DGames Summer Mafia Bash - Day 2 Begins. Deadline Day 2 begins - Deadline 8:00 A.M. CST Monday 6/24

[JeXs]

Jex, I do think it is weird. Why confidently answer that you can find those aspects of his play if it's not available in your memory? Also, I hope you do feel better. Lore It's not really whether he was having irl troubles or not. I'll leave it at this. I do agree that we should trust each other when irl **** happens, not sure if that's actually a general rule we follow though. :thinkingemoji:

I was asked about it. I answered based off of what I remembered. I reread later and it turned out that my memory was wrong, not that it was not available.

 

[Rockin]

wtf are your reads

what reads you want to know in particular?

 

[#HBC | Gorf]

any and all

 

[Lore]

JeXs #HBC | Gorf ranmaru

What are your thoughts on Utopian, given the exchange on the previous page? I've got him read as scum, personally, and my vote is on him for it.

 

[UtopianPoyzin]

First bit is very relevant. In a single phrase of "this is TvT," you establish that you see me as Town and that you're trying to associate yourself as town by proxy. Seeing me as Town this quick, after I've only played for a couple hours and the previous slot-holder had plenty of votes on him? It's weird.

Was in reference to your useless sarcasm. Sorry.

The rest is fair, I did assume you were town based on your immediate instinct to try your hardest to find scum. I'm just saying that you went into the wrong direction. But I can't stop you from pursuing me if you wish. I am all ears to hear what you have to say.

Defensive, aggresive, dismissive, it's got it all!

Pick it to pieces. You have my utmost request. And the best part is, I won't even say a word about it.

I don't really like your defense either.

If you feel like it is a defense, then I sincerely apologize for saying anything in the first place, for this wasn't my intent. If you refer to the bit that I make in smaller letters, that was natural instinct. Disregard it, it's a needless excuse.

You're essentially implying your vote doesn't mean anything until you want it to.

Bluntly, yes. If it can work in a 24 hour day/mafia, it can work in a 144 day/mafia. All this does is give me background so I'm not going in blind. Is that bad?

Might I suggest that if you're literally stating you vote for pressure, that defeats the purpose?

Yep. I can't use that antic now. So therefore I'll have to stop moving around. Which is kind of frustrating because I was trying to take Ryker's advice.

Also because, what if the wagon continued and someone did get hammered.

It wouldn't. Because I will not be responsible for hammering anybody day one. If any wagon gets to 8 votes, I will hop off, don't you worry.

you get to claim that you were on it all along?

I can tell you this: No. That is very silly if I'm using a vote for bragging rights. Even if I were scum and I bussed out another scum, so what? There are 4 scum, and what better way to look town than to vote scum and go under the radar? Sure, it wouldn't be too smart to do it early, but you have my highest promise that I don't treat successful wagons as trophies.

Also remember that I was only on the wagons of those who I was suspicious of. If they were scum, then I'm suspicious for a good reason.

My question to you is, how do you determine to the town what is your final vote?

The one that sticks at the actual day end.

 

[UtopianPoyzin]

Hope I covered literally everything about your post, whether I needed to or not. I'll be hangin' around, let me know if anybody has any questions so that we can get back to scumhunting.

 

[#HBC | Gorf]

JeXs #HBC | Gorf ranmaru

What are your thoughts on Utopian, given the exchange on the previous page? I've got him read as scum, personally, and my vote is on him for it.

i dont hold the same sort of credence as you do in his wagon hopping being scummy. from what ive seen hes also developed reads because of that wagon hopping. aside from that his town screams brownie townie so, yea

 

[#HBC | Gorf]

ebwop bolded

i dont hold the same sort of credence as you do in his wagon hopping being scummy. from what ive seen hes also developed reads because of that wagon hopping. aside from that his posts screams brownie townie so, yea

 

[#HBC | Gorf]

ebwop AGAIN because i misread my one post

i dont hold the same sort of credence as you do in his wagon hopping being scummy. from what ive seen hes also developed reads because of that wagon hopping. aside from that his tone screams brownie townie so, yea

 

[#HBC | Gorf]

im done ebwoping i swear but this is just getting annoying

ebwop AGAIN because i misread my own post

 

[UtopianPoyzin]

EBWOP

ebwoping

ebwoping isn't a word lol who are you

 

[#HBC | Gorf]

ebwop isnt a word. its an acronym. edit by way of post. edit by way of posting. dont make me vote you out of spite.

 

[Rockin]

any and all

Honestly I felt I touched/covered like most of the people in regards of my thoughts from previous post. There are some (like Jex, for example) who I'd like to lynch, while there's others I'm okay with lynching, but would need convincing. I've also spoke about key players that have been involved in either wagons or pressured. I'm not sure what more you want from me at this point, unless there's something specific.

Well I mention most except KevinM. I have a null on him, but under all that 'lynch Rockin so we can move out of D0,' I can see he's stating things he either likes or got a particular question on. I'm unsure of what I'd want to do with him tbh LOL

 

[UtopianPoyzin]

ebwop isnt a word. its an acronym. edit by way of post. edit by way of posting. dont make me vote you out of spite.

I hope you realize that I was joking because the post was an EBWOP and you said we were done EBWOPing so I had to come up with something quick.

