Bingo Mafia: OVAH! Who won?

[#HBC | ѕoup]

because, i thought i had something good but i re-read and there's holes in it, and personally i spent most of my day looking at asdioh, but whatever.

not like it was going somewhere, ****ing 4+ hours just to "I DUNNO LOL"

 

[Seikend]

Why claim though.

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

because, i don't need to make a stupid gambit, or fake-claim, or anything, why would it matter what i claimed if i was a VT, that's right, it doesn't.

not like it makes a difference lol.

 

[Aposl]

ahahahaha soup chill out

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

also let it be noted i'm still very strong on asdioh being scum.

ahahaha aposl, why don't you spend 4 hours of your day doing what i just did.

 

[Seikend]

>Claim VT
>Scum narrows down the possible PR pool.

 

[Seikend]

Soup, if you're just frustrated townie then we got some talking to do at the end of the game, 'kay?

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

>claim vt
>have a clear
>another PR would out by now
>another clear
>shortens down the list even more

>J was uncced
>Smarg was uncced
>Smarg dies
>JTB dies.

>11 people left
>2 vt claims
>2 pr claims

do the math.

v/la.

 

[Kataefi]

@MOD: Why include rules such as these and then include a role that prevents a player from following them? None of J's posts have been in english beyond quotes and the occasional word in an image.

If there is no such role and J is faking the whole thing: Request Modkill

"You must post in english" refers to the written language you speak in the thread. Pictures are not written so I don't consider this a breach of the rule. However, words within pictures must be written in English.

"You must not post in code" refers to coded language used to communicate illegal information in the game.

"No hidden text" refers to no hidden text

Currently I believe no rules are being broken at this time!

Also good activity as usual

VOTE COUNT!

[2] Asdioh - Soupamario / Aposl
[2] Nabe - Pink Lemonade / Toasting Dat Walrus
[1] Aposl - J
[1] J - Glyphmoney
[1] Soupamario - Asdioh

[0] Pink Lemonade
[0] GandhiLaserGun
[0] KevinM
[0] Toasting Dat Walrus
[0] Seikend
[0] Glyphmoney

[4] Not Voting: GandhiLaserGun / Nabe / KevinM / Seikend

With 11 alive, it takes 6 to lynch!
Deadline set for Tuesday, April 19th, Midnight GMT.

 

[Asdioh]

blah blah blah

Vote: Asdioh

I wanted to be scum because I haven't been since my first game, and I wanted to see if I am actually good at it or if it was just beginners luck.

Think about it. I trying to play the game as if I were a VT without knowing my actual role. If I...

-Turned out to be scum, then that's good for my faction because all my scumhunting up to that point had been legit, meaning people couldn't call me out for pseudoscumhunting or anything like that.
-Turned out to be scum, then that's still good for my faction because I had been playing and scumhunting without being distracted by any potential role.

It turned out to be the latter. Get over it.

I haven't read the rest of the thread yet (seems like people wait until I'm at work to have high activity in here) but I sincerely hope nobody was dumb enough to follow your lead.

 

[Asdioh]

I was trying*

 

[Asdioh]

turned out to be scum*
turned out to be town*

holy lack of proofreading. Major scumslip there :mistyface:

 

[DtJ Glyphmoney]

>claim vt
>have a clear
>another PR would out by now
>another clear
>shortens down the list even more

>J was uncced
>Smarg was uncced
>Smarg dies
>JTB dies.

>11 people left
>2 vt claims
>2 pr claims

do the math.

v/la.

This post is all sorts of icky Soup. First off it looks like you're self clearing in the second line, and I don't even know what you mean by "another PR would out by now".

J's claim being uncontested doesn't mean squat, its a null tell (the real watcher could simply not want to out himself and simply focus on killing J thus leaving his PR secret, or hell there could just not be one in this game.)

As for you claiming VT, lets go ahead and do the math like you suggested. We have 13 players in this game. 2 are dead (both town), leaving 11. Based on general mafia layouts, we can assume that there are at least 3 scum members, leaving 8 members of town. Of those 8, I'd guess around 3 are PRs (though honestly I have no idea what the generally accepted number of town PRs is, it probably depends on what abilities the scum team has). So if scum kills a person at random, they have a 3/8 (or 37.5%) chance of hitting a PR and increasing their odds of winning the game.

Now, lets look at what happens when we have people claim. Lets assume for this example that all claims have been true. J would be confirmed PR, and Asdioh and you would be VT. If scum were to pick randomly from the 5 remaining candidates, their odds increase to 2/5 (40%), or 1/2 (50%) after they kill J.

The whole point of claiming isn't to narrow down the lynch pool for the day, since scum can often fake claim and have no one be any the wiser. Claims are supposed to serve as a safety net to protect against a mislynch, which is why we don't ask for them until people have expressed intent to kill them (and even then scum can lie, as I believe J did).

So Soup what you did was pretty bad bro. Honestly not sure if I want you around much longer, even though I only have a weak scum-read on you.

