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Official DLC Speculation Discussion Volume II

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ARandomFruit

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Byleth would be an objectively better character if I had won the game of 5 against my friend for the Sothis color.
Sadly I didn't so now I only have the Edelgard color and a lower rating of Byleth...
 

Idon

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With Sora I think there might also be a subset of general SE fans that would prefer another character from that company (Crono, Neku, various FF protagonists, 2B, Denton, etc)
That really goes for every other company that has multiple popular characters with their own fanbases...
so every other company in general lol.
 

N3ON

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I don't have much new to say about Byleth. I think they should've added a different character from a different series since there are a lot of series with the merits, success and fanbase of FE with a fraction of the attention, but Nintendo wants that character in there, and so that's what we get.

And on a personal level I don't much care for the character. In-game they're pretty personality-challenged, by design, so a lot of the supporting cast is just much more interesting on any number of levels, and if we had to get a 3H character, it's a shame it wasn't one of them instead.

Gameplay-wise I find Byleth fine but unremarkable. I get the theme of the character and I appreciate Sakurai trying to diversify from a pure sword-based moveset. I just find the implementation... unmemorable? Of course that is subjective and I'm not going to cast judgments on opinions which differ.

The most positive thing I think I can say about Byleth is I quite liked 3H. Which I know boggles some minds to not actually hate the game but not be big on the character. I like the music, the stage is fine - if not conducive to shorter matches. But overall a disappointing addition for me.
 

smashkirby

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Chrom could've been a unique character and I'd have been cool with it. He's an awesome character and deserves the best.
Incredible brother and father with an ocean of humility and just a twinge of moronic tendencies… definitely my kind of guy.
Chrom was the only F.E. character I heavily supported pre-Smash 4, so you can imagine my immense disappointment and irritation towards his de-confirmation (only made worse when I learned of the circumstances regarding the inclusion of his daughter and watched Robin's P.G.).

All of that being said, he's now one of only TWO F.E. characters I've ever popped off for in regards to getting into Smash. Ironically enough, the other pop-off was for the return of his 'base' character in Smash 4.
 

DarkFalcon

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It is genuinely fascinating how Smash 4 changed how people view Fire Emblem. Robin was a good newcomer and Lucina was an easy clone for a popular character. Not many complaints other than Chrom missing the cut.

People wanted Roy back because "Roy's our boy!" He came as DLC alongside some other cut veterans. Everything completely changed the moment Corrin came. Really felt like a switch flipped overnight on the franchise. The pure vitriol was kinda disgusting. Even years later despite only getting one true newcomer in Byleth due to good timing the negativity was wild.
 
D

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Everyone is talking about Fire Emblem today so now is the time to remind everyone that a Fire Emblem themed Tourney has YET to take place in Ultimate since they added online tourneys.

I don't believe another Fire Emblem character is coming at this point, but the thought of no Fire Emblem Tourney has been looming in my head for a long time.
 

N3ON

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It is genuinely fascinating how Smash 4 changed how people view Fire Emblem. Robin was a good newcomer and Lucina was an easy clone for a popular character. Not many complaints other than Chrom missing the cut.

People wanted Roy back because "Roy's our boy!" He came as DLC alongside some other cut veterans. Everything completely changed the moment Corrin came. Really felt like a switch flipped overnight on the franchise. The pure vitriol was kinda disgusting. Even years later despite only getting one true newcomer in Byleth due to good timing the negativity was wild.
Well it was percolating once we got two newcomers at the same time and the count pushed up to four, but one was a clone and a popular request, and four wasn't seen as too egregious, so it remained in the undercurrent, a grumble here or there. Then we got Roy which pushed the count up to five, but he was a popular veteran, so the pressure rose a bit more but he was in turn excused and enjoyed.

Then the simmering pot of the bubbling discontent boiled over with Corrin, who, unlike the others, was not popular, not very requested, the fourth addition from a series in one game, promotional, wielding a sword, and last. Perfect storm material.

But they were smart about Chrom's reveal because they sandwiched him literally in the middle of a bunch of popular characters in the midst of a hype Direct, in the middle of the pre-release phase. He couldn't have been more cushioned if they tried. Which is basically the inverse of how Byleth was handled.

