COMPETITIVE Brawl+: Code Agenda

[0RLY]

-Harder Powershield
Decrease the window of powershielding by 3 frames

Melee powershield: 1 frame
Brawl powershield: 2 frames

Failure.

 

[kupo15]

Im Confused to this Gimp Mode, thing your talking about Kupo......free fall as in what exactly?

Also would it not be smarter to just build off 1.2, and implement any features from 1.1 if needed?
.

Like, free falling as in what you look like after a melee air dodge in brawl. Not blinking, but cant do anything. No it would not be a good idea to work off of 1.2 and here is why.
Both 1.1 and 1.2 have the twirl hit stun glitch and bounce off of the wall hit stun glitch
1.1 has a better hit stun mechanic because it takes damage into account. 1.2 does not

So, the common factor between 1.1 and 1.2 is the twirl hit stun and wall hitstun so that doesn't make a difference.
I think it would be easier to rework 1.1 by fixing the gimp mode glitch than fix 1.2 and fix the hit stun mechanic. It might bring gimp mode back. But idk

I honestly don't think the people who are demanding that L-canceling stay manual have any idea how real fighting games work, or what the purpose of a "cancel" is. =/

When there is no advantage to NOT canceling, it's an extremely pointless technique.

It's like "Hey guys, Guilty Gear would be so much more competitive if we had to manually cancel every aerial to do combos."

...no

Besides, I really feel like manual L-canceling would alienate a good portion of newer Brawl players, and I don't think that should be our goal.

Why don't we see how broken auto L-cancel is or isn't when we have a code to do it?

This....is too good. Ppl have to listen to this...srsly.

Melee powershield: 1 frame
Brawl powershield: 2 frames

Failure.

I made a guess. I thought I heard 3 frames and was waiting to be corrected. So what....big deal...

 

[BrutalBrutal]

Everyone is talking about faster-falling without realizing that there is an inherent problem with it: the maximum horizontal aerial velocity of characters is too low. Characters should (a) lose less momentum when they jump and (b) be able to move faster horizontally in the air. It should be fixed so that even though characters fall faster, they are able to cover as much distance in a jump as they can in regular Brawl. That way, recoveries would not be gimped.

 

[MBlaze]

I honestly don't think the people who are demanding that L-canceling stay manual have any idea how real fighting games work, or what the purpose of a "cancel" is. =/

When there is no advantage to NOT canceling, it's an extremely pointless technique.

It's like "Hey guys, Guilty Gear would be so much more competitive if we had to manually cancel every aerial to do combos."

...no

Besides, I really feel like manual L-canceling would alienate a good portion of newer Brawl players, and I don't think that should be our goal.

Why don't we see how broken auto L-cancel is or isn't when we have a code to do it?

It's their ****ing job to know this stuff when they go to tourneys, stop being lazy and/or making it easier than it really needs to be, this is the reason Brawl is the way it is now. Sakurai tried to make it easy and playable for everyone so it wouldn't seperate the good from the casual.

If there are newer Brawlers that don't know adv techs when they go to tourneys tough ****, they learn.

 

[Makkun]

I just realized... Taking out the ledge auto-sweetspot really wouldn't work well at all. Off the top of my head, I thought of MK using his up-b and gliding to the stage... but he wouldn't be able to even grab the edge.

Same goes for tether-recovery, even though that has been stated before.

 

[ChronoPenguin]

It's their ****ing job to know this stuff when they go to tourneys, stop being lazy and/or making it easier than it really needs to be, this is the reason Brawl is the way it is now. Sakurai tried to make it easy and playable for everyone so it wouldn't seperate the good from the casual.

If there are newer Brawlers that don't know adv techs when they go to tourneys tough ****, they learn.

Having to Press L every time you do an aerial to be "Competively viable" Is bull.

This worked in melee as well, in melee you could use an aerial, Space yourself while doing it and just L cancel while Fast falling.

It was tedious to do so but then it just became second nature to people. Note it didn't become a skill, it became more of a Muscle reflex. I don't see how a muscle reflex then constitutes as more skill >.>
In brawl people want to wave bounce, or do reversals, buffer, etc during their aerials.
So they have to L-cancel, SH, FF, Wavebounce/Reversal (or both >.>) maybe do an additional thing too, while spacing.

Thats more than melee.


