**Diddy Kong [Old] General Match-Ups**

[bludhoundz]

I think Le_THieN covered it pretty **** well.

There's one thing I'm curious about though: does hitting D3's Waddle Dees regenerate your moveset? If so you can use dtilts while holding a banana to 1. get them out of the way and open up glide tosses and 2. regain full knockback on your kill moves. If not #2 does not work.. hey the first part is still useful - if he spams them I think you might be able to dtilt -> glidetoss quickly enough to reach him, though it would depend on the distance. If they regen your moves, D3 spamming them is just a bad idea though, which clears up your banana offense a lot.

 

[Fogo]

Yeah, hitting them does refresh your moveset

 

[Mmac]

and Yoshi from the bottom end (Only because I want to see Mmac post in here again <3)

Yay! I'm loved ^_^

This matchup is a weird one. Yoshi has more range, and a Chaingrab. Diddy has a great close combat pressure game and Bananas! The more I play this matchup, the better I feel I do. The main thing I feel is about the Banana's. Whoever controls the Bananas, controls the game (Pretty much true with almost everyone else). One thing I learn is that Nair is great for picking up Bananas! It picks them up from a good length away, even when thrown, and actually makes a safe approach if Diddy is carrying one. It's also good for picking up the ground ones too.

But I say it's about even though. Diddy still causes me problems

 

[Le_THieN]

There's one thing I'm curious about though: does hitting D3's Waddle Dees regenerate your moveset? If so you can use dtilts while holding a banana to 1. get them out of the way and open up glide tosses and 2. regain full knockback on your kill moves. If not #2 does not work.. hey the first part is still useful - if he spams them I think you might be able to dtilt -> glidetoss quickly enough to reach him, though it would depend on the distance. If they regen your moves, D3 spamming them is just a bad idea though, which clears up your banana offense a lot.

It's not a bad idea, although with the way my internal decay tracker functions I would probably prefer to just nail Dedede with the moves anyway. I played two Dededes in the tournament I was in last weekend, and my immediate solutions to the wall of Waddle Dees was to jump-throw bananas or run past them. If you're cornered due to mismanagement of your KO moves, this might be your ticket out, although you might have to mix it up with F-tilt because I recall it taking a couple of hits to get rid of Waddle Dees in general.

 

[Kiwikomix]

Keep in mind that Yoshi also cannot glide toss. Not a huge thing, but it doesn't let him use the naners as effectively as Diddy (or any other character, I guess).

 

[Nitrix]

Yoshi


If the Diddy can play a smart close-up ground game, then Yoshi will have trouble. Yoshi gets really annoying when the battle goes from close-up ground game to the distance where Yoshi can hit you but you can't hit him. With alot of attacks Yoshi outranges Diddy on the ground. This is what Diddy must avoid. Diddy must use have very careful banana control in order to force close-up fighting, and to avoid the chaingrab. If Diddy can keep Yoshi close, then the damage should rack-up and the Yoshi won't stay alive for long.

 

[NinjaLink]

Keep in mind that Yoshi also cannot glide toss. Not a huge thing, but it doesn't let him use the naners as effectively as Diddy (or any other character, I guess).

Yoshi has DJC toss which is like glidetossing......

 

[ChronoPenguin]

So yoshi wins in the air and has a CG.

Diddy wins on the ground and has Bananas.

This sounds neutral to me but thats just me >.> not going to indepth here but
If Diddy makes a mistake he gets grabbed, if they fight in the air yoshi should win.
If Diddy makes no mistakes, he forces yoshi into the air.

Diddy can nullify yoshi CG'ing him with a banana...yoshi can guarantee he CG's with a banana.

 

[bludhoundz]

Diddy also has a CG, and it is more effective against Yoshi than other characters, due to the fact that he slides a lot.

Also I don't know if Yoshi wins in the air.. but he's of much heavier weight and can KO a lot easier, which evens the match up a lot.

I'd say its fairly equal.

 

[pastaboy]

i havnt tried it but its just a theory, but if diddy had a banana in his hand and when yoshi releases him after the cg, cant diddy drop the banana by pressing z and stopping the cg. lol i dunno if this is even remotly plausable, just a thought :S

 

[Luigi player]

I hate Yoshi's dash attack... it picks up the bananas pretty good =/ so Diddy should watch out for that and keep controlling them.