I mean the main difference here is Banjo was just "I don't like these certain aspects" and they got jumped for it.
Here plenty of people have voiced issues with Byleth and not been jumped, it's the one guy being a complete ass about it that's drawing ire.
People have been complaining about negative takes since Piranha Plant day, I'm not just referring to right now.
 

True Blue Warrior

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It is genuinely fascinating how Smash 4 changed how people view Fire Emblem. Robin was a good newcomer and Lucina was an easy clone for a popular character. Not many complaints other than Chrom missing the cut.

People wanted Roy back because "Roy's our boy!" He came as DLC alongside some other cut veterans. Everything completely changed the moment Corrin came. Really felt like a switch flipped overnight on the franchise. The pure vitriol was kinda disgusting. Even years later despite only getting one true newcomer in Byleth due to good timing the negativity was wild.
I remember there being people unhappy over Fire Emblem having two Marth derivatives and 5 characters even back before Corrin got in. In addition to that, a 6th FE character wasn't highly demanded within the Smash community and Corrin's inclusion had nothing to do with fan demand. Add in to the fact that his game wasn't released yet in the west and Corrin being revealed as one of the last characters, and thus, for all these reasons, Corrin got tons of hate. There is also the "Another anime swordsman!?" people. And then people got to play Fire Emblem Fates and things got worse for him considering he got in to showcase that game.
 

slambros

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I just had a thought, and while I placed it in Aiai's thread, I'll post it here too. Super Monkey Ball: Banana Mania is coming out on October 5th. What if the game's release and the timing of the final fighter announcement have been placed together intentionally to match with the character being Aiai or another Super Monkey Ball character?
 

walugurl

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What’s important in universe doesn’t really matter. Waluigi is important to us fans because we love him and Nintendo knows it! That’s why they started shilling merchandise and advertisements of him lately. That outcry from 2018 really gave Nintendo a wake up call telling them”Hey, this character makes money”.
 

Schnee117

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I just had a thought, and while I placed it in Aiai's thread, I'll post it here too. Super Monkey Ball: Banana Mania is coming out on October 5th. What if the game's release and the timing of the final fighter announcement have been placed together intentionally to match with the character being Aiai or another Super Monkey Ball character?
Monkey Ball's release date has been locked in long before we even knew of this presentation so I doubt it, as cool as Monkey Ball content would be.
 

True Blue Warrior

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Another factor was that prior to Corrin, the ire was still mostly focused on that goddam Dark Pit guy, but I guess it was Corrin, not Robin, who finally tipped the scales.
And now you really don't see that much hate for the guy, mainly because of the whole Echo Fighter thing and Everyone being Here.
 

DarkFalcon

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Well it was percolating once we got two newcomers at the same time and the count pushed up to four, but one was a clone and a popular request, and four wasn't seen as too egregious, so it remained in the undercurrent, a grumble here or there. Then we got Roy which pushed the count up to five, but he was a popular veteran, so the pressure rose a bit more but he was in turn excused and enjoyed.

Then the simmering pot of the bubbling discontent boiled over with Corrin, who, unlike the others, was not popular, not very requested, the fourth addition from a series in one game, promotional, wielding a sword, and last. Perfect storm material.

But they were smart about Chrom's reveal because they sandwiched him literally in the middle of a bunch of popular characters in the midst of a hype Direct, in the middle of the pre-release phase. He couldn't have been more cushioned if they tried. Which is basically the inverse of how Byleth was handled.
I just wish the complaints were consistent towards the characters. Too many for a smaller franchise? That's fair. Too many play similarly? Well that isn't the case for Corrin or Byleth but they had the most negative reaction. Cut some? Who? The unique ones? Pointless. The clones? Why? They're lower effort fanservice that take nothing away from fully developed fighters. Make them costumes instead? Why does that matter? So someone feels better about the CSS? Anime swordfighter? Nonsense. People get hyped over other anime characters.

All I want is people to be more consistent instead of saying "well actually it's this too" when you counter them.
 
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N3ON

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I just wish the complaints were consistent towards the characters. Too many for a smaller franchise? That's fair. Too many play similarly? Well that isn't the case for Corrin or Byleth but they had the most negative reaction. Cut some? Who? The unique ones? Pointless. The clones? Why? They're lower effort fanservice that take nothing away from fully developed fighters. Make them costumes instead? Why does that matter? So someone feels better about the CSS? Anime swordfighter? Nonsense. People get hyped over other anime characters.

