Character Discussion Thread

[Morbi]

How about we talk about a character that we know for sure is in the game for once?
Let's talk about DARK PIT!, i know how much you guys love him Embarrass

It is of my belief that Dark Pit is going to be one of our Kid Icarus newcomers. Why not a costume, you ask? Well, my reasons predominantly focus on objective fact, for instance, I have this quote right here from Sakurai-swan. It becomes quite clear that if he is true to his word... Dark Pit is a character. However, on the off chance that everyone who calls him a troll are correct, he is at least one of the most unique alternate costumes featuring his own voice-work and purple effects on dem (sic) wings.

However, even though Lucina shares her physical stats and techniques with Marth, the characteristics of their attacks differ. When two such similar characters function in an even slightly different manner, I give them a separate spot on the roster since that will affect battle records and whatnot. In that sense, you could say she was very lucky to join the fray!

 

[Kenith]

@ CJ Falcon and @ ihskeyp could you guys stop?
At this point you sound like a couple of grade-schoolers going "Nu-uh!" back and forth."

I don't think K. Rool is guaranteed, but I would like to see him in the game. He'd be a very welcome addition to the roster and like Captain Falcon, it gives him something to do while waiting for his next game.

I enjoy your unwavering positivity.

 

[Deleted member]

Alright, only one way to settle this: we have to fight irl. It's the only way.

Woah wait what? A silly discussion on an internet forum about a video game has exploded with threats of real violence? Okay...

 

[HylianHeroBigBoss]

Yeah I'm open to talk about Wario as well. :^)

"he attacks by farting?...Are you kidding me!?"

 

[CJ Falcon]

Woah wait what? A silly discussion on an internet forum about a video game has exploded with threats of real violence? Okay...

I jest, I jest.

 

[CodeBlue_]

The only difference(s) being that Sceptile is more relevant, more recent, more requested. Sceptile comes from a series that deserves an additional representative and Sceptile is a better shade of green.

Sceptile is generally as recent as Dixie is. When it comes to character choices, we don't know if OR/AS was considered in development.

I would disagree with the level of requesting of Sceptile outside of some of the vocal individuals on these boards (and Youtube) who are desperate for a unique Grass type Pokémon to fit the starter trio that was removed.

But once again, I was referring to their popularity in Japan, not Smashboards.

 

[NeonBurrito]

Just one problem: He was already disconfirmed

When was he deconfirmed though? I must still have hope.

 

[False Sense]

Except:
It's a fact K Rool is no longer a part if the series.
It's a fact that Dixie is still relevant.
It's a fact that more relevant harassers have been added this time around.
It's a fact that you grasp at straws a lot.
Nothing 'hilariously wrong' there.

-"No longer part of the series" isn't entirely accurate. He just hasn't appeared in the most recent titles. For him to be "no longer part of the series," there would have to be some kind of official statement saying that K. Rool would no longer be appearing in future installments. As it is, we could, and likely will, see him again.

-Unless she's too relevant, in which case Sakurai might not have been aware of her return until after the roster was decided. Her relevancy may be too recent to have an impact on the roster.

-Goodness, they've been adding harassers into this game?
But, assuming you are referring to characters, this is accurate as of now. Though it's worth noting that they have added less relevant characters to the roster in the past, so assuming that it is impossible for them to do this again is an early assumption.

-That's an opinion.

 

[Fire Emblemier]

http://smashboards.com/threads/k-rools-kremling-kutthroats-become-one-of-us-today.324259/
There are counter arguments in the OP, if you're willing to check it out... Right now, I'm not in the mood to argue about K. Rool'd chances.

 

[BluePikmin11]

Seriously Blue Pikmin, with the due respect i don't think these "criterias" matter much, i mean who we consider "retro" or important enough or who is a shoe-in or who has the most potential, is something that is simply bound to not always match with Sakurai's views, i mean look at Robin and how it threw the "main lord character" criteria away, and pretty much created what we could call the "Sakurai does whatever the hell he wants" criteria.
Who would have considered R.O.B a retro?, when may people could have just said that he wasn't an actual character.

To each to their own I guess.

Exceptions, exceptions.
I'm waiting for "anything can happen because Sakurai!"

To be honest, I don't think statement works all the time.

 

[Spinosaurus]

"he attacks by farting?...Are you kidding me!?"

i am terrible disregard this post

 

[Kenith]

Yeah I'm open to talk about Wario as well. :^)

I think Wario is going to be cut, actually.

Smash Bros is not allowed to have realistic weaponry, and farting is a very real and lethal weapon I have been the victim of many times.

 

[Weeman]

I think Wario is going to be cut, actually.

Smash Bros is not allowed to have realistic weaponry, and farting is a very real and lethal weapon I have the victim of many times.

