Character Data Release Thread

[SuSa]

You're so biased for Lucas... he's the only one with an emoticon

On that note, BRB I know the perfect format.

EDIT:
This with some slight modifications

Instead of:

What it is - frame​

We use:

What it is: frame

:leek:

 

[rPSIvysaur]

Hmm... I might want something not so harsh on the eyes. ~_~

I'm thinking we should use [indent ] tags to denote the different moves.

 

[Luxor]

http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=285276
Something like that?

 

[SuSa]

I only suggested Snake's because of this comment:

http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=10558134&postcount=48

Also having

• Things like this: 50
• Still works: 3

:leek:

 

[T-block]

Squirtle/Ivysaur/Charizard will be in one thread, yeah?

Am I the only one who doesn't like the Collapse tags for this? I think if we're making threads specifically to show frame data, they shouldn't be necessary, especially since we won't be posting too many pictures, if any.

 

[rPSIvysaur]

I don't like the collapse tags either.

 

[SuSa]

I don't like having to scroll for 3 pages to find roll data.

Control+F is unheard of before anyone brings that up. I hate having to search for "forward" and have it appear for like 9 things when I specifically wanted just the roll or something. Especially when I then want to search up something else, it becomes tedious to have to constantly search different phrases when I could just collapse a box or skip over it entirely.

:leek:

 

[Luxor]

I only suggested Snake's because of this comment:

None of my frame data threads existed yet. Just sayin'.

The Snake one has all the hitbox data, but mine have the shield advantages and superior formatting. I don't like the collapse tags either- well, I like it how I formatted it, with a collapse tag around everything, but eh. If you're going to have a whomping big picture for every move it's pretty necessary, but I'm happiest with how I did it. Not to toot my own horn, or anything.

 

[Indigo Jeans]

Man, so I've just got a very basic, easy to read format, yeah?

Jab(Control+F: [JB])​

Hitbox out: F"#"
Duration: "#"F
First Actionable Frame: F"#"
Damage: "#"%
Priority: "Clash/Transcend"
Hitlag Multiplier: x"#"
Jab Flow: F"#"
Jab Loop: F"#"

Aerials(Control+F: [ARL])​

Hitbox out: F"#"
Duration: "#"F
First Actionable Frame: F"#"
Damage: "#"%
Priority: "Clash/Transcend"
Hitlag Multiplier: x"#"
Early Autocancel: F"#"
Late Autocancel: F"#"
Hitbox Change(s): F"#"

Smashes(Control+F: [SMSH])​

Hitbox out: F"#"
Duration: "#"F
First Actionable Frame: F"#"
Damage: "#"%
Priority: "Clash/Transcend"
Hitlag Multiplier: x"#"
Electric Hitstun?: "Yes; x1.5/No; x1.0"
Charge Time: "#"F

Grabs(Control+F: [GRB])​

Grabbox out: F"#"
Duration: "#"F
First Actionable Frame: F"#"

...Adding of course later stuff like trajectory, blah. So then:

[collapse=R.O.B. Test]

Jab1​

Hitbox out: F3
Duration: 4F
First Actionable Frame: F21
Damage: 3%
Priority: Clash
Hitlag Multiplier: x1.0
Jab Flow: F13
Jab Loop: F9
Electric Hitstun?: No; x1.0
Hitbox Change(s): N/A

Forward Aerial​

Hitbox out: F7--9
Duration: 2--8F
First Actionable Frame: F32
Damage: 10--6%
Priority: Clash
Hitlag Multiplier: 1--1
Early Autocancel: F0
Late Autocancel: F25
Landing Lag: 12F
Electric Hitstun?: No; x1.0
Hitbox Change(s): F9

Down Smash​

Hitbox out: F3, 5, 7, 9, 13
Duration: 1F(x4), 1F
First Actionable Frame: F34
Damage: 2%(x4), 5%
Priority: Clash(x4), Clash
Hitlag Multiplier: 1(x4), 1
Electric Hitstun?: No; x1.0
Charge Time: 1F

Standing Grab​

Grabbox out: F6
Duration: 2F
First Actionable Frame: F30[/collapse]

Etc., for all other data. Speaking of which, shouldn't we release these once we have stuff like specials and the rest done?

 

[rPSIvysaur]

http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=263608

Opinion?

 

[SuSa]

Hey look. Like. Exactly what I suggested.

But I was unsure about underlining... but it needs something to have a difference between what it is and the frames. (Yeah I know, words and numbers.. but I like to quickly glance)

Maybe
something
more
like
this?

=\ idk

:leek:

 

[Indigo Jeans]

http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=263608

Opinion?

A little hard on the eyes imo, but I like how it divides frame data, hitbox data, and miscellaneous.

 

[Luxor]

Would be perfect if it had bullets imo.

 

[T-block]

Yes, something like the Ness frame data is what I had in mind.

If searching is your issue, we can even include a table of contents or something with search codes. Like ctrl+f [FWDRL] for Forward Roll.