 

[ranmaru]

I think his behavior here is actually consistent overall. (One such quote is below) It shows he cares to let us know that, that he doesn't care. He does it more than once, I don't think he'd be doing this as scum because this garners negative attention his way, when actually he's trying to be honest. Also again, it was easy to misunderstand your post as attacking him, and defending one self is totally fair. Wagon hopping can be a fair tactic. I think you just need to focus more on the why. This is just off the top of my head, to give you a better answer I'd have to re-read all his votes and tell you in more detail, but I'm already working on a Gorf side-project.

And as for the latter bit, I really don't care whether you think I'm town or scum. I'm not going to give myself a self-read, nor ask anybody to do it for me. That was my bit on that.

 

[JeXs]

JeXs #HBC | Gorf ranmaru

What are your thoughts on Utopian, given the exchange on the previous page? I've got him read as scum, personally, and my vote is on him for it.

I think he's fine. I'm in the same boat as Gorf in that I don't see the wagon hopping as scummy, especially after Ryker has been telling everyone to put their vote somewhere useful. Earlier on, you stated that he seemed nervous, to me, he seems more excited to be in this game. His play has been consistent so far, he's been open with his thoughts and responding to literally anything and everything.

 

[#HBC | Gorf]

Honestly I felt I touched/covered like most of the people in regards of my thoughts from previous post. There are some (like Jex, for example) who I'd like to lynch, while there's others I'm okay with lynching, but would need convincing. I've also spoke about key players that have been involved in either wagons or pressured. I'm not sure what more you want from me at this point, unless there's something specific.

Well I mention most except KevinM. I have a null on him, but under all that 'lynch Rockin so we can move out of D0,' I can see he's stating things he either likes or got a particular question on. I'm unsure of what I'd want to do with him tbh LOL

bro what scumreads do you have currently and what sorts of pushes/substantiations have you done to contribute to their wagons? i am currently accusing you of sidelining and not wanting to involve yourself too heavy with pressure, and sheeping wagons with no drive to make something of them. i want you to do something to alleviate that.

 

[KevinM]

Yeah what Gorf said! Let’s kill Rockin!

No more pussyfooting!

Unvote
Vote Rockin

 

[KevinM]

Gogogogog no thoughts put him at L-1

 

[Tom]

Okay so I'm burned out and I'm about to leave work, so I'm going to post my current list, post all of my notes from my re-read today, and then drive home. Tonight when I'm home, I'll go into detail, maybe shift some of my SAFE/CAN-GO, go into my summarized feelings about people, answer questions towards me (inc. Mac, Ryker, FF's), and ask questions, and probably move my vote from Rockin but no promises

 

[KevinM]

We can kill UP tomorrow or whatever idc

 

[Tom]

TOWN:
Tom
#HBC | Ryker
#HBC | Mac
Ranmaru
KevinM


SAFE FOR NOW:
#HBC | Gorf
UtopianPoyzin
#HBC | marshy
Dooplissity


CAN GO:
JTB
Pythag
JeXs
Rockin
Lore (Maven89)
#HBC | Kary
#HBC | Frozen


WTF:
#HBC | Nabe

 

[UtopianPoyzin]

Yeah what Gorf said! Let’s kill Rockin!

No more pussyfooting!

Unvote
Vote Rockin

So why did you vote me then? It didn't matter if it was me or any other player, at least I had reasons for voting. Did I miss yours?

 

[UtopianPoyzin]

We can kill UP tomorrow or whatever idc

, or I didn't see it.

 

[KevinM]

No no no don’t move it!

 

[KevinM]

So why did you vote me then? It didn't matter if it was me or any other player, at least I had reasons for voting. Did I miss yours?

Yeah let me tell you why you’re giving scum vibes would hate for you to keep them up and slip out to other players.

Ya dingus.

Come kill Rockin and then you get to live a whole extra day!

 

[Pythag]

I liked Gorf's most recent post. Gonna ISO rockin and Jexs

 

[Tom]

Doop:

Spoiler: Doop

#633-634: votes rockin, doesnt like maven wagon, would wagon pythag

#676: votes pythag, obv per Ryker’s growing Doop v Pythag wags

#702: Maven wagon irked him: marshy+pythag on it for one, for two thought Rockin was better for “housekeeping” lynch vs Maven inactive lynch. Doesn’t mean anything / is weak

#713: confirms his stance on marshy is still from marshy-post-1-interaction. Clarifies #702 to mean he hates activity meta lynch (maven) even more than housekeeping lynches (rockin)

#718: trying to understand Rockin v Maven wagons by understanding their meta better

#722: explaining Rockin-KevinM and Rockin v Maven wagons, and his lack of understanding of personal metas involved

#723 - on the record as grumpy that nobody explained the rockin wagon. - makes sense

#735-736: asks Rockin why his vote on is JeXs

Pythag:

Spoiler: Pythag

#530: responds to Kary says he’s also not a fan of his own start. Elaborates to Kary and Mac about his attention toward Ran, says in RvT that Ran is scummier than Tom but can be TvT. Pythag notes that FF dislikes Jex for willingness to wagon with Kevin, but also wagons with Kevin, finds FF hypocritical. Pythag likes Gorf. Pythag likes Marshy in Marshy v Doop and finds FF to agree. Null reads Ryker. Votes Maven saying he’s hitching his vote to Gorf, basically FoS’s Ran while voting Maven. Ryker will point out #532 that Gorf is voting Ran. Marshy points it out in #546.

