Boss Battles on Intense discussion.

[Firus]

Gah, I'm still trying to beat it...now 7 is my record. For some reason, Galleom's uppercut ALWAYS seems to hit me, no matter how much I see it coming. Every time I try to dodge it, I seem to be a millisecond too late, and get hit with it. But he doesn't always use it, and sometimes I don't have enough damage to be killed by it.

The Ridleys, the Hands, and Petey aren't a problem for me (unless I make a stupid mistake, which has happened) but the other four cause me trouble. The worst part is, I know once I make it to Tabuu it'll take another 10 tries to get to him again (I don't think I'll beat him on the first try) and that's going to be annoying.

Ness is still definitely my favorite, but I may have to switch characters soon if this keeps up.

 

[Raptor Jesus]

Intense mode? Holy Raptor Jesus, I haven't beaten it on Very Hard.

 

[neji32]

I got to tabuu with Ness. Bair and Neutral B Takes out bosses pretty easily. You can absorb Master hands finger blaster and buans pink lasers. But make sure to stay in the air most of the time. Tabuu always kills me with those wing flaps.*sigh*

 

[MarthFanatique]

Truly, it's not that difficult once you beat it once. I beat it with Pit, and arrow spamming actually is not the best idea for some bosses (porky sticks out to me a little). Anyway, in general for those who have issues with Taboo's wing's rings lol, I quickly dash under him and do three sidesteps (shield and down). It's easy to dodge the cage move, too: if you see it coming, do a jump and quickly air dodge before it hits you. Overall, you need to practice and see the animations before he attacks; he won't be very hard then. P.S.--IMO it's easier with because of his mirror shield, that thing blocks everything (or next to it).

 

[Firus]

Truly, it's not that difficult once you beat it once.

That's the problem.

 

[pyrotek7x7]

Okay, new guide for all y'alls.

All Bosses: Dodge their attacks. This strategy never fails if implemented correctly! ^.-

When I first started, I ALWAYS made the mistake of rushing. You just need to know that DODGING IS TOP PRIORITY. Don't risk getting in one extra attack if it gets you damaged. Attack once or twice, stand back, and prepare to dodge. You need to watch the boss, see what's coming, and dodge it.

Also, you spend all this work getting to Tabuu, just to die to his red wings of death? DON'T DO THAT! He's 1 minute away from the top-right portal in the Great Maze, ready for you to practice on. Even better, EVERY DIFFICULTY has the same timing for the red rings of death. Just practice on him over and over until you can dodge every ring with ease. (I suggest going to the edge of the stage, it's easier to see them coming).

Don't make the same mistakes I did. After practicing on Tabuu in SSE for an hour or two, he's the easiest boss for me (apart from Petey. Yes, the hands I consider harder than Tabuu...stupid drills)

P.S. I still strongly suggest Metaknight. His nair is all you need. It's incredibly strong and is able to whip out quickly. Sliding you thumb from Y to A, Y to A, you can stay in the air and rip out that monster move over and over again. Rayquaza going to do a tail swipe? Oh well, stay in the air and PUMMEL HIM! Metaknight is also freaking wonderful because he has good mobility. He can retreat when needed and advance quickly to get in that extra hit. He has excellent recovery, can go very high to dodge many of those once-hard-to-dodge attacks, and even best, he completely MURDERS TABUU. He has no projectiles, but that's okay, the bosses will be dead before you'll ever need them.

 

[Firus]

Intense mode? Holy Raptor Jesus, I haven't beaten it on Very Hard.

Hehe, so...funny story. After I read this post, I thought for a second and remembered I had tried Very Hard with Ness and failed, and for some reason thought I had beaten it with someone else. So I was confused, and unsure if this was actually true, and checked and...I forgot to do Very Hard. Yes, that's right, I skipped over Very Hard and went straight to Intense.

After a couple of tries, I beat it, but I thought that was kind of funny. Oh yeah, PS, Meta Ridley killed me by glitching, he slammed the Falcon down and I jumped only a little bit, and when it came back up, I glitched through the platform and died.

 

[Nintendoing]

Go ahead and call me a noob,
I haven't even beaten it on Hard...
Always die to Tabuu's wind flaps

 

[Tiamat475]

The only problem I have with Intense mode is dealing with Petey, I'll get hit at least once by his jump. Sometimes it's Galleom. I did however beat it on Hard and Very Hard with Fox. My record for intense so far is 6. Too annoying if you ask me.

