashBoards. I always thought it encouraged group think, cliques, and in general was a lazy way to show that you enjoyed a person’s content. It does take work to write out that you had a positive opinion on someone’s written work, but at the same time it is far personal as your words are those made by your own intellect and personality. With a “like” it simply one among many. One person’s own individual voice means far more than many likes in my opinion.

Some General Advice to Speculators And Character Support Fanbases Going Forward

I would also like to bestow a few words of advice to those who continue speculating and doing character support for Smash in the years ahead. There have been quite a few disturbing trends I have seen exasperate over the past decade in relation to speculation and character support, namely massive group think, an incredible thirst for leaks no matter how dubious, support for a particular character becoming one’s own primary personal identity and social circle, and believing a “leak” simply because it has their character of choice as part of it.

One of the biggest pratfalls for many character fanbases is the tendency to believe a “leak” if their character of choice is a part of it. As we getting further and further into the future, very believable fake leaks will be more and more common.

A notorious example of this was the “Grinch leak” where a banner was made of a whole bunch of characters that were both highly desired by the Smash fanbase as well as seen as likely in general. To many people, it seemed very likely to be “real” due to the quality of it and amount of effort necessary to fake it.

There have also been instances where people have had credible information in the past but later started making up fake information in order to increase support of their character of choice (a particular example of this was with loz getting multiple details over Ultimate’s unveil correct, but then making up a bunch of fake information in order for Skull Kid to have a massive increase in support).

Overall, a very important piece of advice for any character fanbase going forward is to naturally be very skeptical of any “leaks”, especially if they happen to mention their character of choice as being a part of the roster. I have seen fake “leaks” increasingly become more and more elaborate, and I expect that trend to continue for the next Smash title.

Please be extremely skeptical and do not give any of your mental or emotional energy towards trying to validate these “leaks”.

I must also stress to avoid falling into manias. Character support is not a replacement for a social circle. I would also advise that your own personal history with a character (especially playing some sort of title heavily featuring them) is vastly preferable over you getting excited over a character because others are or because they seem “likely”. Beware the bandwagons.

Please overall, try to find your own individual voices, and do not be afraid to speak out even if it is an opinion that runs contrary to what everyone else is saying.

What Is Truly Important

I have been a part of the online Smash speculation and character support for over 20 years at this point. I am someone that has gone from day dreaming about Smash when characters like Bowser, Wario, Diddy Kong, and Ganondorf were not yet a part of the roster, to a point where now almost half of the newcomers for the latest Smash title are third-party characters.

I had many dreams and hopes dashed and realized over the course of these past 20 years. The realization of Ridley as a fighter for the roster alone took nearly 20 years to happen. It was amazing to have seen not just Roy return, but every single veteran in the history to the franchise as well. Ultimate in general seemed to have realized nearly all of my hopes and dreams for Smash as a series, even some minor ones.

With all of this being said though, I want to say that in the end, getting your favorite character as part of Smash’s roster, even a character you might spending over a decade hoping for, is not as lasting an elation as you might believe it to be.

I can definitely say it is still surreal to be controlling Ridley in Ultimate, and I am still very grateful that he somehow miraculously made the roster. However, over the course of these 20 years, the things that truly mattered to me where something even more pertinent to me going forward.

It is about the friends I have made during my time being involved in speculation and character support. Some of these individuals, I am hoping to have lifelong friendships with in particular. Meeting these people were truly some of the most fulfilling aspects of speculation, and eclipse even the satisfaction of my longest running Smash dreams becoming a reality.

I feel that building these friendships and meeting these people were the true “victory” of my time with Smash speculation and character support. There are also quite a few people that I met that I value as acquaintances and enjoy sharing my thoughts and ideas with. I am really hoping I can continue communication with these individuals even though I plan to no longer be involved in character support and roster speculation going forward.

It was truly a blessing to meet these people. I just want to say that is not the number of friends you might have, but rather the quality. Gaining good friends is very rare in today’s world, and I think I was very fortunate to have made the connections I did.

Conclusion

Ultimate was such a legendary title. It gave me so many of the long running dreams I had hoped for in regards to Smash but thought to be very unlikely or virtually impossible. While there are still a few things that I would like to see in Smash Bros. that did not happen with Ultimate, the game in general granted most of what I had wanted to see.

Ridley was a legendary addition to me, as was bringing back every single veteran in the history of the Super Smash Bros. franchise. Many other additions meant a lot to me as well such as most stages being brought back, Castlevania getting extensive representation, and Banjo-Kazooie happening. Through the Assist Trophies, Mii costumes, and spirits it seems almost every sort of Nintendo character and many third-party franchises in general got some sort of recognition or consolation prize.

In general, Ultimate was a landmark title for myself. It is one of the very few games I can recall from at least from the past ten years that actually lived up to and exceeded my expectations. Ultimate was the Smash title I had always been dreaming about that miraculously became a reality.

I still want to make contributions relating to Smash, but not necessarily the future of Smash if that makes sense. I have a desire to talk about the past and share just what I love about particular content that exists in Ultimate and from prior installments in general. I am not sure how much of an interest there is in this though. Even if I decide to follow through on doing it, it will likely take years before the first content I make for it is finished.

The other important thing I am hoping for is for people to contribute their own personal stories about a particular character on Ultimate’s roster that has a personal meaning to them. It could even be a personal story about a stage, Mii costume, Assist Trophy, or music track that has some sort of significant meaning to you as an individual. I really want to highlight these stories, as I feel in the future, that if there are significant cuts going from Ultimate to the next Smash title, that the conventional belief will be that all of the cuts were “merited” and that they did not much meaning to be a part of Ultimate’s roster in the first place. I doubt I will be able to make much of a dent in this kind of thinking, but I hope to give a platform to those who have something personal to share on some aspect of Ultimate.

I have been an extensive writer for Smash speculation for nearly 15 years now. I am not sure how influential my works pertaining to Smash roster speculation and character support have been during that time, but I hope that I was a good influence overall to these communities. Thank you to all that read my works all throughout the years, or those that only started reading them within the past few years, or even those that just started reading now.

As Sakurai said earlier this year, “Everything must come to an end at some point.” Ultimate was a very special title to me personally. It was the title I dreamed about but never thought it could ever happen. It gave me 95% of the things I wanted to see for Smash in general. In comparison to previous Smash titles that concluded, I feel extremely satisfied and content.

I would have liked to have seen Dixie Kong as part of Ultimate’s legendary roster, and the roster does not quite feel “complete” for me without her being a part of it, but I think for my OWN (as in me in particular) personal desires, Ultimate is as good as it is going to get. I could easily see the next title jettisoning many of the veterans and stages I am particularly attached to. However, I am still extremely happy with how Ultimate turned out, and it fulfilled so many seemingly “impossible” dreams I had.

However, above else, I met so many wonderful people over the course of this 20 year journey. My best friends I have now I met as a result of my time doing speculation and character support. That was the greatest blessing of all for this journey and easily eclipsed even Ultimate’s really special realization.

Thank you to all who actually read this essay in its entirety. If you want to inquire about Everyone’s Stories or have some sort of personal comment you wish to share in regards to any part of this essay, please feel free to send me a private message. I look forward to hearing just what stories are out there.

Thank you very much. I am looking forward to one day working on this next endeavor, and although it will probably take me years before I finally get content out relating to it, I am excited to work on something that talks about what we love about something that already exists in Smash not what we hope about one day ends up being included in it.

Ultimate was a legendary title in many ways, and I want to celebrate this title in the years to come even though successive Smash titles will probably eclipse Ultimate in ways outside of roster and stage count. However, it will not just be me talking about what was so special about Ultimate’s content. It will be all of you. I want to hear your voices and give a platform to them. Even if only a handful of you are interested in it, I would still like to pursue it.

This now ends my “farewell” essay to Smash roster speculation and character support. I wish you all the best. Thank you and farewell. This was both ultimate and special.

As I said, I implore anyone that reads this to share their thoughts via a personal message. I am curious to hear what you think. I apologize for the length. Thank you very much for your time and patience. I am blessed to have met the people here that I have. You have helped me grow in many ways, and I am grateful for what I have learned and experienced during my 20 years as a participant in Smash speculation. I hope those who continue on will similarly be blessed with friendship and personal growth, and that your personal Smash desires (or at least some of them) are fulfilled in the future.

Thank you for the shoutout Chrono. I'm been glad to have become your friend throughout this cycle. I've always looked up to the "old guard" on this site like you,

Opossum ,

Swamp Sensei , etc. since I was here for Smash 4 Speculation, so for you to consider my writings meaningful and worth sharing is incredibly validating.