Also what tournament?
Brawl+ is not going to take over the competitive scene.
Which means your hoping the interested minority knows how to Press L during every aerial.
Whoop de doo, real fun, real competitive >.>

In melee, you might say "Well if they Miss an L cancel..."....well L canceling becomes a muscle reflex later on, and is easier to do since the L and R triggers are pressure sensetive unlike in brawl. Which also meant people were unlikely to Miss an L cancel, and so you considered that someone would always L-cancel.
L-canceling wasn't very Whoop de doo, look at me I have skill. It was pretty easy, it was doing other things in combination with it that could be hard for people.
SH FF, is harder than L-canceling >.>
If you like to use specials in the air, then SH FF, Wavebounce a special. Takes place of L-canceling.....


Im just saying, Whats the purpose of using L-canceling, was it for skill or was it to make it so certain characters could actually do things decently. Like Ganondorf should always be L-canceling in melee, etc.
If you had auto L-canceling in melee, it wouldn't change anything, except people wouldn't be pressing L every second they pick up a controller out of reflex >.>

Disagree me with you wish, I don't claim to be a wiseman.


Also srsly....Theres enough for people to keep focused on in brawl without this manual L-canceling junk, just make it auto so we get the same effect with less hassle.


Also theres nothing wrong with making things accessible to people. The only issue is when someone does this, and deteriorates aspects of things.

Such as in Brawl...Tripping.
Or Tether recoveries.

Auto L-canceling isn't going to do anything wrong by the game.

 

[JacobWins]

How bout' now L canceling at all?

Laggy aerials are laggy for a reason

 

[WoodyWiggins]

Just curious, what about applying Magus's powersheilding idea? I forgot most of the details, but does it involve replacing the Sheild in S-canceling with Powershield (making it P-Cancel, P-Can, Pecan, Toucan, Fruit Loops, Cereal. . . Hungry!)? That would give landing aerials an L-Cancel effect, while adding a frame or two of protection, if perfom correctly, that is.

Yep. . . I'm about to rant now, nothing serious though.

I think the Melee Air Dodge is out of place in Brawl(+). It seems as if hacks have been built to accommadate the Wavedash. If anything, we should find a way to make SJR/ISJR easier to perform. That technique is like the mother of all techniques. It combines L-cancel with the mobility of Wavedashing and the intensity of shuffling(SHFFL). Besides that it would give Brawl(+) it's own unique gameplay. When looking at the previous Smash games;

Smash 64 is more shield breaking, l-canceling ,combo oriented - making seem more like a traditional fighter (compared to Melee).

Melee is more l-canceling, wavedashing, spacing, edge gaurding, chain grabbing, combo oriented - More emphasis was placed on SHFFLing and Wavedashing, which made the gameplay of Melee completely from Smash 64.

Brawl(+) could be Aerial and possibly sheild breaking (when hit stun develops), if SJR/ISJR was made easier to perform. ISJR/SJR could do for Brawl what Wavedashing did for Melee. Not to mention the wavebounce, chain grabbing and infinite aspect of Brawl.

In short I think Brawl(+) has a lot to offer and doesn't need to play like Melee. I think we should improve Brawl original mechanics, instead of changing into something altogether new. Think I should make a new thread regarding SJR/ISJR and it's place in Brawl(+)?
/rant. . .

 

[ChronoPenguin]

Just curious, what about applying Magus's powersheilding idea? I forgot most of the details, but does it involve replacing the Sheild in S-canceling with Powershield (making it P-Cancel, P-Can, Pecan, Toucan, Fruit Loops, Cereal. . . Hungry!)? That would give landing aerials an L-Cancel effect, while adding a frame or two of protection, if perfom correctly, that is.

Yep. . . I'm about to rant now, nothing serious though.

I think the Melee Air Dodge is out of place in Brawl(+). It seems as if hacks have been built to accommadate the Wavedash. If anything, we should find a way to make SJR/ISJR easier to perform. That technique is like the mother of all techniques. It combines L-cancel with the mobility of Wavedashing and the intensity of shuffling(SHFFL). Besides that it would give Brawl(+) it's own unique gameplay. When looking at the previous Smash games;

Smash 64 is more shield breaking, l-canceling ,combo oriented - making seem more like a traditional fighter (compared to Melee).

