Brawl Competitive Videos - NEW Wifi Wars Brawl Tournament Videos! (2-11-08)

[LeeHarris]

I have changed this thread to post updates about Wifi War's Videos and tournaments. Smash League registration will open this week, so look for a thread on SB!

Link to newest videos: http://www.wifiwars.com/?q=node/126
Youtube channel (has new + old): http://www.youtube.com/user/WifiWarsVideos

Wifi Wars just completed its first big Smash weekend event. Huge Melee singles and doubles tournaments with a Brawl tournament. The first set of videos from the Brawl tournament are up now.

These videos are in progress of uploading:

Lee (Snake) vs Hylian (Kirby)
Lee (Snake) vs Hylian (G&W)
Lee (Snake) vs Hylian (Bowser)

More soon from caveman, Xelic, Mr. C, Scav, and other pros!

 

[LeeHarris]

I also want to add that if you have any questions feel free to ask. I played every character a lot, these just so happened to be the ones I studied the most.

 

[LavisFiend]

Give me the entire scoop on Falcon.

I need to know EVERYTHING. I mean, EV-ER-Y-TH-ING.

If you are a competitive player as you claim, you know exactly what I am getting at.

 

[Revven]

How many videos are you uploading? Please tell me it's a good amount! :D

I <3 competitive matches.

 

[Meta_Sonic64]

May I ask something? Does Mr Game and Watch use the Landmaster in 2-D black pixels?

 

[Break]

May I ask something? Does Mr Game and Watch use the Landmaster in 2-D black pixels?

Yes, but it just happens to look like an octopus.

 

[Revak]

Will you upload videos? :D Thats my question. I really want to see some good players play competitively. I just cant stand much more of the Japan streams.

 

[LeeHarris]

Yep, and I am a Falcon main in Melee as well

The worst thing about him is that he is slower than he was in Melee. The greatest thing about him is that he still has the knee . Whenever you hit with a knee it doesn't make any noise and it isn't nearly as satisfying as it was in Melee. The game pauses for at least half a second though when you hit someone with it. Hit uair has hardly any landing lag at all and you can practically use it like you could in Melee with L canceling. It also still does a spike if you hit them with the last part of the uair. His dair still spikes, but I couldn't pull off a nipple spike. Since there is no dash dancing anymore and he is slower he doesn't look nearly as pretty, but hey, it's f-ing Falcon, the only man that straight guys are attracted to . His up B works about the same but it gives you the ability to do some insane DI. You CAN turn him around in the middle of a Falcon punch. This makes it much more usable. His Falcon kick and raptor boost are the same pretty much. Oh, and when you do the Falcon kick in the air after you jump it does not give you another jump. You can still UP B out of it though. Overall his decent speed and strong moves make him one of Brawl's best players (at this point anyways).

 

[NES n00b]

Hey guys,

I spent all last night playing the new copy of JP Brawl that came in. I wrote up some impressions and posted them over at WifiWars.com . Keep in mind that I am a competitive player so when I talk it is in terms of competition and not just brawling for fun.

Let me know what you think!: http://www.wifiwars.com/node/73

By the way, I will be posting some videos between me and some other competitive players tonight. Subscribe to the thread to watch for the updates!

No offense (ok maybe some ) but you seem like someone who just learned to l cancel and wavedashed and didn't go to actual (regional or national) tournies. If so, don't carry around that title so lightly (lol, like it is such a big title).

 

[draigaran]

That was very informative, thanks for taking the time to post this. Fortunately Brawl has only been out for two days, so I'm expecting that new techniques will be discovered to compensate for the lack of Melee tactics. I'm going to miss L-canceling and wavedashing =\.

I'd like to know if Sheik got nerfed? I was hoping to main her in Brawl :b.

 

[Meta_Sonic64]

Yep, and I am a Falcon main in Melee as well

The worst thing about him is that he is slower than he was in Melee. The greatest thing about him is that he still has the knee . Whenever you hit with a knee it doesn't make any noise and it isn't nearly as satisfying as it was in Melee. The game pauses for at least half a second though when you hit someone with it. Hit uair has hardly any landing lag at all and you can practically use it like you could in Melee with L canceling. It also still does a spike if you hit them with the last part of the uair. His dair still spikes, but I couldn't pull off a nipple spike. Since there is no dash dancing anymore and he is slower he doesn't look nearly as pretty, but hey, it's f-ing Falcon, the only man that straight guys are attracted to . His up B works about the same but it gives you the ability to do some insane DI. You CAN turn him around in the middle of a Falcon punch. This makes it much more usable. His Falcon kick and raptor boost are the same pretty much. Oh, and when you do the Falcon kick in the air after you jump it does not give you another jump. You can still UP B out of it though. Overall his decent speed and strong moves make him one of Brawl's best players (at this point anyways).

He's slower b/c he became depressed when Sonic passed him by.

 

[Sl1th]

Finnally some insights for the competitive world

 

[LeeHarris]

No offense (ok maybe some ) but you seem like someone who just learned to l cancel and wavedashed and didn't go to actual (regional or national) tournies. If so, don't carry around that title so lightly (lol, like it is such a big title).

