Balanced Brawl Version 2 Release

[A2ZOMG]

The knockdown part is essential in my opinion because that is when you are allowed to DI hits, which makes the move less polarizing at ledges and against walls.

Otherwise I guess if you're going to avoid the whole knockdown issue, then angle at liek...65 would be more appropriate just for the sake of ensuring that Bowser isn't using this move for silly wall/gimp shenanigans. The current angle is about 55.

 

[LordShade67]

Why is this hack so underrated? It's actually fun. D:

Anywho, I've tried it out,and needless to say,I enjoy it :D
My only real complaint is that this seriously needs its own Strap Loader.Though being a Texture Hacker,I can do this if you guys want.And suggestions would be nice :3

 

[Last Elixir]

Is there a place for sharing Friend Codes to play this online with people? I am interested in playing with more than the few people I hang out with, and the chatroom at the mod's site is absolutely dead.

EDIT: AmazingAmpharos, I read your post a few pages back about whether or not to make BBrawl 3, and would like to pitch in that my little circle of friends and myself have been playing strictly BBrawl for the last 6 or so months and have had no urge to go back. Also we tried B+ for a few months and decided that we didn't like all of the massive changes to physics/etc, so, to put it simply, we would love to see another version of BBrawl released and think that it is an amazing patch to the game!

 

[Rainierman]

Hello guys, I don't think I can ask any favors before saying truthfully that I'm extremely thankful for the existence of this project and that you (AA and Thinkaman) really saved Brawl for me. Words fall short here, really.

Anyways, I want to give this more justice by playing it more, but I have a couple of worries that I didn't want to bother anyone for, yet I couldn't really manage on my own (and I tried plenty) so, here they go.

First, on a cousin's Wii, I tried BBrawl through Stack Brawl and I was surprised to see that stickers were falling in the middle of the battle. When I play it in mine, no stickers show up, which was something I thought too bad, 'cause I'm missing only 7 (I think, maybe 12) and while I stopped playing vBrawl, I still would like to get them without farming for them.

So, the question is: Which of the 2 is the "normal" BBrawl behavior? Stickers or no stickers? I personally would like to have them falling down, but in either case, because I'm sure someone would rather the other than the current: Which is the code for adding/removing them? So we can edit our Gct's accordingly.

One down. The other worry of mine would be, though not really a worry but a whim, is how to edit ourselves the default match settings? For example, to leave the Stock Time Limit in infinite and start with 4 Stock Matches by default? Those are what I would use them for (because when not playing on a tourny, the limit isn't really necessary for me) but, just curious how to edit them all in general. I ask "in general" because I'd like if more people apart from me would find this post useful.

Well thanks in advance for the answers and, more importantly, thanks a LOT for your efforts on this. You guys are great (and I won't change my mind about this even if you don't help me, lol).

 

[A2ZOMG]

Unfortunately there isn't really a place to share friend codes. Coming by this topic and getting more attention from people however might attract some bored players. Like myself. =P

Also, stickers randomly dropping doesn't make sense. As long as all items are off and set to none, and you have the correct files in your SD card, there shouldn't be anything of that sort.

I wish I was on the BBrawl chat more...I just keep forgetting.

 

[LegendofLink]

Yeah, I think that you just had items set to high, but all items turned off, this means that bonus items like stickers and CD's can still drop.

Edit: I didn't feel the need to double post to say this, so:

I finally got this to work for the first time today* and I really do like how it plays, especially the fact that so many characters are given more options for mobility and approach, while the ones who weren't had their current one's improved or left as an inherent weakness of the character. It freshened up game play without resorting to Brawl+ levels of reworks (not that Brawl+ wasn't good, it just changed too much for my tastes).

It was interesting, however to see casual player's reactions to the mod. For exmple, when I told them that overpowered characters were nerfed and everyone else buffed, one of their first questions was if Ike was nerfed. I guess so many 4-player games with that one Ike spamming f-smashes while everyone else is occupied and getting lots of kills can have that effect on people. Overall, the changes were subtle enough to keep casual games pretty much the same, except for frequent Captain Falcon and Ganondorf players who treated the armor on their punches like it was Christmas, and everyone needed to take a couple of matches to adjust to that.




