Day, Night, and Dusk - Lycanroc for Smash Bros. Ultimate

[Delzethin]

inb4 Sonic and Pac-Man are mysteriously absent from the palette creator

Heh, I figure the reason their colors hardly change is because their blue and yellow, respectively, were deemed too iconic to alter. Though I'd imagine they'd have the ability to pick what gear they wear and have that be recolorable, to compensate.

Another thing, will we get a new ''joke'' character in the likeness of Mr. Game & Watch, R.O.B., Wii Fit Trainer & Duck Hunt?

And thinking of the potential return of target smash, if we were to get unique stages for each character, what would Lycanroc's Target smash stage be like with the moveset potential that has been discussed up to now?

I don't know, honestly. Whether we get a surprise character (the term "joke" doesn't really fit here since none of those four were made deliberately bad) depends on what plans we aren't aware of.

Far as Target Test goes...good question. I haven't actually considered it before! What would everyone else want to see be built into a target breaking trial tailored for Lycanroc?

I know there hasn't been as much to talk about lately, but it still helps to keep the ball rolling. We've just about caught up to the Shadow thread, even!

 

[Guynamednelson]

Heh, I figure the reason their colors hardly change is because their blue and yellow, respectively, were deemed too iconic to alter.

It's weird because Namco is willing to recolor Pac-Man. In Pac-Man Battle Royale, the four players control a red, yellow, pink, and blue Pac-Man respectively.

 

[valkiriforce]

At the mention of Break the Targets I just realized another thing - I'd love for Board the Platforms to make a return. To keep with the topic though I'm not sure what would be a good setup for a character like Lycanroc - at least not until we know exactly what kind of moveset Lycanroc would have. So long as it's nothing too tedious I'd be fine with an obstacle course that is compatible with their abilities without stretching things too far. I was never really that keen on maybe one or two Break the Targets in Smash 64 - namely Yoshi's course, which sometimes kinda threw me off since I don't really play as the character, but I wasn't a big fan of trying to rely on his floaty second jump to hit that last target under the stage.

 

[False Sense]

Far as Target Test goes...good question. I haven't actually considered it before! What would everyone else want to see be built into a target breaking trial tailored for Lycanroc?

Well I think the answer is in the question.

Similar to how early Target Tests borrowed a few thematic elements from their source material, it'd be cool if Lycanroc's borrowed from Alola's trial settings, featuring stuff like totem poles, trial gates, and general Alolan fauna.

 

[Delzethin]

Well I think the answer is in the question.

Similar to how early Target Tests borrowed a few thematic elements from their source material, it'd be cool if Lycanroc's borrowed from Alola's trial settings, featuring stuff like totem poles, trial gates, and general Alolan fauna.

It's ideas like these that make me wish something like individual Target Tests with visuals catered to each specific character was actually practical. But of course I'd be all for something that looks like it's set in Alola. Though perhaps specifically Vast Poni Canyon or Ten Carat Hill, or maybe Clawmark if they're pulling from the anime more overtly.

 

[LukeRNG]

Since we're at the last third of october, do you think they will announce 1 character similar to robin or will they wait for the smash direct in november? They kind of have to announce everything before it gets leaked.

 

[DeltaSceptile]

I still think there may be a chance for info this month. Why wait so long to reveal anything, when waiting this long seems to be making a lot of people stop speculating?

 

[Guynamednelson]

I still think there may be a chance for info this month. Why wait so long to reveal anything, when waiting this long seems to be making a lot of people stop speculating?

"We're slowing down reveals" was underestimated.

 

[GlaceonGD]

I was really hoping we'd get a direct this month honestly but it seems very unlikely that we will now, waiting takes too long am I right? Hopefully we don't have to wait too much longer because I'm getting annoyed at the lack of new info, really looking forward to seeing who the next characters will be. (Also I'm back now so that's good)

 

[Delzethin]

We really could stand for some news of note. Everyone's getting restless, and the stress is finding its way out in...less than pleasant ways, as you've probably seen.

If any of you feel your stress building, I recommend finding some means of letting that energy out. Whether it be exercise, or some kind of constructive or creative work, or even just finding a friend willing to lend an ear. I learned the hard way a long time ago what can happen when that stress reaches uncontrollable levels, and I wouldn't wish it on anyone.

 

[BluePikmin11]

I just seamlessly occupy my time with studying or consuming some anime/manga whenever there is nothing going on in Smash speculation.

 

[valkiriforce]

I mentioned in another thread I've just been going through Final Fantasy IV lately and it's been a good way of keeping myself occupied for a while with a fun, classic RPG for the SNES. We don't have that much longer to wait for some kind of news, since the game is getting out there to reviewers and other people who are experiencing this game in its fullness. It's good to keep yourself occupied with something in the meantime.

