Important Carefully Ask PPMD about the Tiara Guy

[Agrathor3]

How does the shield di work exactly like if I'm getting hit on the front of my shield and I want to di away if I move the gray stick back then doesn't it make me more prone to getting poked by the pressure?

What can I do if I'm holding down when I get shined?

 

[Dr Peepee]

During stun you can move the stick and it just moves your body. Out of stun it angles your shield.

You could grab or dash away I suppose but it can depend on spacing and if the Fox is shining in place or RC shining. You can usually still shield most attacks though even out of RC I believe.

 

[Plumpet]

for the first time I played a falcon that actually uses this stuff https://twitter.com/overshot_nair/status/1029101795157725186
So i figured I should probably think of a new partially read-based punish chart off of fthrow for falcons that do this stuff. I think I'll either read:
A: Tech in place/miss tech, in which case I'll cover it with an uptilt (hitting the bounce of the miss tech like you've mentioned)
B: Tech roll
I'd like to punish tech roll with something harder than grab, and since I wouldn't really be looking out for tech in place I feel I'd have a lot of time to cover the tech roll with something strong, bcuz the reactions pretty easy. What do you think I should use there?

 

[Kotastic]

When cornering opponents that sometimes FH in the corner like spacies, sheik, etc., and can also mix things like SH and roll/spotdodge well, do you suppose that FH rising fair might be the answer to cover the most options?

 

[Dr Peepee]

for the first time I played a falcon that actually uses this stuff https://twitter.com/overshot_nair/status/1029101795157725186
So i figured I should probably think of a new partially read-based punish chart off of fthrow for falcons that do this stuff. I think I'll either read:
A: Tech in place/miss tech, in which case I'll cover it with an uptilt (hitting the bounce of the miss tech like you've mentioned)
B: Tech roll
I'd like to punish tech roll with something harder than grab, and since I wouldn't really be looking out for tech in place I feel I'd have a lot of time to cover the tech roll with something strong, bcuz the reactions pretty easy. What do you think I should use there?

There are various things you could do to punish the Fthrow depending on their DI and percent. You could tipper them(and if they hold down that's great for you), tipper Fair, and possibly Nair in some situations in addition to the Utilt.

Anyway Falcon's tech roll is pretty slow and doesn't go too far so you can (WD/walk) tipper him out of it sometimes. If he can be knocked down then Nair can be good too depending on position and percent. Tipper(or untippered Fsmash) vs grab is a mixup I use a good bit, and I'll Dtilt if neither of those look so good to me so I can get damage and maintain good position.

When cornering opponents that sometimes FH in the corner like spacies, sheik, etc., and can also mix things like SH and roll/spotdodge well, do you suppose that FH rising fair might be the answer to cover the most options?

Depends on some things, but if you're already close to them then sure FH rising Fair is alright. You have to be especially careful about doing this vs Sheik though since I think she may be able to FH/WD OOS and hit you afterward. If you test it vs their shields and it looks good then you're alright I guess. I don't personally like it since the reward is lower and I don't want to whiff and want to stay covering roll + I can react if they FH and keep good position at minimum anyway, but I think if you can sort out the pros and cons of this well then it could be fine.

 

[Kotastic]

What if you're at a larger distance away (RC dtilt range) in the corner where they're not as likely to shield but more likely to jump, in which their mixup is to react to my long dash in with SH or FH or roll/attack in. Do you still suppose that FH fair might be a viable option?

 

[Dr Peepee]

If they roll you get screwed and if they SH in to attack if they're early you lose. You also have to drift farther forward more if you run up and FH Fair iirc which means if they could dodge in any way they could likely counterattack. If you do some fakes or first move in with long dash before committing then you mitigate this somewhat but of course that can have its own issues. Again something to test.

 

[Plumpet]

I think i remember you mentioning that letting your forward dash stall out is an underused option. I learned recently that boost grab out of a stalled dash gives you full momentum as if you did it from a run. Do you think this is a good option, and also do you still have a high opinion of letting dashes stall?

 

[Dr Peepee]

I haven't really tested it as Marth but it is worth experimenting with I believe. I do still have a good opinion of letting dashes stall. It's beneficial to not ALWAYS dash back or attack out of dash in as you want the time to observe the opponent while retaining an easy way out(dash back).