*(long story short, I learned two things:
1) The un-updated Wii I have access to in college can't read SDHC cards.
2) I needed to remove the files from the enclosing "BalancedBrawl2" folder so that the Wii can find the files and boot up the mod.)

 

[Last Elixir]

Unfortunately there isn't really a place to share friend codes. Coming by this topic and getting more attention from people however might attract some bored players. Like myself. =P

Also, stickers randomly dropping doesn't make sense. As long as all items are off and set to none, and you have the correct files in your SD card, there shouldn't be anything of that sort.

I wish I was on the BBrawl chat more...I just keep forgetting.

Well, if that's the case, I wouldn't mind exchanging codes with ya, and seeing if I am any good outside of my circle of friends sometime. Next time I'm on my Wii, I will add you, and maybe set up a fight or two sometime!

 

[A2ZOMG]

Well, if that's the case, I wouldn't mind exchanging codes with ya, and seeing if I am any good outside of my circle of friends sometime. Next time I'm on my Wii, I will add you, and maybe set up a fight or two sometime!

You'd have some way of being in contact with me at the moment since I'd be borrowing someone else's Wii to do Wifi. Or you would have to wait for holidays like Thanksgiving or Winter Break when I get back home from school.

 

[Amazing Ampharos]

I'm happy to hear the positive feedback! I'm glad people are having some fun playing the game; after all, that's a lot of the point of Smash in general.

Yeah, the stickers are just a setting in the items menu.

In BBrawl, you can still change the rules to whatever you want like in standard Brawl (our code only changes what they start as, for the sake of convenience). If you want to change our code, the code in question is "Default Settings Standard". There is probably a post somewhere on the forums explaining how to vary parameters on it.

Sorry if we haven't been all that present. We are, however, beginning to work on BBrawl 3 and are pursuing something fairly bold. Unfortunately, we really can't talk much about it at all, but if we can do what we're wanting to do, no one will be complaining to say the least. If we can't do it, well, it will make a good story! In the meantime, I hope you all continue to enjoy BBrawl 2. I can confidently stand behind it as a pretty solid game.

 

[rPSIvysaur]

Trust me, they have some pretty good stories. lmao

 

[Last Elixir]

I'm happy to hear the positive feedback! I'm glad people are having some fun playing the game; after all, that's a lot of the point of Smash in general.

Yeah, the stickers are just a setting in the items menu.

In BBrawl, you can still change the rules to whatever you want like in standard Brawl (our code only changes what they start as, for the sake of convenience). If you want to change our code, the code in question is "Default Settings Standard". There is probably a post somewhere on the forums explaining how to vary parameters on it.

Sorry if we haven't been all that present. We are, however, beginning to work on BBrawl 3 and are pursuing something fairly bold. Unfortunately, we really can't talk much about it at all, but if we can do what we're wanting to do, no one will be complaining to say the least. If we can't do it, well, it will make a good story! In the meantime, I hope you all continue to enjoy BBrawl 2. I can confidently stand behind it as a pretty solid game.

Well, to say the least, I am certainly looking forward to hearing about it, whether you can implement it or not. You seem to do pretty good work with this stuff!

 

[A2ZOMG]

Random thought about Snake's F-tilt:

The best way to nerf it is not necessarily by changing the damage on its hits, but rather increasing the knockback of the first hit so that it knocks people into the air (or changing the knockback angle to say 90 and then giving it much lower knockback). Because the air hitbox of Snake's F-tilt is significantly weaker than the grounded hitbox, this effectively gives Snake's F-tilt the damage nerf it deserves when it's used as a one-two combo in close range, while leaving Snake the option of simply hitting grounded opponents with hit 2 when he needs a high knockback option or something to push shielding opponents. This also should ideally make Snake's F-tilt less gimmicky, removing it's obscure trip mechanic.

I would suggest this in exchange for removing 1 point of damage from Snake's grenades (which are on common3.pac). Brawl minus was able to edit Snakes grenades, and I think that would be an appropriate course of action for this game as well.

 

[Rainierman]

Woah, for some reason I've been always under the impression stickers never stopped appearing, even with items off. It's so weird now realizing that it's a standard Brawl thing when I thought it was BB's doing. Sorry for the bother. I guess I'll Subspace Emissary the remaining stickers, because I don't want to force myself or my friends to play with items on when we don't feel like it (we like items though).