 

[MasteRMerF]

This has happened before, but it happened again the other night so I figured I'd share with you guys (long post incoming) I had a dream that Lycanroc was announced for Smash. It was during a Nintendo Direct, just a general one because they were talking about Let's Go Pikachu and Eevee. They talked about the game for a little bit, reminded us of it's upcoming release and then showed a new trailer. It started with a splash screen reading "An Alolan duo has been spotted in the Kanto Region!" Cut to split-screen gameplay of the Male trainer throwing out a Midnight Lycanroc and the female trainer throwing out a Midday Lycanroc. Some more gameplay of both of them, with a quick part of co-op gameplay with the forms following their trainers. They followed the trailer by saying Midnight would be exclusive to Pikachu and Midday to Eevee, but showed a different method of obtaining your favorite form: amiibos for Midnight and Midday. Using them would allow you to encounter whichever one somewhat early and also unlocked cute little customizable outfits for Pikachu and Eevee. Finished the direct with the usual "We have one more thing we'd like to show you, please take a look" *snap*
Usual Smash Bros. trailer with the logo opening. Trailer opens with a shot of the moon, before the camera pans down and we see something quickly run in front of it. We see a shadowed figure running through what looks like a field on all fours. Cut to Pokemon Trainer, wandering next to tall grass with pokedex in hand . He hears the grass start rustling around him, like something is about to pop out. He reaches and prepares a pokeball. Duck Hunt jumps out of the grass in front of him, being Duck Hunt and looking silly. PT sighs, when they both here the cry of a pokemon from above them. They both look up towards a rocky cliff. Dusk Lycanroc is standing in front of the moon, it howls as it's eyes turn red: LYCANROC ROCKS THE COMPETITION! There's a little more but I think I made this post way too long already

 

[LukeRNG]

Other than dealing with college, i'm currently 100% completing all smash games (except 64). With melee i've becoe tired of adventure mode so i'm on 3ds. Afterwards i'm going after brawl.

 

[Delzethin]

I've been working on my next video while still fighting off neck and shoulder pain. Easier said than done, especially when the latter only makes the stress worse. I've also been playing Fire Emblem Heroes, though I've been active in that since launch. New banner starts later tonight, so there's that to look forward to.

Other than dealing with college, i'm currently 100% completing all smash games (except 64). With melee i've becoe tired of adventure mode so i'm on 3ds. Afterwards i'm going after brawl.

100% completion of Melee?

Have...fun trying to get the Diskun trophy.

This has happened before, but it happened again the other night so I figured I'd share with you guys (long post incoming) I had a dream that Lycanroc was announced for Smash. It was during a Nintendo Direct, just a general one because they were talking about Let's Go Pikachu and Eevee. They talked about the game for a little bit, reminded us of it's upcoming release and then showed a new trailer. It started with a splash screen reading "An Alolan duo has been spotted in the Kanto Region!" Cut to split-screen gameplay of the Male trainer throwing out a Midnight Lycanroc and the female trainer throwing out a Midday Lycanroc. Some more gameplay of both of them, with a quick part of co-op gameplay with the forms following their trainers. They followed the trailer by saying Midnight would be exclusive to Pikachu and Midday to Eevee, but showed a different method of obtaining your favorite form: amiibos for Midnight and Midday. Using them would allow you to encounter whichever one somewhat early and also unlocked cute little customizable outfits for Pikachu and Eevee. Finished the direct with the usual "We have one more thing we'd like to show you, please take a look" *snap*
Usual Smash Bros. trailer with the logo opening. Trailer opens with a shot of the moon, before the camera pans down and we see something quickly run in front of it. We see a shadowed figure running through what looks like a field on all fours. Cut to Pokemon Trainer, wandering next to tall grass with pokedex in hand . He hears the grass start rustling around him, like something is about to pop out. He reaches and prepares a pokeball. Duck Hunt jumps out of the grass in front of him, being Duck Hunt and looking silly. PT sighs, when they both here the cry of a pokemon from above them. They both look up towards a rocky cliff. Dusk Lycanroc is standing in front of the moon, it howls as it's eyes turn red: LYCANROC ROCKS THE COMPETITION! There's a little more but I think I made this post way too long already

That's not half bad of a trailer idea, actually. Albeit a bit derivative of how K. Rool's trailer played out.

I've had a few trailer ideas, though I keep going back and forth on them, unable to decide which would work best.

 

[SuperSceptile15]

At this point I'm honestly hoping that any other non-Gen 1 Pokemon makes it in over Incineroar, whether it be Sceptile, Gardevoir, Decidueye, Lycanroc, Tapu Koko, etc. Anything would be preferable to... THIS monstrosity:

Also, Incineroar doesn't really strike me as a Nintendo all-star. Greninja worked his way into one with the anime like most of the Pokémon fighters. Can anyone really claim that Incineroar is on the level of Lucario or Greninja?

 

[RandomAce]

If it’s one thing we don’t really talk a lot here, what about movesets?

What are some suggestions you guys have for a potential Lycanroc moveset? Either a move, playstyle, ability, etc. I have some suggestions of my own that I do want to share actually, let me know what you think.

UP SPECIAL: ROCK CLIMB
I remember Delzethin using this move in both of his Lycanroc concepts, but I have a different take on that.