Melee is more l-canceling, wavedashing, spacing, edge gaurding, chain grabbing, combo oriented - More emphasis was placed on SHFFLing and Wavedashing, which made the gameplay of Melee completely from Smash 64.

Brawl(+) could be Aerial and possibly sheild breaking (when hit stun develops), if SJR/ISJR was made easier to perform. ISJR/SJR could do for Brawl what Wavedashing did for Melee. Not to mention the wavebounce, chain grabbing and infinite aspect of Brawl.

In short I think Brawl(+) has a lot to offer and doesn't need to play like Melee. I think we should improve Brawl original mechanics, instead of changing into something altogether new. Think I should make a new thread regarding SJR/ISJR and it's place in Brawl(+)?
/rant. . .

If I wasn't a man insecure about his sexuality. A person mentally strong enough to do something without the discomfort of being called "Homo". I would hug you for this post.
However I am and so thus "No homo", Nice post.

CWUTIDIDTHAR?


Anyways Ya I know this place is for discussing codes so far.
However can we actually move from the melee wishes for a bit, and look for some other ideas on codes.
People sound like a broken record now "Uh...more hitstun...more hitstun....+ more hitstun".

Also By what i meant Nice post...I mean the idea of thinking
Of your last sentiments and not so much on your ISJR stuff (Im scatter-brained today).

 

[leafgreen386]

Agreeing with Chrono that that is a very good point you made, Woody. Figuring out what we could expand that is truly brawl specific might be a bit difficult, though.

As for the whole manual/auto l-cancel thing... do you or do you not agree that aerials in this game should have half lag? Surely, if you're in support of manual l-canceling, that you do agree they should have half lag. Now, pretend for a moment that the halved lag in melee was the default, and that there was no l-canceling. Does this amount of lag on moves seem right to you? It probably does, considering you played melee with people who knew how to l-cancel, and nearly all of the time, this was the amount of lag they had. Now, back to the melee where you had to press L or R every time you perform an aerial otherwise you have double that lag. Why should a character have twice as much lag as they should just because they missed an arbitrary button press?

The lag in brawl is currently too much. This is why we're even considering putting in any kind of l-cancel. If we're changing the lag of the aerials anyway, why attach an unnecessary button press to it? To add more "skill" to the game? Please. It does nothing for the depth. The implementation of the half lag is what is adding depth, allowing characters to act more quickly after an aerial and follow up attacks (which still having enough lag to be punishable). The button press does nothing. It's like making it so you have to rotate the control stick once every time before you press a button. Sure, it makes the game more technical, but does it actually add anything to its depth? Not at all. Furthermore, brawl+ only has a cult following right now. Implementing an arbitrary button press to perform a basic technique will only serve to drive away potential players.

 

[MBlaze]

I'm probably going to not end up playing Brawl+ if this stupid **** gets in. How the hell do reflexes not matter?

 

[kupo15]

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E0000000 80008000

 

[Endless Nightmares]

This thread should be renamed the "Noobs Ruin Brawl+" thread. Auto L-canceling? gtfo

Also, S-canceling is complete garbage and should be scrapped.

 

[MBlaze]

Yea, I agree with you, and I am making an in depth vid of what you can do with it to show how overpowered it really is.

Marioblaze: You don't have to play with auto l canceling. You have l canceling and can keep it instead of switching. Please tell me why certain players have to overcome an additional weakness by adding tech skill to their game when others don't have to? And you mention reflexes. What reflexes are you talking about? Your in control of the l cancel and the button press for the l cancel is on your terms. You know when its coming up so its not really a reflex that adds anything like DI. You need more reflexes to have good DI than you do l canceling.

I'm just responding to their very logical posts. I know I can do that Kupo but if it and stuff like gameplay speed up get decided to use for alternative tourneys I'm not participating.

 

[kupo15]

manual
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80000001 00000000
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E0000000 80008000

 

[MuBa]

I'd say let's keep L-Canceling in Brawl since it's always been a staple in Smash Bros. Also while L-canceling does not really add depth to the game, it does add a type of difficulty that rewards the player (by not getting punished and the ability to string combos together) if executed correctly.

L-Canceling is not simply pressing a button it's pressing a button at the RIGHT TIME. That itself takes skill to use and is something that is necessary in a competitive Smash Brothers game.

Edit: I wish auto-canceled aerials never existed. It limits the game's competitive potential -_-;

 

[kupo15]

i know for me, i just want a non buggy l cancel and auto l cancel is just a bonus.