At least you're not mexican, you got no idea how much worse that is here .

 

[Deleted member]

Sceptile is generally as recent as Dixie is. When it comes to character choices, we don't know if OR/AS was considered in development.

I would disagree with the level of requesting of Sceptile outside of some of the vocal individuals on these boards (and Youtube) who are desperate for a unique Grass type Pokémon to fit the starter trio that was removed.

But once again, I was referring to their popularity in Japan, not Smashboards.

GameFreak is an advertising machine, keeping things like event legendaries in code for future releases and fusions for Kyurem in the original Black and White games. Since Sakurai went to them for an X and Y representative, it isn't too to say he found out about ORAS. Many fans, including myself, thought of the possibility of Hoenn remakes in the near future and of the uncompleted type trio immediately after Greninja's trailer. Other than that, Sceptile has nearly nothing besides being one of Ash's strongest Pokémon.

 

[Spinosaurus]

Ash used a Sceptile.

Checkmate, Blaziken.

 

[Weeman]

Ash used a Sceptile.

Checkmate, Blaziken.

Ash has a Hawlucha
GG Rythm Wrestler

 

[CodeBlue_]

Even if OR/AS was considered, would Sceptile be his #1 choice for a rep?

Maybe Blaziken possibly?

Anyone?

 

[JamesDNaux]

Christ, what is all this nonsense I've just read through?

Neither Dixie or K. Rool were ever "kicked out" of their franchise.

Rare was bought by Micro$oft, which is a blatantly old and obvious fact. Nintendo no longer had their big DK making powerhouse to continue the franchise, so they threw it to whoever they could, resulting in the bongo bashing games we had before Returns. I don't see how Dixie is somehow super important when Retro just randomly decided to pick her for Tropical Freeze, I guess Rambi is the only animal buddy with any sort of worth then. Just like the guys who worked on DK before Retro got their hands on it, they want to try their hand at making their own assortment of bad guys, to leave their own mark on the franchise. Anyone who's actually played Tropical Freeze knows that even Retro knows the importance of King K. Rool. Dixie getting lucky has nothing to do with him.

 

[TumblrFamous]

For some reason, this reminds me of Chrom vs. Robin debates.

"Who makes more sense; the face of Awakening, or some character that isn't even in promotions? It's obviously going to be Chrom, just accept it already." (Not an actual quote; just a general representation of common opinion)

Looking at things from one perspective, it may seem like there's an obvious choice. But when you look at it from a variety of perspectives, things may not be as clear-cut as they once appeared.

Basically, we have this "relevancy/recency" argument that claims that a character will not be made playable if they aren't "relevant/recent" enough. UNLESS:

1.) They've already been on the roster before.
2.) They're being added for the purpose of being an old, classic character.
3.) They're from a dead series.

Etc.

Personally, I feel like this whole argument is an arbitrary assumption treated like fact that makes exceptions for every instance that it's contradicted. To me, it's hard to say that it holds that much weight.

I'd just like to quote these posts by False Sense because this is pretty much the voice of reason.

We can easily make assumptions about choosing two characters, but as we saw with Robin/Chrom, our "logic" was thrown out the window. I'm not saying "Sakurai is an unpredictable troll, he can do whatever he wants", but stating your opinions as irrefutable proof is laughable. I was wrong about Rosalina, many people were wrong about Chrom, so what is "popular belief" here could be completely contradictory to what Sakurai believes. So talking in absolutes is not something you should do, because we've seen what that has done. "Chrom is over Robin". "Gematsu is a lock". "Toon Link, Lucario, and Ike aren't returning". We've been wrong many times.

In my opinion, both Dixie and K. Rool have chances. If another character from DK is chosen, they will most likely choose one of the two, maybe even both, and I honestly think they have equal footing.

HOWEVER, if they're padding the roster with semi-clones late in development, and DK had no set newcomer at first, Dixie would be a prime choice as a semi over K. Rool.

 

[ihskeyp]

Woah wait what? A silly discussion on an internet forum about a video game has exploded with threats of real violence? Okay...

I'm pretty sure he was joking (or at least hope, I wouldn't want to get in a physical argument over a video game character). Don't worry haha

 

[Spinosaurus]

Anyone who's actually played Tropical Freeze knows that even Retro knows the importance of King K. Rool.

I played through it twice, wrote a mini-essay about it and it's my GOTY so far.

I don't know what you're talking about.

 

[CodeBlue_]

Ash used a Sceptile.

Checkmate, Blaziken.

Ash would have had Blaziken as well if May didn't take Torchic because it's a cute Pokémon. Seriously, it's only because Torchic is cute.

 

[JamesDNaux]

I played through it twice, wrote a mini-essay about it and is my GOTY so far.

