Dixie Kong's Barrel Of Support Spirits. Farewell Everyone, Thank You ALL For Making This Thread An Excellent Place For DK Fans!

[StormC]

I'm still salty a Twitter poster chickened out when they said if K. Rool was revealed in the August Direct, they would crush a JoyCon and eat it.

 

[Jasae Bushae]

Dixie still has pretty strong odds. While a new Fire Emblem character, and a new gen Pokemon rep are guaranteed, if they announce a third Donkey Kong game coming out, I can easily see Dixie being announced as dlc to serve as a sort of promotion.

 

[InASnowBoundLand]

I have absolutely no doubts whatsoever that we're getting a Treehouses character. I would bet actual money on it. How about, if we don't get a Treehouses character, I'll eat a Corrin amiibo?

Just in case, I hope you have a line of succession planned out for the Dixie Kong twitter.

 

[Strong DK]

I have absolutely no doubts whatsoever that we're getting a Treehouses character. I would bet actual money on it. How about, if we don't get a Treehouses character, I'll eat a Corrin amiibo?

If that happens, make sure to take pics or make a video of it.

 

[TheBazry64]

People need to chill with the FE character for DLC.
Sakurai and Nintendo noticed how big the backlash was for Corrin.
Chrom is only here because he is an echo who was scrapped in 4, i doubt Nintendo would be dumb enough to pull another Corrin.
FE is a niche franchise regardless how many times its fans claim it is not. The sales are nothing impressive, Nintendo wants money with the DLC and other characters would sell way better than yet another FE character.

 

[Mariomaniac45213]

I'm not against a Three Houses rep per se (as long as the rest of the DLC is 1st party only), but we all like to tell ourselves "sales are nothing impressive" and "Nintendo wouldn't be dumb enough to add another FE character" but yet here we are a couple days after Nintendo announced they are making an entire con dedicated to FE in Japan. A series with so-so sales numbers is getting a whole con dedicated to it, yet maybe I'm wrong but have Mario or Zelda ever had a whole con dedicated to it?

 

[Dyllybirdy]

FE is a niche franchise regardless how many times its fans claim it is not. The sales are nothing impressive, Nintendo wants money with the DLC and other characters would sell way better than yet another FE character.

I mean, you could potentially say that it's niche in the West, but it isn't in Japan...

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

I mean, you could potentially say that it's niche in the West, but it isn't in Japan...

And yet it's still doing better here than Dragon Quest...

 

[Vez]

I think we're only getting a Fire Emblem Three Houses character if the protagonist is at least somewhat interesting. If they're just another swords person and that's it I don't think that will be enough for Sakurai. Corrin at least had the whole dragon thing going on.

I'd put much more money on a gen 8 Pokemon happening than a new Fire Emblem character.

FE is a niche franchise regardless how many times its fans claim it is not. The sales are nothing impressive, Nintendo wants money with the DLC and other characters would sell way better than yet another FE character.

I wouldn't really call FE niche any more. It's probably one of Nintendo's bigger franchises at this point as Heroes has been a huge success for them and the last two Fire Emblem games sold over 2 million copies.

 

[KremlingKuthroat19]

Just wanted to say that I used to think that Spirits were a decomfirmation of a character, but took a 180 when then game’s complete list of Spirits leaked.

Basically every Nintendo character ever is a Spirit with the exception of Porky Minch and Adeline. Yes it’s possible these characters are DLC, but I just can’t see it happening. These characters aren’t hype at all imo. I think they’re simply omissions from the Spirits roster, not hints, but I could be wrong.

The devs probably ran out of time anyways and Porky could appear as a free DLC boss later with his Spirit. I’m just speculating, but the notion that Spirits are deconfirmations is silly to me. The only true deconfirmations to me are assist trophies. Look at Chrom. He’s in another character’s Final Smash, has a Mii costume and is his own character. Anything can happen. The only deconfirmation we have is Klaptrap lol

The safe picks for DLC are a Three Houses rep, Gen 8 Pokémon, and three third-party reps, with one of them being a Square rep. But this is Nintendo we’re taking about. They’re unpredictable by nature so I wouldn’t count too much on logic lol

 

[RetrogamerMax]

Just wanted to say that I used to think that Spirits were a decomfirmation of a character, but took a 180 when then game’s complete list of Spirits leaked.

Basically every Nintendo character ever is a Spirit with the exception of Porky Minch and Adeline. Yes it’s possible these characters are DLC, but I just can’t see it happening. These characters aren’t hype at all imo. I think they’re simply omissions from the Spirits roster, not hints, but I could be wrong.

The devs probably ran out of time anyways and Porky could appear as a free DLC boss later with his Spirit. I’m just speculating, but the notion that Spirits are deconfirmations is silly to me. The only true deconfirmations to me are assist trophies.

The safe picks for DLC are a Three Houses rep, Gen 8 Pokémon, and three third-party reps, with one of them being a Square rep. But this is Nintendo we’re taking about. They’re unpredictable by nature so I wouldn’t count too much on logic lol

Porky is the co-antagonist of Mother 2/Earthbound and the main antagonist of Mother 3, so he is a important and interesting character. Mother's 30th anniversary is coming up next year and they could potentially finally announce Mother 3 being localized and released in the west. Porky as DLC could be a promotion for that.