 

[ChronoPenguin]

I lol when people say "Lets have a code to increase game speed by 1.25" or some crap like that, wtf is this?

I'm fine with Any decision.
Whether there Is L-canceling.
Theres Manual L-canceling.
Or there is Auto L-canceling, it does not bother me, to actually play.
However I just don't want to have to Manual L-cancel.
When I learned to L-cancel in melee I was saying to myself "Woot, Yes sweet!".

At one point my cousin who had played Longer then me and I had a small discussion.
Quite simply, he stated it had become purely muscle reflex for him.

When he pressed A, he instinctively pressed L/R as well.
When Brawl came out, How many people were pressing L sub-consciously?
It became a Muscle Reflex, it was not skill.
At the point it becomes a Muscle Reflex, the only reason you Miss an L-cancel is not because of a lack of tech skill, your muscles probably just crapped out on you for that one instance.
L-canceling is really only "Technical" when your first learning it.
Then you just end up Pressing L/R whenever you press A.
Also theres the issue with no sensitivity in the L/R buttons.
Having to press it all the way down is such a chore, and I would not want to change my controls for a more responsive L-cancel.

Also how does someone make a comparison between DI and L-cancel. DI takes more skill to do than L-cancel. Infact, you can L-cancel with your eyes closed. DI'ing with your eyes closed is Stupid.

 

[kupo15]

Also how does someone make a comparison between DI and L-cancel. DI takes more skill to do than L-cancel. Infact, you can L-cancel with your eyes closed. DI'ing with your eyes closed is Stupid.

No one every said that. I brought up that as an example to show that DI takes skill and L canceling doesnt. DI takes more reflexes (esp in melee) than l cancel because you control l cancel, you dont control what move will hit you so you need the reflex to make fast changes at times where your hit unexpectedly.

So I was agreeing with you.

 

[MBlaze]

I'd say let's keep L-Canceling in Brawl since it's always been a staple in Smash Bros. Also while L-canceling does not really add depth to the game, it does add a type of difficulty that rewards the player (by not getting punished and the ability to string combos together) if executed correctly.

L-Canceling is not simply pressing a button it's pressing a button at the RIGHT TIME. That itself takes skill to use and is something that is necessary in a competitive Smash Brothers game.

Edit: I wish auto-canceled aerials never existed. It limits the game's competitive potential -_-;

Pretty much sums up my point, I'm just on Wiiwebz and lazy though and didn't want to type a lot.

 

[Endless Nightmares]

I'd say let's keep L-Canceling in Brawl since it's always been a staple in Smash Bros. Also while L-canceling does not really add depth to the game, it does add a type of difficulty that rewards the player (by not getting punished and the ability to string combos together) if executed correctly.

L-Canceling is not simply pressing a button it's pressing a button at the RIGHT TIME. That itself takes skill to use and is something that is necessary in a competitive Smash Brothers game.

Edit: I wish auto-canceled aerials never existed. It limits the game's competitive potential -_-;

Quoted for epic truth.

It's sad, I center my whole game around auto-canceled aerials lol. It was basically my crutch after I found out L-canceling was gone.

Though Auto-canceling DOES indeed cancel some lag...but let's not get into that >_>

 

[Magus420]

Just because it's how l-canceling worked in the previous smash games and is just what you may be used to (believe me, I am quite accustomed to it as well), doesn't mean that it isn't bad game design.

Seriously. How many good fighting games are there that contain intentional game mechanics/advanced techniques that:

1) Offer great reward for its success in execution at ZERO risk/cost to the player.
2) Failure in its execution always results in the exact same risk/cost/punishment as NOT attempting to perform it.
3) Attempting it in 100% of all cases is absolutely 100% of the time the superior "option" to not attempting it, even if it were to FAIL each and every single time as failure will always result in the exact same outcome as not trying to perform it.