#778: concerned that FF finds JeXs joining Kev’s wagon scummy. He hit this before i believe. Pythag considers RanvTom TvT, cites my 467. Thinks Ran is similar to Doop but if Ran is proving his own townieness Doop is proving others scumminess - so? He finds Doop more scummy on gut compared to Ran. More comfortable lynching Maven than Ran. Doesn’t want to lynch Rockin. Wants to know why JTB is scummy from anyone

#979: doesnt like JTB wagon (meshes with previous 778), doesnt find him scummy, doesnt buy hes scummy. That’s a real thing. Thinks JeXs swings too hard to JTB, doesnt agree with marshy’s “scum determine how to make open ended given situations look” but that’s just shoptalk. Pythag finds Doop slightly scummy. Says he was RanvTom SvT but now is more Tv? - he feels Ran is the T and I’m the ? - so #980 Mac will ask, why join the wagon on JTB?

#987: per Mac, posts scum reads (mac wanted more than JeXs/Doops slight-scum) as Doop, FF, Jex - adds FF

#1003: per marshy, town reads are Gorf, UP, Ran, Ryker; votes JeXs

Rockin:

Spoiler: Rock

#487: responds to Ryker about why he doesn’t like early town reads. I disagree with Rock but it seems null.

#716: man this big post he’s talking to UP and what is it even for. Lmao he said “bangwagon.” votes JeXs. per Ryker, rockin doesn’t understand the maven wagon, thinks Ryker should look at JTB/Kary, doesn’t like throwing out townleans (still on that #487 ****? What’s it matter? I come up with town-leans easily and very often lynch by elimination. Is this Rockin being dumb and just empty talking theory?)

#737: explains JeXs vote per Doops: thinks JeXs is sidelining, they sided with KevinM on the Rockin wagon, thinks JeXs scumdar is weak/safe

#944: votes doop. Re: ryker, fails to respond to ryker about FF

#947: re: JTB, he can “see why others woudl be bothered by him,” tells Ryker that Rockin feels FF’s gut is justified? Rockin talks doop wagon.

#978: Rock votes JTB at behest of Ryker to play the game

#HBC | Gorf:

Spoiler: the enlightened man

#472: Agrees with Rockin’s #462 that I’m null and/or Ran v Tom is XvT

#495: Respond to Mac’s #480: clarifies that Ran’s mistake (literal mis-read that I pointed out for brownie points) isn’t scummy but is weird (when Mac asked how its scummy); clarifies that Gorf suspects Doop for Doop’s marshy vote early. His reads at the time Ran 1, Doop 2. Gorf re-commits to the idea that Ran v UP seems scummy.

#573: responds to JTB’s vig-shoot-Tom post with “love and peace” aka dont shoot

#583: asks Pythag to hitch his vote correctly to Ran if he’s meaning to hitch to Gorf

#655: hops on Ryker’s doop wagon

#694: provides self-ISO x5-posts on his distaste of Doop

#707: questions Doop on weak #702

#785: buddies salt-Marsh

#789: disagrees with Ran’s reads, thinks Ran is dumb or scum, finds Doop more interesting as a push, wants Doop v Rock v Pythag ton continue in that order

#849-850: post Ryker’s comments on AtE!town!Ran, Gorf finds Ran town; feels Doop is only strong scum read; finds JTB question-mark but doesn’t like the wagon - what’s wrong with wagons Gorf? This is like FF saying he doesn’t like Kevin’s Ran-wagon - opinion that Mac shares in #480 - what’s wrong with a wagon?

#857: gorf changes shape.

#884: Gorf @ JTB: “formidable early play” i agree with that at least, i liked JTB really early. This post goes deep as funk? -- He’s right that JTB influence the maven wagon early by asking marshy the difference between doop and maven. Gorf seems super sus on FF--buddy-->Marsh

#887: rephrases/summarizes his 884 @ JTB: -- man i want to find Gorf scummy but he’s totally right about JTB’s early play transition to crap. I also appreciate his theory of FF being scum on the JTB wagon if there’s scum on it - Gorf claim FF is inconsistent on reasonings against JTB - except that FF had his vote on JTB early. Ryker gets on this #889

#920: good to vote FF

#1129: hasn’t like Rockin lately

#HBC | Mac:

Spoiler: mane

#473: Answers my question: no read on Kary or JTB

#480: says his reread is Ran Wagon based - he doesnt find Ran scummy so he suspects the wagon has scum. Points to Gorf finding my Ran-correction as weird and says mistakes aren’t scummy because they aren’t fake. Mac says Ran-questioning-UP reads town; asks Doop to explain his tonal issues with Ran, asks Gorf multiple clarification questions. Ultimately he’s cool with KevinM starting the wagon but wary of the others (probably me, Gorf, doop, JTB, and Rockin) votes Rockin. Also says wishes Ran didn’t switch off Pythag. Says he’s okay with Pythag lynch

#779: likes Doop’s #315 but wants to know why Doop found Ran’s done weird. Asks Gorf if hes okay with the pressure leaving Ran. QUESTIONS FOR ME! - asking about scum!Ran and my reads on reactions

#783: Ran’s JTB read is preposterous (per #748 Ran finds JTB most townie player); not commenting on marshy wagon atm; not feeling doop lynch as he likes doop getting off ran wagon before others leaned Ran; feeling KevinM’s big “can go” list; votes pythag but is on Rock wagon in spirit

#798: down for marshy’s JTB wagon, votes JTB

#825: Mac’s #480 asked JTB about Ranmaru questions UP (mac found it townish) and if JTB always finds it scummy when someone asks about a players scum meta. JTB responds 497 but Mac re-pressed the question: “what was the context in this case that made you lean scum on Ran for the UP questions?”