My initial Sora essay is already up, though I already have some ideas for edits and additions (for example, I forgot to mention that my morning alarm and ringtone are also based around Kingdom Hearts). I was definitely on a time crunch when writing, so with more time I think it can be a lot better.

As for Joker, I'll probably write about him at a later time. Maybe I'll write about both Joker and Sora together, since those were my only two wanted characters this speculation cycle. To begin and end Smash DLC with my two most wanted characters is a surreal experience, and one that I certainly have a lot of thoughts about. However, I'll save those for another day.

For now, I'll just say thank you again, and here's to (hopefully) more long-form speculation going forward!

osby · Oct 20, 2021

Ultimate is the first Smash game that I participated in its speculation from start to finish and the reason I joined Smashboards in the first place so even if it wasn't such an phenomenal game, I think this game period will always be special for me. Even though it has its lows, I'll miss predicting characters as it made them even more exciting when they were finally revealed. I never really predicted any character (unless you count me rooting for Byleth and Steve) but it was still an experience to be a part of the ride.

I'll stay on this site, though. I met a lot of cool people in here when being overly passionate about a funny fighting game and I hope we meet again on next Smash game's speculating thread.

It's been a pleasure.

Ramen Tengoku · Oct 20, 2021

Sweet, sappy, time?

Man, it's been a ride, hasn't it? Really happy to have endured it with y'all. Really made the wait much easy and made some great friends along the way.

And of course, we got an amazing game out of it, currently my favorite game of all time in fact. Crazy to think about the lineup this game got. Every single addition from prior installments, some of the highest requested characters ever, the character from the game that inspired Smash, the star of the single best selling game period, and a character owned by stinkin' Disney. I swear, Ultimate's newcomer lineup feels like a fever dream.

Thank you all for this 3 year long experience here. Thank you frequenters, thank you guests and lurkers, and thank you the rest of SB staff. It's been an honor. Hope to see y'all again for Smash 6.

Anywho, I do intend to stick around here. You can find me in the Social Thread as per usual, and I'll probably frequent the "New Smash" thread as well. Really hope the lot of y'all will stick around too. It won't be the same without y'all.

Professor Pumpkaboo · Oct 20, 2021

DaybreakHorizon said:
View attachment 335041

Hell yeah brother

Then there is me in the corner who let the haters get to me and made me doubt a character I wanted will get in only for me to win in the end

Michael the Spikester · Oct 20, 2021

Colololin said:
Just to clarify, is there anything about Steve having been planned for the first pass? Sakurai said during the Smash 4 days that the process of creating a character can take 1 year so in theory Byleth started development after the game came out meaning it is very possible Steve was planned for the first pass but withheld because of Vergeben's leaks.

I also read something about him and Hero being planned or at least considered for Base game. Sephiroth too.

Colololin · Oct 20, 2021

Wunderwaft said:
The only thing we officially know about Steve is that he took around five years of discussion, we don't know if he was actually planned for FP1 as well. I think he probably was one of the few characters that were planned to be sold after FP1 before an entire FP2 was greenlit.

This is what makes me think it. Steve leaked a lot, LOT earlier than stuff that was even included in the base game. The problem with Minecraft is leakers were toing and froing as to whether Steve was playable or it was just smaller stuff like Miis/spirits.

N3ON · Oct 20, 2021

So, Sora was basically a Sonic situation, except instead of not being able to do DLC and thus delaying the game, they could just... add one more fighter to the post-launch plans.

Worth noting though is that without Sora, it doesn't mean the rest of the FP2 order would be the same. Though ending on Kazuya would be sufficiently... whelming to make sense.

Theguy123 · Oct 20, 2021

With sora now being officially announced as quite difficult to get, I wonder how the list ranks in terms of most difficult to get to least difficult to get. Based on what we know I’d probably rank it as

Steve
Sora
Banjo
Sethiroth
Hero
Joker
Terry
kazuya
Byleth
Pyra and mythra
min min

Momotsuki · Oct 20, 2021

Colololin said:
Just to clarify, is there anything about Steve having been planned for the first pass? Sakurai said during the Smash 4 days that the process of creating a character can take 1 year so in theory Byleth started development after the game came out meaning it is very possible Steve was planned for the first pass but withheld because of Vergeben's leaks.

If Steve was held back (there's no evidence of this beyond vague mentions of years-long negotiations, but it's certainly possible) it was because he was hell to develop. Veggie boy wasn't out here influencing decisions like that. No leaker was.

Jocario Zero · Oct 20, 2021

The end of an era, huh?

I will miss these discussions about possible future characters (and the millionth discussion about Fire Emblem).

Momotsuki · Oct 20, 2021

End of an era? Nah, it just means we modders oughta pick up the slack. :187:

Phoenix Douchebag · Oct 20, 2021

ChronoBound said:
This is my first time ever posting in the second iteration of the Ultimate Newcomer/DLC discussion thread. I have basically been in the background for speculation in regards to Pass 2. Of my predictions, they were mostly wrong, with the only two possibilities I had ended up happening being Steve and Sora.

Regardless, I am here to say I have a very important message to which I want to share with this community. I have been a part of this site for over 15 years. I have seen many things unfold during that time. I want to say I think I am basically done with speculation and character support. Do not get me wrong, there are still some additions that I would like to see happen, but I would say Ultimate has very much satisfied me.

However, I still want to write about Smash and its content, just not about speculation. I prepared a sort of farewell essay that gives me thoughts about the conclusion to Ultimate and my hopes for the future. My hope is that despite the length, that many of you will read it in its entirety. I absolutely encourage anyone who reads it to please send their thoughts and ideas about what I wrote as a personal message to me. I really want to hear the many stories that Ultimate has behind it.

Without further ado, here is my "farewell" essay:

Introduction

Ultimate speculation has finally drawn to an end. This title in particular has been very poignant to me. It fulfilled many different things to which I thought unlikely to ever happen for a Smash title and also were personal dreams and hopes I had. The inclusion of Ridley (my single most wanted character for nearly 20 years) and bringing back the entire past roster were absolutely incredible to me personally, as were the inclusions of the Belmonts and Banjo & Kazooie. Heck, even non-roster inclusions such as most prior stages being brought back and Pico (my favorite F-Zero character) having a role beyond trophy/spirit, meant a lot to me.

In a recent column Sakurai made in Famitsu, he said, "Everything must come to an end at some point."( https://www.nintendolife.com/news/2...ai_says_he_likes_the_idea_of_early_retirement Sakurai ) used this column to announce that he would retire his Famitsu column that he had been writing since 2003. Ultimate will not be the end for Smash, but I think Sakurai will likely to take a break from the franchise for a few years, especially after having worked nonstop on Smash for nearly a decade (development on Smash 4 began in early 2012).

At this point much of my interest in Smash speculation and character support is gone. There are a multitude of reasons for this. One is that I have far less free time than I did during prior Smash speculation epochs. Another is that I am getting older and gradually losing interest in many gaming things in general. Another reason is that the general dynamics for speculation have changed with the in-depth dives only really only being appreciated if you are a known Youtube personality. Platforms like Reddit and Twitter seem counter-intuitive for speculation to me, and the old mainstays like GameFAQs and SmashBoards have bled much of their userbase.

Another important thing about my depreciated interest is that Ultimate has basically given me most of what I had been hoping for in regards to Smash. Ultimate implemented many things I had wanted to see, but had always thought of as being very unlikely to ever happen. I am someone that had been following Smash even before the first installment was internationally released, and I have been involved in online roster speculation for 20 years now. To me, Ultimate feels like a culmination or rather a personal conclusion.

In general Ultimate was basically a "too good to be true" title that somehow ended up being real. There are some things that I wish ended up happening with Ultimate, but the thing is that as far as a Smash title goes in terms of being in line with my own personal desires and tastes, this is the best it will get (assuming Ultimate is not ported and built upon). At some point the journey has to end for myself.

By comparison, there are many others that are still waiting for their most wanted characters to debut in Smash or for it to take a direction that they want the series to go down (such as a single player mode that is similar to Subspace Emissary or a high focus on competitive gameplay). For many others here, their dream Smash has yet to be realized and it is what will be driving them going forward aside from particular characters that they want to see make it onto the roster.

Ultimate is likely the pinnacle in terms of character and stage count, but there are other directions Smash can taken that can take that can make them stand as tall as Ultimate has. For myself, though, Ultimate is what I was hoping for.

There are still a few things left that I would like to see, most notably Dixie Kong being a part of the roster (it is still peculiar how we are at nearly 90 characters, yet she is not part of them), however, overall I would say 95% of my personal desires for Smash Bros. have now been fulfilled.

