Official DLC Speculation Discussion Volume II

[SharkLord]

What first party character do you think is the most likely, if this pass ends off with one?

Before Sephiroth was announced, I was thinking that Impa seemed plausible (between BotW2, Age of Calamity, and her redesign being really popular), but the Age of Calamity spirit event seemed to squash that idea. They could try to promote something, but there haven't been a ton of major first party releases recently. (maybe a gen. 8 Pokemon or one from Pokemon Legends: Arceus? I'm not sure if any stand out - I'm way behind on Pokemon)

I'd love it if we got something like Porky for Smash alongside a Mother/Earthbound trilogy getting released on the Switch, but I doubt that will happen.

It's hard to say. All the "obvious" ones like Astral Chain or Pokemon Sword and Shield have been shot down by Spirits, and I'm pretty sure those events are gonna hold. This leaves us with:

1. Ayumi Tachibana - The only game left that could really fit the end-of-pass promo pick theory in terms of timeframe, with everything else releasing too late or having been out for too long now. On the flipside, the FDC remakes are still a smaller project for a series that was only properly localized recently.
2. King Boo - LM3 is a bit late for a promo, but it's still one of the few games to survive the events (For now). On the other hand, we're not sure how Nintendo looks at the representation; Maybe they consider Luigi, being the player character of the game, and his new Poltergust grabs representation enough? And then there's the matter of the heavily-pushed Mario tournament, which would 90% have King Boo with it had he been added at the time.
3. PDSP/Legends rep - Maybe? I kinda doubt it, though; All the characters chosen in advance in recent releases have had a decent amount of months to cement themselves, and the new Sinnoh games are a bit late for that
4. Octoling - Splatoon's Nintendo's rising star, and a new character could help promote that. Then again, there's the question of the Squid Sister Miis. I don't feel like debating that, so I'll just say opinion hinges on whether or not you think those deconfirm an entire series, just the game they're from, or merely the characters the Miis are based on. Note that Splatoon 3 is a bit too far off for a promo pick like with the Sinnoh games, so Octo would probably be specifically for Splatoon 2 and Octo Expansion.
5. Euden - The most notable recent Nintendo game not acknowledged in any way in Smash, and the company's first original mobile IP. Held back by the lack of EU representation; It's not as egregious as, say, Takamaru's case back in Smash 4, but it might cause some issues.

...Yeah, if you want a first-party you're gonna have to take a bit of a risk to some degree. But ah well, I've been taking risks my entire time here. A couple more shouldn't hurt

 

[Garteam]

I kind of wish Sakurai never made this statement to be honest. Alot of people took this statement at face value. View attachment 315796

I honestly feel the opposite way. I wish more people would pay attention to this statement.

I think a lot of people have a hard time dropping the "Hall of Fame" mentality and look exclusively towards what characters would generate the buzz upon their announcements. However, a lot of the fun of Smash, in general, is seeing weird or unappreciated ideas come to fruition.
For example, while I appreciate that we got , , and in Smash, I kind of like that some of the more unexpected characters like , , and have made such a big splash gameplay-wise. Life is kind of boring without the occasional curveball.

 

[Technomage]

1. Euden - The most notable recent Nintendo game not acknowledged in any way in Smash, and the company's first original mobile IP. Held back by the lack of EU representation; It's not as egregious as, say, Takamaru's case back in Smash 4, but it might cause some issues.

Though if that VA theory were to be true, then DL's lack of European presence could help Euden's chances, since there'd be no need for European voices, just English and Japanese ones.

 

[N3ON]

I'm gonna have to agree with the guy who said Euden, since he'd be repping a new series, repping a mobile game, and has had a decent amount of success and profits.

But only the last one of those is something that would make a character likelier.

I honestly feel the opposite way. I wish more people would pay attention to this statement.

I think a lot of people have a hard time dropping the "Hall of Fame" mentality and look exclusively towards what characters would generate the buzz upon their announcements. However, a lot of the fun of Smash, in general, is seeing weird or unappreciated ideas come to fruition.
For example, while I appreciate that we got , , and in Smash, I kind of like that some of the more unexpected characters like , , and have made such a big splash gameplay-wise. Life is kind of boring without the occasional curveball.