Yoshi is pretty gimpable with the Diddy hump/footstooling...

Well I'd say it is in Diddys favour... but not by that much. Probably 60:40 or something.

 

[Mmac]

i havnt tried it but its just a theory, but if diddy had a banana in his hand and when yoshi releases him after the cg, cant diddy drop the banana by pressing z and stopping the cg. lol i dunno if this is even remotly plausable, just a thought :S

Nope, Diddy doesn't gain recontrol... ever. Yoshi should always be able to grab Diddy before he recovers from the Grab Release

Yoshi is pretty gimpable with the Diddy hump/footstooling...

FOOTSTOOLING DOESN'T WORK! I can't stress that enough. Also Humping suffers from the same problem as Footstooling as Yoshi can easily Airdodge right past it

 

[Luigi player]

Yeah that's true he can just airdodge and that's annoying, but that doesn't mean it's impossible to do it...

 

[ChronoPenguin]

Yeah that's true he can just airdodge and that's annoying, but that doesn't mean it's impossible to do it...

Think of the level of play the two characters should be at.

The yoshi player would in theory DJAD almost everything, and the Diddy would try to punish the delay after the air dodge and if yoshi goes close enough after the jump so that air dodging would cause him to die (thus he won't air dodge) he wont be footstooled and if he is an egg toss snaps him out of it.

 

[Luigi player]

If Yoshi is high enough Diddy can just wait for the air dodge to end and throw up a banana which will probably hit him and then fair him then Yoshi is away from the stage again and without a DJ... well, that's probably really situational and the Yoshi will probably not air dodge if Diddy is on the ground .. >_>

Anyway, I doubt Yoshi will always come from above, so if Yoshi is below the edge there's a chance he will get footstooled... of course he can air dodge, but I really doubt he will ALWAYS avoid it... Diddy could also mix it up and surprise Yoshi with some aerials after Yoshis airdodge for some damage.


I know it's hard to gimp Yoshi, but it happens every now and then that you'll get in a footstool or maybe a overB...

 

[Vyse]

I've updated the OP with a Falco writeup by Le_THieN.

EDIT: I've also now updated this with a Dedede Writeup which is basically a copy and paste of Le_THieN's post a page or two back.

I'll do a Yoshi write up soon.

 

[ADHD]

Sounds like this matchup is neutral but in yoshi's advantage barely

That chaingrab is pretty scary and yoshi's grab game is so good

 

[chimpact]

If you place a banana on the stage, Yoshi can't CG you. And I think Yoshi can Bthrow CG Diddy til 40%. I CG'd and got CG'd by a yoshi til 40% and then I was able to DI out, but Im not sure.

 

[Vyse]

Time to discuss: Weegee (Luigi)

Here's another matchup I really can't help with since I have never really played a good Luigi =_=

 

[pastaboy]

hmm im tired but il just say sumthing quick. a luigi player will wanna steal ur bananas more then anyone else, which sux if they know how to bait properly. think b4 u glide toss, dont just randomly be throwing them everywhere. luigi players tend to walk so they r more likly to pik a banana that is on the ground

 

[ADHD]

Luigi sucks at approaching so sometimes they will try and abuse the tornado so you have to watch out for that if theres not a naner in his way flying over to you. Keep tossing the bananas and don't be intimidated by his massive sliding distance and also don't be afraid to spike him, it's not hard. You want to stay grounded also, and if they keep hopping like some luigis do then abuse peanuts and the monkey flip.

 

[pastaboy]

hmm im gunna be a bit iffy on the easy to spike thing, just because when he uses his tornado to recover verticaly it has lots of priority and it is rly fast, so u will have to make sure u dont get hit by it(obviously). but spiking him out of his shroyuken is easy to do if you r below the ledge.

 

[Player-1]

Luigi sucks at approaching so sometimes they will try and abuse the tornado so you have to watch out for that if theres not a naner in his way flying over to you. Keep tossing the bananas and don't be intimidated by his massive sliding distance and also don't be afraid to spike him, it's not hard. You want to stay grounded also, and if they keep hopping like some luigis do then abuse peanuts and the monkey flip.

Luigi doesn't suck at approaching...Dair to nair or bair or dair to anything really ***** and he can DI out of the shield grab. He also isn't at that easy to spike either, unless they're using their tornado to recover every time. Good Luigis will use a variety of recoveries to not make it predictable. His sliding can usually be overcome by dash attacks to Fairs rather than smashs, but if you're close enough you can glide toss to Fsmash. Side b is a pretty good approach on Luigi IDK why but it really is for me.

