Character Discussion Thread

[jaytalks]

You could say the say the same thing for Banjo really. I don't remember anybody talking about him before Phil Spencer's tweet and if there was, there was little.

I saw that tweet and I thought that Microsoft is desperate to revive the Banjo brand.

 

[Spazzy_D]

Go back to that thread though, it certainly didn't stop people from putting other third-parties on their rosters.

I agree Rayman makes sense. I do. I'm just saying hardly anyone gave a flip before recently.

I mostly agree. I stated earlier that it was Omni's leak that really pushed Rayman into the lime light. I just think that it makes sense for him to be considered regardless, and that he would have had a lot of organic support post Smash 4 due to other big companies already having their dogs in the fight, so to speak.

 

[Wintropy]

As far as I recall, the only newcomers I actively supported in the original times of speculation were Palutena, Little Mac, Wonder Red and Chrom (and possibly Robin, who I thought for sure would be called Avatar, though I wasn't as committed to them as some people I know). Beyond that, I was pretty much happy to take whatever the roster included, and Palutena was the only newcomer I really and truly wanted.

My other favourites, like Ridley and Tiki, only happened after I was either exposed to the pre-existing fanbase or realised how amazing they'd actually be. People change, perspectives alter, realisation dawns, epiphanies are had. That's the beauty of speculation: it's never static. There's always something new and interesting to discover and lend your support to.

 

[Spazzy_D]

As far as I recall, the only newcomers I actively supported in the original times of speculation were Palutena, Little Mac, Wonder Red and Chrom (and possibly Robin, who I thought for sure would be called Avatar, though I wasn't as committed to them as some people I know). Beyond that, I was pretty much happy to take whatever the roster included, and Palutena was the only newcomer I really and truly wanted.

My other favourites, like Ridley and Tiki, only happened after I was either exposed to the pre-existing fanbase or realised how amazing they'd actually be. People change, perspectives alter, realisation dawns, epiphanies are had. That's the beauty of speculation: it's never static. There's always something new and interesting to discover and lend your support to.

Shulk, Palutena, Little Mac, Megaman, Ridley where the characters I was actively supporting pre-E3 reveal.

 

[Wolfie557]

For Smash 4 I definitely supported: Waluigi, Rosalina, Mewtwo, Bayonetta, Ridley,Rayman, Chrom, Dixie, K Rool, Palutena, Medusa and Mii's.

Though it changed during the months. Characters dropped in and out. Mewtwo(before dlc), Chrom, Waluigi, K Rool dropped out while Bayonetta,Ridley and Rosalina joined in by the time Smash released.

That is, post initial reveal.

 

[Burruni]

Rayman, I believe has the AMOUNT of support he currently has by a fair amount of Omni's leak.

Is he one of the stronger choices for a 3rd Party? Yes.
Is he one of the most likely? Debatable.
Is his popularity one that has been a fairly continuous one? No.
Are any third party DLCs probable in the first place? Probably not, with Snake being the one with the most ground due to veteranism (though we can go on rants about his odds at any time).

Much like how Impa supporters mostly had their swells before Sheik was confirmed and the various releases of main game and DLC for Hyrule Warriors came, I doubt that Rayman's support is going to last through the poll nearly as strong as it is now.

Banjo will likely go the same way after the initial spur from the tweet dies out. Shovel Knight will probably fade out due to him not having almost any hold in the eastern markets, Quote due to being from effectively one game will hurt lasting support. Shantae... of the three big indies, she will likely prevail the longest and personally has a stronger chance to get in than Rayman because of WayForward having a better history with Nintendo, Shantae being a "more Nintendo" series, and just how far the makers seem to be wanting to go to for her inclusion.

 

[A Distant Demon]

Guess ill play too

pre smash all I wanted was little mac, wonder red (only as a viewtiful Joe clone) and mewtwo but I had wanted villager since melee. (totally forgot about him by 4 rolled around. Same thing happened to Bowser Jr, my most wanted for brawl)

almost every other character I support or supported was bandwagoning after seeing someone else say it. Ridley, Ganon, toad, Robin, Lucina, rayman, Shulk. Hell Palutena who became one of my most wanted was someone who I barely knew until I saw there name. Then I played Uprising because of how mucgit was advertised from shmash and here I am.

Now i pretty much only care for Wonder Red (on his own merits, not poseman's) Viridi, Ridley and Rayman.
too bad only 1 has a ghost of a chance.

