DKwill
Smash Lord
- Joined
- May 23, 2008
- Messages
- 1,232
- Location
- Planking the ledge 185 times over.
- 3DS FC
- 3497-1934-6087
Okay guys, I won't know officially for at least a week or so, but I'm applying to get into E3 2012. Wish me luck =x
-
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Big secret muscles
- Thread starter Scabe
- Start date
Ruinn
Smash Ace
WELP, DK moved down 5 spots. might as well pick a new main guys.
waldorf2007
Smash Ace
yeah im maining wario now **** monkeys. i only play civilized gentleman wario now.
Hahaha oh DK. I swear DK just has a really bad relation with the BBR or with Tier lists in general. He is probably the easiest character in the game to say "Well we want to rise other people up. We can probably just move DK down."
waldorf2007
Smash Ace
loolol true there's practically no argument, it just feels right. hmm, X did good in tourney, move DK down one. why? well, dude, it's like....DK. just...move him
play wario.
play wario.
I honestly don't care anymore what spot DK is on the tier list.
Not because I don't trust the BBR or their capability to rate characters, but for the simple fact that it has no effect on me. At most, DK dropping down will only make people underestimate him as a character, which in fact, might even put us in an advantageous position.
Another thing that we middle level players usually take for granted is that the characters tier list placings accurately correspond their their use in play. The rankings are more influenced by high/top level players due to the fact that these use the most of their characters potential. DK being in the lower corner of middle tier has no big significance to us (and by us I mean myself and anyone else who recognizes themselves as mid-lvl).
I'm co-maining DK alongside Wario but recently I have been leaning more towards Wario due to the sheer fact that people here have learned how to slay the ape. Sometimes DKs new gimmicks might work, but nowdays players learn to counter them or otherwise just make DKs life extra hard.
I'm also playing Pika for some MUs.
Not because I don't trust the BBR or their capability to rate characters, but for the simple fact that it has no effect on me. At most, DK dropping down will only make people underestimate him as a character, which in fact, might even put us in an advantageous position.
Another thing that we middle level players usually take for granted is that the characters tier list placings accurately correspond their their use in play. The rankings are more influenced by high/top level players due to the fact that these use the most of their characters potential. DK being in the lower corner of middle tier has no big significance to us (and by us I mean myself and anyone else who recognizes themselves as mid-lvl).
I'm co-maining DK alongside Wario but recently I have been leaning more towards Wario due to the sheer fact that people here have learned how to slay the ape. Sometimes DKs new gimmicks might work, but nowdays players learn to counter them or otherwise just make DKs life extra hard.
I'm also playing Pika for some MUs.
Player-1
Smash Legend
DK is bad cuz he loses to Ivysaur -3
Neon!
Smash Lord
For anyone who wants an explanation for DK's movement, heres what i posted in the new tier list thread:
For the formation of the BBR matchup chart V 2.0 there were 4 players chosen to decide on DK’s ratios. Ook, Will, Ripple and Me. I made 70% of the posts out of all the DK’s, Ook posted maybe two or three times, Ripple responded often but rarely in more than two or three sentences. Will posted a few times but not in any of the important matchups that were decided against us. I myself was in between characters during the course of the discussions and switched between having very pessimistic views of DK to very optimistic.
1/3 of the cast tried to increase their rating against Dk in their favor and many of them got their wish, some rightfully some not. Important matchups like DK vs GW were decided against us by ONE post from Vinnie who basically said “this matchup is +1 GW, Will will agree with me” If I remember correctly Will had a positive or near even record against Vinnie before he picked up ice climbers. Other matchups like DK vs PT were decided against us because PT had more respected players like Reflex while DK had only me. The few times Will actually posted, the opponents would often argue that he was an outlier even though there have been many players that have performed at his level: Cable, Dr. G and most recently Nairo. None of these players are currently active unfortunately.
The four matchups that most DK’s will have a problem with are. GW, PT, Snake, Fox. These are the only four that I firmly believe are wrong.