 

[KremlingKuthroat19]

Porky is the co-antagonist of Mother 2/Earthbound and the main antagonist of Mother 3, so he is a important and interesting character. Mother's 30th anniversary is coming up next year and they could potentially finally announce Mother 3 being localized and released in the west. Porky as DLC could be a promotion for that.

That’s true. Porky is actually a likely pick when you put it that way. I can’t see Adeline though. If we’re getting another Kirby rep it’d definitely be Bandana Waddle Dee.

Honestly I’ve never played the Mother series so I thought Porky was only in Mother 3.

 

[ZeroJanitor]

actually now that i think about it adeline would be pretty dope (though unlikely)

 

[Parallel_Falchion]

People need to chill with the FE character for DLC.
Sakurai and Nintendo noticed how big the backlash was for Corrin.
Chrom is only here because he is an echo who was scrapped in 4, i doubt Nintendo would be dumb enough to pull another Corrin.
FE is a niche franchise regardless how many times its fans claim it is not. The sales are nothing impressive, Nintendo wants money with the DLC and other characters would sell way better than yet another FE character.

The backlash from Corrin was probably pretty minor in the eyes of Nintendo. Besides, this time, Fighter Pass: A lot of people have already bought every DLC character, no matter who they are.

FE is not niche. In fact, FE is actually in a perfect spot for DLC; not niche as to be unrecognizable, but not big enough that it couldn't use the promotional push.

 

[KremlingKuthroat19]

actually now that i think about it adeline would be pretty dope (though unlikely)

Adeline could be one of those characters that Sakurai would choose for moveset potential as opposed to popularity. Her drawing ability could be really creative. She actually would have a better chance if Waddle Dee was already playable.

I stand by the notion that Dixie and Bandana Waddle Dee are the last remaining Nintendo all-stars not in the game yet. Toad and Waluigi are pretty high in my book but one is an assist trophy and the other might not get pushed since we have two new Mario reps already (Daisy and Piranha Plant).

I think the Everyone is Here tagline for the game makes Dixie’s chances skyrocket. She’s the most realizable character that’s been cut from previous games that has high fan demand and is from an underrepresented franchise and also doesn’t have a bunch of licensing issues like Banjo and could easily be used as a promotion for a new first party game next year (it’ll be five years since the last game in February).

 

[Marcello691]

There was a smash ultimate dlc poll a week ago from the very popular german website "www.ntower.de" with over 420 votes.
Here are the results:

10: Crash Bandicoot & Paper Mario
9: Geno
8: Dixie Kong
7: Isaac
6: Sora
5: Skull Kid
4: Rayman
3: Waluigi
2: Rex & Pyra
1: Banjo & Kazooie

I'm very surprised but also very happy to see Dixie in the top 10.
Here's the link:
https://www.ntower.de/news/57623-sm...s/?s=8b918db03e7fc50f5a0a1ba661008f967bf21f27

 

[KremlingKuthroat19]

There was a smash ultimate dlc poll a week ago from the very popular german website "www.ntower.de" with over 420 votes.
Here are the results:

10: Crash Bandicoot & Paper Mario
9: Geno
8: Dixie Kong
7: Isaac
6: Sora
5: Skull Kid
4: Rayman
3: Waluigi
2: Rex & Pyra
1: Banjo & Kazooie

I'm very surprised but also very happy to see Dixie in the top 10.
Here's the link:
https://www.ntower.de/news/57623-sm...s/?s=8b918db03e7fc50f5a0a1ba661008f967bf21f27

That’s great news! I’m not very surprised honestly bc from the multiple polls I’m seen from Source Gaming and various other places about most wanted newcomers, Dixie Kong always ranked very high.

Although it’s a relatively small sample size with 420 votes, that means Dixie Kong is the fifth most wanted newcomer that’s possible since Waluigi, Skull Kid and Isaac are above her, but are deconfirmed as assist trophies.

 

[Mushroomguy12]

That’s true. Porky is actually a likely pick when you put it that way. I can’t see Adeline though. If we’re getting another Kirby rep it’d definitely be Bandana Waddle Dee.

Honestly I’ve never played the Mother series so I thought Porky was only in Mother 3.

Adeline recently appeared in Kirby Star Allies (along with most of the series characters) so while she's unlikely, she's certainly not more unlikely than Porky.
I'd probably put her way above Porky just due to Kirby being much bigger than Earthbound (and actually being an active series), as well as her actually being playable in a game.

Though perhaps BiTF just gave me a soft spot for her....

 

[Vez]

There was a smash ultimate dlc poll a week ago from the very popular german website "www.ntower.de" with over 420 votes.
Here are the results:

10: Crash Bandicoot & Paper Mario
9: Geno
8: Dixie Kong
7: Isaac
6: Sora
5: Skull Kid
4: Rayman
3: Waluigi
2: Rex & Pyra
1: Banjo & Kazooie

I'm very surprised but also very happy to see Dixie in the top 10.
Here's the link:
https://www.ntower.de/news/57623-sm...s/?s=8b918db03e7fc50f5a0a1ba661008f967bf21f27

Skull Kid's going to become the next Geno isn't he...

 

[OptimisticStrifer]

Skull Kid's going to become the next Geno isn't he...

I mean; I certainly wouldn't mind. But if Geno get's in; I think it's Isaac who will be top dog.

 

[StormC]

I am going to be curious if characters like Isaac, Geno and Skull Kid (characters with no real "future" basically) are still going to be heavily supported when the next Smash rolls into town 5-7 years from now. We're already seeing a lot of the old guard of speculation move on after this game; the younger fans will be the ones moving the needle and I imagine we'll see the requests reflect that.

