Character Discussion Thread

[God Robert's Cousin]

I'd like you to describe K.Rool for me without giving away his physical appearance or job.

A masochistic and ruthless guy that hates failure above anything else short of the Kongs themselves. Tenacious and inventive, he's always trying to beat the Kongs again and again with new ideas and dirty tricks every time. Not every villain can claim to be genre savvy enough to just outright kidnap the hero and his sidekick, or to fake the player out into thinking the credits are rolling, after all. A stubborn, savvy nut-job that wants nothing more than to have a sense of power over everyone else--pardon me if that doesn't sound like a personality on its own.

 

[AncientTobacco]

I think you could say he's a mentally disturbed psychopath with a fondness for playing dress up.

A masochistic and ruthless guy that hates failure above anything else short of the Kongs themselves. Tenacious and inventive, he's always trying to beat the Kongs again and again with new ideas and dirty tricks every time. Not every villain can claim to be genre savvy enough to just outright kidnap the hero and his sidekick, or to fake the player out into thinking the credits are rolling, after all. A stubborn, savvy nut-job that wants nothing more than to have a sense of power over everyone else--pardon me if that doesn't sound like a personality on its own.

Yep, that about covers it. He's also a showboater, as seen in the final battle of DK64.

 

[Spinosaurus]

So K.Rool is a an all over the place villain that lacks consistency. Gotcha. What a well-written, focused personality.

Well whatever, didn't really want to argue about that anyway, just gave away an example.

 

[Will]

I'm kind of concerned with something. You know the one battle Sakurai had at the last E3? The winner screen,I hope it's not permanently like that in the game.

Either that or it was E3 editing skills,but still.

 

[Deleted member]

It's probably a placeholder.

and if it isn't I'm boycotting the game. Bringing Ike back without his victory quotes would ruin everything.

 

[Spinosaurus]

Yeah I'm willing to bet it's not final. That demo clearly was a very early build.

 

[God Robert's Cousin]

So K.Rool is a an all over the place villain that lacks consistency and proper. Gotcha. What a well-written, focused personality.

Well whatever, didn't really want to argue about that anyway, just gave away an example.

How is what was said inconsistent? "Cruel", witty, and unstable--The three keywords to describing him. You tell me how you're supposed to write a mean and nutty villain without making a carbon copy of Fawful.

 

[Leafeon523]

I'm kind of concerned with something. You know the one battle Sakurai had at the last E3? The winner screen,I hope it's not permanently like that in the game.

Either that or it was E3 editing skills,but still.

The game was still early in development, I'm sure it will be changed

 

[Spinosaurus]

How is what was said inconsistent? "Cruel", witty, and unstable--The three keywords to describing him. You tell me how you're supposed to write a mean and nutty villain without making a carbon copy of Fawful.

I feel like you just tried to describe K.Rool using all the best qualities (if you could say that) of his completely different personalities that he has across all games when there isn't a single game that he's really like that. Hence, inconsistent.

 

[Basty]

K. Rool is my most wanted DK Newcomer. Thats a lie Kaptain K. Rool is who I want more

 

[Spinosaurus]

Kaptain K.Rool is the only one I'd accept.

Rest can die.

 

[God Robert's Cousin]

I feel like you just tried to describe K.Rool using all the best qualities (if you could say that) of his completely different personalities that he has across all games when there isn't a single game that he's really like that. Hence, inconsistent.

Are you being serious right now?

His motive of stealing all of the Kongs' bananas in DKC, as said in an interview with one of DKC's creators Leigh Loveday, was merely to make them starve. Cruel and Nutty.
He attempts to fool the player directly by starting up a credits sequence when the fight isn't over. Deceitful and Witty.
He uses his blunderbuss in a variety of ways and literally creates a versatile war machine run off the power of his kidnapped enemies. Witty.
He makes his minions tremble whenever he goes into a fit of rage in his cutscenes in DK64, threatening them with punishment for failure. Cruel.
He's a blood-shot alligator that is constantly cross-dressing, from a king to a pirate to a mad scientist to a boxer, to steal bananas that he is not even going to eat. Nutty.

I think you need to admit to your own bias that you simply refuse to acknowledge the personality in K. Rool. There are bits everywhere that show that he's Nintendo's most cartoony villain and one of the only ones to have a barbaric take on the typical James Bond villain. Hell, you'd have a harder time giving me a single Kirby villain with more personality than King K. Rool. Even Dedede is ambiguous between being greedy and protecting Dream Land. K. Rool's personality stays the same from game to game, it's only his appearance and tactics that change. I don't know why you have such a hard time seeing that, especially when you treat the clownish villain archetype like it has no consistency when the unpredictability is consistent.