Edit: Made it to Tabuu at 80%. Died from his 2nd ring, dodged it too early. I'm going to go crazy! :embarrass

 

[Endless Nightmares]

idk if I'm a glutton for punishment or what...I almost beat it with Ganon

Tripped @ Tabuu T_T

 

[pyrotek7x7]

@FirustheHedgehog: XD I did Intense first, then Very Hard. I figured it was easier to jump down than up. Boy, was I right. I cleared Very Hard on my first try.

Also, you said in an earlier post you haven't gotten to Tabuu yet and will probably die on him? DON'T MAKE THAT MISTAKE! I did. Practice on him in SSE (on Intense) until you can dodge every attack easily.

@Nintendoing: Go practice on Tabuu in the great maze (upper right door) until you can dodge EVERY ring, EVERY time. Nothing more frustrating than beating 9 bosses just to get hit on an easily dodgeable move.

@Tiamat475: If you aren't getting 0% on Petey every time, you're doing something wrong. Don't be impatient, attack once or twice, then prepare to dodge his attacks that you can see from 3 miles away.

@56k: Wow, Ganon? o_0 He's probably one of the worst choices for beating it the first time. Each to his own, I suppose. Also good for bragging rights. ^.^ "I beat Intense Boss Battles last night! With GANONDORF!"

 

[manhunter098]

Just a little trick I learned for Petey, not sure if it has been mentioned yet before though.

You can attack both the cage and the head at the same time, and it will register the damage from both. This pretty much lets you kill him in about half the time your normally would if you can make sure to damage both the cage (the one you are specifically targeting) and head with one attack.

@Tiamat475 his jump is pretty easy to dodge, just jump up high enough and you can avoid the attack even if he comes down on top of you, though you have to be some degree above his waist and you have to remain above that point until he hits the ground. You could also always just run for it when he jumps up, if you are using a fast or even a medium speed character you can easily see the attack in time to get out of the way. Personally I get hit by his cage attacks more since I like to use jump attacks and go for his head and I tend to get a little overzealous in my offensive since hes so easy.



Also I think I will mention it again, but Zelda, Shiek, Metaknight, and I would assume Pikachu and Lucario can escape a lot of very hard to escape attacks (like the spin attacks from the hands) with their Up B attacks (down b in Metaknights case). Most of them are also pretty agile as well and thus make good candidates for Boss Battles.

 

[Mr.Lombardi34]

I Give Up! Blarg!

Ten minuites ago, I was trying to beat intense, and I have probably tried about 50 times (Really). I got to duon, number 7 I think he was. At one point, he shot the missiles, so I ran in, and he turned around. When the missles came in, his sword side did that attack where he swings his head (Which has a sword on top of it) at the ground. It hit me and the missles exploded in my face. I died, needless to say.

Right then, I tossed my gamecube controller onto the floor, and yelled out, "I GIVE UP!" After getting up and poking the wii's off button, I said, outloud still, "I am not going to try anymore. I don't enjoy trying to beat Boss Battles on intense. No more, I quit."

This is really starting to bug me. I just can't seem to do it, and it's consuming all of my time. I spend an hour or so every day after I come home from school to attempt this, and maybe another half hour some time else in the day. I've tried to be so carefull with avoiding attacks and such, but I just can't beat it. It's not fun for me any more. I always get frustrated after I lose, and this is just torturous. I have decided not to play boss battles on intense for at least a week. I feel so caged up, it's like I won't feel free until I complete this. I just want to forget about it, because I hate trying so many times and never even getting to tabuu.

Now you can all shower me with your, "Just keep trying!", and, "You'll get it sometime!" posts, however pointless, since you will not convince me to do this mode again any time soon.

*End rant*

 

[pyrotek7x7]

@manhunter098: It's pretty easy just to jump and airdodge as Petey comes down. That way, you can attack as you fall.

@Mr. Lombardi34: Trust me, we all know how you feel. I hated Boss Battles, felt I should stop because I felt pissed off all day at school. I suggest trying Metaknight, and then telling us what you specifically are having trouble with. Usually, there's one simple strategy you've never thought of before that will make all the difference.

A break might be good. If you never beat it, though, you'll feel caged forever. Brawl WILL change your life, and for you, it already has. There's no turning back.