All I want is people to be more consistent instead of saying "well actually it's this too" when you counter them.
Well, reasons people dislike characters are generally consistent (or at least there are some fairly regularly seen reasons), it's just different reasons apply to different characters. I'm not validating all the detraction, but you wouldn't expect the reasons people like a character to be uniform either.

And, I mean, it is quite likely that some FE characters will be cut whenever the cuts begin, so... that is a debate that will be had eventually. And Smash typically prioritizes keeping the longstanding and unique characters above the newer or derivative ones. So that will likely inform the direction those conversations take.
 

SharkLord

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Byleth, eh? To be honest, I enjoyed them a lot. Sure, maybe we have a frickton of FE characters already, or maybe they're not making the best use of their potential, but I just like the big chunky damage I can dish out. Snag 'em with the lance, crunch 'em with the axe, shoot 'em down with the bow, catch 'em with the whipsword. I just think they're fun. :drshrug:. Really, I think they're when I realized I like the big heavy hitbox-type attacks, like with Min Min, Sephiroth, and Pyra.
It is genuinely fascinating how Smash 4 changed how people view Fire Emblem. Robin was a good newcomer and Lucina was an easy clone for a popular character. Not many complaints other than Chrom missing the cut.

People wanted Roy back because "Roy's our boy!" He came as DLC alongside some other cut veterans. Everything completely changed the moment Corrin came. Really felt like a switch flipped overnight on the franchise. The pure vitriol was kinda disgusting. Even years later despite only getting one true newcomer in Byleth due to good timing the negativity was wild.
I keep hearing Star Fox and Kid Icarus went through the same phase too. I think it just goes to show that unless you're one of Nintendo's original Big Three, if you start growing faster and nobody else is you're just an easy target for the vitriol.
 

DarkFalcon

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Well, reasons people dislike characters are generally consistent (or at least there are some fairly regularly seen reasons), it's just different reasons apply to different characters. I'm not validating all the detraction, but you wouldn't expect the reasons people like a character to be uniform either.

And, I mean, it is quite likely that some FE characters will be cut whenever the cuts begin, so... that is a debate that will be had eventually. And Smash typically prioritizes keeping the longstanding and unique characters above the newer or derivative ones. So that will likely inform the direction those conversations take.
Marth is never gonna be cut for sure. Perhaps Ike too. The questions start after that. Awakening as the savior of the franchise should have someone. Robin makes sense, but why cut Lucina when she's easy? Now after that is the interesting part. Roy should go imo even though I like him. He's basically Melee nostalgia. Chrom can go, Corrin probably will too despite having a more interesting moveset. Byleth I'd keep unless a future game does something to make you forget about Three Houses.
 

CapitaineCrash

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I just had a thought, and while I placed it in Aiai's thread, I'll post it here too. Super Monkey Ball: Banana Mania is coming out on October 5th. What if the game's release and the timing of the final fighter announcement have been placed together intentionally to match with the character being Aiai or another Super Monkey Ball character?
No. This is just like when people thought that Dante was the final fighter of pass 1 because the Sakurai presents was on the same day as some Devil may cry news.
 

N3ON

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Marth is never gonna be cut for sure. Perhaps Ike too. The questions start after that. Awakening as the savior of the franchise should have someone. Robin makes sense, but why cut Lucina when she's easy? Now after that is the interesting part. Roy should go imo even though I like him. He's basically Melee nostalgia. Chrom can go, Corrin probably will too despite having a more interesting moveset. Byleth I'd keep unless a future game does something to make you forget about Three Houses.
No, I think Marth and Ike are safe. I know Robin is sort of the least buzzed about of the Awakening characters these days, but I think he's the likeliest to stay of the three tbh, since he's original. And so I think the cuts will come from the remaining five. Though who and how many I'm not even going to try to guess.
 

Sucumbio

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Yeesh........ Not one or two but THREE Fates games... I'm so behind. Gah well I appreciate all the suggestions. I think I'll start with catching up by playing 6 through 8...

Anyone like shadow dragon or its sequel?
 

The Stoopid Unikorn

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Geno's a mii costume though. How would that even work?
CacoMallow never outright said it'd come with Geno and Doom Slayer as characters.

This is just something people assumed because Mii costumes HAD to be related to fighters at the time. In other words, fan rules.