 

[VMPR]

Whats your opinion on playing claw as marth? http://alexspuffstuff.blogspot.com/2016/10/proper-claw.html

 

[Dr Peepee]

I don't really look into these things too deeply, but I think it looks good and works fine. As Marth drifts a lot, it can be handy to have a finger close to the C stick so this is potentially a benefit over the traditional grip in that way at least.

 

[RedmanSSBM]

So something I have been wondering when doing my solo practice is that I often feel like, after f-throwing a Marth or a Puff at like 20% and they DI away, it is easier to land a nair on them than it is to land a fair. I find this especially strange since the most outward hitbox of Marth's fair comes out on frame 5, but the first frame of nair (also being out directly in front of him) is frame 6. I feel like this might be because trying to fair using c-stick actually loses some frames because I have to move my thumb from the Y button to the c-stick during the jumpsquat frames, while for nair the A button is just right there and I can more easily hit it frame perfectly the frame that I am airborne after my jumpsquat.

Now I definitely feel this to be true when I f-throw to the right, as it takes a lot longer for me to hit the c-stick to the right immediately after a SH compared to doing it to the left. To the left the SH instant fair almost always comes out frame perfectly. I still make sure to dash for a frame or two before I jump after I do the f-throw, and it still feels like nair will just hit more often than fair does. I could be overthinking it but I wanted to check here to see if there was something I'm missing or not understanding about comboing nair off of throws.

I will admit that it's kind of nicer to land nair since if you do it near frame perfectly after the SH, you can just FF as soon as possible and it will auto cancel, making comboing just a little easier afterward.

 

[Kotastic]

In the mirror PP, how do you mitigate the fears of getting reversal on? Although not a big chance for me, there's a sizable chance where I just get fsmashed/faired/grabbed/DA'd whatever from corner from ledgedash, DJ attack (like fair) from ledge, WL down fsmash, DA/Fsmash from corner, SH/FH from corner to beat my dtilt, spotdodged, and whatever abomination cheese strategy the other Marth has. Thing is on my end, these tools fairly often works as well and sometimes netting a stock, so I'm not really seeing the true benefits of holding center as opposed to being cornered.

Why do you think spotdodge is bad in the mirror? I often see whenever a Marth tries to grab the opposing Marth but the opposing Marth spotdodges, the opposing Marth often has the slight advantage with crossup grab or something. Additionally because Marth's spotdodge lasts awhile, it has a niche use in the mirror where it can just beat some moves straight-up with a clear opening for the Marth that spotdodged. Obviously it can be read and punished, but that goes for going for any other defensive options like dtilt as well. Currently I'm not really seeing as to why spotdodge is supposedly terrible when I think it has great niche uses atm.

What's your general flowchart of covering low up-b's when the Marth is reactively avoiding challenging your bair or something as you go out there? I can't really explain it super well atm, but imagine a scenario where you launch the opposing Marth where he can't quite recover high as an option, and as a result his mixups are to DJ to ledge or to recover low (as well as the mixup of DJ/side-b stall if I hog ledge). Right now I'm struggling to find answers to reliably beat low recoveries without having to resort to really risky attempts (which I consider the M2K going down to up-b pretty risky) or reactively fsmash coverage vs low up-b, but this loses to wall tech bair where I get hit for my own edgeguard. Do you have any suggestions?

 

[Sacredtwin11]

An option that I have found works pretty nicely for edgeguarding is to grab ledge to discourage the dj to ledge, then just normal get up and dtilt their up-b. Depending on spacing and percent, you might still get hit but you should still be able to asdi down dtilt again, unless you're at too high a percent. Mixups from here include the ledgehop dair to hit dj to ledge, haxdash refresh, or drop ledge bair/shield-breaker can work pretty well.

This is also a situation I have a lot of difficulty with, so other input is also appreciated.

 

[AirFair]

For fair/nair from the ledge, I would just stay spaced outside of that range if you believe they will do that, and then you should be able to dtilt/fsmash them for trying it. That does give them room to wl on the edge of the stage though, so you can then pressure them from there. Another thing I try sometimes is to run up and grab them when I see them about to wl onto the edge, but you can get hit going for that a lot, so you should be able to mix the two. If they do get onstage though, you can push in and grab them for trying to intercept you, or dodge their DA/Fsmash attempts depending on how they are moving before you push in/past interactions. If they try and jump at you with like a nair you can grab the landing or fsmash if you are expecting it. I would try and get them to shield if I could, but since they are most likely going to try and make a play to get out of the corner, I would cover those options first.