For my concept, I decided to make Rock Climb more like a Rock Climb. I think Lycanroc will summon a wave of earth under their feet to bring them up to the stage. Similar to how Roy’s Up special works, this part is a multi hit that racks up some damage, the trajectory can also be angled a bit like how Corrin can. The last part of the move has Lycanroc swerve the rock wave in an upward arc, similar to how Roy ends his recovery. This part of the move is what knocks the opponent out of their way. If Lycanroc does his up special either on the ground or close to the ground however, Lycanroc will instead go horizontally on the ground.

A little small gimmick I had in mind is that if you press B again, Lycanroc can end his recovery early and create a small wall. This can only work in the grounded version of their up special, only lasts for a couple of seconds (~6), and has a cool down. But it can help a Lycanroc player block some projectiles, and a skilled player can launch an opponent toward the wall to create a wall bounce to follow up with another attack.

I have a couple of more to talk about, but Rock Climb was something I found a lot of potential to work with the whole rock motif.

 

[Guynamednelson]

Can anyone really claim that Incineroar is on the level of Lucario or Greninja?

People that only want Incineroar because Verg exaggerate how much of a push it's getting.

Also, Lycanroc needs to have both Accelerock and Counter.

 

[Delzethin]

At this point I'm honestly hoping that any other non-Gen 1 Pokemon makes it in over Incineroar, whether it be Sceptile, Gardevoir, Decidueye, Lycanroc, Tapu Koko, etc. Anything would be preferable to... THIS monstrosity:

Also, Incineroar doesn't really strike me as a Nintendo all-star. Greninja worked his way into one with the anime like most of the Pokémon fighters. Can anyone really claim that Incineroar is on the level of Lucario or Greninja?

What in the...eesh, either I hadn't seen that animation before or I blocked it out of my memory. I've seen other Pokémon wind up with weird animations before, but yikes.

I've always thought the concept of a heel wrestler 'mon was harmless at worst, but honestly, over time the design has...whatever the opposite of "grown on me" is, and that animation doesn't help in the slightest. What were they thinking?

Makes me glad we haven't had to worry about that on our end as much.

If it’s one thing we don’t really talk a lot here, what about movesets?

What are some suggestions you guys have for a potential Lycanroc moveset? Either a move, playstyle, ability, etc. I have some suggestions of my own that I do want to share actually, let me know what you think.

UP SPECIAL: ROCK SLIDE
I remember Delzethin using this move in both of his Lycanroc concepts, but his idea never really clicked for me.

Why not make Rock Slide, and actual rock slide? I think Lycanroc will summon a wave of earth under their feet to bring them up to the stage. Similar to how Roy’s Up special works, this part is a multi hit that racks up some damage, the trajectory can also be angled a bit like how Corrin can. The last part of the move has Lycanroc swerve the rock wave in an upward arc, similar to how Roy ends his recovery. This part of the move is what knocks the opponent out of their way. If Lycanroc does his up special either on the ground or close to the ground however, Lycanroc will instead go horizontally on the ground.

A little small gimmick I had in mind is that if you press B again, Lycanroc can end his recovery early and create a small wall. This can only work in the grounded version of their up special, only lasts for a couple of seconds (~6), and has a cool down. But it can help a Lycanroc player block some projectiles, and a skilled player can launch an opponent toward the wall to create a wall bounce to follow up with another attack.

I have a couple of more to talk about, but Rock Slide was something I found a lot of potential to work with the whole rock motif.

The reason it seemed off for you might've been because the move I used was Rock Climb, not Rock Slide! Though your take on a recovery move is also interesting, especially with that alternate rock wall finisher on the ground.

What other moveset ideas does everyone have? Don't let the fact that I made a couple full concepts discourage you from trying out your own takes!

 

[RandomAce]

What in the...eesh, either I hadn't seen that animation before or I blocked it out of my memory. I've seen other Pokémon wind up with weird animations before, but yikes.

I've always thought the concept of a heel wrestler 'mon was harmless at worst, but honestly, over time the design has...whatever the opposite of "grown on me" is, and that animation doesn't help in the slightest. What were they thinking?

Makes me glad we haven't had to worry about that on our end as much.

The reason it seemed off for you might've been because the move I used was Rock Climb, not Rock Slide! Though your take on a recovery move is also interesting, especially with that alternate rock wall finisher on the ground.

What other moveset ideas does everyone have? Don't let the fact that I made a couple full concepts discourage you from trying out your own takes!

Durrrr... I forgot about that. Thanks for reminding me! I still wanted take some liberties with Lycanroc's recovery.

Anyways, I'm planning on making more of these, and soon I'll put them together to make an entire moveset. I wanted to gauge some discussion on Lycanroc's moveset. Someone else stated about how we should talk about "why players can find Lycanroc interesting", so I'm aiming to do just that!

 

[Garteam]

This is a very random idea I had for Up-B, it's a combination of Rock Climb and Rock Tomb. Lycanroc jumps off a large rock, propelling itself upward as it launches the rock down. Lycanroc has a small hitbox at the beginning, but this attack puts him into free fall and is clearly better for recovery than offence. The large offensive part of the attack is the rock that falls downward, which is slow but powerful. It is intended more as a tool for edgeguarding than fighting in the neutral.

Now that I write this out, I kinda realize this is just Bowser Jr.'s abandon ship without the explosion or the ability to attack afterwards.