 

[KC18]

if you can control luigi's air game, he'll suffer a lot,( lol guess i didn't really need to point that out) and with that it would limit him to his ground game, which in my opinion isn't that reliable, even though he has multiple options on the ground. but compared to diddy's ground game luigi wouldn't be able to keep up, banana **** is too much, and diddy's attacks are pretty well rounded for speed and damage. dash attack works well especially with it's follow up options like up-tilt and such. and i agree with player-1 about the side-b approach, dunno why either but it ***** me. down smash is pretty quick, and down-tilt spam. and a few other moves are great that take out luigi's ground game.

 

[pastaboy]

on a side not to wut kc said, dont risk punishing a missfire... it hurts

 

[KC18]

ye jarred good call, kill's so early, and so much hitstun too

 

[DUB]

I played against a Luigi in a doubles tournament a week ago. I know its doubles but heres a few things I found out, and forgive me if this seems redundant.

His air game is amazing. The nairs are brutal. His bair stays out for longer then you would think. Tornado recovery is pretty hard to catch. Rocketbarrel spike him when he uses Side+B for style points ( dair also if ya want :/ ).

I found myself using the popgun more then usual in this matchup to slow up that aerial momentum. After a while I would switch to some Popgun Cancelled Glide Tosses to keep him on the ground because IMO, the match is about keeping Weegee on the ground and close.

EDIT: Another thing I forgot. If you are on the edge w/out invincibility frames. GET OFF! Weegees down-smash will stage spike you off it. And watch out for that jab cancel Up+B.

 

[Vyse]

Tell me what you guys think.

Week #8
Yoshi

Match-Up Estimate - 5 : 5
[This match-up is relatively neutral]

Yoshi's Advantages:

• Greater Range on Diddy Kong, which can make close range play difficult at times.
• Yoshi has a chain grab on Diddy Kong (As well as most other characters) until roughly 40%
• Yoshi's Double Jump + Air Dodge makes him much less gimpable

Diddy's Advantages:

• Diddy's Chain Grab is effective against Yoshi
• Despite being out ranged, with bananas in hand, Diddy can apply a close ranged pressure game
• Quicker Tilts and Smashers at his disposal can quickly apply pressure and force Yoshi to back off.

Specific Match-Up Points:

• Diddy's main problem in this matchup is that most of his attacks (except continuous jab and possibly bair) get outranged. This problem can be mostly eliminated by running a close range game, something that Diddy isn't too bad at between his jab, tilts and grab.
• Yoshi can't Glide Toss. However, he has DJC toss which is like Glide Tossing. So when Yoshi has a banana in hand, expect something of the sort.
• If Yoshi can't deal with bananas or doesn't have the patience to work past them, Diddy has won. Since it is an even match up, it becomes less about characters and more about player mentality.
• Diddy has a harder time edgeguarding Yoshi, and requires a lot of reading, fakeouts and punishing
• Watch out for the sliding up smash.
• Yoshi's chain grab works better against Diddy than a lot of other characters, so be careful.

Strategic Notes:

• Always have a banana behind you so that Yoshi trips while grabbing.
• The way to control this match is by playing an aggressive, close range game using the bananas as much as possible.
• Save those smashes, and nail Yoshi with them at KO percents, this is because Yoshi's recovery is difficult to gimp

 

[pastaboy]

very nice vyse,extremly well organized.

hmm il add some mental advice for the luigi discusion.
If you are ahead in stocks and you feel you have a healthy lead, dont get cocky. Luigi is a clutch character and he is one of the few characters that can change around a match in around 6 seconds and ul be saying wtf X10. The reason being, there r 2 ways a match can change instantly while fighting luigi. 1 if you let your guard down and get to "cocky" then you might get combo'd to ****. ( http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=coRmDjOrYT8 ) the other way is jab to shroyuken. If your over 60% expect them to do it as soon as they hit you and it will probobly kill you, keep your spacing extremly well to prevent that, keep a banana in hand or something to throw or anything, just play smart and space well when you get over that certain percent.