Well, other than "vBrawl" freezing in the stage selection with the SD in for some reason, which you probably already know about anyways, I have no reports with which I can contribute on.

Although, reading about the reasoning of some changes, perhaps I should tell you this, even though it might not be of your concern. It's a vBrawl issue with Sheik (that prevails in BBrawl) that a friend of mine found and I tested (it might already be known, however). When you RUN towards the ledge of the stage (I tested only with Final Destination though), roll dodge so you are cut short by the ledge and stand up facing to the center, AND immediately start charging Sheik's needles, Sheik will slide and fall down 'while' still charging the needles. [Edit: Thinking about it, this maybe happens to all fast characters and I didn't test enough] I'm not sure if such thing can be found a real practical use, more than just be a plain bother (and a good way to suicide). Yet maybe this should remain unchanged, though I just wanted to be sure you guys knew about this behavior, and if you already did sorry. That's all I've got for now. =/

Good luck guys.

 

[Last Elixir]

Actually, I have a pretty similar question about a little thing that always bugged me with certain moves. I thought it was quite nice that Zelda no longer goes into special fall when she casts Din's Fire, but then was wondering what the reasoning is behind Ness/Lucas still going into special fall upon using PK Flash/Freeze?

 

[LordshadowRagnarok]

I'm happy to hear the positive feedback! I'm glad people are having some fun playing the game; after all, that's a lot of the point of Smash in general.

Yeah, the stickers are just a setting in the items menu.

In BBrawl, you can still change the rules to whatever you want like in standard Brawl (our code only changes what they start as, for the sake of convenience). If you want to change our code, the code in question is "Default Settings Standard". There is probably a post somewhere on the forums explaining how to vary parameters on it.

Sorry if we haven't been all that present. We are, however, beginning to work on BBrawl 3 and are pursuing something fairly bold. Unfortunately, we really can't talk much about it at all, but if we can do what we're wanting to do, no one will be complaining to say the least. If we can't do it, well, it will make a good story! In the meantime, I hope you all continue to enjoy BBrawl 2. I can confidently stand behind it as a pretty solid game.

Any chance for an optional download that allows for the Expanded stage roster code?

 

[LordshadowRagnarok]

"vBrawl" freezing in the stage selection with the SD in

Sorry for double post, but let me guess, you load BBrawl through the stage editor, right? Having that stage on the SD card will cause VBrawl to freeze when it gets to the stage select screen.

 

[Tenshi]

Lol, I have Balanced Brawl and I got it from a tournament. It's not anything special, it makes battles lag more.

 

[Amazing Ampharos]

Lol, I have Balanced Brawl and I got it from a tournament. It's not anything special, it makes battles lag more.

Uh, explain? Brawl doesn't lag at all offline, and my fairly extensive online play of Bbrawl tells me it doesn't cause additional lag (though there's still a lot of lag since online netcode in Brawl is terrible, and we didn't improve it).

---

Yes, Smash Stack causes freezing issues if the code "No Custom Stages" isn't on. Please remove the SD card if you are not playing BBrawl to avoid this issue.

---

At one time, we were going to make such a change for Ness and Lucas, but it wouldn't really have any practical utility for them. For the next release, one of the things we are looking into doing is rebuilding animations so the transitions are smooth, and that change would be a real work increase for no real benefit to the game. What we did do for those moves, increasing knockback parameters and changing the angle on Pk Freeze, was significantly more helpful for what use those moves have (Pk Freeze is secretly pretty good in BBrawl doubles!).

 

[Tenshi]

Uh, explain? Brawl doesn't lag at all offline, and my fairly extensive online play of Bbrawl tells me it doesn't cause additional lag (though there's still a lot of lag since online netcode in Brawl is terrible, and we didn't improve it).

---

Yes, Smash Stack causes freezing issues if the code "No Custom Stages" isn't on. Please remove the SD card if you are not playing BBrawl to avoid this issue.

---

At one time, we were going to make such a change for Ness and Lucas, but it wouldn't really have any practical utility for them. For the next release, one of the things we are looking into doing is rebuilding animations so the transitions are smooth, and that change would be a real work increase for no real benefit to the game. What we did do for those moves, increasing knockback parameters and changing the angle on Pk Freeze, was significantly more helpful for what use those moves have (Pk Freeze is secretly pretty good in BBrawl doubles!).