 

[Cosmic77]

At this point I'm honestly hoping that any other non-Gen 1 Pokemon makes it in over Incineroar, whether it be Sceptile, Gardevoir, Decidueye, Lycanroc, Tapu Koko, etc. Anything would be preferable to... THIS monstrosity:

Also, Incineroar doesn't really strike me as a Nintendo all-star. Greninja worked his way into one with the anime like most of the Pokémon fighters. Can anyone really claim that Incineroar is on the level of Lucario or Greninja?

While I do think Incineroar would make more sense than the other two starters (at least from a promotional view), I can't seem to point out what Incineroar offers that would make Sakurai want to choose it over someone with even more promotion and a more unorthodox design like Lycanroc or Mimikyu.

Who knows? Sakurai suprised me before with Greninja, so maybe he'll do it again. I just can't help but worry that Incineroar will age at an underwhelming speed compared to the other options. Glory is fleeting, but obscurity lasts forever.

 

[Delzethin]

I'm all for channeling our energy into some alternate moveset concepts. It gives us something constructive to do for the time being until we get some actual news, haha. We could cover options like, say, a moveset that goes all in on geokinesis whenever possible, or one built more around stage control than baiting and punishing. The more examples we have, the more likely that something therein will resonate with anyone who finds it.

This is a very random idea I had for Up-B, it's a combination of Rock Climb and Rock Tomb. Lycanroc jumps off a large rock, propelling itself upward as it launches the rock down. Lycanroc has a small hitbox at the beginning, but this attack puts him into free fall and is clearly better for recovery than offence. The large offensive part of the attack is the rock that falls downward, which is slow but powerful. It is intended more as a tool for edgeguarding than fighting in the neutral.

Now that I write this out, I kinda realize this is just Bowser Jr.'s abandon ship without the explosion or the ability to attack afterwards.

For what it's worth, the fact that you're concerned it's too similar to Abandon Ship is a good sign. I've seen far too many concepts in the past rely on moves that were deliberately similar to something we already have ("Leaf Blade would work just like Dancing Blade", etc.). We want to emphasize what makes a move different from any that came before it!

Who knows? Sakurai suprised me before with Greninja, so maybe he'll do it again. I just can't help but worry that Incineroar will age at an underwhelming speed compared to the other options. Glory is fleeting, but obscurity lasts forever.

At least Greninja had the upside of being the roster's only waterbender with Squirtle's absence, and plans to be promoted like absolute crazy due to being set up to be Ash's ace for Kalos. Compared to that, Incineroar's based around the single most common element on the roster, uses motifs that have all been touched on already in some way, and hasn't had anything close to the promotion Greninja got, aside from a secondary role in one movie and another secondary role in the anime with only four appearances so far. If anything, the 'mon that has trended closest to Greninja this generation...is, well, Lycanroc.

So, naturally, everyone outside the Pokémon fandom is convinced now that the former must already have Greninja levels of promotion and that the latter couldn't possibly be of any importance. Few things hurt more than getting little credit for everything you've accomplished, while watching someone else be applauded for doing far less just because they were expected to succeed and you weren't...

 

[WaddleMatt]

I'm all for channeling our energy into some alternate moveset concepts. It gives us something constructive to do for the time being until we get some actual news, haha. We could cover options like, say, a moveset that goes all in on geokinesis whenever possible, or one built more around stage control than baiting and punishing. The more examples we have, the more likely that something therein will resonate with anyone who finds it.


For what it's worth, the fact that you're concerned it's too similar to Abandon Ship is a good sign. I've seen far too many concepts in the past rely on moves that were deliberately similar to something we already have ("Leaf Blade would work just like Dancing Blade", etc.). We want to emphasize what makes a move different from any that came before it!


At least Greninja had the upside of being the roster's only waterbender with Squirtle's absence, and plans to be promoted like absolute crazy due to being set up to be Ash's ace for Kalos. Compared to that, Incineroar's based around the single most common element on the roster, uses motifs that have all been touched on already in some way, and hasn't had anything close to the promotion Greninja got, aside from a secondary role in one movie and another secondary role in the anime with only four appearances so far. If anything, the 'mon that has trended closest to Greninja this generation...is, well, Lycanroc.

So, naturally, everyone outside the Pokémon fandom is convinced now that the former must already have Greninja levels of promotion and that the latter couldn't possibly be of any importance. Few things hurt more than getting little credit for everything you've accomplished, while watching someone else be applauded for doing far less just because they were expected to succeed and you weren't...

Wait do people outside of the Pokemon community seem to think Incineroar is a star in the anime right now? Lol that is hilarious.

 

[RileyXY1]

Wait do people outside of the Pokemon community seem to think Incineroar is a star in the anime right now? Lol that is hilarious.

Yeah. They're presuming based on Vergeben's reports that Incineroar is the star Pokemon of Generation 7, when it appears to actually be Lycanroc.

 

[SmashNStache]

Ehh, I'm honestly not really putting my bets on any of these leaks or anything. Then again I tend to not really put much stock into most of them.