 

[Firus]

@FirustheHedgehog: XD I did Intense first, then Very Hard. I figured it was easier to jump down than up. Boy, was I right. I cleared Very Hard on my first try.

Also, you said in an earlier post you haven't gotten to Tabuu yet and will probably die on him? DON'T MAKE THAT MISTAKE! I did. Practice on him in SSE (on Intense) until you can dodge every attack easily.

Yeah, I would've beaten it on the first try if it weren't for the hacking Meta Ridley.

And thanks for the advice, I'll definitely take it. You're right, I'll probably stab myself, twist the knife, pull it out, and put it back in if I finally get to Tabuu and then die.

idk if I'm a glutton for punishment or what...I almost beat it with Ganon

Tripped @ Tabuu T_T

Oh my God...
I'm so sorry. Thanks Sakurai...just, thanks.

Just a little trick I learned for Petey, not sure if it has been mentioned yet before though.

You can attack both the cage and the head at the same time, and it will register the damage from both. This pretty much lets you kill him in about half the time your normally would if you can make sure to damage both the cage (the one you are specifically targeting) and head with one attack.

Thanks for the tip! That tends to happen when I use PK Flash (the blast radius is pretty big) but I didn't know it could happen with other attacks. I'll have to keep that in mind.

Ten minuites ago, I was trying to beat intense, and I have probably tried about 50 times (Really). I got to duon, number 7 I think he was. At one point, he shot the missiles, so I ran in, and he turned around. When the missles came in, his sword side did that attack where he swings his head (Which has a sword on top of it) at the ground. It hit me and the missles exploded in my face. I died, needless to say.

Right then, I tossed my gamecube controller onto the floor, and yelled out, "I GIVE UP!" After getting up and poking the wii's off button, I said, outloud still, "I am not going to try anymore. I don't enjoy trying to beat Boss Battles on intense. No more, I quit."

This is really starting to bug me. I just can't seem to do it, and it's consuming all of my time. I spend an hour or so every day after I come home from school to attempt this, and maybe another half hour some time else in the day. I've tried to be so carefull with avoiding attacks and such, but I just can't beat it. It's not fun for me any more. I always get frustrated after I lose, and this is just torturous. I have decided not to play boss battles on intense for at least a week. I feel so caged up, it's like I won't feel free until I complete this. I just want to forget about it, because I hate trying so many times and never even getting to tabuu.

Now you can all shower me with your, "Just keep trying!", and, "You'll get it sometime!" posts, however pointless, since you will not convince me to do this mode again any time soon.

*End rant*

I know how you feel. I really know how you feel with being sucked into it, being caged up. When you just always have it on your mind and you HAVE to get it done to finally be at peace. I advise you give it a week or so, just stop trying, maybe do some practicing on the bosses in SSE (unless that would cause you agony as well, in which case give it a week on that) and then at the end of the week, try maybe once a day or so. I find that when I'm really annoyed by something, the first time I do it, I have more of an "Argh...oh well, time to try again!" kind of attitude, while once I get to the 10th try, I have more of an "I'M GOING TO KILL MYSELF." attitude. So maybe give it a couple of tries a day, so as not to get so aggravated. That's not optimism, that's just advice from personal experience. If you don't feel like taking it, don't feel obligated. I just think that, if you're sucked into it like I usually get sucked into things, you'll feel better if you finish it eventually.

Best of luck.

Brawl WILL change your life, and for you, it already has. There's no turning back.

Jeez, you make it sound like a drug addiction.

 

[manhunter098]

I tend to be able to hit both his head and the cage at once when I use the n-air attacks for most characters. Though I managed to beat him in like 7 seconds with Captain Falcon once because I could hit both the cage and his head with CF's ^ Smash. At least I think it hit both with him. Either way the hit box for your attack doesnt need to be massive to hit them both, you can probably even do it with Meta-Knight's n-air even.

 

[theogmaster]

i got to taboo 5 times wit fox today. on my best run he had literally a cm of health left when he used the gold chain to grab me and throw me to a game over =( i was so sad. btw first post =D

 

[Firus]

i got to taboo 5 times wit fox today. on my best run he had literally a cm of health left when he used the gold chain to grab me and throw me to a game over =( i was so sad. btw first post =D

You're nuts.