When I brawl my friends online, there's a lot more lag that it is normal. And also disconnecting randomly from matches. It won't even stop to lag, it'll just pop up saying "Your connection was lost" in the middle of a brawl.

I also think Wario should be buffed back up. I don't understand why he was debuffed.

 

[Last Elixir]

At one time, we were going to make such a change for Ness and Lucas, but it wouldn't really have any practical utility for them. For the next release, one of the things we are looking into doing is rebuilding animations so the transitions are smooth, and that change would be a real work increase for no real benefit to the game. What we did do for those moves, increasing knockback parameters and changing the angle on Pk Freeze, was significantly more helpful for what use those moves have (Pk Freeze is secretly pretty good in BBrawl doubles!).

I've noticed that, as usually my friends and I kinda just play free-for-alls, and PK freeze is awesome if I get punched away from a fight and a couple of other people are still messing around and not paying attention! Did you ever consider something like making it so PK Flash still goes off if Ness is hit out of it, which would make the move still pretty punishable, and make it so at least you aren't asking for a big smash attack/being thrown for even considering using it?

 

[A2ZOMG]

When I brawl my friends online, there's a lot more lag that it is normal. And also disconnecting randomly from matches. It won't even stop to lag, it'll just pop up saying "Your connection was lost" in the middle of a brawl.

I also think Wario should be buffed back up. I don't understand why he was debuffed.

Wario was considered one of the strongest characters in vBrawl despite being susceptible to lots of abuse from grab releases. Removing the grab releases alone is a very non-trivial benefit for Wario, who is a character where the majority of his attacks do above average damage per hit. Keep this in perspective: It's debatable as to who actually wins the matchup, but it's generally argued that Captain Falcon in vBrawl goes neutral with Wario in large part because of his grab releases.

Although I do agree that he was nerfed a little too much, and needs slight compensation for matchups like Marth and Falco at least.

Concerning Metaknight, Renegade mentioned a while to me about how MK's N-air damage is really stupid (fresh, capable of doing up to 19 damage landing both hits...wtf?). I think nerfing the damage of that move would be good to consider, and as compensation MK's U-smash be buffed instead, which can cover a lot of the same options N-air oos can cover, except it's not nearly as broken. Given that Metaknight can no longer really KO vertically with Up-B and Mach Tornado, I don't think it would be too unreasonable to make MK's U-smash a bit more powerful or damaging, especially since it has the most ending lag of his other Smashes.

 

[Cyntalan Maelstrom]

So, this applies for all the various hacks in general, but I'm more focused on this one as this is the one I'm using, but what happens when this is used on a Wii with a fresh Brawl save (i.e. no character unlocks)? Will this do the unlocks for you, or will you still need to do that?

 

[MonkUnit]

You will still be able to unlock characters. Each unlocked character will be using the balanced brawl edit and whatever texture you have on their default colour if you have a texture on the default texture.

 

[Rainierman]

So, this applies for all the various hacks in general, but I'm more focused on this one as this is the one I'm using, but what happens when this is used on a Wii with a fresh Brawl save (i.e. no character unlocks)? Will this do the unlocks for you, or will you still need to do that?

It depends on the hack.

From personal experience, Brawl+'s character screen will have the full roster, but as odd as this might sound, they won't be "counted" as unlocked. You could for example play your first 10 brawls with Ness and you'll still get the Warning screen for Ness regardless, and fight him (with Ness xD). With this I mean to tell you that with these mods having a character playable is not the same as having that character unlocked

The same goes for BBrawl, but for the stages. BBrawl doesn't give you access to all characters. It does for stages, though. And incidentally, last time I played Brawl+, it didn't do the stages (but I admit this was quite a long time ago).

Perhaps this other way of putting it will make it clearer. If you load Brawl+, you will have all characters to be chosen. But if you save, unload Brawl+ and then load vBrawl, the roster would be back to the same screen you had before, back to normal. The memory won't have changed. What the mod changes is the selection screen for character/stage, not their unlocked status.

Uhm, maybe I overexplained. Sorry for the long read.

 

[Cyntalan Maelstrom]

You will still be able to unlock characters. Each unlocked character will be using the balanced brawl edit and whatever texture you have on their default colour if you have a texture on the default texture.