#826: weird change in tone **** that i also don’t get. (#824 Ran-Kevin-JeXs? Change in tone?) Also asks me about the current wagons.

#966: rereading, asks why JTB went from scumreading Ran to supporting Ran’s marshy wagon -- pretty good question

#970: thinks JTB wagon is legit - asks Ryker & Gorf if they feel the JTB push is not real, do they implicate pythag or doop for it? - good question; he’s hesitant about marshy like ranmaru is - good - he’s down to lynch JTB, pythag, Rockin

#973: good on asking FF and others like KevinM that thought RanvTom was TvS - how about now?

#974: re Ran, mac is good with Kary because Kary shared Mac’s early thoughts on Pythag

#976: agrees with Wurkul that RvT doesnt make Tom town, also doesnt like that i dipped

#980: asks Pythag why P joined the JTB wagon if he didn’t like it. -- this appears to be wrong in vote counts but is a good line of thought -- Asks pythag for any true scum reads instead of jexs/doop slight-tells

#990: Mac says Ranmaru wagon way fishier than JTB wagon and didn’t get appropriate attention - Pythag 992 and Ryker 993 note this

#998: mac analyses TomvRan and didnt like Ran-shade without Ran-votes

#1016: he’d wagon me for RanvTom and for dipping

#1057: mac asks when did rock start to townread ran?

#1126: Mac @ Lore, mac explains the JTB vs Tom wagon marshy-scenario that Lore bit Mac on

# HBC | marshy:

Spoiler: hmmmmmmmmm

#474: ran/ryker/FF read town, Kary read null. He says he feels ran was pushed into being himself - does he attribute that to Ran v Tom?

#522-523: in response to Kary questioning marshy’s town!Ryker, asks if he’s unreasonable as Ryker is super active

#541: re: kary’s #511: marshy nuts over Ryker’s play, i cant disagree but it doesn’t mean anything; says he didn’t like doop’s start and notes doop is now on pythag, doesn’t mean anything.

#548: asks pythag about his incorrect-wagon-hitch re: Gorf and Maven. Asks pythag why Tom is townier than Ran is TvR

#575: continues re: Kary about Ryker’s activity, doop too

#585: talks shop with Ryker. Its all nothing.

#646: per Ryker, his read of UP is that he’s new and can contradict. Ryker agree. I agree.

#673: keeps talking to JeXs about scumdar, third post now?

#695: still tunneling JeXs, asks about me in relation to mild town (kevin, mac, frozen); asks for patience in own contributions -- JeXs will note #701 it wasn’t in order, that Mac is cleanest mild-town per stance on Ran

#704: ask JeXs why Kevin over Tom, also why does JeXs think marshy has tunneled them

#705: pokes doop about doops dislike of marshy. Is it still from their first-post interaction?

#774: “ran is poop as town” post in response to ran’s marshy!scum read

#780: “ran’s reads are poop and he doesn’t learn” post #2

#781: marshy salty AF @ ran, asks Kary some questions

#782: secret scumread

#796: votes JTB, strongly feels flips scum: no scumhunting, says he isn’t buddying ryker like JTB says, thinks JTB’s willingness to join Ran’s scum!marsh wagon is unreal; strongly disliked JTB’s shade towards vigging Maven. JeXs & Mac will quickly jump on this wagon.

#851: JTB should die, pythag can go over doop

#852: asks Gorf about his wagon-fears - who is the scum on JTB wagon?

#853: addresses Kary’s concerns on Marshy’s D1 town!Ryker

#854: doesn’t townread Gorf - doesn’t like Gorf pushing Ran

#867: JTB needs to die for spinning JeXs’s meta-hunt on UP as scum, says it was JTB spinning JeXs or UP to look bad no matter the situation.

#996-997: JTB must die, asking FF voters of opinions of Tom wagon opposite JTB

#1066: re Ryker @ FF, “yes but actually no” - i would hate for marshy and FF to be scummates

#HBC | FF:

Spoiler: frozone

#490: JTB can go, no strong read; likes marshys posts, like Mac’s #480 on the Ran wagon and agrees scum is on wagon.

#813: JTB can still go, votes JTB - hey FF’s consistent; feels JeXs is over accommodating, maybe ironically being buddy because finds offensive people scummy; likes Kevin’s pullback on Mac being town? - where is that? - thinks KevinMo brownie townie

#814: can go: jexs, nabe, maven, JTB -- feels kary and gorf havent set off the bells and so they’ve left the lynchpool.

#880: ISO-Pythag: doesn’t like pythag wagon even tho he disagrees with Pythag - nothing struck him as scum. Thinks pythag is distraction wagon away from JTB - then who’s the scum pushing it? Pushes JTB wagon more.

#968: FF is fine with his JTB reasons being simple and on gut/tone. Really dislikes JTB

#977: likes Mac’s 973 about FF/KevinM opinion of TomvRan as TvS - will revisit it

#1050: answers Ryker’s H Him re sharing wagon w JeXs ?