You may as well say that Kefka, Fawful, and Majora have absolutely no personality either while you're at it.

 

[Spinosaurus]

...Who are you describing now, K.Rool?
Tell me a moment where he's ever like that, all of that. Nothing specific.

You may as well say that Kefka, Fawful, and Majora have absolutely no personality either while you're at it.

No personality? No. A personality I couldn't care less for? Definitely.

 

[Shagadelic_Baby]

I'd say the Kremlings in Smash Run hint enough at K.Rool. Seriously, they came outta no where.

 

[God Robert's Cousin]

...Who are you describing now, K.Rool?
Tell me a moment where he's ever like that, all of that. Nothing specific.

No personality? No. A personality I couldn't care less for? Definitely.

I just listed all those moments. DKC1, DKC2, DKC3, DK64, DK Jungle Climber. Unless you're going to tell me you have to audacity to say K. Rool has a poor personality when you haven't even played any of the games he comes from, you shouldn't have to be spoon-fed information from the direct sources if you even know anything about the source material in the first place. If you don't even know any of the background knowledge of the series and haven't actually played the games he comes from, then it's friggin' obvious he's not going to have a personality you don't care for because you don't know anything about him in the first place!

You didn't make the latter apparent earlier, by the way. You phrased yourself as saying he has none. I thought that's what we were arguing about here, but alrighty then.

 

[Spinosaurus]

I just listed all those moments. DKC1, DKC2, DKC3, DK64, DK Jungle Climber. Unless you're going to tell me you have to audacity to say K. Rool has a poor personality when you haven't even played any of the games he comes from, you shouldn't have to be spoon-fed information from the direct sources if you even know anything about the source material in the first place. If you don't even know any of the background knowledge of the series and haven't actually played the games he comes from, then it's friggin' obvious he's not going to have a personality you don't care for because you don't know anything about him in the first place!

...So your argument is...I haven't played DKC?

OK. Not bothering with this anymore.

 

[MasterOfKnees]

Have we seriously reached the point where we're discussing if K. Rool of all people has a stable personality or not? I wouldn't expect a character who's whole gimmick is to take on different roles each game to have a stable personality, that's his jam. He has far more personality than any of the currently announced newcomers, jeez.

 

[Shagadelic_Baby]

What's going on in this forum? Ohokaybye.

 

[AncientTobacco]

...Who are you describing now, K.Rool?
Tell me a moment where he's ever like that, all of that. Nothing specific.

No personality? No. A personality I couldn't care less for? Definitely.

Your argument has basically gone from "K. Rool has no personality" to "K. Rool's personality isn't consistent" to "I couldn't care less for K. Rool's personality".

Nice job ignoring the list of specific moments where K. Rool is "ever like that", too.

 

[The Nerd]

Having not played a ton of DK games I can't vouch for K.Rool's personality outside of DK 64, but I did play DK 64 and he's got more personality in that game than Ridley or Bowser have in any of the games I've played that they were in. I'm aware that I haven't played every single Metroid or Mario game ever either, being too poor to own a Wii U or buy many Wii games, but the point stands. God Robert's Cousin did a good job of summing him up overall, but to reiterate:

In DK 64 K.Rool is a showy, cruel monster, a true saturday morning cartoon villain. While most of his personality is a massive cliche it does exist; he's easily angered & frustrated, menacing, somewhat lazy, and cruel. He rages at every single bit of progress you make, scaring all of his underlings, but he never actually bothers to do anything directly, preferring to sit his fat ass on his throne until the end of the game. I mean, he's not a particularly deep or compelling character but he HAS character. That is unarguable. Is his character particularly interesting or complex? No, not at all, but not every character needs to be deep or complex.

That being said, I wish Nintendo had more complex villains, as all of their mainstream villains are fairly straightforward.

 

[Spinosaurus]

Your argument has basically gone from "K. Rool has no personality" to "K. Rool's personality isn't consistent" to "I couldn't care less for K. Rool's personality".

Nice job ignoring the list of specific moments where K. Rool is "ever like that", too.

I NEVER said K.Rool has no personality. I said "if personality is a factor, then K.Rool wouldn't be so heavily requested". I can see the misunderstanding there, but to claim I said he has no personality is premature. When I asked for a description of his personality, I was waiting for that so I can prove my point that his personality was bad, then all of you got super defensive and made him appear like some grade A villain in a best selling novel when he isn't any better than Bowser, a saturday cartoon villain. (I'm waiting for you tell me how Bowser is comparable to Voldemort. Go on.) Also, I fail to see how saying that I couldn't care less for K.Rool's character contraditcs. saying that he's inconsistent. EDIT: Oh and, since I'm continuing this anyway, the poster picked up specific moments that showed SPECIFICS parts of his personality, not ALL of what he actually described.