For myself, the overwhelming bulk of my involvement during this speculation period was during the base game period. I made over 500 posts in 2018 alone. By comparison, I only made around 110 posts in 2019, and only 30 in 2020. I would say for Pass 2 most of my interest in speculating had been very depreciated. I would also say none of the Pass 2 characters in general I was personally hyped for, although of all the DLC characters in general, the only one that I was personally glad to see was Banjo & Kazooie. That being said I am still very happy about the additions that were made with the base roster. I would have satisfied even if there had been no DLC at all for Ultimate.

Ultimate Ending Is A Massive Milestone

I am not sure how many of you are aware of this, but Ultimate concluding is not just the end of Ultimate but also the end of the long cycle that began all the way back when Smash 4 was first announced in June 2011. In general, it seems as though Sakurai seems to view Smash 4 and Ultimate as a single development cycle. Sakurai quite explicitly stated this in one of this columns, and it was alluded to again during the Kazuya presentation to which he showed a short clip of every newcomer in Smash 4 to Ultimate beginning with Villager.

The development between Smash 4 to Ultimate was continuous. The project plan for Ultimate was completed in December 2015, the same month to which Corrin and Bayonetta were unveiled. Sakurai said he began development for Smash 4 soon after Kid Icarus Uprising was finished (which was early 2012), so he has been working on Smash for nearly a decade now.

Making Ultimate was also a “last request” from Iwata to Sakurai (Source: https://www.nintendolife.com/news/2..._sakurai_and_he_doesnt_know_what_hell_do_next ) . Sakurai went over and beyond for Ultimate as a way to honor the deceased Iwata. I think without the particular gravity of Iwata passing soon after he made this request to Sakurai, it might have been possible Ultimate would not be as “ultimate” as it turned out to be.

Ultimate is also the culmination of what began starting with Smash 64 in 1999. It not only has the entire roster up until this current point, and almost all of the stages, but also almost the entire soundtrack for 64, Melee, Brawl, and Smash 4 as well.

Thoughts On Sora

I have barely played the Kingdom Hearts series, so I cannot say I have a personal affinity for the series and its main protagonist, Sora. With that being said, Sora was a fitting conclusion for Ultimate. The main motif of Ultimate going back to its formal unveil at E3 2018 was the “making the impossible possible”. Sora was a character long thought to be impossible due to the unique copyright situation for the character, and in particular being owned by Disney.

There was also the matter that a very important part of Kingdom Hearts is the crossover with Disney’s traditional animation properties. With Sakurai still being very hesitant to add non-game characters to Smash, many believed that adding Kingdom Hearts to Smash Bros. was very unfeasible, and if it was, that it would open the floodgates for non-gaming characters to be added to the roster for future Smash titles.

The revelation that Sora was the true winner to the Smash Ballot makes him the most fitting end to Ultimate in general with the consideration that the Smash Ballot was the basis to which Ultimate’s foundation was derived. Everyone Is Here, Ridley, King K. Rool, the Belmonts, Chrom, Dark Samus, and Banjo & Kazooie all could probably owe their inclusion in Ultimate due to their ballot performance.

There was something very poignant about Sakurai saying that he talked about the results to Iwata (which was probably only months or weeks before he died). Ultimate in general was made as a sort of last request from Iwata to Sakurai. I think with the addition of Sora to Ultimate in a way made Iwata’s last request finally fulfilled. Ultimate is a legendary title that is truly worthy of its moniker.

It is difficult to think of a character that could have beat out Sora in terms of being a bigger finish than he was. Master Chief might have been able to rival him in the West, but he is a pretty niche character outside of Western game markets. I think Sora is the one character that ties best with Ultimate’s unveil motif of making the impossible possible.

A Shout Out To The Dixie Kong Support Thread

I said this to the Dixie Kong support thread in the past, but I was amazed how a cozy and supportive online community that is actually on topic about it (or relatively on topic since it often talked about the DK franchise in general) could exist on today’s internet. You had artists, all sorts of different and unique takes on how Dixie Kong could be approached as a fighter, and many just bringing up their own personal stories about how or why they were fans of the character. It was not a replacement for a social circle like many other online spaces either, most people usually posted when they actually had something to contribute.

Also, there was a tolerance for differing viewpoints and ideas. The most contentious of these for the Dixie Kong thread was whether she should or could work as an echo fighter. Even then, users generally had respect for one another even if they were in different camps in regards to this. The proprietor to the Dixie Kong thread, @BirthNote, would also constantly highlight the contributions that various Dixie Kong supporters put out by changing the topic title. This actually helped foster a sense of community without it being a “social club”. It made everyone feel like their contributions were meaningful and that they put forth something worthwhile.

This sort of environment proved to me that a non-toxic environment in relation to Smash or Nintendo is still possible on today’s internet. This was how an internet community should be. People with unique talents and perspectives coming together and sharing their passion together, and still having a respect for one another even if they have a different opinion on an aspect to that shared interest. Even though Dixie Kong was ultimately never added to Ultimate’s roster I am still thankful for the positive experience I had within that thread during my last few years with the Smash community.

A Brief Background for Who I Am

There are likely many of you that are reading this piece that have little idea as to who I am. In particular, I stopped being very active in speculation after 2018, and I made hardly any posts from the second half of 2015 to June 2018.

My history with Smash speculation and character support is a very long one, but I will only talk about the most important details.

I began my involvement with online Smash speculation and character support all the way back in 2001 a few months after the Melee unveil at E3 2001. I initially joined because I had a hope for Ridley making the roster for that title due to his appearance in the Melee unveil trailer. The basic foundation of what to expect with speculation, with fan expectations not being aligned with what ultimately ended up happening, manias pertaining to peculiar characters at certain points, and legit roster leaks being met with denial and vitriol. It was simply a preview of what was going to expand much more when Brawl was unveiled.

For the next epoch, Brawl speculation, I was at the forefront of speculation. It was in 2007 where I began regularly putting out long write ups in regards to speculation. I was even the first one to piece together the entirety of Brawl’s roster, as all of the legit leakers gave out an incomplete picture, and it was only through looking at how all the ones that were proven to be legit overlapped, that I was able to figure out Brawl’s 35 (or 39) character roster. I also was the first one to call the scrapped characters that still had folders within Brawl’s coding, “the Forbidden 7”.

I apologize if the previous paragraph came across as “boastful”, that was not my intention, but rather to provide context to my impact on the speculation community and just how far back this influence was. There are many who are now here that have little idea as to who I am, so I wanted to provide some anecdotes as to my work in the far past.

After Brawl’s release, I did five things: do extensive history lessons on the history of character support and speculation (I was one of the few speculators from the pre-Melee and first half of pre-Brawl that was still around), provide extensive analyses, do extensive character support for Ridley, extensive character support for Roy’s return, and do research into the desires of the Japanese side to the Smash fanbase.

With Sakurai seeming to give a definitive statement on Ridley as a playable fighter (it almost seemed like he would never become playable) in November 2014 and Roy confirmed to return for Smash 4 in June 2015, I basically left speculation in June 2015. I only made two posts after June 2015 and prior to April 2018.

I only returned in April 2018 a month after the Inkling teaser. I only made a few posts before the Ultimate unveil in June 2018. Ultimate’s unveil ended up fulfilling two of my dreams that I thought unlikely to ever happen, namely bringing back every single veteran and bringing in my single most wanted character for almost two decades, Ridley. At that point, I ended up back to being fully involved in Smash speculation and character support.

The August 2018 direct brought my hype to even further heights through the confirmation of the Belmonts (and the extensive Castlevania content in general), Dark Samus, and K. Rool being confirmed, as well as the confirmation nearly all of the prior stages to the series would be returning. It was shortly after this direct that I began to devote myself to doing character support for Dixie Kong. She was the one character I felt was most conspicuously absent from a roster as legendary as Ultimate’s, as well as the game character that meant a lot to me during my childhood that still was not on the roster (aside from Banjo & Kazooie, whom seemed impossible at the time).

When Ultimate released, I felt largely satisfied with the game and that it had fulfilled most of the desires that I had pertaining to Smash Bros. My activity during the DLC period was much less than it was during the second half of 2018. I was very happy to see Banjo & Kazooie happen. After 2019, I most relegated myself to making infrequent posts in the Dixie support thread as well as my own Pass 2 predictions topic (which ended up being mostly incorrect).

Overall, I am someone known for their very long legacy within the Smash Bros. speculation and character support community, and for making extensive essays on a myriad of different topics. The two primary characters I was known for supporting were Ridley and Roy. I also started extensively supporting Dixie Kong since 2018, although most of that was limited to her support thread.

