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Celebrity Rehab Mafia: Day 5 Begins! Deadline is Monday, May 28th at 11:59 PM EST!

Pink Lemonade

Smash Rookie
Joined
Feb 28, 2011
Messages
5
Location
Ran|July
Scumread. I didn't like Joey's play, yet Vandy muddled the slot for me. He gave good content but I was still in withdrawal due to Joey not responding to my case. I only re-ignited my scumread on him after seeing DH flip scum. Joey gave wishy washy oponions on both me and DH which was very odd.

Vandy's push on me seemed like a desperate push since 3 scum have flipped already. (He was trying to justify it because of me being on the Kantrip wagon instead of Vynil, I was fine with either and explained my thought process on this) Nothing else stood out from Vandy for me.
 

Pink Lemonade

Smash Rookie
Joined
Feb 28, 2011
Messages
5
Location
Ran|July
Also I don't understand what Frozen Flame is doing this game. He isn't really trying that hard to find scum and is only focusing on OS. He is kinda winging it and letting others do the work. He is flying under the radar to me and needs to flesh out some more opinions. I remember his play in Soul Calibur and wonder why he has been playing this way here.

@J: I am wondering why you have Macman as town?
 

Overswarm

is laughing at you
Joined
May 4, 2005
Messages
21,181
Can we kill OS yet?
Nope!

2/10 clear from my pov, as I consider Rajam to be clear for now. Doc is dead though so his investigation tonight is prooooobably his last. If Rajam has another clear, that's 3/10.

Dislike two deaths tonight.
 

Jdietz43

BRoomer
BRoomer
Joined
Apr 3, 2008
Messages
2,625
Location
Milwaukee
Yeah I read up some awhile back while we were waiting for night to end. Not enough that I can pull specifics at the moment, but enough I can give you gut feels on the players who are left.

Let me compile a bullet point list of my notions coming into today:
 

#HBC | J

Prince of DGamesia
Joined
Feb 14, 2010
Messages
7,591
Location
Colorado
OS, Rockin is just as town as Rajam in my book. =P

Macman is town because I like the analysis this game and things. *sorry for vagueness, I'll explain later haha*
 

Jdietz43

BRoomer
BRoomer
Joined
Apr 3, 2008
Messages
2,625
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1. frozenflame751 - Leaning Scum, didn't like his drawn out fights with Kantrip that went in circles
2. KevinM - Null, I get bad vibes from his style but I don't think he's done anything directly incriminating
4. Rajam - Town, hasn't done anything wrong and seems sane so far, want to see what he got today
5. Rockin - Null, he's been kind of inactive but I didn't get any red flags from him otherwise
7. Macman - Leaning Scum, he's been lurking in the intentional kind of way for awhile
10. Pink Lemonade (Ranmaru/July hydra) - Leaning Scum, they've been changing stances a lot and I disliked their overall posturing so far
12. Axel (J/Zen hydra) J - Leaning Town, they've had a few moments I was unsure of early game but seem ok now
16. Vanderzant - Null (slight town), didn't get any major impression out of skimming Dooms, Vanderzant seems fine pushing PL but otherwise I have nothing to base an impression with
17. Overswarm - Cleared by Rajam, I don't see any reason to question his innocence despite his unique armchair playstyle
 

Overswarm

is laughing at you
Joined
May 4, 2005
Messages
21,181
When you say unique do you mean unique overall or unique in comparison to other times I've played.
 

Jdietz43

BRoomer
BRoomer
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Apr 3, 2008
Messages
2,625
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Milwaukee
That's about it right now but I'm sure my feelings will become more concrete as the game plays out with me involved. I'm still not the best at reading a game I'm sidelining for without direct involvement.

Will be re-reading now that I'm actually in the game and we've had more flips.
 

Jdietz43

BRoomer
BRoomer
Joined
Apr 3, 2008
Messages
2,625
Location
Milwaukee
@Overswarm: Overall. I have no idea if you normally play differently than this, but I haven't seen anyone ever just give their votes to a player they feel is going to use them wisely like you have been doing.
 

Jdietz43

BRoomer
BRoomer
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Rajam, do you have an investigate result for us? I could use any extra information before I start my re-read to put past events in perspective.
 