Inconsistent personality is good if it's executed well, which in K.Rool's case isn't. You could go on with some HEAVY exaggerations about how I'm wrong, but the moment you assumed I don't like K.Rool because I haven't played DKC (ESPECIALLY when I wrote about how I think DKC1 is mediocre compared to how great DKC2 in the K.Rool thread yesterday ) is when I stop bothering and notice the heavy bias, hostility and fanboyism that's going on here, because all I said was that a video game villain isn't a good character, and didn't even say anything about it going against his inclusion.

Good job in demonstrating your maturity.

 

[God Robert's Cousin]

Whelp, I guess it's settled then. King K. Rool has no redeeming features and it's obvious that anyone who thinks he's an interesting character is as foolish as they are immature.

Meanwhile, you guys need to move onto more interesting characters. Who needs K. Rool? We have the vibrant personalities of Chrom, Pac-Man, and Mii to look forward to instead...

Nyngggg...

 

[Spinosaurus]

Whelp, I guess it's settled then. King K. Rool has no redeeming features and it's obvious that anyone who thinks he's an interesting character is as foolish as they are immature.

Nice straw man. I definitely said you're immature because you think he's a good character, and not because of your attitude and reaction towards what I said.

I can already see your reply to this.

 

[The Nerd]

I NEVER said K.Rool has no personality. I said "if personality is a factor, then K.Rool wouldn't be so heavily requested". I can see the misunderstanding there, but to claim I said he has no personality is premature. When I asked for a description of his personality, I was waiting for that so I can prove my point that his personality was bad, then all of you got super defensive and made him appear like some grade A villain in a best selling novel when he isn't any better than Bowser, a saturday cartoon villain. (I'm waiting for you tell me how Bowser is comparable to Voldemort. Go on.) Also, I fail to see how saying that I couldn't care less for K.Rool's character contraditcs. saying that he's inconsistent. EDIT: Oh and, since I'm continuing this anyway, the poster picked up specific moments that showed SPECIFICS parts of his personality, not ALL of what he actually described.

Inconsistent personality is good if it's executed well, which in K.Rool's case isn't. You could go on with some HEAVY exaggerations about how I'm wrong, but the moment you assumed I don't like K.Rool because I haven't played DKC (ESPECIALLY when I wrote about how I think DKC1 is mediocre compared to how great DKC2 in the K.Rool thread yesterday ) is when I stop bothering and notice the heavy bias, hostility and fanboyism that's going on here, because all I said was that a video game villain isn't a good character, and didn't even say anything about it going against his inclusion.

Good job in demonstrating your maturity.

Upon re-reading you make a fair point; I think all parties were too quick to hostilities. I think the core issue we're running into is that if people asked for characters based on personality most of the characters in Smash would be very poorly received indeed. All pokemon have variable personalities, and most Nintendo protagonists are generic heroes. I can't think of many Nintendo characters that *do* have what I consider an interesting or complex personality. Comparatively speaking I would say K. Rool has more personality than the average Nintendo character, and that very few of any personality worth speaking of.

On the subject of personality, who do we think has the most personality of Nintendo characters, the charismatic creme of the crop so to speak? I would vote Olimar, simply because his Captain's Logs from Pikmin 1 are fondly ingrained in my memory as loveable little side jokes.

 

[Invisible Shiny Bulbasaur]

I'm having a hard time thinking of any Nintendo characters who have a deep enough personality to be a main character in a classic novel. Most of them don't even speak.
Notice I didn't say best selling novel. I will refrain from mentioning names.

I thought the point of putting a character in Smash Bros. was to include a character who is fun to play as. Their personalities are usually open to interpretation.
I also thought the point of talking about a video game on an internet forum was for fun.

 

[BluePikmin11]

Upon re-reading you make a fair point; I think all parties were too quick to hostilities. I think the core issue we're running into is that if people asked for characters based on personality most of the characters in Smash would be very poorly received indeed. All pokemon have variable personalities, and most Nintendo protagonists are generic heroes. I can't think of many Nintendo characters that *do* have what I consider an interesting or complex personality. Comparatively speaking I would say K. Rool has more personality than the average Nintendo character, and that very few of any personality worth speaking of.

On the subject of personality, who do we think has the most personality of Nintendo characters, the charismatic creme of the crop so to speak? I would vote Olimar, simply because his Captain's Logs from Pikmin 1 are fondly ingrained in my memory as loveable little side jokes.