In the scenario you are describing, I would probably grab the ledge once I see that they are below the ledge and can't recover high, and I would scout the dj to ledge so I can dj dair that. If they don't do that then I could let go dj bair or something to hit their side b stall, and if they ff so they can sweetspot upb then I might refresh or try the getup thing sacredtwin just posted (unfortunately I'm not super sure about this answer to sweetspot, but I know I'm probably not inclined to try riskier strategies against it)

 

[Kotastic]

I know how to beat DA/Fsmash in the corner, but trying to dtilt it can leave me open to getting DD DA'd or something to space around the dtilt itself with your example. Same applies with other options, in which I think Marth has a lot of tools and options from the corner. Yes, it's an advantageous position for the center Marth, but I'm not sure if it's actually really that advantageous for me if I have something like a 20% chance of dying even from center.

 

[Dr Peepee]

So something I have been wondering when doing my solo practice is that I often feel like, after f-throwing a Marth or a Puff at like 20% and they DI away, it is easier to land a nair on them than it is to land a fair. I find this especially strange since the most outward hitbox of Marth's fair comes out on frame 5, but the first frame of nair (also being out directly in front of him) is frame 6. I feel like this might be because trying to fair using c-stick actually loses some frames because I have to move my thumb from the Y button to the c-stick during the jumpsquat frames, while for nair the A button is just right there and I can more easily hit it frame perfectly the frame that I am airborne after my jumpsquat.

Now I definitely feel this to be true when I f-throw to the right, as it takes a lot longer for me to hit the c-stick to the right immediately after a SH compared to doing it to the left. To the left the SH instant fair almost always comes out frame perfectly. I still make sure to dash for a frame or two before I jump after I do the f-throw, and it still feels like nair will just hit more often than fair does. I could be overthinking it but I wanted to check here to see if there was something I'm missing or not understanding about comboing nair off of throws.

I will admit that it's kind of nicer to land nair since if you do it near frame perfectly after the SH, you can just FF as soon as possible and it will auto cancel, making comboing just a little easier afterward.

I don't know the frames, but it always felt to me like Nair came out a bit faster and/or came out in front faster. Fair starts above Marth's head after all. It could also be about where Puff goes on the DI, so the lower angle of Nair could be more beneficial than the Fair which takes even longer to get low. And of course being quick with your C stick timing matters as well as you said. You'd do well to learn to Fair asap anyway because it can come in handy in many situations besides this one.

In the mirror PP, how do you mitigate the fears of getting reversal on? Although not a big chance for me, there's a sizable chance where I just get fsmashed/faired/grabbed/DA'd whatever from corner from ledgedash, DJ attack (like fair) from ledge, WL down fsmash, DA/Fsmash from corner, SH/FH from corner to beat my dtilt, spotdodged, and whatever abomination cheese strategy the other Marth has. Thing is on my end, these tools fairly often works as well and sometimes netting a stock, so I'm not really seeing the true benefits of holding center as opposed to being cornered.

Why do you think spotdodge is bad in the mirror? I often see whenever a Marth tries to grab the opposing Marth but the opposing Marth spotdodges, the opposing Marth often has the slight advantage with crossup grab or something. Additionally because Marth's spotdodge lasts awhile, it has a niche use in the mirror where it can just beat some moves straight-up with a clear opening for the Marth that spotdodged. Obviously it can be read and punished, but that goes for going for any other defensive options like dtilt as well. Currently I'm not really seeing as to why spotdodge is supposedly terrible when I think it has great niche uses atm.

What's your general flowchart of covering low up-b's when the Marth is reactively avoiding challenging your bair or something as you go out there? I can't really explain it super well atm, but imagine a scenario where you launch the opposing Marth where he can't quite recover high as an option, and as a result his mixups are to DJ to ledge or to recover low (as well as the mixup of DJ/side-b stall if I hog ledge). Right now I'm struggling to find answers to reliably beat low recoveries without having to resort to really risky attempts (which I consider the M2K going down to up-b pretty risky) or reactively fsmash coverage vs low up-b, but this loses to wall tech bair where I get hit for my own edgeguard. Do you have any suggestions?