As long as DK games come out and Dixie is in them, hopefully she stays in the minds of fans. DK Switch needs to be a big title; selling >5 million won't cut it when previous franchises break records with Switch software sales. Dixie hasn't been in a game that's sold more than 3 million since 1996, so she could really use the publicity.

 

[Vez]

I think Isaac will probably remain pretty popular but his popularity will likely dwindle as fans will start to give up hope. Basically what happened to Ridley this time around before he was announced. Geno also dropped off pretty hard with Smash For but K. Rool's announcement in Ultimate reignited hope for the character again, so I wouldn't be surprised if he's mostly gone by the next game.

As long as she appears in another (mainline) Donkey Kong game before the next Smash Bros. I think Dixie will be more popular than she is now but still never reach the heights of K. Rool. She'll always have that "clone" stigma to her and I think any character that has that can only go so far.

 

[ChronoBound]

I am going to be curious if characters like Isaac, Geno and Skull Kid (characters with no real "future" basically) are still going to be heavily supported when the next Smash rolls into town 5-7 years from now. We're already seeing a lot of the old guard of speculation move on after this game; the younger fans will be the ones moving the needle and I imagine we'll see the requests reflect that.

As long as DK games come out and Dixie is in them, hopefully she stays in the minds of fans. DK Switch needs to be a big title; selling >5 million won't cut it when previous franchises break records with Switch software sales. Dixie hasn't been in a game that's sold more than 3 million since 1996, so she could really use the publicity.

I think Isaac will probably remain pretty popular but his popularity will likely dwindle as fans will start to give up hope. Basically what happened to Ridley this time around before he was announced. Geno also dropped off pretty hard with Smash For but K. Rool's announcement in Ultimate reignited hope for the character again, so I wouldn't be surprised if he's mostly gone by the next game.

As long as she appears in another (mainline) Donkey Kong game before the next Smash Bros. I think Dixie will be more popular than she is now but still never reach the heights of K. Rool. She'll always have that "clone" stigma to her and I think any character that has that can only go so far.

I think it is too early to say what is going to happen with whoever is going to be the most wanted newcomers for the next game. Keep in mind Waluigi was never a Top 10 character up until the last two years, and it was Daisy being confirmed (who the character and her fanbase was seen as kind of his rival among his fanbase) alongside his simultaneous de-confirmation that made them go nuclear and viral. The future is unpredictable.

However, with that being said, I have been with the core Smash Bros. fanbase since 2001. One thing that was really touched upon after Brawl's release (that really dawned on people as the pre-Smash 4 period dragged on) was that Brawl basically added in nearly every notable character from a veteran franchise. The "core" initially wanted to see the one-shots that were big during pre-Brawl get added in for the next one (Geno, Masked Man, Midna, Lyn, Micaiah), but as Smash 4 dragged on these characters would depreciate, and would get replaced with a new cast of "core" requests (Palutena, Shulk, Fire Emblem Awakening characters, Bandana Dee, Rosalina). Mega Man, Ridley, K. Rool, Little Mac, Bowser Jr., and Isaac were the only characters that manged to stay within the Top 10 between the end of pre-Brawl and when newcomer unveils started happening for Smash 4.

With the current crop of these characters (Skull Kid, Geno, and Isaac) they are all basically retro characters. They do not just lend themselves to the core end of the spectrum, but the hardcore. Super Mario RPG was 1996, Majora's Mask was 2000, and The Lost Age was 2003. Ridley, K. Rool, and Bowser Jr. all had contemporary appearances to buoy them through the pre-Smash 4 period (Ridley was in Prime 3 and Other M, K. Rool had the Paon DS and Wii games as well as his Super Sluggers appearance, Bowser Jr. had major roles in the NSMB and Galaxy games). Even with Isaac, the GBA Golden Sun games were far less older than they are now, and a new Golden Sun game did end up happening which at least made the series relevant at the beginning of the 2010's. Even with Punch-Out at the height of its hiatus between Super Punch-Out and Punch-Out Wii was 15 years. Super Mario RPG, Majora's Mask, and The Lost Age are all older now than Super Punch-Out was when Punch-Out Wii was released.

There is a much higher sense of entitlement among the core fanbase this time than previous epochs. There is a sense that "my character won the internet popularity contests so he #1 on the deserving list" so you have these people grimacing over the fact Isabelle made it in despite the character basically being an icon among casual Nintendo fans. Heck, you even have some bitter over Simon and Richter getting in over the likes of Shantae and Shovel Knight because he likely did not do as well on the ballot or more "importantly" did not win the internet popularity contests like those characters did so they effectively usurped a slot.

I wrote at the beginning of the pre-Smash 4 period that for Smash Bros.'s roster to be fresh it needed to look to add in new franchises to the series as opposed to simply going down the list of characters from various veteran franchises. I wrote at the time that Ridley, K. Rool, and Super Mario characters were exceptions, but that harping for characters that might never appear again would be stagnant, and that bringing in new universes would be "fresher". The series I suggested at the time were Mega Man, Punch-Out, Golden Sun, Custom Robo, Panel de Pon, Starfy, and maybe Sin & Punishment (I would have also included Animal Crossing but I thought Sakurai had ruled out the series being given a playable character with his statement on the series being too pacifist for a playable character). However, most of those franchises ended up dying during the pre-Smash 4 interim or having installments that bombed in sales with the exception of Punch-Out Wii (which was a big seller among the Western Wii userbase).