Your expected/unexpected lists are strangely populated.

 

[Guynamednelson]

Your expected/unexpected lists are strangely populated.

I'm not thinking he said Sephiroth was expected, but that he was a big third party, and that was unexpected because of the focus on Erdrick and Erdrick alone being the DQ rep while were unexpected because of a focus on big third-parties.

 

[N3ON]

I'm not thinking he said Sephiroth was expected, but that he was a big third party, and that was unexpected because of the focus on Erdrick and Erdrick alone being the DQ rep while were unexpected because of a focus on big third-parties.

Fair enough but I feel like half the characters there are interchangeable between either side.

 

[chocolatejr9]

Though if that VA theory were to be true, then DL's lack of European presence could help Euden's chances, since there'd be no need for European voices, just English and Japanese ones.

Ooohhh, big brain play right here.

 

[Louie G.]

The fact that I struggle so much to come up with even one first party character to put confidence in is enough to convince me that these final two characters will be third party.

Unless we get something totally out of pocket like Bandana Dee or an AT promotion based off fan demand, the current first party precedent does not favor much of anyone who strikes me as plausible. The closest thing would be Octoling, although I still teeter on whether or not the Splatoon costumes matter and whether or not Octoling has enough in their camp to justify a full and captivating challenger pack. Otherwise Nintendo’s recent output doesn’t draw attention toward much of promotional value since most of those games are already represented by a character.

Gen 8 Pokemon is the big one, but with sights set on Gen 4 and SWSH DLC being all wrapped up... it just doesn’t make a whole lot of sense to me at this rate. Doubly so because hilariously enough, the DLC expansions landed in both June and October, two months where we got Smash reveals and neither was a Pokemon.

I just think we’re getting two more third parties - one big boy and one more “lowkey”. I understand that people have latched onto the trend of closing out with some sort of first party pick, but with both Min Min and Pythra in tow I feel like we already got our fill of this early.

 

[GilTheGreat19]

I saw Euden talk just now.
While I'd personally prefer e third party mobile rep, I wouldn't be against Euden. At least we actually have a mobile character, haha.

 

[Icedragonadam]

Right now I am feeling Chun-Li and Lloyd(or Yuri or both).

You have one big icon and more a lowkey character(although it's more up higher in Japan).

 

[GilTheGreat19]

The fact that I struggle so much to come up with even one first party character to put confidence in is enough to convince me that these final two characters will be third party.

Same here. I think these last two FP characters may be third party, and that one will be western while the other is eastern.

 

[Speed Weed]

What first party character do you think is the most likely, if this pass ends off with one?

Before Sephiroth was announced, I was thinking that Impa seemed plausible (between BotW2, Age of Calamity, and her redesign being really popular), but the Age of Calamity spirit event seemed to squash that idea. They could try to promote something, but there haven't been a ton of major first party releases recently. (maybe a gen. 8 Pokemon or one from Pokemon Legends: Arceus? I'm not sure if any stand out - I'm way behind on Pokemon)

I'd love it if we got something like Porky for Smash alongside a Mother/Earthbound trilogy getting released on the Switch, but I doubt that will happen.

let's just say things at E3 are gonna be pretty joyful if you catch my drift

 

[Technomage]

let's just say things at E3 are gonna be pretty joyful if you catch my drift

Let me guess, Sukapon?

 

[Speed Weed]

Let me guess, Sukapon?

no it's ****ing mario

ye it's sukapon

 

[N3ON]

The boring answer is Pokemon, because despite the spirit event and the growing distance from the newest gen, who else is it gonna be? There are no frontrunners. All the other options range from possible to pretty unlikely.

The more exciting answer is Waluigi, because pelvic thrusts.

 

[Shroob]

The boring answer is Pokemon, because despite the spirit event and the growing distance from the newest gen, who else is it gonna be? There are no frontrunners. All the other options range from possible to pretty unlikely.

The more exciting answer is Waluigi, because pelvic thrusts.