The craziest part is that Fire Emblem is still lacking characters.
As long as Lyn isn't in, there will always be a large gaping hole to be filled!
View attachment 332107
They'll add Hector instead. :smirk:
 
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DarkFalcon

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Marth
Roy
Ike
Robin
Byleth

Is my preferred FE roster with cuts.

It hurts losing Lucina, Chrom and Corrin but if I had to cut some, they would be the ones.
Pretty good list though I'd keep Lucina. Roy is super hard to figure out since he's 100% Melee nostalgia.
 

Swamp Sensei

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Pretty good list though I'd keep Lucina. Roy is super hard to figure out since he's 100% Melee nostalgia.
Roy and Lucina are the second most popular male and female character in the franchise.

Neither got their popularity purely from Smash. Regardless, I chose Roy as he wasn't an echo and Awakening already had a character.
 

CapitaineCrash

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Honestly I think Roy could stay if his game would released outside of Japan. For now I could see them cutting him again like they did with Smash 4 (alongside Lucas). Personally if I had to choose I would prioritize Lucina over Roy.
 

DarkFalcon

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Roy and Lucina are the second most popular male and female character in the franchise.

Neither got their popularity purely from Smash. Regardless, I chose Roy as he wasn't an echo and Awakening already had a character.
That does bring up something interesting. Roy got semi cloned after coming back. It's possible they could do something like that with Lucina. Although since her shtick was pretending to be marth for a bit idk. Haven't played awakening in ages so I can't remember her moves.
 

Digital Hazard

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Roy and Lucina are the second most popular male and female character in the franchise.
I'll be honest, I'll always find fallacy over this argument, wether in favor or against.

Not because they aren't popular, but because everyone always ignores subsequent CYLs.

Not to menton how times change... Echoes wasn't released by the time the first was done, then did, poof, Celica and Alm were also subsequent winners.

To not mention six Three Houses characters were subsequent winners.
 
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Roy_Boy Color

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I haven't been on Smashboards for a while (since around the time the game released I think lol) but I just wanted to say it's been pretty exciting seeing this all through to the end.

I personally haven't been too too disappointed with any characters, if anything I would just hope the playstyle would be interesting for some characters. But I'm really pumped to see who's gonna be announced next week (I'm personally hoping for Phoenix Wright, but I'm content with anyone at this point).
 

N3ON

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Roy and Lucina are the second most popular male and female character in the franchise.

Neither got their popularity purely from Smash. Regardless, I chose Roy as he wasn't an echo and Awakening already had a character.
No it was from all those people playing his game, lol.

None of the popularity comes purely from Smash, but I think Roy would be considerably lower without it.

I mean the other Japan only lords like Sigurd, Seliph, Leaf, and (at the time) Alm and Celica didn't even chart in the top 20.
 

GoodGrief741

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It is genuinely fascinating how Smash 4 changed how people view Fire Emblem. Robin was a good newcomer and Lucina was an easy clone for a popular character. Not many complaints other than Chrom missing the cut.

People wanted Roy back because "Roy's our boy!" He came as DLC alongside some other cut veterans. Everything completely changed the moment Corrin came. Really felt like a switch flipped overnight on the franchise. The pure vitriol was kinda disgusting. Even years later despite only getting one true newcomer in Byleth due to good timing the negativity was wild.
This just goes to show how terrible a choice Corrin was back then and how bad it still is. There's people who have sworn to never touch a Fire Emblem game because of Smash, and that vitriol can be traced to Corrin's inclusion.
 

The Stoopid Unikorn

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First place was Gatekeeper which was the funniest thing.
What's even funnier is how much IS commited to it once he won.

Commisionning hand-drawn art with the ****ing Monastery in the background, drawn brick by brick. And an attack animation where many 3H characters (including Byleth, Rhea and others) stampede on the foe.

Dude's got the best art and the best attack animation in the entire 600+ roster, hands down.
 
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chocolatejr9

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I'll be honest, I'll always find fallacy over this argument, wether in favor or against.

Not because they aren't popular, but because everyone always ignores subsequent CYLs.

Not to menton how times change... Echoes wasn't released by the time the first was done, then did, poof, Celica and Alm were also subsequent winners.

To not mention six Three Houses characters were subsequent winners.
Now that you mention it, if we count all the votes for each CYL winner, then Gatekeeper and Edelgard are the most popular male and female, respectively. The latter being the most popular of all.
 
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