Funny enough, that was actually the direction Sakurai took with Smash 4. Far more new franchises were added to Smash 4 than there was with Melee, Brawl, and even Smash 64 (for the last one its if DLC is included). Among Nintendo franchises, Animal Crossing, Wii Fit, Punch-Out, Mii, and Xenoblade were all given playable representation (as well as the retro line of NES light gun shooters through Duck Hunt). Most of the third-party franchises added in were among those most iconic to gaming as a whole (Mega Man, Pac-Man, Street Fighter, Final Fantasy), as well as Bayonetta for another third-party universe added to the series. Only Super Mario, Pokemon, Kid Icarus, and Pokemon were given additional fighters among the franchises that already had playable characters in Brawl. For Super Mario, Fire Emblem, and Kid Icarus they had titles that were absolutely integral (the Galaxy games were among the highest acclaimed 3D platformers of all time and New Super Mario Bros. Wii was the second highest home console game of all time in Japan, Awakening ended up being the highest selling Fire Emblem game, Kid Icarus was a major 3DS title developed by Sakurai himself). Pokemon got a newcomer due to the Pokemon Company.

Smash 4's roster went in a direction that most speculators at the beginning of the pre-Smash 4 period did not see happening. The funny thing is that the same happened with Ultimate. Back in March, I think very few saw Ridley coming, and no one thought we would be getting another title that would give us more than three clone newcomers or every single veteran ever coming back. Even with Brawl and Melee the rosters took directions that took the core by surprise. Brawl added in guest fighters, and many of Melee's picks were genuine surprises (the clones, Fire Emblem, Mr. Game & Watch, Ice Climbers).

We have little idea with what will happen with the next game.

I do agree that much of the "old guard" is going to move on after this title. Ultimate being unveiled only two years after the conclusion of Smash 4's DLC was what kept much of the pre-Smash 4 guys around for another cycle in my opinion.

However, it truly says something when the characters people are angry at Sakurai for not including at this point are either effectively retro characters and a Super Mario character that is spinoff exclusive. It personally seems odd to me. I think the Smash Bros. series might need another gap of time similar to Melee to Brawl or Brawl to Smash 4 to replenish the pool of Smash calibur Nintendo character. Bandana Dee shows that integral re-occurring characters can still be introduced for very long running franchises so it would not just be new franchises that have been created (such as ARMS) or freshest faces for series with cycling "faces" like Pokemon, Fire Emblem, or Xenoblade.

What I just said might prove to be extremely unpopular with the fanbase, and it could very well be the case that the retro characters and Waluigi are what dominate the Top 5 even well into the 2020's. Even more unpopular, I think Ultimate might very well be the pinnacle of a character and stage driven Smash Bros. title, and I do not think the next title will surpass Ultimate in the roster count and possibly stage count. It took a very "special" set of circumstances for Ultimate to become "ultimate".

It might very well be that the direction for the next games looks to expanding Smash Bros. as a whole and adding in lots of extra modes to play and experience the game. Those who complained about modes from Brawl/Smash 4 missing do not realize that you cannot get something for nothing or that development time and resources are finite. It could be that the next game goes for a bunch of bells and whistles in exchange for the roster and stage count.

That is only a guess though. I can easily be wrong (I definitely did not see the Switch iteration of Smash Bros. taking the direction it did for example).

However, it will be interesting to see how popular requests go forward. I think for the next generation Dixie Kong is a precious jewel that they should cherish. She has a legacy going back to the 1990s and even into the 2010s she has made major role in masterpieces. She a titan in the shadows as far as I am concerned.

 

[thirsty-pocket]

I've been binging Donkey Kong games lately. I want to finally finish DK64 before Smash Ultimate comes out, but I also picked up the Switch port of Tropical Freeze after my Wii U broke, and have also been playing that... and also watching the cartoon series since it's on youtube...it's a guilty pleasure...

And the thought came to me that I really want another game in which Diddy and Dixie are the stars. When I was a kid, I was kind of annoyed that DK wasn't in the sequel to my favorite SNES game, so I didn't ask my parents to get it for me. Well after revisiting the game years later I certainly feel foolish. ( Not to mention Diddy Kong Racing ended up being better than Mario Kart 64 imo. ) Diddy and Dixie are such a cool team, and now that DK has been in the spotlight for every game for several years now, I actually wouldn't mind him being out of the spotlight again... Besides that, im annoyed nowdays that Diddy, Dixie, and even Cranky seem to be more like power ups for Donkey Kong than they are supporting characters.

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

I just 102% DKC2 and the last K Rool fight was a lot easier than what I remember as a kid. It's just like 4 waves of bullets that are super easy to dodge as Dixie.

I thought I remembered like waves of different colored cloud stuff from his gun mixed with a barrage of cannonballs

 

[KremlingKuthroat19]

I think it is too early to say what is going to happen with whoever is going to be the most wanted newcomers for the next game. Keep in mind Waluigi was never a Top 10 character up until the last two years, and it was Daisy being confirmed (who the character and her fanbase was seen as kind of his rival among his fanbase) alongside his simultaneous de-confirmation that made them go nuclear and viral. The future is unpredictable.

