Q&A Captain Falcon FAQ and Training Guide

[gravy]

I'm always on this forum. What do you need?

 

[It's me Q]

People still hanging out here?? In need of some tipsss!

I got some red hot tips here, very closely guarded, highly potent... quite sexy. Not for shares right now though give me a few months.

 

[Bu$]

Do a lot of falcons use stomp OOS? I have heard they do but i haven't really use it before. Also in what matchups would it be more beneficial?

 

[gravy]

Ok so stomp out of shield is the kind of option that is hard to implement, but has a very, very high reward level. The reason it is difficult to land is because of its very apparent slowness. This means that you can only use it as an OOS option when you see an opportunity to be safe for a good chunk of frames, (a good example is if a fox does a bad dash attack on your shield, hitting you with the start up frames of the dash attack so that you have a ton of time to stomp it) since you don't want to get hit out of it. I wouldn't say that it is more useful for any matchups more than others, but that's kind of debatable. It's hard to tell how new you are, but in my opinion, the best and most useful option out of shield is wavedash, since it unlocks all of the other options in the game. If you're just looking for good out of shield options, make sure you can do that very consistently and well. You should of course be able to do all of your out of shield options consistently and well, but wavedash is a great one to start with.

 

[Wenbobular]

Stomp OoS on dash attack is actually very difficult to time unless you're really good at it
Vs a lot of Falcos I'll just brazenly stomp OoS after a Dair if I think they're going to shine or uptilt

Sometimes you need to get a little lucky against uptilt but stomp will jump right over shine
Against uptilt you can drift out a little and you'll just stomp the **** out of their foot
If they start doing things like Nair Bair then you can do other things to escape

Just experiment with it and see what hits

 

[Bu$]

Thanks guysss. Yeah i have been using WD OOS recently and it's working pretty nice. I pretty much picked up melee since i joined SmashBoards so May last year. More of a general melee question but i'm finding my punishes aren't as good as i would like them to be because i feel i'm not great at getting reads/ regrabs/ tech chases. Any tips on what kind of bad habits people have or ways to see the habits?

 

[Ziodyne]

Kind of a tall order you're asking. If you want to ask about tech-chasing, ask about specific characters.

Reads are educated guesses. No other way to make them than to pay attention to your opponent and/or bait a reaction out of them.

 

[gravy]

I think that the best way to get reliable tech chases is to set up the tech chase, and while they are hitting the ground, position yourself to punish whatever happens. I like to do this by getting close enough to them that I can follow tech away, and I can easily punish tech in place or missed tech. It's all about positioning.

 

[BTmoney]

Yo, Falcons

What is the reason behind me not getting any backwards velocity when I moonwalk? The animation and the sliding looks good but when I jump off stage more often than not I don't get any extra backwards momentum.

Am I not doing it fast enough?

 

[BL!TZ]

It sounds like you might be jumping a bit late.

Edit: It's possible you might not be doing it fast enough. Whatever it is, just keep working at it.

 

[Wenbobular]

If all the time spent discussing moonwalking was spent thinking about real things Falcon mains as a whole would probably get better

@Bahoo - knowing when to techchase and when to aerial combo is very important against characters like Sheik who have weird fall weights
Also knowing when you have opportunities to platform techchase and stuff like that

Covering multiple options in different ways to keep your opponent confused is pretty good too
Knowing how to cover multiple options period is really important

Some basic examples
Raptor boost to cover one techroll direction + tech in place + missed tech
Late Uair to cover missed tech + dash dance grab the rolls
Stomp to cover half the platform on platform techchases

Also seeing how they react to your positioning and movement cues ... like if you jump, will they roll from laying on the ground, stuff like that

A lot of punishment like this is based on seeing how your opponent reacts to different baits ... you can do anything from shielding, jumping, wavedashing in place, wavelanding around ... gotta use your imagination

Falcon also has real combos though don't forget about that

 

[Bu$]

Ah alright. Ty guys. I think i'm at the point where solo practice isn't going to do as much for me as it did in the last few months. Pretty much just need experience vs different players and styles/ characters. I will keep the position thing in mind.

 

[Wenbobular]

Solo practice kinda sucks I have to say
Take a break and think about tech chase coverages or something it'd probably be more useful
Have to be prepared for the mental game and the technical game will fall into place

 

[Zhea]

I would still suggest warming up your tech skill at the very least before tourneys/sessions. I keep getting into that thought process and than ****ing up basics because I haven't played in a week.