The way I generally set up for that edge stuff if I want to be safe is I sit outside of DJ Fair range and either hold down or get ready to do it. If they edgedash I Dtilt and if they WL I don't and sometimes dash back or shield depending on how they play. And then there are a variety of strategies we have discussed for the corner before but maybe I should approach the rest differently. I used to get bodied by stuff like DA a lot because I always sat in a set zone and generally did dash back if people came near me or would wait a little then do something like SH delayed Fair inward if they didn't bite. So you may benefit from playing different positions, or being more proactive to control how they play, or to choose different options out of similar positions like WD back more. Marth with stage control ensures he can counterattack and they cannot dodge him so easily, which is the main weakness against his sword besides stuff like him hitting high Fair on them at low percent and they hold down. As long as you are threatening that in some way you can be flexible. Sometimes they automatically attack to avoid that threat, and sometimes they wait. It's hard to distill the waiting and habits and possibilities all down to a post, but maybe you can link some examples of situations or mixups that you struggle with and I may be more useful if this isn't enough.

Yeah in the ditto spotdodge is okay. It's best in the ditto but I wouldn't say that makes it particularly amazing. Not being able to move and being directly punishable out of it is quite a drawback, but having the chance to dodge a potential swing such as grab or Fsmash and then punish is quite nice when you can't easily roll out of situations. It seems like we agree on this.

You can walk Dtilt low up-B and then shield the walljump Bair. That worked great for me but it's more precise than Fsmash. It's also a bit different on YS. But yeah if the opposing Marth can DJ to edge on non-YS then it's hard to edgeguard him without taking a risk. If you set up beforehand you can do that thing I do where I grab edge and DJ Dair quickly to kill. If they drop when you grab edge then you can refresh or mix getting on stage or you can drop past him and FF up-B behind him to force him into a situation where he can't stall and must up-B....etc. You can also do runoff DJ Dair too but of course that loses to DJ Fair. If you start getting him to DJ Fair more then you can punish that in obvious ways and you can start making runoffs more ambiguous by running to edge then shielding etc. It's an intricate situation that is worth exploring.

 

[Kotastic]

"Marth with stage control ensures he can counterattack and they cannot dodge him so easily, which is the main weakness against his sword besides stuff like him hitting high Fair on them at low percent and they hold down."

Can you clarify on the main weakness part? I'm interpreting the first sentence as Marth with a lot of threatening control he can easily manipulate his opponent for an easy counterattack, but I'm not sure where the weakness part is getting at.

 

[AirFair]

"Marth with stage control ensures he can counterattack and they cannot dodge him so easily, which is the main weakness against his sword besides stuff like him hitting high Fair on them at low percent and they hold down."

Can you clarify on the main weakness part? I'm interpreting the first sentence as Marth with a lot of threatening control he can easily manipulate his opponent for an easy counterattack, but I'm not sure where the weakness part is getting at.

I think the weakness he is referring to here is just marth's sword lag, and they can dodge swings much easier when they have stage to do so, but not when you have stage control.

 

[Dr Peepee]

"Marth with stage control ensures he can counterattack and they cannot dodge him so easily, which is the main weakness against his sword besides stuff like him hitting high Fair on them at low percent and they hold down."

Can you clarify on the main weakness part? I'm interpreting the first sentence as Marth with a lot of threatening control he can easily manipulate his opponent for an easy counterattack, but I'm not sure where the weakness part is getting at.

Marth's sword mainly loses to people moving back, especially vs his not Dtilt. It can also lose to being too slow(like you hit them then you're in lag, or you get hit by trying to wait to avoid lag issues) and stuff like air-to-ground maneuvers aka Fair'ing grounded people. Basically slow sword is a weakness.

 

[Kotastic]

When crossing under Sheik that does FH needles or even just FH in general, I don't know what to do when they react to my crossup under and they (cancel needle and) bair me. It feels like a really tight timing to pivot grab it and they could potentially spotdodge my shield grab. I don't really want to take unnecessary percent with CC. Going for uptilt or fair, especially the tipper hitboxes, feels like a read and not as lenient as crossing under.

 

[Dr Peepee]

Could you run under and Uair? I guess if you believe they will react to your crossup you could cross back up lol. I think shield grab is pretty reliable so long as it's a weak Bair iirc but it may take a precise grab if they Bair pretty late. If you're early maybe you could FH rising Fair into them if they want to wait and hold needles. This is what I thought of off the top of my head, maybe you will find it useful.