Pit, Kirby, Sonic, Wolf, Falco and Pika could be argued another point in our favor if DK were to play the matchup nearly flawless but I’m not particularly determined to win those cases by myself.
All the posts about DK losing points in the matchup chart due to DK not having enough representation are true. If I was a more accomplished player or if well-known players like Will or Cable had posted more than DK’s standing would be a bit more optimistic.
For the formation of the BBR matchup chart V 2.0 there were 4 players chosen to decide on DK’s ratios. Ook, Will, Ripple and Me. I made 70% of the posts out of all the DK’s, Ook posted maybe two or three times, Ripple responded often but rarely in more than two or three sentences. Will posted a few times but not in any of the important matchups that were decided against us. I myself was in between characters during the course of the discussions and switched between having very pessimistic views of DK to very optimistic.
1/3 of the cast tried to increase their rating against Dk in their favor and many of them got their wish, some rightfully some not. Important matchups like DK vs GW were decided against us by ONE post from Vinnie who basically said “this matchup is +1 GW, Will will agree with me” If I remember correctly Will had a positive or near even record against Vinnie before he picked up ice climbers. Other matchups like DK vs PT were decided against us because PT had more respected players like Reflex while DK had only me. The few times Will actually posted, the opponents would often argue that he was an outlier even though there have been many players that have performed at his level: Cable, Dr. G and most recently Nairo. None of these players are currently active unfortunately.
The four matchups that most DK’s will have a problem with are. GW, PT, Snake, Fox. These are the only four that I firmly believe are wrong.
Pit, Kirby, Sonic, Wolf, Falco and Pika could be argued another point in our favor if DK were to play the matchup nearly flawless but I’m not particularly determined to win those cases by myself.
All the posts about DK losing points in the matchup chart due to DK not having enough representation are true. If I was a more accomplished player or if well-known players like Will or Cable had posted more than DK’s standing would be a bit more optimistic.
D
Deleted member 189823
Guest
Dude DK sucks don't even bother.
Do you trust them on that? Haha. Anyways I think a big reason that we've fallen is it's a known fact that the BBR doesn't consider the roles stages play in match-ups. I.E. DK:Falco would be a really bad match-up on Smashville, which is considered a very standard stage. But the only time Falco gets to play us on Smashville is on his counterpick. That'd be like if we judged match-ups assuming we were starting on Yoshi's Island.
Oh and also we have no representation as Neon mentioned. Squeaky wheels and the like.
Also I took 1st in singles at a local tourney I was at today, and I took 2nd in doubles. Good day for me.
GOofyGV
Smash Lord
it's a bit sad how they punish dk at this time.
Ruinn
Smash Ace
any vids gonna be up?
Neon!
Smash Lord
Pulled off the CRAZIEST combo on a falco today. Rofl-copter to jab lock to fsmash for the kill.
I'll probably make another combo video this summer.
I'll probably make another combo video this summer.
No I don't think anything got recorded. Someone was supposed to bring some recording equipment but that didn't happen. It's a shame, I had some good moments and my matches were tense.
Like in Winner's Semis last game last stock I was down 160% to 0% and made the comeback happen, and not through a bull**** early kill or anything. I lived somewhere into the mid 200%s every stock of that game. I mean, it was vs Diddy Kong but w/e. I also beat Diddy Kong on FD that day. Also beat someone who tried to pick DDD on me. Landed about 3 9-winds in total. Other than that I just played really solid, no incredible combos or anything really. Except in doubles I had the beeest team combos.
If anything what I took out of this tourney is how important Up-b and down-b really are to our games. Not so much because of actually hitting with them, although they do nice damage. They really help in conditioning your opponent to stop rolling into you/spot dodging, and conditioning them to limit their options or to hesitate on doing them makes it so much easier to read them.
Like in Winner's Semis last game last stock I was down 160% to 0% and made the comeback happen, and not through a bull**** early kill or anything. I lived somewhere into the mid 200%s every stock of that game. I mean, it was vs Diddy Kong but w/e. I also beat Diddy Kong on FD that day. Also beat someone who tried to pick DDD on me. Landed about 3 9-winds in total. Other than that I just played really solid, no incredible combos or anything really. Except in doubles I had the beeest team combos.