Rajam

Smash Champion
Joined
Oct 3, 2008
Messages
2,175
Location
Santiago, Chile
lol why do you trust in the results of Britney Spears, town cop? Anyways I got a innocent result again, in frozenflame751, but I'm thinking all these results are crap and that Britney Spears being naive makes a lot of sense -_-

---

ok, for the next, people need to know that the votecount was 2 for Chaco / Vinyl. and 4 against X1-12. Then we get this:

#596:


I finally finished my readthrough of this game. My goodness that was longer than I expected though I did put it off for quite some time. Plus I doubt people are going to be posting much today considering it is Easter but yeah.

Well I don't have that much enlightening things to say besides one read which is Kafkaesque(I cannot get saying this name enough), so I'll explain that one first. My gut is shouting to me that they are scum because I feel that most of what they have posted have been purely null and I don't like that fact especially when it feels like its the Swords side of the hydra doing a majority of the posting. His picks for vigging were just weird and I don't get why he picked Macman/Marshy, he says because they are unhelpful but what about Orbo or Rajam or even myself for being a non-presence. I also do not care for his voting history this game of the first one being OS for shallow reasoning against him that someone called them out on and then their most current suspicions just line up with popular thought all of a sudden with Chaco/Rockin suspicion. The thing I dislike the most about this slot would be how they have not really gotten their hands dirty yet, but they have said things/done light actions. Nothing from them seem to be "good" enough (if you understand where I coming with that wording) this game. I don't have much to go on to call them scum but I want to. However, there is really not enough time in the day phase to vote them and would be haphazard to do as such so they just get an FoS from me.

FoS: Kafkaesque

Which actually is a perfect way to fit my suspicion on them. Its there but not enough to warrant a vote.

Rockin seems wishy washy this game but I can't say I see the scum-intent in his actions and they just seem more pitiful. However, dislike his almost random Kanty vote because I did not think he was going to be going there plus it does not make sense to introduce another wagon so close to deadline, especially when Kanty even dropped his vote on FF due to it not going anywhere.

Chaco is someone who I am alright with getting rid of toDay because I completely agree with KevinM in the fact that he has just been revolving around mechanics and not doing any scum-hunting. I do, however, want to add on that I disliked Chaco's way of trying to get scumreads in the beginning of the game with Axel's TA where he said, "I see what you did there, everyone who hopped on is now on my radar." which is a terrible statement to make especially considering that no one hopped on but Axel picked those people for a reason (don't ask me cuz I have no clue why Zen did what he did).

Vandy's slot vs. Pink Lemonade seem like a TvT argument gone on for way too long with their walls and I will be honest and say I began to skim them a tad because they seemeed to get repetitive with their points and it didn't seem to go much more anywhere besides stationary and revolving around them. The thing I liked about both of them though is that they did not let the debate between the both of them stop from scum-hunting on others. I didn't really follow that debate to see who would be the winner in the end but because of the debate, I got a better read on both their slots.

As a side-note for the DH portion of that battle: Null on this slot because I don't know where to place him yet, he is a slot that is hardish for me to read because his intent is always out there. Atm if I had to pick a side, I'd probably lean scummy due to the nature of his posts seeming to lack town intent and instead have more of a "me" intent to them.

KevinM would be my strongest town read this game and I have to say I am thoroughly pleased with pretty much everything he has posted. I find him to be scum-hunting and pressuring his scum-reads really well. OS' suspicion of him does not make sense to me, however, OS leans more town for me. I do agree with KevinM though that his vote being on KevinM is useless and kind of a waste.

RR is a lean-town read at the moment, however that's gut because of what he did to my other half of the hydra. I know he loves his gambits but it felt more sincere his reaction to making my other half get out of this game due to his behavior. Problem with him though, he hasn't done much besides ask a few questions here and there and nothing really much else.

Macman/Marshy/Rajam/Orbo are nulls, good with an investigative being on them.