 

[Croph]

Yeah...

While having good character development may make a character more likable, we already have so many exceptions of bland characters already making it in.

The fighters aren't going to have a huge script -- I highly doubt they're each going to say a monologue. Probably just a few lines here and there. Sakurai will probably give the fighters some sort of personality as best as he can, given the restricting context of Smash. Heck, sometimes the personality might not even be canon. Look at Marth and Falcon. And don't get me started on ROB and G&W... especially G&W (the story mode helped flesh out some characters a bit though).

I highly doubt that personality is a factor for deciding a newcomer. And in all honesty, it shouldn't be. A character with a blank canvas will be painted on in Smash, one way or another.

 

[God Robert's Cousin]

Nice straw man. I definitely said you're immature because you think he's a good character, and not because of your attitude and reaction towards what I said.

I can already see your reply to this.

I don't recall you ever having said I'm immature. Nor do I recall giving any type of attitude beyond "I don't think you've even played a Donkey Kong Country game". Which, from the pivot you made towards "Not bothering with this anymore" (great job sticking to your word, by the way), makes it pretty clear that you haven't. Never mind the fact that you haven't even addressed my points so much as just dismissed them outright.

Please, condescend on me more. I want to be your chew-toy. Embarrass

 

[Invisible Shiny Bulbasaur]

Upon re-reading you make a fair point; I think all parties were too quick to hostilities. I think the core issue we're running into is that if people asked for characters based on personality most of the characters in Smash would be very poorly received indeed. All pokemon have variable personalities, and most Nintendo protagonists are generic heroes. I can't think of many Nintendo characters that *do* have what I consider an interesting or complex personality. Comparatively speaking I would say K. Rool has more personality than the average Nintendo character, and that very few of any personality worth speaking of.

On the subject of personality, who do we think has the most personality of Nintendo characters, the charismatic creme of the crop so to speak? I would vote Olimar, simply because his Captain's Logs from Pikmin 1 are fondly ingrained in my memory as loveable little side jokes.

Haha, I loved reading Olimar's logs in Pikmin 2.
Actually, I'd gladly read a novel about Olimar if it was written like that.

 

[Rockaphin]

Having not played a ton of DK games I can't vouch for K.Rool's personality outside of DK 64, but I did play DK 64 and he's got more personality in that game than Ridley or Bowser have in any of the games I've played that they were in. I'm aware that I haven't played every single Metroid or Mario game ever either, being too poor to own a Wii U or buy many Wii games, but the point stands. God Robert's Cousin did a good job of summing him up overall, but to reiterate:

I would agree with you, however Bowser has a huge defined personality in the Paper Mario series. He's pretty hilarious in that series. Actually, he's hilarious in all the Mario RPG's. I don't even know Ridley's personality.

 

[Spinosaurus]

Upon re-reading you make a fair point; I think all parties were too quick to hostilities. I think the core issue we're running into is that if people asked for characters based on personality most of the characters in Smash would be very poorly received indeed. All pokemon have variable personalities, and most Nintendo protagonists are generic heroes. I can't think of many Nintendo characters that *do* have what I consider an interesting or complex personality. Comparatively speaking I would say K. Rool has more personality than the average Nintendo character, and that very few of any personality worth speaking of.

On the subject of personality, who do we think has the most personality of Nintendo characters, the charismatic creme of the crop so to speak? I would vote Olimar, simply because his Captain's Logs from Pikmin 1 are fondly ingrained in my memory as loveable little side jokes.

Out of all series represented, I think Earthbound/Mother is the only one that's actually written fantastically. The rest are either non-existent for the most part (most), or badly written. I'll give a nod to Pikmin for having a great scope and theme and Metroid for telling a simple story through environments, but they're not exactly well written. (Although the little dialog in Pikmin is pretty great.)


I'm partial to Wario though, he is very simple, but his design process was genius I thought. He was a character that was designed to represent the state the developers were undergoing during the time. (being forced to use Mario when they don't like using a character they didn't design themselves.) There's an article about that I read that demonstrated that, which I thought was neat. But he is my favorite character so I am biased.

I thought the point of putting a character in Smash Bros. was to include a character who is fun to play as. Their personalities are usually open to interpretation.
I also thought the point of talking about a video game on an internet forum was for fun.

That's what I said and gave an example. In retrospect, the example I went for clearly brought out the pitchforks. Heh. Observe:

I don't recall you ever having said I'm immature. Nor do I recall giving any type of attitude beyond "I don't think you've even played a Donkey Kong Country game". Which, from the pivot you made towards "Not bothering with this anymore" (great job sticking to your word, by the way), makes it pretty clear that you haven't. Never mind the fact that you haven't even addressed my points so much as just dismissed them outright.