If anything what I took out of this tourney is how important Up-b and down-b really are to our games. Not so much because of actually hitting with them, although they do nice damage. They really help in conditioning your opponent to stop rolling into you/spot dodging, and conditioning them to limit their options or to hesitate on doing them makes it so much easier to read them.
Ruinn
Smash Ace
I was down 114% today against a rob on yoshis, pulled of some nice crap and took his entire stock in about 10 seconds without taking any damage. the rob was astonished afterwards. today was a good day for our fellow dks.
Attila the Hun
Smash Ace
Had my tourney on Saturday.
In seriouslies I went completely even with KillLock's Marf, and in tourney I 2-0'd Busy's Wario. Sadly, no replies either, unless the guy whose wii I played the seriouslies on puts up me punch shieldbreaking KillLock, then down taunt -> 9-wind. xD
alsodamnstuyoufiiiiine.
In seriouslies I went completely even with KillLock's Marf, and in tourney I 2-0'd Busy's Wario. Sadly, no replies either, unless the guy whose wii I played the seriouslies on puts up me punch shieldbreaking KillLock, then down taunt -> 9-wind. xD
alsodamnstuyoufiiiiine.
Neon!
Smash Lord
Ruinn
Smash Ace
dat rob kickass.
Neon!
Smash Lord
lol I see it now.
Attila the Hun
Smash Ace
19 now! :D
Happy Birthday! <3 you~
Attila the Hun
Smash Ace
<3 you moreee, you cute Asian, you. 
Ruinn
Smash Ace
now go get laid you loser.
haha jokes hbd man
haha jokes hbd man
Attila the Hun
Smash Ace
Savin' it for marriage, dawg.
And shanks. :3
And shanks. :3
Neon!
Smash Lord
smart man.
payasofobia
Smash Champion
Ha ha, Donkey Kong is a gorilla.
Neon!
Smash Lord
On one of my exams today the teacher made 4 different sets of exams to discourage cheating. Instead of calling them just Test A, B, C... she gave them a letter and a number. My exam just happened to be called Test D3 and it absolutely destroyed me, no joke.
Ingulit
Ing-u-lit
So I'm trying to figure out what each character can do with Diddy's Bananas, and I'm going around to each character's board asking this: does your character have any fun combos or tricks they can do specifically with Bananas? If not, you might look into it; it'd be useful both for the Diddy MU and for Doubles when your partner is a Diddy.
waldorf2007
Smash Ace
we have tons, using bananas is glorious. besides drops and stuff like that, our glide toss gets free down smash and maybe f smash.
My favorite thing to do though is once diddy is at 105 or so, you can grab his banana, then wait.
as he attacks, jump, drop it, land behind and go for a grab. if you get it, you cargo and wait, and diddy will fall onto the banana and trip. you can slightly charge a dsmash and it's like a free kill.
My favorite thing to do though is once diddy is at 105 or so, you can grab his banana, then wait.
as he attacks, jump, drop it, land behind and go for a grab. if you get it, you cargo and wait, and diddy will fall onto the banana and trip. you can slightly charge a dsmash and it's like a free kill.
Neon!
Smash Lord
An unusual but very useful tactic that almost no DK's utilize is our ability to grab diddy-cargo hold and place him in front of a banana where he then breaks out of our grab, and trips. This allows us to punish with any number of moves, most notably dsmash or punch.
DK has an incredibly long glide toss shorter than GW's but longer than rob's I believe. The best punish we can net off of a glide toss is a fully charged punch.
http://youtu.be/1fU0VUszwew?t=7m40s
Unfortunately both of these tactics can be hard to setup and DK's throwing animation is incredibly slow, most of the time it's best for DK to just throw the banana up, Z-drop it or throw it off the stage.
waldorf2007
Smash Ace
I use the banana cargo drop all the time. If I'm in the middle of the stage the opponent doesn't think that I'm gonna cargo off stage so I can walk a good distance to a banana.