At this point, I feel like I have lost most of my interest in doing character support and roster speculation. However, I still feel like I have ideas and essays to share with others….

Everyone Is Here: Everyone’s Stories

At the forefront of Roy support, I would constantly hear how Roy was a worthless addition for Smash Bros., and that they could not understand why anyone, much less an avid Fire Emblem fan, be a fan of him. Over the course of supporting Roy’s return for Smash, I also ended up becoming sympathetic to the supporters of other cut veterans, and hoped that somehow that they would get to enjoy their favorite Smash veteran returning one day as well.

There are many deep personal stories that people have in regards to the 89 playable characters on Ultimate’s legendary roster. I really want people to share their own personal stories and be able share just why any character on Ultimate’s roster, whether one of gaming’s biggest icons or ones that are largely forgotten are ones are dear to their heart.

There are many, many personal stories out there regarding each character on Ultimate’s legendary roster. One of my goals going forward is to find a personal story for every single character, from the likes of Link to the likes of Corrin. I would also like to extend this to people who were happy about a particular Mii costume, Assist Trophy appearance, and stage appearance or role. For myself for example, I was extremely pleasantly surprised about Pico’s World of Light role, and I would provide a personal story on why I like Pico so much, and why even though it was not a roster role, it still meant a lot to me.

Here are some of the people I already have in mind to explain their stories:

@Arcadenik: Duck Hunt
Opossum : Chrom
N3ON : Banjo & Kazooie
@BKupa666: King K. Rool
@Fuzzy Pickles!: Mega Man
@Diem: Dark Samus
@Diddy Kong: (What do you think)
DaybreakHorizon : Sora ; Joker
Phoenix Douchebag : Simon

These are just a few of people that come to mind in regards to a certain character inclusion meaning a lot to someone in particular, I apologize if there are others out there that are strongly associated with a character already on the roster and you are not part of this “example list”. As to the examples given on this list, I am not sure whether they would be interested in sharing their stories about these characters, but I hope they do. To anyone else out there that wants to write their own particular personal story pertaining to a particular character on Ultimate’s roster, you are more than welcome. Just send me a private message about the character that means something personally to you.

I would also like to write about the speculation history pertaining to each character on Ultimate’s roster as well, but I cannot make a certain promise I can do it. I will chime in on a particular character’s speculation and character support backstory if I feel I have anything worthwhile to add.

In regards to when the stories have to be written, the truth is that you have plenty of time to write out your stories. I want to turn this into a regular series of sorts, so it would take years to build up a sizable amount of content.

The other reason why you do not have to get your own stories ready immediately (you can write them gradually over the course of months) ties in with my future plans that I want to do after speculation and character support. Back in the summer of 2018, after the August 2018 Ultimate direct, I started thinking about all of the characters on Ultimate’s roster to which meant something me to personally. Initially thinking about it, it was 25 characters. However, over the course of three years, it expanded to 30 and then 40.

For all of these characters, they would each have a series of essays about them. The character in question would be the common “glue” between all of the essays.

Here is an example of what a series of essays would look like for a particular character as part of this project would look like, and how the character in question would serve as the “umbrella” to which all of the essays fall under.

Bowser Jr. will be a part of this 40 character series. Here are the series of essays that I would compose as part of the Bowser Jr. “set”:

A review and analysis of Bowser’s Fury (Bowser Jr. is the co-protagonist of this title)

A review and analysis Bowser Jr.’s Journey (Bowser Jr. is the main protagonist of this title)

History and analysis of Bowser Jr.

History and analysis of the Koopalings

A look at the history of the animosity between the fanbases of Bowser Jr. and the Koopalings and how it was eventually healed

An essay on multiple characters existing within the same slot as “palette swaps” (like it does for characters like Bowser Jr., Olimar, Hero, and Steve).

An analysis, history, and breakdown of the ESRB leak in regards to Smash 4 (Bowser Jr. was among the final characters leaked for Smash 4’s base roster)

A history of the very high competition that always existed between various fanbases for potential Mario newcomers going back to pre-Melee to the very present.

As can be seen, each character might very well have a novella about them.

As mentioned earlier, these are 40 characters on Ultimate’s legendary roster that have some sort of personal meaning to me. It will take a very, very long time for me to get through every single one of these characters, and it will likely take at least one decade.

All of the major roster leaks would be covered as part of this series, as well as many different parts of speculation history in general. This is a personal passion project of mine, and it will take a very, very long time to complete. I am uncertain even what sort of format these essays will take, or where I will even host them.

I know it is difficult for many to read a large piece, so I am contemplating perhaps the video format (it has been suggested by a few others as well to me). However, if it were to be a video format, it would take probably at least two years before my first videos would be published. In the case of a video format, I would also narrate the personal stories of others and try to something special for each of them (like put particular music tracks from that character’s title at particular points in the story as well as put up nice artwork of that particular character at various points in the video).

The Decline of The Smash Community

The other reason for “Everyone’s Stories” is to carve out a nice little niche for the Smash fanbase in general free from much of the toxicity that exists today for most online entertainment medium fanbases.

It is no secret that the old mainstays for roster speculation and character support like SmashBoards and GameFAQs have heavily declined in users and activity since the Smash 4 epoch. Much of the activity these days are now on “mega platforms” such as Reddit, Twitter, Discord, and Youtube. For most of these platforms, character support and speculation is mostly done through memes and ****posts. Your own voice and ideas are drowned out in the massive void.

The only one of these platforms where an individual can make a difference and have their own unique ideas and speculation heard is YouTube, but even there it only really matters if your own channel has a large following (at least 5,000 subscribers) and good luck getting to that number with today’s algorithms.

GameFAQs’s Smash circle has basically degenerated into a sort of 4chan-lite except with usernames in terms of aggressiveness and general nonsense. Aside from that there is only ResetEra and SmashBoards in terms of traditional Smash speculation left. For the former, the site is notorious for how authoritarian it is and how just overbearing and petty the mod team there is.

For SmashBoards though, the decline has been a result of a few different factors. One is that traffic has generally flowed out of dedicated forums onto the “mega cities”. Another is that different aspects to the fanbase now have there needs met elsewhere. For example, SmashBoards used to have lots of active discussion for each of the characters on a particular title’s roster, now these subforums are basically ghost towns. Competitive discussion in general used to be extremely active on the site, now it is simply relegated to a single thread.

Most of SmashBoards activity these days actually pertaining to Smash (or at least during the past two years) has only been the DLC/newcomer discussion thread and the old Geno thread (which was extremely active due to devious reasons). Other character support threads remained slow even for third party characters were deemed likely at particular points during the DLC epoch.

Another reason is due to the aggressiveness and meanness of some of the most prominent users on this site. More deflating for those have complained about this to me is that nothing has been done about this and is usually dismissed as being “oh that is just how XXXXX is.” This sort of “cool kids can say and do whatever they want” mentality chased away many people. The demoralization that many feel when their opinion was mocked by by a "clique" or "cool kids" was a sizeable factor for why many gradually left this site. Regardless of their level of prominence, users should not be allowed to be nasty and condescending towards others and their opinions.

In general, this is a problem seen on many smaller sized forums, not just SmashBoards, where there is an “in-group” and everyone else, which is part of the reason why many have retreated to Discord servers and or go into the “mega cities”.

In general, I hate to say this but I think much of internet discourse has been homogenized in a bad way. The megacities have become horrific echo chambers where people aggressively compete for the best way to accrue the most praise possible (this is especially evident on Reddit). On both Twitter and Reddit (and anonymous spaces like 4chan), there is horrific dehumanization of individuals whom do not share the same views as the rest of the “crowd”. Heterodox thinking is increasingly shunned and marginalized on most of the megacities.

In general, almost every space on the internet is incredibly toxic in one way or another. Many people who are in their 30’s now could have been natural leaders and been shepherds in online circles towards the younger cohorts and making positive environments. Instead, I have mostly been seeing stunted people in most entertainment fanbases regardless of their age or time spent in these spaces. ResetEra has most of its user base over 30, yet are notorious for being one of the most backbiting, authoritarian, close-minded spaces for game discussion on the internet.

I have no idea what went wrong and why things have just deteriorated as opposed to getting better. My thinking was that people would mature as they got older and just guide the younger cohorts. Instead many of the older cohorts got nastier, while the younger ones got largely absorbed into the maelstroms that are the megacities.

Also, another thing I am critical of is the “like” system. I am not sure anyone else has noticed, but I have never “liked” a post on SmashBoards. I always thought it encouraged group think, cliques, and in general was a lazy way to show that you enjoyed a person’s content. It does take work to write out that you had a positive opinion on someone’s written work, but at the same time it is far personal as your words are those made by your own intellect and personality. With a “like” it simply one among many. One person’s own individual voice means far more than many likes in my opinion.