I don't know what you're talking about.

Have you played through any of the DKC trilogy?
[collapse=Spoilers]The final boss of TF uses the same tricks as King K. Rool. Either Retro is being blatantly unoriginal (unlikely, as the rest of the game is jam packed with originality), or it's a blatant homage to Rool. [/collapse]

 

[Spinosaurus]

Ash would have had Blaziken as well if May didn't take Torchic because it's a cute Pokémon. Seriously, it's only because Torchic is cute.

I was just messing with that one. I'd actually prefer Blaziken just because of the potential Muay-Thai inspired moveset he could get.

Have you played through any of the DKC trilogy?
[collapse=Spoilers]The final boss of TF uses the same tricks as King K. Rool. Either Retro is being blatantly unoriginal (unlikely, as the rest of the game is jam packed with originality), or it's a blatant homage to Rool. [/collapse]

It's one of my favorite series, so yes.

And all I remember is tackling and **** coming down from above. Hardly anything.

 

[Deleted member]

Ash would have had Blaziken as well if May didn't take Torchic because it's a cute Pokémon. Seriously, it's only because Torchic is cute.

How is that an argument? Can Ash not have cute Pokémon? Well Pikachu, Oshawott, Snivy, and Corphish need to go

 

[CodeBlue_]

How is that an argument? Can Ash not have cute Pokémon? Well Pikachu, Oshawott, Snivy, and Corphish need to go

This was a response to the original comment saying that Sceptile was chosen as Ash's Pokémon in the Hoenn Anime. I'm explaining why Blaziken wasn't.

 

[Deleted member]

This was a response to the original comment saying that Sceptile was chosen as Ash's Pokémon in the Hoenn Anime. I'm explaining why Blaziken wasn't.

The thing is, who cares if Torchic is cute? Does that affect the writer's choice? No, and if it did, they're bad writers. Besides: Did Torchic stay a Torchic? No. It became a Blaziken, which isn't cute. Its "cool". Just like Sceptile. So why on Earth are you saying that Ash doesn't have a Blaziken because he can't have cute Pokemon, even though he does have cute Pokemon?

 

[Burruni]

My stance on the DK rep: If we are to get one, I would prefer K. Rool, no matter qhat evidence for likelyhood and here are reasons why.

-He's heavy
-He's a villain
I'm tired of these arguments being thrown out wildly for a "need" in the newcomer pool, much like a random retro.
-He has more potential for an interesting, unique moveset than Dixie, to me.
-Would honestly be pretty hilarious as a fighter, just like my PREFERED THIRD DK REP CRANKY.
-Represents the core heart of the games, and would be a bit of a nice change with how uber-recent some of the newcomers have been this time around.

I played through it twice, wrote a mini-essay about it and it's my GOTY so far.

I don't know what you're talking about.

They refer to the clear similarities to downright copying of a number King K. Rool/Kaptain K. Rool attacks in the Final Boss.
King's charge from one side of the screen to the other, the three or four massive jumps across the span of the arena, the canonball dropping across the full span of the battlefield.
Kaptain's usage of tossing back items dropped out from jumping on his attacks, the swarm of projectiles whose pattern you have to quickly judge whether to jump or duck.
Infact, the phase in which the boss makes one massive jump that raises all other platforms before dropping them into lava could be considered an homage to Baron K. Rool, just like the foreground-background section of each phase with tossing the projectiles back to him with proper timing as he darts along the back.
While some of these are general tropes and ploys of bosses, the sum of them, I believe, can't be disregarded especially since these are people who took it upon themselves to continue the Donkey Kong Country games.

 

[Kenith]

You know I just realized they could have thrown in a blatant Fatman mention and "destructive explosions"and all that crap in that codec.
how did they miss that

Oh, yes, because the Fatman is absolutely something Japanese men would make a joking reference to

 

[Spinosaurus]

They refer to the clear similarities to downright copying of a number King K. Rool/Kaptain K. Rool attacks in the Final Boss.
King's charge from one side of the screen to the other, the three or four massive jumps across the span of the arena, the canonball dropping across the full span of the battlefield.
Kaptain's usage of tossing back items dropped out from jumping on his attacks, the swarm of projectiles whose pattern you have to quickly judge whether to jump or duck.
Infact, the phase in which the boss makes one massive jump that raises all other platforms before dropping them into lava could be considered an homage to Baron K. Rool, just like the foreground-background section of each phase with tossing the projectiles back to him with proper timing as he darts along the back.
While some of these are general tropes and ploys of bosses, the sum of them, I believe, can't be disregarded especially since these are people who took it upon themselves to continue the Donkey Kong Country games.

But that's really it, similarities, and as you said, they are general tropes that a lot of bosses use. I never once thought it was even remotely a homage to K.Rool.