Attila the Hun
Smash Ace
Never thought of the cargo drop, tbh. Would be mad flashy to pull off.
Also Neon, that's friggin' hilarious that you got D3. Eff that guy.
Also Neon, that's friggin' hilarious that you got D3. Eff that guy.
zyth
Smash Lord
a real dousche would pummel, cargo hold in fron of the banana grab again repeat till the banana is gone
waldorf2007
Smash Ace
I've done that too at lower percentages. it really pisses off the opponent, it's like regrabbing with ness, but more annoying. Usually by the time I can get the grab, though, the banana has started to fade. if the opponent knows this and has gotten caught before, he'll wait. at 100% diddy can sit in the cargo for like 8 seconds.
Ruinn
Smash Ace
took you guys' cargo tip and did it on a diddy today. so satisfying.
GOofyGV
Smash Lord
I was always thinking for a sub back when I was a dk main.
and I actualy thought about it this week.
I would like to share this with the boards
Must haves:
An good olimar mu(at least even)
An good ddd mu(at least even)
An doable mk mu(At least -1)
things that would be helpfull:
an good IC mu
an Good wario mu
an good Falco mu
so I was actualy making whrite ups for some sub characters and here they are.
MK:
anyone knows that mk is the best character. And yet he is an great sub for dk.
He counters every character and goes even with pikachu. He plays a samilar style.(No projectile and great range and stuff)He also isn't to hard to learn. MK doesn't really has any disadvantage except that everyone know the mu with him really well. And there are regios his is banned.
If mk is allowed in your state it would be one of your best options.
Olimar:
Olimar is a great sub as well. He ***** d3, And does really well vs Mk he also has the ditto vs himself. The 3 mu's we need him for can be done with this character. but if you are bad vs IC as dk or you just hate falco you might want to use someone else. This character doesn't take to much time to learn but will give a good reward.
Diddy kong:
be original and main both the kongs
diddy kong goes really even with mk possibly best mu with mk after pikachu.He goes even vs olimar and he beats d3. This character is at the other hand not that easy to learn so if you want to play soo time to learn him is needed.He does good vs IC and falco. He truly only lose vs mk in the mu which is still an good mu for him.
Falco:
Falco beats Olimar and d3. He goes almost even vs mk.
This is one of the best options avaiable. The disadvantages are that falco has bad mu's vs IC and pikachu.
If these 2 characters are a problem for you don't bother falco.Falco is technical so training his AT's is needed.
IC:
The most difficult sub you can learn. But the sacond best after mk.
the only really bad thing is that they are so hard to learn.
They counter falco,Olimar and are d3's worst mu. they do well vs mk.
but they seem to suffer from stage which can be a problem.
Snake:
Ok snake isn''t that great tbh. Snake loses vs olimar, loses to d3 and loses to mk.
he is not to hard to use but I do not see any reason to tke him. There are probably better options.
Marth:
Marth is like snake not the best choise.
He goes even with Olimar,Loses to d3 and loses to mk.
I don't have to say much about marth.
Wario:
Wario is probably the worst option for a sub ou of top tiers. He loses badly to d3,goes even wit hOlimar and loses badly to mk. The only reason to really go him is if you really strugle vs olimar. But there are much better options.
Pikachu:
ok Pikachu is aavarage.
He beats d3 and goes even vs d3. But loses vs Olimar.
Pikachu isn't bad but a character like Diddy kong or falco who also have a good mk mu and a better Olimar mu might be better.
Difficult order: IC,Diddy kong,Falco,Marth,Olimar,Pikachu,Wario,Snake,MK
order of how good they work: MK,IC,Falco,Diddy kong,Olimar,Pikachu,Marth,Snake,Wario
just some litle thinking from me. It might be useless but if someone can use it.
and I actualy thought about it this week.