#1074: forced to explain his JTB read timeline to Ryker - still to revisit TomvRan as TvS - im looking forward to this

#HBC | Ryker:

Spoiler: i love this guy

#491: @FF re Ran-wagon: feels uneasy about people looking at Tom v Ran and coming out with town!Tom, as I poked aggro and side-stepped - that’s legit. By my read this list would include Rockin #462, Gorf #472.

#513: confirms @Kary’s #511 that Ryker is waiting, but is responsible for it

#521: re Ran’s question: not big reads on FF or marshy, likes FF, waiting on marshy to talk

#595-596: works with UP to get UP to verbalize the Ran wagon

#600: @’s me and asks me to keep an eye. Has previously asked me to watch marshy. Too bad I took a backseat for a couple days.

#623: challenges UPs thoughts re 618 re JeXs 611 -- i agree

#628: Maven/Nabe can go; Rock/Pythag/Doop ok to go

#636: asks Kevin if Doop’s 634 on Pythag isn’t SvS

#639: likes Doop v Pythag wagons with Nabe as fallback; votes Doop - i like this. They oppose each other and both could go.

#645: explains 639 to Ran, our wagons suck, Doop v Pythag can be a thing with real flips, Rock v Maven doesn’t create a real papertrail

#674: asks marshy to give his thoughts, is waiting for marshy to get what he wants and then contribute

#706: questions Doop on weak #702

#740: figuring out Doop’s stance on Maven/Rockin wagons re housecleaning definition

#843: 1 - Ran!Town bc he wouldn’t AtE explode and rep-out as scum -- probably true, unless he really took marshy’s talk to heart.; 2 - Ryker doesn’t like JTB spotlight discussion, wants to change targets to Pythag -- Ran doesn’t rep out though so this might still stand. Votes pythag

#889-892: analysis of FF → JTB. (UP, Mac, JeXs, Marshy as the others besides FF on JTB)

#895-897: sees JeXs has moved quickly against JTB but with a ‘null read’, this is true though JeXs explains it as a re-read in #864

#907: votes FF, willing to after 889

#909: in clarification to Gorf, Ryker explains its JeXs’s reasonings around JTB that are ehh, poking and hounding JTB on Ran

#926: Ryker/Ran confirmed, Gorf looks good, FF grody, Nabe/Maven totally null (good)

#933: lists 12 people to read, asks Ran who to read, Ran decides on me

#938: @me: i said #205 i liked JTB and disagreed with him on marshy’s reminder and attitude to doop

#940: @me: he’s right you know.

#1004, 1006: re: marshy - JTB vote confidence is insanity, wagoning Tom is like wagoning marshy but less useful

#1044: good FF question about he and JeXs on the same wagon and how’s the feels, follows up with,

#1048-1049: Ryker @ FF

#1091: Ryker asks about Kary v Lore SvS - i doubt they’d fake it but Lore getting mad is no town!Lore read I’ll tell you that much. He used AtE to literally win Tomafia 4.

#HBC | Kary:

Spoiler: hard as funk to read

Pre-re-read: I don’t recall much of Kary pre #469 so I should re-read that. Honestly probably wont do it until we get a flip or two.

#493: asks UP who prompted UP’s seemingly-unprompted Null-Ran-read that is #375.

#511: responds to marshy’s town!Ryker stance in #474 saying Kary feels Ryker is just coasting, please elaborate, also asks whats marshy read on Doops?

#524: maven inactive is null, surprised maven’s name is thrown around given nabe is also inactive. Not a fan of Pythag.

#553: continues discussion w marshy re Ryker’s activity meaning town or not

#773: questions Ran on Maven & Nabe

#806: the goods on Ryker? Dislikes Ryker’s “wagon police,” feels Ryker lacks direction on scum hunting; Kary offers meta on inactive!Maven being townie which is nothing to me; feels Ryker hasn’t asked insightful questions as if he’s evaluating other players - that’s what were all doing so its more nothing to me. Feels Ryker is null and should be null, so Kary finds marshy’s read on Ryker to be interesting. -- continuing #474-511-524-533 line of questions re Ryker--Marshy connection. Kary does not like that Marshy is buddying Ryker.

#1142: responds to marshy & lore

KevinM:

Spoiler: is it chill if i chill here

#476: still pushin Rockin wagon, I’m still happily sitting in the wagon. I’m having fun.

#481: he finds Mac’s #480 to be Town. Probably bc Mac votes Rockin, but #480 was a good post too.

#775: marshy’s “rap is poop as town” #774 reads obv-marsh-town to Kevin; doop v pythac could be cool; mac indecision could be scum; JTB smells funky; ok to wagon list has 8 ppl in order

#776: has one or two town leans

#873: removes Ran from his scum-dar, adds macman to bottom of scum-dar. UP goes up on scum-dar due to Ran removal. Rockin/JTB still at the top of the list: Rock, JTB, UP, Nabe, Maven, Doop, Pythag, Macman.

#875: explains his Ran-reads as they evolved

#953: Kev asks Ryker who we’re killing if not Rock - also says “FF kinda grody” is a cop out, asks for ryker’s game-breaking shot -- man this sounds like a ****ty question bc that FF **** could be real and im glad Ryker dodges it

#1101: votes UP after UP’s #1098

Ranmaru:

Spoiler: v glad you didnt rep out lol

#479: pushin inactive!Maven is scum!Maven wagon.