And while Incineroar's got quite a bit going for it, you're not going to get any arguments from me that the anime's spotlight is on Lycanroc. And while he might end up sharing it I don't think he's going to be pushed out of it. Very likely going to have a big role throughout. I may be a supporter of the big fire cat myself, but I still think Lycanroc's got a great shot.

Just figured since Incineroar and the whole 'anime star' was brought up, I'd offer the perspective from an Incineroar supporter who agrees Lycanroc's got the anime's spotlight and someone who isn't really on board the whole leak thing. Not sure if it's wanted or anything, but eh.

 

[Garteam]

Wait do people outside of the Pokemon community seem to think Incineroar is a star in the anime right now? Lol that is hilarious.

It's a combination of people trying to justify Vergeben and people incorrectly assuming that if Ash has a Pokemon evolve once it must evolve again to its final stage (which is not inherently true, as seen by Bayleef, Pignite, Quilava, etc.).

 

[Delzethin]

It's a combination of people trying to justify Vergeben and people incorrectly assuming that if Ash has a Pokemon evolve once it must evolve again to its final stage (which is not inherently true, as seen by Bayleef, Pignite, Quilava, etc.).

That, and the leaked starter concept art from back in summer 2016. One of the uncolored sketches in the Incineroar sheet has Ash, Mallow, and a Rowlet standing around a sleeping one. Recent rumors have collectively led a bunch of people who haven't followed Pokémon news to assume this sketch must mean that Ash's Torracat is destined to evolve and take over the ace role.

Which is not only a huge reach, it completely ignores other explanations. Like the possibility that the sketch was just for fun, or that it's supposed to be Kukui's Incineroar. And it's all from people who didn't think the art meant anything back when Decidueye and Mimikyu were the favorite picks!

I suppose it's a consequence of small reference pools. Those who haven't followed Pokémon news as closely have just assumed that whichever 'mons are being talked about the most must be the most likely, and then turn around and base their arguments on the presumption that their premise is already correct. Frustrating, especially when such a sizeable number of people give it a free pass.


...Anyway, let's make this post more constructive, shall we? Let's pivot back to moveset talk.

Sometimes it helps to know when to change something you've already planned out. For example, I've been wondering if my original idea for Stealth Rock could use altering now that Isabelle's Lloid Mine functions similarly. Maybe instead of the rock buying itself in the ground, it'd bounce off and then rise up to just above ground level and hover in place? Having a floating obstruction at waist level would be better at controlling space and coralling opponents but not as effective as a trap and combo starter, so there're multiple aspects to weigh here...

 

[WaddleMatt]

That, and the leaked starter concept art from back in summer 2016. One of the uncolored sketches in the Incineroar sheet has Ash, Mallow, and a Rowlet standing around a sleeping one. Recent rumors have collectively led a bunch of people who haven't followed Pokémon news to assume this sketch must mean that Ash's Torracat is destined to evolve and take over the ace role.

Which is not only a huge reach, it completely ignores other explanations. Like the possibility that the sketch was just for fun, or that it's supposed to be Kukui's Incineroar. And it's all from people who didn't think the art meant anything back when Decidueye and Mimikyu were the favorite picks!

I suppose it's a consequence of small reference pools. Those who haven't followed Pokémon news as closely have just assumed that whichever 'mons are being talked about the most must be the most likely, and then turn around and base their arguments on the presumption that their premise is already correct. Frustrating, especially when such a sizeable number of people give it a free pass.


...Anyway, let's make this post more constructive, shall we? Let's pivot back to moveset talk.

Sometimes it helps to know when to change something you've already planned out. For example, I've been wondering if my original idea for Stealth Rock could use altering now that Isabelle's Lloid Mine functions similarly. Maybe instead of the rock buying itself in the ground, it'd bounce off and then rise up to just above ground level and hover in place? Having a floating obstruction at waist level would be better at controlling space and coralling opponents but not as effective as a trap and combo starter, so there're multiple aspects to weigh here...

That sounds fine but how many could be placed at once? I'm guessing only one?

 

[Delzethin]

That sounds fine but how many could be placed at once? I'm guessing only one?

Yep! Even my current setup for Stealth Rock has it so only one can be placed at a time. More than that would make it too oppressive and unbalanced of a tool! It's like how Smash 4 changed Diddy's banana peels so that he can only have one out at a time.

Not that it stopped them from being OP anyway, but that's more because Diddy has super fast followups + the quickest item toss animation in the game.

 

[DeltaSceptile]

More than that would make it too oppressive and unbalanced of a tool!

That’s never been part of the thought process for Bayonetta being near-impossible to beat because of infinite aerial combos.

 

[Delzethin]

Well, this is an interesting turn of events.

I'm sure you've probably heard of the newest potential leak by now, but I'll leave my thoughts in spoilers for the time being.

Spoiler

https://www.resetera.com/threads/ru...leak-allegedly-reveals-every-character.76702/

This...seems like it could be legit. Nothing's for sure yet, but more details are lining up than you usually get with hoaxes. The character arrangements, the way they tie into a 4chan post from almost a month ago, the name that wasn't obscured enough having ties to an actual French graphic design company that has known connections to Bamco, and particularly the fact that there's promotional material for the new Grinch movie in one shot that we haven't seen before.