Actually you can ask lots of people from Texas about me. I am a competitive player and have been for years. Ask the admin of these boards, Scav, who lives very close and he will tell you straight up.

 

[Lovage 805]

I enjoyed the article, it's too bad about Falcon....

 

[Aerozeke]

This... actually killed my faith in Brawl's potential competitive scene. Dash-dancing removed? For what reason? It's almost as if Sakurai did everything he could to spite the competitive smash community. First wavedashing (which I cared next-to-nothing about), then l-cancelling, and now dash-dancing. Brawl's competitive scene will either be drastically different from Melee's... or just simply non-existent. Well, I can only hope for the best.

One thing: I have a slightly different method of wavedashing in Melee. Instead of jamming the control stick back and forth in a frenzy, I do this: I tap very quickly in a direction, let go, then tap in the other direction. It's slightly slower, but it could also be considered "dash-dancing" I guess. Does that still work out in Brawl?

Also, second question: how has the AI changed? Are lv9 cpu opponents harder? Easier?

Much appreciated.

 

[LavisFiend]

Yep, and I am a Falcon main in Melee as well

The worst thing about him is that he is slower than he was in Melee. The greatest thing about him is that he still has the knee . Whenever you hit with a knee it doesn't make any noise and it isn't nearly as satisfying as it was in Melee. The game pauses for at least half a second though when you hit someone with it. Hit uair has hardly any landing lag at all and you can practically use it like you could in Melee with L canceling. It also still does a spike if you hit them with the last part of the uair. His dair still spikes, but I couldn't pull off a nipple spike. Since there is no dash dancing anymore and he is slower he doesn't look nearly as pretty, but hey, it's f-ing Falcon, the only man that straight guys are attracted to . His up B works about the same but it gives you the ability to do some insane DI. You CAN turn him around in the middle of a Falcon punch. This makes it much more usable. His Falcon kick and raptor boost are the same pretty much. Oh, and when you do the Falcon kick in the air after you jump it does not give you another jump. You can still UP B out of it though. Overall his decent speed and strong moves make him one of Brawl's best players (at this point anyways).

Your a good man LeeHarris. You nailed it.

but, if what you say about the knee is true....

I am disappointed. I really loved that sound. It was just an orgy to the ears. It really was satisfying when you nail it juuuuust right. but thank god they didn't take away the knee.

and what is this I hear about direction change of the falcon punch?! You can turn it on a whim now?

and what about his >B? If you miss, do you still fall helplessly?

 

[LeeHarris]

Another big thing I forgot to add! Whenever you do a shorthopped aerial your momentum moving sideways drops to practically zero, especially if you are doing a nair. It is not like Melee where you keep moving after a shorthop. This makes the aerial game MUCH different than Melee.

Example: if you run across the stage and do a shorthopped nair with Falcon, you will end up landing barely in front of where you jumped from.

 

[Adi]

Link seems broken?

 

[GameAngel64]

Uh, I'm sure no one else will care... but any impressions about Zelda? Did you play her in Melee; are you in a position to judge if she's improved at all? Is her Final Smash as crappy as it looked in that video where Sheik shot the arrow in the wrong direction?

 

[Blatherskite]

Guess I don't have to buy a Wii any more.

 

[Lovage 805]

Also, do you know if JC grabs are still in?

 

[Gerbil]

I suggest trying to DD at different rates of speed. Cause I swore I saw Metaknight do it in some vids >.<

Too bad about Falcon's knee for real......... but meh if it still has the same effect, then that's cool.

Could you elaborate more on the air game for me?

 

[liverymen]

sweet, i can't wait for those 1v1 videos : )
much appreciated

 

[LeeHarris]

This... actually killed my faith in Brawl's potential competitive scene. Dash-dancing removed? For what reason? It's almost as if Sakurai did everything he could to spite the competitive smash community. First wavedashing (which I cared next-to-nothing about), then l-cancelling, and now dash-dancing. Brawl's competitive scene will either be drastically different from Melee's... or just simply non-existent. Well, I can only hope for the best.

One thing: I have a slightly different method of wavedashing in Melee. Instead of jamming the control stick back and forth in a frenzy, I do this: I tap very quickly in a direction, let go, then tap in the other direction. It's slightly slower, but it could also be considered "dash-dancing" I guess. Does that still work out in Brawl?

Also, second question: how has the AI changed? Are lv9 cpu opponents harder? Easier?

Much appreciated.

Yeah, you can still do the "slower" method of dash dancing where you lunge forward in one direction then go back before the dash animation ends. It doesn't work nearly as well as jamming your stick back and forth but it is better than nothing .

Honestly I don't think the competitive scene will die. I just think that everyone is going to have to bust *** trying to figure out new techniques. Even from the one night I spent playing Brawl I got a completely different play style than I did with Melee. Melee style competitiveness is dead in Brawl, but something new will probably emerge.

The level 9 cpus are harder and smarter. And they actually run this time!

And SSE is cool as hell. The final boss was pretty ridiculous (he has this one move that is unblockable and kills in one hit. You have to air dodge three times in a row perfectly to beat it).