Some General Advice to Speculators And Character Support Fanbases Going Forward

I would also like to bestow a few words of advice to those who continue speculating and doing character support for Smash in the years ahead. There have been quite a few disturbing trends I have seen exasperate over the past decade in relation to speculation and character support, namely massive group think, an incredible thirst for leaks no matter how dubious, support for a particular character becoming one’s own primary personal identity and social circle, and believing a “leak” simply because it has their character of choice as part of it.

One of the biggest pratfalls for many character fanbases is the tendency to believe a “leak” if their character of choice is a part of it. As we getting further and further into the future, very believable fake leaks will be more and more common.

A notorious example of this was the “Grinch leak” where a banner was made of a whole bunch of characters that were both highly desired by the Smash fanbase as well as seen as likely in general. To many people, it seemed very likely to be “real” due to the quality of it and amount of effort necessary to fake it.

There have also been instances where people have had credible information in the past but later started making up fake information in order to increase support of their character of choice (a particular example of this was with loz getting multiple details over Ultimate’s unveil correct, but then making up a bunch of fake information in order for Skull Kid to have a massive increase in support).

Overall, a very important piece of advice for any character fanbase going forward is to naturally be very skeptical of any “leaks”, especially if they happen to mention their character of choice as being a part of the roster. I have seen fake “leaks” increasingly become more and more elaborate, and I expect that trend to continue for the next Smash title.

Please be extremely skeptical and do not give any of your mental or emotional energy towards trying to validate these “leaks”.

I must also stress to avoid falling into manias. Character support is not a replacement for a social circle. I would also advise that your own personal history with a character (especially playing some sort of title heavily featuring them) is vastly preferable over you getting excited over a character because others are or because they seem “likely”. Beware the bandwagons.

Please overall, try to find your own individual voices, and do not be afraid to speak out even if it is an opinion that runs contrary to what everyone else is saying.

What Is Truly Important

I have been a part of the online Smash speculation and character support for over 20 years at this point. I am someone that has gone from day dreaming about Smash when characters like Bowser, Wario, Diddy Kong, and Ganondorf were not yet a part of the roster, to a point where now almost half of the newcomers for the latest Smash title are third-party characters.

I had many dreams and hopes dashed and realized over the course of these past 20 years. The realization of Ridley as a fighter for the roster alone took nearly 20 years to happen. It was amazing to have seen not just Roy return, but every single veteran in the history to the franchise as well. Ultimate in general seemed to have realized nearly all of my hopes and dreams for Smash as a series, even some minor ones.

With all of this being said though, I want to say that in the end, getting your favorite character as part of Smash’s roster, even a character you might spending over a decade hoping for, is not as lasting an elation as you might believe it to be.

I can definitely say it is still surreal to be controlling Ridley in Ultimate, and I am still very grateful that he somehow miraculously made the roster. However, over the course of these 20 years, the things that truly mattered to me where something even more pertinent to me going forward.

It is about the friends I have made during my time being involved in speculation and character support. Some of these individuals, I am hoping to have lifelong friendships with in particular. Meeting these people were truly some of the most fulfilling aspects of speculation, and eclipse even the satisfaction of my longest running Smash dreams becoming a reality.

I feel that building these friendships and meeting these people were the true “victory” of my time with Smash speculation and character support. There are also quite a few people that I met that I value as acquaintances and enjoy sharing my thoughts and ideas with. I am really hoping I can continue communication with these individuals even though I plan to no longer be involved in character support and roster speculation going forward.

It was truly a blessing to meet these people. I just want to say that is not the number of friends you might have, but rather the quality. Gaining good friends is very rare in today’s world, and I think I was very fortunate to have made the connections I did.

Conclusion

Ultimate was such a legendary title. It gave me so many of the long running dreams I had hoped for in regards to Smash but thought to be very unlikely or virtually impossible. While there are still a few things that I would like to see in Smash Bros. that did not happen with Ultimate, the game in general granted most of what I had wanted to see.

Ridley was a legendary addition to me, as was bringing back every single veteran in the history of the Super Smash Bros. franchise. Many other additions meant a lot to me as well such as most stages being brought back, Castlevania getting extensive representation, and Banjo-Kazooie happening. Through the Assist Trophies, Mii costumes, and spirits it seems almost every sort of Nintendo character and many third-party franchises in general got some sort of recognition or consolation prize.

In general, Ultimate was a landmark title for myself. It is one of the very few games I can recall from at least from the past ten years that actually lived up to and exceeded my expectations. Ultimate was the Smash title I had always been dreaming about that miraculously became a reality.

I still want to make contributions relating to Smash, but not necessarily the future of Smash if that makes sense. I have a desire to talk about the past and share just what I love about particular content that exists in Ultimate and from prior installments in general. I am not sure how much of an interest there is in this though. Even if I decide to follow through on doing it, it will likely take years before the first content I make for it is finished.

The other important thing I am hoping for is for people to contribute their own personal stories about a particular character on Ultimate’s roster that has a personal meaning to them. It could even be a personal story about a stage, Mii costume, Assist Trophy, or music track that has some sort of significant meaning to you as an individual. I really want to highlight these stories, as I feel in the future, that if there are significant cuts going from Ultimate to the next Smash title, that the conventional belief will be that all of the cuts were “merited” and that they did not much meaning to be a part of Ultimate’s roster in the first place. I doubt I will be able to make much of a dent in this kind of thinking, but I hope to give a platform to those who have something personal to share on some aspect of Ultimate.

I have been an extensive writer for Smash speculation for nearly 15 years now. I am not sure how influential my works pertaining to Smash roster speculation and character support have been during that time, but I hope that I was a good influence overall to these communities. Thank you to all that read my works all throughout the years, or those that only started reading them within the past few years, or even those that just started reading now.

As Sakurai said earlier this year, “Everything must come to an end at some point.” Ultimate was a very special title to me personally. It was the title I dreamed about but never thought it could ever happen. It gave me 95% of the things I wanted to see for Smash in general. In comparison to previous Smash titles that concluded, I feel extremely satisfied and content.

I would have liked to have seen Dixie Kong as part of Ultimate’s legendary roster, and the roster does not quite feel “complete” for me without her being a part of it, but I think for my OWN (as in me in particular) personal desires, Ultimate is as good as it is going to get. I could easily see the next title jettisoning many of the veterans and stages I am particularly attached to. However, I am still extremely happy with how Ultimate turned out, and it fulfilled so many seemingly “impossible” dreams I had.

However, above else, I met so many wonderful people over the course of this 20 year journey. My best friends I have now I met as a result of my time doing speculation and character support. That was the greatest blessing of all for this journey and easily eclipsed even Ultimate’s really special realization.

Thank you to all who actually read this essay in its entirety. If you want to inquire about Everyone’s Stories or have some sort of personal comment you wish to share in regards to any part of this essay, please feel free to send me a private message. I look forward to hearing just what stories are out there.

Thank you very much. I am looking forward to one day working on this next endeavor, and although it will probably take me years before I finally get content out relating to it, I am excited to work on something that talks about what we love about something that already exists in Smash not what we hope about one day ends up being included in it.

Ultimate was a legendary title in many ways, and I want to celebrate this title in the years to come even though successive Smash titles will probably eclipse Ultimate in ways outside of roster and stage count. However, it will not just be me talking about what was so special about Ultimate’s content. It will be all of you. I want to hear your voices and give a platform to them. Even if only a handful of you are interested in it, I would still like to pursue it.

This now ends my “farewell” essay to Smash roster speculation and character support. I wish you all the best. Thank you and farewell. This was both ultimate and special.

As I said, I implore anyone that reads this to share their thoughts via a personal message. I am curious to hear what you think. I apologize for the length. Thank you very much for your time and patience. I am blessed to have met the people here that I have. You have helped me grow in many ways, and I am grateful for what I have learned and experienced during my 20 years as a participant in Smash speculation. I hope those who continue on will similarly be blessed with friendship and personal growth, and that your personal Smash desires (or at least some of them) are fulfilled in the future.

As always, another essay by Chrono, and you never disappoint me.

Personally, i have my own stories to tell:

Personal stories, of course since you tagged me, i have to gush about Simon again. Since no one else in this website does, i am and will be the biggest Simon stan on this website.

For the record i am just gonna copy and paste what i said on the RTC rerates day.

Simon Belmont: The Face and the greatest hero of Castlevania.

Click to expand...