Now onto the final three that have been in a debate that spans so many pages. (FF/Kanty/X1-12) This argument is one I skimmed to be fair because it seemed to develop the same problem with Ran/Joey's debate. The thing about it is though, I get much more of a tunneling vibe from FF and I would like to see him do something that doesn't really revolve around himself and actually get involved with other players besides being engorged in the argument he is having with X1-12/Kanty. Kanty I literally have no read on him at the current time because their are some posts that I like and some I don't. X1-Inferno slot though I have a little clearer read, though, its based on Inferno's beginning posts which I did not care for (@Vandy: Explanation for why you liked Inferno/X1 earlier on will need to be explained, especially with how this game is going) because they were wagony in the beginning and lacked reasoning. Now X1 has just gotten himself into a position that he hasn't really dug himself out of ever since replacing in. Lean scum on that slot and I would be happy with seeing it go because we will get tons of info on the slot because practically everyone has an opinion on this slot.

Something for all three though, I would like to see more from them that doesn't involve the three of them arguing together.

Tl;dr - Here's a reads list that sums up the post.

Town - KevinM, PL, Vandy
Lean Town - RR/OS
Null - Kanty/Rockin/Orbo/Rajam/Marshy/Macman/Frozenflame
Lean Scum - X1-12/DH/Kafkaesque
Scum - Vinyl.

Unvote
Vote: Vinyl.


Anyways now I'm in this game. ^^
ok so J is ok with both Chaco and X1 dying. He goes against Chaco / Vinyl. though despite the votecount favored X1 more.

Then, #601: (btw marshy had his vote on X1 by this time)


oh my bad. that leaves x1 and chaco (vinyl) as the leading wagons which is good. consider me in the chaco wagon in spirit

j you are town? tell the truth

:phone:
#602:

Yeah I'm town dude.

If you are on the chaco wagon in spirit, why not make it a reality?
#604:

cuz im happy with the x1 wagon!
might switch before days end tho

:phone:

:phone:
#605:

But the Vinyl wagon is cooler than the X1 one. =<
So, despite J said in the first quote that he was ok with X1 dying, he's trying to persuade marshy here to move his vote out from X1 (who had more votes than Vinyl.) and onto Vinyl.

@OS, frozen, KevinM: I want to hear your oppinions here on how scummy do you think is this
 

#HBC | Mac

Nobody loves me
BRoomer
Joined
Dec 5, 2005
Messages
5,086
Location
Mass
Sorry guys, I literally had the most busy week of my school career last wk (kevin couldn't even roll through to cheer me up.. thought we were bros?!). finals are finally over tho, so I should be more on my game.

tbh I only skimmed over what went down the last day, so people should point me to stuff I should look into/that was important and ill check it out
Can we kill OS yet?
you know i'm down vote: os

consider this a double vote on PL too
 

Jdietz43

BRoomer
BRoomer
Joined
Apr 3, 2008
Messages
2,625
Location
Milwaukee
Wait, so Rajam you don't think you're sane?

I know they always say don't outguess the mod but I can't see there being a fair town with two scum factions, one who had a sane cop, and a town with a naive one. There's an easy way for us to test it but I really don't think it's necessary now that the doc is dead. I'm taking your results as true until you flip.


@J concerns: I'm not any of the people you listed, but I can see merit in it. J: Why did you see fit to try and coax Marshy off of X-12 if you were fine with either choice being dead?
 

Overswarm

is laughing at you
Joined
May 4, 2005
Messages
21,181
I'm taking the results as true until a flip as well. For one, I know its accurate with me. Two, there's ten players left. If for some reason Rajam IS naive and mafia knows it and doesn't kill him, when it comes down to it it won't really save anyone. There's two mafia factions, so the likelihood of both of them knowing that Rajam is naive is incredibly thin. Thin as in me and FF both being members of opposite mafia teams and being told we were inno when we should have been guilty.

So, Rajam will die via mafia NKill or he'll be outed as naive by not getting NKilled... which won't happen because he's probably already been poisoned or NKilled.

Assuming that mafia all decide at once across factions to leave him alone to try to get me / FF / Rajam incriminated in some way, we'd keep getting Rajam results. Eventually he'd get a guilty, and that would confirm a whole lotta stuff.

If Rajam is mafia, the problem solves itself. The other mafia team will kill him because they don't want a cop around, mafia or town, and they wouldn't know his alignment anyway.

It's pretty cut and dry here. Rajam, myself, and FF are all off the table toDay.
 