I have nothing at all against tech skill being needed in the game (and if you happen to know me as a Melee player it's actually a strong point of mine). I would also have no problem if the proposed powershield-cancel code were to be created and designed so that it were much more difficult to perform than l-canceling, as that technique's existence would actually add something meaningful to the game. (PS-Cancel = half lag by default, and the cancel removes ALL lag into a PS animation giving the attacker the mixup of instead gaining frame advantage on block when performed and allowing instant A/B attack follow ups, but at the cost of weakening their shield)

I do, however, have a problem with tech skill being implemented in the form of a recycled game mechanic that at its core is straight up flawed game design (though it's a respectable attempt at depth considering it's Sakurai). It's about 1% depth and 99% just an excuse to tack on a rather minor tech skill requirement to a technique that in the end contributes next to nothing to the game beyond the reduction in lag itself. Any minute amount of depth it may actually offer for the rare event someone happens to mess it up, even after the new timing fully becomes muscle memory and is in a slower paced game, is easily trumped by the nuisance it now becomes in this case thanks to the game's gimped L/R buttons.

 

[ChronoPenguin]

WTF are you guys talking about Right time?

Everytime you use an aerial you will L-cancel, if your not, well Lawl. Theres never a reason Not to L-cancel.


Let me give you a comparison of L-canceling vs Something in Brawl.

L-canceling vs Links Quick Draw (Arrow Cancel, Advance Technique).

L-canceling your hitting L or R before you hit the ground.
Quick Draw your pressing B right before you hit the ground.
You could say....they have similar timing.

However, you only L-cancel 1 aerial per jump...not two, obviously.
Which generally means....your usually doing just 1 aerial.

So what do you do.

SHFFL.
Short Hop, Aerial, Fast Fall, L-cancel.
Or Short Hop, Fast Fall, Aerial, L-cancel.

Lets say you want to use Links Triple arrow technique.
This requires you to use your Double Jump and to launch 2 arrows in mid air and Quick draw the third.

This is punishable and can leave Link open.

L-canceling....this is done for the purpose of making you Less open, Less punishable.

Triple arrow is much more situational than L-canceling, however they both end the same, Pressing a button before you hit the ground.
As such the Risk Reward for Triple arrow is BETTER than L-canceling, where there IS no actual risk, the only Risk is the Risk of doing an aerial. In fact L-canceling simply reduces Risk period and lets you capitalize with more reward.
This is a Competitive game, or atleast this is 1 of the things Brawl+ hopes to do (make Brawl, more competitively play focused).
As such things that generate more Reward and generate low risk, May not (not a straight out Not, just a may not) be as good for a competitive setting.

If we Look at Links Quick draw again, he can lead things into this.
Back air into Quick Draw, among other things.
If he wants to do mind games/spacing instead of Quick Drawing, he could Wave bounce his arrow instead.

L-canceling improves the speed of the game, and in some cases improves characters.
However what does Manual L-canceling achieve? It's simply a tedious exercise, that after multiple reputations simply becauses Muscle Reflex.
Where as for other parts of the game, as they are much more active in the actual game (such as using Quick Draw), the player things about them, and while a SKILLED player will know how to execute them flawlessly, it's not just muscle Reflex.

A Skilled Player has the timing to execute things such as Quick Draw, Yoshi's Draconic Reverse, IC's Chain grabs, etc.
What makes these different from L-canceling? They have situational use, and implementing these into your total artillery of moves is a good thing, however you need to know when to use them, which is also a skill. They aren't just used every time.
L-canceling SHOULD be used EVERY time you do an aerial, it's not situational.
Do an aerial? L-cancel the aerial, thats it.
Your aerial Finished before you actually hit the Ground, okay then well your not L-canceling, because theres no aerial to L-cancel.

Basic point.
When you use an aerial you L-cancel, it's not situational.
It's only tech skill generally the first time you use it, then it's just muscle reflex.

In melee, it COULD be part of tech skill but thats only because you initiated other things with it, which required strong finger dexterity.
In Brawl it's just....well....wtf are you doing?

Quite simply L-canceling In Brawl is well....like just B-reversaling every move....except you really don't feel as much pain if you do it wrong (If you B-reversal wrong you can do the wrong move...and well....fun), where as if you L-cancel wrong, the pain is if you Miss the move...where well.... the goal is to make Moves Less laggy in general...not unpunishable so whether you L-canceled or not, your move was probably punished anyways.


In my opinion it should just be auto'd or not implemented. Im fine with whatever is chosen, thats just what I'd prefer however.

Rip this post to shreds if you wish, I do not claim to have great wisdom.

 

[leafgreen386]

"This mechanic has always existed, therefore it should always exist!"