Granted, we've seen elaborate fakes before, but this one...has potential in a way that most blatant fakes don't.

The most notable thing here for us is that it would mean no new Pokémon for the base roster. While most speculators will assume Gen 7 is done for and that they'd jump right into Gen 8 to "promote it early", that is not Sakurai's MO. Corrin didn't make it in until 7 1/2 months after Fire Emblem Fates' release, and Roy was a late add echo fighter to Melee who only got in before his game because his game was delayed!

In other words, the absence of a Gen 7 newcomer would leave the door open for one to happen all the way up until Gen 8 hits shelves, I think...and since they'd be judging things based on roughly right now, we would be the standout choice for a Pokémon newcomer up until that deadline hits.

So, don't worry. Like I've said a few times now, we can play the long game in a way that no one else from Gen 7 can. If this thing is true, it'd help our chances in the long term.

Long story short, if it's legitimate, we'd be punting on the base roster but end up with great field positioning for DLC, so to speak. Considering we've been sitting at 3rd-and-long for the last month, I'd take that.

Thoughts, everyone?

 

[RileyXY1]

Well, this is an interesting turn of events.

I'm sure you've probably heard of the newest potential leak by now, but I'll leave my thoughts in spoilers for the time being.

Spoiler

https://www.resetera.com/threads/ru...leak-allegedly-reveals-every-character.76702/

This...seems like it could be legit. Nothing's for sure yet, but more details are lining up than you usually get with hoaxes. The character arrangements, the way they tie into a 4chan post from almost a month ago, the name that wasn't obscured enough having ties to an actual French graphic design company that has known connections to Bamco, and particularly the fact that there's promotional material for the new Grinch movie in one shot that we haven't seen before.

Granted, we've seen elaborate fakes before, but this one...has potential in a way that most blatant fakes don't.

The most notable thing here for us is that it would mean no new Pokémon for the base roster. While most speculators will assume Gen 7 is done for and that they'd jump right into Gen 8 to "promote it early", that is not Sakurai's MO. Corrin didn't make it in until 7 1/2 months after Fire Emblem Fates' release, and Roy was a late add echo fighter to Melee who only got in before his game because his game was delayed!

In other words, the absence of a Gen 7 newcomer would leave the door open for one to happen all the way up until Gen 8 hits shelves, I think...and since they'd be judging things based on roughly right now, we would be the standout choice for a Pokémon newcomer up until that deadline hits.

So, don't worry. Like I've said a few times now, we can play the long game in a way that no one else from Gen 7 can. If this thing is true, it'd help our chances in the long term.

Long story short, if it's legitimate, we'd be punting on the base roster but end up with great field positioning for DLC, so to speak. Considering we've been sitting at 3rd-and-long for the last month, I'd take that.

Thoughts, everyone?

That leak is way too optimistic.

 

[WeirdChillFever]

Well, this is an interesting turn of events.

I'm sure you've probably heard of the newest potential leak by now, but I'll leave my thoughts in spoilers for the time being.

Spoiler

https://www.resetera.com/threads/ru...leak-allegedly-reveals-every-character.76702/

This...seems like it could be legit. Nothing's for sure yet, but more details are lining up than you usually get with hoaxes. The character arrangements, the way they tie into a 4chan post from almost a month ago, the name that wasn't obscured enough having ties to an actual French graphic design company that has known connections to Bamco, and particularly the fact that there's promotional material for the new Grinch movie in one shot that we haven't seen before.

Granted, we've seen elaborate fakes before, but this one...has potential in a way that most blatant fakes don't.

The most notable thing here for us is that it would mean no new Pokémon for the base roster. While most speculators will assume Gen 7 is done for and that they'd jump right into Gen 8 to "promote it early", that is not Sakurai's MO. Corrin didn't make it in until 7 1/2 months after Fire Emblem Fates' release, and Roy was a late add echo fighter to Melee who only got in before his game because his game was delayed!

In other words, the absence of a Gen 7 newcomer would leave the door open for one to happen all the way up until Gen 8 hits shelves, I think...and since they'd be judging things based on roughly right now, we would be the standout choice for a Pokémon newcomer up until that deadline hits.

So, don't worry. Like I've said a few times now, we can play the long game in a way that no one else from Gen 7 can. If this thing is true, it'd help our chances in the long term.

Long story short, if it's legitimate, we'd be punting on the base roster but end up with great field positioning for DLC, so to speak. Considering we've been sitting at 3rd-and-long for the last month, I'd take that.

Thoughts, everyone?

Of course. The Lycanroc thread had *one* page without leak talk and this happens

Team Fake because it's too optimistic and against what Sakurai noted about reveal schedules and roster size

 

[Garteam]

Well, this is an interesting turn of events.

I'm sure you've probably heard of the newest potential leak by now, but I'll leave my thoughts in spoilers for the time being.