Just remember to stop on your right foot


Don't forget it,

 

[Rie Sonomura]

Just remember to stop on your right foot


Don't forget it,

And then BRING IT AROOOOOUND TOOOOOWWWN-

 

[RileyXY1]

Same here. I think these last two FP characters may be third party, and that one will be western while the other is eastern.

Not me. If there's going to be two third parties I expect both to be Eastern and from a company that already has a character.

 

[HypnoMaster372]

What first party character do you think is the most likely, if this pass ends off with one?

Before Sephiroth was announced, I was thinking that Impa seemed plausible (between BotW2, Age of Calamity, and her redesign being really popular), but the Age of Calamity spirit event seemed to squash that idea. They could try to promote something, but there haven't been a ton of major first party releases recently. (maybe a gen. 8 Pokemon or one from Pokemon Legends: Arceus? I'm not sure if any stand out - I'm way behind on Pokemon)

I'd love it if we got something like Porky for Smash alongside a Mother/Earthbound trilogy getting released on the Switch, but I doubt that will happen.

I would love for it to be a Rhythm Heaven Character, but we all know that ain't going to happen.

 

[Evil Trapezium]

What first party character do you think is the most likely, if this pass ends off with one?

Before Sephiroth was announced, I was thinking that Impa seemed plausible (between BotW2, Age of Calamity, and her redesign being really popular), but the Age of Calamity spirit event seemed to squash that idea. They could try to promote something, but there haven't been a ton of major first party releases recently. (maybe a gen. 8 Pokemon or one from Pokemon Legends: Arceus? I'm not sure if any stand out - I'm way behind on Pokemon)

I'd love it if we got something like Porky for Smash alongside a Mother/Earthbound trilogy getting released on the Switch, but I doubt that will happen.

I don't know. Everyone important is already in Smash so I'll just pick John Raimi because I'm disappointed that he wasn't even acknowledged.

Like dude, he's as spirit as spirits can get.

 

[CannonStreak]

I don't know. Everyone important is already in Smash so I'll just pick John Raimi because I'm disappointed that he wasn't even acknowledged.

View attachment 315813

Like dude, he's as spirit as spirits can get.

I made up some moves for a moveset for him, so you know. I can show them to you if you want.

 

[Louie G.]

I would love for it to be a Rhythm Heaven Character, but we all know that ain't going to happen.

Genuinely if by some miracle Rhythm Heaven was acknowledged and given a full character after years of my heartstrings being tugged left and right by faulty or outdated leaks... I would genuinely be 100% satisfied with Smash Ultimate and ask for nothing else.

Snapping myself out of dream land before I let myself get too infatuated with the thought again.

 

[cothero]

I don't know. Everyone important is already in Smash so I'll just pick John Raimi because I'm disappointed that he wasn't even acknowledged.

View attachment 315813

Like dude, he's as spirit as spirits can get.

Pretty cool character design. Could have been a bad*** final boss for Ultimate.

 

[Gengar84]

I don't know. Everyone important is already in Smash so I'll just pick John Raimi because I'm disappointed that he wasn't even acknowledged.

View attachment 315813

Like dude, he's as spirit as spirits can get.

I don’t know anything about Geist but John Raimi has a cool design and looks like he’d be interesting if he ever made it to Smash. He reminds me a bit of Tabuu.

 

[Evil Trapezium]

I made up some moves for a moveset for him, so you know. I can show them to you if you want.

That would be awesome if you could show it to me. I think John Raimi would be a lot of fun to play.

 

[CannonStreak]

Pretty cool character design. Could have been a bad*** final boss for Ultimate.

As Tabuu's long lost brother!

 

[ZelDan]

When it comes to first parties, I actually have a hard time seeing any sort of promotional picks tbh.

I guess the one most people are looking at right now is Ayumi from the FDC remakes, but I dunno, I just have a hard time seeing her get in when before said remakes she was a retro, Japan-only character. Not going to say its impossible, I just have a hard time envisioning it.

I can't really see a BOTW 2 or Zelda in general pick happening. I don't think (or I would like to think atleast) they wouldn't want to make a DLC pack out of a "Link 4," "Zelda 3," or "Ganon(dorf) 2." Sheik is basically out of the running, and I don't expect a third version of BotW Sheik to happen in BotW2. If there was a new BotW 2 character they really felt like promoting, then I kind of feel like they might have found a way to fit him/her in the last trailer back in E32019?