I would like to share this with the boards
Must haves:
An good olimar mu(at least even)
An good ddd mu(at least even)
An doable mk mu(At least -1)
things that would be helpfull:
an good IC mu
an Good wario mu
an good Falco mu
so I was actualy making whrite ups for some sub characters and here they are.
MK:
anyone knows that mk is the best character. And yet he is an great sub for dk.
He counters every character and goes even with pikachu. He plays a samilar style.(No projectile and great range and stuff)He also isn't to hard to learn. MK doesn't really has any disadvantage except that everyone know the mu with him really well. And there are regios his is banned.
If mk is allowed in your state it would be one of your best options.
Olimar:
Olimar is a great sub as well. He ***** d3, And does really well vs Mk he also has the ditto vs himself. The 3 mu's we need him for can be done with this character. but if you are bad vs IC as dk or you just hate falco you might want to use someone else. This character doesn't take to much time to learn but will give a good reward.
Diddy kong:
be original and main both the kongs
diddy kong goes really even with mk possibly best mu with mk after pikachu.He goes even vs olimar and he beats d3. This character is at the other hand not that easy to learn so if you want to play soo time to learn him is needed.He does good vs IC and falco. He truly only lose vs mk in the mu which is still an good mu for him.
Falco:
Falco beats Olimar and d3. He goes almost even vs mk.
This is one of the best options avaiable. The disadvantages are that falco has bad mu's vs IC and pikachu.
If these 2 characters are a problem for you don't bother falco.Falco is technical so training his AT's is needed.
IC:
The most difficult sub you can learn. But the sacond best after mk.
the only really bad thing is that they are so hard to learn.
They counter falco,Olimar and are d3's worst mu. they do well vs mk.
but they seem to suffer from stage which can be a problem.
Snake:
Ok snake isn''t that great tbh. Snake loses vs olimar, loses to d3 and loses to mk.
he is not to hard to use but I do not see any reason to tke him. There are probably better options.
Marth:
Marth is like snake not the best choise.
He goes even with Olimar,Loses to d3 and loses to mk.
I don't have to say much about marth.
Wario:
Wario is probably the worst option for a sub ou of top tiers. He loses badly to d3,goes even wit hOlimar and loses badly to mk. The only reason to really go him is if you really strugle vs olimar. But there are much better options.
Pikachu:
ok Pikachu is aavarage.
He beats d3 and goes even vs d3. But loses vs Olimar.
Pikachu isn't bad but a character like Diddy kong or falco who also have a good mk mu and a better Olimar mu might be better.
Difficult order: IC,Diddy kong,Falco,Marth,Olimar,Pikachu,Wario,Snake,MK
order of how good they work: MK,IC,Falco,Diddy kong,Olimar,Pikachu,Marth,Snake,Wario
just some litle thinking from me. It might be useless but if someone can use it.
1PokeMastr
Smash Champion
- Joined
- Dec 10, 2009
- Messages
- 2,251
I AM known to play a lot of Characters, but, the character spread that I have found that covers everything for me is..
My Main ->
Falco.
My Secondaries ->
Dk/ Marth/ D3.
This combination covers everything for me.
I'll try and get into detail for this.
What I will say is. Don't bother trying to learn Dacus/ BDacus if you plan on learning Falco until you can master his Basics.
If you want an AT, get down the perfect SHDL timing, and that's it.
For the Gatling Combo, Just C-Stick Down -> Up in quick succession if the Dash attack is going to hit.
My Main ->
Falco.
My Secondaries ->
Dk/ Marth/ D3.
This combination covers everything for me.
I'll try and get into detail for this.
What I will say is. Don't bother trying to learn Dacus/ BDacus if you plan on learning Falco until you can master his Basics.
If you want an AT, get down the perfect SHDL timing, and that's it.
For the Gatling Combo, Just C-Stick Down -> Up in quick succession if the Dash attack is going to hit.
waldorf2007
Smash Ace
So I tried out Wifi today, it was probably one of the worst experiences I've had in the recent years. first time in a year or two, even worse than I remember. If any DKs feel like playing and they're East coast, hit me up here or AiB. I already saw Ruinn on AiB lol.