So by that I can't use this to also unlock everything without going through the whole process. Bleh. Oh well.

 

[MonkUnit]

You can use Balanced Brawl to unlock everything.

 

[Cyntalan Maelstrom]

The same goes for BBrawl, but for the stages. BBrawl doesn't give you access to all characters. It does for stages, though. And incidentally, last time I played Brawl+, it didn't do the stages (but I admit this was quite a long time ago).

You can use Balanced Brawl to unlock everything.

Wait, so which is it?

 

[MonkUnit]

Well, I've never use balanced brawl, but according to Rainierman all characters and stages should be unlocked but you still have to do the challenger approaching fights and get the stage unlock screens. I am not sure. But you can use bbrawl to go through and unlock things.

 

[Cyntalan Maelstrom]

Well, I've never use balanced brawl, but according to Rainierman all characters and stages should be unlocked but you still have to do the challenger approaching fights and get the stage unlock screens. I am not sure. But you can use bbrawl to go through and unlock things.

My reasoning is I'm headed to a location that has a Wii but no Brawl, and thus, no Brawl save. Considering how much of a pain it is to transfer Brawl saves, I figured if BBrawl opens the whole roster, I'd just as soon bring my copy of Brawl and an SD card with it on there. But if I still gotta do all the unlocks, the point is moot.

 

[Rainierman]

I spoke about both Brawl Plus (another mod) and Balanced Brawl. Read closely.

BBrawl doesn't show all characters. It shows all stages.

Brawl+ is the other way around. I mentioned both so you would get the whole business about how they make you able to use stuff without it being "officially" unlocked, and how that doesn't stop you from legitimately unlock them anyways.

 

[Cyntalan Maelstrom]

I spoke about both Brawl Plus (another mod) and Balanced Brawl. Read closely.

BBrawl doesn't show all characters. It shows all stages.

Brawl+ is the other way around. I mentioned both so you would get the whole business about how they make you able to use stuff without it being "officially" unlocked, and how that doesn't stop you from legitimately unlock them anyways.

Yeah, I figured you were the correct one, but when monk contradicted, I wasn't entirely sure what to believe.

 

[Tenshi]

Is the "Wi-fi Waiting Room" considered a fair stage?

 

[LegendofLink]

Is the "Wi-fi Waiting Room" considered a fair stage?

Yeah, its pretty much Final Destination with the sandbag. It does let characters make use of the sandbag as a projectile shield, but that is more of a tactical feature than anything that really swings matchups.

 

[Amazing Ampharos]

In our experiences, it plays out fairly differently from FD. It's a bit longer, and Sandbag really limits most projectile tactics (though notably he does not limit Olimar, a major boon to the character on this stage). Characters like Jigglypuff who have a big focus on stale move management also will really like this stage compared to Final Destination since Sandbag offers an easy opportunity to refresh.

It's definitely fair though. We stand behind every stage we put on the first page, and the top two rows should play out especially evenly.

 

[LegendofLink]

I don't know if this was brought up before, but I found a glitch with the Wi-Fi Waiting Room stage:

If you have items tuned on, only additional Sandbags will spawn. Its pretty amusing, and probably has something to do with spawning the initial sandbag, but obviously not intentional.

 

[Last Elixir]

Can someone explain exactly how the pick/counterpick system works? My friends and I usually just play on random stages, but it does sound pretty fun to be able to pick stages to play on without random turned on, though.

 

[A2ZOMG]

In tournament, the first match is usually determined by stage striking, where players eliminate neutral stages of their choice until a single stage is left, which becomes the stage of the first match.

After the first match, the winner bans one stage, and the loser chooses a different stage from the one played on and the one that was banned to be used as a counterpick.

The counterpick process repeats until a necessary amount of wins to complete the set has been reached.

 

[The_Altrox]

so is this still being worked on?

 

[ぱみゅ]

Since there's few feedback, I'm pretty sure that internal discussion is having some hard times.

Anyways
I'd like if you also include the Bottom Removal for all of Spear Pillar forms (Palkia specially). And I always wondered how a speed redection on Pirate Ship would work...

 

[The_Altrox]

ah... also, is it possible to get the brawl SD card file for vBrawl to add costume hacks onto that? because I got a bunch of costume/music hacks for BBrawl, and I'd like it on vBrawl too without hacking my wii