Spoiler

https://www.resetera.com/threads/ru...leak-allegedly-reveals-every-character.76702/

This...seems like it could be legit. Nothing's for sure yet, but more details are lining up than you usually get with hoaxes. The character arrangements, the way they tie into a 4chan post from almost a month ago, the name that wasn't obscured enough having ties to an actual French graphic design company that has known connections to Bamco, and particularly the fact that there's promotional material for the new Grinch movie in one shot that we haven't seen before.

Granted, we've seen elaborate fakes before, but this one...has potential in a way that most blatant fakes don't.

The most notable thing here for us is that it would mean no new Pokémon for the base roster. While most speculators will assume Gen 7 is done for and that they'd jump right into Gen 8 to "promote it early", that is not Sakurai's MO. Corrin didn't make it in until 7 1/2 months after Fire Emblem Fates' release, and Roy was a late add echo fighter to Melee who only got in before his game because his game was delayed!

In other words, the absence of a Gen 7 newcomer would leave the door open for one to happen all the way up until Gen 8 hits shelves, I think...and since they'd be judging things based on roughly right now, we would be the standout choice for a Pokémon newcomer up until that deadline hits.

So, don't worry. Like I've said a few times now, we can play the long game in a way that no one else from Gen 7 can. If this thing is true, it'd help our chances in the long term.

Long story short, if it's legitimate, we'd be punting on the base roster but end up with great field positioning for DLC, so to speak. Considering we've been sitting at 3rd-and-long for the last month, I'd take that.

Thoughts, everyone?

While the detail on this is really, REALLY impressive, I'm not fully sure I believe it solely due to the quantity of characters. 5 unique, unrevealed newcomers 6 weeks ahead of the game's release feels a little too... optimistic.

Plus, the character selection also feels way too predictable to really feel like the final roster. I mean, the ESRB leak had Duck Hunt, Bowser Jr., and Shulk, 3 characters with only one of them being seen as likely. Now we're here: Geno, Banjo, Chorus Kids, AND Isaac? 3 of the most talked about characters and a character concept that's been getting traction since Gematsu 4 years ago. Not mention Ken and Shadow, two of the most talked about echoes period. The only really out of left field character is Mach Rider, and he's still a fairly popular retro choice.

On a completely unrelated note, Melmetal looks like an absolute unit.

 

[SmashNStache]

Well, this is an interesting turn of events.

I'm sure you've probably heard of the newest potential leak by now, but I'll leave my thoughts in spoilers for the time being.

Spoiler

https://www.resetera.com/threads/ru...leak-allegedly-reveals-every-character.76702/

This...seems like it could be legit. Nothing's for sure yet, but more details are lining up than you usually get with hoaxes. The character arrangements, the way they tie into a 4chan post from almost a month ago, the name that wasn't obscured enough having ties to an actual French graphic design company that has known connections to Bamco, and particularly the fact that there's promotional material for the new Grinch movie in one shot that we haven't seen before.

Granted, we've seen elaborate fakes before, but this one...has potential in a way that most blatant fakes don't.

The most notable thing here for us is that it would mean no new Pokémon for the base roster. While most speculators will assume Gen 7 is done for and that they'd jump right into Gen 8 to "promote it early", that is not Sakurai's MO. Corrin didn't make it in until 7 1/2 months after Fire Emblem Fates' release, and Roy was a late add echo fighter to Melee who only got in before his game because his game was delayed!

In other words, the absence of a Gen 7 newcomer would leave the door open for one to happen all the way up until Gen 8 hits shelves, I think...and since they'd be judging things based on roughly right now, we would be the standout choice for a Pokémon newcomer up until that deadline hits.

So, don't worry. Like I've said a few times now, we can play the long game in a way that no one else from Gen 7 can. If this thing is true, it'd help our chances in the long term.

Long story short, if it's legitimate, we'd be punting on the base roster but end up with great field positioning for DLC, so to speak. Considering we've been sitting at 3rd-and-long for the last month, I'd take that.

Thoughts, everyone?

If this is real (which I'm cautious as always), I'm really torn. On the one hand, I'm a little disappointed to see no Gen 7 rep here, but on the other hand I really low-key want some of the characters in this.

If (a big if) this is real, I'd be fine with this.

 

[SupriceSupplies]

Well, this is an interesting turn of events.

I'm sure you've probably heard of the newest potential leak by now, but I'll leave my thoughts in spoilers for the time being.

Spoiler

https://www.resetera.com/threads/ru...leak-allegedly-reveals-every-character.76702/

This...seems like it could be legit. Nothing's for sure yet, but more details are lining up than you usually get with hoaxes. The character arrangements, the way they tie into a 4chan post from almost a month ago, the name that wasn't obscured enough having ties to an actual French graphic design company that has known connections to Bamco, and particularly the fact that there's promotional material for the new Grinch movie in one shot that we haven't seen before.

Granted, we've seen elaborate fakes before, but this one...has potential in a way that most blatant fakes don't.

The most notable thing here for us is that it would mean no new Pokémon for the base roster. While most speculators will assume Gen 7 is done for and that they'd jump right into Gen 8 to "promote it early", that is not Sakurai's MO. Corrin didn't make it in until 7 1/2 months after Fire Emblem Fates' release, and Roy was a late add echo fighter to Melee who only got in before his game because his game was delayed!