Please, condescend on me more. I want to be your chew-toy. Embarrass

Semantics.

 

[Invisible Shiny Bulbasaur]

I would agree with you, however Bowser has a huge defined personality in the Paper Mario series. He's pretty hilarious in that series. Actually, he's hilarious in all the Mario RPG's. I don't even know Ridley's personality.

RPGs tend to flesh out personality better than platformers.

All we really know about Ridley comes from manuals, some in-game text, and manga, if that counts.

 

[God Robert's Cousin]

That's what I said and gave an example. In retrospect, the example I went for clearly brought out the pitchforks.

I don't recall "Personality makes the Smash Bros. character" ever being a part of the conversation. I agree with you completely that it doesn't matter how much personality a character has--gameplay and individual warrant comes first. I thought this was a topic in a vacuum merely about "King K. Rool has no personality". Based on what a few others have said, I'm not the only one to have gotten the same interpretation. Better communication helps us all, I'd say.

 

[Spinosaurus]

I don't recall "Personality makes the Smash Bros. character" ever being a part of the conversation. I agree with you completely that it doesn't matter how much personality a character has--gameplay and individual warrant comes first. I thought this was a topic in a vacuum merely about "King K. Rool has no personality". Based on what a few others have said, I'm not the only one to have gotten the same interpretation. Better communication helps us all, I'd say.

I have admitted that I can see where the misunderstanding came from, and I do apologize for that. Still not happy towards the hostility that I got over it, however.

 

[Second Power]

On the subject of personality, who do we think has the most personality of Nintendo characters, the charismatic creme of the crop so to speak? I would vote Olimar, simply because his Captain's Logs from Pikmin 1 are fondly ingrained in my memory as loveable little side jokes.

I agree with Olimar, and would probably put Pit up there with him.

 

[The Nerd]

I'm having a hard time thinking of any Nintendo characters who have a deep enough personality to be a main character in a classic novel. Most of them don't even speak.
Notice I didn't say best selling novel. I will refrain from mentioning names.

I thought the point of putting a character in Smash Bros. was to include a character who is fun to play as. Their personalities are usually open to interpretation.
I also thought the point of talking about a video game on an internet forum was for fun.

From what I saw of Mother 3, Lucas could make a halfway decent novel.I'm glad we agree on Olimar though, his universe has some interesting characters.

I kind of disagree; these three characters are very expressive but expressiveness =/= personality. Don't get me wrong, they have personality, especially Luigi, but I think a lot of there personality comes from the obvious comparisons of Mario and Link, who function as essentially cardboard cutouts for most of their games. xD That being said, I do think expressiveness is a better criteria for Smash Bros selection than personality simply because an expressive character can have a wider array of facial and physical reactions.

I would agree with you, however Bowser has a huge defined personality in the Paper Mario series. He's pretty hilarious in that series. Actually, he's hilarious in all the Mario RPG's. I don't even know Ridley's personality.

How could I forget Paper Mario! I consider the Paper games and the other Mario games to be separate universes, but I am more than happy to admit that within the Paper Mario universe all characters get a massive personality boost. RIdley's personality is mostly from instruction manuals and fighting styles; if you treat him like a standard boss monster it's very easy to miss that he's anything other than a recurring enemy.

 

[Spinosaurus]

Oh, I forgot about Kid Icarus Uprising. Hades is the one villain that I have absolutely no problem calling him a good character.

 

[The Nerd]

I agree with Olimar, and would probably put Pit up there with him.

Oh, I forgot about Kid Icarus Uprising. Hades is the one villain that I have absolutely no problem calling him a good character.

I don't have the cash to play Kid Icarus Uprising, so I can't comment on the characters from it, other than apparently everyone loves Palutena? She's visually cool and I think she'll make a cool fighter if she's in.

 

[God Robert's Cousin]

I have admitted that I can see where the misunderstanding came from, and I do apologize for that. Still not happy towards the hostility that I got over it, however.

Right. I think we both could have done better to avoid the hostility that took place. Time and time again, miscommunication is the true conflict here.

Regardless of our individual standings on characters and their personalities, we can both agree that as a video game first and foremost, the personality of a character is completely irrelevant to where they should stand in joining the roster. Chrom, K. Rool, Ridley, Pac-Man--if they have unique moveset potential, that's what matters most, right?

 

[Invisible Shiny Bulbasaur]

I agree with Olimar, and would probably put Pit up there with him.

Dialogue goes a long way.

And I agree about EarthBound. I loved the writing and characters in that game.
I would totally read a MOTHER novel trilogy.