 

[Asdioh]

ok, more in-depth response to Soup "smacking me around" since ACTIVITY STOPS WHEN I'M ACTUALLY HOME WTF GUYS

haven't read the entirety of what happened when I was at work yet, but I wanted to shoot this post down. Soup, for the thousand millionth time, no editing.

@Asdioh

I know you have, i just want your NOW opnion on J and also, lemme go fish up your 'explanation.' also, you couldn't find it? it was one of the very first posts in the beginning of D2.

I still can't find TDWs "stance" against me. My NOW opinion of J is that he's next in lynching order, after you.

look at this little treasure of a post in found.

JTB, the doctor generally can't protect itself. I can almost guarantee she can't protect herself, and she will likely be targeted for the NK tonight, unless scum is afraid there is a watcher

How is this treasure? I was saying what I knew about doctors. I've never seen a self-protecting doctor. I was also hoping there was a watcher (that wouldn't claim) to find out if someone kills her. The general standard is the watcher watches the claimed doctor, the doctor protects the claimed watcher, if they claim.

oh, look, even more gold.

I was reluctant to claim because I knew doing so would kill the gambit I set up?

o.o

And how is this gold? Outing a potentially convincing gambit claim is almost as bad as outing an actual PR. If I claimed VT, it would kill my gambit. If I claimed the watcher/tracker that I crumbed, then I would be expected to actually BE a watcher/tracker, when I did not yet know if I would find a good situation to catch scum.

My plan for the gambit was this. I wanted to make it through D1 without claiming. If, on D2 or later, I had a REALLY REALLY strong scumread on someone, and was almost certain they performed the NK, I would claim the gambit, and say I saw them kill with my Watch or Track power, to convict them. If I was right, then we caught scum. If I was wrong, then I would have to judge their reaction to see if I was wrong. If I didn't have a REALLY REALLY strong scumread, then I wouldn't bother gambiting.
But I already claimed VT so I can't do any of that.

and here is the grand-daddy of them all.

Thanks for rushing me, Seik and Nabe.

Ok, everything I'm going to post about my claim is 100% teh truth, so it's up to you to believe me, whatever good that will do.

However, those crumbs were to be used entirely as a gambit, in the event that I got a strong read on someone and wanted to bait a reaction out of them. I've seen a couple players *coughKuzandX1* pull off very helpful gambits in the past and I wanted to at least give myself the preemptive opportunity to do the same. If that situation didn't arrive, I wouldn't have bothered claiming watcher/tracker 1-shot whatever.

Neat, gambits are alright.

one thing though, Asdioh, this was half-way into the game, i think by now you would have enough information to pull this 'gambit.'

so asdioh, what were you waiting for? what made you so determined to hide this?

Someone already answered this, but BECAUSE THEY'RE NIGHT ACTIONS AND WE HADN'T HAD A NIGHT PHASE YET LOL

But obviously, that's not my real role. Here's the kicker though: I didn't read my role PM until around 10 pm on April 1. I had confirmed with the moderator that it was ok to not read my role for at least part of D1, and also confirmed that I didn't have a posting restriction. I made THIS POST a bit special to hint at it and signify that was where I had read my role PM.

so..basically, you WAITED AT LEAST PART OF D1.

in your crumb (and i have looked at this) you started your quite early into your entrance. contradiction much?

What is your point? I crumbed the role before I had even read my PM. Didn't I say that? If I made it through D1 without claiming, people wouldn't even know that I hadn't read my role at that point. If I turned out to have another PR or was scum, then I would have just ignored my earlier crumb. You're looking so hard into this claim, you should be looking into the actual stances I've taken.

CONTRADICTION FOUND!!

you state, you used your Watcher-Tracker claim to help town, BUT here you state you were HOPING YOU WERE SCUM!?

so you were playing as scum for the intent that you are scum!? i am so shocked!

i like the last bolded part too, i won't say anything, because i think that part is clear.

I already responded to this a couple posts above. The underlined is a good catch, but it doesn't say anything about my alignment. If I ended up being scum, I would just ignore my crumb. If I ended up being town (which I did) I had a gambit already set up in case I found the opportunity to use it. This helps town if I'm town, it does nothing if I'm scum.

bull****.
BULL****.

you don't just go into a game, not knowing your faction, there is no way in ****ING HELL, you did not read your role pm and decided to post, NO ****ING WAY.



i don't buy it.

Vote: Asdioh

uh... yes I did? I saw that I got a role PM, confirmed with the mod that it was ok to wait to read it and made sure I didn't have a posting restriction, confirmed that I had received the role PM in the thread, and then started playing. I've already listed the potential benefits for both scum and town doing this. Good try, but instead of poring over my claim, please look for actual stances I've taken and my reasoning for doing so, and you'll see that I've been trying to find scum.