Your a good man LeeHarris. You nailed it.

but, if what you say about the knee is true....

I am disappointed. I really loved that sound. It was just an orgy to the ears. It really was satisfying when you nail it juuuuust right. but thank god they didn't take away the knee.

and what is this I hear about direction change of the falcon punch?! You can turn it on a whim now?

and what about his >B? If you miss, do you still fall helplessly?

Yeah, you can turn him around while he is doing the Falcon punch now.

You still fly off the edge like a helpless kitten if you do the side-b and miss, haha.

 

[Proven]

Check out Zero Suit Samus. Her Forward B and Back Air seem to be her kill moves, and she also has three jumps, her ground, mid-air jump, and then another with Down+B. If for some reason you haven't been around, you can start the battle with her by holding the R button when you select Samus.

 

[Smasher89]

Does Ice Climbers still seem useable, any information about them is appreciated like better\worse grabs, if they are faster or just anything^^

 

[HuskytheGeek]

I want Ness impressions! Does PK shove still push your opponents way back? Is the bat the same or has the hitbox/damage been shortened?

 

[Thino]

oh no , my knee THUD oh well its still the knee its all that matters

 

[LeeHarris]

I suggest trying to DD at different rates of speed. Cause I swore I saw Metaknight do it in some vids >.<

Too bad about Falcon's knee for real......... but meh if it still has the same effect, then that's cool.

Could you elaborate more on the air game for me?

Yeah, the air game is completely different. Since characters have much greater DI you practically stop dead in the air if you ever do a nair without smashing the stick afterwards in the direction you want to go. It has a very very different feel to it and I didn't get used to it until a few hours after I had started playing. A lot of moves have had their landing lag reduced or removed and it makes them more viable for competitive player. Unfortunately this does not include the slower, fatter characters. They still have tons of landing lag. The lack of L canceling seems like it is going to make them less viable as competitive characters. Except Ike, he is cool as hell

 

[-Rei-]

is marth still able to spike? or do fair combos? i will like more information on marth.

 

[LeeHarris]

I want Ness impressions! Does PK shove still push your opponents way back? Is the bat the same or has the hitbox/damage been shortened?

I didn't play Ness a lot but I played Lucas. His up+B goes THROUGH them and keeps going. Meaning that it hits them but you can still move it around and hit them again or hit yourself for a recovery.

His pk freeze move actually seems usable and it moves much faster than ness's neutral B move. I did see that Ness's DJ cancel is either removed or works completely different.

 

[Kittah4]

So the knee does the same thing Zeldas lightning kick now? Where the enemy freezes for at least half a second and flies back? Thats pretty satisfying. It draws attention to the fact that you're owning someone.

 

[Kyu Puff]

Wait, so now, you can actually dash multiple times in the same direction? Is it only the starting animation (like a traditional DD), and is there any lag between the dashes?

Also, you said you can still do the "long" dash dance. By this, do you mean, one can still pivot after the opening dash animation, or the slow "turning"? If it's the former, Sonic is going to be freakin' awesome.


Edit - Two more things.

Can you "float-cancel" a jump into a glide with flying characters? For example, if you jump with Metaknight, is there any way interrupt it with gliding?

Second, what can the Ice Climbers do out of a grab? (Chain throws... infinites... anything?)

 

[Lovage 805]

Have you tried a WiFi match yet? Pleasetell me you can change the match besides 2mins, items on.

 

[TheLetterJ]

When will the videos be up? Just wondering because all the videos that i see seem like they havent played a day of melee or something.

 

[bob-e]

Hey guys,
**UPDATE2**

Another big thing I forgot to add! Whenever you do a shorthopped aerial your momentum moving sideways drops to practically zero, especially if you are doing a nair. It is not like Melee where you keep moving after a shorthop. This makes the aerial game MUCH different than Melee.

**** it Nintendo, that is not how physics works. You are not pushing against thin air. Why must they constantly screw with the competitive player? First they fix one area of physics to remove a technique (wavedashing), now they do the complete opposite to make shorthopped aerials less useful.

 

[J.L]

It seems a lot of characters have seen some nerfs here and there except for Marth. From what you can tell right now, is he probably one of the top 3 characters?

Also, how are Marth's side b attacks ? can you still do diff variations including the one with the spike? How is the knockback for them?

 

[-Rei-]

is the DD multiple times in the same direction just a simpler version of foxtrotting or different?

 

[LeeHarris]

is marth still able to spike? or do fair combos? i will like more information on marth.

Yes, he still spikes. I was doing fair combos at one point, but I think the max you can chain together now is two, maybe three because of the reduced hitstun that people have. When I pulled off a 6 or 7 hit fair combo and ended with a spike the guy I was playing against said he just wasn't blocking or dodging. His charged B move is pretty strong and comes out fairly quick. His side B combos come out INSANELY fast. His nair is strong, but it is hard to hit people with now. His fsmash seems weaker overall, but if you tip it seems to kill at the same percentages.

 

[Flaminglink]

Youre crazy!! links moves arnt weaker most of them are stronger its just that his up b got nerfed -_-