 

[BTmoney]

If all the time spent discussing moonwalking was spent thinking about real things Falcon mains as a whole would probably get better

I'm not sure if that was intended to be rude but at best that's a backhanded comment.
Is that not a FAQ and is this not a FAQ thread? Now that I have an answer I'll think about this for about 45 seconds next time i turn on my game.

One visible and marginally easily correctible hole in my falcon game is my inability to currently moonwalk with consistency. It's a useful tech and getting down movement is just as important if not more than important than knowing when and what attacks to do.



We could talk about getting better CC options, avoiding getting stuck in shield, or nairing better but that wasn't my question.

EDIT:
If you're sick of seeing a question like that sorry. Can't help it and search did not answer it.

 

[Zhea]

To be fair he is try to do what's best for a growing falcon. That being said, you gotta keep your fire for this game to have any chance of getting good, and if learning some obscure tech does that for him, then it's probably for the best.

 

[BTmoney]

Really, I asked this because I've seen SS and possibly Scar moonwalk while dthrow tech chasing. I'm more interested in that than bairing/uaring off stage which is still useful anyway.


I'm exploring consistent tech chase positioning. Some like to run forward and shield, some dashdance while waiting on the tech, some moonwalk, some do nothing, and some WD forward (Gucci definitely opts for that a lot.)
Chances are, if I'm not moonwalking correctly while going off stage, I'm not doing it correctly (getting maximum backwards slide) while tech chasing.


This is me thinking and wanting to get better. I don't want to be so catty but do I need to justify my questions?

 

[Zhea]

It's not that moon walking isn't useful, many falcon's put it to good use. What Wenbo is saying is that there is more bang for your buck concentrating on other areas. What I was saying is do what keeps you interested, because it will force you to think and play more.

 

[gravy]

I don't know why people say solo practice is so bad. I'm legitimately obsessed with pushing my movement to new levels, I could practice by myself for full days, and I actually have plenty of times. Playing with people is great, don't get me wrong, but I think solo practice improves your tech skill faster.

 

[Zhea]

I disagree, but it's probably because I get too much solo practice. My tech while practicing is flawless, but I drop the stupidest things on people. I wish I could play people more often.

 

[Ziodyne]

Really, I asked this because I've seen SS and possibly Scar moonwalk while dthrow tech chasing. I'm more interested in that than bairing/uaring off stage which is still useful anyway.


I'm exploring consistent tech chase positioning. Some like to run forward and shield, some dashdance while waiting on the tech, some moonwalk, some do nothing, and some WD forward (Gucci definitely opts for that a lot.)
Chances are, if I'm not moonwalking correctly while going off stage, I'm not doing it correctly (getting maximum backwards slide) while tech chasing.


This is me thinking and wanting to get better. I don't want to be so catty but do I need to justify my questions?

No you don't, but I will say that there are many better ways to get positioning for tech chases than moonwalks that take less time to get you into a good spot. Maybe instead, working on pivots would be a better idea for a similar effect?

 

[Wenbobular]

Yeah I was being rude, sorry about that ... I'll explain my comment now

Moonwalking is good in corner edgeguarding cases and if your opponent is not used to it / bad at reacting to really weird things, but being really good at moonwalking will, in general, not help you significantly in neutral game, edgeguarding, or combos because of how much startup time goes into getting the backwards momentum

Judging from your post count, 2013 join date, and the fact that you're asking about moonwalking (it does in fact get asked more than is helpful for the average starting player) I made my comment because I think talking about moonwalking does more harm than good

Personal experience: when I first learned how to moonwalk I would even do it during combos and it took forever for me to drop the habit and I'd be a better Falcon now if I had no idea how to do it in the first place

So there it is

@gravy - solo practice is not bad for getting basics
But it's also no substitute for playing people with an active mind - active being the key word because it also does very little good to play someone without thinking ... you can't improve that way either

Being able to think and test / apply new ideas in-game is the limit to how good you're going to get as a player, not how fast / precise you press buttons (unless your hands can't keep up with your thoughts I guess but I feel it's usually the opposite)

 

[ryankam10]

solo play is pretty much only useful for tech skill
that said it's very useful for getting things down consistently

for example. I had a phase where I was obsessed with playing marth and I would just practice combos on a level 9 fox over and over

haha. then when I played my friend who is pretty good with falco I ***** him because everything was natural, I had done it so many times on the CPU

basic stuff like fthrow x 3 upthrow, chaingrab... some more... etc

 

[Zhea]

I think it's just been harder to give my solo practice direction. Really the only things I can think to practice on my own is controlling my dash dance ( being able to change the rhythm of it whenever I want ) and practicing ledge canceled aerials. There are some ledge shenanigans, but other than that I find it hard to stay motivated during a practice session.