However, with that being said, I have been with the core Smash Bros. fanbase since 2001. One thing that was really touched upon after Brawl's release (that really dawned on people as the pre-Smash 4 period dragged on) was that Brawl basically added in nearly every notable character from a veteran franchise. The "core" initially wanted to see the one-shots that were big during pre-Brawl get added in for the next one (Geno, Masked Man, Midna, Lyn, Micaiah), but as Smash 4 dragged on these characters would depreciate, and would get replaced with a new cast of "core" requests (Palutena, Shulk, Fire Emblem Awakening characters, Bandana Dee, Rosalina). Mega Man, Ridley, K. Rool, Little Mac, Bowser Jr., and Isaac were the only characters that manged to stay within the Top 10 between the end of pre-Brawl and when newcomer unveils started happening for Smash 4.

With the current crop of these characters (Skull Kid, Geno, and Isaac) they are all basically retro characters. They do not just lend themselves to the core end of the spectrum, but the hardcore. Super Mario RPG was 1996, Majora's Mask was 2000, and The Lost Age was 2003. Ridley, K. Rool, and Bowser Jr. all had contemporary appearances to buoy them through the pre-Smash 4 period (Ridley was in Prime 3 and Other M, K. Rool had the Paon DS and Wii games as well as his Super Sluggers appearance, Bowser Jr. had major roles in the NSMB and Galaxy games). Even with Isaac, the GBA Golden Sun games were far less older than they are now, and a new Golden Sun game did end up happening which at least made the series relevant at the beginning of the 2010's. Even with Punch-Out at the height of its hiatus between Super Punch-Out and Punch-Out Wii was 15 years. Super Mario RPG, Majora's Mask, and The Lost Age are all older now than Super Punch-Out was when Punch-Out Wii was released.

There is a much higher sense of entitlement among the core fanbase this time than previous epochs. There is a sense that "my character won the internet popularity contests so he #1 on the deserving list" so you have these people grimacing over the fact Isabelle made it in despite the character basically being an icon among casual Nintendo fans. Heck, you even have some bitter over Simon and Richter getting in over the likes of Shantae and Shovel Knight because he likely did not do as well on the ballot or more "importantly" did not win the internet popularity contests like those characters did so they effectively usurped a slot.

I wrote at the beginning of the pre-Smash 4 period that for Smash Bros.'s roster to be fresh it needed to look to add in new franchises to the series as opposed to simply going down the list of characters from various veteran franchises. I wrote at the time that Ridley, K. Rool, and Super Mario characters were exceptions, but that harping for characters that might never appear again would be stagnant, and that bringing in new universes would be "fresher". The series I suggested at the time were Mega Man, Punch-Out, Golden Sun, Custom Robo, Panel de Pon, Starfy, and maybe Sin & Punishment (I would have also included Animal Crossing but I thought Sakurai had ruled out the series being given a playable character with his statement on the series being too pacifist for a playable character). However, most of those franchises ended up dying during the pre-Smash 4 interim or having installments that bombed in sales with the exception of Punch-Out Wii (which was a big seller among the Western Wii userbase).

Funny enough, that was actually the direction Sakurai took with Smash 4. Far more new franchises were added to Smash 4 than there was with Melee, Brawl, and even Smash 64 (for the last one its if DLC is included). Among Nintendo franchises, Animal Crossing, Wii Fit, Punch-Out, Mii, and Xenoblade were all given playable representation (as well as the retro line of NES light gun shooters through Duck Hunt). Most of the third-party franchises added in were among those most iconic to gaming as a whole (Mega Man, Pac-Man, Street Fighter, Final Fantasy), as well as Bayonetta for another third-party universe added to the series. Only Super Mario, Pokemon, Kid Icarus, and Pokemon were given additional fighters among the franchises that already had playable characters in Brawl. For Super Mario, Fire Emblem, and Kid Icarus they had titles that were absolutely integral (the Galaxy games were among the highest acclaimed 3D platformers of all time and New Super Mario Bros. Wii was the second highest home console game of all time in Japan, Awakening ended up being the highest selling Fire Emblem game, Kid Icarus was a major 3DS title developed by Sakurai himself). Pokemon got a newcomer due to the Pokemon Company.

Smash 4's roster went in a direction that most speculators at the beginning of the pre-Smash 4 period did not see happening. The funny thing is that the same happened with Ultimate. Back in March, I think very few saw Ridley coming, and no one thought we would be getting another title that would give us more than three clone newcomers or every single veteran ever coming back. Even with Brawl and Melee the rosters took directions that took the core by surprise. Brawl added in guest fighters, and many of Melee's picks were genuine surprises (the clones, Fire Emblem, Mr. Game & Watch, Ice Climbers).

We have little idea with what will happen with the next game.

I do agree that much of the "old guard" is going to move on after this title. Ultimate being unveiled only two years after the conclusion of Smash 4's DLC was what kept much of the pre-Smash 4 guys around for another cycle in my opinion.

However, it truly says something when the characters people are angry at Sakurai for not including at this point are either effectively retro characters and a Super Mario character that is spinoff exclusive. It personally seems odd to me. I think the Smash Bros. series might need another gap of time similar to Melee to Brawl or Brawl to Smash 4 to replenish the pool of Smash calibur Nintendo character. Bandana Dee shows that integral re-occurring characters can still be introduced for very long running franchises so it would not just be new franchises that have been created (such as ARMS) or freshest faces for series with cycling "faces" like Pokemon, Fire Emblem, or Xenoblade.