I did say "man this boss is badly designed" though, which is the same thing I said to K.Rool's final boss fight.

Oh, yes, because the Fatman is absolutely something Japanese men would make a joking reference to

He's a Metal Gear boss that fought with C4s.

Though yeah, dunno how that crossed my head. Blech. Edited it out, I feel bad now.

 

[False Sense]

I'd just like to quote these posts by False Sense because this is pretty much the voice of reason.

We can easily make assumptions about choosing two characters, but as we saw with Robin/Chrom, our "logic" was thrown out the window. I'm not saying "Sakurai is an unpredictable troll, he can do whatever he wants", but stating your opinions as irrefutable proof is laughable. I was wrong about Rosalina, many people were wrong about Chrom, so what is "popular belief" here could be completely contradictory to what Sakurai believes. So talking in absolutes is not something you should do, because we've seen what that has done. "Chrom is over Robin". "Gematsu is a lock". "Toon Link, Lucario, and Ike aren't returning". We've been wrong many times.

In my opinion, both Dixie and K. Rool have chances. If another character from DK is chosen, they will most likely choose one of the two, maybe even both, and I honestly think they have equal footing.

HOWEVER, if they're padding the roster with semi-clones late in development, and DK had no set newcomer at first, Dixie would be a prime choice as a semi over K. Rool.

Precisely.

The truth of the matter is that we do not know how the roster is decided. The best we can do is try and figure out what is "logical" based on the games that Smash is built on and what we know of how Sakurai thinks (and while we can get some idea of that based on his decisions and what he says, there is no way to know exactly what goes through his mind). In the process of trying to figure out what is "logical," we often make our own guidelines on how the roster is decided to try and determine who will make the cut. The problem with this is that the rules we make and use as "proof" that certain characters can't be playable are not necessarily the rules Sakurai abides by. The rules and guidelines we make are just theories based on the knowledge we currently have, and new knowledge can come along that throws a wrench in how we previously thought the roster-making process worked.

To put it simply, it's silly to use fan-made criteria for how the roster is decided as some sort of absolute proof when it really isn't absolute at all. That's especially true if the criteria in question has been previously contradicted and the response is to create further arbitrary criteria that explains the exception to the "absolute" rule.

Oh, and thanks for the compliment. I appreciate it.

 

[CodeBlue_]

The thing is, who cares if Torchic is cute? Does that affect the writer's choice? No, and if it did, they're bad writers. Besides: Did Torchic stay a Torchic? No. It became a Blaziken, which isn't cute. Its "cool". Just like Sceptile. So why on Earth are you saying that Ash doesn't have a Blaziken because he can't have cute Pokemon, even though he does have cute Pokemon?

A cute Pokémon would be more appropriate to be given to a female character. That's why Dawn was given a Piplup, Serena was given a Fennekin, and Bonnie (to an extent) was given a Dedenne.

Why Torchic evolved into Blaziken is beyond me. It's probably because that both Torchic and Blaziken both have prominence as starter Pokémon.

 

[Godzillathewonderdog]

I don't think Dixie Kong will be in the initial roster, but I think it's incredibly likely that she'll be added through dlc, if character dlc becomes a thing for this game.

 

[Weeman]

I don't think Dixie Kong will be in the initial roster, but I think it's incredibly likely that she'll be added through dlc, if character dlc becomes a thing for this game.

DLC... why is DLC... a thing... i don't want it to be...

Spoiler

A thing

 

[Kenith]

I'm honestly banking on secret characters more than DLC characters at this point.

 

[False Sense]

I'm honestly banking on secret characters more than DLC characters at this point.

So, you're banking on the return of a Smash tradition over the introduction of something that is somewhat controversial and has never been done in Smash before?

 

[JamesDNaux]

I'm honestly banking on secret characters more than DLC characters at this point.

We've always had secret newcomers, it baffles me that people seriously think everyone will be revealed before release.


I don't know why people are complaining about DLC either, if you don't want it, don't buy it. Common sense.

 

[Morbi]

So, you're banking on the return of a Smash tradition over the introduction of something that is somewhat controversial and has never been done in Smash before?

It might sound risky, but I am speculating in favor of both. I mean, there is a it will happen.

If Dark Pit is not a (secret) newcomer, I can always support him for DLC!

 

[MagnesD3]

Has StarFox been as critically acclaimed as some of Fire Emblem's best-selling titles?

Star fox destroys Fe in sales and in popularity and they really only have 3 good games, fe only be a blip because of smash and awakening lol

 

[Scamper52596]

If Dark Pit is not a (secret) newcomer, I can always support him for DLC!

At that point I'm not sure we'll even be able to handle it anymore.