#501: justifies his inactive!Maven-scum!Maven wagon with 3 meta examples. Means nothing to me.

#507: in response to vig!JTB-shooting-Tom, he says to shoot Maven

#512: admits wouldnt learn much from Maven getting vigged but still says Maven is scum

#658: prefers Pythag to Doop

#670: votes Pythag

#741: ask Ryker: 1 why doop again? 2 how do you feel re marshy not joining wagons

#746-749: spoilered re-read aka the ran goods. Full of papertrail. Skimmed and skipping deep analysis in favor of a later comparison to my notes. Votes marshy. His whole scum list is marshy, ryker, maven, frozenflame which is way off mine but marshy is interesting and FF could be lurkscum.

#753: Ran reiterates his dislike of Gorf’s “my main man marshy hasn’t stopped my vote” post which i cant find the number for

#790: votes Maven; replaces out

#846-847: doesn’t rep out, votes pythag with Ryker

#882: null on Nabe - no ****? Is this just who Ranmaru is?

#883: wonders if marshy is AtE? Not sure. Waiting for “in due time” to come and for marshy to talk about Ran.

#1135: Gorf’s requested Zero-Meta Ranalysis: provides scumtells for his scumdar of Marshy, Ryker, FF, Jex

JTB:

Spoiler: jay tee bee

#309 -- FROM THE FUTURE -- this seems to draw some real heat re JeXs

#483: echoes my opinion of verbose-Ran but comes up with null

#497-500: responds to Mac’s #480 about suspecting the Ran-wagon; Asks questions of Ran, FF, and JeXs: re inactive!Maven-scum!Maven wagon

#502: not a fan of Ran explaining that Ran didn’t join FF’s Jax vote because he wanted people to vote Tom

#504-506: my heart skips a beat as JTB proposes to Gorf that he is claiming vig and wants to know if Gorf has an issue with JTB shooting me right now. He then says he isn’t sure how it happened?

#744: asks JeXs where Marshy has been helpful / has actively contributed re: JeXs #584.

#745: votes Rockin re Kevin-wagon that I’m still a-sittin’ in

#750: after the Ran Goods (746-749) JTB is all about a marshy wagon, calling him an empty IC, saying he’s buddying Ryker, his swap onto the Maven wagon was weird, and JTB didnt like marshy’s weird theory-**** in #585

#820: responding to marshy’s #796 starting the JTB wagon; say’s he’s posting scum reads; says he doesnt know any of marshy’s reads except Ryker-strong-town; says pressuring marshy on ran’s marsh-wagon IS scum-hunting.

#824: what am i following here? Ran-Kevin-JeXs? Change in tone? Why?

#839: tries to clean up this tone stuff: JTB pushed Ran as he felt Ran changed his playstyle towards UP due to Kevin’s interjection. He explains this is the root of his Ran push.

Lore (Maven89):

Spoiler: the artist formerly known as neo-termina

#792-793: replaces out, explains inactivity

#962: Enter Wurkul

#969: up to page 11 on read: basic reads, nothing here

#975: speaks about about RvT meaning town!Tom.

#982: thinks JeXs & Mac are at least 1 scum due to joining marshy’s JTB wagon - weak gut read but good to post and good questions

#986: after parsing out Mac, votes JeXs

#1029-1030: wurkul is not on the level to understand what Mac is doing wagoning me

#1071: votes Macman? Tunneled super hard on comparing Mac->Tom to Mac->JTB. Cant seem to understand why mac would want a Tom wagon even though im Tom and I get it. You know a wagon aint a lynch right?

#1077-1081: Lore if you’re going to flip your **** when someone is mean to you, im going to lynch you. Eliminate this aspect of your play.

#1132: …

#1149: …. seriously just stop taking things personally at all. just eliminate it as an option. if something makes you mad, ask why, and if they're being mean or insulting or w/e, just let it go or better yet assume they didn't mean it

UtopianPoyzin:

Spoiler: uppity

#535: says he owe’s a RvT analysis, he’s lost on the motive of the discussion.

#545: talks with Rock about me? Says I’m Null-Town. Big post, didn’t get much from it.

#581: continues visible discussion with Ryker. Has been sustained throughout multiple days.

#616: on Ran: doesn’t like the meta!Maven push

#618: find’s JeXs 611 scumlist of Rock/Nabe/Maven to be weak.

#621: votes Ran re 616

#631: JeXs/Ran can go; Maven/Nabe/Doop ok to go

#640: explains his growing legitimacy for pythag wagon

#659: hops on Ryker’s Doop wagon

#830: votes JTB; sees no big dif bet Ran and JeXs as JTB does; doesnt enjoy Ran-JTB-Kevin interactions as evidence.

836: doesn’t find JTB’s 824 an appropriate answer to the discussion stemming from #309 - Ran/JeXs/UP - JeXs will respond 825 to agree with UP on Ran

#1098: post re Ryker asking about JTB; UP’s scumpile is Doop, JeXs, JTB

#1109: bounces an idea about UP off Kevin

#1120: votes UP, will explain in a moment - coming off the heels of Kevin’s UP vote, what is Wurkul up to?