 

[Kotastic]

PP, on days where I feel physically slow for some reason (in which I was exercising and sleeping well), what's your best approach to just trucking on mentally or physically? Surely you've felt this on your many off-days, and I did feel like dropping out but I drive all the way over there. For instance, on that day I felt fine in slower mu's like Samus where it's all about positional things and patience, but faster mu's where I require movement like Fox and mu's I don't know as well as like Puff really exposed my poor/late decision-making where I needed my reactions to be tighter.

 

[Dr Peepee]

Well in the moment, there may be breathing techniques or foods to eat etc that can improve your energy. It also helps to remember goals when appropriate so you can motivate yourself. But I think it's more important to look at why else you may be tired and address those things. In my case it has never spontaneously happened, there was always a cause.

Sometimes though I do just feel fine in slow matchups and not in fast ones as you say, and on those times I will try to do fast movement between stocks or during warmup to get my mind moving more quickly and prime myself for the fast paced play I'll be engaged in soon. That can also help me.

 

[BXBX]

Every time I watch peach vs. marth it seems to be a very uphill battle for peach because of marth's crazy range. Marth slices turnips, follows techs reliably, covers recovery from the ledge with fsmash. Is there anything that makes marth players worry when playing against peach or does he dominate the mu.

 

[WoW Tarv]

Once upon a time there was Armada. And all the Marths suffered and feared Peach because of his brutal reign. Rumors of Peach’s advantage in the MU spread. But one day PPMD was like “stop that” and at first Armada was like “no”. But little did Armada know that PPMD was an evil genius. So he, and a few other brave souls came together through the magic of theory crafting and devised a plan. Soon enough in the ancient times of 2015 PPMD defeated the tyrannical peach thus freeing the Marths from their suffering. However to this day the remnants of the old days still seep through and many Marths still live in fear of Peach because of the destructive wave of Marthocide by Armada. Many of us are still terrorized by memories of turnips, and other such weapons of war like dsmash, dash attack and a perfectly placed float.

The End

Hopefully someone will give you an actual answer too...

 

[Dr Peepee]

Every time I watch peach vs. marth it seems to be a very uphill battle for peach because of marth's crazy range. Marth slices turnips, follows techs reliably, covers recovery from the ledge with fsmash. Is there anything that makes marth players worry when playing against peach or does he dominate the mu.

Throwing aerial turnips he has to swing at then you can FC him is one good thing to do. Generally I think one of the best things Peach can mix up is how far/long she floats. Many peaches seem to float and come down quickly in neutral and I think changing it up and floating farther to take stage or catch someone moving back to dodge quick FCs can be good.



Also Merry Christmas everyone! I hope your holiday is/was great and let's have an awesome 2019 =)

 

[BXBX]

Cool thanks and happy holidays

 

[Agrathor3]

Okay so I'm going to my first big tourney at the end of March (Battle of BC 3) and I basically want to get as good as possible as quickly and efficiently as possible so any thoughts or recommendations for what I could do? I'll give myself about 1-2 hours daily for a training routine of some kind and then after that I'll grind netplay for however long I feel like. Basically I'm wondering what kind of marth drills and tech practice you guys think is the most beneficial for improving.

As another thing I want to get better at predicting and covering options as in I don't consciously do so and want to be able to conciously think about why they might do a certain option and then cover it since I heard marth was good at that sort of thing. However I'm not even sure where to start aside from visualization?

Also merry Christmas y'all and hope you have a great new year!

 

[Dr Peepee]

Practice some basic movement sequences and otherwise work on punish game such as edgeguarding and tech chasing and CG. Also make sure you can do tech well and consistently.

Work on how to beat an option close up without moving, then work on beating their approaches or how they can beat or lose to yours. You can start expanding option work from there.

 

[iCrash]

Im struggling with maintaining a good dash dance for an extended period of time, looking over my past couple matches Ill dashdance well, but then screw up after a few seconds and run too far and go beyond the dash range or misjudge distance and get hit.

Also worth mentioning this is on netplay, though I have found a local in my area (hype!)

Is it likely I just need to continue practicing dash dance until it becomes more internalized?

 

[Dr Peepee]

You may want to practice different rhythms. Slower ones and faster ones, and some combinations of those once you've done that. You may also want to find the limit of your dash so you know not to go beyond that(you can do this by seeing when you can immediately run cancel). A metronome could be useful to help you get different timings, and I have heard of using the tick marks on PS for distance.