Let me tell you a story. When i was a kid, i watched the AVGN a lot, it was one of my favorite things to see on the Web, and one day he reviewed the Castlevania series, among them he praised a little SNES game called Super Castlevania 4. I remember playing it before and while i liked it, i was a kid with the attention span of a goldfish, so that memory was erased. I decided to replay it after James's video on the game, and..................i fell in love.

Sometimes people talk about why i chose Simon, and why he is my favorite CV character when there are others like Alucard. Super Castlevania 4 is why, he is the hero of that game, that game is my favorite Castlevania game, my favorite SNES game and one of my favorite games of all time.

I see Simon Belmont as this epic hero who takes a no-nonsense approach, no witty one-liners, no getting beat up by random pedestrians on a Pub (AHEM NETFLIXVANIA SUCKS ASS AHEM) with a barbarian old-school asethetic, instead of the weird designs he would get later. I find his story ironic yet epic at the same time, as he basically didn't knew how he would compare to his ancestors, yet nowadays he is seen as the face of the Belmont family. Also i do have to mention that while SCIV is the reason i am so fond of Simon, Sharp X68000 is best Simon, no ifs and buts.

Anyway, as you can tell, i was already big into Castlevania by that time. Games that i played include CV1, CV3 (2 i would play much later, you can thank its reception for that) SCIV, Rondo of Blood, it's inferior SNES port, Circle of the Moon, Harmony of Dissonance, Aria of Sorrow, The Gameboy Games (the 1st one sucked so much i couldn't even bother finishing it, but the sequel was actually pretty good) and of course the overexposed SotN, which despite not me considering it the pinnacle of CV, it does live up to the hype.

As you can see, i consider myself a CV fan. I loved the music, i loved learning about the lore, i played basically every major 2D release (the only ones i unfortunately could not pick up are the DS games, a shame since i would love to play Dawn of Sorrow seeing how much i loved its predecessor) and even played some fangames. That "Castlevania Fighter" was far better than Judgement ever could be, it even included Castlevania 4 Simon with all his powers! too bad it got discontinued.

To put into perspective how much i loved Super Castlevania 4, i own 3 copies of this game. I have never even bothered to buy the Switch Ports of MK8, Tropical Freeze and Pikmin 3 despite me loving these games, yet i had no issue getting this game again TWICE. Then again, SCIV came bundled with the SNES Classic and CV Collection, so that's why i own 3 copies.

So you can guess that by 2013, after Mega Man was revealed (probably my favorite Gaming Character, period) i was in the Simon Train without stopping. Not only was Simon my favorite CV character, but i fully believed he was the only choice for Castlevania, he appeared in more CV games than any other, he was chosen in to be CV's ambassador in mutliple Konami Crossovers (it wasn't Alucard who went toe to toe with Optimus Prime, let me tell ya) and he was even technically relevant due to his appearance in Lords of Shadow: Mirror of Fate, so he checked all boxes.

However he had an uphill battle for him. Back in 2013/14 Smash was a veeery different envioroment compared to today. First Parties were the true stars, and guest characters were rare, and outside of Pac-Man, most of them were seen as unlikely or even impossible. Characters like Sora, Cloud, Kazuya, Steve were not even a blip on the radar, guests could only be in if they were very close to Nintendo or prominent on Nintendo consoles. Nowadays im actually starting to miss this era as i am not a fan of the "Smash is about gaming history" phase, but as someone who wanted Simon this definitely made it harder for him. Probably the biggest blow to him was Snake, as back then the 1 character per company fan-rule was seen as gospel. If you thought that people would consider Sephiroth, think again.

While Simon was not even talked about back in the day, i was a huge Simon Belmont supporter. I made multiple drawings on my textbooks sketching up Simon and how he would look like in Smash. His moves, his profile in the character page, his trophy (R.I.P Trophies) and so on. I even sketched up a Trailer for him that him saving Luigi. The fact that no one cared about him outside of [IMG alt="Arcadenik"]https://smashboards.com/data/avatars/s/152/152216.jpg?1530214273[/IMG] Arcadenik and a few others, made me only MORE passionate, my Asperger fascination kicked in. I knew Simon wasn't gonna make it into Smash 4, so when stuff like ESRB happened, i wasn't crying for him (I was more worried for Mewtwo)

But one gleam of light came into the darkness. As the LoS series came to a close and CV was seen as a dead franchise due to what happened with Konami after the Kojima incident, one hope came into the scene. In April 1st (yes really) Iwata revealed the Smash Ballot. Of course, i was gonna vote for Simon (and also other characters via other devices) and after Ryu's reveal, now the 1-rep per company was gone, and therefore Snake was no longer a threat. Simon may have not come to Smash 4 but i knew things could only get better for him.

After the disappointing Smash 4 finale and Bayo destroying the Competitive scene, Smash Ultimate was teased. I knew it was gonna be a new game (SUCK IT Portmongers) but i didn't knew who was gonna be in it outside of Inkling. During this time, Vergeben, the infamous SCVI (Soul Calibur 6, not Super Castlevania 6) leaker came into the scene and said Simon and Ridley were playable. You can guess that while i was a skeptic, i wanted it to be true, so much.

A few arguments, an E3 reveal for Ridley and an overrated cartoon later.

Simon was now a big deal. Back in 2017 and early 2018 Simon was barely noticed, but now he was the centerpiece. Smash Ultimate's development started in 2015, right after the Ballot ended and only a few years after Mirror of Fate, Simon's latest appearance. Snake came back so Konami was back on the table, Bomberman was confirmed as an AT and while that sucked it meant Simon had no competition from his own owner company, and Vergeben gained more credibility thanks to Ridley's reveal plus other stuff he leaked.

Some people may argue that leaks and rumors killed the Simon hype of being this super unexpected hype character, but i disagree. I loved Smash speculation. Yes it could get stupid, pretentious, weird, grasping at straws and desperate at times, making it feel like a war was happening, but it was fun. My fondest teenage memories came from the Pic of the Day from Smash 4, and as someone who is too shy to talk to real people most of the time, having a platform to discuss one of my favorite things in gaming was great. Now my most wanted dream character was seen as not only possible, but LIKELY, that had me giddy, and you can bet your high horse i was enjoying every single moment. I even became the owner of the Simon for Smash Ultimate thread, which you can see here. I was THAT passionate about Simon.

So, i think it's pretty likely you know what happened next, right before the August Direct came in, another leak happened................it was Bloody Tears (and Monster Dance)

This was it, Simon was coming in. I remember looking at the trailer that very same morning. I saw the rain, and i saw his boot, i recognized that Boot, of THAT design of Simon, this was it.

and then, it happened.

After 5 years of dreaming, the dream became a reality. and it was great. He was EXACTLY how i pictured him. His Cross as Side Special, his Holy Water as his Down Special, his Super Castlevania 4 Whip moves as his repertoire of Smashes and Aerials, Grand Cross as his final Smash, and most important of all, that old-school macho look. Bleach Blonde hair, brown and beige armor, square jaw, gruff voice and muscular look. Yeah he look like Conan, and i love it (even if i.............never had watched or read Conan in my life) and to this day i prefer it to the werid, akward and honestly off-looking Chronicles look. Ayami Kojima is a talented artist, her Alucard redesign is amazing, and i like her depictions of Trevor and Richter, but i never liked her take on Simon. The bishonen face, the weird leather clothing, and most of all the color usage of Red and Black (usually reserved for Anti-Heroes or villains or those with Darkness alignment, and since Simon was always this Holy Warrior Hero, the color scheme was always why i disliked Chronicles's new look for Simon, especially when the original version of Chronicles for the Sharp X68000 i mentioned earlier, was my ideal look for Simon)

Sometimes i feel the only reason people remember Chronicles is because of that weird redesign, because otherwise people always talk about SCIV and CV1/2 when it comes to Simon's tales, so for me the choice was clear, especially because after the mid-2000s, Konami once again was using the Barbarian Look for Simon after realizing the Kojima look wasn't as popular as expected (the earliest instance of this was with that NECA figurine). Thankfully, i predicted with Sakurai's fondness of CV1 and with Pac-Man's old look, Sakurai was gonna chose wisely, and i was right. The only thing that was off was Richter's moves, but then a again a Belmont echo never crossed my mind.

After so much speculating, discussion and fanboying, i was vindicated. Simon was in, and while everyone was hyped for K.Rool, Dark Samus, Chrom and Richter, Simon was finally a personal dream and story coming to a close.

Yeah, there were some problems, like Simon was reviled on launch due to his projectile game, which is no longer the case as it is understood Simon is a scrub-killer, even if being demonized for beign a Simon main (well, Richter main mostly) sucked, and the fact that his own theme song wasn't remixed (while Richter's was) also sucked, but Simon in Smash was a dream for me. I could play as much Simon as i wanted. and i will always be thankful for Sakurai and his Development team for that. To this day, Simon is the most played character in Smash that i have ever used, and no one comes close.