#1123: elaborates their vote on UP is because UP has been on every popular wagon? JeXs, Maven, Ran, Doop, JTB? But not Rockin. Interesting I guess

JeXs:

Spoiler: jex

#556: confirm re JTB that JeXs is ok voting Maven, likes Marshy, Ryker, and FF; glimpses town Ran; “hard to believe scum Ran would wagon inactive!Maven”

#603-604: scumdar: Rockin/Nabe/Maven can go; Pythag/Doop ok to go; rest not the play

#611: elaborates on doop for Ryker

#653: per marshy, specifices scumdar from 603-604

#663: would prefer to lynch Doop over Pythag, no opinion of Pythag

#683: per marshy, specifies scumdar that Gorf is open on stances, persona is annoying, is headstrong!town; specifices Tom is generally helpful aka brownie points, snarky!mild-town.

#688: per Ryker, votes Doop

#701: JeXs will note it wasn’t in order, that Mac is cleanest mild-town per stance on Ran

#703: sorts mild-town as Mac - Frozen - Kevin - Tom

#708-709: per marshy, kevin is being clear and showing thought; Tom is mild town for weak witheld reasons; thinks marshy is trying to get JeXs into the game but no specific reason otherwise

#759: reading Kary

#764-766: asks JTB re #309 about Ran’s responses to Kevin; rereads and doesn’t agree with Ran’s marsh!scum read

#797: votes JTB on marshy’s wagon, already had questions for JTB re 764-766

#837: tonal argument between UP-JeXs-JTB-Ran - seriously not grokking this ****

#864: re-read, gave attn to Kary and JTB, likes Kary more, dislikes JTB more. JeXs dislikes that JTB concluded JeXs was going to scum-read UP based on meta. -- marshy keys in on this in 867

QUESTIONS FOR ME!

Spoiler: preguntas

Mac’s #779- asking about scum!Ran and my reads on reactions to RanvTom

Mac’s #826- asking me about the current wagons

Ryker’s #904 - is going to do marshy, asks me to lead the read on marshy

Frozone #968 - what’s it take to get KevinM and I on JTB?

Stopped making notes on posts @1152

 

[KevinM]

Great post Tom, especially like the fact where you didn’t unvote Rockin and now I gotta read it.

 

[#HBC | Kary]

tbh it reeks of a distraction wagon with the goal of derailing JTB pressure, ****in narcs might be afoot here

This seems like a shockingly bad take. Which then of Ranmaru / Ryker do you think is scum? Or is there someone else that I'm missing?

While I don't mind him thinking that he thinks I'm town, I disagree with the logic behind it, as he's trying to use meta that's 3 years old. I only state this because I haven't played any mafia since then except the recent one I played in (I rather not talk about it tbh ._. ), so things could be different. I just don't want him to cloud his judgement over me based on ancient meta that may be irrelevant.

I'm struggling to wrap my head around this. The way you phrased the bolded suggests you don't suspect Ranmaru of being scum, so then what's the problem with him townreading you? Just take the town read and be happy?

 

[Tom]

This section from my notes on UP is meant to be in Lore's section, it is just *about* UP:

Spoiler: misteak

#1109: bounces an idea about UP off Kevin

#1120: votes UP, will explain in a moment - coming off the heels of Kevin’s UP vote, what is Wurkul up to?

#1123: elaborates their vote on UP is because UP has been on every popular wagon? JeXs, Maven, Ran, Doop, JTB? But not Rockin. Interesting I guess

 

[#HBC | Kary]

Based on the post, it sounds like he got gut instincts of wanting JTB dead, and less of not having a legit reason of wanting him dead.. It sounded like he was bothered by some words JTB said. I have to look back at the JTB posts, as nothing immediately jumped out to me on my first read through.

and yeah Ryker, sadly it doesn't seem like I can convince enough people in time for a Jex lynch.

Vote: Dooplissity

Also Rockin I want to know where this Doop vote came from, please.

 

[UtopianPoyzin]

Going through the game events per Tom, I didn't actually see that Ran made a no-sub-out post, I assumed that he did which is why I was confused about it earlier. Sorry Ran!

I wasn't really worried about Lore's tone until Tom brought it up. So I wanted to see if there was spite I missed.

Like it, given the fact that I brought up Pythag as one of the wagons that I didn't endorse, rather than the opposite. So Pythag would be in the same boat as Rockin.

Don't bother reading the next bit.

Spoiler: ****ty logic, but out of character

Heck, you'd be incredibly dumb as scum to do this behavior to wagons that don't make sense.

I completely breezed over this post earlier, but I have a hunch. It's definitely a wrong hunch, but I want to post it anyway to see. After making a deal about wanting to be polite to me, this seems rather out of character. The post you quoted didn't insult you or anybody else, and you acknowledged it as such by labeling it "irrevelant" rather than "inflammatory". So the post itself didn't hurt anybody, relevancy aside.
Now, this is where the wild goose chase comes in. If you really wanted to be polite, then this post was completely out of what you would normally post, because you said I was probably scum. If I was "probably scum" in your eyes, then why insult the playstyle? However, you have a tendency to be okay with talking like this if there was no individual target, i.e. no fingers pointed. In this case, there are two targets: town!Poyzin and scum!Poyzin. You wouldn't say that if I was confirmed scum, so therefore, to conclude my faulty slippery slope of logic, you don't actually think I'm scum, but rather dislike my recent posts and placed your vote on it.