 

[Baskerville]

As far as I recall, the only newcomers I actively supported in the original times of speculation were Palutena, Little Mac, Wonder Red and Chrom (and possibly Robin, who I thought for sure would be called Avatar, though I wasn't as committed to them as some people I know). Beyond that, I was pretty much happy to take whatever the roster included, and Palutena was the only newcomer I really and truly wanted.

My other favourites, like Ridley and Tiki, only happened after I was either exposed to the pre-existing fanbase or realised how amazing they'd actually be. People change, perspectives alter, realisation dawns, epiphanies are had. That's the beauty of speculation: it's never static. There's always something new and interesting to discover and lend your support to.

I was a happy Ingrid when was announced.
I equally lost my **** when they showed after the April Direct though I never really thought much of him at the time.
were the icing on the cake.
I was actually rather impressed with how turned out too.

 

[N3ON]

On one hand, I'm not expecting any third-party DLC, on the other, I wouldn't be surprised if we got one. Just one though.

I mostly agree. I stated earlier that it was Omni's leak that really pushed Rayman into the lime light. I just think that it makes sense for him to be considered regardless, and that he would have had a lot of organic support post Smash 4 due to other big companies already having their dogs in the fight, so to speak.

I can't say I agree with the last part. If not for the leak and the trophy I don't think he'd be in any better stead than a Square or Level-5 character or something; companies that have never been tangibly associated with Smash. If Origins and Legends didn't give him organic support, he's... not going to get organic support.

 

[Wolfie557]

I'm impressed how much support these guys are getting right now. For a character from a new IP that hasn't released yet, it's really good as a start.

 

[Godzillathewonderdog]

Twelve? Of like 550? I think that proves my point...


You mean the ones that were loaded up with third-parties? Let's not pretend people still don't make fun of those kind of rosters.

I only bring it up because his appearance in people's rosters was more consistent than most 3rd party characters, that is until the news that Namco was working on the game came out, then I saw a lot more Namco characters and less Rayman. But yeah, I loved making fun of YouTube rosters back in the day, I even made fun of some top ten characters lists with my friends too, good times

 

[Spazzy_D]

On one hand, I'm not expecting any third-party DLC, on the other, I wouldn't be surprised if we got one. Just one though.


I can't say I agree with the last part. If not for the leak and the trophy I don't think he'd be in any better stead than a Square or Level-5 character or something; companies that have never been tangibly associated with Smash. If Origins and Legends didn't give him organic support, he's... not going to get organic support.

I think the vacuum created by Megaman and Pacman would have to be filled by someone, and Rayman makes sense. If you take Shortie's poll that I linked before and remove companies that already have representative characters you are left with:

1.) Banjo and Kazooie (who many wrote off as impossible until recently)
2.) Bomberman (who has to deal with Snake, as much as I would like him in)
3.) Sora
4.) Rayman

I don't think he would be seeing the same level of support, but I would expect him to still be getting a decent push.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

All I wanted when smash was announced was Dillon and Bandana Dee

I saw that tweet and I thought that Microsoft is desperate to revive the Banjo brand.

If they were truly desperate they'd try to make Banjo Threeie, I'm not even a Banjo fan and I'm disgusted with how M$ treated it

 

[MagnesD3]

Being "deserving" is simply an aggregate of the other qualities people value in a character: being iconic, being important, being well-known, and being popular. Basically the qualities that make a character a big name.

And obviously those things are important, being "deserving" is just a divisive qualification because one, people are too cavalier in throwing it around, and two, as the bar for entry lowers with each Smash the "big names" run out, yet people cling to the "deserving" mantle because it did apply more justifiably in past rosters when the majority of (non-clone) newcomers added were legitimately big names. Now most of the additions fall under the category simply of "nice to have" instead of iconic, important or indeed "deserving", which I believe extended only to Villager, Mii, and debatably Little Mac this time around.

As it stands now, the only remaining omitted big-name iconic characters (in other words "deserving") would be Toad, Ridley, and K. Rool. Some might argue Dixie, but that in itself shows that while some general agreement can be found over who is "deserving" or not, it will always inherently be subjective. Though I believe at one point it did hold merit as far Smash goes, however that time has passed.