Thank You. If you wanna read more, you can read this, from my original (now deleted account) Tord the Red Leader.

So yeah.

SATISFACTION 100%

As you can see i have a lot of story with Simon. Super Castlevania 4 is my favorite CV game alongside Aria of Sorrow, and one of my favorite games in general, so much so i replay it every year. Simon truly is a personal wish. For as mixed opinions as i have of the DLC and many of my requests going under (Isaac, Bomberman, Waluigi) i think Ultimate's newcomers on Base game were truly Quality over Quantity ironically enough. Simon and K.Rool were my top 3 newcomers aside from Waluigi, so to get 2 out of 3 was great. It's great that Ultimate had so big highs, because their lows to me felt like really low lows. Even though Smash 4 only added 2 newcomers i really liked (at the time) none of the newcomers of that game outside of Bayo were off-putting to me, while in Smash Ultimate's DLC it felt as if someone who disliked my tastes went out of their way to add all characters i wasn't too keen on.

Regarding The Decline of the Smash Community:

I think this is part of a bigger issue than Smash, it's about the Internet as a whole. There's simply too many people on the internet nowadays. Back in the 2000's there was a lot of people, but you still had to basiaclly be a nerd to spent more than 2 hours on a webiste, the internet was habitated by niche people, they could be jerks and weird, but because there was less people, there was by proxy also less bad eggs. now, the internet is FILLED, it's as mainstream as it has ever been, and therefore if there were like 5 weirdos and scumbags on the internet, now there are 50, and that number will keep growing. I also think Smash going broader and growing larger is simply gonna make it more critized by default. When something is niche less people are inclined to hate it, no matter how specific that niche is. Compare it to mainstream stuff, and you can guarantee it gets more scorned by beign a bigger target. People are far more critical of MCU than say, Senran Kagura. Mainstream makes you a bigger target.

To quote Youtuber User EmpLemon:
"The More you grow, the harder it becomes for your audience to all be in the same page".

You might be able to please some people all the time, all people some times, but not both.

I also understand that probably im simply victim of a generational transition for Smash. When i was a Smash fan years ago, Nintendo characters were the norm, now i feel like im in the minority, this Simpsons video puts it eloquently:

It's funny that i feel this old even though im 22 (This is what happens when you don't attend college and go straight to get a job, your mental age just kinda skips an entire part)

I know i sound like an hypocrite, my most wanted character WAS a third party. Sometimes i feel guilty because i basically enabled the direction Smash is going (general gaming crossover instead of Nintendo-centric), kinda like how i feel i can't really complain about FE over saturation in Smash when i wanted Roy (in hindsight i think Roy should have waited for Ultimate, since he was a guarantee in that game) although i must admit i wasn't expecting to be this disappointed for DLC with their Third Parties. Like if you told me we were getting this many guest characters in 2015 i would have been excited (unless you told me WHO those characters were i guess). 15 year old and 22 year old me are basically different people.

(also im really happy Kazuya wasn't the final fighter, because i can't play Tekken for my life, Sora really was a damn miracle and probably the only FP2 char aside from the Aegis im gonna pick)

I must admit the internet in general has changed. Back in the 2000s it was more of a place for escapism, you only went there if you were a nerd or someone with weird preferences, nowadays the Internet is mainstream, the place everyone gathers around, including the SAME type of people i like to avoid in real life, and its horrifying to me that once a place where i went to escape is now filled with people i don't like. Im an introvert so i already prefer solitude, but now it is hard to enjoy myself (there's no more lonely feeling than being in a place filled with people that don't know you and don't care about you) on the web, every step it feels like you are walking on a minefield.

The only thing i can do nowadays, is simply do the opposite i did back when i was a kid. Leave the internet, which is harder and harder everyday. Going for a walk, go biking alone. Solitude clears my mind form everything you see on the internet nowadays, where Bullying and Harassment is nowadays the norm and witchhunts are becoming real once again, to the Duck vs Brandon, to Virus blah blah blah (im really happy i don't watch the news or TV). When the game sucks, the only winning strategy is not to play.

So honestly the internet becoming the way it is the reason im leaving Smashboards, it's not the website's fault alone, is just a much bigger issue.

One thing however that Smash Ultimate has done and im super grateful for, is make me reevaluate things. "Everyone is here" made me appreciate every veteran in Smash. The characters i play as are always on the chopping block, so to have Lucas and Wolf back, plus all the cut Melee 5 was a godsend. Mewtwo was still my second favorite reveal of Smash 4 and my 3rd favorite Smash reveal of all time, it's funny to think a character that was such a big deal in 4 is now just one of many, although Mewtwo is still my second most played Ultimate character.

There are also many veterans that i never appreciated that i now i play a lot more. I was never keen on Zelda, but her redesign based on A Link Between Worlds (my top 3 favorite Zelda) won me over, i just love cheerful cute blonde girls (I prefer perky and happy female characters, it's why love Dixie so much as she just radiates this positive feminine energy, although i must admit Zelda's new design has "Waifu" vibes,not that i am complaining) and she is now my most played female character in Smash. Diddy Kong was a character i always liked but almost never played, with Ultimate beign the game i play as him the most. Wario finally got his Shoulder Dash Back and while im still angry that WarioLand is laregely ignored in Smash im happy Wario's siganture move is back one again, and i always try to end a match with him KOing an opponent with Wario's Dash Attack. Also Ganondorf should have gotten some magic attacks but the Sword Smashes are greatly appreciated (even if they are recycled from Cloud and Ike)

As someone who loves playing as multiple characters, playing as Luigi, Zelda, Diddy Kong, King K.Rool, Alph, Meta Knight, Sonic, i really must pick back so many characters i played before.

I also realized that there are many things in life that i haven't appreciated. I only NOW recently beat Xenoblade Chronicles and now i like Shulk much, much more. Same for Rosalina with Mario Galaxy (that story book really touches your heart strings), and in general i realized how there are many things in life i never experienced, that i think that rather than argue with people about petty ****, im better off just enjoying this i liked while looking for new experiences. I just recently watched the Rocky films and those films are life changers, i recently watched the entire Superman TAS and Fleischer shorts and those were great, i just read Mirage's TMNT and i was so happy with how Volume 1 ended, im reading through the Diary of A Wimpy Kid and Dork Diaries and i enjoyed them (especially Dork Diaries, somehow i enjoyed reading through a book, back when i was a kid i only read books because Schools forced me to, now i do it willingly, which is never something i thought i would do in my life!)

What im saying is, its that its time for me to force myself to interact with communities that i don't particularily fit in and just enjoy my life as an individual.

Also massive respect for what you said about likes. I must admit, when i was a teenager (and still happens to me now) whenever i posted something in Smashboards and got a lot of likes, i had this feeling of dopamine in my body, obviously that has sort of diminished as my opinions are by nature very controversial (i watch the likes of Mr Enter, so i kinda stopped caring about popular opinion) but i must admit, the internet and collectivist cultures are both very, VERY dangerous when grouped together, so im happy you point this out. Im becoming more individualist in my way of thinking nowadays, and if nothing else its good to see you have strong principles by never giving anyone like for the reasons you gave, people like you are a rare breed. Still i must put likes to your post because i don't want to leave such a good essay on the dust. Consider this wall of text my appreciation for you.

And i must admit, for the turmoil, to the leaks, to the bandwagons, im still happy that i took part in this journey. I joined Smash Speculation not because i wanted to be right, i wanted to talk with people about stuff i liked, cared about, and i felt happy during those days. Nowadays Smash going in such different directions such as Competitive gameplay (which i don't care about) Single Player content (i play mostly Single Player games, but i feel doing that to Smash is like watching Yaoi for Straight relationships, it beats the point, and yes i mostly play Smash via battling CPUs thank you) or just character choices that i don't care for (which is made worse because a lot of my mains will be likely gone by next game) the only way i can see the next game can appeal to me, is if Smash goes back to being Nintendo Centric as hell, if almost all the veterans (Samus, DK, Ganon, Wario) are redesigned to play more faithful to their games of origins in terms of moveset, if all the weird moveset gimmicks are downplayed or removed, and if Sakurai is replaced with a brand new director. Not gonna happen (outside of the last one detail), so i know im in the minority

Honestly this reminds me of what happened to Paper Mario. I loved the style of the first 2 games, and never liked most things afterward. I realized that trying to force my opinion in what was clearly slowly becoming a minority (made worse by the fact that Origami King is now the best selling game in the series, meaning that more people than ever are exposed to this style of Paper Mario) meant to was only one thing left to do, leave. Enjoy what you liked from that franchise and works that meant to you, reject and ignore the future of the franchise, and instead look for greener pastures.