Now I'm going to fully read the other posts that happened while I was at work. I saw Soup claim VT while looking them over, didn't like that at all -_-

 

[Pink Lemonade]

I needed to sit down and organize my thoughts on everyone. Result:

1. Pink Lemonade
2. GandhiLaserGun- probably the player I am most null on; off the top of my head it is really difficult for me to remember his stances which places him at null but makes me uneasy
3. BSL [replaced by Nabe]- I found BSL scummy there right before he replaced out, then Nabe came in and that dissipated a little; however, yesterDay he took no hard stances and was really ambivalent to over half the players as lynch. Cast doubt on J but I don't remember seeing an actual case against him, just the idea that watcher/doc is annoying but could be dealt with later. Then toDay J is still suspicious, but there is this strong push against Soup and regardless of what he says he seems reluctant to pursue J. Top scum pick right now. A Nabe scum flip would make me much more open to Jscum.
4. Asdioh- VT claim sets less well for me after the JTB lynch, where he tunneled J into oblivion but said very little in the way of JTB, and I feel Asdioh was the one pushing the hardest for an immediate lynch of J after his claim and refused to listen to anyone about the pros of waiting for a night of night actions before lynching J. Number 2 scum pick right now.
5. KevinM- has so far been straightforward, he has scum picks, he acts on them, he voices his opinion, pro-town all in all
6. Toasting Dat Walrus- straightforward, has scum picks, has been pretty actively pushing his scum picks and pushing against other players for reactions, town play so far
7. Seikend- his actions and reactions yesterDay as people were being wagoned and claiming looked legit, and his reaction to JTB's claim brought him flack but I honestly think that he reacted against lynching someone he realized was townie but didn't know what to do from there. Also, he actually listened to both sides of the J/JTB thing yesterDay, which I think is a town thing to do if you are unsure and have to make a lynch choice quickly.
8. J- I've had a town read on J from early Day 1 and the watcher claim didn't change that but in fact reinforced it. It is possible for someone to be roleblocked and issued a voting restriction in the same night, I imagine that a roleblock and posting restriction is possible then too. And regardless of what Glyph says, I think for only being able to quote and post pics, J has been trying to scumhunt; the roleblocking has increased the possibility J is scum for me but I'm still not sold.
9. Aposl- there is a chance he is scum but he's been more active D2, he has been responding quickly to questions/pressure, and he is not afraid to ask questions which could bring him flack, while as scum he would have scum buddies to help him through those questions. Furthermore, he was really concerned about lynching a vt yesterDay, which comes across as newb town rather than newb scum to me.
10. Soupamario- Up until the J claim I felt pretty good about Soup, but as has already been mentioned he pushed really hard that there isn't a roleblocker, he pushed that the plan was fool proof and toDay he has been just as adamant that J was roleblocked. Also, the sudden vt claim and getting really defensive are confusing, although he wasn't under pressure so not necessarily scummy. There is currently a Nabe v. Soup thing going on, in which I see Nabe as pretty likely scum and Soup frustrated townie. Nabe lynch would really help with J and Soup connections though.
11. Glyphmoney- Glyph was on J before, during and after J's claim and his efforts against J at least seem genuine and based in scumhunting; of everyone on J right now I think Glyph has the most legit reasoning.

Right now I would prefer a Nabe lynch which out of everyone is the best choice because I think there is a good chance of hitting scum AND he flip would help with reading J and Soup, which is obviously a good thing.

 

[Asdioh]

okay, soup was right, Im naive, just re read, and now with my tail between my legs and my head held low in shame, i thin asidoh is the vote. Not just going off of soups arguments but walrus's smarg quote got me. Now i look really dumb but for the sake of town.

Vote Asidoh

What walrus smarg quote?

But on top of that,how can you lay crumb for a pr gambit unless he was sure he didnt get that role. He could have gotten that role and ended up leaving crumbs to his actual role, I guess that scenario was never thought out?

If I actually got that role, by some great coincidence, then I'd have conveniently already crumbed it. No big deal.

I skimmed your case on asdioh. What you gave, I don't necessarily agree with, BUT it does help me with my read on you, seeing that I can see clear townie intentions coming from the case. It seems like the whole of your case revolves around determining the reason as to why he chose not to read his role PM and play scummy, all the while accepting the fact that he DIDN'T read his role PM. But if you do accept the fact that he didn't start off by reading his role PM, then what is it that's so wrong with the gambit? He didn't know if he'd be using it in a pro town or anti town manner, when he found out his alignment, he used it as a pro town gambit. I guess my whole question mark toward your case is, well, why do you care that he did the gambit, if you accept the fact that he didn't read his role PM till later into the game?

:/.

So on D1 you were considering J as either scum or town, based on whether Smarg lives or not.

Now that Smarg is dead at the start of D2, J is a "confirmed" watcher?

You haven't even considered the possibility of Jscum lying about being RBed?

How do you know there's a roleblocker?

Yeah, as I've been saying, J claiming being roleblocked doesn't prove that he's actually a Watcher, OR that there's a roleblocker. It's up to us to believe him or not.

and sorry, there is a possibility, but right now, AS I HAVE STATED, i want people to talk to me about the asdioh case, ***** about J later, okay?