I am now done with covering Lore for now. I joined the Maven wagon for the sole reason that I didn't like a Rockin wagon. I also didn't like a Maven wagon, but they weren't posting and I hoped I could get something out of them. However, with Lore taking the reins, I feel more comfortable about the slot because they are helping town and proposing really good points, even if I believe them to be going down a rabbit hole. If they want to act on them, that's fine too, but I want to exit out of this conflict. If it needs to be referenced again, that's fine. But I don't want to do any more actual arguing. I cleared up the Pythag bit, and I went on a heavy tangent about voting motives that went nowhere and should be forgotten. If anybody has any grievances with this, then I will happily address them and we can talk about my playing thus far.

 

[#HBC | Gorf]

Gorf claim FF is inconsistent on reasonings against JTB - except that FF had his vote on JTB early. Ryker gets on this #889

no. ff had consistently barely said anything he didnt like about jtb up until his vote, they were lazy potshots. that is in contrast and inconsistent with how he has approached scumhunting the rest of the game: thorough, thought out, willing to be inquisitive. he set up a foundation of a read without putting effort into developing it or prodding others about it. thats not how frozens played with any other scumread.

 

[JTB]

I've been around doing wedding stuff, so I haven't had an opportunity to look at this since my last post and now there are 9 more pages lmao

I should be fully caught up tomorrow afternoon since I have more stuff going on tonight. I'm assuming that both Jexs and Uto answered my question to them about why their issue w/ Ran didn't come forward until a wagon formed on me?

 

[Lore]

Tom Just a quick heads up since I don't have much time tonight since driving/riding, but I wasn't salty with the UP stuff. In fact my posts were explicitly meant to point out that the attempts at insults/condescension were ridiculous, along valid points. If you reread my stuff in my posts with UP, reread with that in mind.

The Kary bit was classic Wurkul though, and I regret doing it. Bad play, bad reading, and bad anger. It was too harsh, even if I was in the right (and I wasn't).

 

[Tom]

no. ff had consistently barely said anything he didnt like about jtb up until his vote, they were lazy potshots. that is in contrast and inconsistent with how he has approached scumhunting the rest of the game: thorough, thought out, willing to be inquisitive. he set up a foundation of a read without putting effort into developing it or prodding others about it. thats not how frozens played with any other scumread.

ok

in short, ff's history of expressing his read on jtb throughout the game is incredibly inconsistent with how he has done so with the rest of his play.

this is what you wrote that i apparently comprehended only partially. it matches your re-explanation. i thought you meant he had been inconsistent, and i disagreed as he has consistently been on JTB. now that i know what you meant, i still vibe with your #884, #887, and ryker's resulting discussion

Tom In fact my posts were explicitly meant to point out that the attempts at insults/condescension were ridiculous, along valid points. If you reread my stuff in my posts with UP, reread with that in mind.

the point is that i did not see them as attempts at insults or condescension worth any sort of note. i would bet most everyone would agree it is simply the back and forth accusatory nature of mafia to dish it out and talk it up. people talk with some pepper. a little bit of the dozens. you're going to call people dumb sometimes. just be clever and funny.

i am v appreciative that you replaced in and read this huge thread. i dont intend to talk about this a lot. thick skin and scum hunt.

 

[Lore]

the point is that i did not see them as attempts at insults or condescension worth any sort of note. i would bet most everyone would agree it is simply the back and forth accusatory nature of mafia to dish it out and talk it up. people talk with some pepper. a little bit of the dozens. you're going to call people dumb sometimes. just be clever and funny.

i am v appreciative that you replaced in and read this huge thread. i dont intend to talk about this a lot. thick skin and scum hunt.

Fair, different perspectives I suppose. I saw it as silly that he was insulting me as part of his own defense, but if you see it as him not doing that, I'll respect that.

Thanks for the input btw, out of the people here I tend to trust your judgment on me more. You've kinda literally been there since the start of my mafia games, haha. You've got plenty of werkel knowledge.


On the note of insults, Pythag seemed to get a similar vibe from UP. Do you think this was legit, or do you think it was forced? It kinda came out of nowhere from Pythag, and while I agreed with his conclusions, it was still kinda random. Leaning towards him being legit, but I'd appreciate input.

(if the above is in your big post, just say so and don't worry about retyping lol)

 

[Pythag]

Dooplissity

Where are you? I wanna hear from you.

 

[#HBC | Kary]

Anyways I'm sick of reading this thread and I don't know how I ever had energy for these kind of mafia games. I do feel like this has been a productive day in terms of discussions and waggons but I'm just getting burned out over and over. I'm up to the end of page 27.

I have no idea why anyone is town reading UtopianPoyzin, is it just noob = town? He's null to me

Personally I have a gut townread on JTB but I see no problem with a waggon on him since it is only a gut read.

Think Pythag has picked up the pace and my vote is no longer needed there so going to be putting it here:

Vote: Dooplissity

I've spent the whole of this game thinking that the marshy vs Doop exchange right at the beginning had scum involved, and I think it's strange that they both seem to have dropped the exchange and aren't pushing one another. I think marshy is a bit off for a variety of reasons, not least of which is his apparent certainty on JTB, but at least he is doing things and making posts. Doop could use some pressure in my opinion and is still a candidate for the lynch today.

I'm sure there's other things I'm forgetting but as I said before, I'm feeling kind of burned out so it'll have to wait.