If that had happened to me, I'd be bawling my eyes out, smashing my Wii into tiny pieces, not just sad.

 

[manhunter098]

Is it really that hard for people to dodge that attack? I have yet to get to him on intense, but is he really THAT much faster? (I have no problem dodging any of his attacks on very hard mode).

 

[KernelColonel]

I did it with Marth, after about a million billion jillion tries.

The best strategy is to attack until you see them warming up to do something that you can counter. I always did both Hands, Petey, Rayquaza, and sometimes Galleom at 0%. Porky usually hit me with his laser, which even if I countered twice it would sneak in 20%. Duon was an annoying piece of **** that wouldn't stop ****ing using unavoidable attacks. I always took minimum 50% on Duon. Both Ridleys were okay, but I kept getting pissed off whenever I countered Meta-Ridley's attack on the Falcon and it would still kill me...

Tabuu was awful for me. Since I killed him in one try in Subspace I didn't even know about half of his face-****** tactics. The Red Ring Wings of Doom were one of them =.=' I had to go to Subspace and go straight to Tabuu just so I could figure out how to dodge properly.

I beat him today, finally, after dodging his Red Ring Wings of Doom for the first time (it helped that I also dodged his yellow cage throw).

Counter can really quicken up those boss matchups, though.

 

[manhunter098]

Interesting approach with the counter there. I wonder if Marth's up b is fast enough to escape from some of Duon's tougher to dodge attacks. Ive found that any move that lets you well move really fast can be used to escape stuff, but it works a lot better with attacks that have you disappear thus making you temporarily invincible. I havent gotten to try out too much on Duon yet though, but it might be worth the time spent falling if you can dodge some of his attacks (I did find Falco to work well since his double jump can get above almost anything Duon can throw at you, combine that with a Phantasm and Falco's fall speed and you can even get a couple shots in from behind, and I havent yet tried escaping from the ground with the Phantasm yet, but I assume it would work, the for the ground one would also apply to Fox I would assume, thats if it works anyways.

 

[Slike]

My problem is getting to tabuu. Tabuu is so extremely predictable. As in, if you can get to tabuu, and he kills you, porky is harder than tabuu, so why did the little pig not kill you?

 

[Urb]

With Pit, you can beat these bosses w/o taking damage:

Master Hand
Crazy Hand
Meta Ridley
Petey P.
Rayquaza
and Ridley

His mirror shield deflect most of the attacks and his areal based atk style is great for the air born bosses. I can usually beat Porky with less then 30% taken, but Galloem and Dueon are trick because of their strong atks. But If you can hit Dueon with his own missiles, he is pretty much dead. His freaking dumb "spin" and his three dark lasers are a major pain.

Yes, after hours of practice, I beat this mode. If anyone needs a strategy guide on how to beat the previous bosses without taking damage, I would love to tell you. (Man, Petey is EASY to do it with!)

 

[Andromeda]

I finally beat Tabuu yesterday, spamming Charizards Rock Smash.

 

[Urb]

Bowser's recovery is also pretty good at dealing brutal damage on the likes of Rayquaza and Porky becasue you can just stay inside them for the durration of the atk.

 

[ShadowLink84]

I did it with Sonic.

Master hand, Crazy hand, Petey Piranha, rayquaza are bosses you should not be getting killed by, maybe Meta Ridley if you know his attack pattern since its predictable.

For Tabuu I relied on good ole jumping and dodging yep.
Dodged the off waves three times before i offed Tabuu.

 

[Tsuteto]

Me and a friend did it with dual Zeldas. That was fun. Three wizard foots each in the air for half of them, and other times I'd be in close while he attacked from afar.

Almost have done it with Zelda solo, but once I get to Tabuu I've been dead tired due to me playing at, like 2 am. I'd probably be fine nowadays though XD

 

[Jeff Highwind]

Me and a friend did it with dual Zeldas. That was fun. Three wizard foots each in the air for half of them, and other times I'd be in close while he attacked from afar.

Almost have done it with Zelda solo, but once I get to Tabuu I've been dead tired due to me playing at, like 2 am. I'd probably be fine nowadays though XD

Can't you just Dins Fire camp? o_ô

 

[Endless Nightmares]

Wouldn't that take forever? Seems like Din's Fire would barely chip off any damage

Zelda's kicks take off a huge chunk.