 

[FishStix]

Oh jesus, that combo is brutal :X

 

[ADHD]

Can someone help me with diddy vs marth? The only reason I have trouble with it is because I have no idea what to do and marth has it better than diddy in terms of close range attacks. If someone could shed light on this matchup I'd appreciate it.

 

[stingers]

Diddy vs. Marth?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_wycAj4ijSY

 

[pastaboy]

Hmm chromepirate il put up some matchs up of me vs a marth, i rly dont have good advice as of yet on how to face a good marth, but just if you happen to throw a banana at them and it is at their feet(their shielding), if you go to get it expect a up B out of shield. so i suggest dont use dash attack to get bananas neer them ,shiled grab them and throw them away or sumthin. iono its just a situation that seems to turn up for me a cuple of times and thats all i rly know how to counter as of yet, sry couldnt be anymore help. also look out wen marth is facing backwards he can glide toss very far

 

[Vyse]

As long as we're on the subject, lets make Marth this week's character.

 

[Count]

I think that diddy has at least a small advantage over marth. I don't seem to have a ton of trouble with him, and I don't think that marth can be great while being pressured. Just don't let him control the pace of the match and stay out of tipper range and you will be fine, in my opinon.

60-40 diddy?

 

[NinjaLink]

Its 60-40 marth.

 

[ADHD]

Bad marths are easy, theres this really good one that gives me trouble and I don't even know how to handle marth in teh first place

 

[chimpact]

I seem to have a relatively "easy" time with marth. He is gimpable, and has no long range attacks, despite having extremely long range on all of his attacks. Bananas and peanuts work very well against him and he isn't that heavy. Id say its 60-40 diddy.

 

[bludhoundz]

It's hard to keep combos going on Marth or to apply any shield pressure because of his up b's invincibility frames.

Bananas, as usual, are your best tool in this match. Marth's glide toss is BEASTLY though, so try to avoid letting him gain any control over bananas. His aerials are all quick and good for catching bananas. His dash attack is bad for picking them up, but he has one of the fastest walking speeds, so he can walk up to one and pick it up.

He can kill you earlier than you can kill him, generally.

If you don't have bananas out, it's almost as bad as facing MK, due to his range advantage.

Shielding and spotdodging against Marth can be risky : his b moves are excellent at screwing with defense (shieldbreaker and dancing blade). If you're in a defensive position, retreating glide toss, dribble / roll backwards, or sh z drop a banana to cover your retreat.

Look out for counter when glide tossing a banana toward him, because if you end up within range you'll be hit. If a Marth gets counter happy against your glide tossing though, glide toss up / down -> grab or glide toss so that he activates the counter but you're just out of reach so you can punish.

Your recovery is better than his, but look out if he tries to harass you while you're trying to recover. He outranges you and can gimp you. You can't really harrass his recovery by going offstage, but you can use peanuts / bananas.

IMO slightly in Marth's advantage, but if you keep a good momentum with the bananas going, you have a good shot at winning.

 

[NinjaLink]

It's hard to keep combos going on Marth or to apply any shield pressure because of his up b's invincibility frames.

Bananas, as usual, are your best tool in this match. Marth's glide toss is BEASTLY though, so try to avoid letting him gain any control over bananas. His aerials are all quick and good for catching bananas. His dash attack is bad for picking them up, but he has one of the fastest walking speeds, so he can walk up to one and pick it up.

He can kill you earlier than you can kill him, generally.

If you don't have bananas out, it's almost as bad as facing MK, due to his range advantage.

Shielding and spotdodging against Marth can be risky : his b moves are excellent at screwing with defense (shieldbreaker and dancing blade). If you're in a defensive position, retreating glide toss, dribble / roll backwards, or sh z drop a banana to cover your retreat.

Look out for counter when glide tossing a banana toward him, because if you end up within range you'll be hit. If a Marth gets counter happy against your glide tossing though, glide toss up / down -> grab or glide toss so that he activates the counter but you're just out of reach so you can punish.

Your recovery is better than his, but look out if he tries to harass you while you're trying to recover. He outranges you and can gimp you. You can't really harrass his recovery by going offstage, but you can use peanuts / bananas.

IMO slightly in Marth's advantage, but if you keep a good momentum with the bananas going, you have a good shot at winning.

this is mostly why i say 60/40 marth. He has a good 'GTFO' move out of his shield, can keep u pressured and kill/gimp u i think a slight bit better. I believe marth can use counter against ur recovery and cause a problem.