That's really the only argument I'm getting from anyone arguing for manual l-cancels. So just because we always used to write using a quill means that when the modern pen and pencil became available we shouldn't have switched to using those? Whether you dip your quill in the ink every time you want to write something or you just click your pen and start writing the end result is still the same. You would always be writing just fine either way, but the latter is less tedious. Likewise, people aren't going to mess up l-cancels; it will just be a tedious extra button press that never needed to be in in the first place. Although it might take some brief getting used to, it still doesn't require any large amounts of skill. Skill involves the application of a technique. There is nothing to apply with l-canceling. You just do it. We should take this as an opportunity to implement what should've been in from the beginning, not to add something that doesn't even improve options during gameplay just because the same archaic mechanic was in the past two games.

 

[wazgood]

what do you all have against scarjumping? it can be much more effective than melee scarjumping since brawl has increased aerial DI. you could pretty much just keep throwing out aerials without having to regrab the edge every time.

 

[WoodyWiggins]

Homo Chrono, LULZ. I see you. j/k

I'm kinda torn about the L-cancel situtaion. However, maybe you could add Super Armor frames to a normal landing after an aerial, since Brawls aerials are naturally L-cancelled, and include a Powersheild cancel (or some type of cancel, save S-cancel).

Advantages of Super Armor landing frames:

Every character sticks their landing, which prevents "trading" hits

Could allow for combo or (multiple hit) attack breaking. Example: Ike's Eruption against Sonic's Fair. Ike's Eruption wins because his SA frames prevent him from being knocked back , and allow him to interrupt Sonic's fair with his Eruption.

Disadvantages

I really can't think of any, right now. . .

SA landing frames v. L-(Powershield) Canceling
Players would ultimately have to choose from landing with normal "lag" and taking damage or landing and cancelling all "lag" with the opportunity to attack (or mixup). However applying this hack may prove to be insanely difficult, but it's an idea. SA frames are original to Brawl right?

And for you learning pleasure, a little known fact about SJR/ISJR; EVERY character can SJR/ISJR an air dodge. That's right, Air dodge > SJR > Air Dodge > SJR > Air dodge etc. . . How cool is that.

 

[kupo15]

Major contributors

Coders: Without the following people, brawl+ would not even exist. These guys deserve a lot of credit for the time they spend dealing with us and making awesome codes. Thank you very much for all of your hard work and dedication!

Phantom wings
Spunit262
Almas
Paprika_killer
Igglyboo

Project organizers: These people work closely with the coders by telling them what codes we need and how it will work. They have made invaluable threads and spend a lot of time keeping it updated so this project can thrive and succeed.

kupo15
Shanus
Almas

Special Thanks:

Magus420
Thecape
Leafgreen386
Falco400
DarkSonic
Team Giza
Project-05
​

 

[kupo15]

Updated**

10awesomecodes

 

[storm92]

I agree with zxeon that the Melee Airdodge is to be considered perfect.

Although it's very debatable that an autocancelable aerial may become an issue. I'd say we just get a bigger time window for pressing L to half the lag of aerials.

I'd respectfully disagree here and say the MAD is not perfect.
We need landing lag. We can't have stacking of WDs and WaveDodges, these give way too many options and Wavedodges are pretty much invulnerable approaches.

 

[MBlaze]

I'd respectfully disagree here and say the MAD is not perfect.
We need landing lag. We can't have stacking of WDs and WaveDodges, these give way too many options and Wavedodges are pretty much invulnerable approaches.

I say we should just take it out, it really doesn't go well with Brawl all that much.

 

[storm92]

I do agree to an extent.
I think it feels fairly awkward in Brawl and find it less natural than the counterpart in Melee, but at the same time it does open up a myriad of new options for every character other than dashing, walking, and aerials. It also leads to finishing combos and such.
I'm somewhat torn but lean towards yes on MAD. For sure though, if we keep BAD we should edit it so there's only one.

 

[kupo15]

I say we should just take it out, it really doesn't go well with Brawl all that much.

I cant believe we actually agree zxeon lol. If you want to make MAD perfect, then MAD will be the ONLY code you have one. I don't think MAD is that important if you cant also have l canceling and the other stuff

 

[ChronoPenguin]

Put for Future Codes.

