Character Discussion Thread

[Autumn ♫]

WFT, G&W, and ROB are oddities we have to accept and live with. The only scenario they might get cut in is a reboot.

Well, if you're like me, you won't have any trouble accepting them. You'll just have trouble not loving them.

 

[Reality_Ciak]

My brain hurts from all the speculation. It's not even fun anymore. This was my conclusion after reviewing leaks and following some gut feelings. I want Isaac and I'd replace Anthony, but I feel like Anthony could take over Snake's playstyle if Snake is gone. I also consider Bandana Dee, other 6th Zelda reps other than Ganon, Lucas, a Kid Icarus villain, and yeah I'm done thinking about this. 55 (56 counting Miis as one, 58 counting them separately) I honestly just like my organization.

 

[Godzillathewonderdog]

Am I the only one that found Toon Link to be a more likely returner than Lucas?

 

[Spinosaurus]

Am I the only one that found Toon Link to be a more likely returner than Lucas?

Nope. Thought the same too.

It's not like Mother fans even want Lucas. :[

 

[Godzillathewonderdog]

My brain hurts from all the speculation. It's not even fun anymore. This was my conclusion after reviewing leaks and following some gut feelings. I want Isaac and I'd replace Anthony, but I feel like Anthony could take over Snake's playstyle if Snake is gone. I also consider Bandana Dee, other 6th Zelda reps other than Ganon, Lucas, a Kid Icarus villain, and yeah I'm done thinking about this. 55 (56 counting Miis as one, 58 counting them separately) I honestly just like my organization.

Do you really think that we're going to get up to 20 newcomers?

 

[Curious Villager]

Am I the only one that found Toon Link to be a more likely returner than Lucas?

Toon Link was a bit of another victim to the whole "patternist" thinking."He replaced Young Link before, so a new child Link would replace him too?" Or because people just plain didn't like him and used the whole Spirit Train thing to confirm him officially gone.

Although as soon as I saw that they kept TP Link and remade Wind Waker as well, I thought he had a good chance to come back as well, despite what the Spirit Train stage lead most to believe.

Although compared to Lucas... I'm not sure, I think they where at least equal to a certain extend (although with Sakurai's desire and importance to keep a child Link in Smash, perhaps Toon Link a little higher than Lucas)

 

[Reality_Ciak]

Do you really think that we're going to get up to 20 newcomers?

I originally thought we'd have a roster of 44 characters. So I don't know what I think anymore when it comes to numbers. haha

 

[Pizzanigs]

This should teach us all a lesson. In this franchise, there is no such thing as a "pattern". Sakurai can do whatever he wants.

 

[JaidynReiman]

Do you really think that we're going to get up to 20 newcomers?

18 at the absolute max, and that's only counting some characters as "replacing" existing updated ones, and a couple of clones. I myself don't anticipate more than 16, with 20 definitely being way high.

This should teach us all a lesson. In this franchise, there is no such thing as a "pattern". Sakurai can do whatever he wants.

I hate it when people try using patterns to justify character inclusions. Sakurai is likely going to kill the pattern of bringing back one character in every game in this one, too, as I don't think we're getting a "retro" or "long forgotten" character in this game.

 

[Morbi]

This should teach us all a lesson. In this franchise, there is no such thing as a "pattern". Sakurai can do whatever he wants.

Or just identify the patterns and make the assumption that he will attempt to refute that pattern in order to maintain the facade that he is unpredictable. So far, that has worked out fairly nicely, it makes speculation easy.

 

[Spazzy_D]

I can't deal with this speculation anymore.

We REALLY need a direct or some other sort of reveal event next week.

 

[Spinosaurus]

We're also not getting a villain either :^)

 

[Pizzanigs]

I hate it when people try using patterns to justify character inclusions. Sakurai is likely going to kill the pattern of bringing back one character in every game in this one, too, as I don't think we're getting a "retro" or "long forgotten" character in this game.