You pushed this a lot, I'm glad I took the time to respond already.

Asdioh has explained why he crumbed the PRS before. I'll let him repeat it, ceebs digging it up.

I guess I did repeat it, didn't I?
Is ceebs a word?

[/LIST]
@MOD: Why include rules such as these and then include a role that prevents a player from following them? None of J's posts have been in english beyond quotes and the occasional word in an image.

If there is no such role and J is faking the whole thing: Request Modkill

I don't like this post.

in fact, while i'm at it, i'm gonna claim right now.

VT.

that's it, no crumbs, no gambits, nothing, just a VT.

a very frustrated one if that.

Get angry, claim VT, profit? :\

Soup, if you're just frustrated townie then we got some talking to do at the end of the game, 'kay?

I'll trust you have some info to help him improve or something

>claim vt
>have a clear

see the second line already poses a problem. You didn't just clear yourself, lol. I already claimed VT and I'm not clear, remember?

 

[Asdioh]

oops, forgot I already had another quote/response on a different tab, responding to lots of stuff is annoying.

this post

So tl;dr version, you think Aposl killed Smarg because he was scum and afraid she was onto him, right?

 

[Asdioh]

I don't like this post.

But I do like Glyphs 1933. It's a pretty pro-town thing to say, and I sincerely hope it's an actual townie saying it, rather than scum looking good by game mechanics (Gheb in Dissidia D: ) >_<

Difference is that I had a scumread on Gheb, and I don't have a scumread on Glyph.

 

[Asdioh]

3. BSL [replaced by Nabe]- I found BSL scummy there right before he replaced out, then Nabe came in and that dissipated a little; however, yesterDay he took no hard stances and was really ambivalent to over half the players as lynch. Cast doubt on J but I don't remember seeing an actual case against him, just the idea that watcher/doc is annoying but could be dealt with later. Then toDay J is still suspicious, but there is this strong push against Soup and regardless of what he says he seems reluctant to pursue J. Top scum pick right now. A Nabe scum flip would make me much more open to Jscum.

Can you say what you found scummiest about BSL? I remember him "rolefishing" as the scummiest thing he did, but other than that I can't really remember.

4. Asdioh- VT claim sets less well for me after the JTB lynch, where he tunneled J into oblivion but said very little in the way of JTB, and I feel Asdioh was the one pushing the hardest for an immediate lynch of J after his claim and refused to listen to anyone about the pros of waiting for a night of night actions before lynching J. Number 2 scum pick right now.

Sorry if you think I should have defended JTB harder. I pushed that a J lynch was the FAR better choice than JTB.
As for the pros of not lynching J... where did that get us? We now have the predictable event of him claiming to be roleblocked, coupled with the unexpected but oh so convenient Pictures Only posting restriction... on the player who already posted pictures the most. x_x

5. KevinM- has so far been straightforward, he has scum picks, he acts on them, he voices his opinion, pro-town all in all

Pro-town in that he was fundamental in getting both myself and Smarg to L-1, and thus to claim, while all the while not getting his hands dirty by bothering to post much reasoning for his scumpicks. Result? He found out who the doctor was, a VT was lynched, and all the while there is nothing super scummy to be found from him.

If you can't see what I'm getting at: I still think he's likely scum.

7. Seikend- his actions and reactions yesterDay as people were being wagoned and claiming looked legit, and his reaction to JTB's claim brought him flack but I honestly think that he reacted against lynching someone he realized was townie but didn't know what to do from there. Also, he actually listened to both sides of the J/JTB thing yesterDay, which I think is a town thing to do if you are unsure and have to make a lynch choice quickly.

I like your reasoning here. This might help me get a more solid read on Seikend.

9. Aposl- there is a chance he is scum but he's been more active D2, he has been responding quickly to questions/pressure, and he is not afraid to ask questions which could bring him flack, while as scum he would have scum buddies to help him through those questions. Furthermore, he was really concerned about lynching a vt yesterDay, which comes across as newb town rather than newb scum to me.

Good point here, too. I was sometimes reluctant to post stuff in my first game, when I was scum.

10. Soupamario- Up until the J claim I felt pretty good about Soup, but as has already been mentioned he pushed really hard that there isn't a roleblocker, he pushed that the plan was fool proof and toDay he has been just as adamant that J was roleblocked. Also, the sudden vt claim and getting really defensive are confusing, although he wasn't under pressure so not necessarily scummy. There is currently a Nabe v. Soup thing going on, in which I see Nabe as pretty likely scum and Soup frustrated townie. Nabe lynch would really help with J and Soup connections though.

I remember him saying foolproof, but I don't remember him insisting there was no roleblocker?

11. Glyphmoney- Glyph was on J before, during and after J's claim and his efforts against J at least seem genuine and based in scumhunting; of everyone on J right now I think Glyph has the most legit reasoning.

If J flips scum, does this clear Glyph in your eyes, or would you think it was a hardcore bus?
And my reasoning isn't legit if I simply agree with his reads on J, just because he got to it first?