An important thing to keep in mind is you need to be doing something with your DD. Even if it's just waiting you need to be aware of that. So if you want to threaten or set up an approach or fake defensiveness then set up an approach etc etc, then you need to move to do it. Many people move a little then realize nothing is happening and they get antsy and so they just rush in and this is a very bad habit you want to avoid. Being aware of this helps you start to think about how to get new patterns that serve your interests.

 

[iCrash]

Ah I didnt even think of using a metronome while practicing, thats a great idea. Ill try that.

 

[Kotastic]

I've been thinking about during tournament days where I have time to prep with some friendlies, do you think it's worth to expend some mental energy trying hard to outplay the opponent (especially against someone really good you're directly fighting in bracket), or you should save that energy until bracket starts? Do you think this sort of heavy concentration should constantly be exercised to increase mental stamina even during tournament, or moreso I should play primarily for maintenance tech skill and basic outplay stuff.

There's definitely been moments that even when I feel energetic, I hold back a decent amount in friendlies/ladder because I know it doesn't mean much when I could use my energy elsewhere in more important areas. I also do this a lot subconsciously where my adrenaline and my will to win in bracket just vastly outperforms even my friendlies where I tryhard the most.

Also caught up the interview stream, you seem like you've definitely gotten more energetic and better, and the exercise part was great to hear! Hopefully some more good news can arrive by 2019.

 

[Dr Peepee]

I personally don't have the best answer to this. I felt I just listened to my body and circumstances and it worked fine. If someone wanted to grind for a bit then I usually would, and when I was coming up I always played hard against everyone. Having that as a default setting meant I was always in good competing shape and my association with the game was good. However, sometimes when I'm more tired or unsure I may push less or play players that don't push me as much instead. Really just comes down to experimentation and preparation I believe.

Yes I did want to give people something concrete yesterday and was very glad to have something to give. I will keep pushing for the best news for me, but until then I imagine you could track my progress in this thread =p

 

[Tablesalt]

When a fox sweet spots to the ledge from this position: https://imgur.com/a/rmFlQRF
Is it a good idea to hit him with one of these fancy fade back fairs? https://gfycat.com/InfamousThoughtfulDikkops

 

[Dr Peepee]

You could do that but I'm not sure how lenient it is. I prefer Dtilt or Fsmash there but the runoff DJ Fair gives less reward but is less risky. It is also more telegraphed depending on the position. All that said I'd say go for it and see how it suits you.

 

[RedmanSSBM]

I'd also suggest using ftilt here because it starts from below and goes upward. I'm not sure if it can cover a true sweet spot from below, but I believe for the position that Fox is at in that screenshot, ftilt can cover the angle but the timing will be tight. Fsmash is one that can work as well but the frames for fsmash hitting at that lower angle take a much longer time, though the reward is much more substantial even if Fsmash doesn't tipper. Tippering an ftilt would still be a pretty great reward so you could probably practice the timing.

 

[maxono1]

hey pp i saw your stream w tafo i watched the whole thing even though it was like 3 in the morning lmao
you were talking about pivots to punish knockdown or something and how they were not consistent enough to rely upon.
well now because we have ucf/arduinos you can get a bad dashback controller or (they have consistent empty pivots) or remove dashback aka pode from your current one and use empty pivots to get pivot fsmashes, grabs or whatever. thats how zain gets his pivots consistently.

Technically all characters make a sound when shielding, but it's so quiet that you can't really hear it when the music is on. Marth's is easier to hear because the sound of him sheathing his sword plays. It's also noticeable when you drop shield.

thas what i meant with distinct sry if that wasnt clear

When a fox sweet spots to the ledge from this position: https://imgur.com/a/rmFlQRF
Is it a good idea to hit him with one of these fancy fade back fairs? https://gfycat.com/InfamousThoughtfulDikkops

the best option there imo is walking very close to the edge and dtilt so it tippers. it crouches under the straight angle so you can cover that on reaction and im pretty sure it kills him outright but i play pal mostly.
if you have the read then fsmash or wd back off the edge and dj back on with dair is also good. idk about ftilt ill test it out later cuz it seems good.
Edit: ftilt and runoff dj fair both dont hit if fox uses the farthest sweetspot, up b and dair work but are scary to do cuz if you miss the timing youre screwed

 

[maxono1]

how can you address someone? like make their name show up with the right color?
has anyone here ever thought about using the falcon instant dj to pressure side platform? you can fastfall earlier than fh so for example fair on shield is safer and you attack higher so they cant jump over as easily but its more risky cuz you use your dj. you guys think that would be good?