#HBC | J

Prince of DGamesia
Joined
Feb 14, 2010
Messages
7,591
Location
Colorado
Rajam said:
So, despite J said in the first quote that he was ok with X1 dying, he's trying to persuade marshy here to move his vote out from X1 (who had more votes than Vinyl.) and onto Vinyl.
Because I had a stronger scum-read on Vinyl at the time...which was correct. xD I also was one of the people who pushed for X1>You due to play and also had been pushing him previously.
 

vanderzant

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Mar 24, 2008
Messages
271
Location
Beneath my dreaming tree
Vote: Pink Lemonade

Scumread. I didn't like Joey's play, yet Vandy muddled the slot for me. He gave good content but I was still in withdrawal due to Joey not responding to my case. I only re-ignited my scumread on him after seeing DH flip scum. Joey gave wishy washy oponions on both me and DH which was very odd.

Vandy's push on me seemed like a desperate push since 3 scum have flipped already. (He was trying to justify it because of me being on the Kantrip wagon instead of Vynil, I was fine with either and explained my thought process on this) Nothing else stood out from Vandy for me.
Substantiate how my play is desperate or even what bearing 3 scum flips have on me suspecting you. I can apply the exact same blanket statement to your play. Second sentence is untrue; I'm saying your stance of being fine with either Vinyl/Kantrip did not match your play at the time.

I don't agree with the DH/Joey connections you've mentioned either, and that's the bulk of your argument.

Since you're trying to pin me as scum with DH, who do you believe to be scum with x1?


Hmmmmm well. I don't wanna do anything till I hear from Rajam atm but Rockin is deffo town atm and one of the only ones I trust with like Macman/Rajam. Town reads are dying and leaving me with nulls = graaaaah.
What's this based on J? Not saying I don't agree, but atm Rockin is sitting in a category of people like KevM/Mac who are pretty nullish.

@Dietz: Where is your vote @ toDay?

@Rajam: At the time I was thinking J wanted to see x1 go over chaco because we'd get more info from that slots flip from connections.
 

#HBC | J

Prince of DGamesia
Joined
Feb 14, 2010
Messages
7,591
Location
Colorado
Vandy, Rockin has nothing scummy going for him this game. The worst he got was his helpless nature getting him into trouble but I saw the towniness show in his posts.

And alright, I just finished reading the Joey vs. PL stuff earlier which was kind of why I was avoiding the thread a tad because well....it confuses the hell out of me. Joey was trying to give everything back that PL had but to me, after re-reading it, I feel moreso that PL was giving an honest train of thought for his suspicion over Joey especially when PL decided to cut the walls down now instead of stagnating things even more and focusing on things. I also feel that PL looked elsewhere besides JUST Joey.

Then let's get to Vandy because I decided to re-look over his posts after reading Joey to see if the uneasiness continued with Vandy. Sad to say, it did for me. Basically Vandy's posts have held a bunch of hot-air really *I plan to dissect this further when I have the time but I can't atm, too tired and posting in 4 other games x_X*. His posts this game have always left me with a cringe because they don't seem sincere nor do they seem clearly backed up. There was a point iirc that Vandy choose to vote Kanty>one of thee scum-wagons (I believe Vinyl) because he felt he was much more scummier. When he has a scum-read, he has continued to tunnel them until there is nothing left to tunnel (OS, that was a bad call-out on the OMGUS because these two have been going at it). He tunnled Kanty and then he continued to tunnel PL even to toDay's phase. He just continues to focus on one person and that is exactly it for him.

I can't be hypocritcal but as of late, FF joins that boat as well because of his OS read that he just keeps on bringing up because it just is getting a tad dry at this point because they are just beginning to say the same thing. *Same about the Vandy vs. PL debate*

For Vandy, I am failing to see the town-intent in his posts because he just seems to be latching on to who seems like a viable lynch candidate and using his prowess of debate to be able to out-manuever them to position himself better. Vandy also said that he didn't think X1-12 was scum and also didn't really make an opinion on Vinyl when he was about to be lynched as well. He always thought there were better options for the lynches instead of who was up. He also waffled on Orbo and just went with "what town wanted". His play just reeks to me and so I am choosing to go Vandy toDay>PL.

Vote: Vanderzant
 

vanderzant

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Mar 24, 2008
Messages
271
Location
Beneath my dreaming tree
@OS: I voted him yesterDay, and am carrying over my reasoning from then. I had PL as scum before they even brought up their suspicion of me.