 

[pyrotek7x7]

I did it with Marth, after about a million billion jillion tries.

The best strategy is to attack until you see them warming up to do something that you can counter. I always did both Hands, Petey, Rayquaza, and sometimes Galleom at 0%. Porky usually hit me with his laser, which even if I countered twice it would sneak in 20%. Duon was an annoying piece of **** that wouldn't stop ****ing using unavoidable attacks. I always took minimum 50% on Duon. Both Ridleys were okay, but I kept getting pissed off whenever I countered Meta-Ridley's attack on the Falcon and it would still kill me...

Tabuu was awful for me. Since I killed him in one try in Subspace I didn't even know about half of his face-****** tactics. The Red Ring Wings of Doom were one of them =.=' I had to go to Subspace and go straight to Tabuu just so I could figure out how to dodge properly.

I beat him today, finally, after dodging his Red Ring Wings of Doom for the first time (it helped that I also dodged his yellow cage throw).

Counter can really quicken up those boss matchups, though.

This is GENIUS!

Marth is really good when counter is used correctly. Moves once dreadfully feared are now hoped for, because they're easy damage to bosses. Rayquaza darting across the screen? Hooray! Duon about to jump on you? Free hit!

 

[neji32]

If anyone has troble with duans 3 dark lasers, I have a way to dodgeing them easy. Actually I beat duan every time taking 0%
When ever the blue side slowly moves toward you, just jump and hang on the ledge. When either side dashes at you, just jump air dodge and prepare for another(just in case). Use close combat attacks on the pink side, if you have projectiles spam them as much as possible.(on both sides) if you stay far from blue, he should case no problem. If you have one, reflect the pinks lasers at him, as for the 3 dark lasers, jump over the first air dodge the second fast fall the third and prepare for duan to dash. When pink shoots the missiles, just jump behind duan and let them hit him. !Close combat should be done in the air!
Petey- Just stand in front of him and use aerials.

Meta Ridley- Jump in his mouth and use a reflector. Or just aerial attack when he doesn't, jump and air dodge should avoid all his blows.

Ridley- Aerial attack. If he goes backward off the screen, then double jump air dodge and he will miss his attack. If he attacks with his tail or claws, quickley jump and aerial. if he slams the ground and wind appears, double jump air dodge. If he slams on the ground with no wind, simply move about 5 feet and prepare to counter.

 

[neji32]

Rayquaza- Aerial attack constinetly to avoid iron tail. When he roars prepare to dodge.
Eyes glow- Jump and air dodge
Flys straight up- double jump air dodge/ do it 3 times if his health is low, DI toward the direction hes going for more time to dodge the second.
Flys up circles the leaves- dash across the stage to avoid a vertical attack.
Flys up around in circle really fast- jump air dodge (timeing needs to be good) to dodge thunder bolt
Dashes straight- jump so he moves to the other side
Goes underground- Wait till you see the ground moving and jump forward(Bair if you can)./repeat 3 times when his health is low
Master hand- Air attacks. If he fires like a rocket off to the BG then double jump(air dodge also to be safe)
If he backs up, then jump and wait for a slap.
I he goes into a fist up top, double jump air dodge or with some char like link and fox, you can Up B.
If he follows you, then just dash and spot dodge/roll to avoid the grab.
If he points his fingers, jump air dodge or reflect(you can absorb as well with ness and lucas)
If he launches up twisty, jump off the stage and then double jump Up B back.
Crazy hand- Same thing basically

 

[neji32]

Galleom and porkey are different, I know what they do but i beat then different ways every time.
Tabuu- He is pretty easy,
Anytime he moves, Try to stay away from him, thats all there is to it. When he keeps teleporting, just wait for him to stop and aerial attack him. The Wings of Doom are my hardest parts of the whole boss battle

 

[Firus]

My problem is getting to tabuu. Tabuu is so extremely predictable. As in, if you can get to tabuu, and he kills you, porky is harder than tabuu, so why did the little pig not kill you?

He is very predictable, the only problem is dodging attacks like the cage, the whip, and the RRoD perfectly when you're very nervous, shaky, and shocked that you've made it so far on Intense. Actually, the only one actually difficult to dodge is the RRoD, because it's 3 dodges in a row and being a millisecond off means certain death.