That's not to say being "deserving" is the be-all-and-end-all of inclusion, because not only are there other factors like potential among others which come into play, but with Smash 4 it seems that as the big-names had mostly already been included up to that point, the focus shifted from "big in general" simply to "big in the last few years".

So yes, I would say "deserving" was an apt way of describing characters back when the roster was made up mostly of the biggest names Nintendo had to offer, or at least names from the biggest series Nintendo had to offer (plus clones and the odd exception or two) but now that it's pretty much based on just what made a splash since Brawl, it's time to drop that qualification, it no longer applies. Just like how Smash is no longer prefaced by "Nintendo's All-Stars".

(I also excluded third-parties because that's a whole other set of standards as far as I'm concerned)

Dont forget Wolf in that deserving category. (theres alot more actually but you got some of the big ones on there.)


Also as for who I supported for Smash 4 newcomer wise was

1. Ridley
2. Krystal
3. Saki
4. Bayonetta
5. King K. Rool

Didnt really get anyone I wanted and lost Wolf in the process.

At least Mewtwo was DLC...

 

[N3ON]

I only bring it up because his appearance in people's rosters was more consistent than most 3rd party characters, that is until the news that Namco was working on the game came out, then I saw a lot more Namco characters and less Rayman. But yeah, I loved making fun of YouTube rosters back in the day, I even made fun of some top ten characters lists with my friends too, good times

Like I said, that's not what I witnessed. Excluding rosters heavy with third-parties of all kinds, Rayman was never any kind of fixture on rosters before recently from what I observed.

I mean for every roster with Rayman on it made in 2013 or earlier, you could probably find at least like twenty five, probably more, that didn't include him.

 

[Spazzy_D]

I only bring it up because his appearance in people's rosters was more consistent than most 3rd party characters, that is until the news that Namco was working on the game came out, then I saw a lot more Namco characters and less Rayman. But yeah, I loved making fun of YouTube rosters back in the day, I even made fun of some top ten characters lists with my friends too, good times

If you feel up to it, go through the roster prediction thread and count out the third parties featured in people's rosters excluding Snake, Megaman, Pacman, and Sonic. I think Rayman's number would hold up well after that, but I am certainly not going to go through all those pages to find out.

 

[Wolfie557]

I think the vacuum created by Megaman and Pacman would have to be filled by someone, and Rayman makes sense. If you take Shortie's poll that I linked before and remove companies that already have representative characters you are left with:

1.) Banjo and Kazooie (who many wrote off as impossible until recently)
2.) Bomberman (who has to deal with Snake, as much as I would like him in)
3.) Sora
4.) Rayman

I don't think he would be seeing the same level of support, but I would expect him to still be getting a decent push.

In my eyes, always impossible until it's Nintendo 1st/2nd party or a 3rd party.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

If I could pick a third party, it'd probably be Shantae, what about you guys and gals?

 

[Wolfie557]

Like I said, that's not what I witnessed. Excluding rosters heavy with third-parties of all kinds, Rayman was never any kind of fixture on rosters before recently from what I observed.

I mean for every roster with Rayman on it made in 2013 or earlier, you could probably find at least like twenty five, probably more, that didn't include him.

I didn't look at much rosters or lists, only about 30 or so, but I found Rayman & Pacman to be consistently appearing there.
With Snake to a lesser extent, a sprinkle of Geno (urgh) & Bomberman and a pinch of Bayonetta pre E3 2014.

 

[Bowserlick]

If we get Rayman and/or Bomberman than all third-party newcomers for Smash 4 will have the word "man" ending their name.

 

[Wolfie557]

If I could pick a third party, it'd probably be Shantae, what about you guys and gals?

Tough choice between Rayman & Bayonetta. Probably Bayonetta, if only for the fact that Rayman would probbably eventually end up in Smash too, if you mean if I was Sakurai for the day.

 

[MagnesD3]

If I could pick a third party, it'd probably be Shantae, what about you guys and gals?

Banjo Kazooie 100%

 

[Burruni]

If we get Rayman and/or Bomberman than all third-party newcomers for Smash 4 will have the word "man" ending their name.

Overlord Laharl from Disgaea, but considering the game is ALMOST sony exclusive with only 1 having a remake on the DS, that isn't gonna happen no matter how well he could transition into things.

 

[Spazzy_D]

In my eyes, always impossible until it's Nintendo 1st/2nd party or a 3rd party.