Ring Fit and Astral Chain likely aren't happening because spirit events.

The lack of any LM3 spirit event I feel could be explained away by the fact that maybe Sakurai/Nintendo thought Luigi's moveset changes were enough LM3 representation.

Pokemon seemed unlikely to me even before the crowd cheer stuff (however legit that theory is). I won't say its impossible though because maybe the Spirit event happened early enough to the point it doesn't matter as much? I dunno...

I reaaaally don't see any kind of playable character coming from the new garage game, whatever it was called.

Honestly, as far as first parties are concerned I almost feel like I could see a more "fan demand" character making it in moreso than a promotional at this point since I can't really pinpoint a potential pick that sounds right to me, but of course there are some issues when it comes to fan-demand picks too, from the fact that first party picks in DLC up to this point have been largely promotional or Switch-only, or returning veterans (which obviously doesn't apply to Ultimate). there's also the ultimate question of if ATs disconfirm or not, which leaves characters like Waluigi and Isaac in an awkward position, who are two of then more popular/demanded first party characters we have (I don't think ATs do disconfirm BTW, which is why I'd personally entertain Waluigi and Isaac, but eh). There is also Bandana Waddle Dee who doesn't have to worry about the AT question, so he could perhaps happen. Then there's Dixie Kong too, I suppose, though tbh, even as someone who is a supporter of her, I always wondered how her demand fared against other characters. Like, K Rool definitely took a good chunk of attention away from her due to also being a DKC character, she doesn't have the gerenal popularity that Waluigi had, I don't think she had the same kind pf presence in the fighter ballot that Isaac had, and I would guess Bandana Waddle Dee has more popularity in Japan than Dixie does (this is me just guessing and assuming though with no real numbers to back anything up, so by all means someone can correct me if that want)

 

[Evil Trapezium]

Pretty cool character design. Could have been a bad*** final boss for Ultimate.

Final boss? He's a good guy though! He gets his body stolen and you get to possess guards, dogs, rats, machine gun turrets, etc. You even get to possess a grenade and blow someone's ass off with it.

 

[CannonStreak]

That would be awesome if you could show it to me. I think John Raimi would be a lot of fun to play.

Anyway, here we go.

Spoiler: Some of John Raimi's Moves

B: Assault Rifle: John uses an assault rifle, which has limited ammo, and needs time to reload after use.

B Side: Grenade Launcher: John fires a grenade launcher, which also has limited ammo.

B Up: Rocket Propulsion: John uses a rocket launcher to shoot downward, which propels him upward from recoil.

B Down: Mine or Grenade: John throws a mine or grenade at the opponent, which sticks until stepped on or explodes after a short time,

After taking enough damage and inflicting damage to others to fill John's gauge, the shield and B button can be pressed to have John's soul removed from his body, the latter which temporarily disappears. Like said before, John, in this state, is very tangible, but cannot attack unless he turns into, or possesses an object, animal or person. He can also be attacked and damaged while possessing such objects and even be knocked off stage. John moves freely in this form without having to be worried about being knocked off the stage, and is very fast. John returns to his body after the gauge for his soul form is drained. John's soul form drains very fast, and must use his possessions to slow down the draining of the gauge. The gauge itself fills up very slowly. He cannot possess other Smashers in this form, though, but he does not have to find and possess the things he possess to use them. They just randomly appear. He is also affected by gravity when possessing things. His moves in this form are.

B: Animal Possession: John possesses an animal, namely a dog out of nowhere, and for a few seconds, can be used to attack and bite and scratch opponents.

B Side: Person Possession: John possesses a person, namely a Volks soldier, who comes out of nowhere, and for a few seconds, can use weapons he does not use in his normal form, mainly anti-spirit weapons.

B Up: Object Possession: John can possess an ordinary object like a grandfather clock to fall on opponents, and sometimes into a vehicle to ram opponents.

B Down: Weapon Possession: John possesses a weapon such as a turret or grenade to attack enemies, the latter which explodes without harming John.