 

[saviorslegacy]

+35 IMO TBH

I like this idea. As soon as I get a chunk of free time I'm going to learn how to do that frame pause hack thing, figure Sheik's frame data out, compile it and turn it in here.
I'll then go, copy it and turn it into a Sheik guide since we need one... bad.
I might even finish my video guide for Sheik.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gbe19spjBzk&feature=related


POWER TO THE NINJA!!!!!!!!!

 

[T-block]

Umm...

http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=282744

 

[saviorslegacy]

Umm...

http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=282744

I have never been that good at hacking or anything like that.
I am good at physics and stuff.
I know someone who is a smash developer. Maybe he'll set the hacks up for me. Once that is done I'll be able to get the frame data.


BTW, this is awesome: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vdBeRjqTBcg

 

[KayLo!]

Eh, you guys've seen the one I did for the Pikas. That's how I'm keeping it formatted, although I'll gladly add to it once we have a standardized list of the info we're all supposed to include.

Same for Zelda.

 

[Mr. Escalator]

Last I heard, rPSI is replacing all existing threads for frame data, KayLo.

 

[KayLo!]

Considering I put days of work into the ones I made and even asked about it back here before I did them, I really hope that's not true.

I'll change the data itself to match the "official" stuff, but if I would've known the whole threads would be completely replaced, I wouldn't've done them in the first place.

 

[Mr. Escalator]

I asked rPSI about it a while back halfway through collecting basic frame data. His answer was that they'd be remaking all the current threads into standardized threads for each character, effectively making the current threads obsolete. I'm not a big fan as someone who has a frame data thread already up which had a lot of work put into it, but I can see the value in having standardized threads. I just wish we could edit the existing ones but eh.

 

[KayLo!]

Imo, they don't all have to look the same as long as they have the same information.

Besides that, the threads I made have more than just frame data in them..... they're research threads that include info for character-specific ATs, techniques, etc. It's pretty silly to replace the ones with accurate, standardized info in them imo, especially when people put so much work into them (at least, I know I did).

 

[SuSa]

I don't feel they should replace the current frame data threads - if the current frame data threads are better. (Such as what KayLo! mentioned with the additional character-specific AT stuff, etc.)

However I do think an official frame data thread should exist in each forum (not required to be stickied) but a stickied link in Data/Ruleset Discussion with the link to each of the official frame data threads in their respective boards.

Comparing things that look alike is much easier, especially when it's displayed and organized in the exact same fashion. But the amount of work (and surplus of info) in some of the existing threads is not worth replacing.

See:
Ike's frame data thread - especially.

:leek:

 

[KayLo!]

Agreed @SuSa.

 

[A2ZOMG]

One of the things I hope people do besides copy/pasting from PSA/OSA2 is also making sure that they get aerial attack animation frames (important for SJRs), airtime on shorthop/fullhop, and of course jump startup time. Since generally speaking, I specifically don't remember rPSI doing any of those in his frame data topics.

 

[rPSIvysaur]

Agreed @ SuSa

We don't need to replace them (unless they suck) we can just provide the alternative.

 

[Yikarur]

well the Ike Frame Data Thread isn't exactly a frame data thread, it's every information about the moves, that's why I don't like to search for Ike Frame data.
I don't like the collapse tags and I used it always like
[Table of Contents]
Jab
Tilts
Smashes
Aerials
...
so you can input cntrl + Aerials and have them instantly. I also wrote every possible name to the aerial
example: Forward Air (Fair,F-Air)
because It's annoying to enter a frame data thread,
you type in let's say "fair" you don't find it, you try "f-air" you don't find it, you type "forward" and you get redirected to 1000 different things.

thats how I structured my frame data thread.
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=249046

just don't use collapse. I wanted it too but you can't find specific moves immediatly, that sucks.
I don't like the frame data thread of Snake at all, the pictures are too tall and cover the whole screen (overstatment but you should know what I mean). Pictures are usefull though and the only thing that should be collapse if we would add them.

 

[rPSIvysaur]

We should use a table of contents like I did in the Ness boards. I believe that is now agreed upon.

 

[SuSa]

The pictures aren't even large enough...... Snake's utilt gets cut off.... not sure if he ever fixed that actually.

It may not get cut off nowadays..... but I think the top does.


Also collapsed with titles and an index is awesome. 5 seconds of scrolling after reading the index and I can find whatever it is I wanted.

Faster than I can even hit control+F and type what I was looking for.

:leek:

 

[rPSIvysaur]

I disapprove of collapsed. :U

 

[SuSa]

I think I've gotten that from like the 20 different people against it.

Fine don't use it. =P

Luckily I have the important frame data committed to memory anyways.

That doesn't stop me from saying how awesome it is

:leek:

 

[KayLo!]

I like how I did it..... collapsed sections with a searchable code for each section. =X

But if it's a thread solely for frame data, it probably doesn't need to be collapsed. There are a good bit of moves to cover, though, so the finished product will be insanely long.