Right now I would prefer a Nabe lynch which out of everyone is the best choice because I think there is a good chance of hitting scum AND he flip would help with reading J and Soup, which is obviously a good thing.

I'm listening, convince me.

 

[Asdioh]

This is something I started working on last night, but got bored/tired.









Late, going to start rereading with the knowledge that Smarg and JTB are Town. Going to look for significant stances players make, and other things of note.

[collapse=attempt to analyze each page but then got bored on page 4]Page 1: TDW jokingly refers to J as scum because he's going "aggro," J responds with extreme relief that he is, in fact, town. (this doesn't sit well with certain people, as you all know by now)

Page 2: TDW tells Smarg that Aposl is not scum for not knowing what RVS is. JTB suggests lynching Soup in response to Aposls earlygame suggestion. TDW apparently already seeing things he dislikes from Smarg, asks currently active players their opinions on her post. Smarg suspects Aposl. GLG opens showing willingness to lynch Smar, and possibly J or Glyph, and possibly buddying Kuz. Then he asks if Seikend is playing and if he agrees with him that Smar is scum. Then he dislikes how Seikend refuses to play until the game starts. Seikend doesn't think Smar looks scummy for her beginning posts. Soupamario confirms, states he will tunnel J (did he actually do this?)

Page 3: Seik and Soup state that they don't know each others alignment, Soup states Seik/Aposl/JTB scum. Soup is already reaching for scumSeik. BSL (now Nabe) disliking Soup. GLG willing to think Seik is scum as well. Soup claims him vs BSL is TvT.[/collapse]Better idea, I'll focus on a few specific players at a time and see who they take strong scum/town stances on, and why.

Main target? Soup. Reason? Because he's scum.


Soupamario:
-opens up saying he'll tunnel J. I don't remember this happening, maybe I'll find it in my reread.
-by page 3, states Seik/Aposl/JTB are scummy, doesn't clarify why.
-states BSL vs Soup is TvT because of BSLs tone in their little squabble.
-calls JTB obv scum because he joins the bandwagon on Seik
-nothing significant until page 11, where he continues to say JTB is his top scumpick, and then posts reads on a bunch of players.






/then I went to bed


The lack of activity ToDay is saddening.

 

[DtJ Glyphmoney]

Asdioh I'm not seeing how you're getting such a solid scum read on Soup based off the 5 points you listed, can you expand on that some?

 

[Asdioh]

that was only the beginning, it was his Late D1 stuff that was scummier. I just didn't finish my readthrough because it's so... intimidating. I've been trying to figure out the most effective way to read through this huge thread. I end up writing too much stuff instead of just pointing out the things that set alarm bells off the most.

 

[DtJ Glyphmoney]

Shoot for something like the three biggest points against him or something then. I'm very curious to see your train of thought.

 

[Pink Lemonade]

Can you say what you found scummiest about BSL? I remember him "rolefishing" as the scummiest thing he did, but other than that I can't really remember.

Along with the BSL rolefishing, there were the Glyph v. BSL interactions which were taking place at that time. Prior to the rolefishing incident BSL handled the pressure of going head to head with Glyph fine, but after getting called out on it his interactions with Glyph became less organized, he became less coherent and I generally saw him as more panicked. It was something I wanted to pursue and then he replaced out, and then honestly Nabe flew under my radar while he was catching up and then with all the wagons it was really easy to forget Nabe until the end of the Day (will discuss later).

Sorry if you think I should have defended JTB harder. I pushed that a J lynch was the FAR better choice than JTB.
As for the pros of not lynching J... where did that get us? We now have the predictable event of him claiming to be roleblocked, coupled with the unexpected but oh so convenient Pictures Only posting restriction... on the player who already posted pictures the most. x_x

I admit that the pros did not pan out like they could have. But I think it is important to consider what situation we could have come into Day 2 with, the possibility of Smarg and J still being alive and J with a watchers report...that would have been great, and I think the risk of holding out for that and hoping that there wasn't a roleblocker was a far better risk than lynching J and assuring our doc died (if she didn't or couldn't protect herself).

As for not defending JTB, my issue is more that you pushed so hard for J that it was tunnelly, whether you realized that or not.

Pro-town in that he was fundamental in getting both myself and Smarg to L-1, and thus to claim, while all the while not getting his hands dirty by bothering to post much reasoning for his scumpicks. Result? He found out who the doctor was, a VT was lynched, and all the while there is nothing super scummy to be found from him.

If you can't see what I'm getting at: I still think he's likely scum.

Understandable for viewing his playstyle as scummy, its minimalistic. However, pushing people who you find scummy and being wrong isn't scummy, so I don't find the fact that he helped push people to L-1 and honestly Smarg being scum wouldn't have surprised me, the fact that she was doctor took until she wasn't cc'ed for me to believe.

I remember him saying foolproof, but I don't remember him insisting there was no roleblocker?