In other words, the absence of a Gen 7 newcomer would leave the door open for one to happen all the way up until Gen 8 hits shelves, I think...and since they'd be judging things based on roughly right now, we would be the standout choice for a Pokémon newcomer up until that deadline hits.

So, don't worry. Like I've said a few times now, we can play the long game in a way that no one else from Gen 7 can. If this thing is true, it'd help our chances in the long term.

Long story short, if it's legitimate, we'd be punting on the base roster but end up with great field positioning for DLC, so to speak. Considering we've been sitting at 3rd-and-long for the last month, I'd take that.

Thoughts, everyone?

Team doubt here. Not completely dismissing it, but the amount of characters that are supposedly left to be revealed are... high. With only about 44 days left, I find it somewhat hard to believe, especially with Sakurai stating they'd reveal every fighter before release, on top of slowing announcements down. (Although you could argue that's already happened, but I don't see it picking up. I'm expecting 2 echoes and 2 uniques myself) But the details behind it make me unsure of my judgement.

But if it's true, I do still agree with Lycanroc having the best shot of any potential Pokémon newcomer prior to Gen 8's release. But I'm still unsure whether they're going to bother adding a new Pokémon until generation 8 is out. Anything can happen, I suppose. Maybe have a gen 7 Pokémon as a newcomer as a final send-off for the generation? Maybe I'm heavily stretching it, but I like to believe.

 

[Shanoa]

Well, this is an interesting turn of events.

I'm sure you've probably heard of the newest potential leak by now, but I'll leave my thoughts in spoilers for the time being.

Spoiler

https://www.resetera.com/threads/ru...leak-allegedly-reveals-every-character.76702/

This...seems like it could be legit. Nothing's for sure yet, but more details are lining up than you usually get with hoaxes. The character arrangements, the way they tie into a 4chan post from almost a month ago, the name that wasn't obscured enough having ties to an actual French graphic design company that has known connections to Bamco, and particularly the fact that there's promotional material for the new Grinch movie in one shot that we haven't seen before.

Granted, we've seen elaborate fakes before, but this one...has potential in a way that most blatant fakes don't.

The most notable thing here for us is that it would mean no new Pokémon for the base roster. While most speculators will assume Gen 7 is done for and that they'd jump right into Gen 8 to "promote it early", that is not Sakurai's MO. Corrin didn't make it in until 7 1/2 months after Fire Emblem Fates' release, and Roy was a late add echo fighter to Melee who only got in before his game because his game was delayed!

In other words, the absence of a Gen 7 newcomer would leave the door open for one to happen all the way up until Gen 8 hits shelves, I think...and since they'd be judging things based on roughly right now, we would be the standout choice for a Pokémon newcomer up until that deadline hits.

So, don't worry. Like I've said a few times now, we can play the long game in a way that no one else from Gen 7 can. If this thing is true, it'd help our chances in the long term.

Long story short, if it's legitimate, we'd be punting on the base roster but end up with great field positioning for DLC, so to speak. Considering we've been sitting at 3rd-and-long for the last month, I'd take that.

Thoughts, everyone?

It's hard to confirm the legitimacy of this leak, though it interests me because people have pointed out it lines up with some details (and apparently the designer's linkedin was deleted like one of the previous ultimate leaks?). But while I think it's possible, the lack of a Pokemon newcomer in the base roster raises some questions.

Edit: Okay I heard the info about the deleted linkedin is false, people probably thought it's gone because you require an account to access it.

 

[Guynamednelson]

Well, it's certainly one way to prove Incineroar isn't getting Greninja-tier promotion.

 

[RandomAce]

I’m fifty-fifty on this.

On one hand, it may seem too optimistic, but a lot of people have pointed out that the newcomers still fall into Sakurai’s criteria, and that this image would be incredibly hard to fake, especially since some of the characters have moved.

A) We would still have less newcomers than previous games, 10- 11* brand new fighters, which fits Sakurai’s not expecting too many new challengers. Even with echoes, we’re still at 16-17*, which is still less than Smash 4, and Sakurai never really specified how many we’ll get.

B) Sakurai never specified if slowing down reveals meant less charcaters. Even with 7-8* new challengers we would still would have received information about 2 months after Isabelle.

So, what does this have to do with Lycanroc? One thing that’s interesting is that Spawn Wave has stated that there is one character in the mural not yet mentioned from this leak. So that may be where our Pokémon newcomer is. Now, what if there isn’t any? We would be the most likely Gen 7 Pokémon for DLC. Sakurai wouldn’t have to look into future plans and instead looked at what already happened, and with Lycanroc being this generations’s top dog, Lycanroc could very likely get selected.

I do want to say that, if there is a Gen 7 Pokémon for the base game, then I would be a little worried since Incineroar and Verge would still be a threat, but I still think that Lycanroc is still likely. It’s just that oddly, DLC may make Lycanroc even more likely.

Either way, we still got this. Lycanroc is still a possibility with what they’ve got going for them.

*There’s currently a figure around Shiek’s spot on the banner, it seems like it resembles Elma, but I want to know most people thoughts on this.