I actually haven't found Porky to be that hard, he's difficult, but more because he racks up damage than killing. Most of Tabuu's moves, on the other hand, kill. Who do you use? Maybe that's why you've found him more difficult.

 

[manhunter098]

I finally beat it. I tried using Metaknight and got it after about 7 or 8 tries. It was really surprisingly easy. Down B rocks for escaping Duon's attacks, though it doesnt seem to work too well against the hands and their spinning attacks.


Tabuu gave me no trouble at all. If you try to get his trophy on very hard mode, you shouldnt have too much trouble getting used to escaping the cage and lassow. The only attack he has that annoys me is the one where he multiplies (its really random and hard to avoid, but not really very deadly). Im just good enough to register his attacks with the lassow thing (he ALMOST got me with it when I fought him, but I managed to dodge it) but I really dont see how the cage gives people trouble, I can see it coming from a mile away and its really not hard to air dodge it.




If you want to beat it for the first time, I have to say Meta-Knight is THE WAY to go, I hardly even touch Meta-Knight at all, but since his strategy for Boss Battles is so outrageously simple (just use n-air and jump between n-air to keep spamming them, make sure both hits connect) and kills bosses so quickly there is no better character. You can escape Duons attacks without having to hang from the ledge (except that blasted lazer, its hell to dodge with him, but as long as you dont start that fight with high damage you wont die and you may even win before he uses it anyways. I mean its practically the same thing for every boss and if you understand the hitboxes for their attacks Meta-Knight is mobile enough to get to a safe spot or just air dodge the attack, then just keep spamming n-air.


For Petey, I found the fastest way to get him to go down is to hover just between his head and one cage so that you hit both the cage and his head with your n-air (in Metaknights case, though hitting both the cage and head at once applies to all characters). He goes down hard and fast and its really no problem to just stay high enough to avoid his cage attacks and air dodge anything you can avoid with height. But really for anyone in doubt that they will ever beat this or are just not making much progress, just try MK, a few runs and you will have the feel for him, and in a few more that trophy should be yours.

 

[Hax]

believe me.. fox makes this easy. reflector = OHKO on meta ridley, spam smashes on rayquaza, the hands, petey and ridley are cake, laser spam galleom (watch out for his OHKOs.. this is the hardest boss for fox), laser spam porky and airdodge the orange laser, get in back of duon when he rushes you and attack him from there. easy stuff.

 

[manhunter098]

I tried Fox, but I tend to get way too involved with his Laser, and thats not a good thing. Also have you tried using side b to escape from Galleom (just dont try it too close to the edge of course). I found that attacks that move your character between two points very quickly, make escaping those problematic attacks (like Galleoms dashes, and Porkey's laser (when hes flying) and even the hands spin attacks a very easy task. Also for Galleom, you could always just cower beneath the ledge to avoid his dash attacks, though it might prove a little tougher to do that with fox.

 

[Tiamat475]

@Tiamat475: If you aren't getting 0% on Petey every time, you're doing something wrong. Don't be impatient, attack once or twice, then prepare to dodge his attacks that you can see from 3 miles away.

@Tiamat475 his jump is pretty easy to dodge, just jump up high enough and you can avoid the attack even if he comes down on top of you, though you have to be some degree above his waist and you have to remain above that point until he hits the ground. You could also always just run for it when he jumps up, if you are using a fast or even a medium speed character you can easily see the attack in time to get out of the way. Personally I get hit by his cage attacks more since I like to use jump attacks and go for his head and I tend to get a little overzealous in my offensive since hes so easy.

I took the two advices from you guys and it helped! I guess I was a bit impatient, thanks a lot! It definitely increased my chances of getting to Tabuu.

And now I officially and I am proud to say that I've beaten the hell mode using Fox! Boy, I think I've played it 50+ times. It does help to notice the boss' tactics and patterns. I wonder what else Sakurai has in store for us in the "next Smash game". I'm happy now, to get the mode finished.

Video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7_u02CJjY18&fmt=18

 

[Urb]

Oh yeah, Marth is also really good thanks to counter. Ridley, Petey, and Duon are NOTHING to our purple haired hero!

 

[The Whiscash]

It's odd. I've been able to ace every boss on their own, but never more than 2 in sequence. I managed to take only 17% during the first 3 boss rounds with Fox, but I could only actually deal with intense with Charizard ( D: )