It was more his insisting that the plan was foolproof and would work despite other people saying that it wasn't foolproof and there could be a roleblocker, which he dismissed for a long time yesterDay.

If J flips scum, does this clear Glyph in your eyes, or would you think it was a hardcore bus?
And my reasoning isn't legit if I simply agree with his reads on J, just because he got to it first?

I would consider Glyph pretty much clear in that situation, if not that is a hardcore bus both Days from both sides and I don't see that to be the case.

The bulk of your case against J seems to be after his watcher claim and tbh largely based in the same things as Glyph's suspicions, the fact is that Glyph's case screams scumhunting to me, even if I don't come to the same conclusions he does. Your case isn't clearly scumhunting, like I said I feel there was a lot of tunneling from you on J.

I'm listening, convince me.

Alright :D actually...I was going to include it in this post, but now I've pretty much launched into an ISO so I will post it in a separate post later tonight.

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

Hi Guys. Posting through my phone.

Asdioh, I'd Like to apologize.

You stated that u did not read your PM until April 1st, My whole Case was ur Scummy intentions before. U read ur PM, But u only stated 4 to 5 things on the 31st and they were just Fluff.

No pr crumb eiether.

Sorry for being bull headed, I just want to be use of town, not just do nothing.

I didn't like being ignored, so I got angry and rambled, I'm good now, just perhaps I should be less agreesive, and More clear.

 

[Asdioh]

Hi Guys. Posting through my phone.

Asdioh, I'd Like to apologize.

You stated that u did not read your PM until April 1st, My whole Case was ur Scummy intentions before. U read ur PM, But u only stated 4 to 5 things on the 31st and they were just Fluff.

No pr crumb eiether.

Sorry for being bull headed, I just want to be use of town, not just do nothing.

I didn't like being ignored, so I got angry and rambled, I'm good now, just perhaps I should be less agreesive, and More clear.

No, you're not wrong.

http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=12464103&postcount=642
^ Everything before this post, was when I didn't know my role.
Everything after and including this post, I knew my role.

 

[Asdioh]

unvote


Hopefully I can motivate myself to reread everything tomorrow.

Shoot for something like the three biggest points against him or something then. I'm very curious to see your train of thought.

One of my biggest concerns was that he just seemed to bandwagon whoever was currently being attacked, saying he was convinced by _____s case against that person, without going specifically into what parts convinced him. For example, when he voted for me or JTB.

I also still think it was extremely scummy how he put me to L-1 with little regard to how close he was to mislynching, with so much time left in the Day.

However, looking back, I see stuff such as him thinking JTB was scum from the beginning, so maybe it wasn't as much of a bandwagon as I thought late D1. I still think he needs to put more coherent reasoning into his scumpicks, but I'm not sure what to think atm. I'm going to try to reread tomorrow and see if my scumread on him stays as strong.


But before that, I want to see more from....

Same as D1, aside from the JTB and Smarg town flips which sour me to the people I listed as being scum with Smarg, obviously. I'll recap shortly. Soupscum though.


This is a really silly post, and you should feel bad.
Not as bad as Soup though, who is the play toDay.

People should talk about Soup and how he's scum.

Lol, PL. J can go, I don't care. At the end of the Day if you like.

Soup is scum though, talk more about that.

 

[Pink Lemonade]

Yeah, I can be caught up in the next couple hours if it's a rush, lol. But I'd rather go slowly and get a better sense of the timeframe and how things transpired.

I see my vote is on Glyph though, that's no good.

Vote: TDW

Alright so I assume he is in the process of reading, so maybe he found something about TDW that he disliked in the process. Of course we don't know because he doesn't explain the vote AT ALL.

Caps lock thing is good, keep doing that.


That was a good read, but really only served to make me feel worse about Pink Lemonade and no better about Asdioh.

Asdioh, has a proper case been made and framed for your lynch? Has anyone posted anything that qualifies, in your eyes? If so, have you responded to that case / those points against you?

So then after his reread he finds me more suspicious and feels no better about Asdioh; he gives no explanation for that random vote on TDW, and if I'm right (I didn't quote all of his posts) he doesn't unvote and vote either of his scum picks here.

Yes, I saw that reasoning in my read. What I was really looking for, though, was for you to continue to be supportive of this vote or otherwise acknowledge it, because prior to my read I saw that you were the only one voting for TDW.


This is ugly. This is an easy vote framed with easy logic, and it comes in the same post where you answer the question, "Why should someone vote for TDW".

Do you feel you tried adequately to convince people of a TDW lynch? If not, what was your intention in voting TDW to begin with? Is an Aposl lynch how you see the Day ending?


@Soup, Smarg convinced you that Aposl was a good vote, yes?

Do you feel you tried adequately to convince people of a BSL/Nabe lynch? If not, what was your intention in voting BSL to begin with? Has your opinion of my slot changed? Is an Aposl lynch how you see the Day ending?



I don't think it's odd that they're paying attention to Asdioh, but I do think more varied attention should be paid by them to others overall. After my interactions with Ran last night though, I'm content with their slot again and they aren't particularly a concern for me.