What I just said might prove to be extremely unpopular with the fanbase, and it could very well be the case that the retro characters and Waluigi are what dominate the Top 5 even well into the 2020's. Even more unpopular, I think Ultimate might very well be the pinnacle of a character and stage driven Smash Bros. title, and I do not think the next title will surpass Ultimate in the roster count and possibly stage count. It took a very "special" set of circumstances for Ultimate to become "ultimate".

It might very well be that the direction for the next games looks to expanding Smash Bros. as a whole and adding in lots of extra modes to play and experience the game. Those who complained about modes from Brawl/Smash 4 missing do not realize that you cannot get something for nothing or that development time and resources are finite. It could be that the next game goes for a bunch of bells and whistles in exchange for the roster and stage count.

That is only a guess though. I can easily be wrong (I definitely did not see the Switch iteration of Smash Bros. taking the direction it did for example).

However, it will be interesting to see how popular requests go forward. I think for the next generation Dixie Kong is a precious jewel that they should cherish. She has a legacy going back to the 1990s and even into the 2010s she has made major role in masterpieces. She a titan in the shadows as far as I am concerned.

Interesting post. When the next Smash comes out in about 7-10 years I think Nintendo should include every first party character ever included in the roster (including Bayonetta since the games are published by Nintendo and exclusive for the foreseeable future) and go crazy with a bunch of game modes and even try to add a real story mode with cutscenes and voice acting.

I’d like to see a really robust create a character mode too on the level of Soul Calibur and allow people to share their creations online. That way people could play with characters who may never make it like Geno and so on.

Any returning or new third party characters could be DLC and the newcomers in the base roster could all be first-party characters.

I don’t dislike third parties by any means. I actually love their inclusion. But the next Smash could do a really good job of rounding out the character rosters for first party IPs. F-Zero, Mother, DK, Star Fox, Xenoblade, Bayonetta, Punch-Out!!, Splatoon, Kirby, Animal Crossing, WarioWare Yoshi, Metroid and Pikmin could each use a new rep and balancing Nintendo’s character representation would make me really happy

It’d be awesome if each of these franchises got a new rep in the base roster of the next game or if Nintendo added one first party character from all of their active franchises so that everyone would be happy. The most popular pick from each franchise would be dope.

 

[Sabertooth]

Steve Mayles liked my latest post on the Twitter.

That's progress!

 

[OptimisticStrifer]

Interesting post. When the next Smash comes out in about 7-10 years I think Nintendo should include every first party character ever included in the roster (including Bayonetta since the games are published by Nintendo and exclusive for the foreseeable future) and go crazy with a bunch of game modes and even try to add a real story mode with cutscenes and voice acting.

I’d like to see a really robust create a character mode too on the level of Soul Calibur and allow people to share their creations online. That way people could play with characters who may never make it like Geno and so on.

Any returning or new third party characters could be DLC and the newcomers in the base roster could all be first-party characters.

I don’t dislike third parties by any means. I actually love their inclusion. But the next Smash could do a really good job of rounding out the character rosters for first party IPs. F-Zero, Mother, DK, Star Fox, Xenoblade, Bayonetta, Punch-Out!!, Splatoon, Kirby, Animal Crossing, WarioWare Yoshi, Metroid and Pikmin could each use a new rep and balancing Nintendo’s character representation would make me really happy

It’d be awesome if each of these franchises got a new rep in the base roster of the next game or if Nintendo added one first party character from all of their active franchises so that everyone would be happy. The most popular pick from each franchise would be dope.

I'd say if we're purging most 3rd parties; at least let Sonic stick around too. He's BASICALLY Nintendo tbh. Megaman and Simon would also be nice, as they are very Nintendo attached.

 

[InASnowBoundLand]

Prediction time: I bet Dixie will get her kneepads like K. Rool got his golden belly. Dixie's most iconic look is with the kneepads.
Wrong or right, I will eat a Corrin amiibo either way.

 

[Sabertooth]

I feel that the 3rd party characters are very mixed on whether they have ties to Nintendo or not. Sonic, Mega Man, Simon, and Bayonetta, I would say are 100% clear. No one would know who these characters are if not for Nintendo. Also, I'm fine with Richter sticking around since he's an echo who starred in a Nintendo game.

Where it gets messier is with Snake, Pac-Man, Ryu + Ken, and especially Cloud. You can make a case for the first four, but I've never liked Cloud's inclusion. Get him out of here--he's only making it easier for people to suggest characters once thought ridiculous like Master Chief. I don't like this "celebration of gaming history" BS that Smash is trying to become--this is a Nintendo game, end of story.

 

[Ultinarok]

Alo everyone, sorry for my absence. Had a ton of stuff going on and haven't been on the web much as of late. But thought I'd check in on my favorite thread. How are we all? Still feeling good about DLC Dixie? Because I'm still hopeful actually.

Ultimate's final build gameplay looks outstanding from the battles I've seen. Everything is so fluid and crisp, and Diddy is looking pretty sharp. The animations in this game are so damn pristine that I really want to see Dixie animated in this fashion too.

I think its quite likely that Nintendo placed Dixie on their potential character picks due to DKC being one of their biggest franchises and her recent revival, but featuring her in a new game would solidify her chances even more since she could serve as an advertisement character. Its hard to read what Nintendo would do since its a company of many individuals with many ideas and differing opinions. I wonder what kind of compromise they would come to when selecting the DLC choices.