[COLLAPSE=List of moves]GROUND MOVES

Jab (48)
Dash Attack (4E)
Ftilt (50)
Utilt (54)
Dtilt (55)
Fsmash (58)
Usmash (5D)
Dsmash (60)
Standing Grab (6C)
Dash Grab (6D)
Pivot Grab (6E)
Grab Pummel (70)
Shield
Spotdodge
Forward Roll
Backward Roll
Up Taunt
Side Taunt
Down Taunt

AERIAL MOVES

Nair (62)
Fair (63)
Bair (64)
Uair (65)
Dair (66)
Jump
Airdodge

SPECIALS

Neutral B (1CE)
Side B (1D0 - 1D2)
Up B (1D6 - 1D9)
Down B (1DA - 1DD)

LEDGE MOVES

Ledge Grab
Ledge Attack <100% (D7)
Ledge Attack >100% (DC)
Ledge Climb <100% (D8)
Ledge Climb >100% (DD)
Ledge Roll <100% (D9)
Ledge Roll >100% (DE)
Ledge Jump <100%
Ledge Jump >100%

TECH & TRIP MOVES (AA-BD)

Tech
Tech Roll Forward
Tech Roll Backward
Flop
Stand (Back)
Stand (Stomach)
Get Up Attack (Back)
Get Up Attack (Stomach)
Get Up Roll Forward (Back)
Get Up Roll Forward (Stomach)
Get Up Roll Backward (Back)
Get Up Roll Backward (Stomach)
Dash Trip
Pivot Trip
Forced Trip
Trip Stand
Trip Get Up Attack
Trip Roll Forward
Trip Roll Backward

ITEM MOVES

Item Pick Up
Item Drop
Dash Toss
Forward Toss (Ground)
Back Toss (Ground)
Up Toss (Ground)
Down Toss (Ground)
Forward Toss (Air)
Back Toss (Air)
Up Toss (Air)
Down Toss (Air)[/COLLAPSE](Some of them can be deleted probably..... I was unsure about a few things, like if tech rolls are the same frames as missed tech get up rolls and exactly how many kinds of trips there are. Prime's told me that dash and pivot tripping are different, but I haven't checked or asked yet.)

EDIT: I posted this as a maybe helpful reference btw..... I don't care how the final thing is formatted/what's included, just trying to help. ;;

 

[rPSIvysaur]

Thanks for the list KayLo. I've been looking for a good one.

 

[KayLo!]

Np.

I didn't include throws, btw, because I know some throws are weight-dependent and don't have set frame data.

 

[SuSa]

IIRC, according to Snake's frame data, missed-tech rolls and tech-rolls are different.

Also I thought we had a formula for weight-dependent throws... isn't there a way we could add that so that people.. who for some reason or another... are interested in how long a throw takes to complete can do the math to figure it out?

Just for the sake of completeness..... obviously # of weights * 4 throws * # of chars is a stupidly high amount of data for us to complete for the likely non-existent group of people who'd want throw frame-data.. we can mention that and say "if interested here's how you can do it yourself"..... but this allows character boards to do it for themselves if interests, possibly to find frame advantage or something?

:leek:

 

[rPSIvysaur]

But the layman doesn't understand formulas!

What's a frame?

 

[SuSa]

I'm in the Smash Lab and I still **** up on Duration okay? Sue me. ****.

3 is so much harder to comprehend on a glance than 3-5.

3-5 takes absolutely NO THINKING WHATSOVER to understand. I can immediately see it is frames 3, 4, and 5.

When I see 3 it makes me want to think 3-6, every god**** time. I have to sit there and correct myself every time before I type, and I messed up on adding it to our chart, even if it was just once - because I have to constantly think otherwise.

So sorry I'm an idiot.

:leek:

 

[KayLo!]

Ah, okay, that's good to know @roll stuff.

We do have a formula for weight-dependent throws, and I wouldn't be against including throws + the formula (although I'd also understand leaving them out). The only thing we'd need to make sure to do would be to note exactly which throws are weight-dependent and which aren't. .....I don't even know which are and which aren't for Pika/Zelda lol.

Going by Prime's work on Pika, weak and strong item tosses are the same frames. I think they are for Zelda as well, but I tested it a long long time ago..... gotta look again.

EDIT: Rage ninja'd. o____o

 

[SuSa]

Weak and strong item tosses are the same frames, different animation.

Also yea, I'm a bit irritable and easy to troll because it's 5:30am and I've yet to sleep.

I don't mind personally adding the 3-5 duration etc. for every **** thing we have in the game with a hitbox duration by myself..... but it's going to have to be double-checked because I often make the error. If I'm in the Smash Lab and make the error, I'm pretty **** certain the layman will too.

That or I shouldn't be in the Smash Lab for making such a trivial error on the easiest thing ever.

:leek:

 

[Yikarur]

I'm on your side for once SuSa =P
I got stuck with my brain when looing at Lucarios data.

U-smash FAF 52 Hitframe 7 Duration 24 Hitbox Changes 26

try to get in which frame of the hitbox is the hitbox frame that changes in less then 5 seconds.