I think that this is interesting, and when I read this I know that Ran took a good vibe away from their interactions but I feel like what Nabe took away was that we are not a "concern for him" aka we are not going to pose a threat to him.

The earlier parts of the post are talking to Smarg, and this is where he first starts to suggest there may be something scummy about her.

Convinced I've been barking up the wrong trail and that Soup is town. Comfortable with either J or Asdioh.

Vote: Asdioh

Then we come down here and his stances have shifted all over the place again. He says he is convinced that Soup is town (which he came to determine through very little pressure) and that he is now comfortable with either J or Asdioh. Asdioh he had mentioned briefly earlier but this is the first time we see J popping up as a suspect. However, Asdioh gets the vote over J for no explicit reason.

Your play hasn't been to my liking. In another game, you made some very good and helpful posts, and your play here differed in that you didn't; your posts were shallow and too far in-between. You've picked things up since.

Most other important points against you have been addressed.

J seems like town to me. But I can see why people would see him as scummy, and I've been wrong about him before. There's an argument for him being scum with any of JTB/Pink/Glyph/You which is very compelling.

You're a better lynch to me, because you could be scum with the J group or with the Smarg group. You bridge the gap and are genuinely scummy aside from that, which imo J isn't.

Having the votes even at the moment is also a very compelling reason on its own, fyi.

o_O Right before this Nabe said he was comfortable with a J lynch. Nabe now thinks J is town, but provides a whole lot of reasons why J scum is possible and understandable buuut an Asdioh lynch is better. Nabe trying to cast doubt on J without actually getting involved or pushing for his lynch.

Oh gosh I like Seik's play all of a sudden. Glad to see support for the idea of Smargscum.
1059 is an ugly switch to Soup that coincides with the first person to really lay a vote on Smarg.

X1, check out the exchange that goes on in 1042 > Bottom of 1045 > 1052, i.e. TDW/Asdioh.

First time Nabe mentions Seikend, and he basis his read on Seikend on this one choice to support Smargscum? I don't like it, Nabe is just piecing together his reads on people as he goes based on if they agree or disagree with him.

J, what games have you played with Smarg before?
IMO her posts are inherently scummy; I've pointed out the recent ones. Her votes are weightless and shifty and opportunistic.

That said, the lynch isn't going anywhere. Asdioh is going.


JTB is scummier, X1 null. The GLG part of GLG hasn't been posting, I asked that earlier.

Check out JTB's 125, that's what started it for me. He makes sure to make a note of the fact that he's wagoning, specifically, and not voting of his own accord. He has a very different posting style from an ongoing game in which he was clearly town and flipped such.

I felt better about him after his 442 though, and after JTB v. Seik in which I thought Seik was scum. I now think it was probably TvT.

I like his lynch for connections to you, but your play has been alright. I liked your 409 in which you seemed to genuinely read Pink well -- supports the idea of J/Pink but otherwise looks pretty alright. I didn't like your 534 in which IMO you took a bit of an odd jump, but then I realized you were v/la at the time and it could be attributed to that.

So he gives up on the Smarg lynch not because he found Asdioh scummier, but because the Smarg lynch just wasn't going to take off (that ironically did end up taking place) and he needed a new target instead of, you know, pushing and getting his hands dirty.

Then he says that JTB is scummier than X1, with X1 being null, so I guess that puts JTB null leaning scummy?...but then he says he believes that JTB v. Seikend is probably town v. town so he must have a town read on JTB right? or at least leaning town? These two ideas in the same post really don't seem to line up.

1100 is a terrific example of why Aposl is town. He posted that quick, he's gutsy. Town recklessness.

Soup is probably town, but there's a terrific case for Smarg/Soup lying just out of reach and I really want to make it

He says Soup is probably town, okay he said that a little while ago. But now he infers that there is this faint semblance of a Smarg/Soup scum buddy option that he could make but he knows he would be reaching...but why even bring it up if you supposedly have a town read on Soup? That's not going to help him convince people Soup is town, if he really believed that.

Asdioh, you should claim if you haven't already, we're getting to that time.

Yeah, claim. Now.

That's cool.
Claim please, Asdioh, thanks.

Vote: Smarg
Oh hey look at that. Smarg is L-1.

So, Asdioh...remember when you said KevinM had a large part in getting you and Smarg to L-1 and getting you guys to claim? I would say that Nabe was much more insistent on getting claims from people and in getting Smarg to L-1.

J, nothing inherently scummy about your wagon. However, the people who unvoted Smarg prior without picking a new vote need to be looked at. Seik, Soup, TDW, PL, and JTB who unvoted a full 20-ish posts later.

Asdioh, who's your lynch for toDay?

Those five are scummy for doing what I said. I'd take any of their lynches. Currently however, Asdioh's the lynch until he answers my question.