Hope is hope, and people have that now. While I SEVERELY doubt that Nintendo would allow Banjo in Smash, that one tweet at least opened the door to the possibility, and that's all people needed to jump on the bandwagon. If Phil Spencer had not responded you can guarantee that people wouldn't be throwing nearly as many votes Banjo's way.

 

[Baskerville]

If I could pick a third party, it'd probably be Shantae, what about you guys and gals?

*Points to sig*

 

[Spazzy_D]

If I could pick a third party, it'd probably be Shantae, what about you guys and gals?

 

[Wolfie557]

Hope is hope, and people have that now. While I SEVERELY doubt that Nintendo would allow Banjo in Smash, that one tweet at least opened the door to the possibility, and that's all people needed to jump on the bandwagon. If Phil Spencer had not responded you can guarantee that people wouldn't be throwing nearly as many votes Banjo's way.

I actually call what happened after he tweeted the "Banjo Phenomenon" lol.
It won't last for too long.

This poll is as much about character stamina as is popularity.

 

[BluePikmin11]

If I could pick a third party, it'd probably be Shantae, what about you guys and gals?

Geno for me, he's the one third-party I adore the most and Super Mario RPG is my favorite game, I'd pick instantly without question.

 

[True Blue Warrior]

If in the unlikely scenario that we're getting another third-party character, I think they will be revealed at E3.

I'd still take her over Young Link though.

Look at that, this time it isn't you who's making that remark.

Me too. That said, don't worry, her chance of getting in is over 18306758383427 times Young Link's chance

Spoiler

You'll get this sentence if you know how likely I think Young Link is.

Spoiler

....What? I haven't joked about his non-existant chance in quiet some time!

 

[Xzsmmc]

Only one more third party needs to be added for me to never want another one.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Super Mario RPG is my favorite game

You aren't the real Bluepikmin! His favourite game is the one with Sablé!

 

[Curious Villager]

If in the unlikely scenario that we're getting another third-party character, I think they will be revealed at E3.



Me too. That said, don't worry, her chance of getting in is over 18306758383427 times Young Link's chance

Spoiler

You'll get this sentence if you know how likely I think Young Link is.

Spoiler

....What? I haven't joked about his non-existant chance in quiet some time!

Just poking fun whenever BluePikmin disagrees with something and you feel the need to bring Young Link up every single time.

 

[Spazzy_D]

Only one more third party needs to be added for me to never want another one.

I MIGHT actually want Simon more than Bomberman. I don't think there is a character with a moveset I would be more excited to try out.

 

[Spinosaurus]

I seriously just want Snake back because the dude had such a well designed moveset, one of the top in the whole series. What a waste to leave it for one game.

...I may also a be a huge MGS fan.

 

[DavemanCozy]

All this talk about Young Link being in. So many Links to choose from though. I would rather have a Broken Link than one more Link in this game.

 

[Spazzy_D]

I hate that the two third party characters I want the most would have to go through Snake in order to be considered. It also doesn't help that I actually like Snake and would like to see him return.

 

[Wolfie557]

All this talk about Young Link being in. So many Links to choose from though. I would rather have a Broken Link than one more Link in this game.

A unique 'Masked Link' would be great and a welcomed addition imho.

 

[Curious Villager]

All this talk about Young Link being in. So many Links to choose from though. I would rather have a Broken Link than one more Link in this game.

It's okay, we will have three Link's very soon anyway. Link, Toon Link and when the new Mii outfits release: Lonk from Pennsylvania!

 

[Spazzy_D]

It's okay, we will have three Link's very soon anyway. Link, Toon Link and when the new Mii outfits release: Lonk from Pensylvania!

I personally can't wait to make Cat Petch.

 

[Arcadenik]

Only one more third party needs to be added for me to never want another one.

Simon Belmont has to be my #1 most wanted third-party character.

Everything about him exudes unique moveset potential. He wouldn't have normal jabs like most characters... he just whips... hell, he could be the only character with diagonal tilts when he whips in 8 directions just like in Super Castlevania IV. I think he would use the morning star when he charges his smash moves and the flame whip when he fully charges his smash moves. I imagine he would be projectile heavy with daggers, axes, holy water, cross boomerangs, and bouncing diamonds (from Simon's Quest). I would love for his Final Smash to be based on "what a horrible night to have a curse" where it is suddenly nighttime and green zombies show up to attack everyone and then Simon uses the holy cross to summon the morning sun to vanquish everyone.