Final Smash: Whether possessing an object or living being in soul form or in normal form, after getting the Smash Ball, John Raimi turns back to his normal form if he is already in his soul form and fires a guided missile. If this missile does not hit anyone, it does not do anything. If it does hit anyone, a cutscene happens where the opponent(s) are pulled into the afterlife, where they are immediately attacked by souls and ghosts. Then, John, in his soul form, possesses a nuke that fell to the afterlife with the opponent(s) and activates it, blowing up the opponent(s) and sending them flying, possibly getting them KOed.

What do you think?

 

[SharkLord]

Final boss? He's a good guy though! He gets his body stolen and you get to possess guards, dogs, rats, machine gun turrets, etc. You even get to possess a grenade and blow someone's ass off with it.

So basically Super Mario Odyssey before it was cool

 

[chocolatejr9]

I don't know. Everyone important is already in Smash so I'll just pick John Raimi because I'm disappointed that he wasn't even acknowledged.

View attachment 315813

Like dude, he's as spirit as spirits can get.

I mean, you made Sergeant Cortez a big name here. Maybe you can make lightning strike twice?

 

[Guynamednelson]

but of course there are some issues when it comes to fan-demand picks too, from the fact that first party picks in DLC up to this point have been largely promotional or Switch-only, or returning veterans (which obviously doesn't apply to Ultimate). there's also the ultimate question of if ATs disconfirm or not, which leaves characters like Waluigi and Isaac in an awkward position, who are two of then more popular/demanded first party characters we have (I don't think they do disconfirm BTW, which is why I'd personally entertain them, but eh).

IMO the structure of challenger packs can be an issue for characters like Waluigi and maybe Dixie/Dee. I've become more of an Isaac-for-DLC stan because Golden Sun is more challenger pack-friendly, but if there was enough Starfy demand in Japan we didn't know about, The Legendary Starfy is also lacking in a fighter, stage, and music, and Krystal might be able to squeeze by with more Star Fox Zero music/spirits and the return of Orbital Gate Assault.

 

[Technomage]

Anyway, here we go.

Spoiler: Some of John Raimi's Moves

B: Assault Rifle: John uses an assault rifle, which has limited ammo, and needs time to reload after use.

B Side: Grenade Launcher: John fires a grenade launcher, which also has limited ammo.

B Up: Rocket Propulsion: John uses a rocket launcher to shoot downward, which propels him upward from recoil.

B Down: Mine or Grenade: John throws a mine or grenade at the opponent, which sticks until stepped on or explodes after a short time,

After taking enough damage and inflicting damage to others to fill John's gauge, the shield and B button can be pressed to have John's soul removed from his body, the latter which temporarily disappears. Like said before, John, in this state, is very tangible, but cannot attack unless he turns into, or possesses an object, animal or person. He can also be attacked and damaged while possessing such objects and even be knocked off stage. John moves freely in this form without having to be worried about being knocked off the stage, and is very fast. John returns to his body after the gauge for his soul form is drained. John's soul form drains very fast, and must use his possessions to slow down the draining of the gauge. The gauge itself fills up very slowly. He cannot possess other Smashers in this form, though, but he does not have to find and possess the things he possess to use them. They just randomly appear. He is also affected by gravity when possessing things. His moves in this form are.

B: Animal Possession: John possesses an animal, namely a dog out of nowhere, and for a few seconds, can be used to attack and bite and scratch opponents.

B Side: Person Possession: John possesses a person, namely a Volks soldier, who comes out of nowhere, and for a few seconds, can use weapons he does not use in his normal form, mainly anti-spirit weapons.

B Up: Object Possession: John can possess an ordinary object like a grandfather clock to fall on opponents, and sometimes into a vehicle to ram opponents.

B Down: Weapon Possession: John possesses a weapon such as a turret or grenade to attack enemies, the latter which explodes without harming John.