The "new retro character" pattern is one of the most infuriating ones. I'm not really sure who at Nintendo said we're getting a new retro character with each new Smash Bros. game.

 

[JaidynReiman]

The "new retro character" pattern is one of the most infuriating ones. I'm not really sure who at Nintendo said we're getting a new retro character with each new Smash Bros. game.

I think Sakurai stated he wanted to try and bring back at least one classic character per game. Note the "try," though. That doesn't mean he always will.

 

[Wazygoose]

A victory, nevertheless!


No. Wolf is not a clone, a clone entails that the character shares their move-set with another character. Who does Wolf share his move-set with, it certainly is not Fox or Falco. Is Wolf a Dark Pit clone or something? They share a projectile and a reflector! He is not even a semi-clone, as that would insinuate that they share half of their moves. Wolf has similar (similar =/= congruent) specials with completely and utterly unique properties and aesthetics. Landmaster and (kind-of, sort-of) reflector... Landmaster and (kind-of, sort-of) reflector. Please, Sakurai. Change these two moves so I do not need to hear of it any longer.

Woa, didn't mean to strike a nerve, my bad. But be at ease, I now see that clone is the wrong word I'm looking for. Wolf is not a Lucina or Dark Pit, both clones I would imagine. Wolf is to Fox and Falco what Luigi is to Mario, Toon Link is to Link, and Lucas is to Ness. Their special moves have the same basic properties and they have similar sizes and/or looks. So they're not clones per se, but they're similar.

And Wolf is like Fox and Falco, and not Dark Pit, because his reflector is a tiny machine that creates a forcefield thing that surrounds his body, his projectile comes from a blaster that shoots exactly horizontally in the direction he faces, his side special is a quick zip move, and with his up special he pauses for a second and then moves in one of the 8 nautical directions. And, he's a space animal carnivore that has a landmaster. Dark Pit isn't a carnivorous space animal in a landmaster, but I'd love to see an image of that.

A ton of stuff is different between them of course. But in my mind, if I had to get rid of a character from brawl, a space animal would be one of my first choices (Falco, but like I said in the earlier post I think they'd go Wolf). Now they might keep all three considering we now have Ike/Marth-Lucina, and it would be like Wolf/Fox-Falco.

I'm just happy we both agree on Paper Mario and Ghirahim, we seriously are the 0.01%.

 

[Doompatron3000]

This should teach us all a lesson. In this franchise, there is no such thing as a "pattern". Sakurai can do whatever he wants.

Agreed, plus we're trying to pull patterns, when only three other games in the franchise exist. I personally think it would be different if there was like 20 games before this one, then speculation might be a little more easier.

 

[Morbi]

Woa, didn't mean to strike a nerve, my bad. But be at ease, I now see that clone is the wrong word I'm looking for. Wolf is not a Lucina or Dark Pit, both clones I would imagine. Wolf is to Fox and Falco what Luigi is to Mario, Toon Link is to Link, and Lucas is to Ness. Their special moves have the same basic properties and they have similar sizes and/or looks. So they're not clones per se, but they're similar.

And Wolf is like Fox and Falco, and not Dark Pit, because his reflector is a tiny machine that creates a forcefield thing that surrounds his body, his projectile comes from a blaster that shoots exactly horizontally in the direction he faces, his side special is a quick zip move, and with his up special he pauses for a second and then moves in one of the 8 nautical directions. And, he's a space animal carnivore that has a landmaster. Dark Pit isn't a carnivorous space animal in a landmaster, but I'd love to see an image of that.

A ton of stuff is different between them of course. But in my mind, if I had to get rid of a character from brawl, a space animal would be one of my first choices (Falco, but like I said in the earlier post I think they'd go Wolf). Now they might keep all three considering we now have Ike/Marth-Lucina, and it would be like Wolf/Fox-Falco.

I'm just happy we both agree on Paper Mario and Ghirahim, we seriously are the 0.01%.