I did the same with Castlevania, i enjoy the games but HATE the Netflix show, to go as to why would only paint a big target on my back, so instead i just kept replaying the games that i loved and ignore what comes afterward. I hate to do the same with Smash, but its clear to me that the next game will not top Ultimate for me, and for me to consider the next game a worthy upgrade or replacement, it would have to do something that would be seen as EXTREMELY controversial in the eyes of the large majority that plays Smash nowadays.

Although at least unlike those 2 examples i mentioned, i leave Smash in good terms. I love Ultimate despite some of the choices the game made, and i will Still keep playing the game (i put over 800 hours into this game after all) It's just that my hype for future Smash games is now gone, and my interest for the franchise's next step ends here. But the memories will always be with me, and so will be the memories of all the people i met, including you Chrono. No one will ever top your posts and essays, and it's good to know i made some friends on this site, but all friendships must come to an end, some people wanna take different paths in life and simply can't keep contact as a result, im one of those people. Smashboards no longer intersts me anymore, but it was fun while it lasted.

Goodbye.

-Branko

N3ON · Oct 20, 2021

Theguy123 said:
With sora now being officially announced as quite difficult to get, I wonder how the list ranks in terms of most difficult to get to least difficult to get. Based on what we know I’d probably rank it as

Steve
Sora
Banjo
Sethiroth
Hero
Joker
Terry
kazuya
Byleth
Pyra and mythra
min min

Just because Steve took a while doesn't mean the hold-up was on MS/Mojang's end. We can already infer that Sakurai turned the character down at least once before being persuaded otherwise. Plus he noted how easy Banjo was to implement.

People read way too much into the five-year thing. Who's to say Nintendo didn't approach Disney prior to this fateful meeting about Sora in attempted collaboration, only to get turned down? There are claims that happened, and if it was around the ballot era that would put Sora at six years to Steve's five.

I also think you've got to put the SE characters above the MS ones, just due to how fastidious and stipulatory that company is, even when cooperative. And of course Sora is first.

Swamp Sensei · Oct 20, 2021

I don't have the time to write a large thank you post so I'll try to put all my emotions into a brief one.

Smash speculation, as bad as it could get, was always fun. And a large part of that was the community. I've met so many individuals that I respect and have made many close friendships. There are people who have gotten me through some super rough times and for that I am eternally grateful. For better or for worse you guys changed me. And for the most part, I think it's for the better.

My only real regret is that some of you won't be around anymore. Just let it be known that I appreciate every one of you for being here and for making this experience the joy it was.

Thank you everyone, for bringing me so much joy.

CosmicQuark · Oct 20, 2021

Theguy123 said:
With sora now being officially announced as quite difficult to get, I wonder how the list ranks in terms of most difficult to get to least difficult to get. Based on what we know I’d probably rank it as

Steve
Sora
Banjo
Sethiroth
Hero
Joker
Terry
kazuya
Byleth
Pyra and mythra
min min

I don't think Steve and Banjo & Kazooie would rank highly in terms of difficulty to acquire, since both Phil Spencer and Sakurai in his Famitsu column said Banjo & Kazooie in Smash was an easy deal to make (though, I still think Microsoft was asking for a lot given the music selection compared to other DLC characters). Unless you're talking about in terms of Smash history rather than Ultimate's development, or if you also include the difficulties to implement in the game (Steve required a lot of programming wizardry), in which case Kazuya would rank higher given Sakurai thought a long time in how to incorporate a Tekken character. Terry should have been the easiest of them all, coming from a smaller company and SNK simply saying "okay" to Sakurai's 50 songs. Even though Bandai Namco own Kazuya, they're still a big company and Tekken is a big IP, and while easier than other third parties, would still require a lot of beaurocracy.

I'd think it'd go Sora, Hero, Sephiroth, Joker, Banjo & Kazooie, Steve, Kazuya, Terry, and then the Nintendo characters in terms of difficult to acquire.

Momotsuki · Oct 20, 2021

Sora is the only character that we've been directly told was hard to negotiate for. Not that it took a while, which could be for any number of reasons, but that it was hard. I think it's very safe to say he was the hardest to get. Sure, we could infer it with Cloud, but it was only Sora that they were up-front about being a challenge.

Only Sakurai could have overcome lolDisney, haha.
I must admit that I was the fool; I really didn't think it could be done.

DaybreakHorizon · Oct 20, 2021

I guess I'll give one last, brief farewell to this thread before we wrap things up for real.

I'm not going to lie and say that Smash Speculation this cycle has been a perfect experience, because it really hasn't. It was riddled with drama, pettiness, and circular arguments galore. I found myself disillusioned multiple times throughout these past three years, which correspond with the multiple goodbyes I've made.

But just when I think I'm out, they pull me back in. I kept coming back for the community because I've made some real, genuine friends here. I've also grown and matured a lot throughout the years, and I owe that in part to my experiences in this community, as much as I've bemoaned it and made jokes at its expense. As a whole I’m thankful for my time here and the amazing community I’ve gotten to be a part of.

I'll still be around, if only to get use out of the free year of Smashboards Premium I got for being a GOD SPECULATOR WHO PREDICTED SORA LET'S GOOOOOOOOO, but I won't be around as much as I'll be focusing on other endeavors (grad school applications, school life, jobs and internships, streaming) and be more active on other platforms (like Discord and Twitter). Y'all are free to follow me on Twitter or reach out over Discord if you want to talk more often.

Here's one last song to play us out:

DanganZilla5 · Oct 20, 2021

If Kazuya was the last fighter I'd be fine with it, considering that some people did have that "Thank you Bandai Namco" theory which turned out to be technically true. But yeah Sora was a much better way of ending things off.

I don't have a long essay to end this thread off with, and I'll be around tonight (When exactly does this thread close?). But I'll say it has been a fun time. Through the excitement and the heachaches, I've gotten to know some of you and it's been a pleasure. Thank you all for the fun times.

As a reminder, I'll be in the social thread and occasionally in other parts of Smashboards. But as for how active I'll be, that I'm not sure about.

ahemtoday · Oct 20, 2021

Haven't been in here for a while. I guess we're closing out, huh? Makes sense.

I was really only ever in this Newcomer Speculation subforum, and only during Ultimate so this closure is gonna hit me more than most. I mean, maybe I'm overselling it. I can always just go to a place on here that's actually open.

Honestly, though, being in here was pretty cool. Even though I've stopped hanging out there, I helped found and run the Character Exploration Thread, and that really made me feel like I fit in here, which... is something that's become pretty valuable to me in recent times. Through this place, I found a community that I feel like an active part of instead of someone on the fringes who talks occasionally, and I really, really appreciate that.

Momotsuki · Oct 20, 2021

Guess I should actually give a "proper" goodbye before I dip from this thread. It's been, uh, pretty fun. I admittedly never speculated as much as I just talked to myself out loud, but I enjoyed doing that and maybe some of you enjoyed hearing me out. I'll check into the social thread now and again, still talk about Smash, and maybe talk about other things, too. Be seeing you!

Michael the Spikester · Oct 20, 2021

See y'all on the Social thread.

Firox · Oct 20, 2021

Momotsuki said:
Only Sakurai could have overcome lolDisney, haha.

It's official. If Lord Sakurai really wants a character in Smash, then they end up Smash. Resistance is futile.

ShotoStar · Oct 20, 2021

We're closing up? I was just checking in on here to see if it was closed yet so I guess I'll say my due. I was a newcomer during Ultimate speculation and I can't say I exactly used Smashboards much later on but I was around here during Pass 1 spec and without this place I wouldn't have found a community I could call my own, a place I can finally be myself around so I'm very thankful for it.

This speculation cycle hasn't been perfect there's been drama, petty drama, We've all had our upsides and downsides but I can't say I won't miss this because... I truly will. I doubt we'll ever get anything like Ultimate again, or at least for a very long time. I'm thankful for this cycle despite my downsides with it I've gained a community, I've grown into my own as a person with due help from this game and I have a lot of good memories from it. I'll always remember the Grinch Leak for example that was crazy, I'll always remember Cacomallow and joking about it with friends, The day Sephiroth got announced, so on and so forth. Good times, all good times.

I'll probably check in on Smashboards once in awhile I've been meaning to get back into it and even if I don't... I'll be around. At least for Smash 6 speculation, this may be the end of one of the best speculation cycles out there but it's not the end for Smash. Till then it's been real, Thanks for everything folks!

Until next time!

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