 

[Wenbobular]

I never had a problem with solo motivation because I could just watch anime while ledgedashing :D
I was really good at ledgedashing for a while ... then I decided it was more useful to like ... learn how to play the game than knowing how to ledgedash :|

 

[JMan8891]

Wenbo: I have focused a lot on the stuff you pointed out. Its helped a lot. I still am sort of stuck with really no one to practice with, so im trying to get things out as fast as possible, and the next thing (be it moving again or attacking again) asap as well.

Its helping a lot.

 

[BTmoney]

Yeah I was being rude, sorry about that ... I'll explain my comment now

It's cool. No harm no foul.

I actually practice so much falcon now I can't play my other characters nearly as well .

 

[Zhea]

I never had a problem with solo motivation because I could just watch anime while ledgedashing :D
I was really good at ledgedashing for a while ... then I decided it was more useful to like ... learn how to play the game than knowing how to ledgedash :|

Yeah Audio books and animu are your friend. I just find myself not being as focused during training as I used too. I don't have this issue with fox and falco due to clear I am bad at wave shining out of shield bull ****, but with falcon it's been harder.

 

[Wenbobular]

Well I think Falcon benefits slightly less from grinding tech skill
Although doing exercises that involve varying hitstun is pretty useful for hitting combos and Lcancels on shields

Or if you want to be Hax and waveland around like a madman you can practice that too haha

 

[Zhea]

Yeah, part of the reason I started doing the current heavy cc and frame research is due to that feeling. However the as I have been digging into that, I don't find new insightful tech that I have never seen before. I find the data behind stuff I have read again and again and again. I find the frame data behind the mix up games and the guaranteed stuff. In other words there is good reason that falcon's meta game is what it is and solid frame data to back it up. Little depressed about it, but atleast I feel more confident in it

 

[S l o X]

Or if you want to be Hax and waveland around like a madman you can practice that too haha

seems to work out pretty well for him

 

[Dan -Zodiac-]

so when you stomp the missed tech, it normally just stomps them back into the ground because of the little bounce after they hit the ground. but there is a short window where it will re-launch them if the move connects the instant they hit the ground it seems. is this something that i should learn the timing of and utilize? ive kinda assumed falcons just throw out the dair and react to whichever happens.

 

[Wenbobular]

Just delay your Dair by a little bit
Try it on CPUs and learn when you need to hit them and you should be able to start implementing it in game

 

[TemPesT-]

any falcon ever figure out how to Doraki with falcon?? i know how to the like.. insta wall jump on FD but it loses your dbl jump, but i KNOW falcon can do a true doraki as i've done it many times on accident and on the special ledges that always do it, ie. green greens left island, or the mountain transition on stadium.

i always thought it had to do with sweet spotting a reverse upb to the ledge, but i've never been able to actually do it when i'm trying. just curious i guess.

 

[gravy]

I still can't do it :/ I'll get around to it eventually.

 

[Windrose]

Doesn't scar do it once and does it again in ikm2?

 

[gravy]

No Scar can't Doraki, he told me that himself. Anything he does is considered scarjumping.

 

[Ziodyne]

if anyone could get the frames behind a ledge doraki jump, that'd be cool
i've also done it a lot on accident and it seems like it'd be pretty useful/janky if we could do it consistently

apart from that, i know how to do the easier but 100x less useful dash attack -> doraki jump lol

EDIT: nvm, there are already a ****ton of guides on this subject lol

 

[Thamauturge]

I've been playing a ton of Melee and Project M as of late. This guide is great, but I was wondering, what are the biggest things in it that should definitely be applied differently in Project M? Is it mostly opposition strategies, since so many characters are buffed?

 

[Nicco]

Is that "training regimen" ever gonna see the light of day?

Scar rose to the top of falcon play, then suddenly disappeared....