I apologize, "Wolf is a clone" discussion is my Achilles' heel. I labor much disdain against the notion. I prefer the more politically correct term, "pseudo-clone."

We're also not getting a villain either :^)

Correct, we are getting an antagonist.

 

[Blue Ninjakoopa]

Do any of you still adhere to that "SOMEBODY has to get replaced!" mindset? It's way too prevalent in fan speculation, even today.

Like, remember when everybody thought Captain Olimar would get "replaced" by Alph from Pikmin 3? Or that Lucario would get "replaced" by Zoroark (these same people thought that Lucario "replaced" Mewtwo in Brawl)? And annoyingly, there are still fans who think Ganondorf is going to be "replaced" by Demise.

 

[Reality_Ciak]

I honestly can't see Dark Pit being a clone. Which makes it hard to believe he would be separately playable. He can't look nearly identical AND play nearly identical. At least I don't think that will happen. So character swap or very different playstyle, or not playable at all.

 

[BluePikmin11]

I honestly can't see Dark Pit being a clone. Which makes it hard to believe he would be separately playable. He can't look nearly identical AND play nearly identical. At least I don't think that will happen. So character swap or very different playstyle, or not playable at all.

But Sakurai could easily make him different by making him pose differently and by giving him a different weapon to distinguish him from Pit. It's not that hard to think outside the box you know.

 

[Godzillathewonderdog]

If they're not even going to bother adding a new villain they better not cut one.

 

[FlareHabanero]

I can't deal with this speculation anymore.

We REALLY need a direct or some other sort of reveal event next week.

Better yet, wait until the games are released. It's only a month.

Also, prepare for people to learn their lessons the hard way.

 

[False Sense]

But Sakurai could easily make him different by making him pose differently and by giving him a different weapon to distinguish him from Pit. It's not that hard to think outside the box you know.

If he's going to actually make Dark Pit that distinct from Pit, and possibly into a fully unique character, then why Dark Pit?

 

[Spinosaurus]

If they're not even going to bother adding a new villain they better not cut one.

They didn't add one in Brawl, and then went ahead to cut Mewtwo. :^)

 

[False Sense]

They didn't add one in Brawl, and then went ahead to cut Mewtwo. :^)

So King Dedede and Wolf don't count as villains?

 

[ihskeyp]

They didn't add one in Brawl, and then went ahead to cut Mewtwo. :^)

Wolf and Dedede aren't villains, but mewtwo is? Lol at least wolf and dedede are pretty much the main antagonists of their series, mewtwo is only the villain of the anime, he's not evil in any actual games.

 

[Spinosaurus]

So King Dedede and Wolf don't count as villains?

I have a very strict definition of what a villain is, so clearly not. Was DeDeDe ever a villain? He's just a douche. And Wolf goes where the money goes.

Bowser and Ganondorf are the only ones. Where's the diversity?

 

[Reality_Ciak]

But Sakurai could easily make him different by making him pose differently and by giving him a different weapon to distinguish him from Pit. It's not that hard to think outside the box you know.

That would be making him unique. Like I said if it's going to happen he can't just be a clone.

 

[Deleted member]

I have a very strict definition of what a villain is, so clearly not. Was DeDeDe ever a villain? He's just a douche. And Wolf goes where the money goes.

Bowser and Ganondorf are the only ones. Where's the diversity?

Technically, Dedede and Wolf were villains in their debuts.
It wasn't until later games that would establish their true colors. Same with Wario. (Though to be fair, Wario was a "villain" for a few games since his debut)

 

[Second Power]

If he's going to actually make Dark Pit that distinct from Pit, and possibly into a fully unique character, then why Dark Pit?

Because he has an idea for something Dark Pit can do which other characters don't logically bring to the table? Then again, logic didn't stop Rosalina...

 

[False Sense]

Because he has an idea for something Dark Pit can do which other characters don't logically bring to the table? Then again, logic didn't stop Rosalina...