1 Hit Knock Out.

...wait thats stupid right?
I think the Powershield sliding thing is stupid too.
The shield is going to be important for punishment with L-canceling in, as otherwise you just might not be able to if your a heavy character >.>

 

[nightSN]

i think No auto sweetspot ledges is going abit way to far. like we cant even wavedash off the stage and now you want us to combine wavedash to the very edge and then hug? blahh there goes the down fall of spacies, ike and ganon

 

[kupo15]

Put for Future Codes.

1 Hit Knock Out.

...wait thats stupid right?
I think the Powershield sliding thing is stupid too.
The shield is going to be important for punishment with L-canceling in, as otherwise you just might not be able to if your a heavy character >.>

I dont think its stupid. My friend was a good ganon in melee and he said that one of the things that hurt ganon now is that you don't slide away when powershielding. All his attacks rely on pushing ppl away so that he doesn't get as punished. You slide away in melee when you powershield also.

i think No auto sweetspot ledges is going abit way to far. like we cant even wavedash off the stage and now you want us to combine wavedash to the very edge and then hug? blahh there goes the down fall of spacies, ike and ganon

Auto sweetspoting doesn't work on the way down, only on the way up. Its the reason why you can't punish ppl for poking their heads above the stage. I think your talking about reverse grabbing which I believe should be in there.

Can you imagine almost all the cast having up bs like sonic? His is the only one that truely resembles melee's edges (it would be more powerful if sonic couldn't attack out of his up B)

 

[BrutalBrutal]

Some physics things no one has noticed

I think that one thing no one seems to have noticed but which would really improve Brawl+ is a hack which makes it so that running jumps (jumps which occur while a character is running) retain the momentum (ie the character is still moves at the same speed after a running jump).

It currently works so that if the analogue stick is tilted forward when you jump, you jump forward at a set speed. Whether you are walking very slowly or running makes no difference whatsoever.

As well as this, I think the maximum horizontal aerial momentum of some characters (fast-fallers mostly) is way too slow, and not conducive to combos.

When I first played Brawl, these basic changes to character physics were what slapped me in the face first. I think they have to be remedied.

 

[mariofanpm12]

So when exactly will we be deciding on a Competitive Standard for Brawl+?

Exactly which codes will be active and whatnot. There needs to be a Discussion/Debate thread.

 

[kupo15]

I think that one thing no one seems to have noticed but which would really improve Brawl+ is a hack which makes it so that running jumps (jumps which occur while a character is running) retain the momentum (ie the character is still moves at the same speed after a running jump).

It currently works so that if the analogue stick is tilted forward when you jump, you jump forward at a set speed. Whether you are walking very slowly or running makes no difference whatsoever.

As well as this, I think the maximum horizontal aerial momentum of some characters (fast-fallers mostly) is way too slow, and not conducive to combos.

When I first played Brawl, these basic changes to character physics were what slapped me in the face first. I think they have to be remedied.

Yea I was thinking about that. Question. Did everyone in melee retain their running momentum in their jump? I thought they slowed down a little but im not sure. (except CF)

So when exactly will we be deciding on a Competitive Standard for Brawl+?

Exactly which codes will be active and whatnot. There needs to be a Discussion/Debate thread.

The debate wont happen until we have all of the codes we want and furthermore, it will not be discussed in this thread.

 

[ZeroFrames]

Very Important:

DoubleJumpCancle for Yoshi and Ness!!!

I have a Question:

If i want a bit more Gravity then in the Normal Brawl
whitch strengh should I use?
- 2.0 is far to much
- 1.5 is a bit to much
is there a code for 1.3 or something like this?

€//:

You Cant Wavedash out of shield o.O
this should be fixed!

 

[MuBa]

Very Important:

DoubleJumpCancle for Yoshi and Ness!!!

I have a Question:

If i want a bit more Gravity then in the Normal Brawl
whitch strengh should I use?
- 2.0 is far to much
- 1.5 is a bit to much
is there a code for 1.3 or something like this?

€//:

You Cant Wavedash out of shield o.O
this should be fixed!

If we have enough room for character specific buffs then we'll do that.

As for the Double Jump Cancel System...I think that would beneit Lucas, Ness, and Yoshi most definitely


Also Gravity, no need to do gravity at all. Thanks to the increased hitstun characters like Sonic now have a more reliable KO (Upair Spring). But what we should do (like kupo mentioned in the original post) is to have faster falls only.


kupo15, also you may want to put the running momentum in your queue.