Final Smash: Whether possessing an object or living being in soul form or in normal form, after getting the Smash Ball, John Raimi turns back to his normal form if he is already in his soul form and fires a guided missile. If this missile does not hit anyone, it does not do anything. If it does hit anyone, a cutscene happens where the opponent(s) are pulled into the afterlife, where they are immediately attacked by souls and ghosts. Then, John, in his soul form, possesses a nuke that fell to the afterlife with the opponent(s) and activates it, blowing up the opponent(s) and sending them flying, possibly getting them KOed.

What do you think?

I love the possession parts of his moveset.

Krystal might be able to squeeze by with more Star Fox Zero music/spirits and the return of Orbital Gate Assault.

Or maybe Sauria as a stage?

 

[CannonStreak]

I love the possession parts of his moveset.

Glad you do! ^_^

 

[Technomage]

Funny idea I had for an echo: Pink Gold Peach! Simply to see what kind of funny reactions Nathaniel Bandy would make. Doesn't even have to be any different from regular Peach. XD

 

[SirCamp]

It's hard to say. All the "obvious" ones like Astral Chain or Pokemon Sword and Shield have been shot down by Spirits, and I'm pretty sure those events are gonna hold. This leaves us with:

1. Ayumi Tachibana - The only game left that could really fit the end-of-pass promo pick theory in terms of timeframe, with everything else releasing too late or having been out for too long now. On the flipside, the FDC remakes are still a smaller project for a series that was only properly localized recently.
2. King Boo - LM3 is a bit late for a promo, but it's still one of the few games to survive the events (For now). On the other hand, we're not sure how Nintendo looks at the representation; Maybe they consider Luigi, being the player character of the game, and his new Poltergust grabs representation enough? And then there's the matter of the heavily-pushed Mario tournament, which would 90% have King Boo with it had he been added at the time.
3. PDSP/Legends rep - Maybe? I kinda doubt it, though; All the characters chosen in advance in recent releases have had a decent amount of months to cement themselves, and the new Sinnoh games are a bit late for that
4. Octoling - Splatoon's Nintendo's rising star, and a new character could help promote that. Then again, there's the question of the Squid Sister Miis. I don't feel like debating that, so I'll just say opinion hinges on whether or not you think those deconfirm an entire series, just the game they're from, or merely the characters the Miis are based on. Note that Splatoon 3 is a bit too far off for a promo pick like with the Sinnoh games, so Octo would probably be specifically for Splatoon 2 and Octo Expansion.
5. Euden - The most notable recent Nintendo game not acknowledged in any way in Smash, and the company's first original mobile IP. Held back by the lack of EU representation; It's not as egregious as, say, Takamaru's case back in Smash 4, but it might cause some issues.

...Yeah, if you want a first-party you're gonna have to take a bit of a risk to some degree. But ah well, I've been taking risks my entire time here. A couple more shouldn't hurt

This is of course a rumor, but if it turns out that we are indeed getting a DK revival of sorts and that 3D DK game comes to fruition at E3 I could certainly see a DK character as well. Specifically Dixie, assuming they use (and I’d be surprised if they didn’t).

 

[ZelDan]

IMO the structure of challenger packs can be an issue for characters like Waluigi and maybe Dixie/Dee. I've become more of an Isaac-for-DLC stan because Golden Sun is more challenger pack-friendly, but if there was enough Starfy demand in Japan we didn't know about, The Legendary Starfy is also lacking in a fighter, stage, and music, and Krystal might be able to squeeze by with more Star Fox Zero music/spirits and the return of Orbital Gate Assault.

There's a good chunk of first parties lacking in a fighter, stage, and music, so Starfy being absent there isn't really notable, and I'm going to guess it probably doesn't have the demand or popualrity to be close to the likes of Waluigi, Isaac, BWD, or Dixie Kong...or Toad too...that's a character that exists...

 

[Shroob]

Unrelated, but someone in PapaGeno's Discord apparently owned up to the "Teensie Bit of Trouble" Rabbids leak.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

Unrelated, but someone in PapaGeno's Discord apparently owned up to the "Teensie Bit of Trouble" Rabbids leak.

The one that said we’d wait till September for CP10, or the other one?

 

[CannonStreak]

Unrelated, but someone in PapaGeno's Discord apparently owned up to the "Teensie Bit of Trouble" Rabbids leak.

So it's not real? Didn't think it was real, anyway.