He called Seik town. He called Soup town. He really didn't take a stance on TDW after that initial vote. He had previously said we were not a concern for him. And JTB we saw last time as null leaning scummy or town v. Seikend. Yet he's willing to let ANY of these people get lynched while vaguely pushing his scum pick Asdioh. And all because they didn't unvote within 20 posts of Smarg claiming, that is enough to erase his previous reads and make them scummy enough they can be lynched.

JTB and Soup.

Soup's play has been different from his other games, IMO, and I was curious if he had noticed a change himself.

These are Nabe's two scummy picks out of the five people he said could go. We know how JTB flipped. His stance on Soup changed again from scummy, to town, now suddenly to scummy again...his reads are really inconsistent.

Kind of sick of the doc/watcher combo, to be honest. Deciding who's town and who's scum out of that makes me cringe every time. I don't want that in lylo. I'd rather lose the PRs and play a decent vanilla game and not have to think about that.

But JTB's responses are ugly and it's altogether better to get rid of him and keep the PRs.

Vote: JTB

I've already talked about this quote in another post, but he complains about doc/watcher combo and says he'd rather lose prs and play a vanilla game, but then he immediately vote JTB and decides to "keep the prs".

Lol, PL. J can go, I don't care. At the end of the Day if you like.

Soup is scum though, talk more about that.

His response to my noticing that he keeps hinting at J scum but won't vote J or act on any of the issues he has with J. He then immediately diverts talk away from J to focus on his idea that Soup is scum.

If Nabe would flip scum, there is a really strong connection between him and J. A Nabe scum flip would also make me think that Soup is town. Nabe town flip would make me suspicious of Soup in particular.

 

[Asdioh]

So, Asdioh...remember when you said KevinM had a large part in getting you and Smarg to L-1 and getting you guys to claim? I would say that Nabe was much more insistent on getting claims from people and in getting Smarg to L-1.

Oh yes, but Kevin was more of a key factor in getting the ball rolling on the wagons, so to speak. He would come in, say or vote who he thought was scum, and then sit back and watch the magic happen, as others joined the bandwagon. He also hasn't admitted to being wrong or anything like that. Like, he was part of the reason the wagon on me got so large, and then later he presumably decided I wasn't scum, or there were much scummier, so he unvotes me and votes someone else, without explanation for why his view changed.
I do remember Nabe (and later Seik) getting on me about claiming though.

I've already talked about this quote in another post, but he complains about doc/watcher combo and says he'd rather lose prs and play a vanilla game, but then he immediately vote JTB and decides to "keep the prs".

I could kind of agree with him risking it, but the fact that he decided to say that and then keep the PRs anyway I don't like.

His response to my noticing that he keeps hinting at J scum but won't vote J or act on any of the issues he has with J. He then immediately diverts talk away from J to focus on his idea that Soup is scum.

If Nabe would flip scum, there is a really strong connection between him and J. A Nabe scum flip would also make me think that Soup is town. Nabe town flip would make me suspicious of Soup in particular.

So, I like your points. That was a pretty good post.
Who is this, btw?


I'll wait for Nabes response now.

I'll also wait for the inactives to un-inactive tomorrow I hope >=(

 

[Pink Lemonade]

@Asdioh: All of Day 2 so far has been July (including this post lol)

 

[KevinM]

Asdioh are you implying I'm scummy for not apologizing for being wrong on a D1 lynch?

Nice redirection attempt.

 

[Asdioh]

Asdioh are you implying I'm scummy for not apologizing for being wrong on a D1 lynch?

Nice redirection attempt.

He would come in, say or vote who he thought was scum, and then sit back and watch the magic happen, as others joined the bandwagon. He also hasn't admitted to being wrong or anything like that. Like, he was part of the reason the wagon on me got so large, and then later he presumably decided I wasn't scum, or there were much scummier, so he unvotes me and votes someone else, without explanation for why his view changed.

you don't have to apologize, you have to explain the thought process behind your few and far between actions or I AM going to think you're scum.

Redirecting from...?

 

[#HBC | Nabe]

Why do you people keep taaaalking

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

Sucks to be you Nabe, i'm gonna post a J ISO.

 

[Seikend]

@Nabe How confident are you in Soup scum exactly?

 

[#HBC | Nabe]

That's cool.
Not at all necessary, since everybody knows why J's scummy already.
But if you want to look like you're contributing, I'm down with that.
So, cool.

 

[#HBC | Nabe]

Seik: I am very confident lol. Not going to quantify it.

 

[Seikend]

'kay. I think I'm with you.


Let me do a re-read.

 

[#HBC | Nabe]

I appreciate it. Having to do actual work to prove someone is scum, bleh, who does that? Not me.

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

how nice of you nabe, i have been contributing.

i decided that i'm not going to post the ISO, as i've already posted enough today, so yeah.

i'm posting the ISO not just for scummy intentions, but also for town intentions, and who has talked with J or had conflicts.

i'm posting it for my own understanding, because i need to decide if my Town read stays, or i flip scum, even now as i'm posting this, and re-reading, i'm still sure of town.

/waits for nabe.