Well, I mean, if Dark Pit is going to be added as a totally unique character, then why add Dark Pit and not someone like Medusa or Hades? Isn't Dark Pit seen as a possibility because he'd be an easy alternate-costume-made-clone character like Lucina? If he's not being added in as a clone, then why would he be added in over characters that are much more important or popular from Kid Icarus?

 

[Spinosaurus]

Technically, Dedede and Wolf were villains in their debuts.
It wasn't until later games that would establish their true colors. Same with Wario. (Though to be fair, Wario was a "villain" for a few games since his debut)

Well they aren't villains anymore, so why count them?

We need someone...except I can't think of a good one. Actually I take it back, who needs villains? The only other one is already an AT, and one is getting cut from Brawl anyway. :^)

 

[Second Power]

Well, I mean, if Dark Pit is going to be added as a totally unique character, then why add Dark Pit and not someone like Medusa or Hades? Isn't Dark Pit seen as a possibility because he'd be an easy alternate-costume-made-clone character like Lucina? If he's not being added in as a clone, then why would he be added in over characters that are much more important or popular from Kid Icarus?

I was referring to a case where concept came before character (I strongly believe this is how ICs got in). However, I misread the person you quoted, so sorry.

 

[Blue Ninjakoopa]

I have a very strict definition of what a villain is, so clearly not. Was DeDeDe ever a villain? He's just a douche. And Wolf goes where the money goes.

Bowser and Ganondorf are the only ones. Where's the diversity?

My definition of a villain is a character frequently at odds with the hero, and Dedede and Wolf fit that criterion quite well. "Anti-heroes" count as villains too, like Wario.

It's not necessarily the fault of the developers that there's a lack of true villains. The villain realm is simply full of characters that are either severely lacking in significance (Black Shadow, Leon Powalski) or have designs that won't fit well into Smash (Mother Brain), or both (Black Jewel).

 

[Reality_Ciak]

Needs more antagonists. Better word?

 

[BluePikmin11]

If he's going to actually make Dark Pit that distinct from Pit, and possibly into a fully unique character, then why Dark Pit?

Because of the open and interesting potential of weapons in Uprising that Sakurai can fill in to make as a (possibly) Luigified semi-clone, unlike other characters who have a few moves to distinguish them such as Dixie Kong.

 

[Sonic Poke]

Wolf and Dedede aren't villains, but mewtwo is? Lol at least wolf and dedede are pretty much the main antagonists of their series, mewtwo is only the villain of the anime, he's not evil in any actual games.

Actually...

Mewtwo is a Pokémon that was created by genetic manipulation. However, even though the scientific power of humans created this Pokémon's body, they failed to endow Mewtwo with a compassionate heart.

A Pokémon whose genetic code was repeatedly recombined for research. It turned vicious as a result.

Because its battle abilities were raised to the ultimate level, it thinks only of defeating its foes.

A Pokémon created by recombining Mew's genes. It's said to have the most savage heart among Pokémon.

He may not be evil second the games but definitely he's not a good guy...

 

[False Sense]

Because of the open and interesting potential of weapons in Uprising that Sakurai can fill in to make as a (possibly) Luigified semi-clone, unlike other characters who have a few moves to distinguish them such as Dixie Kong.

But, as I've stated a minute ago, if they're going to make Dark Pit unique, why not add someone more important to Kid Icarus like Medusa or even Hades?

 

[ihskeyp]

Actually...




He may not be evil second the games but definitely he's not a good guy...

Again, he's not an antagonist. He's not chasing after him, he isn't a boss, he isn't even a villain really. He's just a vicious Pokemon.

 

[Spinosaurus]

But, as I've stated a minute ago, if they're going to make Dark Pit unique, why not someone more important to Kid Icarus like Medusa or even Hades?

I'm pretty sure "important" isn't the word you want to use here, bud.