 

[KremlingKuthroat19]

I'd say if we're purging most 3rd parties; at least let Sonic stick around too. He's BASICALLY Nintendo tbh. Megaman and Simon would also be nice, as they are very Nintendo attached.

Yeah. Honestly I don’t think we should have any cuts ever again if possible. Imo it’s worse for a character to get cut then deconfirmed. All characters should come back for the next game and I agree that those third-party reps are the priorities. The main point I’m making is that it’d be amazing if every first party series finally got proper representation

 

[Mariomaniac45213]

Interesting post. When the next Smash comes out in about 7-10 years I think Nintendo should include every first party character ever included in the roster (including Bayonetta since the games are published by Nintendo and exclusive for the foreseeable future) and go crazy with a bunch of game modes and even try to add a real story mode with cutscenes and voice acting.

I’d like to see a really robust create a character mode too on the level of Soul Calibur and allow people to share their creations online. That way people could play with characters who may never make it like Geno and so on.

Any returning or new third party characters could be DLC and the newcomers in the base roster could all be first-party characters.

I don’t dislike third parties by any means. I actually love their inclusion. But the next Smash could do a really good job of rounding out the character rosters for first party IPs. F-Zero, Mother, DK, Star Fox, Xenoblade, Bayonetta, Punch-Out!!, Splatoon, Kirby, Animal Crossing, WarioWare Yoshi, Metroid and Pikmin could each use a new rep and balancing Nintendo’s character representation would make me really happy

It’d be awesome if each of these franchises got a new rep in the base roster of the next game or if Nintendo added one first party character from all of their active franchises so that everyone would be happy. The most popular pick from each franchise would be dope.

As someone who prefers no 3rd parties that sounds awesome to me. Problem is I don't see myself sticking around until the next Smash comes out. I already feel my love for gaming slipping away by the day. I doubt I'll still be gaming by the time Smash 6 rolls around in who knows how many years. That's why I REALLY want Dixie as DLC now. Not only do I want to play as her in Smash but I'd love to own a Dixie Kong amiibo. Cause even though I'll probably be done with gaming after the Switch era is over I'll definitely be keeping all my amiibo as they are cool figurines of all my favorite Nintendo characters.

 

[KremlingKuthroat19]

As someone who prefers no 3rd parties that sounds awesome to me. Problem is I don't see myself sticking around until the next Smash comes out. I already feel my love for gaming slipping away by the day. I doubt I'll still be gaming by the time Smash 6 rolls around in who knows how many years. That's why I REALLY want Dixie as DLC now. Not only do I want to play as her in Smash but I'd love to own a Dixie Kong amiibo. Cause even though I'll probably be done with gaming after the Switch era is over I'll definitely be keeping all my amiibo as they are cool figurines of all my favorite Nintendo characters.

I understand dude. I’m not as into gaming as I used to be too. In fact I play Nintendo exclusively now bc I don’t have the time or interest for other games so I prioritize Nintendo.

When I was a kid I used to all three consoles, but I primarily play single player and local multiplayer games now. Never been a fan of online gaming so the other consoles don’t appeal to me very much.

 

[StormC]

I feel that the 3rd party characters are very mixed on whether they have ties to Nintendo or not. Sonic, Mega Man, Simon, and Bayonetta, I would say are 100% clear. No one would know who these characters are if not for Nintendo. Also, I'm fine with Richter sticking around since he's an echo who starred in a Nintendo game.

Where it gets messier is with Snake, Pac-Man, Ryu + Ken, and especially Cloud. You can make a case for the first four, but I've never liked Cloud's inclusion. Get him out of here--he's only making it easier for people to suggest characters once thought ridiculous like Master Chief. I don't like this "celebration of gaming history" BS that Smash is trying to become--this is a Nintendo game, end of story.

Cloud was chosen because he was the most popular Final Fantasy character, which is a series that got its start on the NES. Considering that Final Fantasy VII is finally coming to a Nintendo console, I have a hard time seeing a good reason for him to be cut other than avoiding Square-Enix corporate drama. Not sure what makes his inclusion wrong but Snake's okay; Metal Gear was first released on the MSX before a cut-down port was put on the NES.

Also, "no one would know who [Bayonetta is] if not for Nintendo," not sure what gives you this impression, Bayonetta 1 wasn't exactly a niche title. It sold over a million units within its first year on non-Nintendo consoles and had a strong cult following with critical acclaim. I'm not exactly chomping at the bit for more third parties, but the reasoning here seems faulty to me.

 

[Luigi player]

Here’s a thought: if Dixie made it as a DLC character, what’d you want the stage to be? Obviously we have too many jungle stages. Do you think we should get a stage from DKC2 or DKC3 or Tropical Freeze? Or if we got Dixie as a promotional character for a new DK game, then we could get a stage based on the next game. Another possibility is we can get the Wii U stage back as DLC. We could also get a stage for K. Rool like Gangplank Galleon.