@J: Ok @Rockin.

I tunneled Kantrip? Yeah, on Day 1. I was suspicious of him but then changed that based on x1's flip where I had him as town or at least not scum with x1. Saying I've only had 1 scum suspect at a time is not right either, I've expressed who I've felt to be scum, but if town was going in a different direction I was fine following it, and if I didn't agree I said why. Like, I didn't waffle on Orbo AT ALL. I thought and still think PL is scum, but I was V/LA so I just went with what Town wanted (orbo lynch). Back up your statements, please.
 

Jdietz43

BRoomer
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Apr 3, 2008
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@Vandy: PL or Macman are my thoughts since FF is cleared by Rajam, door is open to suggestions until I get the re-read done though.
 

Pink Lemonade

Smash Rookie
Joined
Feb 28, 2011
Messages
5
Location
Ran|July
You had a town read on me, upon replacing in. You did this to appease me, since I was your attacker. I had a legit read on your slot before replacing. You only pushed on me after two-three scum have flipped. I felt the push was only done because you were out of options to push, and the timing of the push also raised flags for me. You tried to tie me to vynil over some weak reasoning, because you had nothing else. Now tell me, do you have any other scumreads? You aren't trying to figure out my intentions/thought process when I explain to you what they were. Here is a quote:

Also, I understand that PL were V/LA on Day 2, however I think they should be accountable for how they've softly danced around the Kantrip/Vinyl wagon on day 1.
This shows you knew that the reasoning was weak yet tried to justify it by saying that I was accountable for it. Now you are trying to use yourself being v/la as a defense which doesn't make sense.

I don't agree with the DH/Joey connections you've mentioned either, and that's the bulk of your argument.
Of course you wouldn't. What do you think of Joey's waffling stances here?

Implying that I understood anything that happened Pre-D1. It was just a bunch of gambit **** that is still confusing me, which is why I'm trying to ask Axel questions.

I liked Dark Horse, but I don't know 100% because apparently he's been viewed as scummy by a lot of others. Then again, I didn't like Pink Lemonade, yet others that participated in pre-game did, sooo...

Lemme re-read it real quick and I'll get you a legit opinion.
Since you're trying to pin me as scum with DH, who do you believe to be scum with x1?
Macman. Check this out:

agreed, plus he was already scummy b4

x1-12
beyond him being inferno's replacement, i dont think much of him cept that he's a good person to have my vote on
First quote is him agreeing with RR about inferno being scummy. I ask him about his developing read and this is what he tells me (Second quote). He sits on X1 all day and X1 magically flips scum. I accuse him of being on the wagon too early and with little reasoning. He flips out and tries to turn it against me and then has a solid scum read on me all game. His read on me is not genuine, nor is his play.

How about you, Vandy?
 

Pink Lemonade

Smash Rookie
Joined
Feb 28, 2011
Messages
5
Location
Ran|July
My #1396 is in response to Vanderzant.

JD, tell me about your suspicion on me. Where do you see me changing stances and what about it? And what do you mean I am posturing?
 

#HBC | Mac

Nobody loves me
BRoomer
Joined
Dec 5, 2005
Messages
5,086
Location
Mass
First quote is him agreeing with RR about inferno being scummy. I ask him about his developing read and this is what he tells me (Second quote). He sits on X1 all day and X1 magically flips scum. I accuse him of being on the wagon too early and with little reasoning. He flips out and tries to turn it against me and then has a solid scum read on me all game. His read on me is not genuine, nor is his play.
seriously pink? you just conveniently skipped over the post where I directly responded to your question? Theres no way you missed this post because it was between the two posts you quoted...

The second post you quoted of mine was what I thought of x1 right after he was replaced, x1 didn't give off any scum vibes himself, but I thought he was scum because of inferno's prior scumminess. and you can't pretend that you didn;t know this

unvote, vote: pinklemonade

call it omgus if you want but pinklemon has been presenting shoddy cases/arguments against me this entire game. literally none of them has made sense and it seems like he;s just goin out of his way to paint me as scum. this latest post just makes it incredibly blatant

kevin, let's do it.

@os: rajam had an inno result on kuz/jd as well. Should he be off the table too?
 
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