Here are my ideas for a potential stage:
-Potential new DK game stage
-Jungle Hijinx (Wii U)
-Rumble Falls (Brawl) (no thanks)
-Gangplank Galleon (stage for King K. Rool)
-Tropical Freeze stage (Windmill Hills, Grasslsnd Groove, Scorch N Torch, Frosty Fruits, Seashore War etc.)
-DKC2 stage (Crocodile Isle, Krazy Kremland, Bramble Scramble, Hornet Hole etc.)
-DKC3 stage (a stage of the overworld would be cool. Any other ideas?)
-Diddy Kong Racing stage (would be an awesome inclusion if Banjo ended up in the game)
-Mine cart stage (moving stage like Big Blue)

I feel like the best chance at a new stage would be either a stage based on a potential new game, Gangplank Galleon for King K. Rool or a mine cart stage. Mine carts are one of the most iconic aspects of DKC and it’d be a great tie in for the theme park ride

I'd like such a stage:

- moving stage that goes to different locations, locations are:
* DK Isle
* Bramble level
* Hornet Hole
* some frozen jungle stage for Tropical Freeze representation

The music would change each time it gets to a new location..

Man, that would be so amazing! Of course I would like it even more if each of them would be seperate (and I do want Gangplank Galleon, the Crocodile "Jet", and Scorch N Torch as well), but there's a higher chance if it'd exist like that I think.

I think this would be a nice representation of DK stages and, together with Dixie Kong, would be some neat DLC that would finish up the DK franchise a bit more (although not having a K. Rool stage doesn't feel right..).

 

[Sabertooth]

Bayonetta selling 1.83 million...I guess that's okay. I'm sure it had an avid fanbase, but it would still be dead in the water nowadays if it weren't for Nintendo who financed the sequel and now Bayonetta 3. All that being considered I think she can be treated as an honorary Nintendo character.

Yes, FFVII is coming to the Switch now, but a twenty-year old port is the bare minimum as far as I'm concerned. Yes, I'm happy that we'll be able to experience Cloud's adventure on a Nintendo console finally, but that whole connection of "Cloud being the biggest FF character and FF starting on the NES"...I don't really buy that. Every FF game is like a whole new series, some of which get their own sequels. Just because someone played the first three Final Fantasies on the NES and SNES when they were a kid doesn't necessarily mean they'll know who Cloud is. He belongs in PlayStation All-Stars, which could've been a great competitor to Smash had they not given up on it.

 

[StormC]

Yes, FFVII is coming to the Switch now, but a twenty-year old port is the bare minimum as far as I'm concerned. Yes, I'm happy that we'll be able to experience Cloud's adventure on a Nintendo console finally, but that whole connection of "Cloud being the biggest FF character and FF starting on the NES"...I don't really buy that. Every FF game is like a whole new series, some of which get their own sequels. Just because someone played the first three Final Fantasies on the NES and SNES when they were a kid doesn't necessarily mean they'll know who Cloud is. He belongs in PlayStation All-Stars, which could've been a great competitor to Smash had they not given up on it.

Personally, I've always felt that if they were going to add a Final Fantasy character, it should be Cloud. He's globally recognizable and an enduring icon; the spiky yellow hair and Buster Sword are famous even to people who haven't played his game. People want to see third party characters because of things like Mario vs. Sonic, or Link vs. Cloud; virtually nobody but diehard nerds like us would get excited about Black Mage or anything like that.

For a point of reference, my 30 year old brother who's never played a Final Fantasy game, and hasn't really played many video games at all in the last 20 years, watched the Everyone Is Here trailer and upon seeing Cloud remarked "is that the Final Fantasy guy?" Without even knowing his name, he could tell you who the character was. That's the kind of stuff people look for in third party characters, and I think Cloud is fine as long as Snake is given the okay. Personally, having a strong connection to Nintendo isn't a big deal to me (at least anymore), but rather just that they're a very big deal and warranted. I'm fine with the current informal rule of 2 third party newcomers in the base game (or just 1 for Ultimate, since there were only a few newcomers in total). It's when DLC starts stuffing itself with third parties that it starts to wear on me... but we'll see how it turns out this game.

As someone who spent most of the Brawl-era staunchly anti-third party, I've learned to accept that they will keep coming in. Best to just make do.

 

[SeashoreWar]

We did catch the attention of Steve Mayles today with the Dixie in Mario Tennis post so that's pretty cool!

Nevermind it was already posted

 

[GoodGrief741]

To throw my five cents into the ring (hey, mangled saying!) while I love the fact that Smash is now a celebration of all gaming, I think ultimately it’s a slippery slope with no end and which might end up being detrimental to the product. There are just so many videogame franchises that left an impact in gaming history. Hell, a lot of people even want characters from franchises that didn’t (and that’s okay, I mean if there’s a ballot why not vote). At the end of the day, I think of left Nintendo-only it would give Smash more breathing room for variety in selections.

It could be said that there are a couple of kinds of newcomers. There’s the Nintendo All-Star, the character so obviously important to an important Nintendo franchise that it just makes sense for them to be in (ex: Ridley, Diddy, Mewtwo). Then there’s the relevant picks, which are characters that make it in because they’re relevant and at least sorta popular (Robin, Rosalina, Greninja). There’s the retro character (Pit, Little Mac, Ice Climbers), and the hardware character (G&W, ROB, Duck Hunt). There are also advertising characters (Corrin, Incineroar and Greninja probably). There’s third-party characters, which usually overlap either with the All-Star category (Snake, Cloud), the retro category (Mega Man, Pac-Man), or both.

And there’s fan-wanted characters, which can basically be anyone of those.

Now, the argument could be made that, by cutting third-parties, you cut a class, and therefore allow more room for characters in the other categories. Plus it also saves a lot of resources.

Looking back, I think I might have rambled and it might not make any sense, but I hope the gist is conveyed well.